PDA

View Full Version : Its Dom


Ibar_Harry
12-31-2004, 02:24 PM
If you go to the Houston Web site and play the Carr interview (about 8 minutes) its very clear who's calling the offensive style and its not Palmer. We simply are not ever going to be a throw it to the WR offense under Dom's administration. Now, having said that I will say we drafted in the wrong direction based on that philosophy, but that's my opinion. Many have been wondering and I think the answer has been given through David.

TexansTrueFan
12-31-2004, 02:34 PM
yes maybe so, but AJ has had a pretty good year, gaffney has done pretty well, and Davis has had his share of catches, i think he/they do a good job of mixing it up. We are a running team, but we are very capable of throwing it when we need to. Look at manning with Edge in the backfield. Whats wrong with that ? ALMOST same thing with us except we are more run, but still have a deadly passing game !

ArlingtonTexan
12-31-2004, 02:50 PM
If you go to the Houston Web site and play the Carr interview (about 8 minutes) its very clear who's calling the offensive style and its not Palmer. We simply are not ever going to be a throw it to the WR offense under Dom's administration. Now, having said that I will say we drafted in the wrong direction based on that philosophy, but that's my opinion. Many have been wondering and I think the answer has been given through David.

This is not news. This point gets lost in every fire Palmer post. Palmer is calling plays under the direction of Capers. It has been that way for three years and poster have trying to get that message across to other fans for that amount of time. Drafting wise the team did not do it wrong. The team wants a power running game with down field big play passing game.

From an investment point of view a starting calibur NFL QB and a big player WR normally physically hold up longer than a RB. When they have drafted in the first three years, IMO, at the point they have draftef in the 1st round there has not been an OLman better than the player taken by the Texans.

The Texans drafts have not been perfect and I have/can pick apart certain players/decisions, but overall the drafting has been above average.

aj.
12-31-2004, 03:05 PM
If you go to the Houston Web site and play the Carr interview (about 8 minutes) its very clear who's calling the offensive style and its not Palmer. That's been very clear for a very long time. Palmer calls the plays within the general framework and philosophy that Dom has established. No revelation there.

BornOrange
12-31-2004, 03:35 PM
And something else that people keep missing is the fact that the Texans offensive line does not allow the coaching staff the option of being a wide-open offense. This offensive line doesn't protect Carr long enough for him to regularly look at more than one WR before having to dump it off to Davis out of the backfield. If they could protect Carr longer, we just might see Capers allow Palmer to open the offense just like Jim Mora and Tony Dungy (both defensive coaches) have allowed Peyton Manning to flourish.

Marcus
12-31-2004, 05:36 PM
I've said it before and I'll say it again. No matter how successful the Texans will be, there will be some who don't like the 'smash-mouth' philosophy. It's simply boring to them. It's their problem, and there is nothing that I, nor anyone else can, or should do to try to help them.

And as far as drafting and aquiring the wrong players for this philosophy, that is also wrong. There are plenty of successful winning teams who play smashmouth football, and have bigtime quarterbacks and wide receivers.

Grid
12-31-2004, 06:30 PM
Big Ben and Hines Ward with the steelers..

carolina doesnt have the big QB but they do have Musid Muhammed (or however you spell that)

it is not unheard of.. not in the least. And when you consider that we are fashioning our team after the Steelers.. the Andre Johnson pick makes alot of sense. A big WR capable of making the play or doing some run blocking... like Hines Ward.

fresno8
12-31-2004, 07:35 PM
I'm okay w/ DD but if our style is smashmouth then we need a power back. Our drafts have been very solid. If we get the type of back Capers wants this year or next then our skill position players will be set for our scheme. However everything will boil down to the line. If it improves then Carr will have time to open things up and we can mix a power back with DD, and have a down field threat w/ AJ. Would also like a recieving threat at TE and another deep threat opposite AJ. Can't get all of this in 1 year though, howevere we're on our way, we're improving year by year, go Texans.
....if there is no power back this year those backs from Louisville sure looked impressive Shelton 250lb and Bush 245 w/ quickness and speed.

SESupergenius
12-31-2004, 09:46 PM
Which is why for the life of me I can't figre out why we picked up Hollings. If ever there was a reach is was this pick. He doesnt fit into the Capers mold and hasn't proven himself outside of 4 games early in his last college season. He has a history of injuries then and he still has them now. This pick seems like a bust.

Grid
01-01-2005, 12:57 AM
well with Zone blocking.. a speedy cutback RB is more effective than a big bruising back. if we make the zone blocking work, we can be a very effective smashmouth football team with DD

RunninRaven
01-01-2005, 05:09 AM
Keep in mind, also, that part of the Texan strategy with player acquisition in this early stage of team existence could be to just build up value. We were in a position to get a back that could turn into a very productive player if he regains his health. He may not ever do much for us, but if he gets healthy and shows something, we could get something decent in trade. I know this doesn't happen as often as other sports like baseball, but it is still a consideration as part of their thinking when they got Hollings.

Hervoyel
01-01-2005, 11:55 AM
Keep in mind, also, that part of the Texan strategy with player acquisition in this early stage of team existence could be to just build up value. We were in a position to get a back that could turn into a very productive player if he regains his health. He may not ever do much for us, but if he gets healthy and shows something, we could get something decent in trade. I know this doesn't happen as often as other sports like baseball, but it is still a consideration as part of their thinking when they got Hollings.

Yes, I see what you're getting at here and I think you are on to something in terms of the team simply getting better quality players in general as well as getting the kind of players they need to do what they intend to do.

Wouldn't it have been possible though to get a better quality player, to "build value" with that pick in the regular draft where many options were available as opposed to using it in the supplemental draft where just one player of percieved value was available? I think it's safe to say that Tony Hollings was a reach and that thus far that reach hasn't panned out.

Vinny
01-01-2005, 12:52 PM
Keep in mind, also, that part of the Texan strategy with player acquisition in this early stage of team existence could be to just build up value. We were in a position to get a back that could turn into a very productive player if he regains his health. He may not ever do much for us, but if he gets healthy and shows something, we could get something decent in trade. I know this doesn't happen as often as other sports like baseball, but it is still a consideration as part of their thinking when they got Hollings.I think it is just as simple as having James Allen and Jon Wells as your "talent" when it came to the decision to go after Hollings in the supp draft. When it was time to pick, the Raiders 2nd round selection and our 3rd round selection was only projected a few picks apart. We took a flier on Hollings before Dom broke out and we had the worst set of backs in the NFL at the time. I don't think it gets much more complex than that.

Ibar_Harry
01-01-2005, 03:47 PM
Vinny I want to disagree with you a little bit, because I think its the difference between Casserly and Capers and perhaps will eventually put them at odds. I believe if you follow Casserly you will find that he wants to draft or take the best player and athelete at that point in time. However, Capers wants to play one and only one way. He does not look at his talent the way Casserly does. Rather than making an offense or defense fit around the talent of his players, he tries to plug his players into square holes they don't fit in. I know a lot of you guys feel differently, but I fervently believe this is the problem and until management recongnizes it we will never reach the top. I hope I'm wrong...................................

Wolf
01-01-2005, 04:13 PM
I can't remember the "birth" of our franchise but I am thinking it went along the lines of McNair, then Casserly then Capers in the hiring process.. If I am correct with that statement. I would think Casserly and Capers had a good discussion during the job interview to see what direction Casserly drafts and the way Capers coaches and viseversa

JMO

Vinny
01-01-2005, 04:14 PM
You don't have to tell me you disagree with me. You say the same thing in every post.... Capers and Palmer must go. I get it.

Hervoyel
01-01-2005, 05:14 PM
There are times when I get frustrated a great deal with what I see that isn't working. I get bent out of shape over the apparent play calling (which is not always what it seems, one must account for audibles and failed execution) but when it all comes down to the final record I can't argue with numbers.

2002 - 4-12
2003 - 5-11
2004 - 7-8 (so far, possibly 8-8 if we do what we should this weekend)

They are improving. It's impossible to make a case otherwise. I know because I tried hard to do so at one point this year. Next season is a playoff run and this weekend we can be 8-8. That's pretty good for three years. Getting rid of coaches, even if you could be 100% assured of getting better coaches in their place will require the team to basically re-boot it's offensive and defensive systems. We'll take a step back instead of another step forward. Look at Cleveland right now. I believe that if they'd stuck with Palmer another year or two then they'd be in much better shape than they are right now. They're a blueprint for how not to build your expansion team. We don't want to be them do we?

ArlingtonTexan
01-01-2005, 09:02 PM
Vinny I want to disagree with you a little bit, because I think its the difference between Casserly and Capers and perhaps will eventually put them at odds. I believe if you follow Casserly you will find that he wants to draft or take the best player and athelete at that point in time. However, Capers wants to play one and only one way. He does not look at his talent the way Casserly does. Rather than making an offense or defense fit around the talent of his players, he tries to plug his players into square holes they don't fit in. I know a lot of you guys feel differently, but I fervently believe this is the problem and until management recongnizes it we will never reach the top. I hope I'm wrong...................................

it seems that you making the assumption that Casserly and Capers don't work together on selection especially one that is isolated from the regular process as Hollings. It works like any Human resource type situation where management gives the personnel department a list of specification that potential players have and it is the job of Casserly to match those wants. Also the coaching staff does do some player evaluation and interviewing so that Capers in not totally out the loop especially on higher end draft picks.

In fact, if you remember that the 2003 draft was overloaded with players that Caper and his staff had worked with at the senior bowl. That if nothing else should tell you that the coaching staff influences the draft decision of Casserly.

Grid
01-01-2005, 09:14 PM
Drafting the BPA is a good way to get yourself hurt. you can draft BPA when your team is built and ready to go.. like the Pats last season. or you can draft BPA if your team totally sucks in every aspect.. but if you are in the middle of the field.. like 28-30 of the teams are.. then you select the best player available that fits your teams needs.

this is not some terrible thing. The colts have been a pass happy team for years now and they have drafted players that fit that.. they have had success doing it. The Steelers have played smashmouth, running football for decades and it has worked well for them. The Dolphins are the same way.. the list goes on.. most every team drafts to fit their play style.

SO.. no I dont think there is any friction between how Casserly wants to do it, and how Capers wants to do it. And the 3 very successful drafts we have had so far should show that.

ArlingtonTexan
01-01-2005, 09:29 PM
Drafting the BPA is a good way to get yourself hurt. you can draft BPA when your team is built and ready to go.. like the Pats last season. or you can draft BPA if your team totally sucks in every aspect.. but if you are in the middle of the field.. like 28-30 of the teams are.. then you select the best player available that fits your teams needs.

this is not some terrible thing. The colts have been a pass happy team for years now and they have drafted players that fit that.. they have had success doing it. The Steelers have played smashmouth, running football for decades and it has worked well for them. The Dolphins are the same way.. the list goes on.. most every team drafts to fit their play style.

SO.. no I dont think there is any friction between how Casserly wants to do it, and how Capers wants to do it. And the 3 very successful drafts we have had so far should show that.

If you believe in drafting BPA then you attempt to solve your needs with FA, both before the draft elimating those obvious holes and then after the draft when you look at your team and go we still need better____. By defintion BPA philosophy does not do a great job of resolving specific needs but a better job of assembling talent than reaching for a need, say DLman when there is a "clearly" better player at another player. if it works correctly over several years then you should have a more talented team than if you drafted based on need. Finally, a part of theory is that when there is not a "clearly" better player then the team drafts need.

Grid
01-02-2005, 02:35 AM
I understand what you are saying.. what I mean by not drafting BPA, is that if you have a good WR corp.. you dont draft a WR in the first round just cause he is the best player on the draft. But also, just cause you need a tackle, you dont draft whatever tackle is available either. you have to weigh your needs against the players available.. and take the best player available that you can use. Now... in the rare situation where there are no good players available at any of your needs.. then you would just draft BPA.

Grid
01-02-2005, 03:11 AM
something i found interesting.

On Sunday, the Texans running game had its best day in team history. Houston runners carried the ball 43 times for 211 yards, nearly doubling the number of passes thrown. It has been a Dom Capers staple to have an efficient running game that allows the defense to take control late in games. Going into next season, Houston looks to adopt that philosophy and become a winning team. With a win next week, Houston will achieve an 8-8 record, the second best record for a Dom Capers coached team. The one common niche among the two seasons is running the ball more than passing.

In Capers' best season, the 1996 Panthers ran the ball 502 times, passed 487 and won the time of possession battle, 30:48 to 29:12. Currently, Houston has run 456 times and thrown 445 times. By no coincidence, Houston is winning the time of possession battle 30:31 to 30:01.

from this article http://www.houstontexans.com/gameday/games/game_16.php

Id say that is a big indicator of our improvement, and shows that the path Dom is taking with this expansion franchise, is working.

wags
01-02-2005, 08:12 AM
What that article doesn't say is that 68 of those runs are David Carr scrambling. Those 68 runs shouldn't be counted as called running plays, but rather called passing plays. 513 called passing plays and 388 called running plays. 57% pass and 43% run. :hmmm:

infantrycak
01-02-2005, 09:21 AM
By no coincidence, Houston is winning the time of possession battle 30:31 to 30:01.

Whoohoo, we are now getting an extra 32 seconds of game time for our tickets. What brain trust of a writer wrote that and didn't notice the game had somehow gone over an hour?

From NFL.com--30:15 for the offense, 29:45 defense--hey that adds up to an hour, how did that happen?

Fact is we are only positive on TOP because of dominating the Jags so badly in the last game. Until then we have been upside down almost all season.

Wolf
01-02-2005, 09:26 AM
how many OT games did we play? all I can think of is the minnesota game.. that would be he only reason I can think of with the time of possession equaling over an hour.

ArlingtonTexan
01-02-2005, 09:54 AM
What that article doesn't say is that 68 of those runs are David Carr scrambling. Those 68 runs shouldn't be counted as called running plays, but rather called passing plays. 513 called passing plays and 388 called running plays. 57% pass and 43% run. :hmmm:

Not quite, Carr has had a couple of QB sneaks, some run/pass rollouts and those falls downs at the end of the games count as runs, but i see you working.