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View Full Version : Run, Texans, Run.............First?


CloakNNNdagger
05-11-2009, 08:45 AM
Now that it is evident that the Texans are trying to beef up their run game, will they abandon last year's approach of the pass setting up the run? Looking at the big picture, the pass setting up the run seemed to have worked pretty well, EXCEPT that we only had Slaton, without a hard yard downer and limited run support personel.
My feeling is that we should not change our approach, but use our new found run "strengths" to make last year's approach more EFFECTIVE. I'd be interested to see how others feel about this subject.

HOU-TEX
05-11-2009, 08:48 AM
Now that it is evident that the Texans are trying to beef up their run game, will they abandon last year's approach of the pass setting up the run? Looking at the big picture, the pass setting up the run seemed to have worked pretty well, EXCEPT that we only had Slaton, without a hard yard downer and limited run support personel.
My feeling is that we should not change our approach, but use our new found run "strengths" to make last year's approach more EFFECTIVE. I'd be interested to see how others feel about this subject.

IMO, too many turnovers. Getting the running game established early will help cut down on our turnover rate.

RipTraxx
05-11-2009, 08:51 AM
IMO, too many turnovers. Getting the running game established early will help cut down on our turnover rate.

Set up play action and bootlegs which kubes LOVES.

HOU-TEX
05-11-2009, 09:05 AM
Set up play action and bootlegs which kubes LOVES.

Supposedly, that's how this scheme has become successful in the past. Establishing the run in order to set up PA and the boots. It worked very well at times this past season and I think it had a lot to do with a better running game. I expect the offense to only get better by having an even better running game.

Plus, it will also depend who's doing the play calling. Kubiak tends to get a little overzealous at times, which leads him away from the run game. I'm still not convinced Kubiak's going to totally hand those duties to Shanny Jr from day 1.

DiehardChris
05-11-2009, 09:23 AM
I don't think the beefing up is intending to make us run MORE as much as it's made to make us run BETTER... except in goal line situations, where I fully expect our offseason changes to give us the ability to run on 3rd and goal from the 2 or 4th and goal from the 2 instead of us having to pass in that situation every time.

TimeKiller
05-11-2009, 10:28 AM
I'm still not convinced Kubiak's going to totally hand those duties to Shanny Jr from day 1.

I'd never expect that. What I expect is KidShan to call the play, send it to Kubiak who will say yay or nay and then to the QB.

I'd like to see a little more poundage in the run game but especially when the field start shrinking so we don't see so many picks in the red zone or near it.

Polo
05-11-2009, 10:50 AM
I think the goal is to run the ball more. That is wha tKubes has wanted to do all along. Using the pass to set up the run is nice when you suck at running the ball, but it shouldn't be your goal.

I think Schaub is a good QB, but I'd rather not have him drop back so often to pass...Hopefully we will n ot be playing catch up too often which would force him to do that...

Our QB's were the cause of too many turnovers because of how much they had to handle the ball...especially in the redzone...

Norg
05-11-2009, 08:00 PM
to me we are still a passing team

what are they done so far to think we a re a running team we still have no one to backup slaton other then moats & Brown ..........

Carr Bombed
05-11-2009, 10:38 PM
to me we are still a passing team

what are they done so far to think we a re a running team we still have no one to backup slaton other then moats & Brown ..........

They added a immediate upgrade at center (as far as running goes) in the draft, they added a H-back type player in James Casey, and they also added the best run blocking TE in the entire draft...

The drafting of Hill and Caldwell alone were clear signs to me that they wanted to get more physical upfront and pound the ball.

TheRealJoker
05-11-2009, 11:06 PM
The reason Slaton was so successful last season was because our passing game spread out the defense giving Slaton the space he needed to make big plays. Give Slaton space and he'll make the most of it.

Slaton is not the type of back that you build an entire offense around (Adrian Peterson and Ladainian Tomlinson are examples of that type of back). He can be shut down if teams focus their attention on him like the Titans did in game 2 until Fat Albert got hurt.

We are lucky enough (depending on how you look at it) to have the personnel where we dont need a franchise type back who can succeed no matter what the defenses gameplan. We've got a very nice big play type back who is the perfect complement to our passing game. Our passing game gives Slaton space and he can do great things with it. Deciding to make Slaton and the running game the focal point of the offense would not only decrease Slaton's effectiveness by decreasing his opportunities in space where he plays best but it would decrease the overall effectiveness on offense because we aren't giving our playmakers in the passing game the opportunities to make plays.

Carr Bombed
05-12-2009, 01:36 AM
The reason Slaton was so successful last season was because our passing game spread out the defense giving Slaton the space he needed to make big plays. Give Slaton space and he'll make the most of it.

Slaton is not the type of back that you build an entire offense around (Adrian Peterson and Ladainian Tomlinson are examples of that type of back). He can be shut down if teams focus their attention on him like the Titans did in game 2 until Fat Albert got hurt.

We are lucky enough (depending on how you look at it) to have the personnel where we dont need a franchise type back who can succeed no matter what the defenses gameplan. We've got a very nice big play type back who is the perfect complement to our passing game. Our passing game gives Slaton space and he can do great things with it. Deciding to make Slaton and the running game the focal point of the offense would not only decrease Slaton's effectiveness by decreasing his opportunities in space where he plays best but it would decrease the overall effectiveness on offense because we aren't giving our playmakers in the passing game the opportunities to make plays.

I think some of y'all are reading WAY too much into the talk about focussing more on the running game or "running first". One think Kubiak has shown is that he's going to attack what the defense is going to give him. He'll run or pass depending on what the defense is doing and then when they make adjustments he'll switch it up. Don't worry we're not going to turn into the Titans offensively and we're not going to turn a blind eye towards our great receiving targets. We're just going to be more balanced this year...Which in the end will open things up for everybody. The more effective we run, the more defenses have to respect our running game, which leads to the more amount of times you'll see our receivers sprinting down the field for TDs (not to mention a hellava lot less TOs)

Also just, because we might run more, that doesn't mean Slaton's touches are going to go up...(Kubiak already said he wants Slaton to get about 20 touches a game, which is about what he got last year) I think it means, we're going to try to have multiple rushing threats this year....a tandem of RBs. Nobody is asking Slaton to be "Adrian Peterson or LT"...that's not how this system works. BTW, Tenn didn't "shut Slaton down until Haynesworth got hurt". I don't think you're giving the guy enough credit...defenses were aware of him and he only had one single carry in that Titans game after Fat Al went out.....it was a 12 yarder, he already racked up 88 yards against a tough defense with Haynesworth in the game. He wasn't being shut out of anything.

I mean, please look at the teams at the top of this list and tell me what the majority of them had in common last season...

http://www.nfl.com/stats (http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?archive=false&conference=null&role=TM&offensiveStatisticCategory=RUSHING&defensiveStatisticCategory=null&season=2008&seasonType=REG&tabSeq=2&qualified=true&Submit=Go)

I'll give you a hint.....If we can work our way up that list, we'll have the same thing in common with them at the end of this year.

threetoedpete
05-12-2009, 11:32 AM
Whether we run first or throw first isn't the question. The big question is how much of a jump as a unit will the o-line make in '09. They had several opportunities to take over and save games last year and they didn't do it. We'll know we have arrived when the o-line goes into a game and manages back to back long TD drives on the first two possessions to open a game. What that will mean is they made twenty plays or so with out a mental error. And Mental errors killed us last year. Physically and on paper they have the talent to dominate anyone. Mentally, they are still a work in progress. They made a major jump with their down field blocking last year. When they got one on one in space, the o-lineman made some spectacular blocks. The next jump is cutting down on the mental errors and dominate our scheme. Doesn't matter how the coaches set up the rushing attack. All that matters is that the o-lineman execute the scheme.

badboy
05-12-2009, 12:02 PM
The key to any offense is having the players that can do what the coach wants them to do. I think we have enough of those players to take another step this season.

beerlover
05-12-2009, 02:31 PM
It's not about run first at all. It's about having the ability to dictate tempo & do as you please to another teams defensive weakness. some teams are better @ stopping the run than others so you take it to them with the pass first to expose their weakness then come back to the run after loosening them up to finish a dominate game plan. can't wait to get it started :specnatz:

infantrycak
05-12-2009, 02:37 PM
It's not about run first at all. It's about having the ability to dictate tempo & do as you please to another teams defensive weakness. some teams are better @ stopping the run than others so you take it to them with the pass first to expose their weakness then come back to the run after loosening them up to finish a dominate game plan. can't wait to get it started :specnatz:

I don't get where this run first stuff comes from with respect to Kubiak. He wants an effective running game. Neither he nor Shanahan has an urge to become or will ever be mistaken for Jeff Fisher or Coach Chin.

CloakNNNdagger
05-12-2009, 04:18 PM
I don't get where this run first stuff comes from with respect to Kubiak. He wants an effective running game. Neither he nor Shanahan has an urge to become or will ever be mistaken for Jeff Fisher or Coach Chin.

Exactly, you don't scrap something that has worked well for you in general. You build on it to become more effective, especially in those scenarios that held you back...........i.e., red zone/short yardage play.