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View Full Version : Some great news for the jets game!!


gtexan02
09-10-2009, 09:24 AM
Game 1 is almost here. Time to get ready.

Schaub is Starting
http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=5551
Matt Schaub is starting on Sunday against the Jets.

No ifs.

No ands.

No buts.

DRob is coming along really well
http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=5550
(on his thought on how CB Dunta Robinson played) "He's looked good. He made a couple of nice plays today. He picked off one or two passes."


Jacque Reeves is back at practice, and looks to be ready by week 2
http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=5550
(on the status of CB Jacques Reeves) "He's made a lot of progress. He actually practiced some today. So that's a big step in the right direction for him so we'll see but I think all indications were all along, we were looking at week two. So hopefully that will still be the case."

The defense we saw in the preseason was very vanilla
http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=5550
(on how much of their defense was not shown during the preseason) "I would say a good bulk of it of course. In the preseason, you want to improve some things, work on some things. But you definitely don't want to go out there and show, you know, all the tricks you have up your sleeve. As the cliché says, ‘A magician shall not reveal all his secrets.' So that's how we're going to look at this."

The players love Frank Bush's style
http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=5550

(on the difference that defensive coordinator Frank Bush will make) "He's a fun coach. For the first time, he's a coordinator that guys really want to go out and play for on Sunday. I think guys are going to try their best to makes sure he looks good. So I will say that will be the biggest different he'll make. We've got a lot of aggressive players on this defense. We like to and want to fly around and hit people. Like I said, we look good on paper, but we've got to make sure we can translate that over to the field."

:fans:

Blake
09-10-2009, 09:25 AM
Hell yeah.

K.Rhodes25
09-10-2009, 09:29 AM
I saw that ankle problem Schaub had during the Vikings game. I know the Jets saw it too because Vernon Gholston made a comment about playing a QB with a bad ankle. I think the Jets are going to want to see how that ankle really feels.

Thorn
09-10-2009, 09:40 AM
Bah...good news? What kind of talk is that?

Just kidding. I can't wait for this game. It's now time to see the Texans come out and play for real. In my fondest dreams we finally have a good defense this year. I would love LOVE LOVE to see that this Sunday. :texflag:

Texan_Bill
09-10-2009, 09:50 AM
I'm not worried about Matt Schaub's ankle. I'm not worried about Steve Slaton and the running game. I'm not worried about Andre Johnson, Kevin Walter or Owen Daniels and I'm not worried about the Texans offense.

I'm worried about the Jets rushing for 200+ yards and I'm worried about rookie Sanchez torching the Texans secondary.

False Start
09-10-2009, 10:10 AM
I'm not worried about Matt Schaub's ankle. I'm not worried about Steve Slaton and the running game. I'm not worried about Andre Johnson, Kevin Walter or Owen Daniels and I'm not worried about the Texans offense.

I'm worried about the Jets rushing for 200+ yards and I'm worried about rookie Sanchez torching the Texans secondary.

Dont worry, be happy. :ant:

infantrycak
09-10-2009, 10:16 AM
I saw that ankle problem Schaub had during the Vikings game. I know the Jets saw it too because Vernon Gholston made a comment about playing a QB with a bad ankle. I think the Jets are going to want to see how that ankle really feels.

Schaub completed every pass he attempted after the ankle injury tweak in the Vikings game.

michaelm
09-10-2009, 10:25 AM
I saw that ankle problem Schaub had during the Vikings game. I know the Jets saw it too because Vernon Gholston made a comment about playing a QB with a bad ankle. I think the Jets are going to want to see how that ankle really feels.
Not trying to be an ass here, but so what? It's not like they were going to take it easy on him, but now that they know he had a sprained ankle they've decided to try and sack him.

ChampionTexan
09-10-2009, 10:26 AM
Schaub completed every pass he attempted after the ankle injury tweak in the Vikings game.
He also had one of the better games of his career when he came back from last years knee injury on the road against the Packers. That was an instance where folks wondered if he was coming back too soon, and might therefore be vulnerable.

Hopefully, he'll respond to all the current concerns the same way he did in Lambeau field last year.

michaelm
09-10-2009, 10:26 AM
I saw that ankle problem Schaub had during the Vikings game. I know the Jets saw it too because Vernon Gholston made a comment about playing a QB with a bad ankle. I think the Jets are going to want to see how that ankle really feels.
Not trying to be an ass here, but so what? It's not like they were going to take it easy on him, but now that they know he had a sprained ankle they've decided to try and sack him.
And another thing...
Gholston who?

Texan_Bill
09-10-2009, 10:31 AM
Dont worry, be happy. :ant:

Nice!! ;)


I still think the Texans win. I'm just super skeptical of the "D". They have to prove it to me this year.

K.Rhodes25
09-10-2009, 10:40 AM
Not trying to be an ass here, but so what? It's not like they were going to take it easy on him, but now that they know he had a sprained ankle they've decided to try and sack him.

What I'm saying is they may start to roll into that ankle.

Hardcore Texan
09-10-2009, 10:41 AM
Schaub completed every pass he attempted after the ankle injury tweak in the Vikings game.

And the key word here is "tweak". How many times have you rolled an ankle or tweaked it, you hobble for a couple of hours and stay off it a day or two but it is usually something you can heal from pretty quickly. I dont' think that Schaub starting was ever a serious question, I also think had that game against the Vikes been a regular season game he would have stayed on the field.

I expect the D to come after Schaub not matter what, and Gholston needs to close his yapper and worry about just showing up and playing a decent game. :whip:

MeLoveTexans
09-10-2009, 10:42 AM
I saw that ankle problem Schaub had during the Vikings game. I know the Jets saw it too because Vernon Gholston made a comment about playing a QB with a bad ankle. I think the Jets are going to want to see how that ankle really feels.

I saw it too. but gholston has had about the same impact as i have on qb's in the league.

Making observations is about all he has been good for so far

gtexan02
09-10-2009, 10:42 AM
What I'm saying is they may start to roll into that ankle.

So you're saying the Jets are a dirty team? Nice.

mussop
09-10-2009, 10:47 AM
I'm not worried about Matt Schaub's ankle. I'm not worried about Steve Slaton and the running game. I'm not worried about Andre Johnson, Kevin Walter or Owen Daniels and I'm not worried about the Texans offense.

I'm worried about the Jets rushing for 200+ yards and I'm worried about rookie Sanchez torching the Texans secondary.

That has to be the 2 biggest concers. Sanchez look the part to me. His pocket awarness is surprisingly good IMO. If NY'S D turns out to be anything like Baltimores and the running game stays consistant we could be looking at the next Joe Namath. I just hope it takes them till week 2 to figure it all out.

GP
09-10-2009, 11:01 AM
I saw it too. but gholston has had about the same impact as i have on qb's in the league.

Making observations is about all he has been good for so far

LOL. I seriously laughed out loud.

Good post. Rep your way.

False Start
09-10-2009, 11:07 AM
I saw it too. but gholston has had about the same impact as i have on qb's in the league.

Making observations is about all he has been good for so far

Agreed.

"Casper the Friendly Ghost" needs to worry more about himself, and actually making a play every once in awhile, rather than Schaub's ankle. :lion:

Vinny
09-10-2009, 11:08 AM
how do you run 46 looks/formations and consider your defense "vanilla"?

gtexan02
09-10-2009, 11:12 AM
how do you run 46 looks/formations and consider your defense "vanilla"?

It sounds like they've been holding a lot back. Base formations are there, but all the complexities are held until the real bullets come out.

Vinny
09-10-2009, 11:14 AM
It sounds like they've been holding a lot back. Base formations are there, but all the complexities are held until the real bullets come out.complexities like making a tackle? When the Saints back gashed that long TD run vs the team we were in basically a 4-6 formation, shooting all the gaps. What we didn't have was guys like Adibi and the S taking good angles and making solid tackles.

brakos82
09-10-2009, 11:31 AM
:woot2: :fans:

dalemurphy
09-10-2009, 11:33 AM
complexities like making a tackle? When the Saints back gashed that long TD run vs the team we were in basically a 4-6 formation, shooting all the gaps. What we didn't have was guys like Adibi and the S taking good angles and making solid tackles.

I think they solved the LB issue with Diles starting but I am terrified of our safeties. Not many SS in the league are incapable of covering and tackling. Other than Roy Williams, DBarber is about the only one I can think of that has shown zero ability to do either!

I'm thinking back fondly to the days of Eric Davis!

RT22
09-10-2009, 11:34 AM
complexities like making a tackle? When the Saints back gashed that long TD run vs the team we were in basically a 4-6 formation, shooting all the gaps. What we didn't have was guys like Adibi and the S taking good angles and making solid tackles.

Vinny, what defense where we in when the Peterson ran for the 75 yard TD? What ever that alignment was it was the same for the Saints 46 yard TD. It was the same formation by both teams and I fully expect the Jets to run the same play to see if we give them the same look.

Hooston Texan
09-10-2009, 11:39 AM
It sounds like they've been holding a lot back. Base formations are there, but all the complexities are held until the real bullets come out.

OK, so what happens when the opposing offenses suddenly unleash their complexities? I sure didn't see anything exotic from the Saints or the Vikings. Effective, yes, but not exotic. Vanilla is the flavor of the entire league in the preseason (except for Jeff Fisher's peculiar desire to run exotic trick plays in August), and our vanilla got roasted.

Vinny
09-10-2009, 11:48 AM
Vinny, what defense where we in when the Peterson ran for the 75 yard TD? What ever that alignment was it was the same for the Saints 46 yard TD. It was the same formation by both teams and I fully expect the Jets to run the same play to see if we give them the same look.
did you just look at it or are you just guessing? I'd have to look at it myself.

K.Rhodes25
09-10-2009, 12:00 PM
I saw it too. but gholston has had about the same impact as i have on qb's in the league.

Making observations is about all he has been good for so far

Actually I have been surprised with how Gholston has played this preseason, his pass rushing is much improved. He was getting good pressure on Eli Manning when we played the Giants, and against the Eagles he had a great game though against backups.

I'm interested to see if he can carries over the momentum of preseason to this game. We need him to step it up with Pace and Ellis out.

badboy
09-10-2009, 12:06 PM
I was very please to see that Reeves should be back against Jets. Having two starters coming off injuries and Bennett not showing much improvement so far this year, I am very concerned about corners. It would be sweet to see our CBs tested this year early and come up with some turn overs.

brakos82
09-10-2009, 12:07 PM
That's Bennett up top on the line, then Wilson, Diles on the bottom side; Ryans and Adibi at MLB. McClain (or whatever his name is, 41) playing CB deep.

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb23/brakos82/vlcsnap-2009-09-10-08h59m48s24.png

Vinny
09-10-2009, 12:15 PM
That's Bennett up top on the line, then Wilson, Diles on the bottom side; Ryans and Adibi at MLB. McClain (or whatever his name is, 41) playing CB deep.
looks like ten men on the field for us or am I just counting wrong? I can count 11 Vikings.

gtexan02
09-10-2009, 12:18 PM
Haha it does look like there are only 10.... no wonder...

Goldensilence
09-10-2009, 12:19 PM
Good news on Schaub though I think most of us expected he'd get the start.

Really would've liked to see Dunta come in a little earlier then he did , but I'll take what I can get when it comes to improving the secondary and someone who can tackle at least.

Good new on Reeves as well. Hopefully Bennett will show up across from Dunta this week.

I've heard the vanilla defense excuse before on how the it looked in pre-season. Prove to me this is actually the case this year, because until I see it I can only think we'll see Dick Smith's version of what a defense looks like. I hope a healthy Cushing makes a big impact on our Lbing corps.

Vinny
09-10-2009, 12:19 PM
Haha it does look like there are only 10.... no wonder...perhaps they weren't playing vanilla after all. They were playing stupid.

Hardcore Texan
09-10-2009, 12:21 PM
My vanilla is better than your vanilla.......or something like that.

Texans_Chick
09-10-2009, 12:39 PM
complexities like making a tackle? When the Saints back gashed that long TD run vs the team we were in basically a 4-6 formation, shooting all the gaps. What we didn't have was guys like Adibi and the S taking good angles and making solid tackles.

Yeah, there was a lot of this talk from the staff after the Saints game too. That they saw what the Saints were doing but weren't going to pull out the tools yet to combat it.

Whatever the complexities, I'm with you on the tackling and just the basically not blowing your assignment thing. They looked confused and overmatched.

I'm not liking this talk at all:

(on if we will see more of an aggressive Frank Bush defense) "I would definitely say that we started building towards that over the last couple preseason games. Now that D-Rob (Dunta Robinson) and is back, (LB Brian) Cushing is back, you're going to see a more intense style of defense. If you talk to Frank Bush, he wants one of those types of defenses that like Buddy Ryan had back in the day in Chicago Bears. Just fly around and hit people. Maybe get some flags or whatever, but you want to let people know that you came to play and its going to be a real physical game."

Physical I'm good with. Stupid I'm not. They are already going to have difficulties getting close calls going their way because of all the young players, and not having much of a rep other than being sorry.

Bush was talking at the luncheon the other day about blowing people up but at least in the MNF game they look like they missed some tackles because they were trying to take the kill shot.

So what do you think the over/under on the tough guy fights are on Sunday?

badboy
09-10-2009, 12:41 PM
looks like ten men on the field for us or am I just counting wrong? I can count 11 Vikings.The guy in stripes is on our side.

texasguy346
09-10-2009, 12:41 PM
looks like ten men on the field for us or am I just counting wrong? I can count 11 Vikings.

I count 10 as well. Is there a safety back really deep that just isn't pictured? Or did the Texans really only line up 10 men? I have erased that game from my DVR so I can't go back and look at the play.

Texans_Chick
09-10-2009, 12:41 PM
One thing I did like to see in the preseason was tipped balls by the defensive line. IIRC, this is something they were working on more with Kollar. Being able to time that if they couldn't get to the QB in time. (Don't know where I know that from).

I don't know if there is any place that tracks stats of tipped balls, but I don't recall the Texans as being particularly good at doing that.

HOU-TEX
09-10-2009, 12:48 PM
Yeah, there was a lot of this talk from the staff after the Saints game too. That they saw what the Saints were doing but weren't going to pull out the tools yet to combat it.

Whatever the complexities, I'm with you on the tackling and just the basically not blowing your assignment thing. They looked confused and overmatched.

I'm not liking this talk at all:



Physical I'm good with. Stupid I'm not. They are already going to have difficulties getting close calls going their way because of all the young players, and not having much of a rep other than being sorry.

Bush was talking at the luncheon the other day about blowing people up but at least in the MNF game they look like they missed some tackles because they were trying to take the kill shot.

So what do you think the over/under on the tough guy fights are on Sunday?

Playing physical in the NFL these days will occasionally draw penalty flags due to the 40 different rules on how not to hit somebody.

badboy
09-10-2009, 01:00 PM
Playing physical in the NFL these days will occasionally draw penalty flags due to the 40 different rules on how not to hit somebody.But are not most them to eliminate illegal blocks (Schaub and Wilson) or the wedge which led to the player neck injury? You can still tackle a guy without ending his career or life.

Vinny
09-10-2009, 01:03 PM
Playing physical in the NFL these days will occasionally draw penalty flags due to the 40 different rules on how not to hit somebody.they need to just put flags on QB's and get it over with.

michaelm
09-10-2009, 01:07 PM
I've heard the vanilla defense excuse before on how the it looked in pre-season. Prove to me this is actually the case this year, because until I see it I can only think we'll see Dick Smith's version of what a defense looks like.

I guess we're seeing different things.
I've seen a ton of things this preseason that don't look like anything that Dick Smith put on the field.
Mostly, it's differences in what the front seven is doing (or front eight, really because we've been showing more eight men in the box looks than before, IMO).
For starters, the front 7-8 is really mixing up their pre-snap alignments, showing different looks.
They've been showing a lot of pre-snap blitz looks, then mixing it up alot as to weather they actually blitz or drop out of the blitz at the snap.
I think this gives a 4-3 alignment one of the advantages of a 3-4 alignment, which is to show the offense a lot of guys who could be coming at the snap, and then mixing up who actually does come at the snap.
That's the big thing with the 3-4. You can't really get a handle on where the fifth or sixth rusher is going to come from.
Basically all I remember from Smith's defense last year is that we would invariable see one LB (DeMeco) lining up in a blitz look, and then he would almost always drop out of it. IIRC, the times he actually blitzed (few), he wasn't showing a pre-snap blitz look, and usually those were delayed blitzes.
All in all, I think it's going to look completely different. Whether it's a 46 look or a standard 4-3 under with an extra man in or out of the box, I think you're going to see a lot of pre-snap looks to camouflage the actual call. Plus a lot more blitzing in general.

DocBar
09-10-2009, 01:18 PM
That has to be the 2 biggest concers. Sanchez look the part to me. His pocket awarness is surprisingly good IMO. If NY'S D turns out to be anything like Baltimores and the running game stays consistant we could be looking at the next Joe Namath. I just hope it takes them till week 2 to figure it all out. Jets fans probably hope he doesn't look like Namath. Probably one of the more overrated passers ever.
The Jets DL is my biggest concern. 3-4 Ds give us fits.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/N/NamaJo00.htm

Vinny
09-10-2009, 01:27 PM
Jets fans probably hope he doesn't look like Namath. Probably one of the more overrated passers ever.
The Jets DL is my biggest concern. 3-4 Ds give us fits.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/N/NamaJo00.htm
That was a different era when you could club a receiver anywhere on the field and there were different rules about hitting QB's. You can't compare stats from one era to the next like you can in baseball where there is not nearly as much evolution in their rules. Namath was a fabulous QB.

76Texan
09-10-2009, 01:34 PM
Vinny, what defense where we in when the Peterson ran for the 75 yard TD? What ever that alignment was it was the same for the Saints 46 yard TD. It was the same formation by both teams and I fully expect the Jets to run the same play to see if we give them the same look.

I don't remember for sure, but I don't think so.
If I remember correctly, we had Diles on the right side.
It was a CB was on the other side that makes it look like a 46 D.

But I'd have to look at it again to be sure.
Man, my memory is terrible!

DocBar
09-10-2009, 01:35 PM
That was a different era when you could club a receiver anywhere on the field and there were different rules about hitting QB's. You can't compare stats from one era to the next like you can in baseball where there is not nearly as much evolution in their rules. Namath was a fabulous QB. I agree with the evolution part, but we can agree to disagree about Namath. I was also comparing him with contemporaries, not just by modern standards at the position.

76Texan
09-10-2009, 01:38 PM
I count 10 as well. Is there a safety back really deep that just isn't pictured? Or did the Texans really only line up 10 men? I have erased that game from my DVR so I can't go back and look at the play.

Yeah there was a deep safety back there.
I can't remember who that was, I had reviewed that play!
Wilson was on the line with Diles.
Crap, my memory is really really bad!

Vinny
09-10-2009, 01:39 PM
I don't remember for sure, but I don't think so.
If I remember correctly, we had Diles on the right side.
It was a CB was on the other side that makes it look like a 46 D.

But I'd have to look at it again to be sure.
Man, my memory is terrible!
I'm pretty sure it was Barber, but I can't figure out if he is beside DeMeco when I look at the pic (the two guys lined up on the 30yd line)

thunderkyss
09-10-2009, 01:44 PM
complexities like making a tackle? When the Saints back gashed that long TD run vs the team we were in basically a 4-6 formation, shooting all the gaps. What we didn't have was guys like Adibi and the S taking good angles and making solid tackles.

I agree, that tackling is an area of big concern. I also agree 46 defensive alignment "should" be one of those "secrets" you don't show too early. But, we obviously needed/need full game speed practice.

looks like ten men on the field for us or am I just counting wrong? I can count 11 Vikings.

Barber is playing way back.

As far as tackling goes, not one Texans laid a hand on AD on that play. The main issue was that Adibi over pursued, and tried to hit the same hole Ryans was filling.

McCain could get around his WR block.....

Next to poor gap assignment by Adibi, Barber overpursuing to the play side also appeared to be a problem.

You play the 46, when you're expecting a run. This was the first play from scrimmage, 1st & 10, They're lined up in the I with 2 WRs on the weak side. Looks like run. When the ball is snapped, the QB turns around and sticks the ball way out there. Looks like run... the Full back, & the tailback make a B-Line to the strong side, and are quickly met with our SAM, Safety, LDE, & 3 tech. There's no where to go. The Full back sees this, and breaks off into the first cutback hole, which is created behind Amobi Okoye.

I'd like to take the time here, to say that Diles did an excellent job pushing the Tighend 2 yards behind the LOS, and turning him into the play. Because of this, the play is turned back inside, there is no chance for the run to bounce to the outside.

Antonio Smith also does a good job of standing up the LT. As Okoye did standing up the LG. They are both on the LOS, not getting pushed back an inch. Antonio Smith was lined up just inside the hash mark & when the fullback broke his route, Antonio was on top of the hash mark. Meaning he was moved to the left. Maybe a little more than a foot. Same thing with Okoye, he may have been moved a foot to the playside. But they both dug in and held their ground.

Sean Cody is playing the nose on this play. At the snap of the ball, he doesn't lay a hand on the center. Which IMHO is unexcusable. He is lined up directly over the Center. The Center has no obstruction to Demeco Ryans, and lays a helmet on him. Cody is caught by the RG, and is moved quite a ways to the left. The guard is pushing him to the left, and he's trying to get around the guard to the left at the same time. The Fullback makes it past him, but there's no way Peterson would have. Adibi is right behind Cody. If there was a gap there, maybe he could have sneaked in behind the Center, and nailed Peterson in the backfield... but there wasn't. He decides to go over the Center/DeMeco block, and follow the fullback.

So, AD cuts back into the second cut back lane, formed to the right of Cody. This lane was created by the RG attacking Cody from the side, and pushing him to the left, and the RT standing up to Mario Williams. Mario was doing a fine job of pushing him into the Pile, but one of the two recievers came back and threw a "crack block" right at Mario's hip, knocking Mario off balance, and by the time he recovered, the play was past him.

After getting through this hole, Peterson heads straight up between the hashmarks. McCain is trying to fight his way to the left side of a pretty good Bobby Wade block. Peterson then breaks off to the right, and there's nothing McCain can do.

When Barber finally shows up into the picture, he is so far to the left of the left hashmarks, I've got to assume he was so far on the play side, that he followed the fullback into the first cutback lane.

IMHO, he should have been able to read the play, and make a line from where he lined up, 13 yards back, on the left hash mark to that second cut back lane, before Peterson got to McCain... but he didn't.

RT22
09-10-2009, 01:48 PM
did you just look at it or are you just guessing? I'd have to look at it myself.

I looked, but I couldn't tell what defense it was. On both plays Mario was the weak side, Okam was the on the nose vs the Saints and Cody vs the Vikings, Okoye was the other DT on both plays and Smith was the strong side DE. Diles was the strong side LB, Ryans the MLB and Adibi on the weak side. What I noticed was that on both plays Mario and Antonio switched sides and Adibi and Diles switched side also pre-snap. I have the Saints game on DVR but don't have the Vikings game. My observations came from the live game (on tv) and the multiple replays of the Petersen TD run.

Vinny
09-10-2009, 01:51 PM
Barber is playing way back.
I think I just spotted him. He's to the left of David Anderson in this pic.
http://susanwiggs.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/wayback-machine2.jpg

76Texan
09-10-2009, 01:52 PM
I guess we're seeing different things.
I've seen a ton of things this preseason that don't look like anything that Dick Smith put on the field.
Mostly, it's differences in what the front seven is doing (or front eight, really because we've been showing more eight men in the box looks than before, IMO).
For starters, the front 7-8 is really mixing up their pre-snap alignments, showing different looks.
They've been showing a lot of pre-snap blitz looks, then mixing it up alot as to weather they actually blitz or drop out of the blitz at the snap.
I think this gives a 4-3 alignment one of the advantages of a 3-4 alignment, which is to show the offense a lot of guys who could be coming at the snap, and then mixing up who actually does come at the snap.
That's the big thing with the 3-4. You can't really get a handle on where the fifth or sixth rusher is going to come from.
Basically all I remember from Smith's defense last year is that we would invariable see one LB (DeMeco) lining up in a blitz look, and then he would almost always drop out of it. IIRC, the times he actually blitzed (few), he wasn't showing a pre-snap blitz look, and usually those were delayed blitzes.
All in all, I think it's going to look completely different. Whether it's a 46 look or a standard 4-3 under with an extra man in or out of the box, I think you're going to see a lot of pre-snap looks to camouflage the actual call. Plus a lot more blitzing in general.
There's really nothing in the PS that we have'nt seen before.
Even the 46 (which I only noticed twice in the PS, one on a 12yd run by the Saints and that TD run by Peterson).

Just that we hardly use exotic schemes.
In the thread where I review some of last year game, for example.
There were a few instances when we left the Center uncovered.
Two LBs would hover in the middle, both threatening him.
They have to decide whether to keep the RB back to block.
(It was a single back formation).

Or we would be in a 3-3 look with Nading play standing up and running around. We would be in a nickel situation then, with two LBs.

Or we could put 2 men on the Center threatening to overcome him.
And a LB or 2 behind, ready for some blitzing.

I can't remember them all.

hookinreds
09-10-2009, 01:57 PM
looks like ten men on the field for us or am I just counting wrong? I can count 11 Vikings.

I'm only counting 10 Vikings too, unless Farve is covering up one, but that looks like his number, not another player.

hookinreds
09-10-2009, 01:58 PM
I think I just spotted him. He's to the left of David Anderson in this pic.
http://susanwiggs.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/wayback-machine2.jpg

Awesome! The way back machine!

76Texan
09-10-2009, 02:10 PM
Next to poor gap assignment by Adibi, Barber overpursuing to the play side also appeared to be a problem.

When Barber finally shows up into the picture, he is so far to the left of the left hashmarks, I've got to assume he was so far on the play side, that he followed the fullback into the first cutback lane.

IMHO, he should have been able to read the play, and make a line from where he lined up, 13 yards back, on the left hash mark to that second cut back lane, before Peterson got to McCain... but he didn't.
To be fair to Barber, when Peterson started to get into the secondary, he couldn't decide which way to go.

We had two CBs on the outside.
Bennett went after the WR (who went into Mario to tie him up) and got caught in traffic.
McCain or Quin, (I can't remember which one) couldn't shake of his man.
Barber had to stay inside first.
And he just didn't have the speed to get back outside.
He wasn't slow, but AP was too fast and too quick.

Adibi was too eager.
He read the FB's block and was fooled.
He was trying to make a big play and forgot his main gap assignment.
I feel his pain though. 'Cause we had Mario and 2 CBs to contain that side (and couldn't).
Adibi took the risk and it bit him in the rear end.

76Texan
09-10-2009, 02:13 PM
I'm pretty sure it was Barber, but I can't figure out if he is beside DeMeco when I look at the pic (the two guys lined up on the 30yd line)

That was Adibi next to Demeco.

The CB was either McCain or Quin, I can't remember.

76Texan
09-10-2009, 02:19 PM
Antonio Smith also does a good job of standing up the LT. As Okoye did standing up the LG.


What happens to the penetrating defense we've heard so much about? http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/images/icons/icon10.gif

Vinny
09-10-2009, 02:23 PM
That was Adibi next to Demeco.

The CB was either McCain or Quin, I can't remember.
I think I identified everyone. You are correct about Adibi and Ryans. G Quin is over the TE at the bottom next to Diles, Bennett is up top over Mario and McCain is at the top of the screen. Apparently Barber lined up in Galveston County and is off the screen. :fans:

ObsiWan
09-10-2009, 02:29 PM
looks like ten men on the field for us or am I just counting wrong? I can count 11 Vikings.

Oh SNAP!
LOL! no wonder we got torched...

HOU-TEX
09-10-2009, 02:30 PM
they need to just put flags on QB's and get it over with.

I know we kid about this often, but I reckon something just as ridiculous is not far in the horizon.

Like QB's wearing uniforms with remote contact switches sewn into them. If a switch is hit outside of a 3 inch diameter around the belly button it'll send a buzz to the ref to throw a flag.

thunderkyss
09-10-2009, 02:33 PM
Looking at this play, seeing all the things we did wrong, I also notice a lot of the things I don't see our guys doing.

That Center targeting DeMeco and putting a helmet on him is an excellent example. I rarely see any of our guys make it to the second level, and put a hit on someone. Instead, they lay down in front of them, or they'll try to play pattycake with them.

I'll take our first running play as an example. We line up in the I formation, with a receiver lined up wide on either side. They're lined up in a 4-3 under look, with the SAM on the LOS.. basically, a 5 man front. Their SS is between 9 & 10 yards back, and their FS is out of the picture, presumably 12 yards back. The Mike is Over the left guard, looking at the A & B gap. The Will is over the right guard.

At the snap of the ball, things look good, with a huge hole opening on the weak side, right away. Winston Holds up the DE two yards behind the LOS, but not getting any closer to the play. Briesel jumps out and puts a helmet on the Will, just like I say I rarely see. Myers Stands up the DT(Pat Williams), and Vonta has a huge hole to run to.

Now, I'm going to admit that I don't know all the intricicies of what the OL is supposed to do. I'm just going to tell you what I see, and give you my opinions.

That huge hole gets small, very fast. One thing is that Vonta Leach takes up a lot of space. Secondly, Chester Pitts helps Myers move Pat Williams into the hole. Was he supposed to do that? I don't know. But seeing Myers go straight up on Williams, & the huge whole that quickly developed I don't think so. But seeing how everyone else on the line (with the exeption of OD & AJ) started to the right, I would think Myers wasn't supposed to take on Pat Williams one-on-one. It's possible that Pat Williams is faster off the snap than our guys, and Myers had no choice. But had Myers taken off to the right, Pitts would have been there to take on Williams from the side.

Duane Brown is also playing. He moves right, and lays a clean cut block on Kevin Williams. At this time there is a huge hole to the left. Jared Allen is making a B-Line to Schaub, and is in no position to tackle Slaton if he decided to cut back to his left. OD as I mentioned earlier went to the left, and is in position to lay a block on the SAM. The MLB, just like our MLB is chasing the play to the play side. If Slaton was to cut back now, the MLB would have to change direction, and make his way around the DTs... I'm speculating, that he wouldn't have been able to do it. I also can't see the SS but I can see six yards beyond the LOS.

As the play develops to the playside, Briesel does an excellent job of pushing the WILL out of the play. Andre Johnson came inside to take on the safety. Vonta Leach also makes it to the second level, to lay a hit on that same safety. The Cornerback watching Johnson is free to make a play, & with the help of Chester Pitts, Pat Williams is in that huge hole, waiting for Slaton.

Now I know some people are going to blame Myers, because it was Pat Williams who made the intitial tackle on Steve Slaton. I can also see blaming Myers for blocking straight up on Pat Williams.... But in a similar play that went for 75 yards not very long ago, Their OL didn't do any better of a job of containging the DTs. Sean Cody would have made the tackle for as small a gain, had Peterson continued to run to that quickly closing hole.

Had Slaton cut back, would anyone have blamed Pat or Kevin Williams for giving up a big play? I doubt it. Not just because they are the Williams.... but because they did their jobs, and prevented the run from going to the play side.

What I think should have happened, Myers should have taken off for the MLB, not worrying about Pat Williams. Chester should have taken on Williams. Vonta should have layed a helmet on Winfield.

But above all else, Slaton should have cut it back to his left.

I know after the New Orleans game, I said Slaton had a problem bouncing to his right. On this play in particular, I don't think he read his blocks correctly.

Again, with the play of Myers, and I don't know what he was supposed to do.... It looks like a weakside Isolation run. But with the play of Pitts & Briesel, it looks like it should have been the Zone Stretch.

76Texan
09-10-2009, 02:47 PM
I think I identified everyone. You are correct about Adibi and Ryans. G Quin is over the TE at the bottom next to Diles, Bennett is up top over Mario and McCain is at the top of the screen. Apparently Barber lined up in Galveston County and is off the screen. :fans:

LOL!

I believe it was Wilson over the TE, not Quin.

76Texan
09-10-2009, 02:52 PM
What happens to the penetrating defense we've heard so much about? http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/images/icons/icon10.gif

Basically, on this play, most if not all our players bought the run to our right side. And we failed to contain the back side.

There were a lot of fingers to be laid here.
But also, it was a lot of AP that we saw, cutting on a dime and sliding and shifting in full gear like nothing at all !

So don't feel too bad, LOL!

76Texan
09-10-2009, 02:58 PM
I looked, but I couldn't tell what defense it was. On both plays Mario was the weak side, Okam was the on the nose vs the Saints and Cody vs the Vikings, Okoye was the other DT on both plays and Smith was the strong side DE. Diles was the strong side LB, Ryans the MLB and Adibi on the weak side. What I noticed was that on both plays Mario and Antonio switched sides and Adibi and Diles switched side also pre-snap. I have the Saints game on DVR but don't have the Vikings game. My observations came from the live game (on tv) and the multiple replays of the Petersen TD run.

OK, I just looked at it again. The Mike Bell's TD run in the Saints game.
Like I said, it wasn't a 46.
But it was the 4-3 under that many folks here are dying to see the Texans make their main front...

Diles was on the LOS on the strong side.
Frankie took this further in the exotic level and loaded that side with all 3 LBs.

On the weak side, we used Bennett on the LOS (that's why it looks like a 46) but he was on the receiver.
We had another CB and a safety behind. All these guys were used to contain that side.

Small wonder they cut back to that side.

thunderkyss
09-10-2009, 03:20 PM
Now, I'm going to break down our second play from scrimmage against the Vikings. It shows more of what we don't do. Or can't do on offense.

We're lined up in Single back formation, Two wide receivers, two TEs. Both TEs are lined up on the left. Hill on the LOS, and OD as the H-back.

At the snap, everyone moves left. With the exception of OD, who cuts back behind our ine, and takes on the weakside DE, & Winston who heads straight into the secondary, and lays the weakest cut block you could expect from a man his size, on a LB. The Will just steps around him, while Winston is laying on the ground, helpless to contribute to the play.

Briesel takes on Pat Williams, but he cut in front of him so fast, that he has to hook his shoulder pad, and probably would have been called for a hold, had the play come back to the weak side. IMO, Briesel should have targeted Williams' shoulder, and attacked him from the side, instead of cutting in front of him the way he did.

The defensive line is also slanting to our left, maybe that's why Briesel had difficulty getting his hands on Pat Williams. I don't know. But because of the DL slanting left, there really is no one for Myers to work against. He should have IMO, put the initial block on PW, then proceed to the second level & take out the SAM. This would have created the big holes New Orleans had, when the ZBSed us to death.

Pitts is doing a fine job pusing Kevin Williams to the far left of the field. Until Duane Brown, who couldn't find anything better to do, decides to help him, and push Kevin Williams back into Chester. The result of them double teaming Kevin Williams is that he is moved off the LOS.. about three yards or so.

Anthony Hill is stood up by Jared Allen, who sheds Hill as a blocker and looks inside to make a play. Just from watching this from my recliner, it looked like Brown started to help Hill with Allen. But Allen shot around the Tightend, leaving Brown with nothing to do. Hill recovered, after being stood up. He should have made an effort to keep Allen moving in his pass rushing arch, keeping him out of the play.

Duane Brown should have gone into the second level & helped Kevin Walter block out the CB. Kevin was pretty much holding on that play, and we should have been called for that, it was so obvious.

After Slaton got the ball, he made a good read, that there was nothing happening to the left, and tried to change direction. Owen Daniel did a good job of pulling, and blocking the weakside DE. Had Winston made a good effort block, and not that futile laydown in front of the WLB, Slaton would have had somewhere to go. But as it stood, he made the best out of a busted play, and picked up a couple of yards made possible by Duan Brown & Chester Pitts pushing Kevin Williams back.

The SLB made the initial tackle. This is the guy Myers was free to attack and make a block 5 yards past the LOS, but didn't. Intead, he made a weak attempt of blocking him after the SLB was at the LOS.

Like I said, I don't know what those guys are supposed to do. But from my understanding of the ZBS, it looks like they were supposed to block whoever crossed their face, or get to the second level. It didn't appear that Myers & Brown had done that. If they had, there would have been lots of room to run on the play side. If Winston had thrown a good block on the weakside, there would have been lots of room to run on the weakside.

I know a most people aren't worried about the offense. But I am. I'm watching our starters in the 3rd preseason game of the year. This is their "dress rehersal". My DVR got wiped, so I can't go back and watch last years games. I thought they played better than this, and running lanes opened up pretty well. Now, I'm beginning to wonder if that wasn't just the talented Steve Slaton creating running lanes. If it was, I think we're going to be in trouble offensively.

Defensively, I know we've got some issues. But with all that's taken place this offseason, we should expect that. For us to get to where we want to be, and consistently win games, our offense has got to come out of the gate, firing on all cylinders.

I haven't seen anything this preaseason to show that would be the case. The passing game looks good. the pass blocking looks decent. But we're one dimensional, and Slaton's stats show it.

thunderkyss
09-10-2009, 03:25 PM
OK, I just looked at it again.
Like I said, it wasn't a 46.
But it was the 4-3 under that many folks here are dying to see the Texans make their main front...


The picture clearly shows Wilson right next to Diles, over the Tightend. That's why they are saying it was the 46.

I agree that it should only be called a 46, if you have two LBs on the LOS, and the SS next to the MLB.... but here, most fans agree that 6 men on the LOS, one safety over the top, is the 46.

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb23/brakos82/vlcsnap-2009-09-10-08h59m48s24.png

76Texan
09-10-2009, 03:30 PM
The picture clearly shows Wilson right next to Diles, over the Tightend. That's why they are saying it was the 46.

I agree that it should only be called a 46, if you have two LBs on the LOS, and the SS next to the MLB.... but here, most fans agree that 6 men on the LOS, one safety over the top, is the 46.

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb23/brakos82/vlcsnap-2009-09-10-08h59m48s24.png

We were talking about the Saints' TD, not this one.

I believe I was the one who brought up the AP's TD run caught us in the 46.

Let me edit my above-post to clarify things.

I know both plays.

Vinny
09-10-2009, 03:41 PM
http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/chats

AFC South chat...didn't want to start a new thread, but I found this on twitter

gtexan02
09-10-2009, 05:03 PM
http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/chats

AFC South chat...didn't want to start a new thread, but I found this on twitter

http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/chat/_/id/28247

Scroll down about 3/4 to find the AFC S guy.