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mussop
10-14-2009, 01:41 PM
Should we ake a look?

http://www.scoresreport.com/2009/10/14/report-chiefs-down-on-glenn-dorsey/

Report: Chiefs down on Glenn Dorsey

Posted by Anthony Stalter (10/14/2009 @ 11:05 am)



According to NFL.com’s Jason La Canfora, the Chiefs are already down on former first round pick Glenn Dorsey and are willing to trade him. La Canfora writes that the new coaching staff isn’t high on Dorsey and that the salary cap ramifications wouldn’t be a deterrent in dealing him before the October 20 deadline.

This isn’t shocking news considering that Dorsey isn’t a fit for the Chiefs’ new 3-4 defensive front. He excels at shooting the gaps as a 4-3 tackle, which is what he played at LSU. He isn’t big enough to play nose in a 3-4, and his pass-rush talents are wasted as an end in a 3-4.

If the report is true and the Chiefs do plan to trade him, one team that could be interested in Dorsey is the Falcons. They were reportedly deciding between Dorsey and Matt Ryan in last year’s draft and there was also a rumor that the Falcons were interested in trading for the D-tackle before this year’s draft.

The Falcons addressed their defensive tackle need in April with the selection of first round pick Peria Jerry. But he suffered a season-ending knee injury in Week 2 and the Falcons could use an interior pass-rusher to go along with Jonathan Babineaux. Once Jerry is healthy, the Falcons could have a fantastic defensive tackle rotation in Babineaux, Jerry and Dorsey (assuming they trade for Dorsey).

But would it be worth it for the Falcons to part with draft picks next year to acquire Drosey? Again, they’ve already addressed the need with Jerry, who will return to health next year (hopefully) and they also don’t have a second round pick in 2010 because of the trade for Tony Gonzalez. I doubt the Chiefs would part with Dorsey for a third rounder, so would the Falcons part with a first rounder? It’s doubtful.


Man I wonder if they would take a second rounder for him?

Malloy
10-14-2009, 01:45 PM
Saw it on NFL.com, depending on what kind of trade they're suggesting we should take a look?

Do I remember correctly that he has a pretty heavy contract one would have to pick up in a trade?

Texecutioner
10-14-2009, 01:45 PM
Should we ake a look?

http://www.scoresreport.com/2009/10/14/report-chiefs-down-on-glenn-dorsey/

Report: Chiefs down on Glenn Dorsey

Posted by Anthony Stalter (10/14/2009 @ 11:05 am)



According to NFL.com’s Jason La Canfora, the Chiefs are already down on former first round pick Glenn Dorsey and are willing to trade him. La Canfora writes that the new coaching staff isn’t high on Dorsey and that the salary cap ramifications wouldn’t be a deterrent in dealing him before the October 20 deadline.

This isn’t shocking news considering that Dorsey isn’t a fit for the Chiefs’ new 3-4 defensive front. He excels at shooting the gaps as a 4-3 tackle, which is what he played at LSU. He isn’t big enough to play nose in a 3-4, and his pass-rush talents are wasted as an end in a 3-4.

If the report is true and the Chiefs do plan to trade him, one team that could be interested in Dorsey is the Falcons. They were reportedly deciding between Dorsey and Matt Ryan in last year’s draft and there was also a rumor that the Falcons were interested in trading for the D-tackle before this year’s draft.

The Falcons addressed their defensive tackle need in April with the selection of first round pick Peria Jerry. But he suffered a season-ending knee injury in Week 2 and the Falcons could use an interior pass-rusher to go along with Jonathan Babineaux. Once Jerry is healthy, the Falcons could have a fantastic defensive tackle rotation in Babineaux, Jerry and Dorsey (assuming they trade for Dorsey).

But would it be worth it for the Falcons to part with draft picks next year to acquire Drosey? Again, they’ve already addressed the need with Jerry, who will return to health next year (hopefully) and they also don’t have a second round pick in 2010 because of the trade for Tony Gonzalez. I doubt the Chiefs would part with Dorsey for a third rounder, so would the Falcons part with a first rounder? It’s doubtful.


Man I wonder if they would take a second rounder for him?

Interesting. Dorsey looked like a for sure stud to me coming out of college. He looked like a can't miss type of player. I don't know if I'd want to reach with any of our draft picks for a guy that even the Chiefs don't want. Plus, if Kubes isn't here next season we could possibly hire a coach that doesn't want to run a 4-3. Seems like bad timing to me as far as the Texans would be concerned.

Plus the guy's got an insane rookie contract.

nero THE zero
10-14-2009, 01:46 PM
Seems a bit redundant to have two underperforming 3-tech DT's and he doesn't address our need of a big space-eater in the middle. But, he does fit this regime's M.O. of athletic linemen.

Mr. White
10-14-2009, 01:46 PM
I'd take him in a heartbeat. Problem is that he's too big to play DT here.

Don't know or understand why. It just is.

TexansFanatic
10-14-2009, 01:47 PM
He's worth a first rounder.

TheRealJoker
10-14-2009, 01:47 PM
NFL forum imo.

We'd have the same problems with Dorsey that we have with Okoye and they play the same position. Plus, Okoye is starting to put together some consistent games. We dont need basically the same player taking reps from him and slowing down his growth process. We need a DT who can drop anchor and not give up ground at the LOS. Dorsey doesn't fit the bill.

Mr. White
10-14-2009, 01:50 PM
But, he does fit this regime's M.O. of athletic linemen.

Does anybody understand this philosophy? Where did it come from? Where has it been successful? Who's responsible for implementing it?

I'm seriously puzzled by it.

nunusguy
10-14-2009, 01:51 PM
Interesting. Dorsey looked like a for sure stud to me coming out of college. He looked like a can't miss type of player. I don't know if I'd want to reach with any of our draft picks for a guy that even the Chiefs don't want. Plus, if Kubes isn't here next season we could possibly hire a coach that doesn't want to run a 4-3. Seems like bad timing to me as far as the Texans would be concerned.

Plus the guy's got an insane rookie contract.

I would think the old man would impose a no-trade sanction on Smith-Kubiak during this season given how shaky the teams doing in Kubiaks 4th season, especially for a deal for a player like Dorsey that's gonna involve some serious consideration in cash, draft picks, and/or players.

Texecutioner
10-14-2009, 01:52 PM
I would think the old man would impose a no-trade sanction on Smith-Kubiak during this season given how shaky the teams doing in Kubiaks 4th season, especially for a deal for a player like Dorsey that's gonna involve some serious consideration in cash, draft picks, and/or players.

Yeah, I would think so as well. I hope so any way.

nero THE zero
10-14-2009, 02:13 PM
Does anybody understand this philosophy? Where did it come from? Where has it been successful? Who's responsible for implementing it?

I'm seriously puzzled by it.

From my understanding, it was popularized by the Tampa 2 defenses that values penetration and getting up field by the front four to be effective.

BigBull17
10-14-2009, 02:18 PM
Does anybody understand this philosophy? Where did it come from? Where has it been successful? Who's responsible for implementing it?

I'm seriously puzzled by it.

I understand it, I just think its really freakin stupid.

mussop
10-14-2009, 02:19 PM
I think its just been a bad situatoin from the beginning in KC. He wa injured alot his first year now he is coming along but having to play out of position and in the doghouse with a new coaching staff. If we could get him for a second round pick we would be crazy not to go after him. He was widely considered the best player in the draft when he came out.

Despite several injuries Dorsey made his average run tackle last season after a gain of just 1.5 yards, the best figure of any of the Chiefs' defensive linemen. Remember Mario didnt blow anyone away his first year either. We should be taking a long hard look at him if these rumors are true. Its not like he isnt an upgrade over what we have.

gtexan02
10-14-2009, 02:20 PM
Just goes to further show that truly great DTs are almost impossible to scout. I read somewhere that more 1st round DTs turn out to be busts than any other position, including QB.

I'd be happy if we never drafted another DT in the 1st round.

BigBull17
10-14-2009, 02:23 PM
Just goes to further show that truly great DTs are almost impossible to scout. I read somewhere that more 1st round DTs turn out to be busts than any other position, including QB.

I'd be happy if we never drafted another DT in the 1st round.

It's a crazy failure rate.

Goldensilence
10-14-2009, 02:23 PM
Just goes to further show that truly great DTs are almost impossible to scout. I read somewhere that more 1st round DTs turn out to be busts than any other position, including QB.

I'd be happy if we never drafted another DT in the 1st round.

Yep. I facepalm everytime I see another person on the board wanting ANOTHER 1st round tackle.

gafftop
10-14-2009, 02:32 PM
Would not give up more than a sixth. They know more than we do about him. My theory on Dline high draft choices is your in a coin flip on whether the guys got HEART and DESIRE and is going to turn into something or if the something he is going to turn into is Fat and Lazy. Dline you gotta have HEART and DESIRE. Really don't want to give up any draft choice for him. Money only is no problem

badboy
10-14-2009, 02:33 PM
I'd take him in a heartbeat. Problem is that he's too big to play DT here.

Don't know or understand why. It just is.He is 6'2" 295 range. I don't understand your comment.

badboy
10-14-2009, 02:35 PM
He's worth a first rounder.Based on what?

badboy
10-14-2009, 02:36 PM
NFL forum imo.

We'd have the same problems with Dorsey that we have with Okoye and they play the same position. Plus, Okoye is starting to put together some consistent games. We dont need basically the same player taking reps from him and slowing down his growth process. We need a DT who can drop anchor and not give up ground at the LOS. Dorsey doesn't fit the bill.There you go. Good Post

WhoDeyBengals
10-14-2009, 02:39 PM
Honest question: what has gone wrong with Okoye? He seemed like such a great prospect coming out of college. I was really disappointed when we didn't get him.

Mr. White
10-14-2009, 02:39 PM
He is 6'2" 295 range. I don't understand your comment.

I thought he was bigger when I typed that. I could have swore he was 300+ when he got drafted.

HOU-TEX
10-14-2009, 02:44 PM
NFL forum imo.

We'd have the same problems with Dorsey that we have with Okoye and they play the same position. Plus, Okoye is starting to put together some consistent games. We dont need basically the same player taking reps from him and slowing down his growth process. We need a DT who can drop anchor and not give up ground at the LOS. Dorsey doesn't fit the bill.

Possibly. IMO, Dorsey was a much more dominant DT then Okoye was in College. Dorsey was a beast in College, which is all we can judge him by considering he's likely playing out of position in KC's 3-4.

TexansFanatic
10-14-2009, 02:46 PM
Based on what?

Based on the fact that he won the Outland and the Lombardi and hasn't been used correctly by a bumbling Chief's organization.

Mario Williams didn't look so great at this stage of his career either.

TheRealJoker
10-14-2009, 02:46 PM
Honest question: what has gone wrong with Okoye? He seemed like such a great prospect coming out of college. I was really disappointed when we didn't get him.

He was a project prospect and it was a mistake to take him when we did with as many holes we had on the team that could've been patched by immediate contributors.

Its very likely that he wont have the strength necessary to play solid against the run until he's playing in his 2nd NFL contract. Good pass rushing DT but doesn't have the strength to hold the POA against NFL OL and the coaching staff insists on keeping him out there on running downs to try and justify his draft position when its obvious that he isn't one of the 2 best run stuffing DTs on the roster.

ATXtexanfan
10-14-2009, 02:48 PM
Money that his contract will tie up is needed for our own guys. Wouldn't mind a looksee but it's a big contract that we'll be picking up on the backend.

badboy
10-14-2009, 02:49 PM
Honest question: what has gone wrong with Okoye? He seemed like such a great prospect coming out of college. I was really disappointed when we didn't get him.Some say it's age, many say it is just learning the position (we have had a few defensive coach changes). He was injured last season & may just now be getting well. It is possible he is just not as good as his hype. He has shown that he does have some skills and is young enough to become a good player. It would have been better if he had been drafted by either a team not expecting to go anywhere or a tean that could stash him while he develops. Texans were hoping for a starter and his rookie year supported their choice. If he is now hitting his stride, great. Now if Okam could just resolve the run stuffer we need this team would be way better.

badboy
10-14-2009, 02:54 PM
Based on the fact that he won the Outland and the Lombardi and hasn't been used correctly by a bumbling Chief's organization.

Mario Williams didn't look so great at this stage of his career either.After a player is drafted, his college days mean squat. I agree with your premise of being in wrong system but transfering to ours where we are already getting similar production with much less salary is definitely not worth a first round pick. I think for every NFL player that has an off season rookie year then turns into a Mario Williams, I can name two that do not.

TheRealJoker
10-14-2009, 02:54 PM
Possibly. IMO, Dorsey was a much more dominant DT then Okoye was in College. Dorsey was a beast in College, which is all we can judge him by considering he's likely playing out of position in KC's 3-4.

http://www.warroomreport.com/draft/rankings/dt/okoye.htm

VS

http://warroomreport.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=114&Itemid=1

Mr. White
10-14-2009, 02:56 PM
http://www.warroomreport.com/draft/rankings/dt/okoye.htm

VS

http://warroomreport.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=114&Itemid=1

Could somebody quote?

I can't read it here at work.

mussop
10-14-2009, 02:58 PM
Based on the fact that he won the Outland and the Lombardi and hasn't been used correctly by a bumbling Chief's organization.

Mario Williams didn't look so great at this stage of his career either.

And this. Started all 16 games at right defensive tackle … Registered 50 tackles (41 solo), a sack (-1.0 yard), one pass defensed and a forced fumble despite playing through several nagging injuries and on a terrible team.

Our best DT had 28 tackles last year. Once again his average tackle came just 1.5 yards after gain last season his rookie year. Still I would offer a second round pick just to see if they would bite.

badboy
10-14-2009, 03:01 PM
He was a project prospect and it was a mistake to take him when we did with as many holes we had on the team that could've been patched by immediate contributors.

Its very likely that he wont have the strength necessary to play solid against the run until he's playing in his 2nd NFL contract. Good pass rushing DT but doesn't have the strength to hold the POA against NFL OL and the coaching staff insists on keeping him out there on running downs to try and justify his draft position when its obvious that he isn't one of the 2 best run stuffing DTs on the roster.Do we have to have two large run stuffers side by side or would Okoye (if his improvement of last 2 games continues)next to a run stuffer be productive. I like having a DT that can hurry the QB IF we have a run stuffer +our LBs. Your thoughts?

beerlover
10-14-2009, 03:01 PM
Glenn Dorsey is a 4-3 DT the Chiefs tried to convert to a 3-4 nose + he has injury concerns they did not take into account (fracture Tibia in his right leg, sprained L/R knee & Shin strains). Trying to replace Jared Allen....priceless.

JB
10-14-2009, 03:01 PM
Could somebody quote?

I can't read it here at work.


http://www.warroomreport.com/draft/rankings/dt/okoye.htm

DT1 - Amobi Okoye, Louisville NFL.com Profile

Height: 6-2
Weight: 302
40 yard dash: 5.00
Grade: 94
Strengths:
What is not to like about this 19 year old man-child defensive tackle prospect? Not only is he one of the better defensive line prospects in the 2007 draft, but he is also one of the top overall athletes. His superior athleticism was on display during the post-season all star games as well as the individual workouts where he blew away scouts with his unparalleled speed and quickness by a prospect that weighed in at 300 pounds. The sky is the limit on the vast potential of Amobi Okoye as he is a very mature young man who has not even scratched the immense potential that he has entering the 2007 NFL Draft.
Weaknesses:
As mature as a prospect can be, there is still concern anytime an athlete at the tender age of 19 enters the physical world of the National Football League. How will the young man hold up to the constant pounding of an offensive line many years his elder on a week to week basis, for sixteen weeks? Okoye was inconsistent at times while playing for Louisville, so expect many moments of inconsistency early in his young career. Okoye is a little shorter than ideal for a defensive tackle prospect.
Overall:
Some feel that Okoye is overrated as a prospect because of his age, but the WRR does not agree with that assessment. He is a work in progress, that much is for sure, but his potential upside is as high as anyone in the 2007 Draft. Okoye should not be expected to set the league on fire during his rookie season, which should be more of a period of transition, but there will be moments where the talent is evident and he will be a full fledge defensive force beginning in the 2008 season at the age of 20.

http://warroomreport.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=114&Itemid=1

LSU DT Glenn Dorsey Scouting Report
Height: 6-2, Weight: 299, Draft Grade: 98

Strengths: Very productive when healthy against top notch competition…extremely strong and powerful player with a great base…shows the ability to penetrate up the field…also able to hold his own against the rush…plays with good technique…versatile to fit any number of defensive schemes…was the leader and heart of a top notch National Champion defense…unable to be blocked by one man…

Weaknesses: Height and bulk are only average for the position…was injured as a junior and a senior so there are some concerns about his durability…may not have the frame to become a 3-4 NT…he may not be an "elite" athlete..

Overall: One, if not the top, DT prospects to enter the NFL in the past 10 years, Dorsey showed the ability to dominate in the SEC when healthy. There are some concerns that he does not protect his legs adequately due to his injury history. He projects to work in any defense, but his best position would be as a three technique in the 3-4 defense as he excels when able to operate in space.

TexansFanatic
10-14-2009, 03:03 PM
After a player is drafted, his college days mean squat.

With all due respect, that is simply not true.

When a player with Dorsey's college accomplishments doesn't perform right away in the pros you can still expect that he will improve.

When a player of average college accomplishments performs at an average level his first season and a half in the pros, you figure you've gotten what you expected.

Dorsey still has a very high upside. No question.

mussop
10-14-2009, 03:05 PM
After a player is drafted, his college days mean squat. I agree with your premise of being in wrong system but transfering to ours where we are already getting similar production with much less salary is definitely not worth a first round pick. I think for every NFL player that has an off season rookie year then turns into a Mario Williams, I can name two that do not.

Similar production? I don't understand your comment. Dorsey Registered 50 tackles (41 solo), a sack (-1.0 yard), one pass defensed and a forced fumble last year. The only player on our DL with better stats than that was Mario with 53 tackles and 44 solo. Next in line, Travis Johnson with 28 and 22. Please explain similar production.

mussop
10-14-2009, 03:12 PM
NFL forum imo.

How is this any different than youre "will we make a trade before the deadline" post? I pointed out that a player of interest is on the trading block and asked if we should be interested. This is a legitamate TEXANS thread.

infantrycak
10-14-2009, 03:13 PM
How is this any different than youre "will we make a trade before the deadline" post? I pointed out that a player of interest is on the trading block and asked if we should be interested. This is a legitamate TEXANS thread.

Generally speaking if there is no reported rumor about the Texans being interested then the thread, even if speculating about the Texans pursuing him, goes in the NFL forum. Since this one has developed this far it can stay here.

LonerATO
10-14-2009, 03:15 PM
I feel bad for KC fans and giving away Gonzo and now trying to ditch Dorsey. I thought that I read somewhere that KC was going to use 4-3 / 3-4 this year with the personal they had, but they are just running 3-4. I still dont see the Texans going after this guy.

beerlover
10-14-2009, 03:19 PM
Generally speaking if there is no reported rumor about the Texans being interested then the thread, even if speculating about the Texans pursuing him, goes in the NFL forum. Since this one has developed this far it can stay here.

posted NFL Trade Deadline for just such purposes under NFL Forum header http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=65051 but now its out of sight out of mind. throw your hands in the air like ya just don't care :runaway:

TheRealJoker
10-14-2009, 03:19 PM
How is this any different than youre "will we make a trade before the deadline" post? I pointed out that a player of interest is on the trading block and asked if we should be interested. This is a legitamate TEXANS thread.

Infantrycak answered for me.

mussop
10-14-2009, 03:20 PM
Generally speaking if there is no reported rumor about the Texans being interested then the thread, even if speculating about the Texans pursuing him, goes in the NFL forum. Since this one has developed this far it can stay here.

noted!

Wolf6151
10-14-2009, 03:23 PM
Dorsey isn't big enough to play NT and we've already got Okoye at UT so assuming that huge contract for a guy that would sit on the bench and rotate into the game is crazy. Dorsey is an UT not a NT and we need a two gap, run stuffing NT.

badboy
10-14-2009, 03:24 PM
And this. Started all 16 games at right defensive tackle … Registered 50 tackles (41 solo), a sack (-1.0 yard), one pass defensed and a forced fumble despite playing through several nagging injuries and on a terrible team.

Our best DT had 28 tackles last year. Once again his average tackle came just 1.5 yards after gain last season his rookie year. Still I would offer a second round pick just to see if they would bite.Mussop, I respect your views but do you not agree, we should compare his production this season to the person's 2009 production he would replace? When you throw in the contracts of each, I just don't see Dorsey even for a 2nd round. If Okoye had not begin improving 2 games ago and Dorsey did not have a huge back end loaded deal, maybe.

TheRealJoker
10-14-2009, 03:27 PM
Do we have to have two large run stuffers side by side or would Okoye (if his improvement of last 2 games continues)next to a run stuffer be productive. I like having a DT that can hurry the QB IF we have a run stuffer +our LBs. Your thoughts?

We dont have two large run stuffers on the roster. But we do have DelJuan Robinson, Frank Okam and Shaun Cody all of which are superior against the run than Okoye. I would prefer that Robinson play the majority of short yardage situations because I feel he's our best DT against the run and he plays Okoye's position.

The last 2 games (where Okoye has shown the most progress) came against 2 teams that haven't been running well. Amobi looked good against Arizona in part because they decided to only run a handful of times in the 2nd half (I think 4?) which played to his strengths. We'll see how far he's come along on Sunday when we play the NFL's leading rusher.

I like having a DT that can hurry the QB in running situations as well but so far in Amobi's career he's been a complete liability against the run and that has allowed offenses to push him off the LOS and get hands on our LBers. If he cant be average against the run then he's too much of a liability in those situations.

m5kwatts
10-14-2009, 03:27 PM
I'd rather go after Shaun Rodgers.

badboy
10-14-2009, 03:30 PM
With all due respect, that is simply not true.

When a player with Dorsey's college accomplishments doesn't perform right away in the pros you can still expect that he will improve.

When a player of average college accomplishments performs at an average level his first season and a half in the pros, you figure you've gotten what you expected.

Dorsey still has a very high upside. No question.What you are refering to is "potential" & Okoye came with a bit of that also. I refer to above evals. Still, both are veterans now and potential should slide into productivity soon. Okoye had seeral sacks his rookie year and Dorsey had tackles. Both in 2nd year were injured. Dorsey was injured both of his last 2 years in college. Considering all this, I would not give up a 2nd for Dorsey and his contract.

badboy
10-14-2009, 03:34 PM
Similar production? I don't understand your comment. Dorsey Registered 50 tackles (41 solo), a sack (-1.0 yard), one pass defensed and a forced fumble last year. The only player on our DL with better stats than that was Mario with 53 tackles and 44 solo. Next in line, Travis Johnson with 28 and 22. Please explain similar production.Surely you understood that 2009 production is what counts now. If you choose to say Dorsey was injured, well Okoye was last season and is only recently recovered. Also remember that I am looking at contracts as well as 2009 production + giving up a high draft pick. Not going to do it.

Mr. White
10-14-2009, 03:39 PM
From my understanding, it was popularized by the Tampa 2 defenses that values penetration and getting up field by the front four to be effective.

So Sapp and McFarland are the model for Okoye and Okam (or whoever.)

Interesting. Repped.

mussop
10-14-2009, 03:48 PM
Mussop, I respect your views but do you not agree, we should compare his production this season to the person's 2009 production he would replace? When you throw in the contracts of each, I just don't see Dorsey even for a 2nd round. If Okoye had not begin improving 2 games ago and Dorsey did not have a huge back end loaded deal, maybe.

I respect youre veiws also (my fellow texnas fan :)) but I dont see why you would want to compare his stats this year considering he is playing out of position in a defense he clearly doesnt fit in. He is so out of position his team is willing to trade him despite giving the 5th overall pick in the draft for him just one year ago. So in fairness we should be compairing his stats from his last stint in a 4/3 to understand his value in relation to the Texans since that is what we run.

As far as Okoye playing good in the last 2 games. I dont know about that. One game was against the Raiders :( enough said, the other was against the Cardinals and I wouldnt say anyone on our D played that great in the first halsf of that game. So he played 1/2 of decent D out of 5 games this year. Not exactly lighting it up.

Now the big contract is an issue I agree on that. But this team isnt going anywhere until it makes some upgrades. Upgrades cost money.

mussop
10-14-2009, 03:54 PM
Surely you understood that 2009 production is what counts now. If you choose to say Dorsey was injured, well Okoye was last season and is only recently recovered. Also remember that I am looking at contracts as well as 2009 production + giving up a high draft pick. Not going to do it.


Probably doubling up on you, Sorry! But why would you discount what a player accomplished just one year ago? And DESPITE playing injured still had better numbers than anyone on our DL other than Mario.

badboy
10-14-2009, 04:07 PM
Probably doubling up on you, Sorry! But why would you discount what a player accomplished just one year ago? And DESPITE playing injured still had better numbers than anyone on our DL other than Mario.My thought is Dorsey had 50 something tackles 2008-Okoye was hurt that season. Both seem about even this season. I do not see giving up a 2 or a 1 that has been suggested & paying a whole lot more. I just do not see the upgrade for the cost.

chicagotexan2
10-14-2009, 04:08 PM
I've had my fill of underachieving DT's. Fool me once shame on me, fool me............... can't get fooled again. Damn I just got possessed by GWB.

El Tejano
10-14-2009, 04:16 PM
Just wanted to add something to this. Remember when everyone said Travis Johnson was playing out of position and would do much better in a 4-3.

Goatcheese
10-14-2009, 05:17 PM
Okoye is bigger, younger, and producing better. Why would be want to give away draft picks for Dorsey? :mcnugget:

badboy
10-14-2009, 05:23 PM
Okoye is bigger, younger, and producing better. Why would be want to give away draft picks for Dorsey? :mcnugget:and cheaper. :gamer:

mussop
10-14-2009, 06:44 PM
Just wanted to add something to this. Remember when everyone said Travis Johnson was playing out of position and would do much better in a 4-3.

And youre point is?

Okoye is bigger, younger, and producing better. Why would be want to give away draft picks for Dorsey? :mcnugget:

There is no comparison. Dorsey is twice the player Okoye is.


I've had my fill of underachieving DT's. Fool me once shame on me, fool me............... can't get fooled again. Damn I just got possessed by GWB.

When did us Texan fans become so spoiled by our great DT play that 50 tackles by a rookie DT is considered underacheaving?

My thought is Dorsey had 50 something tackles 2008-Okoye was hurt that season. Both seem about even this season. I do not see giving up a 2 or a 1 that has been suggested & paying a whole lot more. I just do not see the upgrade for the cost.

Explain even. Dorsey is playing in a 3/4 and comes out on passing downs. His job is to absorb linemen so the LB's can make plays. Okoye has had way more snaps in a defense that fits him and hasnt done didly squat. If you want to say Dorseys contract is too much thats fine but in no way is Okoye even close talent wise to Dorsey. Okoye gets pushed around like a JR college player in hte run game. You wont see that happening to Dorsey.

TwoTrill
10-16-2009, 11:08 PM
http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/playerbreakingnews.asp?sport=NFL&id=4661&line=155084&spln=1

The Chiefs are down on DL Glenn Dorsey and may be willing to trade him, according to NFL.com's Jason La Canfora.
La Canfora says the new coaching staff doesn't like Dorsey, the No. 5 pick in the 2008 draft. Like many other Chiefs, Dorsey landed in coach Todd Haley's doghouse when he showed up to camp out of shape and flunked a conditioning test. Dorsey has been coming around lately and giving up on him just 21 games into his career would be a very surprising move as the trade deadline approaches. He'd also be impossible to trade with a contract including $22.5 million guaranteed. Oct. 14 - 10:37 am et
Source: KCChiefs.com

Do you think it would be a good trade for us since we need help at DT

edo783
10-16-2009, 11:33 PM
Depends on what and how much.

mussop
10-16-2009, 11:36 PM
This has already been discussed.

http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=65805

TwoTrill
10-16-2009, 11:49 PM
This has already been discussed.

http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=65805

my bad didnt know it was discussed

m5kwatts
10-17-2009, 12:59 AM
Rams Safety Oshi Atogwe is more appealing, as is Shaun Rodgers

mussop
10-17-2009, 08:17 AM
my bad didnt know it was discussed

Well its easy to miss since it got moved to a different forum.

threeputtsam
10-17-2009, 09:31 AM
Can we trade Kubiak for Dorsey?

Jackie Chiles
10-18-2009, 11:20 PM
"We went very athletic with our front in the last two weeks, with smaller guys, moving them around, moving Antonio (Smith) inside, moving Tim Bulman inside, and they have responded." Kubiak quote after the game

I wouldn't be opposed to trading a 3rd rounder for Dorsey. Maybe throw in the extra 5 we got in the TJ deal but certainly no more than that. I think he has more potential than any DT we could get in the 3rd next year and he would have a headstart on any rookie after playing the rest of this season and being on the team the entire off-season. If he has any lingering injury issues (I believe there were some questions about his knee) then I probably wouldn't pull the trigger. KC might want more but the amount of money Dorsey makes/will make kind of limits his value imo.

Another interesting tidbit on the Chiefs:
8. The Chiefs are trying to move former 2005 first-round linebacker Derrick Johnson and 2008 third-round safety DeJuan Morgan. Todd Haley and Co. are making no secret about their unhappiness with the players they inherited from the previous regime. I’m hearing they don’t like anyone, including Branden Albert, who they feel is not a left tackle.

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Sunday-at-the-Post-4585.html

Odds are none of these guys even get traded much less to us but worth looking into. Trade deadline will kill our fun in a couple days anyway.

RagingBull
10-19-2009, 01:07 AM
"We went very athletic with our front in the last two weeks, with smaller guys, moving them around, moving Antonio (Smith) inside, moving Tim Bulman inside, and they have responded." Kubiak quote after the game

I wouldn't be opposed to trading a 3rd rounder for Dorsey. Maybe throw in the extra 5 we got in the TJ deal but certainly no more than that. I think he has more potential than any DT we could get in the 3rd next year and he would have a headstart on any rookie after playing the rest of this season and being on the team the entire off-season. If he has any lingering injury issues (I believe there were some questions about his knee) then I probably wouldn't pull the trigger. KC might want more but the amount of money Dorsey makes/will make kind of limits his value imo.

Another interesting tidbit on the Chiefs:
8. The Chiefs are trying to move former 2005 first-round linebacker Derrick Johnson and 2008 third-round safety DeJuan Morgan. Todd Haley and Co. are making no secret about their unhappiness with the players they inherited from the previous regime. I’m hearing they don’t like anyone, including Branden Albert, who they feel is not a left tackle.

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Sunday-at-the-Post-4585.html

Odds are none of these guys even get traded much less to us but worth looking into. Trade deadline will kill our fun in a couple days anyway.

I would give them a second for Dorsey and Albert. We can move Albert to guard. Chances are one of them will work out.

Goatcheese
10-19-2009, 01:37 AM
I would give them a second for Dorsey and Albert. We can move Albert to guard. Chances are one of them will work out.

Albert has been pretty bad in pass protection so far, and merely adequate in run blocking. Sure, that's an upgrade over who we have now, but not worth a 2. Dorsey has been 'blah' too, so he doesn't exactly make that deal any more enticing.

I would do a 3rd rounder for Albert, Dorsey, and Johnson.

At worst Albert is an upgrade over the turds we have playing guard, Dorsey has upside even if he has been terrible so far, and Johnson is a solid starter in a 4-3, that can back up all 3 linebacker positions in case of injury.

2009 salary Dorsey $385k, Albert $493k, Johnson $1.5 mil

nero THE zero
10-19-2009, 01:00 PM
So Sapp and McFarland are the model for Okoye and Okam (or whoever.)

Interesting. Repped.

Some more reinforcement on the issue, from the Chron:
One reason the Texans played such good run defense is because they've gotten lighter but more active and aggressive in the defensive line. The kept five ends and three tackles — Jeff Zgonina, Amobi Okoye and Frank Okam — active. Antonio Smith and Tim Bulman played inside as part of the rotation.

“We rallied to the ball and put a lot of hats on him (Benson),” Zgonina said. “It helped that we could chill a little on the bench while the offense was moving the ball so well. We were fresh.”