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PHAROAH
01-04-2009, 02:29 AM
Guys if one of the top QB's such as Sam Bradford or let's say Mark Sanchez fall to us #15 should we take a hard look at them or are we satisfied with QB Matt Schaub and his health issues and prone mistakes during clutch situations that cost us games this season. I know that DE, OLB, DT & Safety are the Texans biggest needs going into the draft but to pass on a sure fire franchise QB Like Sanchez who has played in the West Coast system while in college is really attractive if he falls to #15 spot.



Mark Sanchez Numbers.

Height: 6'2"
Weight: 225 lbs
College: USC
Flag: N/A
Overall Rank: 15
Position Rank: 3


QB Rating:164.64 Passing Yards: 3,207 TD's: 34


:fans:

barrett
01-04-2009, 02:32 AM
you're drunk. sleep it off.

PHAROAH
01-04-2009, 02:39 AM
you're drunk. sleep it off. Why I'm I drunk? Matt Schaub hasn't proved he is a franchise QB yet and why is it such a bad thought when this guy is constantly hurt and has to fight a journeyman QB like Sage Rosenfels to keep his job and some of you guys were calling for him to replace Matt Schaub as the starter? I'm not saying that Matt isn't developing but how long do we have to wait for this guy to live up to the contract that was given to him before we have to go into another direction.

:gun:

PHAROAH
01-04-2009, 02:44 AM
I'm sorry i'm not sold on Matt Schaub just yet and he might grow into that player he has the tools but I question his leadership skills and his descision making in crucial points in games.

mexican_texan
01-04-2009, 02:45 AM
you're drunk. sleep it off.
Seconded.

Marcus
01-04-2009, 02:48 AM
Guys if one of the top QB's such as Sam Bradford or let's say Mark Sanchez fall to us #15 should we take a hard look at them or are we satisfied with QB Matt Schaub and his health issues and prone mistakes during clutch situations that cost us games this season. I know that DE, OLB, DT & Safety are the Texans biggest needs going into the draft but to pass on a sure fire franchise QB Like Sanchez who has played in the West Coast system while in college is really attractive if he falls to #15 spot.

You don't think Sam Bradford or Mark Sanchez would make any mistakes?

Pass.

mussop
01-04-2009, 03:32 AM
Bradford yes Sanchez no. Simply becasue I dont think Sanchez is a franchise QB. Bradford IMO is. I dont see any way Bradford falls to us but if he did I would snatch him up in a heart beat. There is no more valuable comodity in the NFL than a franchise QB. Keep him for a year and develop him then trade the less talented one for multiple future picks.

Once again I only do this because I believe he is a franchise QB. You dont pass up a franchise QB which is why he will never fall to 15.

dalemurphy
01-04-2009, 03:43 AM
I'm sorry i'm not sold on Matt Schaub just yet and he might grow into that player he has the tools but I question his leadership skills and his descision making in crucial points in games.

He finished the season with a passer rating of 93, which puts him about 7 overall, ahead of guys like: Tony Romo, Matt Ryan, Jay Cutler, McNabb, Eli Manning, Rothlisburger....

In his second season as a starter, he showed dramatic improvement in almost every area. The coaches and players believe in him. Since the Miami game, I believe he's thrown 10 TDs and 3 interceptions. He gets rid of the ball to avoid sacks. He completes 66% of his passes. He threw for more big plays in 11 games than Peyton did in 16 games. He proved against Green Bay and Tennessee that he can take hits. Schaub is clearly better than the majority of NFL starters and he's still young and improving. I'm not sure what it would take for you to be "sold" on him... I'm guessing you were a VY guy, huh?

Kaiser Toro
01-04-2009, 04:11 AM
I would love Sanchez in the 6th for the Texans. Outside of that I see no value.

PHAROAH
01-04-2009, 04:51 AM
He finished the season with a passer rating of 93, which puts him about 7 overall, ahead of guys like: Tony Romo, Matt Ryan, Jay Cutler, McNabb, Eli Manning, Rothlisburger....

In his second season as a starter, he showed dramatic improvement in almost every area. The coaches and players believe in him. Since the Miami game, I believe he's thrown 10 TDs and 3 interceptions. He gets rid of the ball to avoid sacks. He completes 66% of his passes. He threw for more big plays in 11 games than Peyton did in 16 games. He proved against Green Bay and Tennessee that he can take hits. Schaub is clearly better than the majority of NFL starters and he's still young and improving. I'm not sure what it would take for you to be "sold" on him... I'm guessing you were a VY guy, huh?
I like VY but I know that he isn't a good QB right now either but one thing about VY he did take his team to the Playoffs and they have no wr's on that team. I think that a lot people get turned on by stats but he was playing poor as hell at the beginning of the season that is the reason we didn't make the playoffs. Sure he played well down the stretch I give him credit but he still hasn't proved that he can stay healthy and play consistant for full season to say we don't need another very good option at QB.


:cowboy1:

PHAROAH
01-04-2009, 05:00 AM
Guys i'm not saying to use the #1 pick and to reach on a QB but Mark Sanchez, Josh Freeman & Sam Bradford will have a major impact on the first round and depending on Freeman & Sanchez's workouts one of the QB's will fall Like Daunte Culpepper, Ben Rothlisberger & Jay Cutler fell out of the top 10. Bradford has the weakest arm out of them all so he could fall as well.

PHAROAH
01-04-2009, 05:02 AM
You don't think Sam Bradford or Mark Sanchez would make any mistakes?

Pass.
They all make mistakes dude come on.

mancunian
01-04-2009, 05:50 AM
We don't need a 1st round QB, Schuab has impoved over the 2 years he's been here and I think the team has more glaring needs. Maybe some help in the secondary or another pass rusher to play opposite Mario

Old School
01-04-2009, 05:57 AM
Guys if one of the top QB's such as Sam Bradford or let's say Mark Sanchez fall to us #15 should we take a hard look at them or are we satisfied with QB Matt Schaub and his health issues and prone mistakes during clutch situations that cost us games this season. I know that DE, OLB, DT & Safety are the Texans biggest needs going into the draft but to pass on a sure fire franchise QB Like Sanchez who has played in the West Coast system while in college is really attractive if he falls to #15 spot.



Mark Sanchez Numbers.

Height: 6'2"
Weight: 225 lbs
College: USC
Flag: N/A
Overall Rank: 15
Position Rank: 3


QB Rating:164.64 Passing Yards: 3,207 TD's: 34


:fans:

Both of those guys are going to be gone before the 3rd round and if the Texans waste anything more than a 4th on a QB they are making a mistake. They have too many other areas that need to be addressed before a project QB can be picked up.
You can complain about Schaubs issues with turnovers but I think "health issues" is a bit of a strech. Almost all of his "health issues" were the result of a cheap shot or getting Teed off on. Most QB's would end up the same way.
How do you know the Sanchez is a franchise QB? Look at what happened to the last 'SC phenom, he is really tearing up the league from the bench. USC collects great talent in all positions that is why his stats are off the charts. Great receivers, great linemen in a pass happy offense can make most QBs look good.
I think trying to start over again at the QB position is a waste of time. Our offense was what? In the top 5? I am happy with that for now. We need to pull our defense out of the gutter to be solid contenders. If our draft is anything other than DL, DB, LB (in any order) in the first three rounds we will be wasting time.

Goatcheese
01-04-2009, 06:07 AM
Why would the Texans want to replace Schaub? :gun:

stingray
01-04-2009, 07:22 AM
The only way we draft a Qb is if we get rid of rosenfels, and we still won't draft one until at least the 4th. This teams needs defense bad and will probably draft a D player three out of the first four rounds. Matt improved throughout the season. His only drawback is the amount of games he misses. Now, if Matt misses a significant amount of games next year then the Texans are gonna have to go a different direction. But as of right now, they should stick with Matt.

Thorn
01-04-2009, 07:23 AM
The offense is starting to roll. In one year we went from 22nd in running to 13th. We went from 11th in passing to 4th. However, we dropped from 12th in scoring to 17th. Next year will be our second year using the ZBS and Iím certain weíll improve on that scoring stat, and maybe even the other two.

I donít think we need to be spending a high draft choice on a QB when we have a serviceable QB as it is. We need to get our defense up to speed. You win championships with defense. We went from 24th in over all defense to 22nd, and both last year and this year we averaged giving up 24 points a game. At this time itís more important to fix the defense.

Certainly that starts with hiring a good DC, but it also starts with patching a few glaring holes in the defensive line and backfield. A good offense will get you into the playoffs, but without a good defense you won't last long in post season play.

Silver Oak
01-04-2009, 08:11 AM
You can complain about Schaubs issues with turnovers but I think "health issues" is a bit of a strech. Almost all of his "health issues" were the result of a cheap shot or getting Teed off on. Most QB's would end up the same way.



:goodpost:

RTP2110
01-04-2009, 08:59 AM
If you're saying that Schaub hasn't proved to be a franchise QB, then why would you suggest drafting one? Obviously any rookie out there hasn't proven anything either. By the way we have already tried that ''drafting a franchise QB in the 1st round'' method before. It didn't work out so well for us.

Schaub has played about a season and a half, and IMO he's coming nicely. And, as mentioned, we have too many holes on this team to be drafting a project in round 1. We need someone who can come in and make an impact on defense, IMO.

NitroGSXR
01-04-2009, 09:08 AM
I wouldn't be so quick to discount the Texans selecting a QB early as well. Why I think that way is because of the money involved. Would Schaub be worth the 10+ million that he's going to want when his contract is up after the season. Money may be a factor in getting this guy resigned.

We also have to remember that Kubiak selected a QB last season which stunned many of us. There had to be some underlying reason why he did that. Maybe it had nothing to do with Sage Rosenfels possibly being traded or whatever. I firmly believe that we had no reason to think that we would be needing a QB after Rosenfels strung together a few wins in 2007. Kubiak had a different strategy and plan obviously.

I'll be fine with keeping Matt Schaub as well. I like the guy. I love his composure and his obvious leadership skills inside the huddle but he does have his fair share of problems. The amount of passing yards that the Texans have wasn't from Schaub making a great throw time again and again. It's from the Texans' playcalling. Kinda like a Chad Pennington being thrown into the perfect system for his abilities and Chad's definitely used that to his advantage.

Someone stated that Schaub isn't injury prone but rather injured by malicious hits. I don't know. It sure seems like Matt Schaub has a magnet on his back for defenders. Teams/players may be set out to attack Schaub in any way possible no matter the repercussions. Does a team really want a QB like that? I remember an interview by Albert Haynesworth (I believe?) where he would say that for some reason he gets extra motivated when he faces David Carr and that feeling had carried over to Schaub since he still wears the same number (Keep in mind, this is NOT a direct quote. It's just something that I seemed to remember but I could be wrong.). Just scary having a QB who everyone just seems to want to destroy.

I just don't think that selecting a QB in the draft would be all that shocking to me this time around. Even if one was selected in the first round. I don't think it'll happen. I just wouldn't be stunned is all. There are many questions that need to be approached.

Eh. I don't really care much who our QB is. I just want to win.

Grams
01-04-2009, 09:18 AM
I like VY but I know that he isn't a good QB right now either but one thing about VY he did take his team to the Playoffs and they have no wr's on that team. I think that a lot people get turned on by stats but he was playing poor as hell at the beginning of the season that is the reason we didn't make the playoffs. Sure he played well down the stretch I give him credit but he still hasn't proved that he can stay healthy and play consistant for full season to say we don't need another very good option at QB.


:cowboy1:

The defense and the running game took them to the playoffs.

The whole Texans team did not play well in the beginning of the year.

The offense finished in the top of the league and the defense finished at the bottom of the league. Gee - I wonder what our draft needs could be? Defense - ya think??

PhilpW
01-04-2009, 09:32 AM
No, because a QB will not fill a need position or best player available at the 15th spot. Our defense will be targeted early and often. QB may be addressed in free agency.

ChampionTexan
01-04-2009, 09:32 AM
Is there anyone on this board who doesn't believe that Gary Kubiak genuinely believes in Matt Schaub? Whether that belief is well founded isn't the point - my perception is that his belief in Schaub is real, it's strong, and it's held by the guy primarily responsible for making the draft-day decisions.

Oh yeah - there's also the little fact that if he's proven wrong about it, it's almost a certainty that he's out of a job, so Schaub's successor might not be a real high priority on his draft wish-list.

Couple the above points with the fact that we had the #3 ranked offense (Yeah I know all about the RZ problems), and a defense that was bad enough to get the DC fired, and I don't see any realistic scenario where the #15 pick goes towards a QB, no matter who slides down the board.

Thorn
01-04-2009, 09:50 AM
If you think about it, having a franchise QB slip to 15 would be a good thing for us. Someone may want to trade some picks for that QB. I can deal with that. We did pretty well for ourselves by trading down in the first round last year.

beerlover
01-04-2009, 10:07 AM
Bradford will not be an option. Sanchez I don't know. Stafford would be the most likely but only to use as trade down material. y'all realize this is excatly what the Texans did last year so the Ravens could move up to draft Flacco. turned out good for them & Texans :)

TexansSeminole
01-04-2009, 10:24 AM
Jeez. Sanchez or Freeman in the first round would be a huge failure of a draft pick IMO.

Drew_Smoke
01-04-2009, 10:32 AM
I was against taking Carr over Peppers (not cuz I am sort of psychotic and can see the future) because you can always get a journeyman to babysit. I though they could have gotten Drew Bledsoe or someone similar...

See: Kurt Warner


I would not ever burn a one on a QB unless he was a can't miss.

I laughed at Atlanta for taking their boy in '08.


And I would still like to know what they really think of Alex Brink.

Hervoyel
01-04-2009, 10:41 AM
Why I'm I drunk?:gun:

Ok, I'm usually not much of a grammar nazi (except for that whole "lose-loose" thing) but that was just too funny. You're not as think as we drunk you are?

To your post I don't think that's necessary at all. We are not going to find a "perfect" QB no matter how many of them we try out. Every single QB makes some mistakes. Every QB throws some interceptions and every QB fumbles. You put the ball in a single players hand every play and he's going to have more opportunities to do it than anyone else but still, it happens.

Does Schaub need to cut back on the number of mistakes he makes. Of course he does. In the last quarter of the season he threw 5 TD's and only 2 picks. He lost one fumble (out of 2 admittedly). The difference between the first quarter of the season (Schaub's first four games) and the last was significant. To start the year he threw 5 TD's and 7 picks. He again lost 1 fumble but this time it was out of 4 that got loose.

The guy is making progress at this point and I don't know how anyone could not see that or think we would be better off trying to draft a QB in the first round. In statistics he's improved clearly. To the eye, watching him play after he came back from the knee injury he's improved clearly. In both his seasons here in Houston he's played 11 games. The improvement is pretty obvious.

In 2007 he three 9 TD's and 9 Picks. In 2008 he threw 15 and 10 respectively. In 2007 his QB rating was a respectable if not specatacular 87.2 while in 2008 that jumped up to 92.7. He attempted almost 100 more passes this year and threw for around 800 more yards.

The only thing left to question in my mind is his injury problem and I don't question that right now. He missed one game due to illness. That can happen to anyone. The 4 games missed following the Minnesota game came as a result of a clear, fined cheap shot from Jared Allen. Line any QB in the NFL up you want and let Allen pop him a couple of times like that in the knee and they'll miss some games.

We don't need a first round QB. We need a new backup QB (and might not even get that) and we need a whole lot of help on defense but we don't need to be spending first round picks on positions where we are set.

And yes, I said that. We are set at QB.

Thorn
01-04-2009, 10:52 AM
And yes, I said that. We are set at QB.

LOL, yes you said it. I've gone the full gamut with Schaub. I started out hating and criticizing the trade to get him, and was a Sage supporter. Then I went to admitting I was wrong on the trade, then back to thinking he was to injury prone and we should've been starting Sage all along. Now I've accepted that Schaub is our best chance to win, because Sage ain't.

The last two years have been really something. I've gone from :panic: to :brickwall: and now I just accept the inevitability of Schaub. We could do much worse, and some teams are.

b0ng
01-04-2009, 10:59 AM
Too many other glaring needs than QB. There were two (2!) what looks to be franchise QB's in the last draft, and another two drafts ago. There's plenty of prospects coming out that look like they can play the part so I think right now having Schaub gives us the luxury of spending a late round flyer on a QB. Maybe next year, or the one following.

nunusguy
01-04-2009, 11:05 AM
Kubiak may be coaching for his job in 2009, and to start the year off by drafting a QB with the Texans first round pick would be to refute the wisdom of trading two 2nd round picks for his current starting QB.

infantrycak
01-04-2009, 11:33 AM
QB Matt Schaub and his health issues and prone mistakes during clutch situations that cost us games this season.

Care to name those games? Seems like he had a few clutch game winning drives.

Wolf
01-04-2009, 11:56 AM
If you think about it, having a franchise QB slip to 15 would be a good thing for us. Someone may want to trade some picks for that QB. I can deal with that. We did pretty well for ourselves by trading down in the first round last year.

cough*minnesota* cough

mexican_texan
01-04-2009, 12:08 PM
The Dolphins want to get rid of John Beck. Instead of drafting another Quinton Porter or Alex Brink, we could trade a late pick for him.

ObsiWan
01-04-2009, 12:23 PM
I like VY but I know that he isn't a good QB right now either but one thing about VY he did take his team to the Playoffs and they have no wr's on that team. I think that a lot people get turned on by stats but he was playing poor as hell at the beginning of the season that is the reason we didn't make the playoffs. Sure he played well down the stretch I give him credit but he still hasn't proved that he can stay healthy and play consistant for full season to say we don't need another very good option at QB.


:cowboy1:

no he didn't.
they got to the playoffs in spite of VY, not because of him.
The Titans got there last year the same way the got their this year: Good Defense and strong running attack.

And to waste - and I mean WASTE - a first day pick on a QB when we have so many needs on defense would be irresponsible; ESPECIALLY when you don't expect that QB to replace the starter any time soon.

Now if one of those guys does slip down to us, I agree with Thorn, we trade down like we did last draft and parley that position into extra picks.

thunderkyss
01-04-2009, 12:34 PM
We don't need a 1st round QB, Schuab has impoved over the 2 years he's been here and I think the team has more glaring needs. Maybe some help in the secondary or another pass rusher to play opposite Mario

Pharoah, I understand your concern, but as long as we're paying Matt Schaub starter money(damn good starter money I might add) it makes no sense to Kubiak, Matt, the Team, us fans..... to spend a first on a QB.

When you spend a first day pick on a QB, you're saying you are not happy with what you have under center, and are looking at options.

Remember the fit that McNabb's mom had when they drafted Kolb??

When you spend a 1st round pick, you're saying change is eminent.

I'm with you, Schaub hasn't proven to me that he is a 1st tier QB. But even Drew Brees was a disappointment for his first two years.

Marcus
01-04-2009, 01:51 PM
I like VY but I know that he isn't a good QB right now either but one thing about VY he did take his team to the Playoffs . . .

:spit:

Well, if VY took his team to the playoffs, then that means David Carr took his team to the playoffs, right?

:thinking:

sbalderrama
01-04-2009, 03:31 PM
Hm, which team won our division this year and has the best record in the NFL?

Oh yeah, some team with a GREAT defense and a competent, but not great, QB. This isn't college, where apparently the defense talent pool is so low that teams barely even try to field defense anymore. In the NFL, defense is often the difference maker.

Schaub has way more than enough ability to take this team to the playoffs. Drafting any player, much less a QB, is always a crapshoot. Its very rare that the QB's someone thinks are going to be "all that" turn out to be "all that". The Elways and Mannings are the exception rather than the rule it seems. OTOH, occassionally those 6th rounders turn out to be something rather special.

Elway was able to take the Bronco's to the playoffs nearly single handedly multiple times, but he was never able to win anything much in the post season until he had a solid TEAM around him.

We arn't a "franchise QB" away from a playoff team. We are nearly an entire decent defense away from being a playoff team. And a great defense away from being a superbowl team.

J-Russ
01-04-2009, 03:39 PM
I wouldn't mind drafting Josh Freeman in the 4th or later rounds. Right now he's a potential 1st round QB, but he might fall so who knows. He hasn't really done anything spectatcular in college football, and is purely all potential, which is really the only reason he has the chance to be drafted in the 1st round. Since he isn't a potential 1st round prospect based on his college plays, it means either he owns the combine or he sinks like the titanic on draft day.

Jackie Chiles
01-04-2009, 03:50 PM
I was against taking Carr over Peppers (not cuz I am sort of psychotic and can see the future) because you can always get a journeyman to babysit. I though they could have gotten Drew Bledsoe or someone similar...

That is a good blonde joke right there.

Blake
01-04-2009, 03:51 PM
I have no doubt we will look at getting a QB in the draft.

Not saying I agree with these picks, but I could see them drafting:

Tim Tebow in the first.
John Parker Wilson in the late 5-7 rounds.

b0ng
01-04-2009, 03:58 PM
I have no doubt we will look at getting a QB in the draft.

Not saying I agree with these picks, but I could see them drafting:

Tim Tebow in the first.
John Parker Wilson in the late 5-7 rounds.

Yeah I'm sure Kubiak is impressed with Tebow's mechanics and footwork.

PHAROAH
01-04-2009, 06:17 PM
I just wanted to see what you guys thought I am with Kubiak because he is a really good coach and he is an excellent play caller I just want to win and tired of talking about numbers and next year all of the time. I agree with you guys QB shouldn't be addressed during day one of the draft because of all of the needs on defense and if our guy is gone and one of the QB's drop then trading back is the best option.