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Vinny
07-31-2009, 03:01 PM
"It's a bad message when you look at it because you have top guys on the team not getting deals," Ryans said. "If they want to reward me, they'll reward me. If not, there are other teams out there that'll like to. I can't make them give me the deal." http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/6556278.html

76Texan
07-31-2009, 03:11 PM
LOL, we're going to have replacement players in here soon! :brando:

Runner
07-31-2009, 03:14 PM
It's a good thing for the Texans Dre got extended when he did and missed out on all this. He'd have probably bolted when the chance came if he was treated in a similar manner.

Ryan
07-31-2009, 03:15 PM
OD might be a little more expendable for us in the future with our depth at TE right now, but we really cannot afford to lose Demeco. Lock him up and give him the money he deserves.

Texecutioner
07-31-2009, 03:16 PM
I think Demeco should get a deal though. A pretty good one that's within reason though. Demeco's been a very good player and should be for a very long time. He's only going to be in his 4th year and it would be nice to have our MLB for a long time.

m5kwatts
07-31-2009, 03:21 PM
I think the front office is sending a message that 8-8 last year was NOT acceptable and you don't reward players for underachieving

Hardcore Texan
07-31-2009, 03:22 PM
WTH is the FO doing? How hard is to sign your top performers? :brickwall:

nunusguy
07-31-2009, 03:24 PM
It's a good thing for the Texans Dre got extended when he did and missed out on all this. He'd have probably bolted when the chance came if he was treated in a similar manner.
I think AJ could almost name his price, especially this offseason after his 2008year. The only other player that perhaps would get that treatment is Mario, though I'm surprised that DeMeco hasn't been resigned yet.

Double Barrel
07-31-2009, 03:24 PM
Crappy bottom-dwelling teams treat their good players like this on a regular basis. I hope this is not a trend that becomes the norm around here. Not a good sign to hear from one of our best players.

As far as OD is concerned, until someone else PROVES that he can fill his shoes, I think OD is The Man at TE.

Rick Smith is acting like we've got leverage. We don't. We are a perpetually mediocre to suck franchise, and until that changes with continuous winning seasons and playoff appears, we don't have the upper hand.

Runner
07-31-2009, 03:26 PM
I think the front office is sending a message that 8-8 last year was NOT acceptable and you don't reward players for underachieving

Coaching and the front office have some responsibility for the record too. It isb qually unacceptable for their job performance, right?

CT CSTM
07-31-2009, 03:27 PM
From what I hear the general consensus of the players is that they don't take care of "guys all ready here" and give away funny money to FA's like Jaques Reeves and Antonio Smith. Guys I know that have moved on to other teams say the Texans FO is a quiet joke around the NFL. I don't think it all comes from a bad attitude towards them but they say the mentality in other locker rooms is totally diffrent than here in Houston.

El Tejano
07-31-2009, 03:28 PM
I think the front office is sending a message that 8-8 last year was NOT acceptable and you don't reward players for underachieving

This is a pretty tough statement to make but I think it is also a very true one. Noone has taken a second to look at that perspective.

BSofA04
07-31-2009, 03:29 PM
I understand this all takes time and is probably more complicated of a process than I will ever know, but c'mon Rick!! We need our players 100% focusing on the season and not if they're getting hosed.

Texanmike02
07-31-2009, 03:29 PM
I like Demeco. He's a fine player.

Having said that, he's not a top tier player. He's in the second tier of MLBs in the league and certainly not irreplacable. Lets keep in mind that he's the 2nd best player on an average defense. If he resigns that is great but the world doesn't end if we have to draft a MLB next year.

Mike

TheRealJoker
07-31-2009, 03:30 PM
Crappy bottom-dwelling teams treat their good players like this on a regular basis. I hope this is not a trend that becomes the norm around here. Not a good sign to hear from one of our best players.

As far as OD is concerned, until someone else PROVES that he can fill his shoes, I think OD is The Man at TE.

Rick Smith is acting like we've got leverage. We don't. We are a perpetually mediocre to suck franchise, and until that changes with continuous winning seasons and playoff appears, we don't have the upper hand.

Perennial contenders like the Patriots also treat their top players like this outside the one or two chosen players deemed irreplaceable. I'm not condoning the Texans actions by any means, but maybe the coaches and FO think they can get by without certain disgruntled players.

I know i'd hate to find out if that's true going into a season like this where expectations are so high and we've yet to have a winning season.

awtysst
07-31-2009, 03:32 PM
I think Meco and OD will get their deals. While they would love to get paid now, they need to relaize that Rick Smith has been working on getting the players without contracts in (ie the rookies and DR). Cush will hopefully soon be signed. Smith can then turn his attention toward getting a new deal for meco and OD that is acceptable to them and cap friendly.

Jackie Chiles
07-31-2009, 03:33 PM
From what I hear the general consensus of the players is that they don't take care of "guys all ready here" and give away funny money to FA's like Jaques Reeves and Antonio Smith. Guys I know that have moved on to other teams say the Texans FO is a quiet joke around the NFL. I don't think it all comes from a bad attitude towards them but they say the mentality in other locker rooms is totally diffrent than here in Houston.

The current FO, the previous one or both? No disrespect to the guys you know that have moved on but I honestly cannot think of a player we have lost to another team that I was really upset about. Now if we lose a couple of the guys currently unhappy about their situations my view on this could change pretty quickly.

Porky
07-31-2009, 03:33 PM
Let me call the Waaambulance for these guys. How do they make it on that salary? :crying:

Runner
07-31-2009, 03:39 PM
It's a good thing for the Texans Dre got extended when he did and missed out on all this. He'd have probably bolted when the chance came if he was treated in a similar manner.
I think AJ could almost name his price, especially this offseason after his 2008year. The only other player that perhaps would get that treatment is Mario, though I'm surprised that DeMeco hasn't been resigned yet.

I don't know. If he hadn't signed the extension and his original contract was running out, and then he publicly held out in "this economy", I think a segment of this board would talk about his greed, dropped passes, injuries, and the depth behind him to show he should be cut.

ArlingtonTexan
07-31-2009, 03:39 PM
Crappy bottom-dwelling teams treat their good players like this on a regular basis. I hope this is not a trend that becomes the norm around here. Not a good sign to hear from one of our best players.

As far as OD is concerned, until someone else PROVES that he can fill his shoes, I think OD is The Man at TE.

Rick Smith is acting like we've got leverage. We don't. We are a perpetually mediocre to suck franchise, and until that changes with continuous winning seasons and playoff appears, we don't have the upper hand.


My bigest concern is that every player seem to get some version of pissed which may go to how the Texans (specifically Rick Smith) are handling things which are pretty much the course of normal NFL business. There are always one or two who get mad, but seems like everybody comes away with some sort of distate in his mouth here.

Looking at this from Texans' management side, even if these players have performed well, I am not sure if it is good business (or football) to have 6 or 7 guys paid at the top 5 or their positions when the organization has never even made the playoffs much less won a playoff game.

There is a line of rewarding players for good performance and making players truly earn it. Think the Texans are in the process of trying to figure it out the balance.

Vinny
07-31-2009, 03:39 PM
Let me call the Waaambulance for these guys. How do they make it on that salary? :crying:
I don't think any of them claim they can't make it on a NFL salary. I bet if you worked say in a computer call center and all the highest rated staff made 18 bucks an hour but you only made 12 bucks an hour, you would cry foul too. It's all about your share of what your peers are making.

Goldensilence
07-31-2009, 03:42 PM
I wonder if their and the FO's attitude would be different if there wasn't a looming uncapped year and the contract extensions associated with these two players.

When you draft guys who work well within a scheme or are just good solid players like Demeco contract problems are going to be an invetiability. I like Demeco and OD a lot, I don't think they are neccesarily getting treated bad in this process, but I do think they deserve to be rewarded for the work they've put in. Long as both aren't asking for elite money, which well honestly neither is elite, but the yare booth real good players.

Lock em up and stop waiting on Dunta to make a move.

Hardcore Texan
07-31-2009, 03:43 PM
From what I hear the general consensus of the players is that they don't take care of "guys all ready here" and give away funny money to FA's like Jaques Reeves and Antonio Smith. Guys I know that have moved on to other teams say the Texans FO is a quiet joke around the NFL. I don't think it all comes from a bad attitude towards them but they say the mentality in other locker rooms is totally diffrent than here in Houston.

Well that's pretty disheartening to hear.

El Tejano
07-31-2009, 03:48 PM
Crappy bottom-dwelling teams treat their good players like this on a regular basis. I hope this is not a trend that becomes the norm around here. Not a good sign to hear from one of our best players.

As far as OD is concerned, until someone else PROVES that he can fill his shoes, I think OD is The Man at TE.

Rick Smith is acting like we've got leverage. We don't. We are a perpetually mediocre to suck franchise, and until that changes with continuous winning seasons and playoff appears, we don't have the upper hand.

I also agree with this statement. Cardinals, Lions, heck - The Oilers did this too!

MojoMan
07-31-2009, 03:48 PM
He is under contract right now isn't he? The priority needs to be signing Brian Cushing and getting him into camp. DeMeco is engaging in negotiating tactics. The front office is well familiar with his situation. They will get to his contract when the time is right.

El Tejano
07-31-2009, 03:50 PM
I wonder how many people will give back their season tickets as a sign of disapproval from the fans.

Vinny
07-31-2009, 03:51 PM
I wonder how many people will give back their season tickets as a sign of disapproval from the fans.
I'd say......none.

Texanmike02
07-31-2009, 03:52 PM
If we win 10 games this year this will all be a distant memory. Either we'll sign OD and Demeco or we won't. If you win 10 games however, with the young talent we have assembled, we won't have to overpay for freeagents... and would be able to find someone to fill his shoes. Two years ago I thought Demeco was really really special... Every year since however, I've felt he's regressed. He makes tackles out the wazoo and I get that but he's not good at sheding blocks which downgrades him some in my book. Who knows maybe he's a little stronger this year... maybe he worked on some techniques that I don't know about, if he did and he's able to shed blockers a little better then the urgency to sign him rachets up quickly.

Mike

disaacks3
07-31-2009, 03:52 PM
I don't think any of them claim they can't make it on a NFL salary. I bet if you worked say in a computer call center and all the highest rated staff made 18 bucks an hour but you only made 12 bucks an hour, you would cry foul too. It's all about your share of what your peers are making.
That's as balanced and equitable a statement on the whole process as I can think of.

If you had to pay the top 18 TEs and MLBs in descending order by $ amount - how much would YOU pay each of 'em? (Take our scheme into consideration as well) For Me - OD/$14 Meco/$16

I think we should get these two locked up as well, but for an additional reason...the Texans need to reward the guys who came in (even when UNhappy) to help provide a reason for the guys like D-Rob to do so as well.

Work with us, we'll work w/ you - if not, we're not wasting our time.

Thorn
07-31-2009, 03:57 PM
This business of player salaries is the least interesting, horribly frustrating, and without a doubt the absolute most maddening aspect of football for me.

As far as I'm concerned, screw 'em all and their guaranteed promises of tens of millions of dollars whether they play for it or not. They can all kiss my damn ass.

I know it's a business, but screw 'em anyway. This is the kind of crap that drove me away from baseball and basketball, and the only reason it's not driving me away from football is because I love it so damn much.

El Tejano
07-31-2009, 03:57 PM
That's as balaced and equitable a statement on the whole process as I can think of.

If you had to pay the top 18 TEs and MLBs in descending order by $ amount - how much would YOU pay each of 'em? (Take our scheme into consideration as well) For Me - OD/$14 Meco/$16

I think we should get these two locked up as well, but for an additional reason...the Texans need to reward the guys who came in (even when UNhappy) to help provide a reason for the guys like D-Rob to do so as well.

Work with us, we'll work w/ you - if not, we're not wasting our time.

100% agree!

Tailgate
07-31-2009, 03:58 PM
Demeco not being signed is the one that worries me. With OD and Dunta a case can at least be made for no problem. However, this is Demeco Ryans. He is the heart and soul of this defense and an invaluable leader of the team. Playing hard ball with him is not a good football nor good business decision.

Double Barrel
07-31-2009, 04:00 PM
Perennial contenders like the Patriots also treat their top players like this outside the one or two chosen players deemed irreplaceable. I'm not condoning the Texans actions by any means, but maybe the coaches and FO think they can get by without certain disgruntled players.

I know i'd hate to find out if that's true going into a season like this where expectations are so high and we've yet to have a winning season.

You do realize the fallacy of your comparison, yeah?

The Patriots have the leverage because they are the Patriots. Winning franchise, multiple championships, yada yada yada, players WANT to play for them and some even take less money because they want to win.

The Texans don't even have a winning season, so we have no leverage for players wanting to be here other than monetary.

Let me call the Waaambulance for these guys. How do they make it on that salary? :crying:

Why don't you work for minimum wage and be happy with it? Lame argument from one that says he's pro-capitalism.

My bigest concern is that every player seem to get some version of pissed which may go to how the Texans (specifically Rick Smith) are handling things which are pretty much the course of normal NFL business. There are always one or two who get mad, but seems like everybody comes away with some sort of distate in his mouth here.

Looking at this from Texans' management side, even if these players have performed well, I am not sure if it is good business (or football) to have 6 or 7 guys paid at the top 5 or their positions when the organization has never even made the playoffs much less won a playoff game.

There is a line of rewarding players for good performance and making players truly earn it. Think the Texans are in the process of trying to figure it out the balance.

Good points, man. But, if we do not keep our best players, we stand less of a chance of sustaining any success, much less long-term. The problem is a relatively inexperienced GM who does not appear to be one the players seem to respect.

I don't think any of them claim they can't make it on a NFL salary. I bet if you worked say in a computer call center and all the highest rated staff made 18 bucks an hour but you only made 12 bucks an hour, you would cry foul too. It's all about your share of what your peers are making.

Exactly. It's just business on both sides. But we are stuck with this franchise, while the players can move on to other teams that treat them better and might actually mix in a winning season or two.

Second Honeymoon
07-31-2009, 04:01 PM
DeMeco should be unhappy but he should also realize that his own play last season is why he is in this predicament. DeMeco was not a liability last year but he was injured and didn't have quite the same impact as his previous 2 years. Because of this the Texans FO is leery of giving him a new fat contract until they see what he looks like this year. If he plays well early, the Texans will then acquiesce to his demands and sign him. The problem is that if he plays good, he may want to test the waters of FA and screw us out of anything in return in the process.

Personally I would rather re-sign Dunta over DeMeco. I feel its easier to find a serviceable LB than a serviceable CB as a replacement if either departs.

As for Daniels, he needs to get over himself and play football. He isn't a true Pro Bowl TE yet. He has potential but he doesnt deserve top TE money. not yet at least. No way in hell.

Porky
07-31-2009, 04:11 PM
I don't think any of them claim they can't make it on a NFL salary. I bet if you worked say in a computer call center and all the highest rated staff made 18 bucks an hour but you only made 12 bucks an hour, you would cry foul too. It's all about your share of what your peers are making.

I understand that, but when the common man who pays his salary can't make ends meet, and many others are being laid off and foreclosed on, whining and bitching doesn't endear him to anyone, least not me.

One of my favortite bible passages says there is a time for Everything, and a season for every activity under heaven.

What these guys need to realize is that the time is not now, and this is not the season to be greedy. They need to walk a mile in someone else's shoes as apparently thier feet have gotten too large. Proverbs 28 also says a greedy man stirs up dissension.

Be thankful you live in a country where you can make more than 99% of the population all for playing a game and when the season comes then you will prosper. All good things come to those who wait.

76Texan
07-31-2009, 04:18 PM
This business of player salaries is the least interesting, horribly frustrating, and without a doubt the absolute most maddening aspect of football for me.

As far as I'm concerned, screw 'em all and their guaranteed promises of tens of millions of dollars whether they play for it or not. They can all kiss my damn ass.

I know it's a business, but screw 'em anyway. This is the kind of crap that drove me away from baseball and basketball, and the only reason it's not driving me away from football is because I love it so damn much.

Blame everything on Kellen Winslow, LOL!

Tailgate
07-31-2009, 04:20 PM
Personally I would rather re-sign Dunta over DeMeco. I feel its easier to find a serviceable LB than a serviceable CB as a replacement if either departs.

Gonna have to disagree here. First, Demeco has far less question marks and much higher odds at regaining form post injuries. Second, our LB corp looks like it could finally be a complete squad and a strength of the team this year and years beyond. Losing Demeco then creates a huge hole talent and leadership wise in all of that. We have been drafting CBs for a while now and they are high on our two new ones so far, and losing Dunta wont be as negative on the team overall imo....especially if we have room to shop in Free Agency next year.

dalemurphy
07-31-2009, 04:22 PM
I heard from Pat Kirwin yesterday on Sirius NFL radio that over 100 NFL starters this season are in the same predicament of having 3 or 4 years tenure, being scheduled for FA in 2010, but looking at becoming RFAs again next season because of the uncapped rules... The reality is that some NFL players will benefit in huge ways from an uncapped season. And, unfortunately for OD and DRyans, it will be at the expense of 4 and 5 year players. So, the Texans are wise to wait on these guys and sign them to a cap-friendly deal... In the end, OD and Ryans have no choice.

Tailgate
07-31-2009, 04:22 PM
I understand that, but when the common man who pays his salary can't make ends meet, and many others are being laid off and foreclosed on, whining and bitching doesn't endear him to anyone, least not me.

One of my favortite bible passages says there is a time for Everything, and a season for every activity under heaven.

What these guys need to realize is that the time is not now, and this is not the season to be greedy. They need to walk a mile in someone else's shoes as apparently thier feet have gotten too large. Proverbs 28 also says a greedy man stirs up dissension.

Be thankful you live in a country where you can make more than 99% of the population all for playing a game and when the season comes then you will prosper. All good things come to those who wait.


Definitely agree. And if most did too, then our football team would have more room to sign more talent, and ultimately get better. However, who then is going to hold the Texans FO accountable on the other end?

Texan JBZ
07-31-2009, 04:32 PM
If we believe John McClain, then DeMeco was offered an extension that would have made him one of the Top 3 paid MLBs in the NFL. He and his agent turned it down. Shortly after, DeMeco fired his agent and hired a new one. If he was so upset with the Texans FO, then why fire his agent? With OD, if he thinks he's getting a Winslow type deal, then he's crazy. A Dallas Clark or Heath Miller type deal is more up his alley. Sounds like OD is overvaluing himself, but once again its the Texans FO fault. Dunta? We all know that situation. So what it sounds like to me is that these guys need to get better advice from their agents. OD can be replaced (i.e. James Casey). DeMeco can be replaced (i.e. Brandon Spikes). So can Dunta (i.e. CBs already on the roster).

GP
07-31-2009, 04:33 PM
Taking a LB in the first round, and TWO tight ends in the middle rounds, might be an indication that the front office is prepared to let them walk. Right?

I guess since OD and DeMeco say some things, it must be true. All truth is found on those two players' side(s). They whine a little bit, and get a few pals on the team to support them, and it's suddenly Victim City around here. LOL.

IMO, DeMeco played awesome his rookie season, and he's underperformed every year since. Granted, there have been some injuries. But I don't blame a front office for perhaps taking those injuries into account when it comes time to make a long-term "deal" with ANY player.

Owen Daniels needs to block better, particularly in the running game, in order to command "top TE" money. His ability to stretch the field is not enough to be given a huge long-term deal that ranges in the top tier of TEs.

Both guys are class acts when they're not crying about their sad, pitiful position in life. For two guys who "aren't worried about this," and who "are out there just workin' like a hard-workin' man" they sure have a lot of instances in the media and on their personal blogs/sites where they talk at length about it.

I agree with the three posts prior to mine, btw. We have always wanted a front office that didn't hand over the keys of the money vault to the players. Now that we have it, there's this faction of people around here who suddenly want 2 of the 3 guys signed ASAP. Signing ASAP might need be so good a few years down the road. GMs and various staff in the front office have the whole picture to look at.

Runner
07-31-2009, 04:54 PM
If we believe John McClain,

Another common denominator

Thorn
07-31-2009, 05:19 PM
Blame everything on Kellen Winslow, LOL!

:spit: Good one.

Sorry for the drive by nastyness everyone, I promise I won't do that again. (Today at least...LOL)


Hopefully we get Cushing signed soon so we can get past this aspect of football and just concentrate on praising the players when they do good and ripping them up when they don't. :)

GP
07-31-2009, 05:39 PM
Another common denominator

What's up with John McClain's reports on Texans players' contracts?

Isn't McClain the one who reported Dunta was offered NEAR Chris Gamble money? You say there's no shred of evidence for it. Do you think John McClain is misleading us?

Just wondering what your take is.

bckey
07-31-2009, 05:54 PM
I understand that, but when the common man who pays his salary can't make ends meet, and many others are being laid off and foreclosed on, whining and bitching doesn't endear him to anyone, least not me.

One of my favortite bible passages says there is a time for Everything, and a season for every activity under heaven.

What these guys need to realize is that the time is not now, and this is not the season to be greedy. They need to walk a mile in someone else's shoes as apparently thier feet have gotten too large. Proverbs 28 also says a greedy man stirs up dissension.

Be thankful you live in a country where you can make more than 99% of the population all for playing a game and when the season comes then you will prosper. All good things come to those who wait.

Great post Porky!

Runner
07-31-2009, 06:06 PM
Another common denominator

What's up with John McClain's reports on Texans players' contracts?

Isn't McClain the one who reported Dunta was offered NEAR Chris Gamble money? You say there's no shred of evidence for it. Do you think John McClain is misleading us?

Just wondering what your take is.

I think John reports rumor as fact too much. He also puts a lot of weight on his opinion, stating them as facts. I think he writes good, correct information in many cases, but I think he's dead wrong in many cases too. I've seen examples where he repeatedly stated things as fact, when I knew he was incorrect from other people who would know. I watched with interest as events proved him wrong.

None of this necessarily makes him a "bad" sportswriter in my opinion, but readers shouldn't take his every utterance as fact. I'm sure the controversy enhances his readership too.

Basically I read John's stuff if it is interesting, but look for corroboration (other published reports or evidence) before giving it too much weight.

===

For instance he reported Chris Gamble type money for Dunta. Let's forget about our feelings about Dunta for this conversation, OK?

What is Gamble type money? Total contract value? What if very little was guaranteed, or bonus based? If so, "Gamble type money" would be very misleading We don't know for sure what McClain's statement means, or where he heard the rumor in the first place. I doubt it came from Smith or Robinson.

Furthermore, pretty much everyone is in agreement that Dunta would be a fool and a dolt to turn down Gamble money structured the same way. Many think Smith would be a fool and a dolt to offer Dunta that much.

For some reason though many find it easier to believe that both Dunta and Rick Smith are fools and dolts rather than question McClain's vague report.

I question the report.

Double Barrel
07-31-2009, 06:18 PM
I guess since OD and DeMeco say some things, it must be true. All truth is found on those two players' side(s). They whine a little bit, and get a few pals on the team to support them, and it's suddenly Victim City around here. LOL.

I don't see anyone making them a victim. It's just business. Get what you can while you can, because the average NFL career is not that long.

I don't hear any "whining", either. I hope the next time you expect any kind of raise from your job your boss tells you to quit whining like a little punk. Be happy you have a job and all that jazz.

Nobody seems to ***** about what Mr. McNair makes off this team. He's part of this equation, as well. Ahh, but his lifetime exemption is the law of the land. He brought pro-football back to us after we refused to give the previous NFL owner in this town a new stadium.

Around and round we go, because we'll catch that tail one of these days! :chickendance:

barrett
07-31-2009, 06:19 PM
For some reason though many find it easier to believe that both Dunta and Rick Smith are fools and dolts rather than question McClain's vague report.

I question the report.

awesome!!! repilicious!

Norg
07-31-2009, 11:09 PM
I like demco hes been a fine player but IMO is best days are behind him

And hes not like the best MLB in the game besides cant cushing also play MLB

heck i dont even think a team like pittsburg keeps all over the best players

u cant pay everybody top tier money

NitroGSXR
07-31-2009, 11:24 PM
I understand that, but when the common man who pays his salary can't make ends meet, and many others are being laid off and foreclosed on, whining and bitching doesn't endear him to anyone, least not me.

One of my favortite bible passages says there is a time for Everything, and a season for every activity under heaven.

What these guys need to realize is that the time is not now, and this is not the season to be greedy. They need to walk a mile in someone else's shoes as apparently thier feet have gotten too large. Proverbs 28 also says a greedy man stirs up dissension.

Be thankful you live in a country where you can make more than 99% of the population all for playing a game and when the season comes then you will prosper. All good things come to those who wait.
Somebody's getting the money. All they're doing is fighting for what's theirs. Fans get angry at the wrong people a lot. Especially athletes.

Lucky
08-01-2009, 06:58 AM
I think the front office is sending a message that 8-8 last year was NOT acceptable and you don't reward players for underachieving
Another 8-8 season, and the owner will be sending the front office (and coaching staff) a message. Likely on pink paper.

bckey
08-01-2009, 07:38 AM
Somebody's getting the money. All they're doing is fighting for what's theirs. Fans get angry at the wrong people a lot. Especially athletes.

I don't understand how owning a team makes you the wrong person. It is employee vs. employer. In the NFL, employees are very well paid for what they do. Actually overpaid imho. Where does it stop. These guys have college degrees and go on to other careers after football. Don't feel sorry for them because their football careers are short.

Runner
08-01-2009, 07:57 AM
I don't understand how owning a team makes you the wrong person. It is employee vs. employer. In the NFL, employees are very well paid for what they do. Actually overpaid imho. Where does it stop. These guys have college degrees and go on to other careers after football. Don't feel sorry for them because their football careers are short.


I don't understand how after the Enron's, the GM's and all the others that people still think the owners and bosses are always right and employees always wrong.


It's somewhere in the middle.

GP
08-01-2009, 09:16 AM
I don't understand how after the Enron's, the GM's and all the others that people still think the owners and bosses are always right and employees always wrong.


It's somewhere in the middle.

Don't get mad at me on this, runner, but it does come off like you lean pretty hard to the labor side.

Not saying you can't, or that it's wrong to do so, but you seem to swing that way. And sometimes our perceptions shape our analysis of other situations.

TEXANRED
08-01-2009, 10:02 AM
Crappy bottom-dwelling teams treat their good players like this on a regular basis. I hope this is not a trend that becomes the norm around here. Not a good sign to hear from one of our best players.

As far as OD is concerned, until someone else PROVES that he can fill his shoes, I think OD is The Man at TE.

Rick Smith is acting like we've got leverage. We don't. We are a perpetually mediocre to suck franchise, and until that changes with continuous winning seasons and playoff appears, we don't have the upper hand.

I think until we start winning divisions and championships the players don't have the upper hand.

DRob wants big money but we finish near the worst every year in pass D.

OD wants a big contract but can't find the EZ and we finish at the bottom of RZ scoring.

Meco wants a big contract but our run D and our short to medium pass D is consistantly exposed. He is no Ray Lewis.

6-10, 8-8, 8-8. We have finished last, last, and third in our division with a divisional record of 6-12 in that time period.

I thought we rewarded excellence not mediocrity.

Runner
08-01-2009, 10:39 AM
Don't get mad at me on this, runner, but it does come off like you lean pretty hard to the labor side.

Not saying you can't, or that it's wrong to do so, but you seem to swing that way. And sometimes our perceptions shape our analysis of other situations.

I don't get mad at honest questions that aren't twisting my words around...

Up until a couple of years ago I was a big corporate/owner guy, and still am in most cases. Recent scandals and government bailouts can have the effect of changing views though, if the views are open to change. I've certainly softened my stance.

In sports, for the most part I have no sympathy with the baseball and basketball players. They have high salaries pretty much from top to bottom that are all guaranteed. Too many of those players cash in their big checks and then cash in their effort. Basketball players get $10s of millions to get away from teams now. It is ridiculous, but the owners share a big part of that blame too.

Football is a little different in that the salaries and career of the average player are short and relatively low compared to the other major sports. The risk of severe injury is high too. Combine that with the weak players union and the players often get the short end of the stick. The superstars (and unproven highly drafted rookies) get taken care of, but the average to lower player doesn't. In the past few years I've been privy to some of the machinations the coaches, front offices, and owners get away with (not just the Texans). I consider some things anywhere from unfair to unethical even if they are within the rules. For a team like the Texans who profess to "do the right thing", well, I'd like to see actions rather than PR blurbs.

So, based on my observations I do fall more readily to the player's side in a lot of football discussions, especially players that aren't outright jerks like the T.O.'s of the league. Overall though I doubt anyone would want me as a union rep.

Runner
08-01-2009, 10:43 AM
I think until we start winning divisions and championships the players don't have the upper hand.

DRob wants big money but we finish near the worst every year in pass D.

OD wants a big contract but can't find the EZ and we finish at the bottom of RZ scoring.

Meco wants a big contract but our run D and our short to medium pass D is consistantly exposed. He is no Ray Lewis.

6-10, 8-8, 8-8. We have finished last, last, and third in our division with a divisional record of 6-12 in that time period.

I thought we rewarded excellence not mediocrity.

Agreed. And the best players should get theirs and the worst players should get below average. I don't think every player on an 8-8 team should be paid the average at their position.

b0ng
08-01-2009, 10:45 AM
It's all posturing until somebody signs or is let go.

And I find it hard to believe that this FO is more laughed at than the Raiders/Lions/Redskins front offices around the league.

DRob has been acting like he wants to leave since the 2008 season ended. While McClains factual reporting might be erroneous I still think all 3 players were made offers and all 3 were turned down. If the Players don't want to play for what is being offered then they will probably leave and that is sad. But I don't get any feelings of Scroogery or penny-pinchery from the Texans FO. Hell this might be the first year we've had the chance to lose multiple decent (OD and Meco) or overhyped (DRob) in the next offseason. I actually like the idea that we have players that others covet (for once).

Runner
08-01-2009, 10:49 AM
Another 8-8 season, and the owner will be sending the front office (and coaching staff) a message. Likely on pink paper.

I don't think you understand the difference between Kubiak's maginficent 8-8 season and the players' mediocre 8-8 season. :cool:

NitroGSXR
08-01-2009, 10:57 AM
I don't understand how owning a team makes you the wrong person. It is employee vs. employer. In the NFL, employees are very well paid for what they do. Actually overpaid imho. Where does it stop. These guys have college degrees and go on to other careers after football. Don't feel sorry for them because their football careers are short.
So you're saying that players need to stop weasling the millions from the owners? It's ok for them to hang on to that money rather than giving it to their employees? The problem with America is that the top 5% of Americans control 95% of our wealth. I'm for the players here. Spread the wealth around.

bckey
08-01-2009, 11:40 AM
So you're saying that players need to stop weasling the millions from the owners? It's ok for them to hang on to that money rather than giving it to their employees? The problem with America is that the top 5% of Americans control 95% of our wealth. I'm for the players here. Spread the wealth around.

Must be a democrat.

TEXANRED
08-01-2009, 11:41 AM
So you're saying that players need to stop weasling the millions from the owners? It's ok for them to hang on to that money rather than giving it to their employees? The problem with America is that the top 5% of Americans control 95% of our wealth. I'm for the players here. Spread the wealth around.

Your beer just went from $8 to $10.

Joe Texan
08-01-2009, 11:43 AM
These guys are in touch with Rick on this and now that the defense Cushing is set things will go smoothly

NitroGSXR
08-01-2009, 11:45 AM
Your beer just went from $8 to $10.
Like I said, that's not the athlete's fault. The problem lies higher up. Fans are getting mad at the wrong people.

NitroGSXR
08-01-2009, 11:46 AM
Must be a democrat.
My party affiliation has nothing to do with the fact that the rich keep get richer while we struggle for jobs.

FYI, I'm not a democrat.

Tailgate
08-01-2009, 12:25 PM
I like demco hes been a fine player but IMO is best days are behind him

And hes not like the best MLB in the game besides cant cushing also play MLB



I just don't really understand this. He is 25 years old. If anything his best years should be IN FRONT OF HIM. Especially as we continue to add more talent around him.

GP
08-01-2009, 12:26 PM
Like I said, that's not the athlete's fault. The problem lies higher up. Fans are getting mad at the wrong people.

I actually think it's mostly the fans' fault.

If we didn't obsessively consume NFL, as a collective group of NFL fans, we wouldn't have this discussion about what's being done with all that money. Of course, there wouldn't be the quality of NFL product, either.

Maybe we shouldn't take ANY side, since we're part of the equation. In fact, I'd say we're the dominant factor in that equation. We buy the products and/or services that have promotional ties to the NFL, we buy the team merchandise, the tickets, the concessions, the online fantasy football leagues which all have corporate sponsors or advertisers tied to them. The list is endless. We enable it. Period.

When we get into discussions about what should be done with money, is there really any winning argument? Those who have it, naturally want to keep it and get more of it. Those who don't have it, want more of it and think they're being swindled out of it by those who DO have more of it.

I grew up on a farm, my parents religiously voting for Democrats because they believed that the Democratic party was always in the corner of the little man. My parents are no more richer today than when they first got married and started a family back in 1962. I'm sorry, but I've lived in their home and never saw the fruition of this great promise that Dems always rolled out at election time. It's electoral bribery, basically: "Vote for us, and we'll give you some of your money back. Oh, and by the way, those greedy Republicans are only for the rich!" Look at out government, there are rotten apples galore in BOTH parties. It's out of control. Grossly.

Anyways, I hope they get a Goldeylocks deal: The chair is not too firm, nor too soft...it's juuuust right. That's my "best case scenario" in regards to those two guys. Anything excessive is foolish, anything meager is a slap to their face. And hopefully they will compromise. If not, thanks for the memories.

Goatcheese
08-01-2009, 12:29 PM
I like Demeco. He's a fine player.

Having said that, he's not a top tier player. He's in the second tier of MLBs in the league and certainly not irreplacable. Lets keep in mind that he's the 2nd best player on an average defense. If he resigns that is great but the world doesn't end if we have to draft a MLB next year.

Mike

If Diles comes back 100% and continues to improve I don't see us drafting a MLB at all. His replacement is already in house.

I wouldn't be opposed to dealing Ryans for a high pick or an equivalent player in that scenario.

GP
08-01-2009, 12:36 PM
I just don't really understand this. He is 25 years old. If anything his best years should be IN FRONT OF HIM. Especially as we continue to add more talent around him.

I, too, think DeMeco is declining. Due to playing TOO hard and fast, or whatever, but he's not the same as he was in his rookie year.

Tailgate
08-01-2009, 12:47 PM
I, too, think DeMeco is declining. Due to playing TOO hard and fast, or whatever, but he's not the same as he was in his rookie year.

Sure, his numbers are down. But I would be more inclined to agree with you if he were 35 instead of 25. I mean he has only been in the league for 3 years. And we all know he battled some injuries last year. He has had basically no help up front since he was brought into this league. He has had to endure alot his first 3 years. Beefing up the front 7 and making him less of a target doesnt say to me he should continue to decline imo. Where is the logic that if he has more help up front and around him...that he might actually get better this year?

TEXANRED
08-01-2009, 01:03 PM
I, too, think DeMeco is declining. Due to playing TOO hard and fast, or whatever, but he's not the same as he was in his rookie year.

I don't think he is declining. But I do think that he lacks a certain killer instinct to play MLB. When I think of top MLB's who put fear into the other side of the ball, Dick Butkus, Mike Singletary, Ray Lewis, Jack Lambert come to mind. Just to name a few. Right now Meco doesnt belong in the same zip as these guys in term of attitude and the will to dominate.

Meco is not a game changer. Teams do not game plan for him. I have never seen Meco take over a game.

He's good, decent. Better than a lot of other MLB's. But I would not put him up there with the upper crust.

Specnatz
08-01-2009, 01:11 PM
Only in sports are contracts meaningless. This goes for college coaches who leave after signing a new deal because the other college is more high profile. So they pay a small buyout and move on and leave kids who signed because of him stuck because they are not free to leave after the coach leaves.

DeMeco and Daniels need to be upset with the union because the collective bargaining agreement, as well as Dunta, because it says this is what a 3rd year player gets. Also since there is no agreement neither will be a FA next year, so the FO has time to try and get all the deals worked but it seems they all want theirs first.

The draft and all the FA that the Texans had come up all at the same time and certain players seem to say I do not care, it is all about me and what I want when I want it. So as far as who to blame and who is the greedy one in all of this? Football is not like baseball where most owners and not turning a profit, here they are all making a lot of money and they want to continue making that money, just as players want to make as much as they can as soon as they can and for as long as they can. The ones caught in the crossfire is the fans. Tickets went up this year and so did parking and I bet so did some of the concession items as well. Not that they were not making a good profit already.

Tailgate
08-01-2009, 01:14 PM
I don't think he is declining. But I do think that he lacks a certain killer instinct to play MLB. When I think of top MLB's who put fear into the other side of the ball, Dick Butkus, Mike Singletary, Ray Lewis, Jack Lambert come to mind. Just to name a few. Right now Meco doesnt belong in the same zip as these guys in term of attitude and the will to dominate.

Meco is not a game changer. Teams do not game plan for him. I have never seen Meco take over a game.

He's good, decent. Better than a lot of other MLB's. But I would not put him up there with the upper crust.

Unfortunately those guys you named dont come along very often. In the mean time, I think that many teams would love to have Demeco in the middle. I happen to think the best is yet to come. The more we can free him and the other linebackers up, the more game changing plays they are going to make.

Malloy
08-01-2009, 01:17 PM
:spit: Good one.

Sorry for the drive by nastyness everyone, I promise I won't do that again. (Today at least...LOL)


Hopefully we get Cushing signed soon so we can get past this aspect of football and just concentrate on praising the players when they do good and ripping them up when they don't. :)

Mad drive-by posts is what I like most about you! :)

Double Barrel
08-01-2009, 02:43 PM
I think until we start winning divisions and championships the players don't have the upper hand.

DRob wants big money but we finish near the worst every year in pass D.

OD wants a big contract but can't find the EZ and we finish at the bottom of RZ scoring.

Meco wants a big contract but our run D and our short to medium pass D is consistantly exposed. He is no Ray Lewis.

6-10, 8-8, 8-8. We have finished last, last, and third in our division with a divisional record of 6-12 in that time period.

I thought we rewarded excellence not mediocrity.

That's certainly one way to look at it, and it's a valid perspective.

However, the difference is that these good players will find offers available to them if they play their contracts out, and usually they will have a choice of teams that will bid for their services.

The Texans will not be high on any free agent's priority list unless there is the financial motivation, simply because we are not a franchise that can attract players because of success.

The plan seems to be "build through the draft", but that only works if you can actually keep those players that you develop.

It is definitely a two way street, and I am not taking any particular side. We just don't have the details of the offers available to us, so we can just speculation and let our own points-of-view guide our opinions.

I just want to see the happy medium that we keep our good players, they are happy with the contracts, and provide us with performances on the field that put us in more winning results than losing ones.

Thorn
08-01-2009, 03:35 PM
Now that all the draft picks are signed, I'm sure the Texans are working on other contracts. They made a very reasonable offer to Dunta who turned it down, so it's not like they aren't trying. I'm sure they are working on the other contract extensions.

GP
08-01-2009, 09:56 PM
Sure, his numbers are down. But I would be more inclined to agree with you if he were 35 instead of 25. I mean he has only been in the league for 3 years. And we all know he battled some injuries last year. He has had basically no help up front since he was brought into this league. He has had to endure alot his first 3 years. Beefing up the front 7 and making him less of a target doesnt say to me he should continue to decline imo. Where is the logic that if he has more help up front and around him...that he might actually get better this year?

I think there's a significant injury with Meco. Something is way different in his style of play, when you look at that rookie season compared to each subsequent season afterward.

His play in his rookie year was off-the-charts scary good.

I've brought this up before, and I am wondering if CND or someone has more insight about this: Have you noticed Meco wears one of those shoulder straps on his left arm, the kind that Clinton Portis has to wear because his arm keeps coming out of the shoulder socket?

I won't argue his football I.Q. or anything. He can read a play and flow to the ball very well. He has instincts that an NFL linebacker has to have. But I wonder if the body is the same as it was, even though he's only 25.

CloakNNNdagger
08-01-2009, 10:10 PM
I think there's a significant injury with Meco. Something is way different in his style of play, when you look at that rookie season compared to each subsequent season afterward.

His play in his rookie year was off-the-charts scary good.

I've brought this up before, and I am wondering if CND or someone has more insight about this: Have you noticed Meco wears one of those shoulder straps on his left arm, the kind that Clinton Portis has to wear because his arm keeps coming out of the shoulder socket?
I won't argue his football I.Q. or anything. He can read a play and flow to the ball very well. He has instincts that an NFL linebacker has to have. But I wonder if the body is the same as it was, even though he's only 25.


GP,

Now that you mention it, if I remember correctly, near the end of last season he was held out of practice for a "shoulder problem" that wasn't characterized. Any type of shoulder problem could affect his performance for many reasons..........limited range of motion, decreased strength, and tentativeness due to pain and/or fear of further injury. It certainly would be well to watch his play during TC and preseason, to see if his play demonstrates any of those presentations.

CloakNNNdagger
08-01-2009, 10:24 PM
Actually near the very end of the season, he was suffering additionally from a knee and ankle problem. For that matter, at the end of 2007, Demeco was having knee problems significant enough to keep him out of practices. Even though Demeco didn't miss actual games along the way, it makes you think that the Texans may have concerns for his continued durability.

Second Honeymoon
08-01-2009, 10:42 PM
Actually near the very end of the season, he was suffering additionally from a knee and ankle problem. For that matter, at the end of 2007, Demeco was having knee problems significant enough to keep him out of practices. Even though Demeco didn't miss actual games along the way, it makes you think that the Texans may have concerns for his continued durability.

exactly. it sounds like DeMeco is a victim of his injuries last year and Dunta/OD are over-evaluating their own worth to the Texans. I want to keep Dunta and OD and DeMeco but at a smart price and at the prudent time.

Lets see DeMeco show some of the pursuit he showed in his first 2 years.
Lets see Dunta play some quality corner and show that he has come back from his injury.
Lets see Daniels continue to prove that he is a legitimate top receiving target in this league.

If everyone involved does their part, I am sure at least 2 if not all 3 of these guys will be back with the Texans one way or another.

Remember the Domanick Davis extension. We didn't have to give him the extension so early and we did and what happened? Dude was never the same and was a walking injury from that moment on. Why not keep the guy on the cheap and try and spend that expected surplus elsewhere

RagingBull
08-02-2009, 01:13 AM
So you're saying that players need to stop weasling the millions from the owners? It's ok for them to hang on to that money rather than giving it to their employees? The problem with America is that the top 5% of Americans control 95% of our wealth. I'm for the players here. Spread the wealth around.

The employers payroll expense is FIXED (e.g. salary cap). If they give all the money to a few guys, they won't have any to pay other good players with. No matter how much they decide to spend on Demeco and OD, their payroll is still going to be ~$130 million. Smith is doing the right thing and trying to wait to see what happens with the collective bargaining agreement before resigning guys to long term deals. I have no doubt that he will pay these guys salaries that are more than fair as he has done in the past with AJ, Eric Winston, David Anderson, Andre Davis, etc. Demeco and OD are just caught up in the expiration of the CBA. You can't blame Smith for wanting to see what the rules are going to be before making a business decision that doesn't NEED to be made yet.

That being said, I hope OD and Demeco finish their careers as Texans and retire very wealthy.

RipTraxx
08-02-2009, 06:47 PM
It's a good thing for the Texans Dre got extended when he did and missed out on all this. He'd have probably bolted when the chance came if he was treated in a similar manner.

IMO even with his extension he's outplaying his contract. I dont know the breakdown of his contract but i do know it was a while ago, before he became the BEST WR in the league.

Earl34
08-02-2009, 08:16 PM
From what I hear the general consensus of the players is that they don't take care of "guys all ready here" and give away funny money to FA's like Jaques Reeves and Antonio Smith. Guys I know that have moved on to other teams say the Texans FO is a quiet joke around the NFL. I don't think it all comes from a bad attitude towards them but they say the mentality in other locker rooms is totally diffrent than here in Houston.

Frankly, besides Glenn, I can't think of any player that has left the Texans and has been productive on another team.

The only thing worse than fights between productive players and management is scrubs complaining about management

NitroGSXR
08-02-2009, 09:08 PM
The employers payroll expense is FIXED (e.g. salary cap). If they give all the money to a few guys, they won't have any to pay other good players with. No matter how much they decide to spend on Demeco and OD, their payroll is still going to be ~$130 million.

But they don't have to spend all of it. Or do I have it wrong somewhere?

Statis22
08-02-2009, 10:52 PM
I would really hate to see this team regress after so much progress is trying to be made.

I hope the team doesn't get labeled as one that doesn't take care of their core talent. OD and Demeco should have been signed to long term deals

GP
08-03-2009, 10:14 AM
Dockett and Boldin (both Cardinals) complained all off-season about wanting new deals.

But they still showed up to camp ON TIME.

DeMeco and Owen are to be applauded for doing the same thing.

I can't ever understand or allow justification for the type of behavior that Dunta is exhibiting. At the end of it all, just get to camp and play football.

We might not know the full details of the contract, but we do know that he has a near $10 million one-year deal that he could accept and get him through to the end of this season. So why not do it? You can live the rest of your life on that amount.

I don't have to know the details of the supposed long-term deal that wasn't accepted. I see two Pro Bowl caliber players in Arizona who put their own restructured/long-term deals aside so they could be at camp and play ball.

So this is my "thanks" to Meco and OD for joining the team and getting down to the business of trying to make this team better.

HOU-TEX
08-03-2009, 10:18 AM
Dockett and Boldin (both Cardinals) complained all off-season about wanting new deals.

But they still showed up to camp ON TIME.

DeMeco and Owen are to be applauded for doing the same thing.

I can't ever understand or allow justification for the type of behavior that Dunta is exhibiting. At the end of it all, just get to camp and play football.

We might not know the full details of the contract, but we do know that he has a near $10 million one-year deal that he could accept and get him through to the end of this season. So why not do it? You can live the rest of your life on that amount.

I don't have to know the details of the supposed long-term deal that wasn't accepted. I see two Pro Bowl caliber players in Arizona who put their own restructured/long-term deals aside so they could be at camp and play ball.

So this is my "thanks" to Meco and OD for joining the team and getting down to the business of trying to make this team better.

OD and D-Ryans really didn't have a choice but to show up for camp. They'd be facing daily fines if they chose to hold out (up to 12 grand per day IIRC). Dunta is not under contract yet so he can't really be fined until he signs.

GP
08-03-2009, 09:57 PM
OD and D-Ryans really didn't have a choice but to show up for camp. They'd be facing daily fines if they chose to hold out (up to 12 grand per day IIRC). Dunta is not under contract yet so he can't really be fined until he signs.

I think that's the same thing with Dockett and Boldin. I know Boldin was acting all kinds of mad and declaring the Cards didn't want him and that he wanted to be traded.

Aren't both those guys under a current deal and desiring to get a better long-term deal? I thought they were.

Pantherstang84
08-03-2009, 11:37 PM
OD and D-Ryans really didn't have a choice but to show up for camp. They'd be facing daily fines if they chose to hold out (up to 12 grand per day IIRC). Dunta is not under contract yet so he can't really be fined until he signs.

I think it's clear the Texans are moving on without him. Pity. I wish him luck wherever he lands because I don't think he'll ever play for Houston again. And I don't think a team will sign him to a long term deal either until he proves his leg has healed and he is back to pre-injury form.

Too bad he and his agent got their panties in a wad over a legitimate CBA option the Texans exercised.

In fact, I think his agent has been trying to get him out of town all along. Just rescind the franchise offer and use the 10 mil to lock up Demeco and OD and let's move on. Sometimes the best option is to just walk away.

leebigeztx
08-04-2009, 01:23 AM
OD might be a little more expendable for us in the future with our depth at TE right now, but we really cannot afford to lose Demeco. Lock him up and give him the money he deserves.

I disagree only because OD is probably rated higher in the nfl as a te than ryans as a mlb. I mean gates,tony,whitten,and maybe K2 are the only te's u can say are better than owen. If one woulld uuse last yr, that list shrinks to whitten,tony and clark.Not only that, I think cushings best position is mlb. I hope they keep both though.

HOU-TEX
08-04-2009, 08:52 AM
I think that's the same thing with Dockett and Boldin. I know Boldin was acting all kinds of mad and declaring the Cards didn't want him and that he wanted to be traded.

Aren't both those guys under a current deal and desiring to get a better long-term deal? I thought they were.

Yes, they are. Which is why they showed for camp. This stuff happens every year around the League. Players under contract talking crap of wanting a new deal or traded to a new team or they're going to hold out. Pffft! Once camp comes rolling around the player's tone begins to change because they know if they do hold out they're going to be writing some checks.

Look at Brandon Marshall as well. lol. That cat was flapping his gums ever since Cutler was traded off, but where id he now? In camp because he doesn't want to pay 15 grand a day.

eriadoc
08-04-2009, 09:04 AM
Frankly, besides Glenn, I can't think of any player that has left the Texans and has been productive on another team.

I can think of a few - Marlon McCree, Steve Foley, Greg White, and Jabar Gaffney just off the top of my head. Of course, I don't think that has anything to do with the original assertion that the team doesn't take care of its players. The Ryans and Daniels situations speak more to that topic.

GP
08-04-2009, 09:12 AM
I think it's clear the Texans are moving on without him. Pity. I wish him luck wherever he lands because I don't think he'll ever play for Houston again. And I don't think a team will sign him to a long term deal either until he proves his leg has healed and he is back to pre-injury form.

Too bad he and his agent got their panties in a wad over a legitimate CBA option the Texans exercised.

In fact, I think his agent has been trying to get him out of town all along. Just rescind the franchise offer and use the 10 mil to lock up Demeco and OD and let's move on. Sometimes the best option is to just walk away.

I like your idea.

Use the $10 mill for DeMeco and OD. It will show that the front office DOES reward those (those who don't pull a stunt like Dunta has).

Texan JBZ
08-04-2009, 09:54 AM
I disagree only because OD is probably rated higher in the nfl as a te than ryans as a mlb. I mean gates,tony,whitten,and maybe K2 are the only te's u can say are better than owen. If one woulld uuse last yr, that list shrinks to whitten,tony and clark.Not only that, I think cushings best position is mlb. I hope they keep both though.

Most NFL analyst have DeMeco rated as the #2 or #3 best MLB in the NFL. Daniels is solid, but at his position there are more players better than him than are better than DeMeco at his position (you forgot about Dallas Clark). And Cushing is absolutely NOT a MLB. I was watching the replay of the Oregon game from last season on ESPU last week. Rey was hurt and out of the game. Cushing was moved from the outside to the middle. It was not a good look at all. I made sure that I paid special attention to him and he was very unspectacular. He doesn't have the instincts to play inside.

silvrhand
08-04-2009, 10:14 AM
Honestly, I don't see where Dunta has any room for making him one of the highest paid CB's in the league..

He had a really good first year, but after that he hasn't really shown close to the same level.

Season Team G Solo Ast Total Sack YdsL Int Yds IntTD DefTD FFum PD Sfty
2004-05 Houston 16 74 14 88 3.0 26 6 146 0 0 3 19 0
2005-06 Houston 16 69 19 88 1.0 0 1 1 0 0 1 10 0
2006-07 Houston 16 70 13 83 0.0 0 2 9 1 1 1 12 0
2007-08 Houston 9 30 5 35 0.0 0 2 6 0 0 0 7 0
2008-09 Houston 11 35 3 38 0.0 0 2 0 0 0 0 6 0
Career 68 278 54 332 4.0 26 13 162 1 1 5 54 0

Does anyone really think Dunta is better than the following corners:

Asante Samuels
Al Harris
Champ Bailey
Terrance Newman
Deanglo Hall

Pantherstang84
08-04-2009, 12:17 PM
Honestly, I don't see where Dunta has any room for making him one of the highest paid CB's in the league..

He had a really good first year, but after that he hasn't really shown close to the same level.

Season Team G Solo Ast Total Sack YdsL Int Yds IntTD DefTD FFum PD Sfty
2004-05 Houston 16 74 14 88 3.0 26 6 146 0 0 3 19 0
2005-06 Houston 16 69 19 88 1.0 0 1 1 0 0 1 10 0
2006-07 Houston 16 70 13 83 0.0 0 2 9 1 1 1 12 0
2007-08 Houston 9 30 5 35 0.0 0 2 6 0 0 0 7 0
2008-09 Houston 11 35 3 38 0.0 0 2 0 0 0 0 6 0
Career 68 278 54 332 4.0 26 13 162 1 1 5 54 0

Does anyone really think Dunta is better than the following corners:

Asante Samuels
Al Harris
Champ Bailey
Terrance Newman
Deanglo Hall

No.

dc_txtech
08-04-2009, 12:24 PM
Honestly, I don't see where Dunta has any room for making him one of the highest paid CB's in the league..

He had a really good first year, but after that he hasn't really shown close to the same level.

Season Team G Solo Ast Total Sack YdsL Int Yds IntTD DefTD FFum PD Sfty
2004-05 Houston 16 74 14 88 3.0 26 6 146 0 0 3 19 0
2005-06 Houston 16 69 19 88 1.0 0 1 1 0 0 1 10 0
2006-07 Houston 16 70 13 83 0.0 0 2 9 1 1 1 12 0
2007-08 Houston 9 30 5 35 0.0 0 2 6 0 0 0 7 0
2008-09 Houston 11 35 3 38 0.0 0 2 0 0 0 0 6 0
Career 68 278 54 332 4.0 26 13 162 1 1 5 54 0

Does anyone really think Dunta is better than the following corners:

Asante Samuels
Al Harris
Champ Bailey
Terrance Newman
Deanglo Hall

Deangelo Hall? Yes.

Porky
08-04-2009, 12:35 PM
I don't see anyone making them a victim. It's just business. Get what you can while you can, because the average NFL career is not that long.

I don't hear any "whining", either. I hope the next time you expect any kind of raise from your job your boss tells you to quit whining like a little punk. Be happy you have a job and all that jazz.

Nobody seems to ***** about what Mr. McNair makes off this team. He's part of this equation, as well. Ahh, but his lifetime exemption is the law of the land. He brought pro-football back to us after we refused to give the previous NFL owner in this town a new stadium.

Around and round we go, because we'll catch that tail one of these days! :chickendance:


Actually I have been told that. I have worked here 2.5 years and was promised a raise last year. Then they renegged and told me they never promised me a raise and that I should be happy I have a job. I haven't mentioned it since.