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Carr Bombed
08-31-2009, 10:54 PM
Anybody else worried about our franchise back?

I know he didn't have many holes tonight, but this preseason it's obvious that the weight gain has taken away some of his quickness and explosiveness. I wasn't for the weight gain and I hope he can find his first step, his big plays were huge last year (He was single-handedly responsible for our leap to the #3 offense last year). So far this year he isn't making anybody miss.

SteveSlaton20
08-31-2009, 11:03 PM
nah, i thought he played okay, especially against one of the best, if not the best defensive line in the nation...

m5kwatts
08-31-2009, 11:09 PM
Can we save our judgements for the regular season? Chris Johnson is averaging 2.2 ypc in preseason. Dear Lord we wanna jump the gun on so many guys and its freakin preseason.

V3rm0nt3r
08-31-2009, 11:09 PM
against the williams i didn't think he did too bad. didn't play great, but it IS preseason people.

DocBar
08-31-2009, 11:10 PM
To be honest, I think he looked like what he was drafted to be: a 3rd down back. I don't know if it's the extra weight or the weight of expectations, but something is slowing him down.

Carr Bombed
08-31-2009, 11:10 PM
nah, i thought he played okay, especially against one of the best, if not the best defensive line in the nation...

He had a good goalline carry and that was it........but I'm not just talking about this game (that's not what this thread is about), I'm talking about all the carries he's had this preseason. It's obvious the guy is not as quick or elusive as last season.

Carr Bombed
08-31-2009, 11:11 PM
To be honest, I think he looked like what he was drafted to be: a 3rd down back. I don't know if it's the extra weight or the weight of expectations, but something is slowing him down.

It's the weight.......it's the same thing that slowed him down his junior season and that's the reason why he fell to the third round. He was a Heisman hopeful before that.

Carr Bombed
08-31-2009, 11:12 PM
but it IS preseason people.

I am so sick of hearing that line.....and again, this thread isn't just about tonight's game. I don't even care about the yards per carry, I'm talking about the ovbious lack of last year's quickness and explosiveness.....anybody can see it.

DocBar
08-31-2009, 11:13 PM
It's the weight.......it's the same thing that slowed him down his junior season and that's the reason why he fell to the third round. He was a Heisman hopeful before that. Then he should go visit Jenny Craig. He looked like a tugboat in dragrace....on LAND.

SteveSlaton20
08-31-2009, 11:13 PM
He had a good goalline carry and that was it........but I'm not just talking about this game (that's not what this thread is about), I'm talking about all the carries he's had this preseason. It's obvious the guy is not as quick or elusive as last season.

true...but like what watts said, it is preseason.

Fox
08-31-2009, 11:15 PM
Not worried. Vikings have a stout run D. Slaton will be alright so long as he stays healthy.

Carr Bombed
08-31-2009, 11:15 PM
true...but like what watts said, it is preseason.

Preseason doesn't have jack crap to do with a player looking slower and less agile than the year before. Read above, I'm not talking about his YPC, I'm talking about what I see when he's running the ball or trying to make someone miss. His cuts aren't as quick or as sharp.

Carr Bombed
08-31-2009, 11:16 PM
not worried. Vikings have a stout run d. Slaton will be alright so long as he stays healthy.

again......

This thread isn't just about tonight's game.

DocBar
08-31-2009, 11:17 PM
Not worried. Vikings have a stout run D. Slaton will be alright so long as he stays healthy. He's looked slow all PS. He just had more touches to drop his YPC tonight.

V3rm0nt3r
08-31-2009, 11:18 PM
true...but like what watts said, it is preseason.

:goodpost:

Texecutioner
08-31-2009, 11:20 PM
Anybody else worried about our franchise back?

I know he didn't have many holes tonight, but this preseason it's obvious that the weight gain has taken away some of his quickness and explosiveness. I wasn't for the weight gain and I hope he can find his first step, his big plays were huge last year (He was single-handedly responsible for our leap to the #3 offense last year). So far this year he isn't making anybody miss.

I've noticed it. I wasn't aware about any weight gain either. Why did he feel that he needed to do that?? He was just fine last season.

I haven't seen a lot of holes for him, but yeah he hasn't seemed to have that quick burst and shiftiness from before.

I'm really worried about this team right now in all aspects.

TexansSeminole
08-31-2009, 11:21 PM
He showed poor vision on some plays. He has been doing a lot of that this preseason. Hope they fix that. I can't tell if he has lost explosveness, he hasn't been in the open field enough for me to make a judgement on that.

Just in the second series he missed two good holes that he could have picked up 5 yards easily, without even getting touched, but he tried to bounce it or cut it back.

Carr Bombed
08-31-2009, 11:21 PM
:goodpost:

Yeah, keep your head in the sand...

You know what I find absolutely Hilarious around here....

"OMG Barwin is for real, I'm sold....he's working his way into the starting lineup, he's the pass rusher we've needed"....yada yada yada


Then when a player/team is not playing as well....

"It's preseason..nothing to see here, walk along folks".

m5kwatts
08-31-2009, 11:21 PM
The weight gain was for long-term purposes, so he can still break tackles in weeks 13,14,15 and so on... he didn't take a bigger workload (20+ carries) until the second half last season, this year he'll be expected to carry the full load all season. Chris Brown will get his carries as well as the other backs but Steve will be expected to carry the load and the weight will help when taking a full NFL season of hits.

Texecutioner
08-31-2009, 11:23 PM
Yeah, keep your head in the sand...

You know what I find absolutely Hilarious around here....

"OMG Barwin is for real, I'm sold....he's working his way into the starting lineup, he's the pass rusher we've needed"....yada yada yada


Then when a player/team is not playing as well....

"It's preseason..nothing to see here".

At least I'm not the only one that notices this.

Texecutioner
08-31-2009, 11:25 PM
The weight gain was for long-term purposes, so he can still break tackles in weeks 13,14,15 and so on... he didn't take a bigger workload (20+ carries) until the second half last season, this year he'll be expected to carry the full load all season. Chris Brown will get his carries as well as the other backs but Steve will be expected to carry the load and the weight will help when taking a full NFL season of hits.

Yeah, but if that causes him to lose his speed burst and quick shiftiness from side to side, then that's not something that's going to help. I've noticed exactly what CB's pointing out. He hasn't looked bad or anything, but I'm not seeing that same explosiveness that CB's referring to either. Of course it would help to see some bigger holes and all, but color me worried not only in this area but a lot of areas.

V3rm0nt3r
08-31-2009, 11:26 PM
Yeah, keep your head in the sand...

You know what I find absolutely Halarious around here....

"OMG Barwin is for real, I'm sold....he's working his way into the starting lineup, he's the pass rusher we've needed"....yada yada yada


Then when a player/team is not playing as well....

"It's preseason..nothing to see here".

calm down dude. no need to make it personal. and i haven't said i'm sold on Barwin at all. he's shown flashes but i've reserved myself (i learned from JJ). i haven't seen all the other games yet but from what i saw tonight he never got enough room to get a head of steam. again, the williams were out there with a very good LB group backing them up. i just don't think it's worth getting into too much in the preseason. like with Amobi or Barwin or Smith. it's too early in the season to mark progression or regression.

and so what if i like being the optomist and like to look at the good side of my team. that's my right ain't it?

disaacks3
08-31-2009, 11:27 PM
He showed poor vision on some plays. He has been doing a lot of that this preseason. Hope they fix that. I can't tell if he has lost explosveness, he hasn't been in the open field enough for me to make a judgement on that.

Just in the second series he missed two good holes that he could have picked up 5 yards easily, without even getting touched, but he tried to bounce it or cut it back. That's the biggest thing I noticed "live" at the stadium tonight. The holes he chose were the bad choices 4 of 5 times.

jppaul
08-31-2009, 11:31 PM
Yeah, he showed some poor vision tonight at points. I think that and the impression that he looked slower tonight have something to do with how good the Vikes D was. There was nowhere to go so he was being patient, but nothing ever developed. Made him look slower.

stingray
08-31-2009, 11:34 PM
:crying:So what is all the fuss... Neither Barwin is great yet and Steve hasn't to this moment his his sophomore slump. It's amazing how many people around here hit the :panic: right away. Talk to me after week four and I will give you an educated guess about Steve Slatons sophomore year.

But Schaub did look injury prone, preseason or regular seaon, it don't matter with that boy.....:gun:

Jackie Chiles
08-31-2009, 11:35 PM
I don't know if it is directly related to his weight gain. What it looks like to me is he is being entirely too patient behind the LOS. I don't know if he is looking to break a big run every carry or he is just shaking off the rust. Overall though I'm not that worried because I trust his talent.

CloakNNNdagger
08-31-2009, 11:38 PM
The weight gain was for long-term purposes, so he can still break tackles in weeks 13,14,15 and so on... he didn't take a bigger workload (20+ carries) until the second half last season, this year he'll be expected to carry the full load all season. Chris Brown will get his carries as well as the other backs but Steve will be expected to carry the load and the weight will help when taking a full NFL season of hits.


It seems that with his extra weight and loss of explosiveness (if it is permanent), he may take a full NFL season of hits by the end of the first half.

m5kwatts
08-31-2009, 11:43 PM
We'll see on Steve, I'm going to reserve judgement until more than a few weeks into the season and not based on limited carries in preseason. Steve didn't set the world on fire in preseason last year either he won the starting job by default and was actually pretty putrid in his first game vs. the Steelers.

Carr Bombed
08-31-2009, 11:47 PM
:crying:So what is all the fuss... Neither Barwin is great yet and Steve hasn't to this moment his his sophomore slump. It's amazing how many people around here hit the :panic: right away. Talk to me after week four and I will give you an educated guess about Steve Slatons sophomore year.

But Schaub did look injury prone, preseason or regular seaon, it don't matter with that boy.....:gun:

I'm not hitting a panic button, because Slaton's weight gain will hopefully make his a tougher inside/goalline runner, I'm talking about a lack of quickness and agility that he had last season. The guy was third in the NFL last year in runs of 20+ yards.......his big play ability is the reason why we were as good as we were last year on offense. I'm simply saying if he can't get that quickness and agility back our offense (which carries our team) is going to take a major hit.

stingray
08-31-2009, 11:56 PM
I'm not hitting a panic button, because Slaton's weight gain will hopefully make his a tougher inside/goalline runner, I'm talking about a lack of quickness and agility that he had last season. The guy was third in the NFL last year in runs of 20+ yards.......his big play ability is the reason why we were as good as we were last year. I'm simply saying if he can't get that quickness and agility back our offense is going to take a hit.

I just wanna see him in the regular season first before I make any real judgements. I wanna see him with 20 touches after a couple of games. I also heard on the Sirius NFL fantasy show that Slaton was the worse back (per carry) in the red zone in the NFL last year. And like you said, the weight gain might help some in the Red Zone.

But obviously, the weight gain won't help him in the red zone if he can't help his team get there. He's gotta read his own body and recognize that if the muscle weight is slowing him down, then he's gotta drop the 8-12 lbs he gained. Well, that is what I am assuming he gained. Does anyone know how weight he gained?

Carr Bombed
09-01-2009, 12:02 AM
But obviously, the weight gain won't help him in the red zone if he can't help his team get there. He's gotta read his own body and recognize that if the muscle weight is slowing him down, then he's gotta drop the 8-12 lbs he gained. Well, that is what I am assuming he gained. Does anyone know how weight he gained?

He looks pretty big....


I will say this, like someone mentioned above, his vision hasn't been that great this preseason. On one running play he had the entire left side of the field to run to (since the DB followed our WR who ran a route and cleared that side of the field), but instead of Slaton running towards that space he ran right into the the Dline.

Things are never as great as the appear and never as bad either, so I'm sure Slaton is going to be productive this season.......I just hope he hasn't lost his big play ability, because that was a BIG part of our offense.

imatexan
09-01-2009, 12:05 AM
I am so sick of hearing that line.....and again, this thread isn't just about tonight's game. I don't even care about the yards per carry, I'm talking about the ovbious lack of last year's quickness and explosiveness.....anybody can see it.

Ya but its the truth.

Carr Bombed
09-01-2009, 12:10 AM
Ya but its the truth.

Not really....

Team records don't mean crap, but individual play does.......if it didn't NFL coaches wouldn't use it to evaluate the talent of their roster and they sure as hell wouldn't use it to decide who stays and who goes.

The "preseason doesn't mean anything" line is completely false and used by fans who want to excuse all bad play by their home team players, while at the same time, they praise the players who played well during those games.

Go ask Kubiak if the preseason means nothing. (again I'm not talking about scores....could care less about that.)

El Tejano
09-01-2009, 12:15 AM
I was actually coming on this site to say the same thing. He doesn't have the same speed, and is looking like a 3rd down back.

My thread was going to be called Start Chris Brown.

Texecutioner
09-01-2009, 12:17 AM
Ya but its the truth.

What in the world do you think pre season is for?? To evaluate how players perform in their circumstances against certain teams. You can't praise guys for playing great on one play or two and then say "oh well it's pre season," when other players aren't showing up in the amount of time they have to get in there and make a few things happen. I watch every team every year in pre season. Not every game, but usually about two of every team's pre season where I'll watch the starting units so I can make my fantasy football evaluations. Players are always being evaluated by their coaches, so why would it be any different for the fans who have to gauge whether some players or units will be successful or not.

imatexan
09-01-2009, 12:26 AM
What in the world do you think pre season is for?? To evaluate how players perform in their circumstances against certain teams. You can't praise guys for playing great on one play or two and then say "oh well it's pre season," when other players aren't showing up in the amount of time they have to get in there and make a few things happen. I watch every team every year in pre season. Not every game, but usually about two of every team's pre season where I'll watch the starting units so I can make my fantasy football evaluations. Players are always being evaluated by their coaches, so why would it be any different for the fans who have to gauge whether some players or units will be successful or not.

Pre-season is to mainly evaluate back-up players and to get the starters used to being in the groove of the game again and making sure that they are not injured.

Has nothing to do what they will do during the regular season, history proves so.

I never get worked up one way or the other as many fans do every year.

Texecutioner
09-01-2009, 12:32 AM
Pre-season is to mainly evaluate back-up players and to get the starters used to being in the groove of the game again and making sure that they are not injured.

Has nothing to do what they will do during the regular season, history proves so.

I never get worked up one way or the other as many fans do every year.

When starters hardly play at all in the pre season, they usually don't have really good regular seasons. It's about getting your rhythm and chemistry going early on. When teams usually don't do that, they typically don't do well. No one is talking about score here. We're talking about watching how teams are playing and what the chemistry looks like. You can tell a lot about a back in the pre season when watching how he runs the ball in certain games even if he's only getting like 7 or 8 carries. You can watch his cuts, his vision, and ability to break tackles and everything else.

imatexan
09-01-2009, 12:34 AM
When starters hardly play at all in the pre season, they usually don't have really good regular seasons. It's about getting your rhythm and chemistry going early on. When teams usually don't do that, they typically don't do well. No one is talking about score here. We're talking about watching how teams are playing and what the chemistry looks like. You can tell a lot about a back in the pre season when watching how he runs the ball in certain games even if he's only getting like 7 or 8 carries. You can watch his cuts, his vision, and ability to break tackles and everything else.

I agree with the chemistry part, that was what I meant by saying "getting in the groove of the game".

TexansSeminole
09-01-2009, 12:41 AM
A 16 game nfl season will take some weight off of you. Perhaps his thinking was that he'll lose weight throughout the season?

stingray
09-01-2009, 12:49 AM
Chemistry is overated.....


Signed, 2008 Dallas Cowboys.

stingray
09-01-2009, 12:52 AM
Lions went 4-0 in last years preseason.

Texecutioner
09-01-2009, 12:53 AM
Lions went 4-0 in last years preseason.

Geez, for the last time NO ONE IS TALKING ABOUT SCORE OR WINS! CB mentioned this like 5 times already.

hot pickle
09-01-2009, 12:55 AM
is it just me or does SS look like he still has a bit of a belly on him?

Carr Bombed
09-01-2009, 12:57 AM
A 16 game nfl season will take some weight off of you. Perhaps his thinking was that he'll lose weight throughout the season?

I hope so.

stingray
09-01-2009, 12:59 AM
Geez, for the last time NO ONE IS TALKING ABOUT SCORE OR WINS! CB mentioned this like 5 times already.

Well, he can mention it 10 more times!!! It's PRESEASON!!!!

Carr Bombed
09-01-2009, 01:12 AM
Well, he can mention it 10 more times!!! It's PRESEASON!!!!

Says all the fans who preached that during 2005...

Now I don't think that's going to happen again, (we have too much talent for that), but you can't just whitewash every bad play by the "It's preseason" line........that's wishful thinking at best. It's obvious to anyone that wants to admit it......Steve Slaton has lost some burst with his weight and talking about it isn't a sin, it's just acknowledging the obvious.

Carr Bombed
09-01-2009, 01:14 AM
is it just me or does SS look like he still has a bit of a belly on him?

No, I've noticed that too.

stingray
09-01-2009, 01:19 AM
Says all the fans who preached that during 2005...

Now I don't think that's going to happen again, (we have too much talent for that), but you can't just whitewash every bad play by the "It's preseason" line........that's wishful thinking at best. It's obvious to anyone that wants to admit it......Steve Slaton has lost some burst with his weight and talking about it isn't a sin, it's just acknowledging the obvious.

Fair enough, we'll talk about it at midseason.

PHAROAH
09-01-2009, 01:30 AM
Slaton is fine he will break loose in the regular season.

JamesC
09-01-2009, 01:46 AM
A lot of people have echoed the same thoughts I've had about Slaton so far. I know its the preseason but he does look like he's lacking that extra burst he had last season. I do remember reading somewhere about him bulking up a bit so he can absorb the extra wear and tear from the long season. Hopefully as the season goes on he can get that speed back.

Runner
09-01-2009, 07:17 AM
I'm not worried about Slaton; I think he'll be fine.

b0ng
09-01-2009, 07:43 AM
I thought Slaton looked fine. The run blocking was not fine though, understandable. The Williams wall is crazy.

TEXANS84
09-01-2009, 08:18 AM
against the williams i didn't think he did too bad. didn't play great, but it IS preseason people.

When they were backed up near the bullpen, I watched the Williams guys and both ends during a timeout. They are huge, made Myers look like he was on roller skates during running plays.
Can't really fault Slaton for not having holes to run through, although he did miss one very huge hole and opted to run to the right side. Pitts and Brown created a massive area that would have been a guaranteed 30 yards.

HoustonFrog
09-01-2009, 08:27 AM
Slaton was 5'9, 185 out of high school. I believe he was 5'9, 197-203 last year. Right now he is listed as 5'9, 215. So that is alot of weight.

When a guys bread and butter is his quickness and how he hits the holes, then weight isn't making him better if he loses that speed. That is what throws defenses off. If Darren Sproles bulked up 20 lbs and was slower, he wouldn't be as effective. Some guys speed and how they get through the line is what makes them the runner they are.

ChampionTexan
09-01-2009, 08:52 AM
Here's the preseason statistics for the top 5 NFL rushers for the last three years. What you see is that five of fifteen averaged 3.5 ypc or less, four of fifteen averaged between 3.5 and 5 ypc, and three exceeded 5 ypc. 3 had no carries at all in preseason:

2008 Regular Season Rushing Leaders:
1. Adrian Peterson (20 carries - 51 yds - 2.6 ypc)
2. Michael Turner (18 carries - 169 yds - 9.4 ypc)
3. Deangelo Williams (26 carries - 188 yds 7.2 ypc)
4. Clinton Portis (15 carries - 50 yds - 3.3 ypc)
5. Steven Jackson (No preseason carries)

2007 Regular Season Rushing Leaders:
1. Adrian Peterson (30 carries - 146 yds - 4.9 ypc)
2. Ladainian Tomlinson - (No preseason carries)
3. Brandon Jacobs (29 carries - 102yds - 3.5 ypc)
4. Brian Westbrook (10 carries - 22 yds - 2.2 ypc)
5. Willie Parker (14 carries - 36 yds - 2.6 ypc)

2006 Regular Season Rushing Leaders:
1. Ladainian Tomlinson (No preseason carries)
2. Larry Johnson (20 carries - 75 yds - 3.8 ypc)
3. Frank Gore (26 carries - 140 yds - 5.4 ypc)
4. Tiki Barber (17 carries - 85 yds - 5.0 ypc)
5. Steven Jackson (19 carries - 73 yds - 3.8 ypc)

Slaton's preseason stats thru 3 games are 22 carries, 69 yds, 2.9 ypc. For those of you showing concern - I can understand. For those of you saying it's preseason, there's some justification for ignoring the preseason performance/statistics even on individual performance basis.

I still prefer to wait a few games into the season before getting into either ecstasy or panic mode.

TexanBacker93
09-01-2009, 09:42 AM
Yeah, keep your head in the sand...

You know what I find absolutely Hilarious around here....

"OMG Barwin is for real, I'm sold....he's working his way into the starting lineup, he's the pass rusher we've needed"....yada yada yada


Then when a player/team is not playing as well....

"It's preseason..nothing to see here, walk along folks".

Those aren't always the same folks, though. In some instances they might be, but I tend to get the impression that there are folks that feel on the edge of doom no matter the time of year and those that can only see the positive. Maybe it is just me, though. I am a little off.

HOU-TEX
09-01-2009, 09:44 AM
I don't think it has anything to do with the added weight. As others have said, his vision hasn't been very good this preseason. I haven't re-watched the game yet, but there were a few plays he either missed the running lane or a wide open cutback.

That said, I think he'll be ok. Hopefully he finds his groove sooner rather than later though.

Goatcheese
09-01-2009, 09:46 AM
I'm more worried about the ineffective run blocking we're getting from the O-line than anything I've seen from Slaton. Last year he had huge lanes to run through, and so far this preseason he's got tiny cracks in a solid wall.

GuerillaBlack
09-01-2009, 09:47 AM
Here's the preseason statistics for the top 5 NFL rushers for the last three years. What you see is that five of fifteen averaged 3.5 ypc or less, four of fifteen averaged between 3.5 and 5 ypc, and three exceeded 5 ypc. 3 had no carries at all in preseason:

2008 Regular Season Rushing Leaders:
1. Adrian Peterson (20 carries - 51 yds - 2.6 ypc)
2. Michael Turner (18 carries - 169 yds - 9.4 ypc)
3. Deangelo Williams (26 carries - 188 yds 7.2 ypc)
4. Clinton Portis (15 carries - 50 yds - 3.3 ypc)
5. Steven Jackson (No preseason carries)

2007 Regular Season Rushing Leaders:
1. Adrian Peterson (30 carries - 146 yds - 4.9 ypc)
2. Ladainian Tomlinson - (No preseason carries)
3. Brandon Jacobs (29 carries - 102yds - 3.5 ypc)
4. Brian Westbrook (10 carries - 22 yds - 2.2 ypc)
5. Willie Parker (14 carries - 36 yds - 2.6 ypc)

2006 Regular Season Rushing Leaders:
1. Ladainian Tomlinson (No preseason carries)
2. Larry Johnson (20 carries - 75 yds - 3.8 ypc)
3. Frank Gore (26 carries - 140 yds - 5.4 ypc)
4. Tiki Barber (17 carries - 85 yds - 5.0 ypc)
5. Steven Jackson (19 carries - 73 yds - 3.8 ypc)

Slaton's preseason stats thru 3 games are 22 carries, 69 yds, 2.9 ypc. For those of you showing concern - I can understand. For those of you saying it's preseason, there's some justification for ignoring the preseason performance/statistics even on individual performance basis.

I still prefer to wait a few games into the season before getting into either ecstasy or panic mode.

This post should end this thread. :)

ChampionTexan
09-01-2009, 10:20 AM
I'm more worried about the ineffective run blocking we're getting from the O-line than anything I've seen from Slaton. Last year he had huge lanes to run through, and so far this preseason he's got tiny cracks in a solid wall.

Don't forget that last night was the first game this year that all 5 of the projected starters played together - and there was no practice together prior to last week.

My concern isn't the blocking in last night's game, but rather if Pitts and Myers are recovered and get enough of a chance to work with the other three guys to continue to build on last years progress from game one.

Carr Bombed
09-14-2009, 06:34 AM
edit

Marcus
09-20-2009, 05:00 PM
I'm not worried about Slaton; I think he'll be fine.

I wish I could agree with you, Runner.

But it's been what . . . 2 regular season games so far . . . and so far, he's not doing anything more than what he did in preseason games.

That's too bad. We won't sniff a winning season without a running game.

Runner
09-20-2009, 05:07 PM
I wish I could agree with you, Runner.

But it's been what . . . 2 regular season games so far . . . and so far, he's not doing anything more than what he did in preseason games.

That's too bad. We won't sniff a winning season without a running game.

I posted that after one game. I'm slightly concerned now, but I think he picks it up the next few games.