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View Full Version : AFC South Shamockery


beerlover
03-02-2009, 01:58 AM
It should be simple to figure out at least a 1st rd. AFC South Mock Draft but it isn't. as we've seen in only three days some teams have been quite aggressive while others stand pat....waiting on the sidelines.

so whats really changed? the Titans lost Haynesworth, that kinda sticks out in my mind plus they resigned Kerry Collins. the Colts have parted ways with Marvin Harrison. while the Jaguars have done nothing except release players like former #1 pick Reggie Williams & starting LT Khalif Barnes roaming FA market. meanwhile Texans have aquired a starting LDE to complement Mario & extra 4th rd. pick by trading Sage Rosenfels then found his replacement Dan Orlovsky.

so lets just simplfy the AFC South 1st rd. picks.

Jags will get the 1st pick since they had such an outstanding season, then Texans, Colts & Titans.

#8 Jacksonville - Andre Smith, LT/OG they will use him to fill the void left by Barnes, this would signal that Rio wants to ball control with running game as feature weapon, so they go LT in 1st then maybe a RB like Donald Brown in the 2nd to replace Fred Jones.

#15 Houston - Larry English, DE/SLB Texans now have luxury to develop what seems to be a very talented natural pass rusher who has enough length combined with smooth fluid hips to back peddle in coverage from SLB position. I know people here love Mathews & thats fine, but English flashes tremedous upside just needs to work hard, we'll see if he gets a personel invite to come workout @ Relient, just don't be surprised if he does.

#27 Indianapolis - Brian Robiskie, WR Very impressed with this young man, very intelligent should hit if off great with Manning who runs great routes has long speed & creates seperation.

#30 Tennessee - Evander Hood, DT Ascending inside presence with ability to pressure the QB. strong for his size 6-3 300 & very cat like quick with high motor. could also go WR but this tackle class does not have much depth so unless the can pick up somebody in free agnecy they could be forced to address DT need early.

dsorc
03-02-2009, 08:16 AM
I wouldn't be so sure about any of those picks.

Jacksonville - Andre Smith is most likely the worst case scenario for them. Smith profiles to be a much better fit at RT than at LT since he is better run blocker than pass blocker. Their dream scenario would be for Jason Smith to drop to them. If not, I think they would pick Oher over A. Smith specially after the combine debacle.

Houston - Larry English could play SLB in a 3-4 but I'm not so sure he can do so in a 4-3. My gut feeling is that we will trade down and either pick Mathews or a SS (Moore or Chung) in the bottom of the first.

Indianapolis - Robiskie is not 1st round material as he is at best the 6th WR in the draft (Crabtree, Maclin, DHB, Britt, Nicks). Even then, the colts have Anthony Gonzalez ready to take over for Harrison right away. Instead, I see them grabbing a DT to try to fix their horrible run D.

Tennessee - Ziggy Hood is a round 2 talent. Plus Jason Jones did well enough in place of Haynesworth so DT is not that huge a need. I have to think that sooner or later they have to address their WR corps. If not I can see them going CB to groom a replacement for Nick Harper who is 35.

thunderkyss
03-02-2009, 09:36 AM
I'm no draft Guru, but I don't think Jax will be going LT. Not with the idea of starting him right away. They've got Charles Spencer, and may hit FA for a stop gap. I'm just saying, if I were Jax, I'd be more worried about replacing Fred Taylor. If the end up signing Derrick Ward, then I'd agree with the OT.

I'm all about Houston getting an OLB. But I'm hoping we draft a starting CB.

I too think Indy will be looking for a big ugly. Most likely OL, but I could see a DT.

& I bet Tennessee draft another RB in the first round. I'm not saying it makes sense, I'm just sayin

TimeKiller
03-02-2009, 10:01 AM
Kind of a miss from beerlover.

Larry English is a trade down scenario right? He's not really on the radar yet at 15 to me.

Indy goes line, O or D in 1st. Holes are too glaring.

Tenn enough defense without Fatty? Maybe but not enough to reach a whole round down to grab a guy.

beerlover
03-02-2009, 02:13 PM
actually your comments prove my point, "it should be easy but its not". its half frustration half being mocked out. its all just so silly yet here we are, back day after day like sheep to slaughter, glutteonous for punishment.

so here I go again defending the indefenseable (nobody knows for sure what will happen).

The combination of Andre Smith & Donald Brown would give Jacksonville an excellent 1-2 punch with Maruice Jones Drew as the change of pace. Del Rio want to dominate the LOS & pound the ball inside to open up the outside. I think this is far better than "worst case scenario for them".

Not many people have seen Larry English play but he is quietly become possibly the best pass rushing DE in the draft with the athletic abiltiy to cover & change directions to pursue. a very exciting, ascending talent that needs development time afforded with the signing of Antonio Smith. I also really like Sidbury, now projected in the 2nd.

I don't care or look to much at the rankings, I watch film & how players react under pressure in game situations or important workout interviews like the combine. Indy always seems a little different in their selections if you've noticed they really place a higher level on intelligence & character. I would assume alot of that is required to play with Manning but they've had outstanding results with players not thought 1st day or 1st rd. picks just look at Kelvin Hayden #60th pick in 05 just resigned to a big contract (not sure if it was more than the Texans offered Dunta, don't know but it raised awareness around the league). Bob Sanders 2nd rd. pick in 04 not too shabby....or more recently Joseph Addai #30 06 Anthony Gonzalez #32 07.

Ziggy Hood is pretty interesting too & probably the next DT off the board after Peria Jerry. really like his athletic first step, good use of hands, strong & can play mulitple positions which we all know to well needed in the 4-3. they must address losing Haynesworth early otherwise face the very early decline of a premier defense, something Jeff Fisher is famous for-

:twocents:

mussop
03-02-2009, 03:49 PM
actually your comments prove my point, "it should be easy but its not". its half frustration half being mocked out. its all just so silly yet here we are, back day after day like sheep to slaughter, glutteonous for punishment.

so here I go again defending the indefenseable (nobody knows for sure what will happen).

The combination of Andre Smith & Donald Brown would give Jacksonville an excellent 1-2 punch with Maruice Jones Drew as the change of pace. Del Rio want to dominate the LOS & pound the ball inside to open up the outside. I think this is far better than "worst case scenario for them".

Not many people have seen Larry English play but he is quietly become possibly the best pass rushing DE in the draft with the athletic abiltiy to cover & change directions to pursue. a very exciting, ascending talent that needs development time afforded with the signing of Antonio Smith. I also really like Sidbury, now projected in the 2nd.

I don't care or look to much at the rankings, I watch film & how players react under pressure in game situations or important workout interviews like the combine. Indy always seems a little different in their selections if you've noticed they really place a higher level on intelligence & character. I would assume alot of that is required to play with Manning but they've had outstanding results with players not thought 1st day or 1st rd. picks just look at Kelvin Hayden #60th pick in 05 just resigned to a big contract (not sure if it was more than the Texans offered Dunta, don't know but it raised awareness around the league). Bob Sanders 2nd rd. pick in 04 not too shabby....or more recently Joseph Addai #30 06 Anthony Gonzalez #32 07.

Ziggy Hood is pretty interesting too & probably the next DT off the board after Peria Jerry. really like his athletic first step, good use of hands, strong & can play mulitple positions which we all know to well needed in the 4-3. they must address losing Haynesworth early otherwise face the very early decline of a premier defense, something Jeff Fisher is famous for-

:twocents:

Actually I could see the Jags drafting Raji if available. Their D hasnt been the same since they traded Marcus Stroud.

English- I really have liked English for awhile now but I dont want to draft anyone in the first round (at 15) that isnt going to start right away. If we are going to go that route then lets trade down and get an extra pick.

I agree that Indy has their own way of drafting. Certain players in this draft seem like good fits to me. Chase Cofman TE, James Casey TE, Jarret Dillard WR, Max Unger C/G and Brian Robiskie WR Off the top of my head.

I cant imagine Tennessee not going WR with so many good ones available (assumption) with their pick. This really is a good WR group and eventually they have to add some good ones to their roster. Of course I said that last year to.

threetoedpete
03-04-2009, 12:26 AM
Well in terms of hitting the ground running....Robiskie is the best fit for the Colts. I know they'll be tempted for a Dt....but Manning is their bell cow soaking up all the cap. They rise and fall with their offense. His top end speed isn't the best. But neither was Harrison's the last three years. Wayne has been the number one up there for a while. Paying Robiskie at their slot makes a lot of sense.

I wonder how much the Colts front office covets Walter ?

MJD is a heavy runner. But he is still a little guy. He's at his best when he is on the second level banging on the safety's. I agree beer lover. One of the high end Tackles falls to them, they bang the guy. The running game is key for them. Glut of WR's and running backs on the board they can afford to shore up the o-line.

I can see the logic with Ziggy hood. they just lost Fat Albert....wouldn't you replace him with the best disruptive guy in the pile ?

If you like English, I like him too.

I think Ayers is a pipe dream at the 46 or what ever our second is. If they are hot for one of these first step guys....or in Ayers case a stack and shed guy with a first step....better bang him in the first.

What we know for a fact to day eight weeks out....

Maybin at 250 is pretty ordinary. He can't carry that much weight and be effective. At 235 he has the best first step in the class. No telling how far he falls now. Or which team will reach for him on the first day. Or when. another Erick Winston ?

threetoedpete
03-05-2009, 02:16 AM
Pretty interesting Mock.

Beerlover. I think he was tring to go against the herd.


http://www.nfl.com/combine/story?id=09000d5d80eea152&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true

beerlover
03-05-2009, 04:00 AM
Pretty interesting Mock.

Beerlover. I think he was tring to go against the herd.


http://www.nfl.com/combine/story?id=09000d5d80eea152&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true

If I had time to waste, I mean spend, mocking each division it would help even more gaining useful insight into each teams true desire & intentions based on sound supporting evidence. with whats flying around out there right now its easier for me to find ways to break it down,make it simplier & more understandable.

Free agency has had a huge impact in the Mock Drafting Buisness. Teams are addressing if at all possible their most pressing needs now so when the draft rolls around they'll be ready to select the bpa for what remains to be addressed. Classic example is the Texans who signed DE Antonio Smith. Its a mistake to think the Texans are finished addressing this need, its unfair to Smith because thats not his MO so people need to understand this, they also need to understand the Texans need to aquire an explosive first step kinda speed/power end rusher. that is why I have them taking Larry English. To seal the deal he can play SLB so he's an everydown player for this defense not just a situational pass rusher, does everybody understand the value this brings to the Texans?

you solidfy the DL with Smith, address with exclamation point the pass rush & added a physical outside linebacker to support Mario. this is the physcial, pressing defense Bush is talking about :)

beerlover
03-05-2009, 01:18 PM
heard some discussion this morning on 1560 Lance was saying its his understanding the Texans are committed & now set @ DE so will now pass on one even if a potential great fit is available. while I understand his (Texans) resoning I call bluff if a dynamic speed edge rusher is there they take him (Orakpo). or option to go with a SLB like English to bring more speed & pass rush skills from the outside. :cool:

mussop
03-05-2009, 05:15 PM
heard some discussion this morning on 1560 Lance was saying its his understanding the Texans are committed & now set @ DE so will now pass on one even if a potential great fit is available. while I understand his (Texans) resoning I call bluff if a dynamic speed edge rusher is there they take him (Orakpo). or option to go with a SLB like English to bring more speed & pass rush skills from the outside. :cool:

English may bean option if we believe he can play OLB in the 4/3.

beerlover
03-06-2009, 10:34 AM
still most pressing need is pass rusher. no reason why OLB cannot create immediate help even as a rookie if used like I think Bush could use a talent like English, a natural instinctive pass attacker. they can turn the DL loose & English would hit the edge, fill holes, track down backside whatever it takes to fill the role of playmaking skilled pass rushing OLB with DE body. just because the Texans play in a 4-3 does not mean they can't rush QB's like any 3-4 team he fits right in there with the Lawrence Timmons & Lamarr Woodley's of the NFL. By the way, how'd that draft work for the Steelers anyway :trophy: Timmons 1st rd. #15th overall/Woodley 2nd rd. #46th overall. in 2007. two years later SB.

The Texans should have a clean shot at this guy, transforming anemic pass rush into dynamic pressing aggressive style that wins championships :cool:

Ole Miss Texan
03-06-2009, 11:11 AM
heard some discussion this morning on 1560 Lance was saying its his understanding the Texans are committed & now set @ DE so will now pass on one even if a potential great fit is available. while I understand his (Texans) resoning I call bluff if a dynamic speed edge rusher is there they take him (Orakpo). or option to go with a SLB like English to bring more speed & pass rush skills from the outside. :cool:

That's such good news and I'm really glad to hear this! This means there is a zero % chance we reach on a guy strictly because of need. DE, in my mind, was the biggest priority of the offseason and they got it filled. I agree with you though, if there's an elite talent at DE that is there I think we could still take him. But this alleviates us having to worry on reaching for a guy like Michael Johnson at 15 (maybe).

While some may not like our moves thus far, I'm thrilled with our offseason up to this point.

Ole Miss Texan
03-06-2009, 11:21 AM
English is a guy that interests me. I absolutely love his explosion and closing speed. Like all the other guys, I don't know where he fits in at DE or LB and in what scheme. How did he do during the LB drills at the Combine? I would really really like a guy that could start at SLB for us and if needed move to the DE spot on passing downs...sliding A. Smith inside. I think that would be the best bang for our buck and fill 2 needs with one player. Can English do this?

beerlover
03-06-2009, 01:36 PM
English is a guy that interests me. I absolutely love his explosion and closing speed. Like all the other guys, I don't know where he fits in at DE or LB and in what scheme. How did he do during the LB drills at the Combine? I would really really like a guy that could start at SLB for us and if needed move to the DE spot on passing downs...sliding A. Smith inside. I think that would be the best bang for our buck and fill 2 needs with one player. Can English do this?

interesting question? could English be to Antonio Smith what Karlos Dansby was to him in Arizona?

I think the package fits but alternate roles. Dansby is leaner & excellent in coverage. remember when he came out of Auburn typical SEC type very athletic plays hungry. English comes from lesser competition & dominates it @ DE with similar hunger for sacks & game breaking defensive stops. watching him practice & in drills he makes instinctive moves using footwork, planting w/ability to change direction, very fluid hips that can drop & stay low keeping his weight centered & balanced. so to me at least all the attributes needed to project to OLB in a 4-3 package. we all talk of the really good ones who look the part, DeMeco, Willis, Mayo now Curry. the only difference between English & all these great LB's is his strength to post & go low inside from a three point stance. to me thats added value, but heck what do I know?

beerlover
03-09-2009, 12:34 PM
#8 Jacksonville - Andre Smith, LT/OG they will use him to fill the void left by Barnes, this would signal that Rio wants to ball control with running game as feature weapon, so they go LT in 1st then maybe a RB like Donald Brown in the 2nd to replace Fred Jones.

#15 Houston - Larry English, DE/SLB Texans now have luxury to develop what seems to be a very talented natural pass rusher who has enough length combined with smooth fluid hips to back peddle in coverage from SLB position. I know people here love Mathews & thats fine, but English flashes tremedous upside just needs to work hard, we'll see if he gets a personel invite to come workout @ Relient, just don't be surprised if he does.

#27 Indianapolis - Brian Robiskie, WR Very impressed with this young man, very intelligent should hit if off great with Manning who runs great routes has long speed & creates seperation.

#30 Tennessee - Evander Hood, DT Ascending inside presence with ability to pressure the QB. strong for his size 6-3 300 & very cat like quick with high motor. could also go WR but this tackle class does not have much depth so unless the can pick up somebody in free agnecy they could be forced to address DT need early.

Football Draft Analysis.com

8) Jacksonville Jaguars - *Andre Smith, OT, Alabama
The Jaguars really need a new LT to replace Khalif Barnes, so I think Smith gets
selected here. I know that his combine week didn't go as planned, but let's not
forget just how good this kid is.

honestly, this pick makes more sense than my own @ least from a value standpoint
15) Houston Texans - Peria Jerry, DT, Ole Miss
If the Texans are able to land Jerry here, they'd have one of the best starting
DT tandems in the NFL by pairing him with Okoye. Jerry plays with great
functional strength and knows how to get into the backfield.

Bill Polian discussed WR @ combine & gave glowing review of Brian Robiskie, just saying.
27) Indianapolis Colts - *Darrius Heyward-Bey, WR, Maryland
The Colts need to find an eventual replacement for all-everything Marvin
Harrison. DHB did not post 1st-Round numbers in college, but the kid has track
speed and it was clear at the combine.

I hope they go WR instead of defense from a Texan standpoint.
30) Tennessee Titans - Evander Hood, DT, Missouri
Hood has increased his stock as much as an DT out there this off season.
Blessed with great strength and drive, this kid could help fill the void left by
Haynesworth. Even though they signed Jovan Haye, I still think a DT works
here.

ChampionTexan
03-09-2009, 01:24 PM
honestly, this pick makes more sense than my own @ least from a value standpoint
15) Houston Texans - Peria Jerry, DT, Ole Miss
If the Texans are able to land Jerry here, they'd have one of the best starting
DT tandems in the NFL by pairing him with Okoye. Jerry plays with great
functional strength and knows how to get into the backfield.



I'm far from a draftnik, but I competely concur.

The DE need clearly decreased with the signing of Smith, and while it's been said ad nauseum (although correctly) that we still need a pass rusher, I don't see them going that direction in round 1. The coaching staff has been pretty upfront about liking the LB trio of Diles/Ryans/Adibi, and although there's some health concerns, I think they expect Diles to be 100% by the start of TC, and are probably more than willing to give Adibi an off-season of strength and conditioning training before making any negative assumption about his durability. There's just lots of reasons to doubt they're going to even consider a safety in the first round, and with Dunta, Reeves, Molden and Bennett, I just don't see them going CB unless they genuinely believe that Dunta's gone after '09 (and I don't see them conceding that point any time soon). These observations are made based on my perception of what Kubiak and Smith feel our needs are, not any attempt of mine to evaluate our existing talent. One thing about Kubiak is that when he says things like Walters or Diles should get more playing time (or Barber will be the starting safety, or he likes the starting 5 he's got on the O-Line), he's saying it because he genuinely believes it.

That leaves DT, and the current starting tandem of TJ and Amobi. With TJ, you probably have what you're going to get after four years in the league, plus he's a FA after 2009, so it's a crapshoot at best. You clearly don't give up on Amobi after only two years in the league, but you've got to recognize that between another year to mature both mentally and physically, and another coach to attempt to tap his potential, a sub-par 2009 for Amobi would be very difficult to rationalize away.

In the perhaps unlikely event that Jerry's gone (and given that it's a pipedream to think Raji might be around), I don't see another DT worth a first round pick, much less a #15 pick, so maybe it doesn't work out in this draft. But when I try to envision what our "Brain-trust" views as our most compelling needs, it just seems like that's going to end up being interior D-Linemen, and if Jerry is available at 15, it also seems to me they'd be pretty happy with him.

The Pencil Neck
03-09-2009, 01:42 PM
I wrote up a long reply and deleted it.

The bottom line is: this is really the best position this team has ever been in going into a draft. We really could go a lot of different ways and we really could choose to go BPA this time around. A lot of the guys we're choosing this time around don't need to be pushed into the starting line up as soon as possible.

Ole Miss Texan
03-09-2009, 01:45 PM
If Smith deemed Jerry to be BPA, I wouldn't have a problem with it. I have serveral competing thoughts when it comes to our DL and Jerry.

1. I'd love a NT like Raji that can stop the run AND penetrate into the backfield. Pipedream yes.
2. With Kollar as the new DL coach, I feel like he may be able to get more out of our players in his "style" of play. I do actually like the rotation of our DL players as it is now.
3. With #2 said, I can see Smith obviously going with a "D" player to help Kollar and Bush out and succeed. If Kollar says the kids great, I don't see why he can't be the pick. We all know how important our DL is to our current regime.
4. I think Jerry's run stopping ability is underrated by most of the people on the internet. He gets compared to Amobi a lot, with good reason...they are similar, but they are not the exact same. If we're sending our DL every single time into the backfield: Mario, Amobi, Jerry... sheesh, that's going to be tough for the OL.
5. I read one scout's thoughts that I think Jerry has been misused in college. That he could actually be better if he slimmed down some and became a DE in the pros.
6. At least having this versatility on our team could be a good thing. We would be able to rotate guys in and out constantly or even just shuffle them along the line to create mismatches depending on opponents and the situation.

beerlover
03-09-2009, 02:00 PM
here's a question for y'all, would there be any teams willing to trade-up to get Peria Jerry if the Texans where willing to trade down?

The Pencil Neck
03-09-2009, 02:04 PM
here's a question for y'all, would there be any teams willing to trade-up to get Peria Jerry if the Texans where willing to trade down?

Colts or Buccs?