PDA

View Full Version : GP's ultimate "WTH?!?" mid-bottling free agency signing


GP
03-11-2009, 07:56 PM
Oh, I'm going to stir the pot on this one...BIG TIME.

Just my way of tossing some gasoline on this pile of dried up threads.

Kubiak loves to grab the guy who has potential, but the timing has to be right. He passed on even CONSIDERING a visit for Benson last season, and then had the guy in for a visit (and nearly signed him to a nice offer). That's a pretty big turn around from laughing off the mere thought of Benson to almost signing the guy.

Having said that, here we go...

PacMan Jones. Defensive back AND punt return specialist who has tortured us in the past. He might not be a true one-on-one cover man anymore, but I can see him playing safety...roaming the field and dashing into a deep pass play for the interception.

Glazer has a great column about PacMan on foxsports.com, and it looks like PacMan has finally figured out that he blew his chance. He says he will play for THE LEAGUE MINIMUM for a few years if that's what it takes. He's engaged to be married. He wants no part of strip clubs. He says he's done hanging out with certain people. The shine wore off the party-animal lifestyle, which happens at different points for all people.

Here is a great excerpt from the story (http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/9321684/No-longer-sure-how-to-feel-about-Pacman):

Instead, I came away hoping that the kid who seemed to "get it" in our few days together has turned the corner. He never once shied away and tried to say he did nothing wrong. To the contrary, he openly talked about how much he's screwed up and how he relished the chance to change and prove he has changed. I don't really know how I should feel about this.

"I got a little girl. I'm engaged now, so I have other things that interest me other than going to strip clubs, hanging out with 20 guys 'til four or five o'clock in the morning," Jones said in an exclusive interview. "I want to play football and you can't do those types of things with my lifestyle and all the controversy I've had."

In past interviews, Pacman often denied wrongdoing for his arrests and suspensions. He blamed everyone but himself. I was waiting for him to take this same approach with me. If he had, I was going to jump down his throat. He never gave me the chance.

"If anything goes wrong, it's going to be, 'Oh Pac was there, Pac this, Pac that,' " Jones said. "I'm not saying I haven't done that, I've done some wrong things, I'm no angel by far. But a lot of things I got myself into was being at the wrong place at the wrong time.

"I know, let's not go into the (strip clubs), or hang out with the guys I used to hang out with. I don't got to stay out 'til four o'clock in the morning."

I've had a ton of guys tell me they've changed and I knew they'd be back in trouble before I could hit the "send" button on my column. But this guy felt a little different to me than those clowns.

Of all the former star athletes we had battle it out on this season of PVJ -- and we had major star power like Alonzo Mourning, Steve McNair, Robert Horry, Priest Holmes, the list goes on and on (insert horrific gagging for my shameless plug) -- Pacman was, simply put, the most eager to please. He wasn't pompous. He wasn't a thug. He didn't have an entourage in tow. In fact, he was a natural showman who couldn't have been more gracious.

League minimum? Sign him up. Cut him if he needs to be cut.

Pretty freaking simple if you ask me. Regardless of what you think about him, it still remains that we need talent on defense. And he's easily the replacement of JJ on special teams.

Let the rage commence. :heart:

kiwitexansfan
03-11-2009, 08:00 PM
Pay the man!!!

Everyone deserves a (whats he up to??) 4th chance!!

Jackie Chiles
03-11-2009, 08:02 PM
Mind boggling?

There is no way this would happen. I don't know if there is a single team in the NFL that would want any part of Jones right now. He just got into a fight on Pros vs. Joes for crying out loud. Anything that comes out of his mouth about rehab is worth less than nothing.

TheRealJoker
03-11-2009, 08:05 PM
I would definately bring him in for league minimum. Forget the whole choir boy schtick, league minimum is low risk/high reward. He doesn't pan out we can cut him in training camp!!!

Believe me, I hate bringing in bad apples as much as the next person on here but for league minimum its too hard to resist a guy who can play among the best at 2 positions in the NFL (CB/PR). Its a whole different situation if we actually paid him...but it would be LEAGUE MINIMUM.

Maybe having two knuckleheads fighting for the PR job will make the light switch go off in both their heads. Best case we would see Pacman starting opposite a healthy Dunta. Pacman's got too much talent to not even consider at the league minimum.

ObsiWan
03-11-2009, 08:07 PM
it'll never happen here.
McNair is waaaay too proud of the Texans' choirboy image to allow it.

I hadn't heard about the "Pros vs. Joes" scuffle. And even if it happened, are you sure that wasn't staged for ratings??

I mean, I didn't even know that silly show was still on the air.

Jackie Chiles
03-11-2009, 08:16 PM
it'll never happen here.
McNair is waaaay too proud of the Texans' choirboy image to allow it.

I hadn't heard about the "Pros vs. Joes" scuffle. And even if it happened, are you sure that wasn't staged for ratings??

I mean, I didn't even know that silly show was still on the air.

I doubt it was staged, its really damaging to his (already shattered) image.

http://nfl.fanhouse.com/2009/03/06/pacman-jones-fights-at-pros-v-joes/

"He hit me 10 yards out of bounds, kind of a cheap shot," Adams said. "I couldn't sit there and not retaliate. You've got to have some pride and dignity."

I mean come on. This guy is more cartoon than human being, he is a complete joke. I am not married to the squeaky clean image the Texans have either but this guy goes so far beyond questionable character and behavior he is really on another planet altogether.

ArlingtonTexan
03-11-2009, 08:25 PM
Wow..I can't believe that someone would suggest the Texans pick-up a familiar named player who is both of bad character and mediocore performance. Who would have thought!!!!

76Texan
03-11-2009, 08:27 PM
The Texans will have to hire TexanBill as his chaperone first.
Then he can make the recommendation to McNair, Kubiak and Smith.
Or maybe somebody here on board is a tad more qualified for the job? http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/images/icons/icon10.gif

phantom17
03-11-2009, 08:38 PM
GP!....... WTH!!!! :) Oh well, I guess we could use @ least one bad boy on the team! :mail:

mussop
03-11-2009, 08:40 PM
I just threw up in my mouth alittle. GP youre getting one of these :voodoo: for even suggesting this.

DiehardChris
03-11-2009, 08:49 PM
You seem to have forgotten that it's not just about character issues anymore. He was terrible in Dallas... a total non-factor.

TEXANRED
03-11-2009, 08:53 PM
Pacman Jones? Whats he ever done?

And he is only worth league minimum.

GP
03-11-2009, 08:55 PM
LOL.

L-e-a-g-u-e M-i-n-i-m-u-m.

Cut him IN CAMP if he's not giving his all, or if things look bad.

I am the whitest, nerdiest, boy scout haircut, conservative republican, family-values guy on here. Or I am at least tied with a few of those on here. And I am saying: For the league minimum, and considering our defense and punt return duties, he's worth the league minimum.

Someone's going to do it. Why not?

Buffi2
03-11-2009, 09:14 PM
Someone's going to do it. Why not?

Ohhh, maybe because he cares more about carousing than football? Maybe because he would be a hindrance more than a help team-wise? There is always the fact that this liberal female who fllunked out of girl scouts doesn't like the guy which isn't worth anything but a fact nonetheless.:winky:

El Tejano
03-11-2009, 09:19 PM
Ask Cowboy fans what they think of PacMan? He wasn't that good of a corner after all. Forget the other stuff, he isn't that good anymore and he was on a good D in Dallas.

LonerATO
03-11-2009, 09:25 PM
I would rather go after Ken Lucas since he has been cut by the Panthers

GP
03-11-2009, 09:25 PM
deleted.

GP
03-11-2009, 09:27 PM
deleted.

dalemurphy
03-11-2009, 09:50 PM
LOL.

L-e-a-g-u-e M-i-n-i-m-u-m.

Cut him IN CAMP if he's not giving his all, or if things look bad.

I am the whitest, nerdiest, boy scout haircut, conservative republican, family-values guy on here. Or I am at least tied with a few of those on here. And I am saying: For the league minimum, and considering our defense and punt return duties, he's worth the league minimum.

Someone's going to do it. Why not?

Here's the problem. What if he plays really well. He outplays Bennett and Molden and surplants JJ as the punt returner. So, he's going to make the roster and someone else (at his position) will get cut. Then, in November, he gets caught with drugs and is indefinitely suspended. Well, he only cost us $400,000 right? No, we also cut Fred Bennett and Jacoby Jones. Now, we don't have a punt returner and we're dangerously thin at CB. Meanwhile, Molden hasn't received many snaps because Pacman and Dunta have been on the field for every snap.

GP
03-11-2009, 10:01 PM
Here's the problem. What if he plays really well. He outplays Bennett and Molden and surplants JJ as the punt returner. So, he's going to make the roster and someone else (at his position) will get cut. Then, in November, he gets caught with drugs and is indefinitely suspended. Well, he only cost us $400,000 right? No, we also cut Fred Bennett and Jacoby Jones. Now, we don't have a punt returner and we're dangerously thin at CB. Meanwhile, Molden hasn't received many snaps because Pacman and Dunta have been on the field for every snap.

Why would Fred be the one who is cut?

There's that guy named Jacques Reeves. Is Jacques Reeves better than PacMan? I don't think so.

Bring up one of our 2009 draft choices, from the practice squad, to replace him.

When was the last time you read PacMan being a menace to the team, in the locker room and with his teammates? The guys in Tennessee hated to see him go, but they knew he was living an off-the-field lifestyle that was bad for the team.

So...what if he's for real now?

League minimum sounds good to me.

HoustonFrog
03-11-2009, 10:23 PM
GP, I can't fault your reasoning because that is exactly what Dallas did. As much as we, as fans, hate to get ragged on, they didn't give up anything or spend much money on him. It was boom or bust. Of course he should not have come back after the one incident but they got a draft pick in a round lower back and pretty much lost nothing in the process.

Of course he promised to change and that he was a better person with a second chance and blew it too.:)

TheIronDuke
03-11-2009, 10:28 PM
Not only do I not want the Texans to sign this piece of garbage but I really hope the NFL bans him for life for being the exact opposite of what an NFL player is supposed to be. He's absolutely worthless (which is far below league minimum) and is just a complete non-factor-cancer and his IQ would probably reveal that he is functionally retarded.

I want no part of Adam Jones and hope he is banished from the league. He is a horrible person and the only skills he had (football) have been diminished.

Dan B.
03-11-2009, 10:39 PM
All I know is taking someone with Jones' appetite for strip clubs and putting them in Houston is about as smart as taking Ricky Williams to play in Amsterdam. You are begging for disaster.

bigfan77801
03-11-2009, 10:45 PM
Not only do I not want the Texans to sign this piece of garbage but I really hope the NFL bans him for life for being the exact opposite of what an NFL player is supposed to be. He's absolutely worthless (which is far below league minimum) and is just a complete non-factor-cancer and his IQ would probably reveal that he is functionally retarded.

I want no part of Adam Jones and hope he is banished from the league. He is a horrible person and the only skills he had (football) have been diminished.

Please tell us how you really feel and quit hiding your opinions. J/King, I 100 percent agree with you

GP
03-12-2009, 09:54 AM
GP, I can't fault your reasoning because that is exactly what Dallas did. As much as we, as fans, hate to get ragged on, they didn't give up anything or spend much money on him. It was boom or bust. Of course he should not have come back after the one incident but they got a draft pick in a round lower back and pretty much lost nothing in the process.

Of course he promised to change and that he was a better person with a second chance and blew it too.:)

But sometimes, a guy has one more ounce of crazy in him. I think getting waived by the Cowboys has caused him to realize he has to have a zero-tolerance contract with himself. That's what I took away from the Glazer article.

Like I said, it's for the league minimum. It costs us no draft picks. And you know Kubiak will waive him in a heartbeat if he's not for real.

It's one thing for a team owner to avoid players who are rampant and CURRENT abusers of the system. It's another thing to wear that as a badge in order to come off as holier than thou. Sometimes, with the way this team works, you do wonder if the latter is true.

We'll reach for Chris Brown and give him a locker, when he's clearly a walking injury report. We'll reach for Ahman green. We'll reach for Samkon Gado. We'll reach for Weaver. But the Texans laughed at the mere thought of Benson mentioning he wanted to visit the team last fall. He goes and has a solid season, stays out of trouble, and almost had a contract with us a few days ago. I guess some sins are forgivable and some aren't. I guess Benson's were.

T.O. is a person who is going to have life-long problems, due to the nature of his personality. I think PacMan is a guy who knew better, but he had to take several lumps on the head to figure it out. He seems like someone who just put off "growing up" as long as he could.

I dunno. There are some people here who are so offended at him for what happened with the disabling of the bar worker (IIRC) that they could never consider forgiving him. I think our owner would never want him here just for those reasons alone. It was TOO much of a public relations "hit" for it to go away easily and not haunt our team if we were to sign him.

LOL. The draft gurus on draft day, I remember them saying they liked the Titans' pick but that there was a lot of baggage and potential problems with drafting him. Pretty accurate prediction.

El Tejano
03-12-2009, 10:17 AM
All I know is taking someone with Jones' appetite for strip clubs and putting them in Houston is about as smart as taking Ricky Williams to play in Amsterdam. You are begging for disaster.

It's funny you bring up Ricky Williams because I feel that if Adam Jones wants to ressurrect his career, he should take Ricky's approach. Go play in The CFL, show that you mean business about playing football and then make your way back on an NFL team. Then when you get there, shut up, straighten up and play.

Hervoyel
03-12-2009, 10:44 AM
Guys who have real problems say this sort of thing 8-10 times before people realize that they're just saying what they know the man wants to hear. I'm sure somewhere that Art Schlichter is telling someone right now about his inner demons and how he's going to do it all right this time because he's finally learned his lesson.

Pac Man means it... for now. Still, I would not have a problem with the Texans taking the chance (but I know they won't) provided that they cut him without hesitation the moment he got arrested for urinating on a hooker he just beat up for stealing his weed in the back of a casino.

I often advocate that the Texans look at guys who have had troubled pasts and I'm always told by someone that I must want the Texans to become like the Raiders or Crackboys or Bungles and just become a characterless team of thugs. Nothing could be further from the truth. I think the team should be willing to try guys who have had problems, not try them out and tolerate them at any cost. Giving Pac Man a chance would be one thing and arguably could be considered the right thing to do IF he's willing to rebuild his career from the ground floor AND you're willing to send his ass packing the moment he returns to his old form.

Texan Asylum
03-12-2009, 10:47 AM
Guys who have real problems say this sort of thing 8-10 times before people realize that they're just saying what they know the man wants to hear. I'm sure somewhere that Art Schlichter is telling someone right now about his inner demons and how he's going to do it all right this time because he's finally learned his lesson.

Pac Man means it... for now. Still, I would not have a problem with the Texans taking the chance (but I know they won't) provided that they cut him without hesitation the moment he got arrested for urinating on a hooker he just beat up for stealing his weed in the back of a casino.

I often advocate that the Texans look at guys who have had troubled pasts and I'm always told by someone that I must want the Texans to become like the Raiders or Crackboys or Bungles and just become a characterless team of thugs. Nothing could be further from the truth. I think the team should be willing to try guys who have had problems, not try them out and tolerate them at any cost. Giving Pac Man a chance would be one thing and arguably could be considered the right thing to do IF he's willing to rebuild his career from the ground floor AND you're willing to send his ass packing the moment he returns to his old form.

Yup! :goodpost:

GP
03-12-2009, 11:03 AM
It's funny you bring up Ricky Williams because I feel that if Adam Jones wants to ressurrect his career, he should take Ricky's approach. Go play in The CFL, show that you mean business about playing football and then make your way back on an NFL team. Then when you get there, shut up, straighten up and play.

Why does it have to be the CFL? Just curious.

Other players have salvaged their careers by staying in the NFL.

Look, this is probably a lost cause anyways. There's no way the Texans would ever take on PacMan after the things that he's been involved with. The residue off of those incidents is too much for this team's image.

infantrycak
03-12-2009, 11:04 AM
Pac Man means it... for now. Still, I would not have a problem with the Texans taking the chance (but I know they won't) provided that they cut him without hesitation the moment he got arrested for urinating on a hooker he just beat up for stealing his weed in the back of a casino.

Yup, and there are some false arguments in here. If you sign him you don't cut Bennett or Molden, you cut the 5th or 6th CB on the roster.

Grams
03-12-2009, 11:10 AM
People make mistakes. Young men out of college with money make mistakes.
After a couple of times with being in trouble, the vast majority of people learn from these mistakes and get their head on straight.

There are the few that after a while you realize will never get their head on straight.
Adam "Pacman" Jones is one of these. If he has not learned by now, he never will. I would not like to see anyone in the NFL pay him to play for their team - even for the league minimum.

I am all for second and even third chances, but when it rounds out to an even dozen, it is time to stop. He needs a lifetime ban from the NFL.

And anyone who wants to give him another chance, needs their heads examined - IMHO

The Pencil Neck
03-12-2009, 11:18 AM
Yup, and there are some false arguments in here. If you sign him you don't cut Bennett or Molden, you cut the 5th or 6th CB on the roster.

PacMan Jones or Petey Faggins.

You make the choice.

dtran04
03-12-2009, 11:34 AM
According to PFT, Pacman was "making it rain" at a birthday party. He mistakened it for a strip club.

pbat488
03-12-2009, 11:41 AM
Though I agree that I wouldn't want him on our team due to his image, I don't agree with how players off the field issues are affecting things on the field.

It's more than just football where I see this, especially in basketball and in baseball as well, were for some reason over the past 10 years or so, people have become so obsessed with what players do off the field, that it takes away from what they do on the field. It seems like we don't understand that these gifted athletes are fallible as well, and make some damn stupid decisions from time to time, and if it's a repeatable thing like PacMan, then you gotta trim the fat. But some of the punishments or blackballing that happens to some players just seems a little out of hand to me.

Take Tank Johnson for example, he's from Gary, IN, one of the most crime-ridden cities in the U.S., and when he is carrying a gun around for his own protection, it's just him trying to protect himself and because of who he is and where he is from. I would most likely do the same thing. Granted, he put himself in that position by going out to nightclubs, but still, if you were in his position, would you want to go out and have some fun, or would you want to stay home and workout or watch TV or whatever the hell he'd do? Also, I know he has had subsequent charges after this incident, but isn't there a chance that his reputation that he got after this incident helped fuel those other ones so that a small thing like the speeding ticket he got that finally made the Bears cut him seemed like a huge problem?

I know these athletes are held to a higher standard because they are supposed to be role models to kids, but why can't the John Elway and Brett Favre types be the role models, and let PacMan be PacMan or O.J. be O.J. We're not going to change who they are, it's how they grew up and what they know, and it seems like the media just doesn't understand it.

Finally, I know that this matter has so many intricacies that every case is different and should be looked at so, but just the overall scrutiny to what professional athletes do in their own time and then the publics' reaction seem unfair and unjust to me.

Oh well, just my two cents.

GP
03-12-2009, 11:43 AM
Yup, and there are some false arguments in here. If you sign him you don't cut Bennett or Molden, you cut the 5th or 6th CB on the roster.

That's right.

Like I said earlier: Jacques Reeves...or PacMan Jones?

Faggins...or Jones?

A lot of people, I think, are mad at what he's done. And I "get that," I really do. But there are 31 other teams in the NFL (Well, make that about 29) who might take a chance on the guy, especially at a league minimum.

I forgot we were so stacked on defense that we don't need to take every angle that presents itself.

If he gets it straightened out, and he gets back to that form that he had his first season or two, and he's still off the police blotter(s)...there was an opportunity missed to make our defense and special teams better.

If we signed him and he has that wandering feeling (he's not putting in extra hours, he's having Jacoby show him the sites in Houston, he's hard to handle by the coaches and teammates) then you waive him.

I'd rather take a chance on him than T.O. For all that has happened with PacMan, there's still something there that you can see that he's going to come around at some point. Just by hanging out with certain guys is what has landed him in a lot of hot water. After awhile, even the dimmest bulb has the light flicker on long enough to see the furniture in the room.

Just sayin'...

TEXANRED
03-12-2009, 11:43 AM
There's that guy named Jacques Reeves. Is Jacques Reeves better than PacMan?



In a word? Yes.

TEXANRED
03-12-2009, 11:45 AM
That's right.

Like I said earlier: Jacques Reeves...or PacMan Jones?

Faggins...or Jones?

A lot of people, I think, are mad at what he's done. And I "get that," I really do. But there are 31 other teams in the NFL (Well, make that about 29) who might take a chance on the guy, especially at a league minimum.

I forgot we were so stacked on defense that we don't need to take every angle that presents itself.

If he gets it straightened out, and he gets back to that form that he had his first season or two, and he's still off the police blotter(s)...there was an opportunity missed to make our defense and special teams better.

If we signed him and he has that wandering feeling (he's not putting in extra hours, he's having Jacoby show him the sites in Houston, he's hard to handle by the coaches and teammates) then you waive him.

I'd rather take a chance on him than T.O. For all that has happened with PacMan, there's still something there that you can see that he's going to come around at some point. Just by hanging out with certain guys is what has landed him in a lot of hot water. After awhile, even the dimmest bulb has the light flicker on long enough to see the furniture in the room.

Just sayin'...

What has pacman ever done in this league? With the exception of returning a punt to beat the Texans.

Nothing.

Squat.

Nadda.

Zilch.

GP
03-12-2009, 11:47 AM
In a word? Yes.

That's nowhere near being the truth.

If that's the case, then I don't want to see anymore bad-mouthing of Jacques Reeves when he gets beat or didn't throw his hand back behind his head just at the right time to luckily swat the ball away. All the "Cut Reeves from the team NOW!" threads need to stop, if that's the case.

Seriously, there's better arguments than "Reeves is better than Jones."

For the league minimum, on a defense that IMO is a little soft in the secondary, he's OK to take a chance on. Give him no slack, waive him if he even cracks a joke about a strip club.

TEXANRED
03-12-2009, 11:55 AM
That's nowhere near being the truth.

If that's the case, then I don't want to see anymore bad-mouthing of Jacques Reeves when he gets beat or didn't throw his hand back behind his head just at the right time to luckily swat the ball away. All the "Cut Reeves from the team NOW!" threads need to stop, if that's the case.

Seriously, there's better arguments than "Reeves is better than Jones."

For the league minimum, on a defense that IMO is a little soft in the secondary, he's OK to take a chance on. Give him no slack, waive him if he even cracks a joke about a strip club.

Not only is Reeves better than Jones but he is also better than Bennett, Faggins, and Moldin.

GP
03-12-2009, 12:04 PM
Not only is Reeves better than Jones but he is also better than Bennett, Faggins, and Moldin.

Better than Bennett?

I'm trying to be nice... :spit:

HOU-TEX
03-12-2009, 12:12 PM
Good grief! This off-season's going to suck if we're seeing crap like this already. :gun:

HoustonFrog
03-12-2009, 12:18 PM
Guys who have real problems say this sort of thing 8-10 times before people realize that they're just saying what they know the man wants to hear. I'm sure somewhere that Art Schlichter is telling someone right now about his inner demons and how he's going to do it all right this time because he's finally learned his lesson.

Pac Man means it... for now. Still, I would not have a problem with the Texans taking the chance (but I know they won't) provided that they cut him without hesitation the moment he got arrested for urinating on a hooker he just beat up for stealing his weed in the back of a casino.

I often advocate that the Texans look at guys who have had troubled pasts and I'm always told by someone that I must want the Texans to become like the Raiders or Crackboys or Bungles and just become a characterless team of thugs. Nothing could be further from the truth. I think the team should be willing to try guys who have had problems, not try them out and tolerate them at any cost. Giving Pac Man a chance would be one thing and arguably could be considered the right thing to do IF he's willing to rebuild his career from the ground floor AND you're willing to send his ass packing the moment he returns to his old form.

Your last statement is exactly why I don't get alot of the criticism of teams like Dallas. It's not like their goal is to become a haven for criminals...despite jokes, etc. I, personally, don't like some of the guys brought in and that is my main problem. They mess with chemistry. BUT sometimes, with minimal effect, you can take a shot and see if a guy changed. Take for example Charles Haley. Freak of a guy. Trouble with the 49ers but he sure did put Dallas' D over the top and he never really got in trouble....just seemed to whip his member out alot. Tank Johnson. I never had a problem with him because I found his his legal problems to be more technical with gun licenses, etc. But he sucked and in the end was lazy. PacMan, I never wanted. His problem was he ended up being a bad player. He should have been gone after one strike. But I wasn't upset at the team about what they had to do to get him...which was nothing. So I'm with you and my theory on any of these guys is that you bring them in for nothing, you give them incentive contracts and they should be gone after they screw up. That is my problem with Jerry Jones at times..he actually will give them more than a second chance and won't cut the cord. Overall there is a difference in a persons character and what has transpired in life than just having a history of being a knucklehead where you look past it and ignore it.

On the exact topic...I still don't bring this guy is just because I think his skills have diminished quickly.

GP
03-12-2009, 12:29 PM
Your last statement is exactly why I don't get alot of the criticism of teams like Dallas. It's not like their goal is to become a haven for criminals...despite jokes, etc. I, personally, don't like some of the guys brought in and that is my main problem. They mess with chemistry. BUT sometimes, with minimal effect, you can take a shot and see if a guy changed. Take for example Charles Haley. Freak of a guy. Trouble with the 49ers but he sure did put Dallas' D over the top and he never really got in trouble....just seemed to whip his member out alot. Tank Johnson. I never had a problem with him because I found his his legal problems to be more technical with gun licenses, etc. But he sucked and in the end was lazy. PacMan, I never wanted. His problems was he ended up being a bad player. He should have been gone after one strike. But I wasn't upset at the team about what they had to do to get him...which was nothing. So I'm with you and my theory on any of these guys is that you bring them in for nothing, you give them incentive contracts and they should be gone after they screw up. That is my problem with Jerry Jones at times..he actually will give them more than a second chance and won't cut the cord. Overall there is a difference in a persons character and what has transpired in life than just having a history of being a knucklehead where you look past it and ignore it.

On the exact topic...I still don't bring this guy is just because I think his skills have diminished quickly.

And that's where i wonder if his head was so "gone" at that time, to the point that he was scared or hesistant or just out-to-lunch because of all that was going on.

In short: Maybe he just wasn't a fit in Dallas. That's a hard place to fit into, especially when you are trying to NOT make a mistake. I mean that in the sense of the awe that players have for Dallas, the platform you're on (no pun intended, no pole included) with Dallas, etc.

In short (again): Getting cut from the Cowboys might have been the final jolt he needed. And now he has NOTHING but football. Now he truly understands that his time is almost up.

I just am baffled at how T.O. gets a fourth new team so quickly after the sociopathic behavior that he willingly uses to destroy the inner-harmony of the TEAM he's on. PacMan goes out and parties. T.O. makes it a point to destroy the team and certain people on it.

Just a bit confusing.

Grams
03-12-2009, 12:37 PM
Pacman goes out an parties and people endup in wheelchairs the rest of their life.

TEXANRED
03-12-2009, 12:46 PM
Better than Bennett?

I'm trying to be nice... :spit:

Yes, Bennett. The guy who lost his starting spot to Faggins and gives the 10 yard cushion to receivers. That guy.

Texanmike02
03-12-2009, 01:32 PM
Guys who have real problems say this sort of thing 8-10 times before people realize that they're just saying what they know the man wants to hear. I'm sure somewhere that Art Schlichter is telling someone right now about his inner demons and how he's going to do it all right this time because he's finally learned his lesson.

Pac Man means it... for now. Still, I would not have a problem with the Texans taking the chance (but I know they won't) provided that they cut him without hesitation the moment he got arrested for urinating on a hooker he just beat up for stealing his weed in the back of a casino.

I often advocate that the Texans look at guys who have had troubled pasts and I'm always told by someone that I must want the Texans to become like the Raiders or Crackboys or Bungles and just become a characterless team of thugs. Nothing could be further from the truth. I think the team should be willing to try guys who have had problems, not try them out and tolerate them at any cost. Giving Pac Man a chance would be one thing and arguably could be considered the right thing to do IF he's willing to rebuild his career from the ground floor AND you're willing to send his ass packing the moment he returns to his old form.

So much for the notion that Pacman has grown up.

In response to our item regarding whether the oft-troubled cornerback has changed his life, a league source tells us that, in many respects, he’s still the same guy.

Jones recently attended former teammate Marcus Spears’ birthday party, which was held at Buddha 9 in Dallas. (To illustrate just how far the mighty have fallen, Jones didn’t even make the publicized list of confirmed guests.)

According to the source, “Jones made it rain with dollar bills.”

Said the source: “All the other players there thought he was a complete ***** for doing it. It was a upscale bar/restaurant and he acted like it was a cheap Atlanta strip club. So, no, he hasn’t grown up.”


http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/03/12/pacman-still-making-it-rain/#comments

I'm not saying whether we should or shouldn't give him a second chance. I'm just saying this is ridiculous. Actually I am saying I'm NOT in favor of giving him a chance. He's now been out of football more than he's been in football over the last three years. Sure he can come in and amaze you, then just when you start to think you're safe at that position, and don't draft the guy you should because "Pac-man" has "grown up" he goes and does something stupid. We're not talking about a one time offender. We're not talking about a mistake. The definition of stupidity is making the same mistake and expecting different results. Guess what. This guy is stupid. He MIGHT be the Jeff George of CB's. Million dollar body, 10 cent head. I'll pass.

Mike

disaacks3
03-12-2009, 01:41 PM
Jones recently attended former teammate Marcus Spears’ birthday party, which was held at Buddha 9 in Dallas. (To illustrate just how far the mighty have fallen, Jones didn’t even make the publicized list of confirmed guests.)

According to the source, “Jones made it rain with dollar bills.”

Said the source: “All the other players there thought he was a complete ***** for doing it. It was a upscale bar/restaurant and he acted like it was a cheap Atlanta strip club. So, no, he hasn’t grown up.” [

Not to defend Pac-Man, but Buddha 9 advertises 3 "seductive level of entertainment" and "go-go dancers" three night a week. This is NOT a Ruth's Chris we're talking about here.

GP
03-12-2009, 07:20 PM
Nobody was injured. I'd say it was a step in the right direction.

Baby steps...

TimeKiller
03-12-2009, 07:41 PM
Worst.

League-minimum signing.

EVER.

I'll be glad as hell to hear "Pacman" isn't in strip clubs ordering hits and such but as far as someone who deserves to have the kind of luxury in life being a professional athlete affords, I'd say Pacman is somewhere between an uninsured driver and people who cut in line.

Bulluck53
03-12-2009, 08:25 PM
If he hadn't ever been suspended I have no doubt he would be one of the best corners in the league right now. The guy has skills, don't see how anyone can doubt that.

It's an incredible waste of talent but for the right price, right mindset and a little time he may be able to get close to where his potential says he could be.

Dapper
03-12-2009, 08:29 PM
if he were to come in and do a media blitz showing the softer side of pac-man........i'd give him a chance to earn a spot on the roster.... for the league minimum

Grams
03-12-2009, 10:25 PM
With all the trouble he has been in, if he does not have the right mindset now, he never will.

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink. Some people never learn. Pacman is one of those. Don't waste any time or effort trying to change him.

dalemurphy
03-13-2009, 12:29 AM
Better than Bennett?

I'm trying to be nice... :spit:


The coaches think so, since he started over him all season.

GP
03-13-2009, 11:47 AM
The coaches think so, since he started over him all season.

Meaning defensive coordinator Richard Smith, and/or his positional coach.

Makes sense.

TEXANRED
03-13-2009, 11:50 AM
Meaning defensive coordinator Richard Smith, and/or his positional coach.

Makes sense.

Lets see how Bennett plays this season. Last season he played out of position, gave too much of a cushion, and was out played by Faggins.

As you said, baby steps.

GP
03-13-2009, 11:59 AM
Lets see how Bennett plays this season. Last season he played out of position, gave too much of a cushion, and was out played by Faggins.

As you said, baby steps.

Go back and find times when there was ANY of our CBs who jammed a receiver at the line. IIRC, pretty much every CB on every play was giving at least a 5-yard cushion, of not 10. There was the rare moment when we would press, but it was definitely the exception and not the rule. I don't have a perfect memory, but I do recall that our CBs all (all of them) were giving too much cushion. Jacques, bless his heart, was lucky on a lot of plays.

You guys have already forgotten that Richard Smith's philosophy was a non-aggressive, bend-but-don't-break, read and react style of defense. It wasn't just the DL that had to do that.

Bennett is a superior athlete to Reeves, period. That defense was so messed up, I don't think anybody here can say anything until about week 4 or 5 of this season. I don't even think Okoye can be measured accurately due to how they had him holding the line and moving side-to-side to "contain" LOL.

If I had to choose between Bennett and Reeves, I'm choosing Bennett. I'll let other people (here) choose Reeves since that's who the fired coaches went with.

TEXANRED
03-13-2009, 12:13 PM
Bennett is a superior athlete to Reeves, period. That defense was so messed up, I don't think anybody here can say anything until about week 4 or 5 of this season. I don't even think Okoye can be measured accurately due to how they had him holding the line and moving side-to-side to "contain" LOL.



How can you say the Bennett is a superior athlete? Bennett is slower in everyway, straight ahead speed, break speed, back pedal, and recovery time.

I have never seen Bennett stick to a receiver the way Reeves does.

The only thing Reeves lacks in his game is he was unable to turn his head and run.

badboy
03-13-2009, 12:46 PM
Oh, I'm going to stir the pot on this one...BIG TIME.

Just my way of tossing some gasoline on this pile of dried up threads.

Kubiak loves to grab the guy who has potential, but the timing has to be right. He passed on even CONSIDERING a visit for Benson last season, and then had the guy in for a visit (and nearly signed him to a nice offer). That's a pretty big turn around from laughing off the mere thought of Benson to almost signing the guy.

Having said that, here we go...

PacMan Jones. Defensive back AND punt return specialist who has tortured us in the past. He might not be a true one-on-one cover man anymore, but I can see him playing safety...roaming the field and dashing into a deep pass play for the interception.

Glazer has a great column about PacMan on foxsports.com, and it looks like PacMan has finally figured out that he blew his chance. He says he will play for THE LEAGUE MINIMUM for a few years if that's what it takes. He's engaged to be married. He wants no part of strip clubs. He says he's done hanging out with certain people. The shine wore off the party-animal lifestyle, which happens at different points for all people.

Here is a great excerpt from the story (http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/9321684/No-longer-sure-how-to-feel-about-Pacman):



League minimum? Sign him up. Cut him if he needs to be cut.

Pretty freaking simple if you ask me. Regardless of what you think about him, it still remains that we need talent on defense. And he's easily the replacement of JJ on special teams.

Let the rage commence. :heart:I think your view of Kubes on the Benson matter is a little off. A lot of difference in offering the player coming off a season of some success this year than where Benson was a season before. As for PacMan NO!

ObsiWan
03-13-2009, 12:51 PM
Pac Man means it... for now. Still, I would not have a problem with the Texans taking the chance (but I know they won't) provided that they cut him without hesitation the moment he got arrested for urinating on a hooker he just beat up for stealing his weed in the back of a casino.
hmmmm... been playing a little too much Grand Theft Auto haven't we
:D

I often advocate that the Texans look at guys who have had troubled pasts and I'm always told by someone that I must want the Texans to become like the Raiders or Crackboys or Bungles and just become a characterless team of thugs. Nothing could be further from the truth. I think the team should be willing to try guys who have had problems, not try them out and tolerate them at any cost. Giving Pac Man a chance would be one thing and arguably could be considered the right thing to do IF he's willing to rebuild his career from the ground floor AND you're willing to send his ass packing the moment he returns to his old form.

If I were going to give any suspect guy a second chance, it would be Tank Johnson, not PacMan Jones. At least Tank has kept his nose clean since he got another chance in Dallas. And I think the last item that got him released from the Bears - a speeding ticket (40 in a 25 zone) in the middle of the night while coming from visiting kinfolks - was proved bogus.

Ole Miss Texan
03-13-2009, 12:51 PM
Adam "Pacman" Jones:

2005- So here's a guy that was on probabation at West Virginia because of fighting. Decided to forego his senior year and enter the draft as a junior. He was the 1st defensive player taken in the '05 draft.

Immediately after getting drafted, he had several off field incidencts (assault & felony vandalism at a nightclub, got in a verbal altercation at a sports luncheon 2 months later and failed to meet his probation requirements). That had Titans' management concerned. Contract negotiations were a hassle and he missed most of his rookie training camp.

In early 2006 he had a subpoena for felony and misdemeanor obstruction of justice charges for an incident outside a home. The charges of marijuana possession were dismissed. Later in '06, he was arrested for disorderly conduct and public intoxication. Allegedly spat on a female's face and refused to leave when officer's told him to. A judge granted him 6 months of probation on the conditions he stay out of more trouble and away from the nightclub. 2 months later, he was cited for misdemeanor assault for spitting on a female college student at a nightclub. Titans suspended him for one game.

He then had several more off field issues early in 2007. He was stopped on the highway while speeding in a Cadillac he bought from a police auction. The police had seized the car, which had "Pacman" stitched on the headrests in a Cocaine bust. The car wasn't registered in his name at the time but Pacman told reporters he had loaned the car to a friend. Jones was also questioned by police for an Atlanta nightclub shooting that evidently envolved pacman's entourage- pacman was not present and was not charged with anything. Then there was also the a fight and shooting at a Vegas strip club where Pacman was to face two felonies but he accepted a plea deal. Titan's management spent a lot of time with Jones trying to get him on the right track. Then before the '07 draft, Goodell handed down a 1 year suspension to Jones. Pacman took out a full page add in the newspaper apologizing to fans and saying that he was a changed man and would "do everything in his power to regain their trust and respect." He was evaluated after 10 games and Goodell chose to keep the suspension in place and not reinstate him. It was reported that if Jones was reinstated, the Titans would try to trade him.

2008- Jones was accused of hitting a woman in an Atlanta nightclub. The Titans then traded him to the Cowboys in a deal that pretty much favored Dallas but Tennessee was wanting to get rid of him. He was reinstated for the '08 season and began practicing with the Cowboys. Then, during the season he had a fight with his bodyguard and was suspended for 6 games. He was then released immediately after the season when the Cowboys found out he was a suspect in a shooting at an Atlanta strip club in '07 (allegedly ordering the shooting).

2009- Now he is reportedly a "changed man" all of a sudden.


Did I miss anything? :gun: Please tell me how this would be categorized as a "2nd chance". Puhleese.

infantrycak
03-13-2009, 02:33 PM
Bennett is a superior athlete to Reeves, period.

I can see an argument on who is the better CB and who has better football instincts, but on the above--no way. Reeves is clearly the more athletic guy. He was often on guys like white on rice but then didn't have the awareness to make the play.

Polo
03-13-2009, 02:35 PM
Yeah...Reeves is a very athletic guy...

Bennett reminds me of gumby sometimes with the way he moves...

El Tejano
03-13-2009, 02:36 PM
I can see an argument on who is the better CB and who has better football instincts, but on the above--no way. Reeves is clearly the more athletic guy. He was often on guys like white on rice but then didn't have the awareness to make the play.

Doesn't that mean athleticism?

The Pencil Neck
03-13-2009, 02:45 PM
Doesn't that mean athleticism?

No.

Athleticism is the ability to run fast, jump high, and change direction quickly.

Awareness is the ability to locate the ball. It's more of an intelligence/perception thing.

Reeves has great athleticism but crap awareness.

DBCooper
03-13-2009, 03:38 PM
No way!

Pac-thug is completely overated.

Big Lou
03-20-2009, 04:52 PM
According to PFT, Pacman was "making it rain" at a birthday party. He mistakened it for a strip club.

I live in Vegas and when I go to strip club the ladies love it because I started my own trend. I take a bag full of rolls of nickels and when a couple of hotties take the stage I break open a roll of nickels and I throw them in the air. I call it making it hail, and ever since the recession started the girls love it!!!!!

Just kidding, I don't make it "hail", nor do I visit strip clubs. Alos my lawyer advised that also state that I don't have my homies shoot people in strip clubs either. Sorry for the Non-Texans related post, but I couldn't really take it very seriously to begin with.

Was the thread title in reference to a Michael Scott on the office, or was it a typo?????

threetoedpete
03-21-2009, 04:17 AM
Well one thing about it, Pac Man wouldn't be bored here. Plenty of boobie bars in Houston.

I think they like thier coners...and their safetys....even if the board does not.

:thinking:

got four pages out of it....good job.

GP
03-22-2009, 05:43 PM
I live in Vegas and when I go to strip club the ladies love it because I started my own trend. I take a bag full of rolls of nickels and when a couple of hotties take the stage I break open a roll of nickels and I throw them in the air. I call it making it hail, and ever since the recession started the girls love it!!!!!

Just kidding, I don't make it "hail", nor do I visit strip clubs. Alos my lawyer advised that also state that I don't have my homies shoot people in strip clubs either. Sorry for the Non-Texans related post, but I couldn't really take it very seriously to begin with.

Was the thread title in reference to a Michael Scott on the office, or was it a typo?????

It was supposed to be "mind bottling" which is a play on the actual phrase "mind boggling," as used by Will Ferrell in the movie Blades of Glory, but I freaking typed too fast and, well...you can't change the thread title even if you're the one who started it.

I would ask the mods to change it, but I think they (a) have been waiting for me to beg them to change it, (b) wouldn't change it anyway, and (c) get a good chuckle every time one of you makes reference to it.

Respectable, honorable mods would have changed it by now. :shades:

:sarcasm:

ObsiWan
03-22-2009, 07:23 PM
I would ask the mods to change it, but I think they (a) have been waiting for me to beg them to change it, (b) wouldn't change it anyway, and (c) get a good chuckle every time one of you makes reference to it.

Respectable, honorable mods would have changed it by now. :shades:

:sarcasm:

I told you dude, bribes...
its the way capitalism works

Hardcore Texan
03-22-2009, 09:00 PM
I can see an argument on who is the better CB and who has better football instincts, but on the above--no way. Reeves is clearly the more athletic guy. He was often on guys like white on rice but then didn't have the awareness to make the play.

Yeah...Reeves is a very athletic guy...

Bennett reminds me of gumby sometimes with the way he moves...

No.

Athleticism is the ability to run fast, jump high, and change direction quickly.

Awareness is the ability to locate the ball. It's more of an intelligence/perception thing.

Reeves has great athleticism but crap awareness.

Agree on all counts, Reeves has better atheletism period.