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beerlover
01-29-2005, 11:29 AM
Of these three players only- Thomas Davis, Adam Pac-Man Jones or Dan Cody which one would you most be in favor of the Texans selecting & why? :listening

Fiddy
01-29-2005, 11:34 AM
Pac-Man simply for the name. Imagine D-Rob and Pac-Man. Pac-Man and D-Rob. The greatest nickname duo for a pair of CBs in NFL history.

On a serious note if we got Pac-Man, in a year or two no one will be able to move the ball against us through the air. And I mean no one.

tiger06
01-29-2005, 11:54 AM
I'd definitely take Pac-Man. Imagine Glenn, D-Rob, and Pac-Man in our secondary next year. Pac-Man will eventually take Glenn's spot and he and Dunta will be an awesome CB duo. We've got Earl at SS, and I think he's more than capable.

ledzeppelin229
01-29-2005, 02:02 PM
I would go with Pac Man.

We don't need to take a SS that high and we also don't need to spend #13 overall on another DE/OLB convert. And then you have the fact Pac Man is arguably the best CB in the draft and we need another young CB for whenever Glenn's wheels really start wearing down.

Vinny
01-29-2005, 02:40 PM
Adam Pac-Man Jones claims he runs a 4.2 fourty. He is a great open field tackler like Dunta. I'd take him (although I passed him in our mock), but I don't think he will be there at 13 if he indeed does run a sub 4.4 fourty.

texasguy346
01-29-2005, 03:05 PM
I'll make it unanimous. I, too, would go with Pac Man Jones. There would be no 'safe' side of the field for QBs to throw the ball. If he indeeds runs a 4.2 40 then you won't hear about recievers burning him much after his rookie year (rookie mistakes).

Grid
01-29-2005, 03:53 PM
Pac Man here too. Our secondary would be locked down for years.

D-ReK
01-29-2005, 06:18 PM
I, too, would take Pac-Man...He is a Dunta clone in that they both are great tacklers and good zone defenders...

Pac-Man and D-Rob would be unstoppable for years to come...

BuffSoldier
01-29-2005, 06:19 PM
As much as I like TD and would love to have him in our secondary, you just dont come across a chance to have 2 CBs of that caliber in the same defensive backfield very often.

travfrancis
01-29-2005, 07:38 PM
id take pacman also

CoachJim
01-29-2005, 07:49 PM
So everyone so far likes this kid enough to pass on O or D line help? Ok, here's a question just because I haven't really read up on him (PacMan) like some of you have. If Jones & DRob hadda came out the same year & ya could only have one knowing what you now know about DRobs NFL progression, who do you take?

D-ReK
01-29-2005, 07:52 PM
If Jones & DRob hadda came out the same year & ya could only have one knowing what you now know about DRobs NFL progression, who do you take?

Definitely D-Rob...The draft is a calculated risk and when you have a player who has proven himself in the NFL, you have to take him over an unproven commodity...

AndreJ
01-29-2005, 07:52 PM
So everyone so far likes this kid enough to pass on O or D line help? Ok, here's a question just because I haven't really read up on him (PacMan) like some of you have. If Jones & DRob hadda came out the same year & ya could only have one knowing what you now know about DRobs NFL progression, who do you take?

The question was out of Pac-Man, TD and i forget the other guy, who would you take. Noone here is saying that our O and D line shouldn't be helped.
And the answer to your question is pretty obvious everyone would take D-Rob.

CoachJim
01-29-2005, 09:16 PM
The question was out of Pac-Man, TD and i forget the other guy, who would you take. Noone here is saying that our O and D line shouldn't be helped.
And the answer to your question is pretty obvious everyone would take D-Rob.
I see you have a knack for speaking for others including me. I never said anyone thinks the O & Dline shouldn't be helped. I questioned if the 13th pick should be used on DB help as opposed to O & DLine help.Last time I checked there were 6 more rounds worth of picks we could use on either/or. The argument is which to address first ... and as for that "everyone" reference, at the time only D-Rek had answered the question at the time. As knowledgable as he may be, I hardly believe he counts for much more than just HIS opinion. This was MY question within this thread ... comparing DRob to Jones. The aggrivating thing about all this is that you have done this to one of my posts before on the Jags board. My questions & opinions are just as valid as anyones on this MB. Heres a thought ... just ignore my posts if you can't find anything to say thats not condescending.

texasguy346
01-29-2005, 09:25 PM
So everyone so far likes this kid enough to pass on O or D line help?

I believe this is what AndreJ was referring to. Since the three choices were Pac Man Jones, Thomas Davis, and Dan Cody there wasn't a choice for O Line or D Line help. Dan Cody would translate to an OLB in the 3-4. It's perfectly reasonable for AndreJ to think you misinterpreted the original question.

The question was out of Pac-Man, TD and i forget the other guy, who would you take. Noone here is saying that our O and D line shouldn't be helped.

No reason to get offended over some simple misunderstanding on a message board.

AndreJ
01-29-2005, 09:27 PM
The aggrivating thing about all this is that you have done this to one of my posts before on the Jags board.

I dont wan't to turn this thread into an argument between me and you, but I would love to know what post i had done this to you on the Jags board. I've posted one thing on that board and that was about 1 hour ago.

And as for the everyone comment. If it'll make you happy I'll change it to about 99% of us would take D-Rob, taking in the consideration that during the season plenty have said they wouldn't want anyone else in the leauge and if they wouldn't want one of the present greats in the NFL, then why would they take someone who they haven't even seen perform at a professional level.

beerlover
01-29-2005, 09:35 PM
Mock Draft Scenero-

1. 49er's- Aaron Rogers
2. Fins- Alex Smith
3. Browns- Alex Barron
4. Bears- Mike Williams
5. Bucs- Cadillac Williams
6. ****- Derrick Johnson
7. Raiders- Ronnie Brown
8. Cards- Cedric Benson
9. Skins- Elton Brown
10. Lions- Antrell Rolle
11. Boyz- Marcus Spears
12. Boltz- Jammal Brown
13. Texans- Adam "Pac Man" Jones

agreed, Pac-Man it is should this order fall to us which I think is realistic, if not & the Boyz decide not to change to the 3-4 (Spears) & take Jones instead then we only have to worry about the Boltz taking Marcus because of need as well. I've been breaking this down to these players as being the most logical without trades (inevitable) to date. So basicly lets narrow this down a little futher-

1. Adam "PAC MAN" Jones
2. Marcus Spears

which one? :confused:

AndreJ
01-29-2005, 09:39 PM
I can see the BOYZ taking Pac-Man, because they don't have a real stong secondary. As for whether i would take Spears or Pac-Man, I would have to go with Spears, because #1 Gary Walker is getting old and should be retiring after this year or the next and #2 I beleive it starts in the trenches and Marcus Spears would be a great addition to our front 7 for years to come.

texasguy346
01-29-2005, 09:43 PM
1. Adam "PAC MAN" Jones
2. Marcus Spears

which one? :confused:

That's a tough one. If we were to have both of those players available to us on draft day we'd be stuck in quite a dillemma. We could take the BPA (PacMan) or we could take a closely ranked player who fills a need (Spears). I absolutely love what Spears brings to the game, and there's no question in my mind that he'll be very good in the NFL for a long time. However, PacMan Jones would give us a secondary that could prove to be the best in the NFL. Imagine it. DRob, Glenn starting with Faggins and PacMan coming in whenever Nickle and Dime scenarios pop up during the game. I think if we do this we could still get a pretty good DE or DT later in the draft. If you want evidence of that just look at who Vinny picked in our mock draft.

astrofan
01-29-2005, 10:00 PM
Dan Cody

Jones would be great if we were stacked at every position, but we are in dire need of having two real OLBs on the field at the same time (when I reread this I realized that we are also in need of two real ILBs as well)

then again Cody isn't always at the top of my first round OLB list, which rotates between Cody, Roth, and Pollack; Pollack would also fit in at DE for us

this will be an easier choice after the combine

we have a decent secondary, but after Babin and Sharper, the linebacker squad is woefully inadequate

AndreJ
01-29-2005, 10:07 PM
Pollack would also fit in at DE for us


Pollack is 6-3 and about 275, he would have to add about 20 lbs to be a Lineman in the 3-4 Defense. The avg. size for a DE in the 3-4 is right about 300 lbs. No less than 290

Honoring Earl 34
01-29-2005, 10:16 PM
:howdy: If Pac Man runs a 4.3 he'll be gone. If my favorite DL was there I'd take him. If not and I did not have a stud LB on the board I'd take PacMan or trade down depending on what I thought of him. If you can't raise the bridge lower the water. Meaning if you can't get a good rush cover a little longer.

beerlover
01-29-2005, 10:24 PM
tough decisions but good ones at least this year for the Texans to ponder :hmmm: my point of this thread was to wittle down to the most realistic players available with the 13th pick. the 13th pick most likely favors a defensive player, hence Jones, Spears, Davis & Cody. hard to figure the Texans can lose picking any of the three or four mentioned. i have it upon strong opinion however the Cowboys (who fired their defensive ends coach & former great Jim Jeffcoat as a sign) seem intent on changing to the ever popular 3-4 defense in which case Spears will be a Cowboy :thud: I see Rolle being chosen as the big physical corner that the Lions need thus facilatating the pick.

so you bascily have a choice between-

Adam "Pac Man" Jones who soldifies both cb positions along with Dunta for the next 10 years, or

The next best safety since Sean Taylor which last year everybody wanted, or

the bookend to Babin soldifying the OLB's position for the next 10 years in Cody.

Gentleman, Texans, this very well is what it will come down to this coming April. All I can suggest is that we stay with the 13th pick and let's see what falls our way. Overall the consensus is for Adam "Pac Man" Jones-

hard to argue that :howdy:

beerlover
01-29-2005, 10:31 PM
Pollack is 6-3 and about 275, he would have to add about 20 lbs to be a Lineman in the 3-4 Defense. The avg. size for a DE in the 3-4 is right about 300 lbs. No less than 290

Cody has a big frame which he has still not yet filled out, hence he is a natural 4-3 DE or a "New Era" OLB in the 3-4. the team who drafts him can mold him into their expectations because he is verstile, unique & is a fierce warrior. he is however a project at OLB & would take time like Babin to learn the system, but when that happens I would wager the Texans sack totals rise expotentially, not strictly because of him but because the skilled tools are available to make the 3-4 work.

texansfan88
01-29-2005, 10:39 PM
I'm not that high on Jones, although he is taken by the Texans in my next mock

Can anyone name a really true great #1 receiver that he faced this year? Guys from Temple and UCONN and Syracuse don't count.

He faced one good one, Cro Thorpe, who he got killed by, and he's not even considered a day 1 prospect

TexansCanes
01-30-2005, 01:20 AM
So everyone so far likes this kid enough to pass on O or D line help? Ok, here's a question just because I haven't really read up on him (PacMan) like some of you have. If Jones & DRob hadda came out the same year & ya could only have one knowing what you now know about DRobs NFL progression, who do you take?

this is such a bad question, why would any one take a player that might be good in the nfl if they knew that they were getting a person that should have been in the pro bowl and could have won the rookie of the year. also say that jones isn't a first day player is just ignorant. i know that this draft authorities can't always be trusted but many have him as one of the top 3 corners in the draft, so i don't know how you say that about him. i will agree that he is a little overrated because of his forty time.

fresno8
01-30-2005, 01:28 AM
Pac-Man, draft a MLB or sign one and let Peek rotate in w/ Babin and Wong, sense everyone doesn't think Peek can handle everydown play. Our pass rush will suffer until we get a better D-line to occupy o-lineman and generate some pass rush. Pac-Man and Robinson will form a super duo for yrs and both can learn from Glenn and Glenn can still play a yr or two.

BornOrange
01-30-2005, 08:43 AM
I see you have a knack for speaking for others including me. I never said anyone thinks the O & Dline shouldn't be helped. I questioned if the 13th pick should be used on DB help as opposed to O & DLine help.Last time I checked there were 6 more rounds worth of picks we could use on either/or. The argument is which to address first ... and as for that "everyone" reference, at the time only D-Rek had answered the question at the time. As knowledgable as he may be, I hardly believe he counts for much more than just HIS opinion. This was MY question within this thread ... comparing DRob to Jones. The aggrivating thing about all this is that you have done this to one of my posts before on the Jags board. My questions & opinions are just as valid as anyones on this MB. Heres a thought ... just ignore my posts if you can't find anything to say thats not condescending.
Lighten up, Francis.

CoachJim
01-30-2005, 09:21 AM
Lighten up, Francis.

"Any of you guys touch me or my stuff ... I'll kill ya."

CoachJim
01-30-2005, 09:24 AM
I dont wan't to turn this thread into an argument between me and you, but I would love to know what post i had done this to you on the Jags board. I've posted one thing on that board and that was about 1 hour ago.

And as for the everyone comment. If it'll make you happy I'll change it to about 99% of us would take D-Rob, taking in the consideration that during the season plenty have said they wouldn't want anyone else in the leauge and if they wouldn't want one of the present greats in the NFL, then why would they take someone who they haven't even seen perform at a professional level.

I checked the Jag board member list last night & I now remember it being someone else so for THAT I apologize...

CoachJim
01-30-2005, 09:31 AM
Back to the original question, I'd just love to see us getting a player or two via the draft and/or FA that'll improve our pass rush just so our DBs ain't gotta work so hard. It's true that soon we will have to address AGs replacement but our bigger need is for not letting opposing QBs the time to sit back in the pocket looking for their recievers like a woman shops for an Easter dress.Taking the BPA is cool if you have that need but I'm all for fixing the problem NOW.

texansfan88
01-30-2005, 10:54 AM
Yet, no one has answered the simple question of who has Pac Man really faced?

I WIN AGAIN

beerlover
01-30-2005, 11:29 AM
East Carolina, UCF, Maryland, James Madison, Virginia Tech, Connecticut , Syracuse, Rutgers, Temple W, Boston College, Pittsburgh & Florida State.
Looks decent to me.

the only game I saw Adam play in was the Gator Bowl & from what I saw was very impressed with coverage (reminded one of Dunta) as well return duties (although he did drop the ball on the carpet once). Still faced some good competition, nothing like Big 12 but still good :twocents:

texasguy346
01-30-2005, 12:11 PM
I can't really blame him for not facing top quality talent. Miami and Virginia Tech bolted from the Big East to join the ACC. He was on a West Virginia team that was supposed to walk away with the Big East title, but they vastly underachieved. I watched Pac Man in the Maryland game, and he played very well. It always looked like he was around the ball.

Just for comparision here's DRob's schedule from his last season. Remember he played for an SEC team. LOUISIANA-LAFAYETTE, VIRGINIA, Georgia, UAB, Tennessee, KENTUCKY, LOUISIANA STATE, VANDERBILT, Mississippi, Arkansas, FLORIDA, CLEMSON.

Georgia has Reggie Brown and Fred Gibson who are notorious for being a little soft. LSU had Clayton, and not much else. Tennessee didn't really have a top level WR. Florida had a great freshman QB, and some good WRs. All those teams are in the SEC, and South Carolina was blownout in most of those games with the exception of the Tennessee game that they lost in OT. Can't really let one year's schedule speak for a CB. It was just last season when Pac Man Jones faced off with Larry Fitzgerald of Pittsburgh, and he also faced higher level competition against Miami and Virginia Tech. If who you played was such an important factor then you'd never see guys from small schools make it into the NFL like Steve McNair or Jerry Rice etc.

beerlover
01-30-2005, 12:19 PM
I can't really blame him for not facing top quality talent. Miami and Virginia Tech bolted from the Big East to join the ACC. He was on a West Virginia team that was supposed to walk away with the Big East title, but they vastly underachieved. I watched Pac Man in the Maryland game, and he played very well. It always looked like he was around the ball.

Just for comparision here's DRob's schedule from his last season. Remember he played for an SEC team. LOUISIANA-LAFAYETTE, VIRGINIA, Georgia, UAB, Tennessee, KENTUCKY, LOUISIANA STATE, VANDERBILT, Mississippi, Arkansas, FLORIDA, CLEMSON.

Georgia has Reggie Brown and Fred Gibson who are notorious for being a little soft. LSU had Clayton, and not much else. Tennessee didn't really have a top level WR. Florida had a great freshman QB, and some good WRs. All those teams are in the SEC, and South Carolina was blownout in most of those games with the exception of the Tennessee game that they lost in OT. Can't really let one year's schedule speak for a CB. It was just last season when Pac Man Jones faced off with Larry Fitzgerald of Pittsburgh, and he also faced higher level competition against Miami and Virginia Tech. If who you played was such an important factor then you'd never see guys from small schools make it into the NFL like Steve McNair or Jerry Rice etc.

add Ben Roethlisberger :D

Vinny
01-30-2005, 12:31 PM
Yet, no one has answered the simple question of who has Pac Man really faced?

I WIN AGAINEnjoy your trophy. Nobody can watch cornerback play on tv and grade them out (hard to grade what you cannot see), so it would be hard for me to form opinions on guys based on second hand internet scouting. TV does not capture the secondary other than the occasional replay.

TexansCanes
01-30-2005, 04:37 PM
Yet, no one has answered the simple question of who has Pac Man really faced?

I WIN AGAIN

i agree that he hasn't faced anyone good and shut them down. larry killed him last year. the fascinating thing about him is that he is fast and scouts really like that. also he can also have a big part in the return game. if you think about it, their aren't any good wr in the big east now that miami and va tech left. he had very good games against them last year.

astrofan
01-30-2005, 06:44 PM
Pollack is 6-3 and about 275, he would have to add about 20 lbs to be a Lineman in the 3-4 Defense. The avg. size for a DE in the 3-4 is right about 300 lbs. No less than 290

Jarvis Green 6'3" 272
Brett Keisel 6'5" 279
Aaron Smith 6'5" 275

I think that Pollack's history of being a great interior lineman (DT/FB) who moved outside to play end would lend itself toward him playing on the line like Aaron Smith, where guys like Matt Roth (LB/FB) and Dan Cody (FS/LB/TE), who were shuffled into the mix at DE in college because that is where the playmakers are, would be more natural OLBs

OT: as I am typing this, Willie McGinest is being interviewed on NFL channel
I feel like I'm on the Truman Show (or the Astrofan Show, I guess)

D-ReK
03-31-2005, 01:52 AM
I was browsing this thread (old thread alert) and I came to wonder what everyone's opinion is now...Scout.Com is reporting that

"League sources have told us that the word out of last month's combine is red flags have come up on the urine sample for West Virginia cornerback Adam "Pac Man" Jones. We will update the story as more information is available."

If these allegations hold true, where do you see Pac-Man landing? What's everyone's opinion of Davis now? Why have we not heard the name of Dan Cody in weeks around here?

royce1054
03-31-2005, 02:35 AM
my texans list
1. Johnson will either go #3 or #6
2. Merriman could 3-10
3. Pac-man #6 #8 or #9
4. Rolle #3, #9, #9
5. Edwards #4, #5, #6, #7
6. M. Williams #6, #7
7. Williamson #9, #12
8. Barron #10

This is each player i think is Texans wish list and where they might go.

beerlover
03-31-2005, 09:20 AM
wow this has changed in two months, I don't even have Dan Cody on my first round draft board anymore, pac-man has slipped but still has an outside shot, although CB's like Fabian Washington have surfaced after working out & the Combine and Pro Days & Thomas Davis however has remained the most "REAL" possibility.

Thomas Davis answeared questions about his speed by running 4.43-4.44 but also opened another by lifting only 12 times, I would have thought he was a lot stronger than that watching him play and make big hits. looks like FS material.

David Pollack should be available @ #13 his College career stands on its own and he has done nothing but improve his intangibles by out performing the entire DE/tweeners with his quickness. a much quicker, played against stronger competition Jason Babin ready made NFL 3-4 OLB. of all the players in the draft who scouts say PROJECT to play another position in the NFL he makes the most seamless transition.

Troy Williamson(4.38)/Mark Clayton(4.43)- as more people anaylze the WR class people are starting to take notice that Clayton is the better route runner, has softer hands and more elusive. Williamson gets the edge on size & speed but this is a deep WR class, with the chance to solidify the defense will the Texans invest another #1 in a WR?

less than three weeks to go and still no consensus pick of who the Texans will pick @ #13. so I'll just post who I'd like to see available-

CEDRIC BENSON

DERRICK JOHNSON

DAVID POLLACK

keyfro
03-31-2005, 09:23 AM
that's pretty close but i think casserly's board looks something like this

1. derrick johnson
2. bryalon edwards
3. mike milliams
4. antrell rolle
5. cedric benson
6. marcus spears
7. shawn merriman
8. david pollack
9. ronnie brown
10. alex barron

i honestly think if either one of those two backs fall to us casserly will jump on them...but mostly defensive guys are up there...pac-man isn't up there because we already are short at the corner position we need a taller corner to replace glenn when he retires rolle is 6" which is pretty tall for a corner...pollack does make it into the top ten but only because of his attitude and the possibility of having one of the most underrated players in this draft