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View Full Version : Ok Cowboy fans I need some help


Hervoyel
01-14-2009, 09:49 AM
I'm talking to a guy I know at work and the Cowboys come up and he's talking about how he used to hate the Cowboys (Aikman era) because they always seemed to be able to beat his guys when they played and how you just knew they were going to come back even when you had them down.

I then told him about the Cowboys in the 70's and how infuriating they were to play against. Very difficult opponent who also never seemed to be out of it no matter how well you played. As I was telling him about this (He's like early 20's) I mentioned how demoralizing it was to watch them all come up to the line, set, and then reset before running the play and how their offense looked so damned "automatic" with Landry standing there looking totally unreadable and their linemen doing that robot shift thing.... and he had no idea what I was talking about.

I know you guys know what I'm talking about but do any of you know where there's any old footage of the Cowboys line doing that? I'm trying to explain it and how cool it used to look but I want to show him what I'm talking about. A quick look at Youtube didn't turn anything up.

Anyone know where a clip showing that is online?

HoustonFrog
01-14-2009, 10:00 AM
I'm talking to a guy I know at work and the Cowboys come up and he's talking about how he used to hate the Cowboys (Aikman era) because they always seemed to be able to beat his guys when they played and how you just knew they were going to come back even when you had them down.

I then told him about the Cowboys in the 70's and how infuriating they were to play against. Very difficult opponent who also never seemed to be out of it no matter how well you played. As I was telling him about this (He's like early 20's) I mentioned how demoralizing it was to watch them all come up to the line, set, and then reset before running the play and how their offense looked so damned "automatic" with Landry standing there looking totally unreadable and their linemen doing that robot shift thing.... and he had no idea what I was talking about.

I know you guys know what I'm talking about but do any of you know where there's any old footage of the Cowboys line doing that? I'm trying to explain it and how cool it used to look but I want to show him what I'm talking about. A quick look at Youtube didn't turn anything up.

Anyone know where a clip showing that is online?

Well I'm laughing because I still look at the talent of the 70s team..which was my childhood team and think they were one of the most talented in history. So to think of someone who doesn't know of that part of the history..that is funny.

I know EXACTLY what you are talking about and it was unreal to see guys start to bend down, get up like the changing of the guard and simultaneously move and get back down. I didn't find any video but I did find another article

http://ezinearticles.com/?That-Strange-Up-And-Down-Thing-The-Cowboys-Once-Did&id=798594

Hardcore Texan
01-14-2009, 10:16 AM
Trying so hard to be polite here.......oh well, I'll say it.........WHO CARES? It's the freakin' cowboys.

:jk:

sort of

Showtime100
01-14-2009, 10:17 AM
Anyone know where a clip showing that is online?

I know exactly what you are talking about. I remember telling my dad I hoped one day one of them would hurt a back muscle doing that unnecessary maneuver (I was a kid, what can I say).

I'll see if I can find a gif online or something later on. :)

Wolf
01-14-2009, 10:20 AM
herv best I got is this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUDdbQdLjjo&feature=PlayList&p=EFEC181D12E5A7D6&playnext=1&index=21

I thought in the 80's the linemen stood up more and then back down ,but in this clip of steelers-cowboys superbowl, they didn't do up as high as I thought they did as a kid

Showtime100
01-14-2009, 11:03 AM
Here's another one but it's about the same deal as Wolf's. I still watched all of it. This is MNF '79 Browns/Cowboys, Gifford, Dandy Don, Howard. Check out the Cowboy uniforms, those were my favorite Cowboys uni's of all. Not only did they look the best but the Cowboys felt they were cursed when they wore them..lol.

If you can't see the whole vid, watch the Sipe to Newsome TD at the very end, sweet.

ROBERT NEWHOUSE IN THE HOUUUSE. :jam:

Gifford, Dandy Don, Howard. *sniff* Toalk amoungst yourselves. :cry2:

stingray
01-14-2009, 11:17 AM
herv best I got is this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUDdbQdLjjo&feature=PlayList&p=EFEC181D12E5A7D6&playnext=1&index=21

I thought in the 80's the linemen stood up more and then back down ,but in this clip of steelers-cowboys superbowl, they didn't do up as high as I thought they did as a kid

They do it right at the 2:15 mark..

Texan_Bill
01-14-2009, 11:22 AM
Also watch the game between Coach Herman Boone / Coach Bill Yoast's Alexandria Va. team versus Coach Ed Henry for the state championship. Ed Henry's team does the "robot shift"....

:specnatz:

infantrycak
01-14-2009, 11:50 AM
Not what you were looking for but damn that was a team and QB--Staubach (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNJvW8w5JSU)

WWJD
01-14-2009, 12:06 PM
I saw Roger play alot and he was the toughest QB I've ever seen. I use to go to the games where Tom would have Roger in and then put in Craig Morton..that's how far back I go.

Roger still looks like he could play! Greatness there.

Texan_Bill
01-14-2009, 12:09 PM
I saw Roger play alot and he was the toughest QB I've ever seen. I use to go to the games where Tom would have Roger in and then put in Craig Morton..that's how far back I go.

Roger still looks like he could play! Greatness there.

Apparently you never watched Dan Pastorini. That was the toughest SOB QB from that era that I can remember.

infantrycak
01-14-2009, 12:22 PM
Apparently you never watched Dan Pastorini. That was the toughest SOB QB from that era that I can remember.

Didn't watch him enough to compare. I did watch Staubach go back into a game with his throwing hand pinkie bent 90 degrees at the 1st knuckle. Watch Staubach lower his head and shoulders and finish his runs. Landry used to chew his butt about that--some of those rare occasions you saw Landry animated.

WWJD
01-14-2009, 12:22 PM
Apparently you never watched Dan Pastorini. That was the toughest SOB QB from that era that I can remember.

Never saw Pastorini other than a blurb on the sports highlights. I didn't watch the Oilers. I'll go with Roger but to me most QB's are really tough guys. It's just the nature of the beast.

WWJD
01-14-2009, 12:23 PM
Didn't watch him enough to compare. I did watch Staubach go back into a game with his throwing hand pinkie bent 90 degrees at the 1st knuckle. Watch Staubach lower his head and shoulders and finish his runs. Landry used to chew his butt about that--some of those rare occasions you saw Landry animated.

Roger's hand is still all funky from his playing days.

Hervoyel
01-14-2009, 12:24 PM
Never saw Pastorini other than a blurb on the sports highlights. I didn't watch the Oilers. I'll go with Roger but to me most QB's are really tough guys. It's just the nature of the beast.

I have a Dan Pastorini jersey (childhood hero) but if I'm putting together a football team I'm going to go with Staubach over Pastorini every single time that question comes up. I'm sorry but that's just a no-brainer right there.

Showtime100
01-14-2009, 12:28 PM
Never saw Pastorini other than a blurb on the sports highlights. I didn't watch the Oilers. I'll go with Roger but to me most QB's are really tough guys. It's just the nature of the beast.

First man to wear the flak jacket and for good reason. They once did an x-ray on his knee and found two ribs. :specnatz:

stingray
01-14-2009, 12:36 PM
They do it right at the 2:15 mark..

Nevrmind, I thought that was it. I now wanna see it... Robot looking formation, that sounds cool.

nunusguy
01-14-2009, 01:39 PM
Well I'm laughing because I still look at the talent of the 70s team..which was my childhood team and think they were one of the most talented in history.

C'mon Froggy, get real !
The Cowboys '90s SB teams would kill the '70s team. Actually most '90s
NFL team would kill the '70s team.

WWJD
01-14-2009, 01:41 PM
I have a Dan Pastorini jersey (childhood hero) but if I'm putting together a football team I'm going to go with Staubach over Pastorini every single time that question comes up. I'm sorry but that's just a no-brainer right there.

I remember seeing some corny movie Dan made once...it was horrible. Let's just say he was no actor.

I only saw the Oilers once and Warren was the QB.

On Roger/Dan question...one is a HOF and the other isn't. It is a no-brainer but I wouldn't question his toughness even if I had watched him based on what's being said here.

Brando
01-14-2009, 01:45 PM
I remember seeing some corny movie Dan made once...it was horrible. Let's just say he was no actor.

I only saw the Oilers once and Warren was the QB.

On Roger/Dan question...one is a HOF and the other isn't. It is a no-brainer but I wouldn't question his toughness even if I had watched him based on what's being said here.


Killer Fish, and no he wasn't an actor, he was a QB.:cool:

My favorite QB as a kid.

WWJD
01-14-2009, 01:49 PM
Killer Fish, and no he wasn't an actor, he was a QB.:cool:

My favorite QB as a kid.

Jim Brown was a decent actor and he was a RB right? Ha. At least he tried I guess.

MannyFresh
01-14-2009, 01:54 PM
Pastorini is the man....growing up my dad loved the guy until, stupid Bud traded him for that broken down Kenny Stabler....

Funny how even in the 70's Bud caused heartbreak...when the Raiders punked the Oilers back then.

Brando
01-14-2009, 01:54 PM
Jim Brown was a decent actor and he was a RB right? Ha. At least he tried I guess.


Come on now, we're comparing one's acting abilities.:shades: Besides Brown was a way better RB than an actor.

HoustonFrog
01-14-2009, 01:54 PM
C'mon Froggy, get real !
The Cowboys '90s SB teams would kill the '70s team. Actually most '90s
NFL team would kill the '70s team.

Are you kidding?I know teams of different eras get faster and stronger but the 70s Cowboys is one of the greatest teams assembled. Staubach, Dorsett, Tony Hill, Preston Pearson, Drew Pearson, Butch Johnson, Billy Joe Dupree and their line. Then on Defense you had Randy White, Ed Too Tall Jones, Harvey Martin, Charlie Waters, Cliff Harris, Benny Barnes, DD Lewis, etc, etc....you know Doomsday. They and the Steelers were two of the most stacked teams of all time and is a reason they met in SB or won SBs in the mid to late 70s. Your statement is ridiculous. Again, I know guys get faster, bigger, etc but you can't do anything about talent at every position. Hall of Fame talent. Plus teams back then all played their asses off and you rarely had the lazy chumps you see now.

Pastorini was tough but I still think Roger was tougher. The guy was the man. I tell you what, people wonder why some Cowboy fans stay loyal...when you are a kid in the 70s and you had this team and they played teams like the Steelers and the old redskins and all. Nothing better. Overall though I really cheered for the Oilers as a secondzary team and was peeved when the Renfro catch was not called a TD.

Brando
01-14-2009, 01:56 PM
Pastorini is the man....growing up my dad loved the guy until, stupid Bud traded him for that broken down Kenny Stabler....

Funny how even in the 70's Bud caused heartbreak...when the Raiders punked the Oilers back then.

Can't blame Bud on this one, this one turned out to be a mutual agreement with Bum and Dan to get Dan out of Houston.

Showtime100
01-14-2009, 01:57 PM
They were both great QB's, tough as nails that have given their respective fans many great memories. Is that satisfactory?

Watch it people, I'll turn this car around right now. :bat:

Brando
01-14-2009, 02:03 PM
They were both great QB's, tough as nails that have given their respective fans many great memories. Is that satisfactory?

Watch it people, I'll turn this car around right now. :bat:

Yes they were, I grew up calling Roger, Roger Starbach.:cool:

WWJD
01-14-2009, 02:08 PM
Come on now, we're comparing one's acting abilities.:shades: Besides Brown was a way better RB than an actor.

I actually like some of Jim's movies..he was pretty good... it was meant to be sarcastic....I just saw Dan in that movie and I remembered that...it was so bad I may have seen it on Mystery Science Theatre....but like I said at least he tried. He gets brownie points for trying and he was a good looking guy...movie star good looks.

WWJD
01-14-2009, 02:10 PM
Are you kidding?I know teams of different eras get faster and stronger but the 70s Cowboys is one of the greatest teams assembled. Staubach, Dorsett, Tony Hill, Preston Pearson, Drew Pearson, Butch Johnson, Billy Joe Dupree and their line. Then on Defense you had Randy White, Ed Too Tall Jones, Harvey Martin, Charlie Waters, Cliff Harris, Benny Barnes, DD Lewis, etc, etc....you know Doomsday. They and the Steelers were two of the most stacked teams of all time and is a reason they met in SB or won SBs in the mid to late 70s. Your statement is ridiculous. Again, I know guys get faster, bigger, etc but you can't do anything about talent at every position. Hall of Fame talent. Plus teams back then all played their asses off and you rarely had the lazy chumps you see now.

Pastorini was tough but I still think Roger was tougher. The guy was the man. I tell you what, people wonder why some Cowboy fans stay loyal...when you are a kid in the 70s and you had this team and they played teams like the Steelers and the old redskins and all. Nothing better. Overall though I really cheered for the Oilers as a secondzary team and was peeved when the Renfro catch was not called a TD.

Didn't Mike come and play for the Cowboys for a few years? I seem to recall seeing him....but maybe I'm wrong?!? My favorite Cowboys receiver back in the day was Golden Richards. Kind of had a school girl crush on him. Yikes.

Showtime100
01-14-2009, 02:12 PM
Yes they were, I grew up calling Roger, Roger Starbach.

I grew up calling Pastorini Dan That Bum Who Married My Honey. June Wilkinson was one hot woman. I would've walked 15 miles in the snow just to stand in her garbage. :hmmm:

Brando
01-14-2009, 02:14 PM
I actually like some of Jim's movies..he was pretty good... it was meant to be sarcastic....I just saw Dan in that movie and I remembered that...it was so bad I may have seen it on Mystery Science Theatre....but like I said at least he tried. He gets brownie points for trying and he was a good looking guy...movie star good looks.

I know I was messin with ya.:) I was a kid when I watched it so I didn't pay attention to the acting ability, I was just happy to see my QB in a movie. It had Lee Majors in it also.

WWJD
01-14-2009, 02:20 PM
I know I was messin with ya.:) I was a kid when I watched it so I didn't pay attention to the acting ability, I was just happy to see my QB in a movie. It had Lee Majors in it also.

OK! Lynn Dickey sat behind me once on a flight and he was the nicest guy. He played for the Oilers at the time and I remember thinking I needed to go watch him play but I never did. I should have gone. I wasn't an Oilers fan but hearing all these remembrances it sure seems like that whole Oiler/Houston gig was a special time.

I only saw the Oilers a few times in Texas Stadium and I really don't remember anything except Earl running wild. Lots of Oilers fans there; I do remember that.

HoustonFrog
01-14-2009, 02:52 PM
Didn't Mike come and play for the Cowboys for a few years? I seem to recall seeing him....but maybe I'm wrong?!? My favorite Cowboys receiver back in the day was Golden Richards. Kind of had a school girl crush on him. Yikes.

Yup, Golden Richards and Butch were two of my faves even with Drew Pearson and then Tony Hill. I remember vividly the Butch diving catch against the Broncos in the Super Bowl and the Richards TD in the same game that came from a halfback pass from Newhouse. Renfro played for the Cowboys for 3 years I think..84-87?

infantrycak
01-14-2009, 03:37 PM
Renfro played for the Cowboys for 3 years I think..84-87?

4 seasons--84 thru 87.

On Roger/Dan question...one is a HOF and the other isn't. It is a no-brainer but I wouldn't question his toughness even if I had watched him based on what's being said here.

I wouldn't question Pastorini's toughness either but like you say on rankings for all time it is a no brainer--Staubach was the man and belongs in the all time greats discussions.

Texecutioner
01-14-2009, 03:38 PM
Staubach was freaking great!

WWJD
01-14-2009, 04:05 PM
Yup, Golden Richards and Butch were two of my faves even with Drew Pearson and then Tony Hill. I remember vividly the Butch diving catch against the Broncos in the Super Bowl and the Richards TD in the same game that came from a halfback pass from Newhouse. Renfro played for the Cowboys for 3 years I think..84-87?

I never liked Butch...he just rubbed me the wrong way.

Texan_Bill
01-14-2009, 05:14 PM
On Roger/Dan question...one is a HOF and the other isn't. It is a no-brainer but I wouldn't question his toughness even if I had watched him based on what's being said here.

Nowhere did I compare the two's careers. I compared toughness. Clearly Roger was the better QB and had a way more HOF, illustrious career. I just don't ever remember Roger playing with broken ribs or even a punctured lung. Pastorini's career numbers are pedestrian, at best.

The reason QB's wear flack-jackets today?? Because the first was invented for Dante so that he could play with his ribs busted all to hades.

Even with all that said, I'm not implying that Roger wasn't tough, just that not many were tougher than Dante.

Brando
01-14-2009, 05:48 PM
Renfro played for the Cowboys for 3 years I think..84-87?

Yep, The Oilers traded him to the Cowboys for Butch Johnson and switched 5th round picks.:gun:

Edit: Looking it up, it could have been used on Frank Bush the Texans new DC. It was either Bush or Lee Johnson. Not sure which one.

The Cowboys used the 5th round pick on Herschel Walker.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_NFL_Draft

They used the pick on Lee Johnson, the ole left footed punter.

link (http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D00E6DB1438F937A25757C0A9629482 60)

WWJD
01-14-2009, 06:27 PM
Nowhere did I compare the two's careers. I compared toughness. Clearly Roger was the better QB and had a way more HOF, illustrious career. I just don't ever remember Roger playing with broken ribs or even a punctured lung. Pastorini's career numbers are pedestrian, at best.

The reason QB's wear flack-jackets today?? Because the first was invented for Dante so that he could play with his ribs busted all to hades.

Even with all that said, I'm not implying that Roger wasn't tough, just that not many were tougher than Dante.

Roger had a ton of concussions...that's what I remember most about him injury wise. And he beat up Clint Longley once. Just for mouthing off.

infantrycak
01-14-2009, 06:35 PM
Roger had a ton of concussions...that's what I remember most about him injury wise. And he beat up Clint Longley once. Just for mouthing off.

He missed most of the 1972 season after a shoulder injury that required surgery although he came back and led the Cowboys to two TD's in the 4th quarter to beat the Niners in the play-offs which I think started the Captain Comeback nickname (which was well earned with over 20 come from behind in the 4th victories in his career).

Somebody tell me Staubach would not be an ideal QB in Shanahan/Kubiak's roll-out west coast system.

Definitely for his era he is my favorite QB and one of the top all time. Can you imagine what he would have done if he hadn't served in the Navy four years and if Landry had been more decisive on playing him?

Texan_Bill
01-14-2009, 06:46 PM
Ummm, I'm sure someone that was so beat up that they punctured a long also had his fair share of concussions.

The Cowboys had a good O-line. The Oilers, not so much. Well until the late 70's (78-79 ish). From '71 to that time, Dan missed a handfull of games.

WWJD
01-14-2009, 06:50 PM
Ummm, I'm sure someone that was so beat up that they punctured a long also had his fair share of concussions.

The Cowboys had a good O-line. The Oilers, not so much. Well until the late 70's (78-79 ish). From '71 to that time, Dan missed a handfull of games.



I don't know a thing about Pastorini..I didn't watch the Oilers till after he was history and only saw them once and Warren was playing. That team was impressive.

My comment was only that I remembered Roger having a lot of concussions.

And besides really when you think about it FEMALES are far tougher than any man. After all we are the ones that have the babies. Try doing that! HA!:)

Texan_Bill
01-14-2009, 06:58 PM
If the Oilers could have bottled Warren's skill and Pastorini's heart, the Oilers could have won so much more (despite Dud's butt).. :cry2:

Texecutioner
01-14-2009, 07:05 PM
If the Oilers could have bottled Warren's skill and Pastorini's heart, the Oilers could have won so much more (despite Dud's butt).. :cry2:

Moon was always one of the best passers I have ever seen. Moon's problem was always that he would end up throwing costly picks at the wrong times. Maybe because it was the Run N Shoot and because we passed a lot, but damn Moon used to kill so many games with bad INT's.

Texan_Bill
01-14-2009, 07:16 PM
Moon was always one of the best passers I have ever seen. Moon's problem was always that he would end up throwing costly picks at the wrong times. Maybe because it was the Run N Shoot and because we passed a lot, but damn Moon used to kill so many games with bad INT's.

Agreed, Moon threw one of the prettiest balls of all time.

Maybe his problem was that he wasn't a leader, motivator or a winner. Kind of those little things you look for in a QB. :whistle:

WWJD
01-14-2009, 07:56 PM
Agreed, Moon threw one of the prettiest balls of all time.

Maybe his problem was that he wasn't a leader, motivator or a winner. Kind of those little things you look for in a QB. :whistle:


Romo can't compare to Warren passing wise but he's not a leader, motivator or winner. Could be talking about Warren's counterpart....although I'm not so sure about the leader part?? I thought he was pretty good at that just from what I've read and heard.

nunusguy
01-14-2009, 08:51 PM
Are you kidding?I know teams of different eras get faster and stronger but the 70s Cowboys is one of the greatest teams assembled. Staubach, Dorsett, Tony Hill, Preston Pearson, Drew Pearson, Butch Johnson, Billy Joe Dupree and their line. Then on Defense you had Randy White, Ed Too Tall Jones, Harvey Martin, Charlie Waters, Cliff Harris, Benny Barnes, DD Lewis, etc, etc....you know Doomsday. They and the Steelers were two of the most stacked teams of all time and is a reason they met in SB or won SBs in the mid to late 70s. Your statement is ridiculous. Again, I know guys get faster, bigger, etc but you can't do anything about talent at every position. Hall of Fame talent. Plus teams back then all played their asses off and you rarely had the lazy chumps you see now.

Pastorini was tough but I still think Roger was tougher. The guy was the man. I tell you what, people wonder why some Cowboy fans stay loyal...when you are a kid in the 70s and you had this team and they played teams like the Steelers and the old redskins and all. Nothing better. Overall though I really cheered for the Oilers as a secondzary team and was peeved when the Renfro catch was not called a TD.

You get real Froggy. Charlie Waters & Cliff Harris were the kind of comparitively slow white-boys in defensive backfields of their time who couldn't play with the 4.3-4.4 speed receivers that dominated the NFL by the '90s. And I certainly remember Randy White - had a motor that wouldn't quit, right ? He was also under 260 lbs. He couldn't effectively compete at that size as an inside DLineman by the '90s.
I was still living in my native Missouri in the '70s and as Chiefs fan a guy named Ed Podalak was a favorite player who set some records back then as a running back. In the '90s he probably couldn't make the roster of most NFL teams if any.

WWJD
01-14-2009, 08:54 PM
You get real Froggy. Charlie Waters & Cliff Harris were the kind of comparitively slow white-boys in defensive backfields of their time who couldn't play with the 4.3-4.4 speed receivers that dominated the NFL by the '90s. And I certainly remember Randy White - had a motor that wouldn't quit, right ? He was also under 260 lbs. He couldn't effectively compete at that size as an inside DLineman by the '90s.
I was still living in my native Missouri in the '70s and as Chiefs fan a guy named Ed Podalak was a favorite player who set some records back then as a running back. In the '90s he probably couldn't make the roster of most NFL teams if any.

Randy White could play any decade...any team...and dominate.

HoustonFrog
01-14-2009, 09:00 PM
Randy White could play any decade...any team...and dominate.

Agreed. I am being real. Charlie Waters and Cliff Harris are border line HOF'ers and back in their day they played against Lynn Swann, Stallworth and others. How much faster was Irvin and Harper from the Super Bowl years?I think Nuns going a little over the top. Football players of certain eras shouldn't be a factor. My initial statement was that they have one of the greatest assembled teams in the history...not if they could beat a 1995 team.

The size and speed stats really bother me because there are plenty of speedy guys with no heart and skill and there are plenty of undersized guys who play long careers...Singletary, Zach Thomas, etc. So to sit there and say a HOF type guy couldn't hack it is just assinine.

infantrycak
01-14-2009, 09:02 PM
You get real Froggy. Charlie Waters & Cliff Harris were the kind of comparitively slow white-boys in defensive backfields of their time who couldn't play with the 4.3-4.4 speed receivers that dominated the NFL by the '90s. And I certainly remember Randy White - had a motor that wouldn't quit, right ? He was also under 260 lbs. He couldn't effectively compete at that size as an inside DLineman by the '90s.
I was still living in my native Missouri in the '70s and as Chiefs fan a guy named Ed Podalak was a favorite player who set some records back then as a running back. In the '90s he probably couldn't make the roster of most NFL teams if any.

You're arguing a point which wasn't even made to begin with. HoustonFrog said the 70's Cowboys team was one of the most "talented" teams he has ever seen and more "talented" than the 90's team. None of this bigger, stronger, faster stuff has anything to do with that--it doesn't in any way make prior era teams less talented.

You're way overplaying your hand as well. Does the name Bob Hayes ring a bell?

Honoring Earl 34
01-14-2009, 09:14 PM
Agreed. I am being real. Charlie Waters and Cliff Harris are border line HOF'ers and back in their day they played against Lynn Swann, Stallworth and others. How much faster was Irvin and Harper from the Super Bowl years?I think Nuns going a little over the top. Football players of certain eras shouldn't be a factor. My initial statement was that they have one of the greatest assembled teams in the hostory...not if thy could beat a 1995 team.

The size and speed stats really bothr me because there are plenty of speedy guys with no heart and skill and there are plenty of undersized guys who play long careers...Singletary, Zach Thomas, etc. So to sit there and say a HOF type guy couldn't hack it is just assinine.

Waters or Harris wrote a book about their career . In one chapter they wrote about playing Earl Campbell in a preseason game Earl's rookie year .

Up until that point Earl had been going through the motions because they had so many games before the real season and he wasn't very impressive on film . They decided they would welcome him into the NFL with their sandwich hit that they used on tackles . In the book Waters said that Earl must of been ramping it up for the season because when they went to hit him ... he ran them both over .

HoustonFrog
01-14-2009, 09:37 PM
You're arguing a point which wasn't even made to begin with. HoustonFrog said the 70's Cowboys team was one of the most "talented" teams he has ever seen and more "talented" than the 90's team. None of this bigger, stronger, faster stuff has anything to do with that--it doesn't in any way make prior era teams less talented.

You're way overplaying your hand as well. Does the name Bob Hayes ring a bell?

Exactly...in fact I never even mentioned the 90s team at first...which I also loved.. in my first statement I only said "Well I'm laughing because I still look at the talent of the 70s team..which was my childhood team and think they were one of the most talented in history.

I stand by that. I still look at SBs like XIII and find it to be an epic battle of two teams that were full of talent and studs. It was a game and two teams that lived up to the hype.

WWJD
01-14-2009, 09:39 PM
Waters or Harris wrote a book about their career . In one chapter they wrote about playing Earl Campbell in a preseason game Earl's rookie year .

Up until that point Earl had been going through the motions because they had so many games before the real season and he wasn't very impressive on film . They decided they would welcome him into the NFL with their sandwich hit that they used on tackles . In the book Waters said that Earl must of been ramping it up for the season because when they went to hit him ... he ran them both over .


They both wrote that book together..in fact they work together now in an energy company.

Cliff has been infamously quoted as saying he never got whipped as bad as when he hit Earl....high compliment indeed from Captain Crash. Cliff wasn't afraid to pop anybody. Hard.

Wolf
01-14-2009, 11:28 PM
But Could Roger do this? :stirpot:

Pastorini
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2364/2149531935_0f7cd3319c.jpg

I liked Roger the Dodger ..

WWJD.. did I hear that right, crush on pastorini? hmmm (JOKING)
http://i3.iofferphoto.com/img/item/147/006/68/1.jpg

WWJD
01-15-2009, 10:24 AM
But Could Roger do this? :stirpot:

Pastorini
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2364/2149531935_0f7cd3319c.jpg

I liked Roger the Dodger ..

WWJD.. did I hear that right, crush on pastorini? hmmm (JOKING)
http://i3.iofferphoto.com/img/item/147/006/68/1.jpg

Ha! Dan had movie star good looks but I had a crush on Golden Richards. And Charlie Waters as well. Charlie did this cheesy beefcake poster that I still have somewhere...goofy what you hold on to.

Texan_Bill
01-15-2009, 10:31 AM
In the book Waters said that Earl must of been ramping it up for the season because when they went to hit him ... he ran them both over .
:wild:
:doot:

Texan_Bill
01-15-2009, 10:33 AM
WWJD.. did I hear that right, crush on pastorini? hmmm (JOKING)
http://i3.iofferphoto.com/img/item/147/006/68/1.jpg

:bat: Really??? How did you know to google a Playgirl cover with Dante on it??

Showtime100
01-15-2009, 10:48 AM
Ha! Dan had movie star good looks but I had a crush on Golden Richards. And Charlie Waters as well. Charlie did this cheesy beefcake poster that I still have somewhere...goofy what you hold on to.


Too funny. Here's is his ex-wife June Wilkinson they way she looks today or at least recently at the age of 69. (I had to word that carefully)

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r65/ShowtimeN15580/Houston%20Texans/200px-June_Wilkinson_1998.jpg

Not bad for the age I'd say. Although I have at least two reasons to believe modern technology had a little to do with it.

WWJD
01-15-2009, 11:11 AM
Too funny. Here's is his ex-wife June Wilkinson they way she looks today or at least recently at the age of 69. (I had to word that carefully)

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r65/ShowtimeN15580/Houston%20Texans/200px-June_Wilkinson_1998.jpg

Not bad for the age I'd say. Although I have at least two reasons to believe modern technology had a little to do with it.

She looks GREAT for 69...69? How old is Dan? Geez he can't be that OLD can he? Must have married a cougar huh?

She's been "enhanced" for sure...facelift as well I would guess but hey it works!

WWJD
01-15-2009, 11:13 AM
:bat: Really??? How did you know to google a Playgirl cover with Dante on it??

When I saw that cover all I see is Redford...another guy we girls use to drool over. Who can forget both he and dreamy Paul Newman in "Butch Cassidy"?

Now he looks like a California raisin...too much sun damage.

Showtime100
01-15-2009, 11:23 AM
She looks GREAT for 69...69? How old is Dan? Geez he can't be that OLD can he? Must have married a cougar huh?

She's been "enhanced" for sure...facelift as well I would guess but hey it works!

I just did "year subtraction" oooops..my bad. She was born in '40 but still 68, he was born in '49 but is still 59. I can understand that, my ex-wife is 11 years my senior but like June, you'd never know it.

Texan_Bill
01-15-2009, 11:27 AM
When I saw that cover all I see is Redford...another guy we girls use to drool over. Who can forget both he and dreamy Paul Newman in "Butch Cassidy"?

Now he looks like a California raisin...too much sun damage.

Ummmm, now he looks like a man draped in a coffin. [RIP Paul]

WWJD
01-15-2009, 11:37 AM
I just did "year subtraction" oooops..my bad. She was born in '40 but still 68, he was born in '49 but is still 59. I can understand that, my ex-wife is 11 years my senior but like June, you'd never know it.

She looks great for her age...I'd be interested to see a picture of Dan now if you could dig that up. He was a very good looking guy...

Cute about your wife...most men want younger women! I go by the adage myself...beggers cannot be choosers!

WWJD
01-15-2009, 11:40 AM
Ummmm, now he looks like a man draped in a coffin. [RIP Paul]

Redford's good looks are gone..bye. He's probably 70'ish though so well not too many good looking guys his age anyway! HA!

Although Howie Long looks great for his age...I mean the guy has a grown son and he looks like he could still play himself.

nunusguy
01-15-2009, 11:42 AM
You're arguing a point which wasn't even made to begin with. HoustonFrog said the 70's Cowboys team was one of the most "talented" teams he has ever seen and more "talented" than the 90's team. None of this bigger, stronger, faster stuff has anything to do with that--it doesn't in any way make prior era teams less talented.

You're way overplaying your hand as well. Does the name Bob Hayes ring a bell?
Bob Hayes could play and perhaps star in the '90s IMO, but White & Waters & others couldn't. But apparently White was one of the more popular players among Cowboy fans' favorites of that time judging from the level of indignation on this Board at the suggestion he couldn't make in the NFL of the '90s. But I simply don't think he could. Not as a DT at 255 or thereabouts.
And for you Cowboy fans - no I'm not picking on you and your beloved favorites because I would lump other players of that time (Larry Csonka, Fred Bilentnkoff, Dick Butkus to name a few), in there with your guys.
And on your point about talented, one player who can't compete at the level of another is also not as talented as the other. End of story.

WWJD
01-15-2009, 11:51 AM
Bob Hayes could play and perhaps star in the '90s IMO, but White & Waters & others couldn't. But apparently White was one of the more popular players among Cowboy fans' favorites of that time judging from the level of indignation on this Board at the suggestion he couldn't make in the NFL of the '90s. But I simply don't think he could. Not as a DT at 255 or thereabouts.
And for you Cowboy fans - no I'm not picking on you and your beloved favorites because I would lump other players of that time (Larry Csonka, Fred Bilentnkoff, Dick Butkus to name a few), in there with your guys.
And on your point about talented, one player who can't compete at the level of another is also not as talented as the other. End of story.

Randy wasn't even the biggest guy back when he was playing. I do know though that he was the strongest and I still think he could play today and dominate. I won't be swayed about that...I saw the guy for too many years. Great is great and he was GREAT.

You lost me with Butkus...of course that dude could still play! Huh?

But to each his own...it's all opinion anyway.

HoustonFrog
01-15-2009, 11:58 AM
When I saw that cover all I see is Redford...another guy we girls use to drool over. Who can forget both he and dreamy Paul Newman in "Butch Cassidy"?

Now he looks like a California raisin...too much sun damage.

Butch Cassidy...one of the best pictures..Top 10 for me. in my book. Love it.

HoustonFrog
01-15-2009, 12:01 PM
Randy wasn't even the biggest guy back when he was playing. I do know though that he was the strongest and I still think he could play today and dominate. I won't be swayed about that...I saw the guy for too many years. Great is great and he was GREAT.

You lost me with Butkus...of course that dude could still play! Huh?

But to each his own...it's all opinion anyway.

Beat me to it. He still refuses to take into account guys like Largent...even Rice(speed was not his greatest asset), Singletary, Zach Thomas, etc, etc...guys with less speed or size that played in the legaue during these times and then guys like Alexander Wright, Jett, and about 100 workout warriors that were talented but their speed and athleticism didn't translate into the NFL. I think when you take heart, hard work and desire out of the equation, then it just looks assinine to compare eras and specific traits.....Butkus, you lost credibility there Nun..a ton.

Brando
01-15-2009, 12:04 PM
She looks great for her age...I'd be interested to see a picture of Dan now if you could dig that up. He was a very good looking guy...

Cute about your wife...most men want younger women! I go by the adage myself...beggers cannot be choosers!

I don't know how recent this is but as far as the last time I seen Dan back in 2003 looks accurate.....


http://www.nypost.com/seven/04122007/photos/biz038a.jpg








Here is another picture I found......



http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/unfairpark/pastorini_cosbie.jpg

WWJD
01-15-2009, 12:05 PM
Butch Cassidy...one of the best pictures..Top 10 for me. in my book. Love it.

That is a great movie....there is a conspiracy theory out there that Butch survived.

WWJD
01-15-2009, 12:06 PM
I don't know how recent this is but as far as the last time I seen Dan back in 2003 looks accurate.....


http://www.nypost.com/seven/04122007/photos/biz038a.jpg








Here is another picture I found......



http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/unfairpark/pastorini_cosbie.jpg


Thanks! He's still good looking. He's aged well. Like fine wine.

Showtime100
01-15-2009, 12:08 PM
She looks great for her age...I'd be interested to see a picture of Dan now if you could dig that up. He was a very good looking guy...

Cute about your wife...most men want younger women! I go by the adage myself...beggers cannot be choosers!

This is the best I could find, this pic from 2007. Texans_Chick had a great vid in another thread but it has been renoved.

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r65/ShowtimeN15580/Houston%20Texans/Harold20and20Dan.jpg

Bob Hayes could play and perhaps star in the '90s IMO, but White & Waters & others couldn't. But apparently White was one of the more popular players among Cowboy fans' favorites of that time judging from the level of indignation on this Board at the suggestion he couldn't make in the NFL of the '90s. But I simply don't think he could. Not as a DT at 255 or thereabouts.
And for you Cowboy fans - no I'm not picking on you and your beloved favorites because I would lump other players of that time (Larry Csonka, Fred Bilentnkoff, Dick Butkus to name a few), in there with your guys.
And on your point about talented, one player who can't compete at the level of another is also not as talented as the other. End of story.

Just my two cents. I've never bought into the whole argument of players doing well or not doing well in different eras.

Simply put because my time is limited here, the rules were not the same then as they are now. Maybe I should say the games were officiated with a different mindset. Besides, who could play at what age now or who now could go back and play then is a highly subjective opinion. So much so it's hard to say what would really happen and all opinions are just that, opinions.

WWJD
01-15-2009, 12:17 PM
Dan still looks good. He's better looking right now than Matt Schaub is! Ha!

You can't compare players of certain eras with any certainty but I do think sparks of greatness that certain guys possess would translate to any time.

infantrycak
01-15-2009, 12:23 PM
Dan still looks good. He's better looking right now than Matt Schaub is! Ha!

You can't compare players of certain eras with any certainty but I do think sparks of greatness that certain guys possess would translate to any time.

Yeah, who is to say how those players' speed, strength, size, etc. would have developed if they had been practicing the modern strength and conditioning programs in college and the pros.

Wolf
01-15-2009, 12:25 PM
Yeah, who is to say how those players' speed, strength, size, etc. would have developed if they had been practicing the modern strength and conditioning programs in college and the pros.

If Earl had that?
I don't even want to think about it

WWJD
01-15-2009, 12:33 PM
If Earl had that?
I don't even want to think about it

Yea..good Lord...he was already the king of the beasts.

Poor Earl. I hope his recent back surgery helped him. I saw him some months back and he was in a wheelchair. Hard to correlate that man in that chair with the RB Earl...

HoustonFrog
01-15-2009, 12:34 PM
Thanks! He's still good looking. He's aged well. Like fine wine.


Shaking hands with another Cowboy TE that I thought did a bang up job..Doug Cosbie.

nunusguy
01-15-2009, 12:45 PM
Randy wasn't even the biggest guy back when he was playing. I do know though that he was the strongest and I still think he could play today and dominate. I won't be swayed about that...I saw the guy for too many years. Great is great and he was GREAT.

You lost me with Butkus...of course that dude could still play! Huh?

But to each his own...it's all opinion anyway.

Here's another one who I'd lump in the same group with White who was a similar type player - Alan Page of the famous "Purple People Eaters". Both would be just too small to hack it in the '90s as DTs even though both players were HOFs (I believe they were, without looking it up ?).