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Vinny
07-30-2009, 01:25 PM
from the nickster over at the dotcom...

Molden, T. Johnson, Hill going on PUP
Per Kubiak in his 11:30 a.m. news conference, Antwaun Molden, Travis Johnson and Anthony Hill will be on PUP when the Texans start camp tomorrow. Put it up in my blog (http://www.houstontexans.com/blog/) a few minutes ago.

More details from Kubiak's press conference later.

-Nick Scurfield

badboy
07-30-2009, 01:29 PM
What are the Vegas odds of Molden playing a game before his contract is up?

m5kwatts
07-30-2009, 01:48 PM
Guys can be removed from this list and be on the roster for week 1 correct?

alphajoker
07-30-2009, 01:51 PM
What are the Vegas odds of Molden playing a game before his contract is up?

He played last year quite a bit on special teams and contributed on some nickel and dime packages, too.

dalemurphy
07-30-2009, 01:53 PM
Guys can be removed from this list and be on the roster for week 1 correct?

there are 2 separate PUP lists. It's unclear which these guys have been put on. On the preseason PUP, they can be taken off at anytime. ON the regulare season PUP, they can't be activated for 6 games... Other than that, I'm not sure about the details of the two lists.

m5kwatts
07-30-2009, 01:57 PM
there are 2 separate PUP lists. It's unclear which these guys have been put on. On the preseason PUP, they can be taken off at anytime. ON the regulare season PUP, they can't be activated for 6 games... Other than that, I'm not sure about the details of the two lists.

I'm gonna assume its preseason PUP, find it hard to believe they would box themselves into having to keep these guys out for the first 6 weeks and be making that determination the last days of July.

In a way its not that surprising, I figured they'd be taking it easy on TJ and Okoye all of training camp. Wasn't Kubiak preaching about how TC this year is going to be less physically demanding so we can start the season quicker?

The only one that surprises me a little is Hill. I didn't know he had a lingering issue that could keep him out of camp. He's the one of those 3 who can't miss time.

badboy
07-30-2009, 01:59 PM
He played last year quite a bit on special teams and contributed on some nickel and dime packages, too.I should have said "play as a CB" as that is what he was drafted for.

gary
07-30-2009, 02:05 PM
I'm gonna assume its preseason PUP, find it hard to believe they would box themselves into having to keep these guys out for the first 6 weeks and be making that determination the last days of July.

In a way its not that surprising, I figured they'd be taking it easy on TJ and Okoye all of training camp. Wasn't Kubiak preaching about how TC this year is going to be less physically demanding so we can start the season quicker?

The only one that surprises me a little is Hill. I didn't know he had a lingering issue that could keep him out of camp. He's the one of those 3 who can't miss time.If you want your team to be good and ready to pay on day you'd had better hope that no players miss much time.

ChampionTexan
07-30-2009, 02:06 PM
there are 2 separate PUP lists. It's unclear which these guys have been put on. On the preseason PUP, they can be taken off at anytime. ON the regulare season PUP, they can't be activated for 6 games... Other than that, I'm not sure about the details of the two lists.


The PUP lists are separate but related. You can't go on the reserve (regular season) PUP list unless you've previously been put on the active (pre-season) PUP. I don't believe you can place players on the reserve list until the end of the pre-season, so these guys have to be on the active PUP.

Here's a good article by AJ outlining the basics:

PUP List 101 (http://www.examiner.com/x-778-Houston-Texans-Examiner~y2009m7d28-Clarifying-NFL-rules-on-the-physically-unable-to-perform-PUP-list)

m5kwatts
07-30-2009, 02:07 PM
If you want your team to be good and ready to pay on day you'd had better hope that no players miss much time.

Oh I agree, but TJ and Okoye missing time won't affect their playing time like it would Anthony Hill whose battling 3 other TE's for playing time. We're relying on Okoye to have a huge season and start and TJ is expected to contribute in the DT rotation.

gary
07-30-2009, 02:12 PM
I understand.

Porky
07-30-2009, 02:30 PM
Anyone know what the deal is with Hill? I didn't even know he had any kind of lingering issue. My guess is that with the reduced roster sizes, they don't want to waste a spot on guys that would be limited in camp. I bet all three of these guys play early in the year.

Spike
07-30-2009, 02:39 PM
I hadn't heard anything on Hill either -- this is not good.

I most disappointed about Moulden. With Dunta out, this would have been a good opportunity to get valuable reps at CB. We have to be checking the waiver wire to look at more CBs - even if they are just bodies for camp. I don't think you can rely on Robinson week 1 (or even the first couple of weeks) if he misses all of camp - which leaves us thin at CB.

Hopefully, we can find a gem late in the pre-season, similar to what we have been able to find at safety the past couple of years. The CB is already a concern for me.

HOU-TEX
07-30-2009, 02:45 PM
I hadn't heard anything on Hill either -- this is not good.

I most disappointed about Moulden. With Dunta out, this would have been a good opportunity to get valuable reps at CB. We have to be checking the waiver wire to look at more CBs - even if they are just bodies for camp. I don't think you can rely on Robinson week 1 (or even the first couple of weeks) if he misses all of camp - which leaves us thin at CB.

Hopefully, we can find a gem late in the pre-season, similar to what we have been able to find at safety the past couple of years. The CB is already a concern for me.

Kubiak mentioned during OTA's that he didn't think Molden would be 100% by the start of camp. I figure he and TJ would be held out for a short stint. Like most others, Hill's the one that surprizes me most.

nunusguy
07-30-2009, 02:46 PM
D-Rob has the Texans right where he wants them. Behind the 8-ball at CB.

ChampionTexan
07-30-2009, 02:51 PM
Anyone know what the deal is with Hill? I didn't even know he had any kind of lingering issue. My guess is that with the reduced roster sizes, they don't want to waste a spot on guys that would be limited in camp. I bet all three of these guys play early in the year.

Can't be a roster issue - even on the active PUP, he counts against the 80 man limit. The only reason they'd put him on the active PUP is if he isn't able to practice, and they think there's a chance (even a very, very tiny chance) that he won't be ready by the first regular season game.

With that, don't forget that last year, both Peyton Manning and Dwight Freeney were on the Colts active PUP. In that case, it was just a matter of keeping all of your options open - hopefully, that's the case with the Texans this year also.

HOU-TEX
07-30-2009, 02:54 PM
The PUP lists are separate but related. You can't go on the reserve (regular season) PUP list unless you've previously been put on the active (pre-season) PUP. I don't believe you can place players on the reserve list until the end of the pre-season, so these guys have to be on the active PUP.

Here's a good article by AJ outlining the basics:

PUP List 101 (http://www.examiner.com/x-778-Houston-Texans-Examiner~y2009m7d28-Clarifying-NFL-rules-on-the-physically-unable-to-perform-PUP-list)

Hmm, I was unaware the ActivePUP players actually count against the roster limit of 80. There will be a few players getting a lot of work. Hopefully not too much.

D-Rob has the Texans right where he wants them. Behind the 8-ball at CB.

No....he doesn't. Dunta has practically no leverage what so ever.

CloakNNNdagger
07-30-2009, 03:06 PM
I'm not too surprised by this. Hill has been labelled by some as "injury prone." He missed the entire 2007 season with an ACL tear and 4 months of the 2008 season with a chest muscle injury of some sort. It could be that he reinjure his "chest" in the weight room. It'll be interesting to see if his absence is related to either of these past injuries.

barrett
07-30-2009, 03:22 PM
Did you see that we signed Zgonina? ugh.

nunusguy
07-30-2009, 03:25 PM
No....he doesn't. Dunta has practically no leverage what so ever.
I dunno 'bout you, but 10 million bucks sounds like serious leverage to me ?

HOU-TEX
07-30-2009, 03:32 PM
I dunno 'bout you, but 10 million bucks sounds like serious leverage to me ?

And how does 10 million give Dunta leverage over the Texans? Maybe I'm missing your point. lol

He either signs the tender, or he doesn't play. Or, the Texans yank the tender and leave Dunta hangin.

Leverage------>Texans

badboy
07-30-2009, 03:44 PM
I dunno 'bout you, but 10 million bucks sounds like serious leverage to me ?I think leverage is thought of as having something that makes the other party do what you want. DR has zero. He plays or he sits out. Texans identified that and selected two CBs in draft & expect Bennett to revert back to his rookie year of exceptional play. Reeves is our best CB and if Bennett does well, DR may not be on Texans the following season. I have been pulling for Molden to live up to expectations this season.

Goldensilence
07-30-2009, 03:54 PM
I dunno 'bout you, but 10 million bucks sounds like serious leverage to me ?

After the June 15th deadline he can no longer negotiate a new contract with the team until after the season. His options are basically sign the one year tender and attend camp, or hold out. Though holding out doesn't do him much good at this point honestly. The longer he holds out the more time he misses on getting to know the new scheme, the terms, and reps. If he holds out into preseason I wouldn't expect the team to just up and hand him the starting role opposite Reeves.

Bottom line at this point if he wants the inflated contract he feels he deserves, wants, or wants out of Houston he's gotta suit up and earn it.

badboy
07-30-2009, 04:06 PM
After the June 15th deadline he can no longer negotiate a new contract with the team until after the season. His options are basically sign the one year tender and attend camp, or hold out. Though holding out doesn't do him much good at this point honestly. The longer he holds out the more time he misses on getting to know the new scheme, the terms, and reps. If he holds out into preseason I wouldn't expect the team to just up and hand him the starting role opposite Reeves.

Bottom line at this point if he wants the inflated contract he feels he deserves, wants, or wants out of Houston he's gotta suit up and earn it.Can this scenario happen? Texans remove franchise tag and Dr reports and plays several games. He and the Texans then agree to a multi-year agreement. Or does that violate CBA?

Goldensilence
07-30-2009, 04:12 PM
Can this scenario happen? Texans remove franchise tag and Dr reports and plays several games. He and the Texans then agree to a multi-year agreement. Or does that violate CBA?

I'm not sure. I think the Texans can rescind the tag whenever and if they have assurances or confident that they can reach an agreement with Dunta that's a possibility. A similar situation happened in Seattle this year with Leroy Hill.

CloakNNNdagger
07-30-2009, 04:57 PM
Did you see that we signed Zgonina? ugh.

Only days ago, he was reported to be on the verge of making the decision to retire. I wonder how much we would lose if we just line up a scare crow in his place............not a great sign.:mcnugget:

barrett
07-30-2009, 05:00 PM
punny or not, it's a very bad "sign" in my mind. What is the benefit?

76Texan
07-30-2009, 05:02 PM
I'm not too surprised by this. Hill has been labelled by some as "injury prone." He missed the entire 2007 season with an ACL tear and 4 months of the 2008 season with a chest muscle injury of some sort. It could be that he reinjure his "chest" in the weight room. It'll be interesting to see if his absence is related to either of these past injuries.
I was afraid something like this might happen, dang it!

TimeKiller
07-30-2009, 05:18 PM
TJ honestly I don't expect anything from him so it's not a big deal there. Molden...that's a pill to swallow, I'm not going to hold on to hope for him for too much longer. Yeah, he's big and athletic as hell but neither does very much on a bench. HILL though...damn...I was really looking forward to having a mini-T on the line in goalline forms. Really want to see this guy on the field because we passed over a shot at a backup to Slaton for him.

Let's start it off right fellas...rehab and get back on the field!

Insideop
07-30-2009, 05:20 PM
I guess I'm like most on here. I'm not surprised at TJ and Molden, but Hill on the PUP seemed to come out of nowhere. This will be good news for Casey and Harris (more reps) but not good for the team. I was looking forward to seeing what Hill could do, especially in the Red Zone, during Preseason and Regular Season. I guess I'll have to wait! :foottap:

HOU-TEX
07-30-2009, 05:48 PM
It turns out that Hill has had a lingering hamstring problem.

Three to PUP: Three Texans players will be on the Active Physically Unable to Perform list when training camp begins tomorrow: cornerback Antwaun Molden, defensive tackle Travis Johnson and rookie tight end Anthony Hill, who has a hamstring issue.

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=5394

CloakNNNdagger
07-30-2009, 06:21 PM
I guess I'm like most on here. I'm not surprised at TJ and Molden, but Hill on the PUP seemed to come out of nowhere. This will be good news for Casey and Harris (more reps) but not good for the team. I was looking forward to seeing what Hill could do, especially in the Red Zone, during Preseason and Regular Season. I guess I'll have to wait! :foottap:

You may have a very long wait.........like until next season. If it's a weight lifting injury, and it's the pectoralis major muscle that is injured (which is the most likely), a complete (versus partial) tear is the most common. Keep in mind the "tear" actually refers almost exclusively (in a young [20-30] athlete) not to the muscle itself, but to the tendon's attachment to the bone (or the muscle). Partial tears of the muscle belly usually occur in the elderly. The typical complete tear, and usually the partial tear in the young athlete weight lifter, requires surgical reattachment of the segment of tendon that has torn away from the bone. Prognosis is good...............for next year.

BTW, with all that's been made of Cushing's benching abilities, I hope that we are not encouraging "THE HULK" type of workout for all of our players. When you go so heavy and exceed your natural limits, you better take care to maintain a widened grip and avoid lowering the bar all the way to your chest..............lest you hear your pecs go PING.

Vinny
07-31-2009, 01:44 AM
Anthony "Joppru" Hill? lingering hamstring? hurt before camp starts? No, I didn't just curse him. I ain't takin' the blame on this one. Get yourself another patsy.

Kaiser Toro
07-31-2009, 01:56 AM
Anthony "Joppru" Hill? lingering hamstring? hurt before camp starts? No, I didn't just curse him. I ain't takin' the blame on this one. Get yourself another patsy.

Curses!? Curses!? You're talking about curses?

76Texan
07-31-2009, 02:06 AM
Curses!? Curses!? You're talking about curses?

I thought the curse had been purged?!? http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/images/icons/icon9.gif http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/images/icons/icon10.gif

ObsiWan
08-01-2009, 01:52 AM
Did you see that we signed Zgonina? ugh.

No. I couldn't find it on the HT.com Transactions page...
And this is just until T.J. comes off the PUP list anyway. I wouldn't sweat it.

GP
08-01-2009, 10:13 AM
Anthony "Joppru" Hill? lingering hamstring? hurt before camp starts? No, I didn't just curse him. I ain't takin' the blame on this one. Get yourself another patsy.

You know I didn't like this pick, Vinny.

Smelled fishy the instant it was made.

I think it was a wasted pick. Sage's trade nabbed us that extra 4th rounder, and I think we wasted it.

Insideop
08-01-2009, 02:02 PM
You may have a very long wait.........like until next season. If it's a weight lifting injury, and it's the pectoralis major muscle that is injured (which is the most likely), a complete (versus partial) tear is the most common. Keep in mind the "tear" actually refers almost exclusively (in a young [20-30] athlete) not to the muscle itself, but to the tendon's attachment to the bone (or the muscle). Partial tears of the muscle belly usually occur in the elderly. The typical complete tear, and usually the partial tear in the young athlete weight lifter, requires surgical reattachment of the segment of tendon that has torn away from the bone. Prognosis is good...............for next year.

BTW, with all that's been made of Cushing's benching abilities, I hope that we are not encouraging "THE HULK" type of workout for all of our players. When you go so heavy and exceed your natural limits, you better take care to maintain a widened grip and avoid lowering the bar all the way to your chest..............lest you hear your pecs go PING.

Thanks for the info CNNND but I sure hope you're wrong about the type of injury. If this is from the injury he sustained last year and missed 4 months of the season, shouldn't that have thrown up red flags to the Texans staff when they do their evaluations of players before the Draft? :thinking:

NitroGSXR
08-01-2009, 06:39 PM
Hill has been taken off the PUP list. He passed his physical today.

Per Nick Scurfield's blog...

Rookie tight end Anthony Hill passed a physical today and has been taken off of the Active/PUP list. A fourth-round draft pick from North Carolina State, Hill sat out the first day-and-a-half of training camp practices with a hamstring issue. Now healthy, he can take the practice field and compete for playing time at a crowded tight end position.

Hill was one of the top run-blocking tight ends in this year's draft and has a chance to make an immediate impact for the Texans in two-tight end sets.

http://www.houstontexans.com/blog/

I wonder why they would place him on the PUP list so early? Seems like he was merely waiting on a physical? Is Smith trying to tell teams around the league that Hill is damaged goods while he tries to stash him on the practice squad? The TE position is a tough racket to make on the Texans.

Maddict5
08-01-2009, 06:50 PM
lol @ the worry followed by the relevation that its a minor injury & he missed just 1 day over it. us texans fans are a bit snakebit arent we?

Insideop
08-01-2009, 07:07 PM
lol @ the worry followed by the relevation that its a minor injury & he missed just 1 day over it. us texans fans are a bit snakebit arent we?

Yes, I guess we are "a bit snakebit." I'm just glad it was a false alarm. Now he can get back to business and I can sleep :zzz: a little easier at night! :shades:

CloakNNNdagger
08-01-2009, 09:13 PM
No "hamstring issue" lets me sleep very easy..........maybe if there's no recurrence by the end of preseason...........Till then, I'll be sleeping with one eye open.:cool:

The Pencil Neck
08-01-2009, 10:30 PM
lol @ the worry followed by the relevation that its a minor injury & he missed just 1 day over it. us texans fans are a bit snakebit arent we?

Um.

Maybe so... but... let's wait a bit before saying we're out of the woods on this...

RipTraxx
08-02-2009, 07:56 PM
*sigh* im so done w/ TJ.

Can we please move on? Its the same thing out of him every year. Nagging injuries, sub-par performance.

Pending the cap hit we'd take i'd be willing to cut him.