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TheIronDuke
07-04-2009, 03:24 PM
http://www.newschannel5.com/

NASHVILLE, Tenn. - Former Titans quarterback Steve McNair has been killed. Police said McNair suffered a fatal gunshot wound to the head in downtown Nashville.

The incident happened at 2nd South & Lea Ave. Police said it looked like a double homicide. A female victim was also found dead.

Blazing Arrow
07-04-2009, 03:26 PM
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...

Vinny
07-04-2009, 03:26 PM
wow!

edo783
07-04-2009, 03:26 PM
Man oh man, what a dang shame. Rest in peace Steve.

Vinny
07-04-2009, 03:27 PM
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...many of us saw his first game live so go spend your time on the jags board if you really want to lecture a fanbase.

Ckw
07-04-2009, 03:27 PM
Wow! Sure shows you how quick your time here can come to an end. RIP Steve.

TheIronDuke
07-04-2009, 03:28 PM
I got to see his first game he played in at the Dome. He was a helluva QB.

TexanSam
07-04-2009, 03:29 PM
What?!?

Wow...

mexican_texan
07-04-2009, 03:31 PM
I thought it was a joke the first time I saw it. He was one of the very few Titans players I respected, may he RIP.

texanmojo
07-04-2009, 03:33 PM
Damn...that's unbelieveable...RIP Steve.

Showtime100
07-04-2009, 03:41 PM
Man oh man. Terrible and shocking to hear. Rest In Peace Steve. You will be missed.

Live each day my friends.

Hookem Horns
07-04-2009, 03:45 PM
many of us saw his first game live so go spend your time on the jags board if you really want to lecture a fanbase.

Exactly. I was at his first ever preseason game which ironically was in Tennessee, Knoxville to be exact. I even had his jersey by then and was wearing it. All the Tennesseans there were rooting for the Redskins. Funny how things turn out.

Mari-OWNED!
07-04-2009, 03:52 PM
So very sad... I was absolutely shocked when I heard the news...

R.I.P. Steve McNair, you were a joy to watch on the football field.

My condolences to the McNair family.

Fox
07-04-2009, 04:05 PM
Very sad, way too young. Great QB and much more importantly seemed like a great person. RIP.

TEXANS84
07-04-2009, 04:14 PM
Terrible, just saw up at the bar.

RTP2110
07-04-2009, 04:16 PM
Damn, just 36 years old, this is terrible.

RIP Steve!

ObsiWan
07-04-2009, 04:17 PM
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...

This is the Texans msg board, not the Titans.

I have a Steve McNair jersey.

Take your lecture someplace else.
:foottap:

R.I.P. Steve. My sympathies to his family & friends.

False Start
07-04-2009, 04:19 PM
Wow.... I loved it when we drafted Mcnair. I remember being so excited at the thought of him and George being the new faces of the Oilers. I still have his jersey stashed away in my storage building. It was the first jersey I ever purchased. RIP Steve. :(

ObsiWan
07-04-2009, 04:21 PM
Wow.... I loved it when we drafted Mcnair. I remember being so excited at the thought of him and George being the new faces of the Oilers. I still have his jersey stashed away in my storage building. It was the first jersey I ever purchased. RIP Steve. :(

Ditto!

Vinny
07-04-2009, 04:24 PM
Here is exactly where it went down...

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=2nd+south+and+lea,+Nashville&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&split=0&gl=us&ei=KshPSrWXKYnSsgPxls2qDQ&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=title&resnum=1

jaayteetx
07-04-2009, 04:26 PM
Way too young, what a shame. All the violence involving current and former players in the NFL really is getting scary. Looks like they're all big targets because of their fame and wealth. Sad.

WWJD
07-04-2009, 04:26 PM
Wow. How horrible.

I remember a game that Steve played where he and Ray Lewis were going at it...Steve played very well that game even though he was on the decline.

So darn tough.

Hookem Horns
07-04-2009, 04:27 PM
There are some rumors flying around that this was a murder / suicide. Anyone hear that?

Vinny
07-04-2009, 04:29 PM
There are some rumors flying around that this was a murder / suicide. Anyone hear that?

I haven't seen that anywhere other than in some guy posting on message boards myself. Double homicide is what I've seen everywhere.

TEXANS84
07-04-2009, 04:30 PM
Here is exactly where it went down...

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=2nd+south+and+lea,+Nashville&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&split=0&gl=us&ei=KshPSrWXKYnSsgPxls2qDQ&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=title&resnum=1

I'm assuming it's at those townhomes on the corner.
Still shocked, and according to the map right across from the stadium.

Vinny
07-04-2009, 04:31 PM
I'm assuming it's at those townhomes on the corner.
Still shocked, and according to the map right across from the stadium.
It was in one of those condos, but the stadium is in downtown and they have a small downtown so its pretty close.

GuerillaBlack
07-04-2009, 04:33 PM
Yeam, my uncle in Nashville called us about it about an hour ago. Really sad.

Reports are it was a murder-suicide.

WSMV says his wife killed him and than shot herself

MannyFresh
07-04-2009, 04:36 PM
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...

Aww shut up, we're better than that!

So sad to hear this news, world class person and player, man I feel for his family

GuerillaBlack
07-04-2009, 04:37 PM
I wonder how Vince Young is dealing with it. He always called Steve McNair pops.

Texan Asylum
07-04-2009, 04:40 PM
Unreal!

This is like a punch to the gut.

Hookem Horns
07-04-2009, 04:40 PM
I wonder how Vince Young is dealing with it. He always called Steve McNair pops.

VY already seemed a bit unstable. I wouldn't think this is going to help matters. However who knows. Maybe VY goes the other way with it and grows up some.

LORK 88
07-04-2009, 04:41 PM
Definitely a tragic thing to hear today, RIP Air McNair.

Lucky
07-04-2009, 04:49 PM
This is what I posted (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=895208&postcount=34) upon Steve McNair's retirement. Still seems appropriate.

It was much easier for me to root against the Titans once Eddie George & Steve McNair left the team. I have tons of respect for both, as they played the game the way it was meant to be played. I don't know if McNair will make the HOF, but he's a HOFer in my mind. Maybe not a great passer, ala a Fouts or Moon, but a great football player. He will be missed.
He will be missed. RIP, Steve.

valleytexfan
07-04-2009, 04:49 PM
RIP Steve. I still own his No. 9 jersey in columbia blue. I was very very excited when he was drafted by the Oilers. I remember he threw a football 75-80 yards against the wind in college and I was so in awe. RIP.

Brando
07-04-2009, 04:49 PM
Wow. I'm very shocked and saddened. RIP Steve McNair.

Hookem Horns
07-04-2009, 04:54 PM
CNN is reporting that the woman killed was his girlfriend. Wasn't he married?

Texan JBZ
07-04-2009, 05:01 PM
Man, I'm really hurting over this one. McNair grew up in the Pine Belt region of Mississippi just as I did. I followed his entire career from his record breaking performances at Alcorn to Houston and Tennessee. This is both sad and unbelievable at the same time. McNair by all accounts was a stand-up guy. I knew guys back home that played on his softball team. He was big into softball back home. I've never heard on person utter one bad word about him. He was known back home as a guy who loved to enjoy himself. He would have get-togethers at his ranch and order a whole beer truck for the party! Man, I'm just deeply saddened by this. My respects go out to his family. The state of Mississippi will miss you Steve! You were one of her finest sons ever. Rest in peace

Honoring Earl 34
07-04-2009, 05:01 PM
I watched McNair play agaist the Lions when Barry Sanders was with the Lions . I'm not sure if that but he came into the game in the 2nd half and rallied the Oilers .

CloakNNNdagger
07-04-2009, 05:04 PM
I remember coming across the fact that McNair recently opened a restaurant in Nashville.

“I always wanted to retire and teach kids about life, and I’m still doing that with my camps,’’ McNair said. “This is something that I can still give back to the community. A lot of college students don’t have the funds to go to (upscale) restaurants, but we can still offer them good food, healthy food they can afford.’’


The restaurant has a bit of a college, come-as-you-are type feel to it, not big, but relaxed.


“We want to know (customers), their name, what they eat and drink,’’ McNair said. “If I’m in town, I’ll be here every day.’’


McNair plans to open additional Gridiron9 locations. He’ll first look to expand at other areas in and around Nashville and then, perhaps, in McNair’s home state of Mississippi.

Link (http://www.tennessean.com/article/20090629/COUNTY01/90629057/Steve+McNair+hopes+to+open+more+restaurants+)

McNair will be missed by those who loved him and those who respected him.

gg no re
07-04-2009, 05:07 PM
R.I.P. Steve McNair

Oiler, Titan, Raven.... whatever he was, he was a man who people respected and admired, and he will be missed.

bckey
07-04-2009, 05:09 PM
Really sad to hear about Steve McNair. I loved to watch the guy play. Tough as nails. What a tragic and early end to his life. I'm shocked. We need more players in the NFL like McNair. RIP Steve. You will always be remembered as one of the greats and certainly one of the toughest.

stingray
07-04-2009, 05:09 PM
I saw Steve play when Alcorn State made a visit to Hunstville, Tx to play Sam Houston. I walked from my dorm to the stadium to see what all the fuss was about with this QB. Steve had just come out on the cover of Sports Illustrated. The stadium was full because of that cover. He put on a great show and passed for over 300 yrds. I'll never forget it.

R.I.P Steve

SheTexan
07-04-2009, 05:13 PM
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...


Geeeezzzzz, I can't believe you made that post! Kinda pisses me off!! This is definitely not the time for smack talk, and I don't believe any TEXAN fan would mouth off about something this sad. Steve was a rival football player, but, first of all, he was a father, son, and friend!! A very sad day for the McNair family, as well as Titan, Raven, and YES, old Oiler fans. May God give his family the strength they will need to get through this terrible time.

Texan4Ever
07-04-2009, 05:20 PM
Steve McNair was a fine athelete and hard-working QB who played for my beloved Oilers. Always had a smile on his face and was one of the best when it came to contributing his time to his community.

R.I.P. Air McNair

http://www.athlonsports.com/store/images/mcnair8x10oilers.jpg

IlliniJen
07-04-2009, 05:37 PM
This is shocking. RIP Stevie. I wasn't an Oilers fan, but you were a stand up QB and meant a lot to this city.

Malloy
07-04-2009, 05:50 PM
Real sad news :I

Bulluck53
07-04-2009, 06:14 PM
BA, they only have ill will towards Bud, he made the decision.

I'm in disbelief right now. I keep watching ESPN and everytime I see it in print it shocks me again. He's a big reason I became a fan.

Houston_Fanatic
07-04-2009, 06:18 PM
So very sad and shocking. Such a fine athlete and a fine person. too - a great loss.

My condolences to the McNair family.

Thorn
07-04-2009, 06:25 PM
Wow, shocking. RIP Steve, I enjoyed watching you play football for us.

Hervoyel
07-04-2009, 06:26 PM
Terrible news. I'm just so sorry to hear this. I used to curse Steve McNair non-stop when we were playing the Titans because it seemed like no matter what you did to him or how hard you came he would find a way to do something with it and move the team forward. I grew to hate him but it was that "hate" you reserve for a player you really respect. Maybe "dread" is more the word I'm looking for.

gary
07-04-2009, 06:32 PM
This is very sad news he was a great QB and an even better person and also a wonderful family man. This makes that SB loss niner years ago when his team come came up just short even sadder. RIP Stevie boy you will be missed. Has anyone heard what really happend?

ObsiWan
07-04-2009, 06:49 PM
I remember coming across the fact that McNair recently opened a restaurant in Nashville.



Link (http://www.tennessean.com/article/20090629/COUNTY01/90629057/Steve+McNair+hopes+to+open+more+restaurants+)

McNair will be missed by those who loved him and those who respected him.

I hadn't heard about the restaurant thing. And that article is only a week old.

Damn. Standup guy. Real, old school warrior. Tries to start something positive.
And it ends like this.
Absolutely tragic.

Maddict5
07-04-2009, 06:49 PM
RIP

its becoming a 'mcnair & girlfriend shot' story. the wife was in mississippi. even more unfortunately, it sounds like a complicated affair- no simple robbery gone wrong etc

CloakNNNdagger
07-04-2009, 07:01 PM
RIP

its becoming a 'mcnair & girlfriend shot' story. the wife was in mississippi. even more unfortunately, it sounds like a complicated affair- no simple robbery gone wrong etc

I was hoping that this was not the case. But it seemed a bit unusual that they would not have identified his wife during the initial report.
Police: Female Victim Not McNair's Wife

Getting even more bizarre with now possibility of murder/suicide. Witnesses were evidently not asked to come forward by the police:
Steve McNair and Companion Found Dead, Conflicting Reports Emerging (http://www.east-coast-bias.com/2009/07/steve-mcnair-dead-shot-along-with.html)

Revolution
07-04-2009, 07:13 PM
No matter what happens to come out....

R.I.P. Steve.

I loved watching him play the game of football.

CloakNNNdagger
07-04-2009, 07:31 PM
A Nashville TV station reports now that the police spokesman is saying that it is not a murder/suicide........and that they aren't even sure that the couple died today.
LINK (http://www.wsmv.com/news/19950553/detail.html)

Seems like a good deal of false information is coming in. The media is frenzied to get the "scoop." CNN (http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/07/04/mcnair.shooting/) initially put out a contradictory report that it was the "girlfriend's" condominium.


The murder/suicide story came from the initial misinformation that his wife was the shooter and the dead woman. It will take awhile until readers get the facts established.

Meanwhile, lost in all of this is what McNair's 4 children are going through (and his wife). Their "recovery will be a very difficult one no matter what the circumstances.

BigBull17
07-04-2009, 07:32 PM
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...

I liked Steve alot. He was alot of fun to watch, even when he beat us. Someone getting murdered transcends a petty rivalry. It's a sad story. R.I.P.

Revolution
07-04-2009, 08:01 PM
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...

He was HOUSTON Oiler, long before he ever played professional football in Tennessee...

toronto
07-04-2009, 08:01 PM
For one of the first times ever, I am sick to my stomach over an athlete's death. McNair was one of the greatest players I ever got the chance to root for, and when I got the wire copy (I get all AP bullets sent to my crackberry for work) of this, I didn't want to believe it.

I still can't come to grips with this. This frigging sucks. :(

Revolution
07-04-2009, 08:03 PM
Geeeezzzzz, I can't believe you made that post! Kinda pisses me off!! This is definitely not the time for smack talk, and I don't believe any TEXAN fan would mouth off about something this sad. Steve was a rival football player, but, first of all, he was a father, son, and friend!! A very sad day for the McNair family, as well as Titan, Raven, and YES, old Oiler fans. May God give his family the strength they will need to get through this terrible time.

Thanks for the great post. I couldn't agree more...

Blazing Arrow
07-04-2009, 08:14 PM
many of us saw his first game live so go spend your time on the jags board if you really want to lecture a fanbase.

I meant it in no disrespect but sometimes people see a guy as an enemy and think that it is a chance to diss the guy. When I heard the news the first thing I did was dig my jersey out and put it on. By far my favorite player as a Titan.

I know you guys are a classy group and did not think you would. I just felt remorse and did not want to see BS. Thank you all for not being those types of fans.

RIP McNair ... I just wish you had gotten a ring on what ever team you landed.

Blazing Arrow
07-04-2009, 08:17 PM
This is the Texans msg board, not the Titans.

I have a Steve McNair jersey.

Take your lecture someplace else.
:foottap:

R.I.P. Steve. My sympathies to his family & friends.

No lecture in anyways ... read my previous post to see my reasoning.

Giant Tiger
07-04-2009, 08:45 PM
Terrible news. I too was thrilled when the Oilers drafted Steve McNair. I always enjoyed watching him play and the way he carried himself on & off the field. RIP Steve.

gwallaia
07-04-2009, 09:19 PM
No matter how hard they hit McNair, he always got back up. So sad that it was a bullet that stopped him.

Heartfelt prayers to his family.

CloakNNNdagger
07-04-2009, 10:18 PM
The Tennessean has updated the story with solid facts............This one seems to pretty much ended the controversy..........an affair ending in a murder (McNair) / suicide (girlfriend).

UPDATED (http://www.tennessean.com/article/20090704/SPORTS01/90704013/UPDATED+7+30+p.m.++Steve+McNair+and+female+shot+to +death) 10 p.m.: Steve McNair and Sahel Kazemi killed


Former Tennessee Titans quarterback Steve McNair was killed in an apparent murder-suicide with a young woman he met at a local restaurant and have been dating for at least a few months.



McNair, the hometown hero who did extensive charity work in Nashville, died of several gunshots and was found on the sofa, police said. Sahel Kazemi, 20, was found alongside him in a Second Avenue condo he rented. She had a single gunshot wound to her head; a pistol was found near her body.

Metro police spokesman Don Aaron said they were leaning toward certain scenarios based on the evidence, but they hadn’t ruled anything out. Still, they were not actively looking for suspects Saturday night.


“The medical examiner will be conducting autopsies (Sunday),” Aaron said. “We expect to make additional conclusions after the autopsy process.”


Though much of the attention was on the Second Avenue crime scene, police also swarmed at the Cherry Creek apartment complex in Hermitage. They were questioning neighbors who said they often saw McNair visiting Kazemi. Sometimes, neighbors said, she would arrive home in a limousine in the early morning hours. She showed up with a new black car she said was a gift from her boyfriend.


She was arrested in that car, a black Cadillac Escalade registered to she and McNair, just two days before the deaths. She was charged with driving under the influence and refusing to take a breath test.


Keith Norfleet, Kazemi’s boyfriend for four years before they broke up five months ago, said he came to pick up the car for Kazemi.


Norfleet said McNair was in the car with her when the stop occurred, a fact that was not in the police affadavit but was confirmed by police Saturday night. McNair later bailed Kazemi out, according to bail bondsmen.


Norfleet said she told him she was seeing McNair, who she met while working as a waitress at Dave & Busters. He was worried about her dating a married man and hopeful they’d get back together. They had been living together for four years, since they moved from her family’s home in Jacksonville, Fla., to Nashville.

texanhead08
07-04-2009, 10:40 PM
I dont think this is a murder/suicide. Its just too weird that she would kill McNair after they had been dating for a few months and he has purchased a new car for her and such. The only way I can see the murder/suicide possibilty is if he told her it was over and he wanted the car and such back.

Texaninlild
07-04-2009, 10:44 PM
I am in no way a Titan fan, but when you lose a good man those things don't matter. With all that is wrong with the players, he was one you could point to as an example of what players should be. He has garnered the respect of all around the league, as seen by the comments. Just a sad day.

Corrosion
07-04-2009, 11:20 PM
RIP Steve , You'll always be an Oiler to me.

Goldensilence
07-04-2009, 11:21 PM
A friend called me up today to tell me as I've been working on a move all day. All the "celebrity" deaths lately, this one hit home to me more so then the others.

Shame that his life ended this way and I don't know if it might tarnish his legacy any. Guy was a great athlete and a fierce competitor. He was also a stand up guy in the locker room and community. I remember seeing reports of how he treated his mom on draft day and just... respect for a guy who does that for his mom. That made me a fan.

Steve no matter what you're still an Oiler to me. RIP.

Yankee_In_TX
07-04-2009, 11:23 PM
My wife just saw it on her IPod. Wow. I said what? Are you sure? RIP.

Wolf
07-04-2009, 11:40 PM
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...

BA, I know we give grief and kid around in the rivalry section (among other things), but .. at least on this board, when things turn serious, you will see our true colors ..on game day.. yes it is the enemy and we say stuff but when it comes to real life stuff , we are compassionate human beings and fans of the game.

R.I.P Steve

sad that the good dye young



my thoughts and prayers go out for his family,friends and even fans on this tragic day

I will admit.. even as the titans were a yard short, I was pulling for them to beat the rams (no matter what smack talk I gave and continue to give)

DBCooper
07-04-2009, 11:52 PM
Holy Crap!

Sad, Sad, Sad!

Wish I could have rooted for him more, seemed like a good guy too.

disaacks3
07-04-2009, 11:55 PM
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...

When I heard about this before leaving for fireworks, all I could think was the world lost one of its great competitors. The man may not have been the best QB, but he was a true competitor who left it all on the field every game.
RIP Steve.

JCTexan
07-04-2009, 11:57 PM
I was never a fan of the Oilers (too young), and I've never liked the Titans, but Steve Mcnair earned my respect by his toughness. He was a hell of a player. R.I.P Mcnair

Bulluck53
07-05-2009, 12:00 AM
Please excuse this message for it shows how mind-numbing the grieving process apparently is for me. Apologies.

StarStruck
07-05-2009, 12:13 AM
I had just tuned into CNN when the breaking news report was announced. I sat in absolute shock. My prayers are extended to his family, fans, teammates and teams as I can only imagine the devastation all must feel.

I recall him being the awe of SWAC and how people went to games that Alcorn played just to see this young quarterback. Then, after being drafted by the Oilers he appeared on Extra Points or a similar Houston sports show and how accessable he ws to the audience and his many supporters. While visiting Nashville on business in the early 2000's I bought a jersey for my son at a sports team shop near the stadium. Although at the time, I wasn't happy with Bud packing up and leaving Houston, I still had nothing but admiration for McNair.

He was a warrior and I recall reading how sometimes it was hard for him to pick up his child or his wife who was educated as a nurse helped him through much of the pain that he bore from his game injuries.

bckey
07-05-2009, 12:28 AM
I dont think this is a murder/suicide. Its just too weird that she would kill McNair after they had been dating for a few months and he has purchased a new car for her and such. The only way I can see the murder/suicide possibilty is if he told her it was over and he wanted the car and such back.


I was thinking the same thing. I'm guessing the former boyfriend Keith Norfleet whom she lived with for 4 years is a major suspect.

GuerillaBlack
07-05-2009, 12:30 AM
I was thinking the same thing. I'm guessing the former boyfriend Keith Norfleet whom she lived with for 4 years is a major suspect.

I think it is a murder-suicide. How can Steve McNair have multiple gunshots to the hair, but the girlfriend have one? Murder-suicide.

texasguy346
07-05-2009, 12:40 AM
Very sad news. I was shocked, and my prayers go out to the victim's families.

Vinny
07-05-2009, 01:18 AM
I'm really pissed at ESPN right now, they're showing way too many clips of Steve in purple. Selfish I know, but come on!

I'm sure some of you may feel somewhat the same.
I'm sure most of us don't. Most of us don't give a crap about team colors when it comes to a 36 year old man murdered - someone who we all followed since his draft at that. You Titan fans need to find some dignity or go pollute your own board with this stuff please.

BSofA04
07-05-2009, 01:26 AM
RIP Steve. Loved you as an Oiler, hated you as a Titan, respected you as a person.

stingray
07-05-2009, 01:27 AM
I saw Steve play when Alcorn State made a visit to Hunstville, Tx to play Sam Houston. I walked from my dorm to the stadium to see what all the fuss was about with this QB. Steve had just come out on the cover of Sports Illustrated. The stadium was full because of that cover. He put on a great show and passed for over 300 yrds. I'll never forget it.

R.I.P Steve

This is the cover that came out on of S.I. when I saw Steve play in Hunstsville against the Bearkats.

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb167/ray9175/0926_large.jpg

YellerLotYeller
07-05-2009, 01:31 AM
I remember sitting in the Astrodome thinking "man, I sure wish they would play him." It seemed like all we did that year was watch Eddie run and stare at the back of Steve's head wishing he was in.

When he became the enemy I was always jealous of how tough of a qb he was.

RIP Steve McNair

DiehardChris
07-05-2009, 01:39 AM
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...

Listen man, I haven't read this entire thread, but I saw this post and had to respond... just what the hell do you think you're saying here?

He was a Houston Oiler before he ever went to Nashville, and he was beloved here, as well. I was a huge, huge McNair fan, obviously - and I'm sorry - but he's not "yours" to come in here and be uneccessarily protective over. I saw this guy play in Huntsville when I was going to SHSU and Alcorn St. came to town. I was doing color commentary for the team as a student and by then it was already obvious he was headed for the NFL... and a lot of people were already speculating he would end up an Oiler... so again - he was a HUGE part of Houston's community too, it was just a long time ago.

RIP Steve McNair. He was a class guy who never a "me" athlete, and he didn't seek out the spotlight. He will be missed. One of the toughest football players ever.

Wolf
07-05-2009, 01:43 AM
I remember sitting in the Astrodome thinking "man, I sure wish they would play him." It seemed like all we did that year was watch Eddie run and stare at the back of Steve's head wishing he was in.

When he became the enemy I was always jealous of how tough of a qb he was.

RIP Steve McNair

I thought that too.. It took a Eddie George injury to open fisher's eyes up to open up the offense (so it seemed)

Fisher was a 3 yards and a cloud of dust (so it seemed at the time)

Carr Bombed
07-05-2009, 02:17 AM
I've been reading this thread for a couple of hours, but didn't really know what to type in it. When I found out about Steve's death I was in absolute shock.....he's a guy I followed since his college years and he was one of the last "Oilers". I'm extremely saddened by what happened. The guy is not going to go in the HOF and years from now the guy is not going to be remembered as one of the alltime great QBs, but I don't know if I've seen more of a straight "competitor" from that position. He was a guy that just kept getting up...and up..and up. Even though Adams moved the team, I always had respect for McNair and a peice of me wanted Tenn. to win that SB for him......god knows he put them in position to win the damn thing.


Anyways...RIP Steve.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6fQ7FKRTRw

:( I still can't believe the news I heard today...... It might as well have been a Texan killed....after all the battles we've had with Steve (and the guy always found a way to win..LOL he killed us) it felt about the same way.

GuerillaBlack
07-05-2009, 02:26 AM
Wait, so the woman he was supposedly cheating on his wife with, killed him? If true, I have to admit a certain twisted karma.

But, one of the toughest players to ever play football, at any position. It's unbelievable how he was so banged up yet never gave up, never cried, never whined and never ego tripped. How he was able to put his body through hell and still be a leader and an effective player is something I'll never ever forget. I don't think his numbers are good enough to get him into Canton, at the very least his #9 should at least be retired by the Titans.

Koolaid Time
07-05-2009, 06:53 AM
Lesson to all of you; Don't date a 19-20 year old Dave & Busters Waitress/Psychobitch.

Most recently, she had a new black car she said was a gift from her boyfriend.

She was arrested in that car, a black 2007 Cadillac Escalade registered to her and McNair, early Thursday at Broadway and Ninth Avenue, just two days before the deaths. She was charged with driving under the influence and refusing to take a breath test. She told police she was not drunk, but high.

McNair was in the car, a fact that was not in the police affidavit but was confirmed by police Saturday night. Police allowed McNair to take a cab home. He later bailed Kazemi out of jail, according to bail bondsmen.

Ex-boyfriend worried

Keith Norfleet, who said he dated Kazemi for four years before they broke up five months ago, was worried about her dating McNair, a married man. She met McNair while she was a waitress at Dave & Buster’s Grand Sports Cafe, he said.

“She was a very strong, independent girl. A hard worker,” said Norfleet, who had hoped to get back together with her. “She had a huge heart. She was very caring, very loving.”

Neighbors said she had turned 20 just a few weeks ago and described her as friendly and fun-loving though naive about some things. She was known as Jenny to her friends.

Tony Farahani, general manager at Dave and Buster’s at Opry Mills, said McNair frequently came to his restaurant, often bringing several people. He said he would not be surprised if McNair met Kazemi there. He described Kazemi as a solid employee, a workaholic with high energy.

“This is a tremendous shock, so unexpected. She was a bubbly girl and she was supposed to come today at 5 p.m.”

http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/...t+to+death

http://www.hollywoodcelebgossips.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/sahel-kazemi-picture.jpg

CloakNNNdagger
07-05-2009, 07:41 AM
Date rape drug and boyfriend threat. Facts, rumors or coincidence???? The Nashville City Paper (http://nashvillecitypaper.com/content/city-news/details-shed-new-light-mcnairs-death) reports:

While the news that Former Tennessee Titans quarterback Steve McNair has died has Nashville in a state of shock, NashvillePost.com has gathered new information that sheds a different light on his untimely death.

McNair, 36, and an unnamed woman, were found dead Saturday in downtown Nashville.

The pair died of apparent gunshots wounds and were found in a condominium at 2nd and Lea Avenues in Rutledge Hill. The woman, sources say, was approximately 20 years of age.

While Metro Police has reported that details are sketchy, NashvillePost.com sources say that at approximately 2 a.m. Saturday morning, McNair was celebrating the holiday weekend at the Blue Moon Restaurant near the John C. Tune Airport.

According to the same NashvillePost.com sources, a white woman in her early 20s, around 5-foot-4, approached McNair at the restaurant and accused him of slipping her a “roofie” a year ago.

The woman then told McNair, according to sources, that her boyfriend was going to kill him.

Roofie is a slang term for Rohypnol, a sedative dating back to the early 1970s that is used in hospitals for deep sedation, but is now a fairly infamous date-rape drug.

Multiple sources have confirmed that this information has been shared with the Metro Police Department. Metro Police has yet to identify the dead woman, but is it unknown if the woman at the restaurant is the same woman found in the condo.

GermanTexan
07-05-2009, 07:49 AM
R.i.p.

Maddict5
07-05-2009, 07:56 AM
just speculating but it has all the signs of McNair cheating on his wife, then wanting to stop and end the relationship, only to have her flip out and commit murder/suicide.

I'm just saying that's what it looks like.

CloakNNNdagger
07-05-2009, 08:18 AM
I thought that, at a time like this, it would be appropriate to post a link to what I have found to be the best and most inclusive biography on McNair I've ever read. I learned many things about McNair "the man" and "the QB" that I didn't know

STEVE MCNAIR'S BIOGRAPHY---HIS LIFE AND CAREER (http://www.jockbio.com/Bios/McNair/McNair_bio.html)

Lucky
07-05-2009, 08:27 AM
Listen man, I haven't read this entire thread, but I saw this post and had to respond... just what the hell do you think you're saying here?
Everyone, this has been hashed over enough. Let's move on and not spoil this thread. This is about Steve McNair.

Edit: Any off topic posts will be removed, from here on.

Bulluck53
07-05-2009, 08:41 AM
Date rape drug and boyfriend threat. Facts, rumors or coincidence???? The Nashville City Paper (http://nashvillecitypaper.com/content/city-news/details-shed-new-light-mcnairs-death) reports:

The Tennessean will be the most reliable source throughout all this, not ruling out those rumors, though. This whole thing is a big mess.

Koolaid Time
07-05-2009, 09:24 AM
The Tennessean will be the most reliable source throughout all this, not ruling out those rumors, though. This whole thing is a big mess.

The sad thing is if the Nashville Police didn't cover up the fact that McNair was in the car when the bimbo was popped for the DWI, he still might be alive.

News would leak that a car with McNair in it (and registered to him as co-owner) was involved in a DWI stop. Michelle McNair (wife) would have raised Holy Hell, and Steve would have gone back to Hattiesburg to settle things out. He wouldn't have been in Nashville when the bimbo went off her rocker.

nunusguy
07-05-2009, 09:49 AM
He’s a reminder to us all that we put the wrong people on pedestals, that running fast and jumping high defines one only narrowly.

Being brilliant in the fourth quarter of a close game doesn’t make one a great husband or father. So as we honor a great athlete who touched hundreds and lived his public life with grace and dignity, we are reminded that men have flaws.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/6513317.html
**************************************
Here's Chron columnist Richie J being candid again and some might say controversial with these thoughts about McNair just hours after the former-QBs tragic and violent death. But it certainly puts some things in perspective.

Malloy
07-05-2009, 10:41 AM
Too much speculation going on here. Until more facts are revealed its really bad form to automatically condemn the 20-year old as being a psycho biach and Steve as being unfaithful.

eriadoc
07-05-2009, 10:44 AM
He’s a reminder to us all that we put the wrong people on pedestals, that running fast and jumping high defines one only narrowly.

Being brilliant in the fourth quarter of a close game doesn’t make one a great husband or father. So as we honor a great athlete who touched hundreds and lived his public life with grace and dignity, we are reminded that men have flaws.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/6513317.html
**************************************
Here's Chron columnist Richie J being candid again and some might say controversial with these thoughts about McNair just hours after the former-QBs tragic and violent death. But it certainly puts some things in perspective.

I actually agree. I haven't posted on this topic because there's no need to trample a dead man's grave, but I keep seeing people post how he's a class act when he's got a 20-year old girlfriend and a wife back home.

I hated him on the football field, but in the way that you hate truly great players. The game was better for having him, and I wish we would have gotten the opportunity to enjoy him here in Houston. R.I.P. Steve.

Too much speculation going on here. Until more facts are revealed its really bad form to automatically condemn the 20-year old as being a psycho biach and Steve as being unfaithful.

That may be, and I hope that's the case.

Blazing Arrow
07-05-2009, 10:47 AM
http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u13/BlazingArrow24/stevemvp.jpg

Hookem Horns
07-05-2009, 10:49 AM
He’s a reminder to us all that we put the wrong people on pedestals, that running fast and jumping high defines one only narrowly.



I agree. The reverence given to these players is too much in general. I'll root for them on Sunday (if they play for my team) however it pretty much stops there for me. We rarely know who these people really are and meeting them a few times is no indicator. Just because they have some athletic ability doesn't make them any better or due anymore reverence than anyone else. Many of these pro athletes are slimeballs on the human level.

As for this story, I will just say that nothing good ever comes out of betraying your own family. McNair paid the ultimate price however the price his family will now be paying is even greater because they have to live with it.

This girl wasn't even legal to drink. My feelings are more for his wife and kids than McNair himself.

Dan B.
07-05-2009, 10:52 AM
Steve was a wonderful football player and a great teammate. He was, much like all of us, not a perfect man however. There is a tendency to hagiographize celebrities/athletes though. We in Houston are guilty too -- if Troy Aikman had the same record of spousal abuse that Warren Moon does, how would most of you react to his name coming up?

I mourn Steve's tragic passing. There was still a lot of good in the world left for him to accomplish. His death should still serve as a lesson though. Whatever happened, no matter how painful it may be to have the details come out, it may teach all of us quite a bit about the dangers of infidelity and putting yourself in potentially dangerous situations.

Hookem Horns
07-05-2009, 11:02 AM
Steve was a wonderful football player and a great teammate. He was, much like all of us, not a perfect man however. There is a tendency to hagiographize celebrities/athletes though. We in Houston are guilty too -- if Troy Aikman had the same record of spousal abuse that Warren Moon does, how would most of you react to his name coming up?

I mourn Steve's tragic passing. There was still a lot of good in the world left for him to accomplish. His death should still serve as a lesson though. Whatever happened, no matter how painful it may be to have the details come out, it may teach all of us quite a bit about the dangers of infidelity and putting yourself in potentially dangerous situations.

Agree, however don't think Moon's issues did not tarnish his legacy in Houston. Just ask SheTexan what she thinks of Warren Moon. I lost any respect I had for him too after all of that came out. Choking in the playoffs is one thing, however choking your wife is quite another.

Marcus
07-05-2009, 11:11 AM
For the FWIW department . . .

Just got thru reading aloud the Chronicle story to the wife . . . she said "when was the last time you heard about a woman shooting a man and then killing herself? it's always the other way around."

She thinks Michelle was there waiting for them.

Anyways, forensically, this should be a very easy one to solve.

RIP Steve.

texanmojo
07-05-2009, 11:12 AM
The sad thing is if the Nashville Police didn't cover up the fact that McNair was in the car when the bimbo was popped for the DWI, he still might be alive.

News would leak that a car with McNair in it (and registered to him as co-owner) was involved in a DWI stop. Michelle McNair (wife) would have raised Holy Hell, and Steve would have gone back to Hattiesburg to settle things out. He wouldn't have been in Nashville when the bimbo went off her rocker.

Whenever someone dies in a tragic way...there are ALWAYS "what-ifs"...

He was a great player...and he will be missed.

Hookem Horns
07-05-2009, 11:17 AM
Whenever someone dies in a tragic way...there are ALWAYS "what-ifs"...


True, in a way this is Bud's fault. If he wouldn't have moved the team to Nashville, McNair would have never met that woman.

:thinking:

Marcus
07-05-2009, 11:28 AM
True, in a way this is Bud's fault. If he wouldn't have moved the team to Nashville, McNair would have never met that woman.

:thinking:

Actually, it was the Houston Oilers and the fans' fault. If they hadn't of choked that Buffalo game, the Oilers would still be here, and the Houston Texans and the Tennessee Titans wouldn't even exist.

:wild:

SheTexan
07-05-2009, 11:32 AM
Agree, however don't think Moon's issues did not tarnish his legacy in Houston. Just ask SheTexan what she thinks of Warren Moon. I lost any respect I had for him too after all of that came out. Choking in the playoffs is one thing, however choking your wife is quite another.

Yep, Warren Moon is definitely NOT one of my fav players of all time. Some has to do with the way he treated his wife, but, more of it has to do with the things I heard about him deliberately throwing games for money. I don't know what's true and what's not, and really don't care anymore. What he, or any football player, does with their personal life is none of my business, BUT, IF he was indeed quilty of throwing a game, then I will hate him until the day I die. NOthing I could do if his wife was to weak to file charges against the bastard, BUT, I will not honor that same bastard for screwing over thousands of Oiler fans.

Bulluck53
07-05-2009, 11:42 AM
The sad thing is if the Nashville Police didn't cover up the fact that McNair was in the car when the bimbo was popped for the DWI, he still might be alive.

News would leak that a car with McNair in it (and registered to him as co-owner) was involved in a DWI stop. Michelle McNair (wife) would have raised Holy Hell, and Steve would have gone back to Hattiesburg to settle things out. He wouldn't have been in Nashville when the bimbo went off her rocker.


You've got a point. I think a lot of the news coming out, assuming they are true, makes this whole thing seem a little fishy. I'll wait until we get more details.

Vinny
07-05-2009, 11:43 AM
My greatest memory of McNair was his almost perfect drive to end the SB with the Rams. If the Titans drafted Moss instead of Dyson they would have beaten the Rams that year. McNair made 3-4 just incredible ridiculously athletic plays to keep that drive alive.

Lucky
07-05-2009, 11:52 AM
My top memory of McNair is from a Sunday Night game versus the Bucs (as the QB for the Tennessee Oilers). With a 2 point lead and about 2 minutes left, the Oilers needed a 3rd down conversion, else punt to a hot Tampa Bay offense. A naked boot to the right was called. McNair made a DE miss, cut back against the grain, and outran a very fast Buc defense to the goalline. Jaw dropping play (wish I could find it on youtube).

Bulluck53
07-05-2009, 12:16 PM
I've had so many. '03 against the Giants in the Meadowlands. '03 vs the Texans at home. So many from the '99 season and of course the 2nd half of the Super Bowl. The thrill of the '02 season. He and Eddie George were the rocks of the franchise through the move and the next seven years. Steve did more than anyone for the Titans and the city of Nashville. The city is devastated right now. I wish he had gotten that ring, whether with Baltimore or Tennessee, because he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame.

My favorite has to be one where he wasn't even playing. The Music City Miracle clip where it shows his expression after Dyson scores. He went through so much adversity that year, from a mini QB controversy created by the fans, expectations finally coming to fruition, back surgery and his usual assortment of nicks and bruises culminated on that play and his reaction showed how much he loved the game. I was eleven and his face sticks out to me more than any other game from that season, even the Super Bowl.

It makes you put things into perspective, as far as sports go, but also makes you want to go back and cherish the moments as they happen.

Brando
07-05-2009, 12:37 PM
My top memory of McNair is from a Sunday Night game versus the Bucs (as the QB for the Tennessee Oilers). With a 2 point lead and about 2 minutes left, the Oilers needed a 3rd down conversion, else punt to a hot Tampa Bay offense. A naked boot to the right was called. McNair made a DE miss, cut back against the grain, and outran a very fast Buc defense to the goalline. Jaw dropping play (wish I could find it on youtube).

That play( I too tried to find it on youtube)and the SB drive that Vinny mentioned are the memories that stand out to me also.

Mailman
07-05-2009, 01:03 PM
For the FWIW department . . .

Just got thru reading aloud the Chronicle story to the wife . . . she said "when was the last time you heard about a woman shooting a man and then killing herself? it's always the other way around."

http://tbn0.google.com/hosted/images/c?q=e0a900bf0b828bc3_landing

Mailman
07-05-2009, 01:06 PM
Too much speculation going on here. Until more facts are revealed its really bad form to automatically condemn the 20-year old as being a psycho biach and Steve as being unfaithful.

I think it's self-evident that he was being unfaithful. Rich pro athletes don't buy expensive vehicles for 20-yr old waitresses out of charity and kindness.

HoustonFrog
07-05-2009, 01:49 PM
First of all RIP Steve. Just got back from Lake Austin and am catching up on the details. I loved the way he played

As for what happened. Why are so many focusing on the wife. The 20 year old had a boyfriend or ex that she dated for 4 years and that she broke up with just months before. He could be the person just as easily as the wife. Either way this seems to be something that will be uncovered quickly. Of course he was shot multiple times and the girl in the head once which makes it seem personal towards McNair.

BattleRedToro
07-05-2009, 02:00 PM
Yep, Warren Moon is definitely NOT one of my fav players of all time. Some has to do with the way he treated his wife, but, more of it has to do with the things I heard about him deliberately throwing games for money. I don't know what's true and what's not, and really don't care anymore. What he, or any football player, does with their personal life is none of my business, BUT, IF he was indeed quilty of throwing a game, then I will hate him until the day I die. NOthing I could do if his wife was to weak to file charges against the bastard, BUT, I will not honor that same bastard for screwing over thousands of Oiler fans.

You are assuming that Warren Moon beat his wife when I remember hearing that it was his wife that was the one that was doing the hitting. I don't know what happened and neither do you, so I think it would be best not to imply guilt on his part or weakness on her part when it comes to their personal life.

HoustonFrog
07-05-2009, 02:38 PM
Updated

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4307274


NASHVILLE, Tenn. -- Former NFL quarterback Steve McNair's death has been classified a homicide, but the death of Sahel Kazemi, the woman found alongside him in his downtown condominium, remains unclassified, Nashville police said.

Autopsies were conducted early Sunday, and McNair was found to have suffered four gunshot wounds -- two to the head, and two to the chest, police spokesman Don Aaron said during an afternoon news conference.

Kazemi, 20, had one gunshot wound, to the head, according to police. A semiautomatic pistol was found under her body later during processing of the crime scene, and there was no sign of forced entry, police said.

As for the victims' connection, "They apparently were involved in a dating relationship over the past several months," Aaron said.

Nashville police said Saturday night that they weren't actively looking for suspects, and also did not believe McNair's wife was involved.

Mechelle McNair, mother of two of his four sons, was expected to collect her husband's belongings from authorities. Funeral arrangements were not expected to be finalized until Monday afternoon at the earliest

Polo
07-05-2009, 02:40 PM
Sad...RIP Steve

CloakNNNdagger
07-05-2009, 02:45 PM
You are assuming that Warren Moon beat his wife when I remember hearing that it was his wife that was the one that was doing the hitting. I don't know what happened and neither do you, so I think it would be best not to imply guilt on his part or weakness on her part when it comes to their personal life.

Sorry, but the facts were pretty straight forward. Moon's wife reported to the Houston police he slapped her, then choked her to the point of almost losing consciousness. The case went to trial. However, with Moon promising that he would go through conseling and publicly apologizing, his wife refused to testify against him, leading to acquittal.

Overalls
07-05-2009, 02:52 PM
Besides when the Oilers came home after losing in the Afc Championships so long ago, the only fan friendly thing I can remember Dud doing in Houston is having a draft party the year the Oilers drafted Steve. We all take the draft parties for granted now and I didn't even go to this years because it almost seemed to be a "been there, done that" event but back then it was the biggest fan event I had ever been too. I remember standing on the 50 yard line in the Dome after the Oilers drafted him and thinking "Life don't get any better than this."

You never know what personal demons a person carries. I don't know yours. You don't know mine. We don't know Steves. I don't like the sound of what it looks like may have happened but I won't judge a dead man. It's not my place.

My prayers go out to his and her families. They need them more than I need to be able to put a football player on a pedistal.

CloakNNNdagger
07-05-2009, 02:57 PM
The girlfriend's sister adds more potential twists to the story.
[The Tennessean (http://www.tennessean.com/article/20090705/NEWS03/90705013/Kazemi+s+sister)]

Salmani said she talked to her sister nearly every day, and that she'd been hearing about McNair for several months, since he started coming to Dave & Busters and chatting her up.

"He started to talk to her a little," Salmani said. "They exchanged phone numbers, and started dating from there."

Kazemi told her sister that McNair was in the process of divorcing.

"That's why she was like, 'OK, now you're divorcing. We can date,'" Salmani said. "He told her, it was going to be finished, the whole divorce was going to be done, two weeks from yesterday."

Although a check of Davidson County's court records shows there is no divorce pending — at least in Nashville — McNair's house is for sale. His wife, Mechelle McNair, hasn't spoken to the media. Police said she is distraught over his death.

Salmani said her sister believed that she and McNair would move in together once the divorce was final, and eventually marry.

"All she was trying to do was have fun," Salmani said. "Nothing else. I believe there is a third person involved."

Kazemi first came to Nashville nearly four years ago with her then-boyfriend, Keith Norfleet. They broke up about five months ago, and she started seeing McNair soon after.

She probably didn't know who McNair was, Salmani said, until her colleagues at the restaurant told her. Salmani now fears McNair was using her sister, because she was a young woman with a pretty face. She fears jealous people in his life are the reason her sister is dead, and won't live out her dreams.

Her greatest dream, Salmani said, was to be famous.

"I think she is now," she said. "She is everywhere."

Hookem Horns
07-05-2009, 03:52 PM
Anyone find this interesting? It was a screen shot taken from a MySpace page of a friend of McNair's girlfriend's x-boyfriend Keith Norfleet. The account has been deleted by someone. Notice what his MS headline says, then notice the last time he had logged in.

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g282/baldballer02/McNairsuspect3.jpg

GuerillaBlack
07-05-2009, 03:54 PM
I think it's self-evident that he was being unfaithful. Rich pro athletes don't buy expensive vehicles for 20-yr old waitresses out of charity and kindness.

IF he cheated, then that would be low. I have pretty much no respect for cheaters.

However, I'm not about to jump on a moral soapbox just after someone died. We have all fallen from grace at some point and IF this was his "fall," then it shouldn't take away from the sum whole of his life. Especially when he was a pillar of the community, gave much of himself and his money for so many causes, and was the kind of player you want to root for. Even if he wasn't on your team.

SheTexan
07-05-2009, 04:45 PM
You are assuming that Warren Moon beat his wife when I remember hearing that it was his wife that was the one that was doing the hitting. I don't know what happened and neither do you, so I think it would be best not to imply guilt on his part or weakness on her part when it comes to their personal life.

Why don't you read a post completely before you respond with sarcasm. I CLEARLY said, I don't know what's true and what's not!! I also said it's none of my business what player's do with their personal life. We all have opinions as to what happened back in that day and age, and we can all agree to disagree about W. Moon. This thread has to do with Steve McNair! I apologize for anything I said that might have highjacked this thread away from it's original intention.

RIP Steve!!

texanmojo
07-05-2009, 04:47 PM
Anyone find this interesting? It was a screen shot taken from a MySpace page of a friend of McNair's girlfriend's x-boyfriend Keith Norfleet. The account has been deleted by someone. Notice what his MS headline says, then notice the last time he had logged in.

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g282/baldballer02/McNairsuspect3.jpg

Yes...interesting...the RIP Sahel part is especially interesting.

Koolaid Time
07-05-2009, 05:02 PM
http://photos.tmz.com/galleries/steve_mcnair_and_sahel_kazemi#46171

Apparently she and Steve went on a parasailing trip to the beach together.

texanmojo
07-05-2009, 06:09 PM
Anyone find this interesting? It was a screen shot taken from a MySpace page of a friend of McNair's girlfriend's x-boyfriend Keith Norfleet. The account has been deleted by someone. Notice what his MS headline says, then notice the last time he had logged in.

It's also interesting that the police HAVE NOT ruled her death a suicide. The fact that they have not done this yet leads me to believe that there "might" be someone else involved, and when I see the page like the one you just posted, it futhers my belief that someone else was involved.

Didn't she say something about her boyfriend wanted to kill him? Just seems odd to me that this is taking so long.

GuerillaBlack
07-05-2009, 06:23 PM
*snip*

I'm thinking it was photoshopped. It could have been easily.

Dread-Head
07-05-2009, 07:19 PM
Rest in peace Steve.

JPPT1974
07-05-2009, 07:48 PM
RIP Steve, you will be missed! Thoughts and prayers are with you and your loved ones!

CloakNNNdagger
07-05-2009, 07:49 PM
It's also interesting that the police HAVE NOT ruled her death a suicide. The fact that they have not done this yet leads me to believe that there "might" be someone else involved, and when I see the page like the one you just posted, it futhers my belief that someone else was involved.

Didn't she say something about her boyfriend wanted to kill him? Just seems odd to me that this is taking so long.

There are many strange bits of info coming out, or should I say, not coming out. The late revelation that the gun wasn't found because she was laying on it, and the crime scene investigators discovered it "later." It is very atypical for a suicide gun not to found away from the body. Then the fact that no-one was brought in for questioning and the announcement was made that they are pursuing no other suspects (throw any suspects off). After the autopsy, knowing the exact angle of trajectory, the position of the body, the position of the gun, the powder patterns, the casings and type of bullet and its pattern........and still no suicide confirmation. At that time of occurence, it is probably safe to assume, with both of their past party/drinking history, that there was alcohol associated at some level. There can be many speculative alternatives, not saying that any are correct. A third party present after she shot McNair, only to shoot her (unexpected to her) as a staged suicide..............her ex, a hired gun, an angry father (Persian honor killing). No matter how this turns out, it would not surprise me to see this show up as a segment on "Snapped," because it is obvious someone snapped.

Whatever the real story, let it come out sooner than later, for the sake of this not being a long ardous story that only prolongs an already tragic set of events having befallen those innocents left behind.

texanmojo
07-05-2009, 07:58 PM
I'm thinking it was photoshopped. It could have been easily.

Very true...good point.

WWJD
07-05-2009, 08:01 PM
This story leaves a knot in my stomach. Just horrible.

Koolaid Time
07-05-2009, 08:37 PM
Whatever the real story, let it come out sooner than later, for the sake of this not being a long ardous story that only prolongs an already tragic set of events having befallen those innocents left behind.

Its only going to get worse IMO. I wonder what was "cleaned up" at the condo and flushed down the toilet in the 30 minutes between the bodies were found by the co-owner of the condo, who for some reason called McNair's buddy instead of immediately calling the authorities.

It was McNair's buddy who then came over to the condo and then called 911.

I have a feeling that the tox results will show some "party substances" in the blood of both.

ubecool454
07-05-2009, 08:42 PM
You are assuming that Warren Moon beat his wife when I remember hearing that it was his wife that was the one that was doing the hitting. I don't know what happened and neither do you, so I think it would be best not to imply guilt on his part or weakness on her part when it comes to their personal life.

OK battle I was going to say the same thing but to keep from getting in a big mess on these boards again I thought I would just let it ride. You are right that we don't have a clue what was going on in their personal lives. I've known women who are pretty violent....so what do you do in that case? I guess be a punching bag..lol

Hookem Horns
07-05-2009, 10:30 PM
I'm thinking it was photoshopped. It could have been easily.

True, however the board that I found this on had the original link posted to MySpace for all to to see this live and others were replying to seeing this thing live on MySpace. Within a few hours the account was deleted. However someone took a screenshot of the page before it went down and that is what I posted.

Here is the link to the account this was found on http://www.myspace.com/postedinthaoch . Notice to the right of the "More" dropdown menu it has the "The Caucasion Persuasion" as the last choice. This account was real.

As for the board I found this on look at the thread here http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=86011&page=2 and people replying to what it said before it was taken down. Off of that I tend to believe this is an actual screenshot and not a Photoshop job since people were seeing this live on MySpace.

Also, IMO if someone was going to go through the trouble of photoshopping this they would have done it on her x-boyfriend's MySpace page here http://www.myspace.com/460719734

If this is real it will come out in a few days. MySpace surely has a way to retrieve records of deleted acccounts and I am sure someone has forwarded this to the police in Nashville.

toronto
07-05-2009, 11:25 PM
I have had very few 'football' heroes, thanks to a relatively crummy franchise you all know well and suffered with alongside me before they split to Nashville.

Campbell. Bethea. Matthews. Moon. Bishop. McNair. That's been it for me, and McNair's death has just stunned the crap outta me. Almost 2 days later and I can't shake the 'stun.'

:(

RTP2110
07-06-2009, 12:08 AM
I just read a rumor that someone at the crime scene leaked that according to her liver temperature, she had been dead for 2 days.

GuerillaBlack
07-06-2009, 12:11 AM
I just read a rumor that someone at the crime scene leaked that according to her liver temperature, she had been dead for 2 days.

How is that possible if she was just pulled over for DWI the day before?

CloakNNNdagger
07-06-2009, 07:57 AM
The Tennessean (http://tennessean.com/article/20090706/NEWS03/907060343/Girlfriend+had+hoped+to+wed+McNair) writes a 3 page interview with the girlfriend's nephew, which confirms the relationship, the trips, the future plans, her ex's jealousy, and reasons that she and the family had reason to believe that McNair and his wife were separated in preparation for divorce.

Police continue to investigate the circumstances of the events leading up to the deaths, but according to friends of Kazemi, she was smitten and so was McNair.

For her 20th birthday in late May, McNair got her a black Cadillac Escalade. Her family met him over sushi dinner that same weekend. Before that, Kazemi zipped around in his Bentley, telling family and friends about the generosity of her new beau — a former professional athlete.

"We met him because I don't watch football and didn't know who he was," said Farzin Abdi, Kazemi's nephew, who was in town from Jacksonville, Fla. to retrieve the body. "We went out to dinner and she was so happy and was having fun. Were we happy about the relationship? No."


There were trips, dinners, a promise of living together and ultimately marriage, according to Abdi, 27.

"I don't know if he had filed for divorce but I thought it wouldn't happen," Abdi said, adding that Kazemi was a child when adopted into the family after her mother died in Iran. Abdi's mother is Kazemi's sister.

McNair took Kazemi, known as Jenny to friends, on trips to Key West in Florida, Las Vegas, California, Hawaii and McNair's farm in Mississippi, with the couple seeing each other often, Abdi said. Pictures of the smiling couple parasailing were posted Sunday afternoon on the celebrity gossip site TMZ.com.

Kazemi told Abdi they would take a break when McNair would go away on his own with his children. McNair and the children recently returned from Mexico, Abdi said.

"I was under the impression that his family knew about her," Abdi said. "That he took the children alone with him on vacation is a sign that they were separated."

Kazemi told her sister, Sepideh Salmani, that McNair was in the process of divorcing.

Kazemi, though younger than Abdi and Salmani, was actually their aunt but they were raised as siblings.

Salmani talked to her sister every day and said she was very happy in her relationship with McNair.

"That's why she was like, 'OK, now you're divorcing. We can date,' " Salmani said. "He told her, it was going to be finished, the whole divorce was going to be done, two weeks from yesterday."

The family was worried about the rapid relationship and the extravagance that came with it.

"She was in a Bentley and I don't think it was right because there are jealous people," Abdi said. "People were telling her that they didn't have anyone to pay their bills or buy them things."

Kazemi first came to Nashville nearly four years ago with her then-boyfriend, Keith Norfleet. They broke up about six months ago, and she started seeing McNair soon after. The family says the ex-boyfriend was not happy about her seeing the former quarterback and wanted to rekindle their relationship.

But Kazemi had moved on and remained friends with Norfleet.

Neighbors said they overheard arguments come from her Hermitage apartment periodically, and occasionally saw Kazemi dropped off by a limo service. Abdi said they were minor arguments without giving details of the spats.

chicagotexan2
07-06-2009, 08:02 AM
I'm laaaaate to the discussion, but I really feel for McNair and his family. His personal life (between 2 consenting adults) is none of my business. As a player I thought he was awsome at Alcorn and he was a real life Rocky that just wouldn'y go down for the count. He made it tougher to hate the Titans right after they left Houston.

Texan_Bill
07-06-2009, 08:15 AM
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...

Pfffft. Like we care what you hope for. :rolleyes:



RIP Steve. You were one of the toughest sumbitches to play.

With that said, I hope this situation is just another reminder of putting athletes on pedestals and teaching our children to look up to these guys. It's one thing to admire their talent and feats on the field, it's a whole other issue to worship these guys overall.

PapaL
07-06-2009, 08:45 AM
Originally from Saleh Kazemi's facebook page:

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/1.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/2.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/3.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/5.jpg

PapaL
07-06-2009, 08:46 AM
http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/4.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/9.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/12.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/10.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/11.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/8.jpg

spurstexanstros
07-06-2009, 09:05 AM
BA, they only have ill will towards Bud, he made the decision.

I'm in disbelief right now. I keep watching ESPN and everytime I see it in print it shocks me again. He's a big reason I became a fan.

exactly....
You never want to see someone in his position die early muchless in the circumstances that Steve McNair did. It is sad but it shows how little we know the people we root for. We nor anyone else can criticize the position he put himself in, because we dont know the entire story. all we can do is offer sympathy.

CloakNNNdagger
07-06-2009, 09:58 AM
Steve McNair's wife was unaware of affair with Sahel Kazemi until husband's death

New York Daily News (Steve McNair's wife was unaware of affair with Sahel Kazemi until husband's death)

The wife of slain quarterback Steve McNair may have only learned about the gridiron star's affair with a gorgeous young woman after the clandestine couple's grisly deaths, sources close to the football player said Sunday.

"She's blindsided by this," one source said of Mechelle McNair, who was holed up in her family's home just 6 miles from the condo her husband used to bed his mistress. "She's crushed. Her whole world is shattered."


Investigators said McNair had been drinking at a pair of Nashville bars - Blue Moon Lagoon Bar and Loser's Bar - into the early-morning hours of Saturday and then returned to the downtown condo he shared with a pal.

HOU-TEX
07-06-2009, 10:14 AM
R.I.P. Steve is all I can say at this time. I loved it when we selected him and enjoyed watching him play the game. He was a warrior on the field.

WWJD
07-06-2009, 10:36 AM
Steve McNair's wife was unaware of affair with Sahel Kazemi until husband's death

New York Daily News (Steve McNair's wife was unaware of affair with Sahel Kazemi until husband's death)

Poor wife. Always the last to know. I feel very, very sorry for her.

TimeKiller
07-06-2009, 11:02 AM
Ummm....can someone take the question mark off the title? Yes, he's dead.


Since I'm jumping in on the 8th page I'll just say RIP Steve McNair. Hard to root against a guy who played like he did but this just goes to show that crazy **** happens to anyone, regardless of fame or fortune.

Double Barrel
07-06-2009, 11:59 AM
RIP Steve McNair. :(

The respect toward his NFL career was earned with sweat and blood, and he was the kind of player that hearkened back to the old days of the NFL when players played for passion of the game instead of greed. He played through and with so many injuries that it could be considered heroic as it pertains to sports. His legacy will be remembered by all football fans, and hopefully will inspire future players to fulfill their potential.

My thoughts and prayers are with the victims' families. Such a sad time, and his poor kids will never get to be with their dad again.

MannyFresh
07-06-2009, 12:02 PM
http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/4.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/9.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/12.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/10.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/11.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/8.jpg


Damn definitely not worth the consequences, could have least been cute.

bckey
07-06-2009, 12:43 PM
Things that bothers me about this case are:

1) Nobody called in that they heard gunshots. 5 rounds should get someone's attention.

2) If the girl did the shooting they would have already found residue on her hand from firing the gun.

3) McNair's friend and co-owner of the condo found them but called a friend instead of the police.

4) The DUI incident just 2 days prior to the murder of McNair

5) A jealous ex-boyfriend

6) McNair had a concealed handgun license


I just hope they solve this quickly. His wife and kids don't need this to drag out in the media. If she truly didn't know then she is having to deal with grief and anger at the same time. Just a sad situation all the way around.

HoustonFrog
07-06-2009, 12:45 PM
Things that bothers me about this case are:

1) Nobody called in that they heard gunshots. 5 rounds should get someone's attention.

2) If the girl did the shooting they would have already found residue on her hand from firing the gun.

3) McNair's friend and co-owner of the condo found them but called a friend instead of the police.

4) The DUI incident just 2 days prior to the murder of McNair

5) A jealous ex-boyfriend
6) McNair had a concealed handgun license


I just hope they solve this quickly. His wife and kids don't need this to drag out in the media. If she truly didn't know then she is having to deal with grief and anger at the same time. Just a sad situation all the way around.

This is what I talked about 2 pages earlier. People were concentrating on the wife when the girlfriend of his had a boyfriend for 4 years and they had broken up around the same time or a little earlier than when McNair came in the picture.

HoustonFrog
07-06-2009, 12:51 PM
Or this...so the guess would be he told her he would leave his wife and get married and then told her that it wouldn't happen..she is drugged up and shoots him...realizes what she did and shoots self...CSI

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4309196

NASHVILLE, Tenn. -- A relative of the woman found shot to death with Steve McNair said Monday that Nashville police told him she recently purchased a gun and that police believe they are almost sure she was the shooter.

Farzin Abdi is 20-year-old Sahel Kazemi's nephew, but the two were raised together like brother and sister. Abdi says he does not believe Kazemi would have killed the former Tennessee Titans quarterback and herself.

Abdi said Kazemi, McNair's girlfriend, had no motive. McNair and Kazemi were found dead on Saturday in a condominium owned by McNair.

Nashville police didn't immediately have a reaction to Abdi's comments.

Abdi said Kazemi believed McNair was divorcing his wife and she was preparing to sell her furniture to move in with him.

spurstexanstros
07-06-2009, 12:58 PM
Being married is hard and I for one do not fault McNair for having a girlfriend...especially if he and his wife were separated and if his wife had a boyfriend. Sometimes marriages are complicated...well all marriages are complicated. It is easy to get married....hard to stay married. There are 60% of the marriages that end in failure. I would assume that that number is higher among professional athletes who have women at their disposal. In normal life there are some women see a married guy as a challenge...and some married men see it as a challenge to get over on their wives. Imagine being famous with money and 20 -30 year olds are throwing themselves at you on a regular basis. If your marriage went on a "dry spell" or was in a bad place (which most marriages get to at some point) would you be able to resist? Like I said before there is alot we dont know about Steve's marriage (and we shouldnt) so the fact that he had a girlfriend doesnot mean people should pass judgement on him. I am sure no one on here wants someone to pass judgement on our lives.

HoustonFrog
07-06-2009, 01:03 PM
Being married is hard and I for one do not fault McNair for having a girlfriend...especially if he and his wife were separated and if his wife had a boyfriend. Sometimes marriages are complicated...well all marriages are complicated. It is easy to get married....hard to stay married. There are 60% of the marriages that end in failure. I would assume that that number is higher among professional athletes who have women at their disposal. In normal life there are some women see a married guy as a challenge...and some married men see it as a challenge to get over on their wives. Imagine being famous with money and 20 -30 year olds are throwing themselves at you on a regular basis. If your marriage went on a "dry spell" or was in a bad place (which most marriages get to at some point) would you be able to resist? Like I said before there is alot we dont know about Steve's marriage (and we shouldnt) so the fact that he had a girlfriend doesnot mean people should pass judgement on him. I am sure no one on here wants someone to pass judgement on our lives.

I see your points and agree marriage is hard but I'm a firm believer that if you want the extras, then get the divorce and move on. If your wife isn't a priority then at least make your kids a priority and try to do things the right way. I'm not judging but you can take the proper steps and still get what you want. It's that simple sometimes. If you are cheating then the love is gone already. My wife and I have a strong marriage but if anything went wrong I'd think of what would be best for my daughters and all involved.

texanmojo
07-06-2009, 01:07 PM
Ok...so we know that there is at least 1 woman outside of McNair's wife that McNair has been with. My guess this is not the first time he has strayed from his marriage...I would not be suprised to hear of other women in the next several days...

bckey
07-06-2009, 01:19 PM
Or this...so the guess would be he told her he would leave his wife and get married and then told her that it wouldn't happen..she is drugged up and shoots him...realizes what she did and shoots self...CSI

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4309196



That is the onle of only 2 motives I could come up with for her to shoot McNair. He wanted to end the relationship. One other possibility is that she found out he never filed for a divorce like he told her and realized she was being strung along.

With it being reported she recently bought a gun, the door was locked when McNair's friend found them (no forced entry), she had a single gunshot wound to the head and was found laying on the gun. It is looking like more like murder/suicide with the new details. I still find it really hard to believe a 20 year old woman would kill her boyfriend and the turn the gun on herself unless she was extremely unstable or drugged up. Maybe one of those will be the next detail that comes out. Two lives snuffed out way too early. And for what.

CloakNNNdagger
07-06-2009, 01:19 PM
This is what I talked about 2 pages earlier. People were concentrating on the wife when she had a boyfriend for 4 years and they had broken up around the same time or a little earlier than when McNair came in the picture.

Being married is hard and I for one do not fault McNair for having a girlfriend...especially if he and his wife were separated and if his wife had a boyfriend. Sometimes marriages are complicated...well all marriages are complicated. It is easy to get married....hard to stay married. There are 60% of the marriages that end in failure. I would assume that that number is higher among professional athletes who have women at their disposal. In normal life there are some women see a married guy as a challenge...and some married men see it as a challenge to get over on their wives. Imagine being famous with money and 20 -30 year olds are throwing themselves at you on a regular basis. If your marriage went on a "dry spell" or was in a bad place (which most marriages get to at some point) would you be able to resist? Like I said before there is alot we dont know about Steve's marriage (and we shouldnt) so the fact that he had a girlfriend doesnot mean people should pass judgement on him. I am sure no one on here wants someone to pass judgement on our lives.

I believe that Frog's words were misinterpretted to be referring to his wife having a boyfriend. There is NO report anywhere that I have come across that even implies that McNair's wife had a "boyfriend." Frog, I am sure, was referring to the girlfriend's ex boyfriend of 4 years.

HoustonFrog
07-06-2009, 01:24 PM
I believe that Frog's words were misinterpretted to be referring to his wife having a boyfriend. There is NO report anywhere that I have come across that even implies that McNair's wife had a "boyfriend." Frog, I am sure, was referring to the girlfriend's ex boyfriend of 4 years.

Right...my bad and thanks for stating how it read. I was replying to another post talking about the girlfriend. But yes, his gf had a bf for 4 year.

infantrycak
07-06-2009, 01:39 PM
Haven't read the thread. Top most thoughts - not a hall of fame QB and getting murdered shouldn't make him one. Really good QB just like with any other athlete doesn't mean really good person.

HoustonFrog
07-06-2009, 01:41 PM
UMMM..I'm finding it quite bad that Andrew Sicilliano, sitting in for Rome, is having Warren Moon interviewed about McNairs death. Not to be harsh but you are asking a wife abuser, etc to comment on a the tragic death of a guy who was with his girlfriend on the side...OK. Not judging, again, just a poor choice of people to bring in IMHO....despite their connection.

BTW, I might killed for this opinion because people do reform, etc. It just hit me as very odd considering the fresh open wound that the murder is and the questions around it.

Dan B.
07-06-2009, 01:50 PM
UMMM..I'm finding it quite bad that Andrew Sicilliano, sitting in for Rome, is having Warren Moon interviewed about McNairs death. Not to be harsh but you are asking a wife abuser, etc to comment on a the tragic death of a guy who was with his girlfriend on the side...OK. Not judging, again, just a poor choice of people to bring in IMHO.

I heard that next they are having Barry Bonds on to discuss the harmful effects of steroid abuse.

Double Barrel
07-06-2009, 01:54 PM
2) If the girl did the shooting they would have already found residue on her hand from firing the gun.

As of 1:53 p.m. this afternoon, forensic reports have not been returned about gunpowder residue on her hands. It's still part of the investigation at this time.

CloakNNNdagger
07-06-2009, 01:55 PM
Since McNair's friend (co-renter) supposedly says he didn't find the bodies for a couple of hours after the incident, didn't call 911, and delayed even more in calling another McNair friend, who then called 911. A co-renter would have key (no forced entry). First friend (or someone else who knows of her newly purchased gun) shoots McNair, forces girlfriend to take knock out drug (the importance of tox screen results), puts the gun in girlfriend's hand murders her with her own hand (gun powder residue would fit picture).......... Only one possible scenario.

GuerillaBlack
07-06-2009, 01:56 PM
http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/4.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/9.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/12.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/10.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/11.jpg

http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/8.jpg

Damn. She looks like she just graduated out of my high school.

But she killed Steve McNair.

Second Honeymoon
07-06-2009, 02:45 PM
This whole thing seems fishy. Like an earlier post mentioned, there would be gunpowder residue on her hand and would have been found at crime scene level. Maybe they are waiting to announce those findings because they seem pretty focused on the girlfriend as the lone assailant. Could they be luring an unnamed suspect into a false sense of security (boyfriend, girlfriend's father, Steve's roommate) who knows?

The numbers add up perfectly, but almost too perfectly. The only red lights outside of the girlfriend are Steve's roommates and her boyfriend. I throw the dad in there because they are muslim and from Iran and honor killings are not unheard of even within US borders. I know I wouldn't be happy if a married 33 year old NFL QB was sugar daddying my 19 year old daughter. Maybe her run-in with the law was the last straw for the dad or boyfriend? who knows...

she just doesn't seem the type to pull this but hell hath no fury like a woman scorned...maybe McNair was gonna break things off with her because of how she handled the DUI incident 2 nights prior, and she just flew off the hinges? once again, who knows.

One thing I do know is McNair was a great competitor and extraordinary athlete/tough guy. The guy was a winner and he managed to get Bud Adams' franchise to a Super Bowl...He couldn't break such a strong curse but he got as close as humanly possible before coming up one yard short.

Hookem Horns
07-06-2009, 03:16 PM
Damn. She looks like she just graduated out of my high school.



Assuming she graduated HS you would be correct. She is only 20 years old, most graduate HS at 18.

badboy
07-06-2009, 03:25 PM
Can not find link to Houston Chronicle article that I read about McNair. It talked about him having a wire in his chest and being instructed by doctor not to play, but the playing QB went down against Pittsburgh and Steve went in. The Steelers talked about hitting McNair and hearing air wheezing out of the wire. Steve got up and kept on playing. This is the McNair I am focusing on. Yes, the other things are valid and maybe even important. He apparently was not the role model most thought. I was shocked by his death but not by the alleged girl friend.

There will be plenty to lay blame and placed fault. It just will not be me. God, cover his children with Your Mercy and Grace.

badboy
07-06-2009, 03:31 PM
Can not find link to Houston Chronicle article that I read about McNair. It talked about him having a wire in his chest and being instructed by doctor not to play, but the playing QB went down against Pittsburgh and Steve went in. The Steelers talked about hitting McNair and hearing air wheezing out of the wire. Steve got up and kept on playing. This is the McNair I am focusing on. Yes, the other things are valid and maybe even important. He apparently was not the role model most thought. I was shocked by his death but not by the alleged girl friend.

There will be plenty to lay blame and placed fault. It just will not be me. God, cover his children with Your Mercy and Grace.Found the link read #2 for good article.http://www.examiner.com/x-14024-Pittsburgh-Steelers-Examiner~y2009m7d6-Top-five-most-memorable-games-Steve-McNair-vs-Pittsburgh-Steelers

Double Barrel
07-06-2009, 03:32 PM
Can not find link to Houston Chronicle article that I read about McNair. It talked about him having a wire in his chest and being instructed by doctor not to play, but the playing QB went down against Pittsburgh and Steve went in. The Steelers talked about hitting McNair and hearing air wheezing out of the wire. Steve got up and kept on playing. This is the McNair I am focusing on.

It was a Richard Justice article:

In his football career, McNair was a pro’s pro (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/6513317.html)

**edit: badboy sort of beat me to it***

spurstexanstros
07-06-2009, 04:19 PM
I see your points and agree marriage is hard but I'm a firm believer that if you want the extras, then get the divorce and move on. If your wife isn't a priority then at least make your kids a priority and try to do things the right way. I'm not judging but you can take the proper steps and still get what you want. It's that simple sometimes. If you are cheating then the love is gone already. My wife and I have a strong marriage but if anything went wrong I'd think of what would be best for my daughters and all involved.

Yeah I agree with your point, my point was that we dont know the entire story and whether or not they were in the process of the divorce.There are three sides to a story, (in this case four) steve's side, wife's side, gf's side and what really happened.

I wish the killer would have thought about the kids and their need to have the father around. It is sad it had to end in death.

Marcus
07-06-2009, 04:51 PM
I really feel sorry for Mechelle McNair. If indeed, she "was the last to know", she's going through a fate worse than death. Can you just imagine having to prepare and attend your own spouse's funeral, and being forced to feel nothing but pure humiliation in front of the entire world? And then, there are his 4 kids. Just imagine how their lives will be affected.

And Steve McNair will no longer be remembered for what he did on the field.

He'll just be looked back on as a married man who was gunned down by his girlfriend. That will be his legacy.

TEXANRED
07-06-2009, 05:21 PM
I really feel sorry for Mechelle McNair. If indeed, she "was the last to know", she's going through a fate worse than death. Can you just imagine having to prepare and attend your own spouse's funeral, and being forced to feel nothing but pure humiliation in front of the entire world? And then, there are his 4 kids. Just imagine how their lives will be affected.

And Steve McNair will no longer be remembered for what he did on the field.

He'll just be looked back on as a married man who was gunned down by his girlfriend. That will be his legacy.

Oh no, a married man who had a woman on the side. Never heard of that one. I wouldnt be so quick to judge. Who knows what kind of arrangements he had with his wife. Or if his wife had a man on the side too.

If that is the worst thing he ever did in his life than he wasnt to bad of a man.

Thorn
07-06-2009, 05:24 PM
And Steve McNair will no longer be remembered for what he did on the field.

He'll just be looked back on as a married man who was gunned down by his girlfriend. That will be his legacy.

I hope that doesn't happen. While McNair was "the enemy" most of his time in the NFL, he was a damn good QB and wasn't the a-hole that some of the Titans were. This is just tragic and horrible.

Double Barrel
07-06-2009, 05:49 PM
I will always remember McNair for being a great, and very tough, NFL QB. His football legacy will live on in NFL Films.

Marcus
07-06-2009, 05:52 PM
Oh no, a married man who had a woman on the side. Never heard of that one. I wouldnt be so quick to judge. Who knows what kind of arrangements he had with his wife. Or if his wife had a man on the side too..

You're kidding me, right? If you've been keeping up with the reports, you wouldn't say that.

If that is the worst thing he ever did in his life than he wasnt to bad of a man.

Sounds like you've been there, done that. I guess you're one of those you think having a "mid-life crisis" is a legit excuse to **** around, aayy?

Eye of the beholder, I guess. :rolleyes:

TEXANRED
07-06-2009, 05:54 PM
You're kidding me, right? If you've been keeping up with the reports, you wouldn't say that.



Sounds like you've been there, done that. I guess you're one of those you think having a "mid-life crisis" is a legit excuse to **** around, aayy?

Eye of the beholder, I guess.

Speculations and accusations make you a very sad person.

Marcus
07-06-2009, 06:05 PM
Speculations and accusations make you a very sad person.

lol: :potkettle:

Showtime100
07-06-2009, 06:10 PM
I really feel sorry for Mechelle McNair. If indeed, she "was the last to know", she's going through a fate worse than death. Can you just imagine having to prepare and attend your own spouse's funeral, and being forced to feel nothing but pure humiliation in front of the entire world? And then, there are his 4 kids. Just imagine how their lives will be affected.

And Steve McNair will no longer be remembered for what he did on the field.

He'll just be looked back on as a married man who was gunned down by his girlfriend. That will be his legacy.

Yes indeed, great post.

Oh no, a married man who had a woman on the side. Never heard of that one. I wouldnt be so quick to judge. Who knows what kind of arrangements he had with his wife. Or if his wife had a man on the side too.

If that is the worst thing he ever did in his life than he wasnt to bad of a man.

Don't ever get near my sister, if so you and I both will make the 6 o'clock news. (tougue in cheek, but I strongly disagree with that post.)

WWJD
07-06-2009, 06:13 PM
Well Steve hasn't been in the news for awhile for anything related to his football prowess so unfortunately this will be his legacy for awhile..

Showtime100
07-06-2009, 06:13 PM
Damn. She looks like she just graduated out of my high school.

But she killed Steve McNair.

Wait one second. Aren't you the flagship ala Michael Jackson of believing all the courts say? If so don't be a hypocrite. :spit:

CloakNNNdagger
07-06-2009, 06:23 PM
Can not find link to Houston Chronicle article that I read about McNair. It talked about him having a wire in his chest and being instructed by doctor not to play, but the playing QB went down against Pittsburgh and Steve went in. The Steelers talked about hitting McNair and hearing air wheezing out of the wire. Steve got up and kept on playing. This is the McNair I am focusing on. Yes, the other things are valid and maybe even important. He apparently was not the role model most thought. I was shocked by his death but not by the alleged girl friend.

There will be plenty to lay blame and placed fault. It just will not be me. God, cover his children with Your Mercy and Grace.
Sorry, already posted

steelbtexan
07-06-2009, 06:31 PM
Steve was married and took his chances having a GF on the side.

He took a gamble and his number came up.

Warren Moon should be a great interview on the subjects of domestic violence and extra marital affairs.

As well as DWI laws.

Double Barrel
07-06-2009, 06:43 PM
I'm not a big fan of Richard Justice, but his article did have a good point:

He’s gone now, at 36, via a tabloid death. He died of multiple gunshot wounds along with a woman not his wife.

He’s a reminder to us all that we put the wrong people on pedestals, that running fast and jumping high defines one only narrowly.

Being brilliant in the fourth quarter of a close game doesn’t make one a great husband or father.

So as we honor a great athlete who touched hundreds and lived his public life with grace and dignity, we are reminded that men have flaws.

Regardless of what the public eventually decides to remember as his legacy, the simple and very sad fact is that his children will always remember him as "dad".

CTWade
07-06-2009, 06:50 PM
I read or heard somewhere that romantic jealously is the leading cause of murders. McNair is not the first and likely won't be the last.

Most, I suspect, will mourn the passing of such athletic talent but I will mourn McNair's lack of wisdom. Ah, the price he and others paid for it. Alas, if only talent and character went hand in hand.

CloakNNNdagger
07-06-2009, 06:54 PM
The gun involved was purchased by the girlfriend Thursday after McNair bailed her out from the DUI. The purchase was from a private party, not a gun shop. It has been said that the police do not know if the "sale" was legal or not. However, since a permit to carry a gun in Tennessee requires that you be 21 years old, considering "legality" seems a little strange .

bckey
07-06-2009, 06:54 PM
It is looking more and more like murder/suicide.

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20090706/NEWS03/90706040


Police spokesman Don Aaron has said Sahel Kazemi purchased the gun on Thursday night from a private owner, and there were a total of five shots fired.


That means each of the shots fired at the Second Avenue-area condo hit one of the victims. The gun, Aaron said, was purchased sometime on the night after Kazemi's DUI arrest. He declined to say who sold it, or where that person obtained the gun.

GP
07-06-2009, 07:06 PM
McNair had two to the chest and two to the head....

That's not how a 20-year-old party girl waitress shoots someone. Is it?

Someone was pissed off. And that someone knew how to make sure that the bullets did their work. Two to the head, two to the chest.

It's a hire, or it's an ex. Or both.

GP
07-06-2009, 07:11 PM
It is looking more and more like murder/suicide.

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20090706/NEWS03/90706040


Police spokesman Don Aaron has said Sahel Kazemi purchased the gun on Thursday night from a private owner, and there were a total of five shots fired.


That means each of the shots fired at the Second Avenue-area condo hit one of the victims. The gun, Aaron said, was purchased sometime on the night after Kazemi's DUI arrest. He declined to say who sold it, or where that person obtained the gun.


Maybe the ex-boyfriend said "Go buy the gun, I'll do it."

Then he DID do it, but he made sure he popped the girl, too. She unknowingly helped to kill Steve and herself. With the sale of the firearm in her name...that's pretty much doing the work of a goon yourself.

Or, maybe she bought the gun to defend herself from the ex-boyfriend, especially if he was saying "I'm going to blow the lid of your affair with Steve"? Somehow she threatens him with it, and he grabs it and shoots her. Then heads down to take care of Steve?

That's only a couple of scenarios. I don't think she shot Steve. Two to the head, two to the chest.

This whole deal is sad.

awtysst
07-06-2009, 07:55 PM
I feel bad for his kids right now. No kid should have to read these kind of things about their father.

bckey
07-06-2009, 08:09 PM
Watch the video in this link of Don Aaron, Metro Police spokesman. She was arrested on wednesday night/thursday morning and bought the gun thursday night from a private party.

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20090706/NEWS03/90706040

I think the police in this case are doing a really good job.

Hervoyel
07-06-2009, 08:14 PM
I feel bad for his kids right now. No kid should have to read these kind of things about their father.


I agree with you. I think it's every kids right to believe that their father (and mother as well) walk on water right up until the parent proves otherwise. They're going to learn soon enough that their parents are all too human so why speed up the process.

CloakNNNdagger
07-06-2009, 08:17 PM
I just had a thought..........a really troubling thought...........the DUI...........presence of McNair totally obscured.............he is wisked home by cab..........she is booked...........still no mention of McNair's presence..........he bails her out..........still no mention..............could it be that McNair was driving?...........obvious implications (past DUI's in Tennessee) with immediate wide release of public record of his name and situation.........could his girlfriend have been made to be the "fall guy?"......................under aged drinker with McNair................still no mention of his presence.........................girlfriend sobers up................purchases gun...............girlfriend dead............McNair finally mentioned........"DEAD."

[FYI, in Tennessee DUI laws have a twist that wasn't invoked against McNair...............this time. Keep in mind, the car was registered to both his girlfriend McNair] READ THIS LINK to jar your memory (http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/18591782/)

bckey
07-06-2009, 08:26 PM
I thought the same thing. We may never know but she certainly was pissed about the DUI arrest. Also, in the video Aaron says she claimed she hadn't been drinking. Under the influence of drugs.

awtysst
07-06-2009, 08:44 PM
I agree with you. I think it's every kids right to believe that their father (and mother as well) walk on water right up until the parent proves otherwise. They're going to learn soon enough that their parents are all too human so why speed up the process.

Well said.

steelbtexan
07-06-2009, 08:58 PM
Maybe the ex-boyfriend said "Go buy the gun, I'll do it."

Then he DID do it, but he made sure he popped the girl, too. She unknowingly helped to kill Steve and herself. With the sale of the firearm in her name...that's pretty much doing the work of a goon yourself.

Or, maybe she bought the gun to defend herself from the ex-boyfriend, especially if he was saying "I'm going to blow the lid of your affair with Steve"? Somehow she threatens him with it, and he grabs it and shoots her. Then heads down to take care of Steve?

That's only a couple of scenarios. I don't think she shot Steve. Two to the head, two to the chest.

This whole deal is sad.

Or more likely

GF gets DWI, she's p***ed off.

McNair gets her out of jail. They go out partying that night, GF finds out McNair hasn't filed for divorce. He tells GF he is going back to his wife.

She knows that means she is going to be waiting tables at Dave & Busters. She cant handle that. (Being Used)

GF waits for a drunk- drugged McNair to pass out.

GF shoots McNair 2 times in the head and twice in the chest.

Gf turns gun on self.

McNair had to have been asleep for GF to shoot him 4 times. She was inexperienced with a gun.

We're in agreement that this is really sad.

steelbtexan
07-06-2009, 09:08 PM
Does anybody woder why McNair's co-owner waited 30 mins. before he called a mutual friend and asked him to call the cops?

Could he have been cleaning up the drugs in the house. After all the GF said she wasn't drunk. She was high during the DWI stop the night before the homicide.

The Pencil Neck
07-06-2009, 09:08 PM
I just had a thought..........a really troubling thought...........the DUI...........presence of McNair totally obscured.............he is wisked home by cab..........she is booked...........still no mention of McNair's presence..........he bails her out..........still no mention..............could it be that McNair was driving?...........obvious implications (past DUI's in Tennessee) with immediate wide release of public record of his name and situation.........could his girlfriend have been made to be the "fall guy?"......................under aged drinker with McNair................still no mention of his presence.........................girlfriend sobers up................purchases gun...............girlfriend dead............McNair finally mentioned........"DEAD."

[FYI, in Tennessee DUI laws have a twist that wasn't invoked against McNair...............this time. Keep in mind, the car was registered to both his girlfriend McNair] READ THIS LINK to jar your memory (http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/18591782/)

That's along the lines of what I was thinking.

It's awfully odd timing.

The Pencil Neck
07-06-2009, 09:12 PM
Or more likely

GF gets DWI, she's p***ed off.

McNair gets her out of jail. They go out partying that night, GF finds out McNair hasn't filed for divorce. He tells GF he is going back to his wife.

She knows that means she is going to be waiting tables at Dave & Busters. She cant handle that. (Being Used)

GF waits for a drunk- drugged McNair to pass out.

GF shoots McNair 2 times in the head and twice in the chest.

Gf turns gun on self.

McNair had to have been asleep for GF to shoot him 4 times. She was inexperienced with a gun.

We're in agreement that this is really sad.


How about this:

Steve and GF are out getting high.
Police pull them over, Steve gets GF to switch places.
GF goes to jail, Steve goes home.
GF spends night in jail, scared and alone.
Steve bails out GF.
Steve says something about "distancing" himself from GF to save his reputation or something. (Maybe, how about one last time for old time's sake?)
GF gets pissed, buys gun.
GF goes over to "talk" to Steve, finds out that on top of everything else, he wasn't getting a divorce. Maybe she threatens him or something and he laughs at her, not thinking she's serious.
Bam, bam, bam, bam.
Bam.

bckey
07-06-2009, 09:21 PM
She bought that gun thursday night with the intent of killing McNair imho. She was doing drugs, something about her arrest tripped something in her, she planned to kill McNair prior to saturday. Probably had a couple of questions she asked McNair that morning in a high frame of mind and got answers from McNair that made her feel like the relationship was over. She may have even been pregnant. We just don't know yet. I'll bet we find out some information that solves at least a good part of this soon.

ObsiWan
07-06-2009, 10:28 PM
Being married is hard and I for one do not fault McNair for having a girlfriend...especially if he and his wife were separated and if his wife had a boyfriend. Sometimes marriages are complicated...well all marriages are complicated. It is easy to get married....hard to stay married. There are 60% of the marriages that end in failure. I would assume that that number is higher among professional athletes who have women at their disposal. In normal life there are some women see a married guy as a challenge...and some married men see it as a challenge to get over on their wives. Imagine being famous with money and 20 -30 year olds are throwing themselves at you on a regular basis. If your marriage went on a "dry spell" or was in a bad place (which most marriages get to at some point) would you be able to resist? Like I said before there is alot we dont know about Steve's marriage (and we shouldnt) so the fact that he had a girlfriend doesnot mean people should pass judgement on him. I am sure no one on here wants someone to pass judgement on our lives.

Good post. We don't know whether the McNairs marriage was rosy or rocky. Probably never will - nor should we. It ain't really our business.

DBCooper
07-06-2009, 10:34 PM
McNair had two to the chest and two to the head....

That's not how a 20-year-old party girl waitress shoots someone. Is it?

Someone was pissed off. And that someone knew how to make sure that the bullets did their work. Two to the head, two to the chest.

It's a hire, or it's an ex. Or both.

Does a pro need more than one bullet?

Sounds like a pissed off girlfriend to me.

ObsiWan
07-06-2009, 10:37 PM
I really feel sorry for Mechelle McNair. If indeed, she "was the last to know", she's going through a fate worse than death. Can you just imagine having to prepare and attend your own spouse's funeral, and being forced to feel nothing but pure humiliation in front of the entire world? And then, there are his 4 kids. Just imagine how their lives will be affected.

And Steve McNair will no longer be remembered for what he did on the field.

He'll just be looked back on as a married man who was gunned down by his girlfriend. That will be his legacy.

Not for me.
Speak for yourself.

ObsiWan
07-06-2009, 10:38 PM
Does a pro need more than one bullet?

Sounds like a pissed off girlfriend to me.

Would a "pro" want something like this to LOOK like it was done by a "pro"?

DBCooper
07-06-2009, 10:39 PM
Would a "pro" want something like this to LOOK like it was done by a "pro"?

You have a point.

A smart pro might make it look like a pissed off girlfriend did it......hmmmmmm

Texan JBZ
07-06-2009, 10:42 PM
Not for me.
Speak for yourself.

Not for me either. None of us know the real situation of what their marriage was like. I do know this. Steve lived in Mt. Olive on his ranch when he was at home. His wife and kids lived in the Hattiesburg area (Oak Grove I believe). He was renting a condo in Nashville. Doesn't seem like they were spending a lot of time together. I do feel sorry for her, because regardless of what the situation was she has lost someone that she shared a lot of her life with.

ObsiWan
07-06-2009, 10:43 PM
I still haven't come up with a logical answer to a question asked a few pages back:

How is it no one heard five rounds being popped off in an apt/condo complex??

Koolaid Time
07-06-2009, 10:45 PM
You have a point.

A smart pro might make it look like a pissed off girlfriend did it......hmmmmmm

Most of these questions will be resolved when the blood tests come back and we see what all substances were in their systems.

I wouldn't be surpised to see a mixture of illicit substances involved.

And it isn't difficult of a shot (regardless if you are sober or FUBAR,) to hit someone in the head that is passed out on the couch, from a couple of feet away.

Koolaid Time
07-06-2009, 10:47 PM
Not for me either. None of us know the real situation of what their marriage was like. I do know this. Steve lived in Mt. Olive on his ranch when he was at home. His wife and kids lived in the Hattiesburg area (Oak Grove I believe). He was renting a condo in Nashville. Doesn't seem like they were spending a lot of time together. I do feel sorry for her, because regardless of what the situation was she has lost someone that she shared a lot of her life with.

Remember he just opened up his new Sports Bar in Nashville a couple of weeks ago. That is a great excuse to stay up in the condo.

"Hey Honey, I need to stay up here to keep an eye on the new Sports Bar"...

Koolaid Time
07-06-2009, 10:49 PM
I still haven't come up with a logical answer to a question asked a few pages back:

How is it no one heard five rounds being popped off in an apt/condo complex??

Depending on the caliber of weapons.. .22 for example... "fireworks"

pop pop pop pop

Not really "BANG" like a .38 or a 9mm

gtexan02
07-06-2009, 10:49 PM
Most of these questions will be resolved when the blood tests come back and we see what all substances were in their systems.

I wouldn't be surpised to see a mixture of illicit substances involved.

And it isn't difficult of a shot (regardless if you are sober or FUBAR,) to hit someone in the head that is passed out on the couch, from a couple of feet away.

No one is questioning the difficulty, only that what 20 year old emotional girl would go 2 in the head, 2 in the chest. You'd think there'd be one bullet or maybe a ton with a few in weird places. 2 in the head 2 in the chest is very "cold blood" and you'd think there would be more emotions involved if it was the picture they are painting

DBCooper
07-06-2009, 10:51 PM
I still haven't come up with a logical answer to a question asked a few pages back:

How is it no one heard five rounds being popped off in an apt/condo complex??

Depends on the neighborhood.

Hervoyel
07-06-2009, 11:17 PM
It's not as easy to hear as you think. I had a roommate back when I first got out of the police academy have (I kid you not) 3 accidental discharges in the townhouse we shared in less than a month and not one person living around us even noticed.

Totally football related angle follows
I have had the Oilers on my mind for a week or two now after seeing Earl Campbell at the George R. Brown and I don't want to derail this thread or anything but I can't really deny that strictly from a football fan POV I have never felt like Steve McNair was "ours". Several people have mentioned watching him in college and being excited when the Oilers drafted him but I just never considered McNair an Oiler. He is and always has been a Titan in my eyes much like Eddie George. To me they're the first great Titans and the fact that they were drafted by "The Houston Oilers" is almost sort of an accident of fate kind of thing. They're Titans who just happened to be drafted by Houston. In much the same way Bruce Matthews was (to me) always an Oiler who just happened to finish his career in Nashville. I don't want to sound like I'm downplaying the tragedy of this event or anything like that but I feel like I did when Sean Taylor was killed or as I would if we picked up the paper tomorrow and read about some other retired but very good in his time player being killed. I understand how Titans fans are particularly hard hit by this but I don't have a sense of any Houston connection. The teams really are seperating now as the years go by. There will be very few players who have the same amount of affection and attachment from both cities. Bruce might be one of the only ones. He might be the only one really.

MannyFresh
07-06-2009, 11:26 PM
McNair had two to the chest and two to the head....

That's not how a 20-year-old party girl waitress shoots someone. Is it?

Someone was pissed off. And that someone knew how to make sure that the bullets did their work. Two to the head, two to the chest.

It's a hire, or it's an ex. Or both.

Did you hear that guy on 1560 AM too or were you the caller?

ObsiWan
07-06-2009, 11:32 PM
Depends on the neighborhood.

Downtown Nashville.
not exactly "the 'Hood"

I know, I grew up in Nashville.

bckey
07-07-2009, 06:15 AM
Well this happened on the 4th of July so I am assuming that is why no one reported shots being fired. Maybe it was planned on that night for that reason.

MightyTExan
07-07-2009, 06:45 AM
Originally from Saleh Kazemi's facebook page:
http://www.3030fm.com/mcnair/2.jpg



Is that Peter North? , lol

eriadoc
07-07-2009, 07:48 AM
The gun involved was purchased by the girlfriend Thursday after McNair bailed her out from the DUI. The purchase was from a private party, not a gun shop. It has been said that the police do not know if the "sale" was legal or not. However, since a permit to carry a gun in Tennessee requires that you be 21 years old, considering "legality" seems a little strange .

Legality to purchase is completely different from permitted to carry. An 18 year old can buy a handgun here in TX and keep it in their home, but cannot obtain a CHL (except under specific exceptions).

CloakNNNdagger
07-07-2009, 07:50 AM
Tennessean UPDATE (http://tennessean.com/article/20090707/SPORTS01/907070345)

3 of the GSWs to McNair were from at least 3 feet away and 1 was at close range.

(per Sports Center this morning, the girlfriend's GSW was a contact wound.)


Police have not determined whether gunshot residue was found on Kazemi's hand..................still???????

Aaron said detectives were concerned about the length of time it took McNair's friend to call police once he discovered the bodies. Wayne Neely, who rented the condo with McNair, got there before 1 p.m. Saturday, but police weren't called until another friend arrived at 1:35 p.m.

McNair and Kazemi had been dead for several hours by the time their bodies were found, police said. Aaron said they did not believe the bodies were moved. When asked if other evidence may have been moved, he said he couldn't comment.

Police and emergency communications officials have declined to release the tape of that 911 call, citing the ongoing investigation.

The building's owner allowed The Tennessean to view the apartment once police released the unit to him.

What was left of the couch was bloodstained, but much of it had been cut up during the evidence- gathering process. A large bloodstain remained on the carpet in front of the couch.

Two pieces of drywall behind the couch had been cut out for processing at the crime lab. Penciled near the missing chunks of wall were the words "strike mark #1," "strike mark #2" and "stain #1" marking apparent bullet holes and a bloodstain.
Unless there were more than 5 bullets retrieved, the gun was not a .22 caliber.

Bishop Joseph Walker, the pastor of Mt. Zion Baptist Church, said he had no indication there was trouble in the McNairs' marriage. When they came to service, they came together. They had not been to see him for counseling.


There was no cause to arrest McNair when he was a passenger during Kazemi's DUI stop on July 2 because Kazemi was a co-owner of the Cadillac Escalade and bore the responsibility, Aaron said.

Kazemi was driving 54 mph in a 30-mph zone and was stopped at Broadway near 12th Avenue, according to court records. She told police she was not drunk, but high. She later said it had been eight hours since she had drunk any alcohol. The court records don't mention that McNair and a second passenger were in the car.

Although McNair was an owner, police did follow procedure when they released McNair, said Nashville criminal defense lawyer Nathan Moore.

"Absolutely, they did the right thing," Moore said of the officers' letting McNair take a cab. "He had no legal obligation keeping her from driving the SUV. It was registered in both their names.''

Officer Shawn Taylor, who stopped Kazemi, also was the officer who arrested McNair in 2003. The charges were dismissed and expunged.

Taylor, however, was disciplined six years ago for violating department rules by repeatedly asking McNair to take a breath test after he refused. Police also said Taylor violated departmental rules then by taking home copies of DUI arrest tapes, including one of McNair.

There's no indication McNair was given a pass in the Thursday traffic stop though, Aaron said.

"The officer even said to Ms. Kazemi that if the Escalade was registered solely to McNair, he would likely have been in the same situation as she," Aaron said.


No court record of McNair's presence????????......purposeful loose-weighted interpretation of the co-owner law of responsibility??????????

HOU-TEX
07-07-2009, 09:19 AM
This thread is beginning to remind me of the game Clue. 'Kazemi, in the condo, with the revolver'.

Marcus
07-07-2009, 09:24 AM
Now, I know I can't add worth a sh!t, but didn't I read somewhere that the gun was only fired 5 times. (3 out of 4 that hit McNair was fired from more than 3 feet away, and the 4th with the gun close to his temple) and that Kasemi's was a contact wound, meaning that the gun was touching when fired?

So what's with the "strike marks" on the wall?

toronto
07-07-2009, 10:02 AM
Dick Wolf just got the template for yet another interesting episode of "Law and Order"

texanmojo
07-07-2009, 10:44 AM
Tennessee’s state medical examiner says investigators have been hesitant to conclude that Steve McNair’s girlfriend killed the NFL star and herself because she didn’t appear to have a motive.

Bruce Levy said Tuesday that murder-suicide is the most likely scenario and it’s unlikely the crime scene was staged by a third party.

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/31779394/ns/sports-nfl/

Why are they having such a hard time with this?

Boris
07-07-2009, 11:02 AM
http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/31779394/ns/sports-nfl/

Why are they having such a hard time with this?

I'm with you. Was there residue? You'd think results from such profile would be in by now.

With the same inner voice that called him Steve (hoping he'd convert the third down), i'm pissed at his lack of judgement. Damn!

CloakNNNdagger
07-07-2009, 11:16 AM
Now, I know I can't add worth a sh!t, but didn't I read somewhere that the gun was only fired 5 times. (3 out of 4 that hit McNair was fired from more than 3 feet away, and the 4th with the gun close to his temple) and that Kasemi's was a contact wound, meaning that the gun was touching when fired?

So what's with the "strike marks" on the wall?


I don't remember that anyone reported 5 shots. They reported 5 GSWs. My point was that if there were bullet holes in the wall (and still 5 bullets), it either meant that there was a high velocity bullet involved (going through the body). If not, there more likely had to be more than 5 shots fired, to have come from a .22 caliber.........unless there was ricochet of bullets off of the victim.

Double Barrel
07-07-2009, 11:31 AM
If the gun was fired from someone that is not familiar with firearms, then it would make sense that more than five rounds were shot. What confused me in the above article was that it said McNair was shot in both temples. Whoever murdered him wanted to make sure that he was dead. It seems very pre-meditated, which makes me question the angle of being an "act of passion" by a jilted lover. But the fact that it was her gun does seem to lead to a murder/suicide.

Cjeremy635
07-07-2009, 11:35 AM
If the gun was fired from someone that is not familiar with firearms, then it would make sense that more than five rounds were shot. What confused me in the above article was that it said McNair was shot in both temples. Whoever murdered him wanted to make sure that he was dead. It seems very pre-meditated, which makes me question the angle of being an "act of passion" by a jilted lover. But the fact that it was her gun does seem to lead to a murder/suicide.

Which link was that in? I must have missed it.

DBCooper
07-07-2009, 11:41 AM
Downtown Nashville.
not exactly "the 'Hood"

I know, I grew up in Nashville.

Cool. I like Nashville the city.

If only it didn't have that Oiler/Titans bad karma going.........

Double Barrel
07-07-2009, 12:03 PM
Which link was that in? I must have missed it.

It's in CloakNNNdagger's link: Tennessean UPDATE (http://tennessean.com/article/20090707/SPORTS01/907070345)

In the third paragraph:

McNair was found dead on the couch with four gunshot wounds — one bullet in each temple, and two in the chest — Levy said.

Vinny
07-07-2009, 12:29 PM
Downtown Nashville.
not exactly "the 'Hood"

I know, I grew up in Nashville.
well, if you grew up in Nashville you would know that there is public housing and "the hood" right next to downtown Nashville across from the Cumberland river. You could almost throw rocks there and hit your targets. When I was there "Stadium Inn" was a giant crack house. Dickerson pike rd is loaded with pimps and whores.....all walking distance from those condos and downtown Nashvegas....I lived down there for two football seasons and lived 15 mins from the stadium.

Malloy
07-07-2009, 01:16 PM
I actually visited that place with the then-gf (now wife :) ) 2 years ago driving from DC to TX on our first 'roadtrip'... We left after 30 minutes, downtown was a horrible place to be.

GP
07-07-2009, 02:28 PM
Did you hear that guy on 1560 AM too or were you the caller?

LOL. No, it could not have been me. I am in Amarillo, TX.

I'm having a hard time with the idea that this party girl Dave & Buster's waitress had the sand, and aim, to do one to each temple and two to the chest.

I can see the two to the chest, facing McNair and having a broad target to hit. It's the two to the temple that seems over-the-top. If she did it, she had to have shot him in the chest twice, and then rushed over for the two to the temple(s) area. Then left the scene and turned the gun on herself.

She either staged a very brave confrontation, or played into the hands of someone who used her (getting her to purchase the gun). Either way, this is an unfortunate end.

Texecutioner
07-07-2009, 02:33 PM
LOL. No, it could not have been me. I am in Amarillo, TX.

I'm having a hard time with the idea that this party girl Dave & Buster's waitress had the sand, and aim, to do one to each temple and two to the chest.

I can see the two to the chest, facing McNair and having a broad target to hit. It's the two to the temple that seems over-the-top. If she did it, she had to have shot him in the chest twice, and then rushed over for the two to the temple(s) area. Then left the scene and turned the gun on herself.

She either staged a very brave confrontation, or played into the hands of someone who used her (getting her to purchase the gun). Either way, this is an unfortunate end.

Interesting take there GP and a lot of that makes a lot of sense.

GP
07-07-2009, 02:39 PM
Or more likely

GF gets DWI, she's p***ed off.

McNair gets her out of jail. They go out partying that night, GF finds out McNair hasn't filed for divorce. He tells GF he is going back to his wife.

She knows that means she is going to be waiting tables at Dave & Busters. She cant handle that. (Being Used)

GF waits for a drunk- drugged McNair to pass out.

GF shoots McNair 2 times in the head and twice in the chest.

Gf turns gun on self.

McNair had to have been asleep for GF to shoot him 4 times. She was inexperienced with a gun.

We're in agreement that this is really sad.

If she was able to slip him something to sedate him, then I can see it.

If toxicology shows nothing, then how in the world was she able to pull this off with him sitting on the couch? Sex game with a pistol, acting like she's being kinky (in order to get near him)?

Second Honeymoon
07-07-2009, 02:47 PM
the fact that they have not already officially labeled it a murder-suicide makes me think there may be more layers to this onion.

everything just wraps into too tidy of a bow for my tastes. smells fishy.

HoustonFrog
07-07-2009, 02:48 PM
I could see 2 to the chest and then a freak out and then making sure he is dead with the two to the temple...still target while he is laying there and being a big guy who is tough he might have been still alive after 2 to the chest.

the fact that they have not already officially labeled it a murder-suicide makes me think there may be more layers to this onion.

everything just wraps into too tidy of a bow for my tastes. smells fishy.

I think the delay is motive, from what they have been talking about today. It all fits but why would a 20 year old who is just getting cash for being with the guy wanting to kill him and herself. My earlier guesses were him bailing on the divorce thing and going back to his wife. The thing about staging something like this....you have to get the trajectory right, how she would fall on the gun, etc. They CSI that stuff. So you never know.

GP
07-07-2009, 02:58 PM
the fact that they have not already officially labeled it a murder-suicide makes me think there may be more layers to this onion.

everything just wraps into too tidy of a bow for my tastes. smells fishy.

How much you want to bet that her ex-boyfriend, though not in a holding pen nor even picked up/released, is under surveillance?

I wonder if the authorities are choosing to go this slowly so that he doesn't flee. They can't tie him to it (yet) but they're working on it, making sure they don't overplay their hand.

Fishy is a good description. Or, we don't want to think that Steve McNair could ever possibly be done in by a Dave & Buster's waitress.

Double Barrel
07-07-2009, 03:09 PM
LOL. No, it could not have been me. I am in Amarillo, TX.

I'm having a hard time with the idea that this party girl Dave & Buster's waitress had the sand, and aim, to do one to each temple and two to the chest.

I can see the two to the chest, facing McNair and having a broad target to hit. It's the two to the temple that seems over-the-top. If she did it, she had to have shot him in the chest twice, and then rushed over for the two to the temple(s) area. Then left the scene and turned the gun on herself.

She either staged a very brave confrontation, or played into the hands of someone who used her (getting her to purchase the gun). Either way, this is an unfortunate end.

You bring up some very interesting points, because it does seem strange that a 20 yo waitress with no gun experience would take the time to put a bullet in each temple. I've seen noobs holding guns, and they simply look lost with a weapon in their hands.

With the close range of one of the shots, they should easily find evidence of his blood and gunpowder on her shooting hand. There has to be more to the picture for these questions to still be out there.

How much you want to bet that her ex-boyfriend, though not in a holding pen nor even picked up/released, is under surveillance?

I wonder if the authorities are choosing to go this slowly so that he doesn't flee. They can't tie him to it (yet) but they're working on it, making sure they don't overplay their hand.

Fishy is a good description. Or, we don't want to think that Steve McNair could ever possibly be done in by a Dave & Buster's waitress.

I'm wondering about that ex-boyfriend, as well. She talked to him after getting busted in that DUI, so the rabbit hole gets deeper.

And there was a third person in the vehicle when she got busted, but the identity is still unknown to the public at this time.

ChampionTexan
07-07-2009, 03:22 PM
This thread is beginning to remind me of the game Clue. 'Kazemi, in the condo, with the revolver'.

Yep - I love the way that folks with a computer and an interweb connection are using their skills of deduction to second guess law enforcement (where virtually all of the credible info. is coming from in the first place), solve the crime from hundreds of miles away with absolutely zero first-hand information, and in some cases, even be able to determine that info that directly conflicts with their solution must be misinformation put forth by the police to facilitate solving the crime.

GP
07-07-2009, 03:23 PM
You bring up some very interesting points, because it does seem strange that a 20 yo waitress with no gun experience would take the time to put a bullet in each temple. I've seen noobs holding guns, and they simply look lost with a weapon in their hands.

I grew up with shotguns, and fired a rifle a few times. Shotguns and rifles are generally, usually, associated with hunting (deer, rabbits, birds, etc.). In that sense, I am very comfortable handling a shotgun or rifle.

I was curious about buying a handgun and getting a CHL. So I went to the local firearm store, and handle a 9mm pistol. Holding it, my hands got sweaty and my wrist got weak...like I couldn't get comfortable handling something that's meant to kill a human. It felt odd.

It's just hard to believe that she could buy it and handle it, the way she supposedly did, all in one broad stroke.

With the close range of one of the shots, they should easily find evidence of his blood and gunpowder on her shooting hand. There has to be more to the picture for these questions to still be out there.

I was also wondering about the messy nature of what she supposedly did. If she's relatively spotless, then that's an issue IMO. Those details aren't being released, and releasing such details would alert the actual gunman (if there is a 3rd party involved at all).

This might end up a cold case, for the sake of moving forward.

Double Barrel
07-07-2009, 03:28 PM
Yep - I love the way that folks with a computer and an interweb connection are using their skills of deduction to second guess law enforcement (where virtually all of the credible info. is coming from in the first place), solve the crime from hundreds of miles away with absolutely zero first-hand information, and in some cases, even be able to determine that info that directly conflicts with their solution must be misinformation put forth by the police to facilitate solving the crime.

Think of the forum as a virtual water cooler. It's just a bunch of friends talking, nothing more, nothing less. I think the overwhelming majority of forum members have great respect for police, IMO, so it's just conversation.

I don't think there is so much second-guessing law enforcement, but more of trying to make sense out of tragedy. Nobody will get their feelings hurt if the cops come out with a result that contradicts everyone. It's just jibber-jabber at the end of the day, the things we chat about.

GP
07-07-2009, 03:28 PM
Yep - I love the way that folks with a computer and an interweb connection are using their skills of deduction to second guess law enforcement (where virtually all of the credible info. is coming from in the first place), solve the crime from hundreds of miles away with absolutely zero first-hand information, and in some cases, even be able to determine that info that directly conflicts with their solution must be misinformation put forth by the police to facilitate solving the crime.

Oh, come off it already.

The police aren't releasing much info. They won't make a final ruling yet. They are, by the nature of their investigation, allowing speculation to mount.

It would be best to deem it a cold case, and move on. If things turn up in the future, they can resume the case on new info.

The fact (or the fact that's been put out there) that Mrs. McNair didn't know this was going on, coupled with Steve's prior run-in(s) with the law....or at least the ones we know about...paint a picture that might just be more complex than anyone knows at the moment.

I don't want to get hated upon here, but there exists the possibility that Steve McNair was in a deeper hole than what's being shown thus far.

Let's not forget that O.J. Simpson was perhaps the first star athlete that made us realize that all's not as it seems. Kobe Bryant fooled a lot of people, too. We keep saying that we'll never be THAT surprised again, and lo and behold something comes along like this.

DB is right: This is just chatter. No attempt to smear McNair; but the situation itself is interesting.

steelbtexan
07-07-2009, 03:32 PM
A jilted lover wouldn't feel the way you did GP.

Passion and anger drove her over the edge.

We will know for sure when all of the CSI tests are done.

texanmojo
07-07-2009, 03:37 PM
Yep - I love the way that folks with a computer and an interweb connection are using their skills of deduction to second guess law enforcement (where virtually all of the credible info. is coming from in the first place), solve the crime from hundreds of miles away with absolutely zero first-hand information, and in some cases, even be able to determine that info that directly conflicts with their solution must be misinformation put forth by the police to facilitate solving the crime.

It's great fun...right?

texanmojo
07-07-2009, 03:44 PM
DB is right: This is just chatter. No attempt to smear McNair; but the situation itself is interesting.

No doubt...I don't think I have spent so much time on a single thread. It's just interesting for now...

Hervoyel
07-07-2009, 03:55 PM
I keep wondering if the ex-boyfriend was there and whether or not he was the shooter. I can see him pissed off at losing her, at McNair for taking her from him. He gets her to buy the gun he wants and if he's in the room he shoots her once in the head while McNair is close but not too close. He could fire once, turn and put two in McNair's chest, and then walk up and deliver the two shots to the temples. Wipe his handprints off the gun, put it in her hand and get her prints on it, then roll her slightly over and put it under her.

For her to shoot McNair over any of the reasons given doesn't make much sense to me. He's the sugar daddy and the guy who writes the checks. If he's gone then all the cool toys go away too. I think the ex boyfriend would have more motive than she would to do this to both of them but who knows. Phil Hartmann's nutbar wife killed him and then herself. Women don't usually put a gun to their heads and pull the trigger but it does happen from time to time. It's not usually something that happens in a well thought out suicide but where mental illness is concerned all bets are off.

HoustonFrog
07-07-2009, 04:02 PM
I keep wondering if the ex-boyfriend was there and whether or not he was the shooter. I can see him pissed off at losing her, at McNair for taking her from him. He gets her to buy the gun he wants and if he's in the room he shoots her once in the head while McNair is close but not too close. He could fire once, turn and put two in McNair's chest, and then walk up and deliver the two shots to the temples. Wipe his handprints off the gun, put it in her hand and get her prints on it, then roll her slightly over and put it under her.

For her to shoot McNair over any of the reasons given doesn't make much sense to me. He's the sugar daddy and the guy who writes the checks. If he's gone then all the cool toys go away too. I think the ex boyfriend would have more motive than she would to do this to both of them but who knows. Phil Hartmann's nutbar wife killed him and then herself. Women don't usually put a gun to their heads and pull the trigger but it does happen from time to time. It's not usually something that happens in a well thought out suicide but where mental illness is concerned all bets are off.

Again, I've leaned boyfriend as the "other" the whole time but I'm not sure if he could pull it off and get the positioning correct, etc. You mention mental instability...drugs could be a key if she did it. If she is coked out of her mind and he says he needs to go back to his wife, who knows what could happen.

Double Barrel
07-07-2009, 04:54 PM
Again, I've leaned boyfriend as the "other" the whole time but I'm not sure if he could pull it off and get the positioning correct, etc. You mention mental instability...drugs could be a key if she did it. If she is coked out of her mind and he says he needs to go back to his wife, who knows what could happen.

The drug angle is a very viable theory, and might also explain what his roommate was doing for over 30 minutes after he discovered the bodies (i.e. flushing the illegal stuff).

I've seen some normal folks do some strange things on drugs, so that is an angle that could be a cause without really explaining "why" it happened (which might never be known).

Koolaid Time
07-07-2009, 04:57 PM
Again, I've leaned boyfriend as the "other" the whole time but I'm not sure if he could pull it off and get the positioning correct, etc. You mention mental instability...drugs could be a key if she did it. If she is coked out of her mind and he says he needs to go back to his wife, who knows what could happen.

Some reports indicate that she was under the impression that McNair was divorcing, had already filed etc.. when the facts now clearly show otherwise.

If he had promised her the sun and the moon and the stars and then finally confesses that oopps, he is still married and not divorcing, and that he is going back to his wife, that would easily be enough to piss her off and make her fly off the edge.