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El Tejano
11-14-2008, 08:55 AM
I was just kind of thinking about it and was wondering something. After Jacoby Jones made that great 40 something yard play, why was he not in the game more but David Anderson was in there quite a bit.

I'm just assuming that a defensive team would see that a real fast guy just burned them for 40 something yards and will have to account for him. I hardly believe they were scared of David Anderson. Ok that is my rearview mirror so no more of the Ravens game after this but I do hope they include Jacoby quite a bit in the Indy game.

gtexan02
11-14-2008, 09:02 AM
I get the feeling that Kubiak is hesitant to make in game adjustments.

I think they gameplanned the way they did, and that was without major use of Jacoby. Just because he did well on one play, doesn't mean that Kubiak is able or willing to write him into others.

Its sort of one our handicaps

SheTexan
11-14-2008, 09:51 AM
It's called incompetent coaching!! Game plan that they half ass prepared for to start with AIN'T working, but, God forbid they have a little guts and change it any.

hobie
11-14-2008, 10:06 AM
It's called incompetent coaching!! Game plan that they half ass prepared for to start with AIN'T working, but, God forbid they have a little guts and change it any.

So, tell us how you really feel ......

Runner
11-14-2008, 10:09 AM
Change can be scary.

Let me think of the usual answers.

1) Jacoby is worn down. He did return those punts earlier in the season. Unlikely.
2) David Anderson has been working his tail off in practice. Possible.
3) They are looking at getting Jacoby on the field more and they need to figure out a way to do that. He's been working his tail off. Probable.

Texan_Bill
11-14-2008, 10:18 AM
It's called incompetent coaching!! Game plan that they half ass prepared for to start with AIN'T working, but, God forbid they have a little guts and change it any.

Kind of tough to do when you have a QB you don't trust....


:thinking: Kinda reminds me of the way Capers had to handle one David Carr.

MannyFresh
11-14-2008, 10:22 AM
Kind of tough to do when you have a QB you don't trust....


:thinking: Kinda reminds me of the way Capers had to handle one David Carr.


two words: Matt Cassel

hobie
11-14-2008, 10:27 AM
two words: Matt Cassel

Well he is also on a good team that has a good O-Line....and well he saw his chance to be something after 4 yrs. on the bench and is making good of it...then again, would he be as effective here....my dollar says NO !

HOU-TEX
11-14-2008, 10:27 AM
Kind of tough to do when you have a QB you don't trust....


:thinking: Kinda reminds me of the way Capers had to handle one David Carr.

So does that mean we're going to see some 2 yard hitches in the near future? Or the drop back and nail the camera man? Or the scramble out of bounds behind the line of scrimmage? Or the throw the ball 5 yards past the LOS play? Or the drop back and hit the ground like there's bullets flying? :winky:

ObsiWan
11-14-2008, 10:27 AM
I get the feeling that Kubiak is hesitant to make in game adjustments.

I think they gameplanned the way they did, and that was without major use of Jacoby. Just because he did well on one play, doesn't mean that Kubiak is able or willing to write him into others.

Its sort of one our handicaps

I agree. That is one of the major bones I have to pick with Kubiak. He won't deviate from the plan unless injuries force him to. You would think that he'd give JJ (or whoever - it took him, what, 3-4 games to make Slaton the starter) a couple more touches as a reward for doing well - but noooooooo.

Texan_Bill
11-14-2008, 10:31 AM
two words: Matt Cassel He pitches for the Astros, no??

So does that mean we're going to see some 2 yard hitches in the near future? Or the drop back and nail the camera man? Or the scramble out of bounds behind the line of scrimmage? Or the throw the ball 5 yards past the LOS play? Or the drop back and hit the ground like there's bullets flying? :winky:

You saw it against it Baltimore. Rosencopter to Lewis was open all day long. ;)

Hardcore Texan
11-14-2008, 10:36 AM
two words: Matt Cassel

Two more words: No thanks.

SheTexan
11-14-2008, 10:39 AM
Kind of tough to do when you have a QB you don't trust....


:thinking: Kinda reminds me of the way Capers had to handle one David Carr.

Who doesn't trust him, players or coaches. Players say they stand by him competely. Kubes had his chance to "trade" him but he BELIEVED in him so there ya go, he is still here. Switch roles for all I care! Let OD squat behind center, let Sage runs some routes, and get his ass plastered! Put the damn waterboy out there to return a damn punt!! Do something to shake this damn team up. Make them see that fat paycheck they receive every week just might come to an end, if they don't play like pros instead of Jr High. I'm for ACTION!! If the present scheme is NOT working, have the balls to change it and let's get on with the game!!!

HOU-TEX
11-14-2008, 10:41 AM
Two more words: No thanks.

I agree. IMO, it's the players around him making him look worthy. There were several passes that were horrible. Moss would've had 2 more TD's if the ball was thrown to him and not out of the EZ.

MannyFresh
11-14-2008, 10:43 AM
Two more words: No thanks.

So you don't think he learned anything from Tom Brady? Learning and watching Brady work with what he had at times? Sure, they had a great DLine, but before Moss and company he spread that ball around and made some damn good lemonade out of lemons when he needed to.

Ole Miss Texan
11-14-2008, 10:46 AM
Kubiak likes guys he can trust. He's got a home run threat out there in AJ but he gets covered a lot. He wants receivers he can trust to get open and make the catch. Kevin Walter, Owen Daniels and David Anderson fit this mold. Anderson is ahead of Jacoby at this point from a receivers standpoint. Jacoby still hasn't learned how to run holding the ball (punts, kickoffs, catches or handoffs). That's fine if teams aren't scared of Anderson... he'll keep catching those TD passes. I do, however, think Jacoby can develop into a really good player for us but at this point Kubiak trusts Anderson more, and quite frankly I do too.

Texan_Bill
11-14-2008, 10:50 AM
Who doesn't trust him, players or coaches. Players say they stand by him competely. Kubes had his chance to "trade" him but he BELIEVED in him so there ya go, he is still here. Switch roles for all I care! Let OD squat behind center, let Sage runs some routes, and get his ass plastered! Put the damn waterboy out there to return a damn punt!! Do something to shake this damn team up. Make them see that fat paycheck they receive every week just might come to an end, if they don't play like pros instead of Jr High. I'm for ACTION!! If the present scheme is NOT working, have the balls to change it and let's get on with the game!!!

Lip service..... When Carr was here, you might've thought that he and Steve McKinney were tight. To listen to McKinney now on the radio, not so much.

LMAO!! Let Sage run some routes? We're not getting any younger darlin'. We would age 2 years with Sage running a "GO" route....

The1ApplePie
11-14-2008, 10:52 AM
Two more words: No thanks.

Certainly better than Rosencopter or Fragile Mattie though

Runner
11-14-2008, 10:54 AM
Certainly better than Rosencopter or Fragile Mattie though

The Texans can afford to be selective, with starters 1a and 1b already on the roster. :)

Vinny
11-14-2008, 10:56 AM
I was just kind of thinking about it and was wondering something. After Jacoby Jones made that great 40 something yard play, why was he not in the game more but David Anderson was in there quite a bit.

I'm just assuming that a defensive team would see that a real fast guy just burned them for 40 something yards and will have to account for him. I hardly believe they were scared of David Anderson. Ok that is my rearview mirror so no more of the Ravens game after this but I do hope they include Jacoby quite a bit in the Indy game.
because Jones is an inconsistent WR and Anderson isn't even though Jones has more pure physical ability....Jones gets on the field more if he continues to do this sort of thing.

MannyFresh
11-14-2008, 10:56 AM
The Texans can afford to be selective, with starters 1a and 1b already on the roster. :)

More like 1F and -2F cause thats the grade they're playing at right now.

Hardcore Texan
11-14-2008, 11:14 AM
So you don't think he learned anything from Tom Brady? Learning and watching Brady work with what he had at times? Sure, they had a great DLine, but before Moss and company he spread that ball around and made some damn good lemonade out of lemons when he needed to.

That's just it, he probably learned a lot but it doesn't show in his performance. He's not horrible but he's not great, he's serviceable. At least what I have seen so far. If we ever go another direction than Schaub, I want it to be a top tier QB or at least projected to be. I haven't seen that out of Cassel.

BigBull17
11-14-2008, 12:26 PM
It's called incompetent coaching!! Game plan that they half ass prepared for to start with AIN'T working, but, God forbid they have a little guts and change it any.

Yep. JJ was more of a mismatch for the Baltimore D, so we played to their strength. They are pretty damn good in the middle of thier D, with their CB's being a little suspect. Im tired of seeing guys not play, then later hearing " I should have played himm more." It gets really ******* old.

So does that mean we're going to see some 2 yard hitches in the near future? Or the drop back and nail the camera man? Or the scramble out of bounds behind the line of scrimmage? Or the throw the ball 5 yards past the LOS play? Or the drop back and hit the ground like there's bullets flying? :winky:

If we start to see 2 yard hitches, we will have alot of pick 6's. Carr had a live arm, while Sage's is more akin to a BB gun. He cant throw that pass consistantly.

Specnatz
11-14-2008, 01:01 PM
two words: Matt Cassel

You did see him fail at throwing in resemblance of a deep ball didn't you?

Yankee_In_TX
11-14-2008, 05:41 PM
I get the feeling that Kubiak is hesitant to make in game adjustments.

I think they gameplanned the way they did, and that was without major use of Jacoby. Just because he did well on one play, doesn't mean that Kubiak is able or willing to write him into others.

Its sort of one our handicaps

I hate that BOTH my college and NFL coach seem brain damaged in that respect.

Texans_Chick
11-14-2008, 06:47 PM
because Jones is an inconsistent WR and Anderson isn't even though Jones has more pure physical ability....Jones gets on the field more if he continues to do this sort of thing.

There was a Woody Allen short story where the narrator wanted to get the brain of a smart ugly girl into the body of a really hot dumb girl. But the guy in the story ends up with the dumb girls brain in the smart girls body. Dumb and ugly.

It's too bad David Anderson's brain isn't in Jacoby Jones body. Thought Jones had some moments, he also AT HOME gooned and fielded punts inside the 10 that were baffling and put the offense in horrible position, especially against a good defensive team.

TheRealJoker
11-14-2008, 07:35 PM
Jacoby Jones reminds me of the Scarecrow in Wizard of Oz sometimes...

You would be a big time player "If you only had a brain!!!"

Norg
11-14-2008, 11:25 PM
PLay him more in what are u saying let JJ play WR for a Few PLays ......???? I say NO !!! 2 that

threetoedpete
11-16-2008, 10:55 AM
I was just kind of thinking about it and was wondering something. After Jacoby Jones made that great 40 something yard play, why was he not in the game more but David Anderson was in there quite a bit.

I'm just assuming that a defensive team would see that a real fast guy just burned them for 40 something yards and will have to account for him. I hardly believe they were scared of David Anderson. Ok that is my rear view mirror so no more of the Ravens game after this but I do hope they include Jacoby quite a bit in the Indy game.

He still makes mental errors. He has responsibilities to the team. If he doesn't meet those responsibilities...his touches get reduced. I'm not talking about taking the punt back every time he touches the ball. But making crisp, clear, correct decisions when he has opportunities. If he can't manage decisions on a punt....how can he manage a pass route on a rhythm passing team ?
What is the name of the old Bille Jole song..."it's a matter of trust" ?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xx53c_6h-W4


Same thing is going on with Bennit. Bennit's feet are just awful. He is not having a good season.

Reduced playing time, It's the only hammer the coaches have.

I'm with you on one thingy though...Got a ZBS team and a very aggressive run defense....no end a rounds. No reverses...and only one screen pass play...that's a coaching flaw. That's bad game planing. I don't care what level you're on. With Duane struggling against the elite guys. And the interior struggling against the NTs...they should be running every draw in the book. Lead, wrap around, delayed.

threetoedpete
11-16-2008, 11:06 AM
Maybe we should send Reeves a Billy Joel CD ?

Sal Rosenberg
12-07-2008, 08:04 PM
He dropped a punt today that turned the whole momentum in the game.I saw Kubiak drop and "F" bomb and I almost broke my television.

Silver Oak
12-07-2008, 08:34 PM
he makes me more nervous than any other player on our roster.

why in God's name does he have to jump into the air while fielding a punted ball? that is either coaching, or him not listening to his coaches.

either way, I'm just about ready to say goodbye to Mr. Jones. loads of gamebreaking talent, but damn...I don't want heart palpitations every time we line up for a punt return either.

awtysst
12-07-2008, 08:39 PM
he makes me more nervous than any other player on our roster.

why in God's name does he have to jump into the air while fielding a punted ball? that is either coaching, or him not listening to his coaches.

either way, I'm just about ready to say goodbye to Mr. Jones. loads of gamebreaking talent, but damn...I don't want heart palpitations every time we line up for a punt return either.

My next mock draft is coming this week. In it, the Texans take a certain Big XII Wide receiver. To find out who, look out for my next Mock, coming later this week!

If the Texans agree with my assessment, it might be tough for Mr. Jones to make the squad.

Hardcore Texan
12-07-2008, 08:53 PM
My next mock draft is coming this week. In it, the Texans take a certain Big XII Wide receiver. To find out who, look out for my next Mock, coming later this week!

If the Texans agree with my assessment, it might be tough for Mr. Jones to make the squad.

Quan Cosby could be a steal in this year's draft. He won't go in the early rounds, but he's a hell of an all around, dependable player with good hands and good speed.

ATXtexanfan
12-07-2008, 09:02 PM
Quan Cosby could be a steal in this year's draft. He won't go in the early rounds, but he's a hell of an all around, dependable player with good hands and good speed.
Sounds like jacoby coming out of the draft. He tries to hard, needs to learn how to pick his spots. All he has is pr duties and tries to make a play everytime. Can't say cosby wouldn't be the same when he chose baseball over football. We're deep at wr and jacoby doesn't get any action on offense. Cosby could try to hard shine like jj.

ATXtexanfan
12-07-2008, 09:03 PM
Quan Cosby could be a steal in this year's draft. He won't go in the early rounds, but he's a hell of an all around, dependable player with good hands and good speed.
Sounds like jacoby coming out of the draft. He tries to hard, needs to learn how to pick his spots. All he has is pr duties and tries to make a play everytime. Can't say cosby wouldn't be the same when he chose baseball over football. We're deep at wr and jacoby doesn't get any action on offense. Cosby could try to hard to shine like jj.

beerlover
12-08-2008, 12:21 AM
its so easy to jump on the kid when the spotlight shines down & centerstage. The Texans won the game despite turnovers because the best players were put in positions to make plays, thats all you can ask. Not trying to make excuses but watching all the cold weather games the football behaves much different under those conditions. Jacoby had a hard time adjusting to the conditions & learned another lesson the hard way. I feel bad for his sake, but I don't want to see him get down on himself after everthing thats happend this year, take the good with the bad & let the playmaker in him shine next time he gets his moment :)

Goldensilence
12-08-2008, 12:36 AM
I like Jacoby and the kid has all the tools but doesn't seem, from the outside looking in, can bring it all together. He's had his adjustment time and it make take him leaving the team to focus on getting better. I know this is a JJ thread but this staff and Molden have got to find out if he can crack the CB rotation. It's great to have a ST ace but we need a contributer in the secondary.

Not saying they've been a waste but...if this staff really wants to nail its drafts we're going to have to stop using our 3rds on small school guys, that are really raw, and use them on guys who are polished but dropped into the third. I hate to think we have two good ST guys but passed on two starters elsewhere.

Marcus
12-08-2008, 12:36 AM
Excuse me, but other than today, when has Jacoby put the ball on the ground? From reading previous posts, I get the impression that he fumbles a punt as many times as Rosenfels throws interceptions.

I don't get what someone else said, that he holds his breath everytime he catches a punt. Again, other than today, what's the reason why you'd feel that way?

threetoedpete
12-08-2008, 12:37 AM
its so easy to jump on the kid when the spotlight shines down & center stage. The Texans won the game despite turnovers because the best players were put in positions to make plays, thats all you can ask. Not trying to make excuses but watching all the cold weather games the football behaves much different under those conditions. Jacoby had a hard time adjusting to the conditions & learned another lesson the hard way. I feel bad for his sake, but I don't want to see him get down on himself after ever thing thats happened this year, take the good with the bad & let the play maker in him shine next time he gets his moment :)

Jacoby Jones made two critical errors. The first pointed out By Spencer Tillman on Mr McNair's recap show....he leaped into the air to receive a punt.
Now I was a lineman and have absolutely no practical experence....but football 101 you never leave your feet. The second, he doesn't have his shoulder pads square to the ball. Football 101, if they can read your numbers in the stands your not moving your feet and you are out of position. Now what we don't know is are they coaching him these things ? Or are they using the mother of all screw ups and assuming he knows ?

The second thing you might want to consider: The Green Bay Kid missed his first punt. But after that he was stroking knuckle balls in that wind. Now J.J. is a professional. And you're correct to call him out. But I'm here to testify if it was you or I under those punts or Andre Davis or Dav Anderson....we'd of drop more than just a few. The first mistakes should be correctable. The second...give the devil his due...the Kid from Penn St. is a terrific punter.

I doubt they have much media on this guy. So not being prepared for the Penn St. kid, caulk that up as they slipped one under the radar against us.

What we don't know for a fact is what they are doing with J.J. in practice. What he is being coached. And is the coaching taking ?

The next time you take a raw guy....raw means raw....the mistakes are part of the process. I'm still willing. Don't know about Kubes.

Marcus
12-08-2008, 12:42 AM
Not saying they've been a waste but...if this staff really wants to nail its drafts we're going to have to stop using our 3rds on small school guys, that are really raw, and use them on guys who are polished but dropped into the third. I hate to think we have two good ST guys but passed on two starters elsewhere.

Steve Slaton loves you, too! :)

Jackie Chiles
12-08-2008, 12:47 AM
Excuse me, but other than today, when has Jacoby put the ball on the ground? From reading previous posts, I get the impression that he fumbles a punt as many times as Rosenfels throws interceptions.

I don't get what someone else said, that he holds his breath everytime he catches a punt. Again, other than today, what's the reason why you'd feel that way?

Let me toss in some disclaimers before I answer this. First, I think we should keep Jacoby back there and let him work through his troubles. Second, I have no doubt that is what Kubiak is going to say and do. We don't have anyone nearly as explosive as him and he can just be so good when he gets the ball and guys aren't in his face.

Having said that he makes me nervous, and it has nothing to do with recent muffs. If there is a punt that is shorter than he anticipated he makes almost no attempt to come up and fair catch it. If he does come up its usually late and hurried and it finally caught up with him today. I don't know if he has problems judging the ball or its just a confidence issue but there is a ton of room for improvement there. We have lost a lot of field position on him avoiding making routine catches, there have also been some where he comes up charging and at the last moment sidesteps the ball, that stuff is scary.

The other obvious answer would be the end of last season and this pre-season where he was straight dropping balls. Those kind of impressions are hard to get out of your head when you see the ball as rarely as he does. I mean our defense has not been great about forcing punts until recently. Catching a punt is also something that most people view as routine. When he muffs its like hes missing a sac bunt or something. Harder to do than most probably realize but it just has to get done or the **it hits the fan. I still have hope because in the limited amount of punts he has returned he has been fantastic.

Goldensilence
12-08-2008, 12:49 AM
Steve Slaton loves you, too! :)

Yeah cause West Virginia is just like Eastern Kentucky and Lane College respectively. Steve was also no where near as raw as either Jones or Molden and has played in a BCS conference and a BCS bowl.

Steve was pretty polished but just dropped into the third.

BuffaloglennTX
12-08-2008, 08:10 AM
Yeah cause West Virginia is just like Eastern Kentucky and Lane College respectively. Steve was also no where near as raw as either Jones or Molden and has played in a BCS conference and a BCS bowl.

Steve was pretty polished but just dropped into the third.

I think that was the point that Marcus was trying to make, that our coaches don't just throw third round picks at small school guys, and Slaton is a prime example of a third round pick on a big school guy.

In my mind, Jacoby's rewards are higher than his risks. No punt returner's hands are fool-proof. It is exactly like our defense; you can minimize risks by not blitzing or jumping passes, but then you also minimize your chance for making plays. Jacoby has made plays this season, and that, in my mind, is worth some risk. I would also suggest that it is another lesson learned for him.

BuffaloglennTX
12-08-2008, 08:13 AM
Let me toss in some disclaimers before I answer this. First, I think we should keep Jacoby back there and let him work through his troubles. Second, I have no doubt that is what Kubiak is going to say and do. We don't have anyone nearly as explosive as him and he can just be so good when he gets the ball and guys aren't in his face.

Having said that he makes me nervous, and it has nothing to do with recent muffs. If there is a punt that is shorter than he anticipated he makes almost no attempt to come up and fair catch it. If he does come up its usually late and hurried and it finally caught up with him today. I don't know if he has problems judging the ball or its just a confidence issue but there is a ton of room for improvement there. We have lost a lot of field position on him avoiding making routine catches, there have also been some where he comes up charging and at the last moment sidesteps the ball, that stuff is scary.

The other obvious answer would be the end of last season and this pre-season where he was straight dropping balls. Those kind of impressions are hard to get out of your head when you see the ball as rarely as he does. I mean our defense has not been great about forcing punts until recently. Catching a punt is also something that most people view as routine. When he muffs its like hes missing a sac bunt or something. Harder to do than most probably realize but it just has to get done or the **it hits the fan. I still have hope because in the limited amount of punts he has returned he has been fantastic.


As a side note, my six year old started crying when JJ fumbled the punt! I had to send him to another room to watch sponge bob and stop crying. You would not believe the joy on his face when Kris Brown nailed the game winner. :thisbig:

FirstTexansFan
12-08-2008, 08:15 AM
Excuse me, but other than today, when has Jacoby put the ball on the ground? From reading previous posts, I get the impression that he fumbles a punt as many times as Rosenfels throws interceptions.

I don't get what someone else said, that he holds his breath everytime he catches a punt. Again, other than today, what's the reason why you'd feel that way?

I'm old, sometimes I remember things that never happened, sometimes I forget things that did, but, wasn't Jacoby responsible for a few screw ups in Pre-Season that had the coaching staff have him carrying a ball around like it was his child during training camp?

Texans_Chick
12-08-2008, 09:35 AM
Semi-interesting thing that came up in my Chron.com game preview (http://blogs.chron.com/texanschick/2008/12/four_things_about_the_green_ba.html). This was written by a Packer fan friend of mine:

3. We signed a punter!!! Didn't have one until late Wednesday. Jeremy Kapinos is the dude. He's left-footed, which allegedly makes it harder to catch the punt because the spin is different.

Goldensilence
12-08-2008, 11:44 AM
I think that was the point that Marcus was trying to make, that our coaches don't just throw third round picks at small school guys, and Slaton is a prime example of a third round pick on a big school guy.

In my mind, Jacoby's rewards are higher than his risks. No punt returner's hands are fool-proof. It is exactly like our defense; you can minimize risks by not blitzing or jumping passes, but then you also minimize your chance for making plays. Jacoby has made plays this season, and that, in my mind, is worth some risk. I would also suggest that it is another lesson learned for him.

I'm aware that we have chosen big school guys with our third round pick and Slaton is the current prime example. Erick Winston is another. However, we've also tagged a few other good players a round later OD, Fred Bennett and this year's example Xavier Adibi that are big school guys that fell.

My point is as much as i Love Jacoby's upside, I'm just not sure we'll fully see it HERE. It's great having a PR ace but it's becoming questionable if he can carry out those duties without fumbling or show signs of life as our 3rd or 4th WR. I hate to think the same thing with Molden. Guy looks great on ST but something, whether it is the staff or him making the transition to the pros, is keeping him from even cracking the CB rotation. I'm not saying it is a blown pick because it's way to early to tell.

My point is this team can't keep picking on sheer potential and hope it pans out in a year or two. Once we have enough talent ( and a full coaching staff on the defensive side of he ball) we can afford to make those kind of picks. In the mean time we have to cross our fingers and hope they pick it up quick as possible.

Carr Bombed
12-08-2008, 12:10 PM
I'm aware that we have chosen big school guys with our third round pick and Slaton is the current prime example. Erick Winston is another. However, we've also tagged a few other good players a round later OD, Fred Bennett and this year's example Xavier Adibi that are big school guys that fell.

My point is as much as i Love Jacoby's upside, I'm just not sure we'll fully see it HERE. It's great having a PR ace but it's becoming questionable if he can carry out those duties without fumbling or show signs of life as our 3rd or 4th WR. I hate to think the same thing with Molden. Guy looks great on ST but something, whether it is the staff or him making the transition to the pros, is keeping him from even cracking the CB rotation. I'm not saying it is a blown pick because it's way to early to tell.

My point is this team can't keep picking on sheer potential and hope it pans out in a year or two. Once we have enough talent ( and a full coaching staff on the defensive side of he ball) we can afford to make those kind of picks. In the mean time we have to cross our fingers and hope they pick it up quick as possible.


I have no problem with the Molden pick, he's not cracking the rotation, because he's a 3rd round rookie. You speak of Xavier, but he just now cracked the rotation as a 4th round rookie only because of injury........look at Barber, he's getting burn due to injuries also. Hell it even took Bennett (a big school guy) awhile to beat out a crappy Faggins, which tells me that our coaching staff has a glaring problem indentifying the talent on their own team.......they seem to be joined at the hip to their incumbent starters.

Rarely can you find CBs as physically gifted as Molden that far down in the draft, the only one more gifted in his draft was Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie and it wasn't by much. (who also came from a small school, but he was a first round pick so he's going to start in his first year). Everytime Molden gets a chance he makes plays, he was making plays in preseason and I see him involved on damn near every tackle on STs..(which this year have been shaking, but we've been spoiled with coach Joe)......he's saved our ass a couple of times and has probably prevented some scores.

The problem here isn't the "small school" guys (really you can find 1st round talent in the bottom rounds that just fell because they went to a small school) There have been PLENTY of players drafted out of small schools that have no problem making the transition in the NFL. The problem here is that Jacoby Jones just isn't very smart......his head is soft, you can just tell by listening to him. Jacoby Jones has all the talent in the world, but the kid is just dumb as rocks. He's just "that guy" who will make a great play and then leave you scratching your head next week.

BigBull17
12-08-2008, 12:21 PM
I think that was the point that Marcus was trying to make, that our coaches don't just throw third round picks at small school guys, and Slaton is a prime example of a third round pick on a big school guy.

In my mind, Jacoby's rewards are higher than his risks. No punt returner's hands are fool-proof. It is exactly like our defense; you can minimize risks by not blitzing or jumping passes, but then you also minimize your chance for making plays. Jacoby has made plays this season, and that, in my mind, is worth some risk. I would also suggest that it is another lesson learned for him.

We have constantly. 2 of 3 years we have done it. Winston, Slaton and Spencer were bigger school guys. JJ and Moulden are tiny school guys. We are bad about the raw project guys.

Its not JJ's hands, its his brain that scares me. He makes more bone head ***** mistakes back here than alot of people.

Double Barrel
12-08-2008, 12:52 PM
Man, I was so pissed at JJ the jackrabbit for trying to hop up and catch that ball. Fortunately, it didn't matter in the end.

I like his upside, and I have no desire to see him gone, but dude needs to mature and settle down. He just looks like he's already thinking about running before he's caught the ball. He needs to learn the art of the fair catch and accept the reality that he won't be able to return every punt he catches.

I think he will, though. We've got a great special teams coach, so it's just a matter of time before he finally figures it all out and becomes one of the best return men in football.

infantrycak
12-08-2008, 12:55 PM
Just for perspective--Hester had two muffed punts yesterday.

beerlover
12-08-2008, 01:07 PM
Just for perspective--Hester had two muffed punts yesterday.

clearly there is more to returning punts than realized :thinking:

badboy
12-08-2008, 01:11 PM
I am a big JJ fan but his focus seems to be on the spectacular play rather than securing the ball and then heading down field. Part of that is what makes him who he is and gives the potential for 6 points.

Goldensilence
12-08-2008, 02:38 PM
I have no problem with the Molden pick, he's not cracking the rotation, because he's a 3rd round rookie. You speak of Xavier, but he just now cracked the rotation as a 4th round rookie only because of injury........look at Barber, he's getting burn due to injuries also. Hell it even took Bennett (a big school guy) awhile to beat out a crappy Faggins, which tells me that our coaching staff has a glaring problem indentifying the talent on their own team.......they seem to be joined at the hip to their incumbent starters.

Rarely can you find CBs as physically gifted as Molden that far down in the draft, the only one more gifted in his draft was Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie and it wasn't by much. (who also came from a small school, but he was a first round pick so he's going to start in his first year). Everytime Molden gets a chance he makes plays, he was making plays in preseason and I see him involved on damn near every tackle on STs..(which this year have been shaking, but we've been spoiled with coach Joe)......he's saved our ass a couple of times and has probably prevented some scores.

The problem here isn't the "small school" guys (really you can find 1st round talent in the bottom rounds that just fell because they went to a small school) There have been PLENTY of players drafted out of small schools that have no problem making the transition in the NFL. The problem here is that Jacoby Jones just isn't very smart......his head is soft, you can just tell by listening to him. Jacoby Jones has all the talent in the world, but the kid is just dumb as rocks. He's just "that guy" who will make a great play and then leave you scratching your head next week.

I'm not questioning the talent of both JJ or Molden. I think you nailed a bit of my concern with bold part of your post.

What concerns me is looking at our roster and the holes we need to fill NOW I don't know if I, myself could justify taking guys that are raw but have the potential down the road. I agree that Jacoby has a the talent to be special but does he have the brains and work ethic to go along? AJ is the complete package at WR, KW has great hands and runs good routes and while I like David Anderson's hands and routes as well we need a guy that can allow us to take a deep shot. Jones needs to develop into that guy and I'm just not sure he will HERE.

I won't argue on Molden's potential and what he showed in TC problem is like you pointed out about this staff and their starters. I know we took him in mind with Dunta's injury and he'd have roughly at least half a year to develop. What bothers me is other guys on the board at the time that had a good chance to come in and solidify our secondary like Thomas Decoud or Dejuan Morgan.

I love how our staff isn't afraid to gamble on some high potential guys and some guys whose work ethic alone gets them in. The problem that is starting to develop is passing on the guys in between and relying on mediocre starters for too long when they get scared to put each of those polar opposites in the game.

TimeKiller
12-08-2008, 03:52 PM
He needs to learn the art of the fair catch and accept the reality that he won't be able to return every punt he catches.
that x 1000!!!

Just wave the hand, catch it.

I still see no point in not letting him off the bench to play WR. He must be crap in practice or spending too much time practicing kick returns. 1 deep route a game is too much for him?