PDA

View Full Version : Mike Shanahan Fired


AnthonyE
12-30-2008, 04:24 PM
http://www.realgmfootball.com/src_wiretap_archives/10318/20081230/breaking_news_shanahan_out_in_denver/

Mike Shanahan and his staff have been fired by the Denver Broncos, according to the National Football Post.

Shanhan has been the head coach of the Broncos since the 1995 season and won Super Bowls in 1997 and 1998.

The Broncos were 8-5 and on the doorstep of winning the AFC West, but lost their final three games, including a 52-21 loss at San Diego.

Prior to his work with NationalFootballPost.com, Michael Lombardi helped Denver with personnel evaluations during the 2007 season.

dang.

brakos82
12-30-2008, 04:25 PM
Breaking News on NFLN... it's on the NFL Front Page too...

DiehardChris
12-30-2008, 04:25 PM
Whoa

no way!!!! HUGE bombshell!!

Sal Rosenberg
12-30-2008, 04:26 PM
Wow!holy cow!

Vinny
12-30-2008, 04:26 PM
what has he accomplished without Elway? Jack squat, that's what.

brakos82
12-30-2008, 04:26 PM
That's twice today that somebody else has posted something at the same time that I do... :foottap:

GuerillaBlack
12-30-2008, 04:27 PM
That's twice today that somebody else has posted something at the same time that I do... :foottap:

And his thread lives.

DiehardChris
12-30-2008, 04:28 PM
This is huge.

I wonder how it will affect the Texans, because you KNOW it will.

Sal Rosenberg
12-30-2008, 04:30 PM
:mcnugget:

Brandon420tx
12-30-2008, 04:31 PM
I wonder who from their defensive coaching staff will end up as our DC ... -sigh-

infantrycak
12-30-2008, 04:35 PM
Add Bob Slowik to the list of folks to be interviewed for DC.

Pantherstang84
12-30-2008, 04:36 PM
I wonder who from their defensive coaching staff will end up as our DC ... -sigh-

/rimshot

On the firing...

Wow! Just wow!

HOU-TEX
12-30-2008, 04:37 PM
what has he accomplished without Elway? Jack squat, that's what.

Yep, and he's done even worse without Kubiak.

It'll be interesting to see what he does from here. Take a year off maybe? There's no way he'd come here and work under Kubiak and his son. If he did, the poster's who are always clamoring for National exposure will surely be happy.

MeLoveTexans
12-30-2008, 04:37 PM
I wonder who from their defensive coaching staff will end up as our DC ... -sigh-

I like how your Mr. Rogers avatar looks just like shanny. except less orange
http://www.volterraproducts.net/images/celebphotos/CoachMikeShanahanDenverBroncos1.jpg

Vinny
12-30-2008, 04:39 PM
Yep, and he's done even worse without Kubiak.

It'll be interesting to see what he does from here. Take a year off maybe? There's no way he'd come here and work under Kubiak and his son. If he did, the poster's who are always clamoring for National exposure will surely be happy.There is always the Raiders or the Lions. :lion:

rollinstone18
12-30-2008, 04:39 PM
That's a shame. I like Shanahan. He's strictly an offensive mind and the Broncos have most of the pieces in place on that side of the ball.

Their defense on the other hand, just sucks.

HoustonFrog
12-30-2008, 04:39 PM
Damn, I'd rather have the rat Shanny as coach of Cowboys than Wade. I think their offense is still good and he has done well with Cutler. He also made a guy like Jake the Snake watchable. Their defense sucks.

Pantherstang84
12-30-2008, 04:40 PM
Yep, and he's done even worse without Kubiak.

It'll be interesting to see what he does from here. Take a year off maybe? There's no way he'd come here and work under Kubiak and his son. If he did, the poster's who are always clamoring for National exposure will surely be happy.

Cleveland? One thing is for sure. If Shanahan wants to work next year, he will be employed. However, with $20 mil now in his pocket, he might want to move to Houston to be with the grand baby.

VP of Football Operations here?

DiehardChris
12-30-2008, 04:41 PM
This has to instantly be the most attractive vacant position, right?

The Jets are overspenders with a huge question mark at QB.

The Browns are severely overrated and have questions all over the place.

The Lions are the Lions.

The Broncos have an elite offense in place, an elite QB in the making, but a horrible defense.

Is that a place Cowher might end up in? Did Denver also fire their GM?

Pantherstang84
12-30-2008, 04:43 PM
This has to instantly be the most attractive vacant position, right?

The Jets are overspenders with a huge question mark at QB.

The Browns are severely overrated and have questions all over the place.

The Lions are the Lions.

The Broncos have an elite offense in place, an elite QB in the making, but a horrible defense.

Is that a place Cowher might end up in? Did Denver also fire their GM?

I think Shanny was the GM. They might have had someone with the title but Shanny made all of the player personnel decisions.

HOU-TEX
12-30-2008, 04:44 PM
There is always the Raiders or the Lions. :lion:

Wasn't he already dicked by the Al and the Raiders once?

DiehardChris
12-30-2008, 04:44 PM
I think Shanny was the GM. They might have had someone with the title but Shanny made all of the player personnel decisions.

If that's the case - sounds like a perfect spot for Cowher since he wants total control.

Problem is - there's no way they can possibly change their offensive scheme with as great as they played last year... but if the whole staff is gone - I guess they have to? Bill Cowher certainly isn't going to run a bootlegging/waggle/ZBS offense!

Vinny
12-30-2008, 04:45 PM
If that's the case - sounds like a perfect spot for Cowher since he wants total control.

Problem is - there's no way they can possibly change their offensive scheme with as great as they played last year... but if the whole staff is gone - I guess they have to? Bill Cowher certainly isn't going to run a bootlegging/waggle/ZBS offense!Cowher told the Browns that he isn't ready to come back yet and he plans on sitting out at least one more season.

dtran04
12-30-2008, 04:46 PM
I bet if any of his 5 or 6 RB's had stayed healthy, they would be in the playoffs and he wouldn't have been fired. Crazy business. I can't even imagine losing that many backs. The Texans lost two and were 1 Slaton injury from being in shambles.

Vinny
12-30-2008, 04:48 PM
I bet if any of his 5 or 6 RB's had stayed healthy, they would be in the playoffs and he wouldn't have been fired. Crazy business. I can't even imagine losing that many backs. The Texans lost two and were 1 Slaton injury from being in shambles.
his defense gave up about 450 points this season....his offense was fine. Similar to the Texans I'd say...we gave up nearly 400 points ourselves.

HoustonFrog
12-30-2008, 04:49 PM
Cowher told the Browns that he isn't ready to come back yet and he plans on sitting out at least one more season.

But I read today that he told the Jets he would talk to them if he could bring in his own people. Maybe he didn't want the Browns since they were division rivals.

Pantherstang84
12-30-2008, 04:50 PM
Cowher told the Browns that he isn't ready to come back yet and he plans on sitting out at least one more season.

But there is also news today that he is at least entertaining an offer from the Jets.

Cowher Talking to Jets (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3799959)

Kaiser Toro
12-30-2008, 04:50 PM
But I read today that he told the Jets he would talk to them if he could bring in his own people. Maybe he didn't want the Browns since they were division rivals.

Cowher is still tight with the Rooneys.

Blake
12-30-2008, 04:51 PM
Cowher told the Browns that he isn't ready to come back yet and he plans on sitting out at least one more season.

How many times have players, coaches and everyone in sports said one thing, and then 2 seconds later they do it. All the time.

I wouldnt be surprised if Cowher goes here. 50/50.

WWJD
12-30-2008, 04:51 PM
He'll get another head coaching job.

LonerATO
12-30-2008, 04:52 PM
I see him being in Buffalo

Vinny
12-30-2008, 04:52 PM
But I read today that he told the Jets he would talk to them if he could bring in his own people. Maybe he didn't want the Browns since they were division rivals.I don't think division rivals had much to do with the decision personally...He has deep roots in Cleveland since he played there and started his coaching career there under Marty Schottenheimer....but he may not have liked their situation.

Pantherstang84
12-30-2008, 04:54 PM
If that's the case - sounds like a perfect spot for Cowher since he wants total control.

Problem is - there's no way they can possibly change their offensive scheme with as great as they played last year... but if the whole staff is gone - I guess they have to? Bill Cowher certainly isn't going to run a bootlegging/waggle/ZBS offense!

You're right. He won't but I love that offense. I'm glad the Texans are running it.

nunusguy
12-30-2008, 04:54 PM
I dunno, any chance Denver comes after Kubiak ?

JWarren14
12-30-2008, 04:55 PM
Holmgren is also out at the Hawks right? I thought I remembered reading this past game was his last. A lot of vacancies, I sure hope Kubiak doesn't somehow end up in Denver, but I guess we would just get Shanny? Its weird, he has been the Broncos coach almost as long as I have been alive.

Pantherstang84
12-30-2008, 04:59 PM
I dunno, any chance Denver comes after Kubiak ?

I doubt it. He is under contract for 2 more years here. Even if they do, Kubiak would probably turn them down. He has stated more than once this is his dream job.

If anything, Daddy Shanny might end up here as a consultant in the front office if he doesn't want to coach next year. Maybe even as Kubes boss.

sbalderrama
12-30-2008, 05:00 PM
I never thought they'd ever fire Shanny. Amazing. I think Shanahan has made a number of missteps in recent years, starting with probably costing the Bronco's the post season a few years ago by pulling Plummer for Cutler toward the end of that season.

This instantly has to be one of if not THE plum jobs now. Clean slate. Huge Tradition. Great ownership. Great Stadium. Great Fanbase. If that can't lure Cower out of retirement nothing will. No way the Bronc's can go with some unknown coach after the standard that has been set there for so many years. Possible great landing spot for the Tuna if he opts out of Miami.

HoustonFrog
12-30-2008, 05:02 PM
I don't think division rivals had much to do with the decision personally...He has deep roots in Cleveland since he played there and started his coaching career there under Marty Schottenheimer....but he may not have liked their situation.

I definitely can see that. I agree that the Jets situation would be less work putting in the pieces if you ask me. Cleveland may be a project.

LonerATO
12-30-2008, 05:06 PM
I'm still going to say Buffalo!!! He will get almost near full control of the team and has one of the best runningbacks in the league with Lynch and Edwards will be his new Elway.

nero THE zero
12-30-2008, 05:07 PM
If that's the case - sounds like a perfect spot for Cowher since he wants total control.

Problem is - there's no way they can possibly change their offensive scheme with as great as they played last year... but if the whole staff is gone - I guess they have to? Bill Cowher certainly isn't going to run a bootlegging/waggle/ZBS offense!
Yep. Seems like a mighty fine situation for Cowher - the offense is in place and he can work his magic with the defense; the division is also weak and he would have control over personnel. Denver has also slowly strayed from the strict ZBS scheme so, while he would have to make some changes on offense, it wouldn't have to be such drastic changes.

Pantherstang84
12-30-2008, 05:07 PM
I'm saying Shanny will go to Cleveland.

Second Honeymoon
12-30-2008, 05:09 PM
But I read today that he told the Jets he would talk to them if he could bring in his own people. Maybe he didn't want the Browns since they were division rivals.

That is exactly right, but it still looks like Cowher is going to sit out another season unless someone blows him away with a package.

Ironically, I think the best move would be for the Cowboys to talk to Shanny and kick Wade AND Jason to the curb. Jones would have an out too and he could claim he just couldn't pass up the chance at Shanny and had to reneg on his post-game 'there will be no coaching changes' statement.

Pantherstang84
12-30-2008, 05:11 PM
That is exactly right, but it still looks like Cowher is going to sit out another season unless someone blows him away with a package.

Ironically, I think the best move would be for the Cowboys to talk to Shanny and kick Wade AND Jason to the curb. Jones would have an out too and he could claim he just couldn't pass up the chance at Shanny and had to reneg on his post-game 'there will be no coaching changes' statement.

Shefter was saying on NFLN that the chances of Cowher coaching in 2009 are about 0%.

kastofsna
12-30-2008, 05:12 PM
wow, i was just thinking the other day how he was teflon and had zero chance of getting fired

LonerATO
12-30-2008, 05:13 PM
DAMN! Just reported the Bills are keeping Dick Jauron. Well so much for my shot in the dark.

DiehardChris
12-30-2008, 05:19 PM
Cowher told the Browns that he isn't ready to come back yet and he plans on sitting out at least one more season.

Right. But today comes word that he's going to hear the Jets out.

EDIT - oops, a couple of people already said that.

Grams
12-30-2008, 05:23 PM
Damn, I'd rather have the rat Shanny as coach of Cowboys than Wade. I think their offense is still good and he has done well with Cutler. He also made a guy like Jake the Snake watchable. Their defense sucks.

Kubiak made Jake the Snake watchable I believe.

kcdoubleeagle
12-30-2008, 05:28 PM
JUst. Unbelievable. Shanahan, IMHO, is a great coach.

mussop
12-30-2008, 05:41 PM
Dont know how much control hes had over the D in Denver but could this be a consideration???

DiehardChris
12-30-2008, 05:43 PM
Dont know how much control hes had over the D in Denver but could this be a consideration???

No, never. First, Shanny's an offensive guy, period. Second - he's a huge Type A. No way he'll ever be anyone's assistant or coordinator. Third - he's going to be a head coach. He's probably an even more attractive option than Cowher at this point. If not, a close second.

Insideop
12-30-2008, 05:52 PM
That is exactly right, but it still looks like Cowher is going to sit out another season unless someone blows him away with a package.

Ironically, I think the best move would be for the Cowboys to talk to Shanny and kick Wade AND Jason to the curb. Jones would have an out too and he could claim he just couldn't pass up the chance at Shanny and had to reneg on his post-game 'there will be no coaching changes' statement.

I can't see Shanahan going to Dallas. He would want full control and I don't think Jerry would give it. Two "Alpha Dogs" :wild: in the same pack could get ugly!

painekiller
12-30-2008, 06:08 PM
I dunno, any chance Denver comes after Kubiak ?

Yes they can ask for permission, McNair does not have to grant it though.

Thorn
12-30-2008, 06:12 PM
No, never. First, Shanny's an offensive guy, period. Second - he's a huge Type A. No way he'll ever be anyone's assistant or coordinator. Third - he's going to be a head coach. He's probably an even more attractive option than Cowher at this point. If not, a close second.


If the Texans were looking for a head coach, it would be hard to pick between Cowher or Shanny senior. They both are very very good. I don't see why Denver got rid of him. At least the Texans had enough sense to keep Kubiac and get rid of the defensive side of the coaching staff where the problem actually was. Denver should have done the same thing. I think Denver will regret this.

spurstexanstros
12-30-2008, 06:16 PM
What is the liklihood of Shannahan Sr. being in Reliant as a consultant, if he doesnt have a job in the offseason? I would say 100% Imagine all the resources he is going to give to his son and his friend. I bet he is gonna go the route of unpaid consultant to the Texans so he can earn the money off the remainder of his contract with the Broncos..this is great news for the Texans.

mussop
12-30-2008, 06:19 PM
I dunno, any chance Denver comes after Kubiak ?
They should of contacted us about a trade before they fired him. Since we are Denver South why not do some coach swapping. :shades:Hmmmm would you trade Kubiack for a more proven Shanny??? How about trading picks in the first round and swopping coaches??????

Pantherstang84
12-30-2008, 06:19 PM
What is the liklihood of Shannahan Sr. being in Reliant as a consultant, if he doesnt have a job in the offseason? I would say 100% Imagine all the resources he is going to give to his son and his friend. I bet he is gonna go the route of unpaid consultant to the Texans so he can earn the money off the remainder of his contract with the Broncos..this is great news for the Texans.

That would be cool. However, I don't know what he could do here but take a Parcell's/Miami type role. It would be nice for Denver to pay him to give us his expertise.

steelbtexan
12-30-2008, 06:27 PM
Shanny> Greir

HoustonFrog
12-30-2008, 07:12 PM
That is exactly right, but it still looks like Cowher is going to sit out another season unless someone blows him away with a package.

Ironically, I think the best move would be for the Cowboys to talk to Shanny and kick Wade AND Jason to the curb. Jones would have an out too and he could claim he just couldn't pass up the chance at Shanny and had to reneg on his post-game 'there will be no coaching changes' statement.

I mentioned this earlier...kick Wade to D coordinator where he is tops and belongs and give Shanny Romo and the offense and leading the team. He wouldn't do it though and Jerry seems serious about stubbornly bringing the team down

b0ng
12-30-2008, 08:13 PM
Thats just the most retarded thing. The rest of the AFC West is collectively celebrating that they don't have to deal with Shananagins.

Shananagins.

b0ng
12-30-2008, 08:18 PM
what has he accomplished without Elway? Jack squat, that's what.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq263/b0ngerz/jobsecurity.jpg

Vinny
12-30-2008, 08:21 PM
http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq263/b0ngerz/jobsecurity.jpg

all that equals one playoff win for the post elway broncs. Elway won 12 playoff games and appeared in 5 Super Bowls.

kastofsna
12-30-2008, 08:21 PM
2 losing seasons in 14? i'll take that

b0ng
12-30-2008, 08:32 PM
all that equals one playoff win for the post elway broncs. Elway won 12 playoff games and appeared in 5 Super Bowls.

This sounds like the same logic that got Schottenheimer canned off of the Chargers.

Besides, why fire him when he gets another great looking QB in Cutler? I imagine that Denver is going to have some problems replicating so many good seasons with great draft picks all over.

Vinny
12-30-2008, 08:36 PM
This sounds like the same logic that got Schottenheimer canned off of the Chargers.

Besides, why fire him when he gets another great looking QB in Cutler? I imagine that Denver is going to have some problems replicating so many good seasons with great draft picks all over.How long has Elway been out of the league and you can only win 1 playoff game in all that time after winning all those playoff games with him? To me he is riding on this Elway rep. Looks to me like he used the mile high home field advantage to his advantage and won lot of home games but if you can't win any playoff games then what the heck is the use? I bet you enjoyed David Carr telling the media that "this isn't a must win game...it's a must play well game".

Kaiser Toro
12-30-2008, 08:39 PM
I bet you enjoyed David Carr telling the media that "this isn't a must win game...it's a must play well game".

Please good sir, stop using that name. We will concede the Elway Shanahan relationship, just stop saying that name.

http://moon.felk.cvut.cz/~pisem1/blog/KnightsWhoSayNi.jpg

b0ng
12-30-2008, 08:55 PM
How long has Elway been out of the league and you can only win 1 playoff game in all that time after winning all those playoff games with him? To me he is riding on this Elway rep. Looks to me like he used the mile high home field advantage to his advantage and won lot of home games but if you can't win any playoff games then what the heck is the use? I bet you enjoyed David Carr telling the media that "this isn't a must win game...it's a must play well game".

If you want to tell me that a guy who has shown that he can draft an offense, and perennially gets his team to the playoffs is a bad coach then that is fine.

I'm not buying it, he's going to leave the Bronco's in great shape (Sorry, but going to a team with Cutler, Marshall, and Clady in place already is not a bad situation), and will be one of the hottest coaching commodities in years. Take away his GM powers if you feel so wronged by his draft picks, but I don't think the Bronco's are going to be any better for this move anytime soon.

Vinny
12-30-2008, 08:56 PM
If you want to tell me that a guy who has shown that he can draft an offense, and perennially gets his team to the playoffs is a bad coach then that is fine.

I'm not buying it, he's going to leave the Bronco's in great shape (Sorry, but going to a team with Cutler, Marshall, and Clady in place already is not a bad situation), and will be one of the hottest coaching commodities in years. Take away his GM powers if you feel so wronged by his draft picks, but I don't think the Bronco's are going to be any better for this move anytime soon.

You must be a Texans fan...all shiny and happy with being fairly good. It's easy to name excellent players on all the NFL teams so that doesn't move me. Love him all you want but I don't think he is all that and a bag of chips.

b0ng
12-30-2008, 09:06 PM
You must be a Texans fan...all shiny and happy with being fairly good. It's easy to name excellent players on all the NFL teams so that doesn't move me. Love him all you want but I don't think he is all that and a bag of chips.

I am a Texans fan. But if my coach is consistently putting out a product on the field that competes for the playoffs every year and makes it over half the time I'm not calling for his head. That's a pretty ridiculous litmus test to put a coach against and I can't think of anybody that the Bronco's could try to hire that would improve their team and take them to playoff games and superbowls over and over. No, not even Cowher.

Bad firing in my opinion.

Vinny
12-30-2008, 09:08 PM
I am a Texans fan. But if my coach is consistently putting out a product on the field that competes for the playoffs every year and makes it over half the time I'm not calling for his head. That's a pretty ridiculous litmus test to put a coach against and I can't think of anybody that the Bronco's could try to hire that would improve their team and take them to playoff games and superbowls over and over. No, not even Cowher.

Bad firing in my opinion.psst, these teams all play to win the Super Bowl....they don't play to look good in the regular season. You play to win the big game! Its my guess the owner wanted to win it all more than he wanted to look good in the regular season.

IlliniJen
12-30-2008, 09:11 PM
I bet you enjoyed David Carr telling the media that "this isn't a must win game...it's a must play well game".

Is that before or after DCarr received his Good Job Participatory Trophy?*


*Okay, I stole "Participatory Trophy" from Dan Patrick, but the rest is mine.

b0ng
12-30-2008, 09:15 PM
psst, these teams all play to win the Super Bowl....they don't play to look good in the regular season. You play to win the big game! I guess the owner wanted to win it all more than he wanted to look good in the regular season.

All you have to do is win a Superbowl with Brian Griese and Jake Plummer.

ready, go

Talking about how bad they look in the playoffs is all rendered moot when they fail to make the playoffs because their new coach is more worried about what's going to happen in the post season.

EDIT: And if you think you're making great points and really "opening my eyes" then I don't know what to say anymore. It really sounds like something talk radio jocks would be spewing in Denver right now, not anybody sensible.

kastofsna
12-30-2008, 09:26 PM
lol it's not that easy to make the playoffs consistently for over a decade, let alone win two Super Bowls. not really sure where Vinny is coming from here, there's not even a handful of coaches out there who have a resume like Shanahan's

Brando
12-30-2008, 09:29 PM
The immediate speculation in some league circles when word broke of the termination of long-time Broncos coach Mike Shanahan is that Shanahan has something else cooking, and that he forced his firing by refusing to agree to changes that owner Pat Bowlen wants to make.

According to Jeff Legwold of the Rocky Mountain News, part of that speculation is right on the money.

Per Legwold, Shanahan was fired because he refused to fire defensive coordinator Bob Slowik, whose unit surrendered 52 points in a Week Seventeen loss to the Chargers.

Said Bowlen, in a release issued by the team: “After giving this careful consideration, I have concluded that a change in our football operations is in the best interests of the Denver Broncos. This is certainly a difficult decision, but one that I feel must be made and which will ultimately be in the best interests of all concerned.

“I appreciate the 21 years that Mike Shanahan has given to the organization as an assistant and head coach, and the two Super Bowl wins in that time. His contributions hold a special place in Broncos history.”

So if Shanahan wanted to get out of town because he has something else cooking, what might it be?

Believe it or not, there’s speculation that Shanahan is trying to position himself for the Chargers job.

What’s that, you say? The Chargers are in the playoffs and they’ve made it clear that Norv Turner is coming back as head coach?

That was our reaction, too. But a highly-placed league source suspects that something is happening with Shanahan and San Diego.

In our book, it’s almost as unlikely as Shanahan coaching the Raiders. But we’ll continue to keep our eyes peeled on this one.

pft (http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/12/30/shanahan-has-something-up-his-sleeve/)

infantrycak
12-30-2008, 09:29 PM
psst, these teams all play to win the Super Bowl....they don't play to look good in the regular season. You play to win the big game! Its my guess the owner wanted to win it all more than he wanted to look good in the regular season.

I hear ya, but it took Cowher 13 years to win a super bowl--granted he got there early on. Should Rooney have given up on him? I wonder if the owner wanted to strip him of GM and he refused?--that seems like a better plan than just canning him. That team is built for his offensive plan and while LZ was dismissive about changing that, I don't think it will be easy as just stepping in and keeping it going.

The Pencil Neck
12-30-2008, 09:38 PM
psst, these teams all play to win the Super Bowl....they don't play to look good in the regular season. You play to win the big game! Its my guess the owner wanted to win it all more than he wanted to look good in the regular season.

The question is really about strategy.

If you've got a coach who consistently fields a winning team, then you're probably going to get to the playoffs more often than if you change coaches every 3-4 years if they don't get you to the Super Bowl in that period or if they have an off year. And if you get to the playoffs, you've got the chance to go all the way. So, maximizing your chances to get to the playoffs should maximize your chance to win it all.

Let's look at the coaches that have won it all recently: Coughlin, Dungy, Belichik, Cowher, Gruden, Billick, and Vermiel.

Coughlin had been to the playoffs the two previous years but people were calling for his head in NY because he wasn't able to win it all. Dungy had his team in teh playoffs over and over and over... and had a "can't win the big one" reputation and then finally got one. Belichik... was on the road to being fired when he got lucky. Cowher had a reputation of getting his team to the playoffs without being able to get to the big game... and now everyone wants him as their coach. Gruden was an oddity. He has been pretty good at getting his teams to the playoffs but it was his first year at TB. Vermiel was as good as gone when he made the right moves in the offseason and caught lightning in a bottle.

I'd prefer a coach/team situation like Coughlin, Dungy, and Cowher. Where they consistently get to the playoffs with the occasional off year. Now, I'd love to have a dynasty where we win SB after SB but really, that's pretty rare. I'd love to be in a situation like the Colts, several years of total domination until they get to and win a SB and then some more good years and a chance of more SB's.

At the beginning of the post season, I want to be in the hunt. Shanahan gave the Broncos that, although the last couple of years have been rough.

thunderkyss
12-30-2008, 09:48 PM
That article by PFT makes me wonder.

I was thinking the same thing as another poster, Get rid of the DC, and move on. I'm not a big Cutler fan, but with Shanahan, that system, I know it's only a matter of time.

Phillip Rivers, LT, Sproles...... Sean Merriman..... I can see that too.


But yes, I was completely shocked, when I saw the headline on HoustonChronicle.com

thunderkyss
12-30-2008, 09:49 PM
The question is really about strategy.

If you've got a coach who consistently fields a winning team, then you're probably going to get to the playoffs more often than if you change coaches every 3-4 years if they don't get you to the Super Bowl in that period or if they have an off year. And if you get to the playoffs, you've got the chance to go all the way. So, maximizing your chances to get to the playoffs should maximize your chance to win it all.


Now that's an interesting question.

Can one of our statisticians run the numbers, and see if tenure means anything in this league??

Imatexanfan
12-30-2008, 09:58 PM
shanahan maybe to houston by chance?! i mean kubes and shanahan been together for a while in denver come on ...u gotta think of the possibility.:chickendance:

Marcus
12-30-2008, 09:58 PM
Jesus . . . how stupid can you get?

I've always had the opinion that fans want coaches fired just for the sake of firing them. Kinda like getting closure or something.

Guess it applies to owners as well.

Pantherstang84
12-30-2008, 10:03 PM
shanahan maybe to houston by chance?! i mean kubes and shanahan been together for a while in denver come on ...u gotta think of the possibility.:chickendance:

Not as HC. We have one. Funny thing though looking at the comments from the Denver Post article, folks up there are wanting Kubiak. That ought to make IlliniJen's day.

The1ApplePie
12-30-2008, 11:00 PM
Shanahan had gotten stale and had long stopped really bringing anything to the table. His teams were almost a throwback to the NFL a decade ago, with little or no inovation.

Bellicheat is a douche but at least he brings in fresh blood and new ideas all the time.

euro-Texan
12-30-2008, 11:12 PM
Now that Denver fired him, what are the odds that if he doesn't accept another head coaching position next season, he might come over here in a consultant/asst head coach position? Just a thought..

euro-Texan
12-30-2008, 11:27 PM
Now that Denver fired him, what are the odds that if he doesn't accept another head coaching position next season, he might come over here in a consultant/asst head coach position? Just a thought..


Sorry about that...

Hooston Texan
12-30-2008, 11:32 PM
I'm naturally a pessimist, so here goes:

I'm not so concerned about the Broncos' search for a new head coach affecting us. Kubes and Shanny are clearly good friends, so I doubt Kubes would make a lateral move to work for the guy who just dumped his buddy.

What worries this pessimist is that the Broncos' now must shop for a new GM, too. Might they make a run at Bronco alum Rick Smith? If I'm the Bolen, I definitely consider it.

mexican_texan
12-31-2008, 12:30 AM
Holy Shneike this came out of nowhere.

Lucky
12-31-2008, 12:36 AM
Might they make a run at Bronco alum Rick Smith? If I'm the Bolen, I definitely consider it.
Both Smith & Kubiak are under contract to the Texans. They couldn't go to Denver if they wanted to.

texanhead08
12-31-2008, 01:20 AM
Both Smith & Kubiak are under contract to the Texans. They couldn't go to Denver if they wanted to.


Gruden was under contract too but he ended up in Tampa. I am not saying it could happen but its not impossible.

edo783
12-31-2008, 02:07 AM
Almost anything is possible given enough time, money and caffeine. However, the likelihood of something happening is a totally different thing. IMO, neither Kubes nor Rick Smith are going anywhere soon. Having said that, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Daddy Shanny showed up in Houston in some sort of capacity. Not in the coaching area, but somewhere in the management area. Maybe as some sort of consultant.

Thorn
12-31-2008, 07:02 AM
Almost anything is possible given enough time, money and caffeine. However, the likelihood of something happening is a totally different thing. IMO, neither Kubes nor Rick Smith are going anywhere soon. Having said that, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Daddy Shanny showed up in Houston in some sort of capacity. Not in the coaching area, but somewhere in the management area. Maybe as some sort of consultant.


I think Kubes and Smith want to run things on their own now, and make their own decisions. If that weren't the case, they wouldn't have left Denver in the first place.

Because of Kubiac, Rick Smith and Shanny Jr., we'll always have a "Denver" connection, but with Shanny Sr. leaving Denver, even that will eventually pass.

rarazz00
12-31-2008, 09:34 AM
I wonder if Rod Marinelli would be interested in our D-Line position...he's the best D-line coach in the league and he's unemployed...I would give him an interview...He wasn't fired as a D-line coach...he was fired as a head coach. We got three 1st rounders one the D-line and only one is showing up for work. I think Coach Marinelli gets them all showing up for work as one of the top three D-Lines in the league. Marinelli may comand some top dollars so pay him amd Make Bush the DC. Bush won't command top dollar because he's not of the elite DC's yet. Just as Kubiak and Gibbs do for Kyle Shannahan, Ray Rhodes and Marinelli will do for Bush as DC and Frank Bush isn't new to his craft....:fans:

HOU-TEX
12-31-2008, 09:48 AM
I would think Shanahan would want to have at least a year off to collect himself before jumping into another coaching role. At least I would. He's been going at it for over 20 years straight.

If he does take a year off I'm willing to bet he'll be here in Houston during camp at some point or another. It'll probably just be to visit and check out how his boys are doing.

Specnatz
12-31-2008, 09:51 AM
Gruden was under contract too but he ended up in Tampa. I am not saying it could happen but its not impossible.

Yes but the Raiders actually accepted draft picks for that to happen. Not to mention Gruden and Al Davis were not getting along (I know what a shock).

We are not Denver's minor league affiliate they can not call up whomever they want.

HoustonFrog
12-31-2008, 10:08 AM
Good article on the firing. I like Forde's work

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=forde_pat&id=3801219&sportCat=nfl

Mike Shanahan is easily the best coach in Denver Broncos history. But that doesn't mean he should be coach for life.

It was time for a new coach in Denver. Give credit to owner Pat Bowlen for making that difficult decision and firing the man most Broncos fans never thought he'd fire -- the man who helped deliver the only two Super Bowl victories in franchise history.

Turns out everyone overestimated Shanahan's job security -- including, perhaps, Shanahan himself. After 14 years, his comfort level and strategic intransigence could be some of the reasons the Broncos have become the embodiment of mediocrity with their 24-24 record the past three seasons. ...............

Since John Elway rode off into the Rocky Mountain sunset after a second consecutive Super Bowl title in early 1999, Denver has been utterly ordinary. It has won a single playoff game in the decade without No. 7 at quarterback.

The post-Elway Broncos have been a blur of fired defensive coordinators, failed free-agent acquisitions, boom-or-bust drafts, spotty special teams, late-season swoons and -- on those occasions when they did make the playoffs -- postseason pratfalls. Shanahan has continually churned the roster without changing the bottom line. The magic is long gone, and it will be up to someone else to recapture it.

Post-Elway, Shanahan seemed to believe he could plug any quarterback into his creative, aggressive offense and it would work at a championship level. He hand-picked Brian Griese for the role, and it didn't work. He hand-picked Jake Plummer for the role, and it didn't work. The current hand-picked quarterback is Jay Cutler -- and so far it hasn't worked. .....................

Farough
12-31-2008, 12:55 PM
It doesnt help this year they had what 6 running backs on IR?
I mean yeah, they blew it but they had a rash of injuries.
I don't know how the D was so bad, maybe fire the coordinator,
but I didnt see him getting fired happening.

Specnatz
12-31-2008, 01:13 PM
It doesnt help this year they had what 6 running backs on IR?
I mean yeah, they blew it but they had a rash of injuries.
I don't know how the D was so bad, maybe fire the coordinator,
but I didnt see him getting fired happening.

Pat Bowlen told Shanahan to fire the DC and he refused, that is what they said on NFL Access on NLFN.

Champ Bailey missed something like 6 games They also lossed Boss Bailey and Center Tom Nalen to IR. Nate Webster starting MLB missed 3 games.

They have had several injuries.

But when the owner wants the DC fired and you refuse you are most likely going to get the pink slip.

Pantherstang84
12-31-2008, 01:20 PM
lol: The arrogant Donkey press thinks they have a shot @ Kubiak...

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/dec/30/bowlen-expected-to-be-swift-in-finding-successor/

Ckw
12-31-2008, 01:28 PM
lol: The arrogant Donkey press thinks they have a shot @ Kubiak...

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/dec/30/bowlen-expected-to-be-swift-in-finding-successor/

Kubiak isn't leaving. Even if he wasn't still under contract, he would come back to Houston unless Denver offered him ridiculous amounts of money and even then I doubt he would leave. Throughout his career, he has consistently interviewed for jobs in or around Houston and has referred to the Texans job as his dream job. He is a Houston native and as long as he is wanted here, he is likely staying here.

Pantherstang84
12-31-2008, 01:30 PM
Kubiak isn't leaving. Even if he wasn't still under contract, he would come back to Houston unless Denver offered him ridiculous amounts of money and even then I doubt he would leave. Throughout his career, he has consistently interviewed for jobs in or around Houston and has referred to the Texans job as his dream job. He is a Houston native and as long as he is wanted here, he is likely staying here.

I agree. Just goes to show you how the lack of oxygen in high altitudes affects people's brains.

thunderkyss
12-31-2008, 01:34 PM
lol: The arrogant Donkey press thinks they have a shot @ Kubiak...

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/dec/30/bowlen-expected-to-be-swift-in-finding-successor/

Didn't see anything arrogant about that, just reporting the news, putting all the possibilities on the table.

I don't know one way or the other, but I think they are inferring a little extra on the heat that Kubiak is facing that "forced" him to fire three defensive coaches. I don't know, but I thought it was Kubiak's idea/decision.

Pantherstang84
12-31-2008, 01:42 PM
Didn't see anything arrogant about that, just reporting the news, putting all the possibilities on the table.

I don't know one way or the other, but I think they are inferring a little extra on the heat that Kubiak is facing that "forced" him to fire three defensive coaches. I don't know, but I thought it was Kubiak's idea/decision.

I was under the impression the defensive coaching shake up was Kubiak's decision too.

Obviously, Kubiak is highly regarded up there. I could fill up one post with links to blog comments, press articles, etc. of folks wanting Denver to go after Kubiak and give up draft picks if necessary.

Personally, I think the Shanahan firing was pure knee jerk. Denver is very much like Houston. Young and talented on offense with some help needed on defense.

I just would hate for Houston to break in Kubiak for Denver's benefit.

I think Kubiak is on his way to becoming an outstanding HC. I just wish a certain element on this MB felt the same way.

Vinny
12-31-2008, 03:36 PM
Good article on the firing. I like Forde's work

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=forde_pat&id=3801219&sportCat=nflMike Shanahan is easily the best coach in Denver Broncos history. But that doesn't mean he should be coach for life.

It was time for a new coach in Denver. Give credit to owner Pat Bowlen for making that difficult decision and firing the man most Broncos fans never thought he'd fire -- the man who helped deliver the only two Super Bowl victories in franchise history.

Turns out everyone overestimated Shanahan's job security -- including, perhaps, Shanahan himself. After 14 years, his comfort level and strategic intransigence could be some of the reasons the Broncos have become the embodiment of mediocrity with their 24-24 record the past three seasons. ...............

Since John Elway rode off into the Rocky Mountain sunset after a second consecutive Super Bowl title in early 1999, Denver has been utterly ordinary. It has won a single playoff game in the decade without No. 7 at quarterback.

The post-Elway Broncos have been a blur of fired defensive coordinators, failed free-agent acquisitions, boom-or-bust drafts, spotty special teams, late-season swoons and -- on those occasions when they did make the playoffs -- postseason pratfalls. Shanahan has continually churned the roster without changing the bottom line. The magic is long gone, and it will be up to someone else to recapture it.



Pretty much what I've been stating. I was starting to think I was the only one who thought Shanahan was overrated.

Specnatz
12-31-2008, 04:05 PM
Pretty much what I've been stating. I was starting to think I was the only one who thought Shanahan was overrated.

I guess that means Jeff Fisher is overrated as well 11 years with the Titans and only one Super Bowl appearance and no wins.

The owner of the Broncos wanted certain changes which Shanahan did not agree with, so he was let go. He is still a very good head coach, just maybe he should not be the GM as well (Which I am not a big fan of anyway).

Vinny
12-31-2008, 05:08 PM
I don't think Fisher is overrated and he hasn't gone .500 the last three years and he isn't in the same situation as Shanahan since he isn't his own GM....I don't know how my not being as high on Shanahan as you guys makes me immediately some dolt who has to generalize everyone else who has had some success in with Shanahan. I just think he is wildly overrated as a coach and has ridden John Elway's coattails for a long time. I think for myself so I may come to different conclusions as the popular logic around here.

hot pickle
12-31-2008, 06:43 PM
i just watched the interview with mike on nfl.com and he handled it like a champ... great guy and great coach... demote kubes to OC and bring in mike lol... kidding

ObsiWan
12-31-2008, 08:07 PM
I have to admit I was taken by surprise. Especially since the Broncos really had no business being 8-8 this year considering all the injuries at RB and the fact they have no real defense.

But nothing lasts forever.

...well, maybe Al Davis

SheTexan
01-01-2009, 09:42 AM
But nothing lasts forever.

...well, maybe Al Davis

and Bud the dud Adams!!

eriadoc
01-01-2009, 09:52 AM
I don't think Fisher is overrated and he hasn't gone .500 the last three years and he isn't in the same situation as Shanahan since he isn't his own GM....I don't know how my not being as high on Shanahan as you guys makes me immediately some dolt who has to generalize everyone else who has had some success in with Shanahan. I just think he is wildly overrated as a coach and has ridden John Elway's coattails for a long time. I think for myself so I may come to different conclusions as the popular logic around here.

From '05 to '07, Fisher went 22-26, FWIW.

Personally, I think Shanahan is a good coach. I don't think he's a good GM, though. I also think once he started losing his lieutenants, he stopped delegating as well, and the product has suffered.

I also think that coaches largely go as their QBs go, so yeah, Elway had a lot to do with Shanahan's success. Belichick didn't look so great prior to Brady, either. Cowher finally got back in when he found a QB that could do what he wanted. The Giants finally took it to the next level when Eli finally clicked last year. If Cutler had come along instead of Plummer back when Shanahan had his people in place, they might have been in the SB again by now. Who knows?

Vinny
01-01-2009, 01:06 PM
From '05 to '07, Fisher went 22-26, FWIW.

I follow the league pretty close but thanks for the heads up. I don't think I have to dislike Fisher because I perceive Shanahan as largely overrated.

IMA TEXAN
01-01-2009, 04:34 PM
From '05 to '07, Fisher went 22-26, FWIW.

Personally, I think Shanahan is a good coach. I don't think he's a good GM, though.
It's not worth much. Here's something more relevant -> Fisher has a better record with Vince Young at QB than Shanahan has with Jay Cutler at QB. Jeepers!!!

If you are one of the "I control everything" guys then you better be a good GM. The "I'm a good coach but I only bring in crappy players for myself" excuse doesn't fly. The net effect is your coach/GM is not getting the job done.

While it is important, I don't necessarily agree with Vinny's "count the playoff wins and SuperBowl appearances" as the end-all be-all measure. If it makes Fisher look like Shanahan, that proves it doesn't always work. Fisher is one of the best coaches in the league - definitely the best who has been in one place for a long time. Shanahan is (was) pretty average the last 10 years. Anyone who doesn't realize that Fisher >> Shanahan is not paying attention.

eriadoc
01-01-2009, 08:47 PM
Eh, I mostly agree with both of your takes, except I think you're underrating Shanahan. Fisher had nothing to do with the conversation really, except someone brought him up earlier, and I was just pointing out the record. In fact, the Tacks went 5-11 the year before that 22-26 compilation. So every coach has their bad stretches. That doesn't make Fisher a bad coach, and the 24-24 record over the past three doesn't necessarily make Shanny a bad coach.

What did Shanny in was his GM duties, and I maintain that he's actually a good coach when he's not doing that. I guess we'll find out soon enough, because I seriously doubt his next job will grant him GM duties.

TexanSam
01-02-2009, 11:27 AM
I didn't realize how many coordinators Shananan had gone through. He apparently liked getting rid of people. Control freak to the max.

toronto
01-02-2009, 11:42 AM
Comparing Fisher to Shanahan doesn't work.

Fisher doesn't make the personnel decisions, although he obviously has input. It's been documented he didn't want VY, remember?

Shanahan owned that team. He was the VP, GM, HC and OC. And Fisher, unlike Shanahan, showed more ability to work with less, given the fact that Fisher adapted to the salary cap mess and a rebuilt team.

I agree with Vinny. The man rode Elway's coattails and coasted. The team has had a ton of talent yet never did squat, and Cutler aside, I have no clue what the team's direction/identity is moving forward. We can all see that with Fisher and the Titans, and how well the team appears set up for the future. (VY aside)

mexican_texan
01-02-2009, 11:55 AM
I have to disagree here, they had a good team in 2005. They had an awesome LB corps, good DBs, a good running game, and what many called an MVP performance by Jake Plummer. They never really had a good D-line, apart from the play of Elvis Dumerville. Seems like their offense misses Kubiak too.

toronto
01-02-2009, 12:19 PM
I have to disagree here, they had a good team in 2005. They had an awesome LB corps, good DBs, a good running game, and what many called an MVP performance by Jake Plummer. They never really had a good D-line, apart from the play of Elvis Dumerville. Seems like their offense misses Kubiak too.

Agree actually with that, although I wouldn't call Plummer's year MVP-esque.
And they lost in the AFC Championship at home, getting punked badly by the Steelers, so I think we can say they underachieved.

Shanahan slipped, and we all saw how lousy that defense became. He wanted all the responsibility and glory, but that means when the team has an epic collapse, he has to bear the weight of that royal screwup. The Bills' loss was just inexcusable. Buffalo was a team that had already shown to be pretty inept and was playing awful football, yet put up 30 on that defense in Denver. Ugh.

Specnatz
01-02-2009, 01:51 PM
Eh, I mostly agree with both of your takes, except I think you're underrating Shanahan. Fisher had nothing to do with the conversation really, except someone brought him up earlier, and I was just pointing out the record. In fact, the Tacks went 5-11 the year before that 22-26 compilation. So every coach has their bad stretches. That doesn't make Fisher a bad coach, and the 24-24 record over the past three doesn't necessarily make Shanny a bad coach.

What did Shanny in was his GM duties, and I maintain that he's actually a good coach when he's not doing that. I guess we'll find out soon enough, because I seriously doubt his next job will grant him GM duties.

I agree with you.

Everything is not so black and white as to say his record is this thus this the blame. 7 RB on IR and he still goes 8-8, damn good job in my opinion. Like I said earlier, I am not fan of a HC also having GM duties.