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Nawzer
02-02-2009, 06:26 PM
I was having a discussion with some friends last night during the game about some things you would like to see changed in the NFL. The game is pretty good (understatement) as is but there's always things here and there that people don't like. For example, my biggest gripe is the holding penalty. There's holding on virtually every play but some are called while others are overlooked. I don't have a problem with the rule per se, but I think penalizing 10 yards is a bit too much. I think 5 yards should be enough. I don't see why false starts are penalized less than a holding call. Also, why can't the NFL just do away with the extra point? Why isn't a touchdown worth 7 pts. instead of 6? I understand it gives the special team a chance to block that extra poin attempt, but what are the percentages? Anyway, fire away with your thoughts about things you would change.

bah007
02-02-2009, 06:59 PM
The only thing I want to see changed is pass interference. Everything else is great.

If I was in charge, the NFL would have two options:

1. Pass interference would be a 15 yard penalty max and a spot foul inside of 15 yards. There would be no automatic 1st down on a pass interference, holding, or illegal contact penalty against the defense.
Ex.- a PI on a 20 yard pass on 2nd & 16 would move to 2nd & 1.

OR

2. The rules for pass interference should be changed. Putting your hand on a guy's hip so you can turn to the ball without losing him should NOT be a penalty. There should be no penalty for face guarding unless you obviously impede the receiver (the rules for PI should be the same whether you are facing the receiver or not).

Speedy
02-02-2009, 07:26 PM
Also, why can't the NFL just do away with the extra point?

Because the extra point is like a reward for scoring a TD, a free throw so to speak.

I don't like messing with what works. Other than some ticky-tack stuff that's turning the game to touch football, there's nothing I'd change. The game works just the way it is, and works well.

Nawzer
02-02-2009, 07:42 PM
Because the extra point is like a reward for scoring a TD, a free throw so to speak.

I don't like messing with what works. Other than some ticky-tack stuff that's turning the game to touch football, there's nothing I'd change. The game works just the way it is, and works well.

I understand your logic there but I don't think I quite agree with the free throw analogy. Free throws are rewarded to a player who's been fouled. It's a reward for trying to score a basket but not given the proper opporutnity to do so. Just because you make a basket doesn't mean you get to shoot a free throw for "reward" unless it's a continuation. In my view, getting the six points awarded to your team for getting into the endzone IS the reward. Why should there be an additional point after that?

bah007
02-02-2009, 07:49 PM
I understand your logic there but I don't think I quite agree with the free throw analogy. Free throws are rewarded to a player who's been fouled. It's a reward for trying to score a basket but not given the proper opporutnity to do so. Just because you make a basket doesn't mean you get to shoot a free throw for "reward" unless it's a continuation. In my view, getting the six points awarded to your team for getting into the endzone IS the reward. Why should there be an additional point after that?

I'm not sure what your problem with the PAT is...

Do you think only TDs should count?

No more PATs, safeties, FGs...

Thorn
02-02-2009, 07:58 PM
If there was only the option of the kick for one point, I think I might agree with just doing away with it. But since you can go for two points (or the one) I think it should stay.

I also don't have a problem with the pass interference rules as they are, as far as the penalty goes. But I could see treating pass interference like face masking, giving the officials the option of a serious or minor infraction and basing the penalty in yardage on that.

I think on unsportsmanlike like conduct, the player guilty of it has to stay on the bench for 15 minutes of game time. Upon his second in the same game, he's ejected.

Speedy
02-02-2009, 08:08 PM
I understand your logic there but I don't think I quite agree with the free throw analogy. Free throws are rewarded to a player who's been fouled. It's a reward for trying to score a basket but not given the proper opporutnity to do so. Just because you make a basket doesn't mean you get to shoot a free throw for "reward" unless it's a continuation. In my view, getting the six points awarded to your team for getting into the endzone IS the reward. Why should there be an additional point after that?

OK, not a good analogy, but the extra point has been around since the beginning of the game, back to it's rugby roots when a TD was worth 1 point and the free kick was worth 4. 1912 is when they changed to the current points for TD and PAT's.

I just don't see why you want to change a rule that's been around since the beginning of time. There's nothing wrong with an extra point. Changing rules like pass interference or whatever is one thing, changing the structure of the game is another.

edo783
02-02-2009, 08:11 PM
The only thing I want to see changed is pass interference. Everything else is great.

If I was in charge, the NFL would have two options:

1. Pass interference would be a 15 yard penalty max and a spot foul inside of 15 yards. There would be no automatic 1st down on a pass interference, holding, or illegal contact penalty against the defense.
Ex.- a PI on a 20 yard pass on 2nd & 16 would move to 2nd & 1.

OR

2. The rules for pass interference should be changed. Putting your hand on a guy's hip so you can turn to the ball without losing him should NOT be a penalty. There should be no penalty for face guarding unless you obviously impede the receiver (the rules for PI should be the same whether you are facing the receiver or not).

OK, let me guess, you are/where a defensive player. LOL

bah007
02-02-2009, 08:15 PM
OK, let me guess, you are/where a defensive player. LOL

...I played cornerback.

I thought the rules were fine a few years ago, but then they started making it harder and harder for the defensive player.

Besides QB, CB is the hardest position on the field to play. And that gap is closing because of the rule changes.

Nawzer
02-02-2009, 08:16 PM
OK, not a good analogy, but the extra point has been around since the beginning of the game, back to it's rugby roots when a TD was worth 1 point and the free kick was worth 4. 1912 is when they changed to the current points for TD and PAT's.

I just don't see why you want to change a rule that's been around since the beginning of time. There's nothing wrong with an extra point. Changing rules like pass interference or whatever is one thing, changing the structure of the game is another.

I understand. I think if we're talking about reward, how about rewarding the team with that one point if they block it? I think that's a fair reward.

awtysst
02-02-2009, 08:22 PM
I would change the whole Challenge system. I would say that anything at all is up for a challenge. I say ANYTHING at all can be challenged. For example, the lack of a penalty could be challenged, the spot of a ball could be challenged, a ref making a mistake and calling a penalty that should not have been called also could be challenged. I say ANYTHING from the coin flip to the end of the game would be open to a potential challenge.

The thing is I would still say each coach gets 2 challenges and if they are successful they get an extra. If they are not successful they lose a time out. Therefore coaches need to be prudent in those challenges and make good ones.

Fox
02-02-2009, 08:43 PM
I would institute an OT system like they have in NCAA. I find that to be more exciting and it seems more fair to me.

Speedy
02-02-2009, 09:31 PM
I would institute an OT system like they have in NCAA. I find that to be more exciting and it seems more fair to me.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!

That isn't even football!!

Texaninlild
02-02-2009, 09:44 PM
I would institute an OT system like they have in NCAA. I find that to be more exciting and it seems more fair to me.

Exactly. I hate the OT in the NFL. The one thing the NCAA got right.

You do not mess with the point system in the NFL.

drewmar74
02-02-2009, 09:46 PM
All field goals are not created equal.

55 yards and up - 1 point.

40 - 55 yards out - 2 points.

chip shot to 40 yards - 3 points.

teams that get better field position get rewarded for their time and effort.

:tiphat:

The1ApplePie
02-03-2009, 12:32 AM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!

That isn't even football!!

Every level of football uses it except NFL

I'd say Rodger Goodell is what needs to be changed. He wants the whole NFL to play two-hand-touch or with flags

TexanSam
02-03-2009, 12:34 AM
I would change the overtime system. I'd make it similar to the one the NCAA uses but not exactly the same. Each team would get the ball at the 50 yard line instead of the 20.

I'd also get rid of so many TV timeouts. Gets annoying real quickly.

gunny
02-03-2009, 01:47 AM
Full time referees, the amount of costly mistake made this year has shown it is needed.

In regards to Overtime, I'd like to see a team get a chance to respond if scored against, though having kick off and all, not start at a certain place like in NCAA

BattleRedToro
02-03-2009, 07:26 AM
1) Move the Pro Bowl to the same city that is awarded the Super Bowl and play it on the weekend before the Super Bowl. Any players elected to the Pro Bowl that are on the Super Bowl teams would not play and alternates would take their places.

2) Consider either playing the Super Bowl on a Saturday instead of Sunday, or starting the game a little earlier on Sunday. For instance, actual kickoff was at 6:30 PM ET. Why not move it to 4:30 PM ET?

3) Overtime should be a normal full quarter, or become sudden death upon each team having 1 offensive possession. For instance, under the revised sudden death format, Team A wins the coin toss, receives and scores a FG, then Team B would receive the ball from a kickoff, just like normal. If Team B doesn't score, then game over Team A wins. If Team B scores a TD, then game over Team B wins. If Team B scores a FG, then overtime would continue but the next team to score would win.

4) I also agree with needing full time referees, and ...

5) coaches should be able to challenge more, as explained in previous posts.

Showtime100
02-03-2009, 07:29 AM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!

That isn't even football!!

I agree totally Speedy. I'm not sure, but I think it was you and I that had a discussion a few weeks ago about OT and how to make it better. I'll edit this post with a lick if I have time to find it later this morning, but I would much rather keep it the way it is (which if memory serves was your positition) than to institute a form of NCAA OT rules.

====================================

As for my :twocents: on the thread topic. I've always wondered why a safety, the accomplishment of forcing the opponent off a cliff if you will, is only worthy of two points. The problem then is how many points do you allow for forcing an opponent - against their will - into the endzone and once you've increased the reward for a safety do you still allow the team the caused the safety to get the ball back?

Well, if it weren't for the team scoring the safety getting the ball back I would hate the lack of points awarded for a safety, as it is I would still have the rule changed to a 4 point safety + the football back via a normal kickoff. That way you have your safety, 4 points, and the ball back, but if you get good field position after the kickoff it was due to good special teams and not because the spot of the kickoff was so deep in the opponent's territory.

In short: instead of 2 pts and a free kick at the 20, 4 pts and a normal kickoff to the team that scored the safety.

Please understand I haven't really thought this out as much as I would like, but thought I would throw it out there and see what you guys thought. If 4 pts and the ball sounds a little steep or radical, just think about how rare and radical a safety is. It would add impotance to a great punt inside the 5 as well.

Let the bashing begin, I need to make some coffee.

SheTexan
02-03-2009, 08:39 AM
:includeme: Just get back to old fashion smash mouth football! To touch on a couple things outside the game itself, I detest the "no celebration" rule. Hell, they've taken the FUN aspect of the game away from the players as well as the fans. Getting penalized for "intimidation" is just dumb! It's freaking FOOTBALL, it's suppose to be intimidating!! JMO.

No bells, NO whistles, NO horns, NO noise makers at all! Damn, whats a fan suppose to do it they have a bummed up hand and laryngitis (to lazy to look up the spelling:thinking:.)

TOOO many rules, PERIOD! I've gotten to where the first thing I look for after every damn play is a yellow flag. Sometimes I feel sorry for the zebra's. Must be hell having to remember all those rules.

gwallaia
02-03-2009, 08:58 AM
Award 10 points if the ball hits the uprights on a field goal attempt from more than 40 yards away. Its easy to kick it in all that empty space between the uprights, its much much more difficult to hit the 8" wide uprights.

mattieuk
02-03-2009, 09:10 AM
I would seriously look at changing the overtime rules. I just can't see how the current system is fair, even if not an NCAA system is put in, I'm sure there is some method of making it more representative of all round talent, rather than a said defense versus a said offense.

I think the main thing I want tweaked is relating to challenges. I think the current system of getting a a third challenge after 2 successful challenges beforehand is wrong. I would prefer the idea of, get a challenge right, keep the challenge, get it wrong, lose it, rather than getting presented a third one as a reward. If coaches make bad challenges, they don't get the option, if they make good challenges, they keep hold of them and aren't penalized.

Jackie Chiles
02-03-2009, 09:38 AM
I would do something about roughing the kicker/punter rules. I hate watching a defense get penalized after earning a punt because some moron ran into the kicker or, worse, came close and the kicker put on an act. I know they need to be protected and there might not be any real good solution but this is probably the thing that gets me most ticked off when watching a game. I guess i'll offer up a solution: no more 15 yard automatic FDs awarded, all roughing the kicker penalties are 5 yards. If that penalty results in a FD there is an automatic booth review (quick one) to make certain there was contact. Its too in depth and it will never happen but what the heck.

HOU-TEX
02-03-2009, 10:57 AM
As an ex-DE, I think the QB's are getting too much protection from the rulebook. I can agree with calling hits to the knees illegal, but the heck with the rest. IMO, the QB should be open game just like the rest of them. Seeing flags thrown for puh C hits on the QB just pisses me off. The little tap on Ben that was flagged had me jumpin out of my chair.

bah007
02-03-2009, 11:20 AM
I would do something about roughing the kicker/punter rules. I hate watching a defense get penalized after earning a punt because some moron ran into the kicker or, worse, came close and the kicker put on an act. I know they need to be protected and there might not be any real good solution but this is probably the thing that gets me most ticked off when watching a game. I guess i'll offer up a solution: no more 15 yard automatic FDs awarded, all roughing the kicker penalties are 5 yards. If that penalty results in a FD there is an automatic booth review (quick one) to make certain there was contact. Its too in depth and it will never happen but what the heck.

How about we keep the 15 yard penalty but the yardage gets added on to the punt?

That way the defense gets the ball but is still penalized yardage.

Dread-Head
02-03-2009, 12:35 PM
GOODBYE TUCK RULE!!!! : If you're a QB and get hit and the ball comes loose while you're still standing up...FUUUUMBLE! Man up and learn to hold on to a football sweetheart, this is a sport played by men.

PUSH OFF = OFFENSIVE PASS INTERFERENCE: You can't outrun him? Then you don't deserve to make the catch. Deal with it.

REDEFINE "Roughing the Passer": You shouldn't be allowed to get a cheap shot in on a QB five or six seconds after he's thrown the ball, but you shouldn't get penalized for barely bumping into the guy, brushing past him or accidentally colliding with him. Who are these shreiking violets we're attempting to turn into QB's?

LOSE THE EXCESSIVE CELEBRATION/UNSPORTSMAN LIKE CONDUCT PENALTY: It's a game...sometimes in a game you taunt the other guy a little. If you go overboard? You pay for it the next time you touch the ball. That's life. Besides...the "California Quake" and "Ickey Shuffle" gave the game character.


LOSE THE STIFF ARM: Run over me...or run around me. You stick your hand in my face you've just gotten me ejected because I'll be doing my best to either break your arm or bite off one of your fingers.


To quote rap group Onyx "LET THE BOYS BE BOYS!"

TexanSam
02-03-2009, 12:50 PM
One more thing...change the halftime entertainment for the Super Bowl.

Janet Jackson showed her nipple 5 years ago now. Get over it. No more Tom Petty, Prince, or Bruce Springsteen.

gtexan02
02-03-2009, 12:55 PM
1. Penalties should be reviewable
2. Redefine holding and call it every time or don't call it at all
3. No more roughing the passer unless someone is obviously trying to injure the QB
4. False Starts should be a free play for the defense, like offsides is for the offense

Dread-Head
02-03-2009, 12:56 PM
One more thing...change the halftime entertainment for the Super Bowl.

Janet Jackson showed her nipple 5 years ago now. Get over it. No more Tom Petty, Prince, or Bruce Springsteen.


To HECK with you man! I LOVED Prince's performance last year.

Jackie Chiles
02-03-2009, 01:00 PM
How about we keep the 15 yard penalty but the yardage gets added on to the punt?

That way the defense gets the ball but is still penalized yardage.

Works for me.

bah007
02-03-2009, 01:02 PM
1. Penalties should be reviewable
2. Redefine holding and call it every time or don't call it at all
3. No more roughing the passer unless someone is obviously trying to injure the QB
4. False Starts should be a free play for the defense, like offsides is for the offense

I like the first three, not the last one though. Some QB is gonna get injured because his tackle jumps and the DE comes inside of him and blasts the guy. The false start penalty is good just how it is.

painekiller
02-03-2009, 02:28 PM
I think a team should get unlimited reviews as long as they are winning them. It is not the coaches fault the refs blew 4 plays, Now keep the 2 wrong reviews per game.

I would expand the roster to 55 men and all men are active for each game.

I would have 2 types of IR, one for 6 games, one for the season.

I would have FG over 50 yards worth 4 points, under 30 yards worth only 2.

I would expand the practice squad, and you could lock one player on the squad, making him unavailable to other team. Then a team could truly develop a QB on the PS.

Jackie Chiles
02-03-2009, 02:31 PM
I think a team should get unlimited reviews as long as they are winning them. It is not the coaches fault the refs blew 4 plays, Now keep the 2 wrong reviews per game.

I would expand the roster to 55 men and all men are active for each game.

I would have 2 types of IR, one for 6 games, one for the season.

I would have FG over 50 yards worth 4 points, under 30 yards worth only 2.

I would expand the practice squad, and you could lock one player on the squad, making him unavailable to other team. Then a team could truly develop a QB on the PS.

I like most of your ideas (minus the FG idea) but love making everyone active and adding 2 roster spots. Honestly, why have 53 on your roster but not suit everyone up?

gtexan02
02-03-2009, 02:32 PM
I like the first three, not the last one though. Some QB is gonna get injured because his tackle jumps and the DE comes inside of him and blasts the guy. The false start penalty is good just how it is.

Probably a good point. It just seems unfair that the offense gets afree play if the D jumps offsides

HOU-TEX
02-03-2009, 02:36 PM
1. Penalties should be reviewable
2. Redefine holding and call it every time or don't call it at all
3. No more roughing the passer unless someone is obviously trying to injure the QB
4. False Starts should be a free play for the defense, like offsides is for the offense

I like the first three, not the last one though. Some QB is gonna get injured because his tackle jumps and the DE comes inside of him and blasts the guy. The false start penalty is good just how it is.

1. If penalties were reviewable the game would last for ever.
2. See above. Plus, if every holding penalty was called are we going to allow safeties off penalties? That would be where the Offense ends up on every drive. lol
3. Agreed. Too many rules protect the QB.
4. Agree with bah on this one. As much as I am against a lot of the rules protecting the QB, this would have QB's in traction.

gtexan02
02-03-2009, 02:53 PM
In response to #1) The game would not go on forever, because you only get 2 (3) reviews per game. It would allow coaches to save those reviews for when they really need them

Second Honeymoon
02-03-2009, 03:02 PM
GOODBYE TUCK RULE!!!! : If you're a QB and get hit and the ball comes loose while you're still standing up...FUUUUMBLE! Man up and learn to hold on to a football sweetheart, this is a sport played by men.

PUSH OFF = OFFENSIVE PASS INTERFERENCE: You can't outrun him? Then you don't deserve to make the catch. Deal with it.

REDEFINE "Roughing the Passer": You shouldn't be allowed to get a cheap shot in on a QB five or six seconds after he's thrown the ball, but you shouldn't get penalized for barely bumping into the guy, brushing past him or accidentally colliding with him. Who are these shreiking violets we're attempting to turn into QB's?

LOSE THE EXCESSIVE CELEBRATION/UNSPORTSMAN LIKE CONDUCT PENALTY: It's a game...sometimes in a game you taunt the other guy a little. If you go overboard? You pay for it the next time you touch the ball. That's life. Besides...the "California Quake" and "Ickey Shuffle" gave the game character.


LOSE THE STIFF ARM: Run over me...or run around me. You stick your hand in my face you've just gotten me ejected because I'll be doing my best to either break your arm or bite off one of your fingers.


To quote rap group Onyx "LET THE BOYS BE BOYS!"

I was gonna post but why bother? You hit the nail on the head for me outside the ban on stiff arms. It was your last proposed change so you get a pass from me on that one ;)

I would only replace the stiff arm rule change with some new rule on running/roughing the kicker/punter. It's too game changing for just the slightest amount of contact to be called all the time.

Dread-Head
02-03-2009, 03:16 PM
Also I advocate the abolition of the "INELLIGIBLE RECEIVER DOWNFIELD" rule...I would like to see EVERYONE on offense declared Elligible receivers...hell if you're open and can catch...here ya go (pass) now run damn it!

eriadoc
02-03-2009, 03:22 PM
Rookie salaries. Money has changed the game so much, and not for the better.

Seņor Stan
02-03-2009, 03:27 PM
Three words. Rookie Salary Cap.

All picks all rounds are slotted by dollar amount. No holdouts. Let the guys who have proven themselves get the fat paychecks. Keep a high draft choice from crippling a franchise financially.

HOU-TEX
02-03-2009, 03:39 PM
Three words. Rookie Salary Cap.

All picks all rounds are slotted by dollar amount. No holdouts. Let the guys who have proven themselves get the fat paychecks. Keep a high draft choice from crippling a franchise financially.

Excellent! I'd forgotten about this one. Even though I don't think it'll happen.

IMO, Stan's got the winner so far.

Goldensilence
02-03-2009, 04:34 PM
Also I advocate the abolition of the "INELLIGIBLE RECEIVER DOWNFIELD" rule...I would like to see EVERYONE on offense declared Elligible receivers...hell if you're open and can catch...here ya go (pass) now run damn it!

Never got this one myself and thing that upsets me the most with it is they aren't guys you are probably going to throw it to. I hate seeing a lineman bust it downfield on a block or something and get flagged.

Rookie salaries. Money has changed the game so much, and not for the better.

Pretty much hit nail on the head.

Yankee_In_TX
02-03-2009, 05:21 PM
All field goals are not created equal.

55 yards and up - 1 point.

40 - 55 yards out - 2 points.

chip shot to 40 yards - 3 points.

teams that get better field position get rewarded for their time and effort.

:tiphat:


I would argue the reverse. The kicker making 50+ yarders should get more points.

Texan_Bill
02-03-2009, 05:31 PM
I'm sure someone else mentioned but could we do away with a commercial timeout after the extra point and the subsequent change of possesion??

Nawzer
02-05-2009, 12:24 AM
Three words. Rookie Salary Cap.

All picks all rounds are slotted by dollar amount. No holdouts. Let the guys who have proven themselves get the fat paychecks. Keep a high draft choice from crippling a franchise financially.

Yes!

mexican_texan
02-05-2009, 12:47 AM
Rookie salary cap is a must.

Also, I'd like a loaning system like they have in soccer. The Vikings could loan us Chester Taylor for a season :)

Wolf
02-05-2009, 02:29 AM
If the penalty would move the ball more than half the distance towards the offender's end zone, the penalty becomes half the distance to the goal instead of its normal value.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_football#Penalties

I don't know why, but I hate the "half the distance to the goal line"

if you are on your own 4 yard line and you commit a penalty of say false start, put the ball on the 1 yard line, if you still commit another penalty. safety (doesn't matter if it was committed in the end zone or not)


if you are on your opponents 4 yard line and say they commit a penalty, put it on the 1 yard line. if they commit another penalty .. replay down

OzzO
02-05-2009, 09:17 AM
Y'all got most of mine (NCAA OT, nix the tuck, roughing the passer, excessive celebration, rookie $) so I'll say for the fan's sake....

drop the ticket prices / psl's to a resonable amount

drop concessions to a logical amount. $10 for a cold BBQ sandwhich and $8 for a 12oz warm beer... and no kiss or vasoline?

superbowl should be for the fans - not corporations. Open up the sales to all, an online raffle if needed, and make sure those prices are not 200x the amount of a normal ticket.

all games available for free on tv - but for "outside city limit" fans. Those inside the city limits can go to the game since ticket prices were lowered (see suggestion #1)

WWJD
02-05-2009, 09:23 AM
I would most definitely change the overtime. I don't think it's fair the way it's set up.

I will agree on the rookie salary cap as well. Good thought.

HJam72
02-05-2009, 09:38 AM
I wouldn't just let anybody catch a pass, but I would either do away with the penalty just for being too far downfield or more likely make it 10 yards instead of five so that it doesn't happen accidentally so much.

Changing the overtime rules and having strictly enforced salary caps on rookies are MUST changes. Those need to happen soon.