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View Full Version : you got to be kidding me(defense)


utahmark
10-20-2008, 01:36 PM
we had the ball for 20 minutes longer than detroit and they still score 21. if it wasnt for our offense controlling the clock for over 40 minutes the detroit lions would of put up 30 on our defense.(the freaking detroit lions who just traded roy williams and had there starting qb out.)

if we are gonna give up the big play anyway we might as well start being aggresive and create a few turnovers. this defense is not good. something needs to be done.

eriadoc
10-20-2008, 01:38 PM
we had the ball for 20 minutes longer than detroit and they still score 21. if it wasnt for our offense controlling the clock for over 40 minutes the detroit lions would of put up 30 on our defense.(the freaking detroit lions who just traded roy williams and had there starting qb out.)

if we are gonna give up the big play anyway we might as well start being aggresive and create a few turnovers. this defense is not good. something needs to be done.

I think we all know what needs to be done as a first step, and it's not going to happen until after the season.

TexansLucky13
10-20-2008, 01:41 PM
I think we all know what needs to be done as a first step, and it's not going to happen until after the season.

Unfortunately, that's probably true.

To the defenses credit, most of the Lions offensive production came off a worthless 2nd half hail mary to CJ, and a huge 96 yard reception. Excluding those, the defense played decent. They still have many problems, though.

P.S. - WHY are we still seeing Petey in single coverage against fast WRs??

eriadoc
10-20-2008, 01:42 PM
P.S. - WHY are we still seeing Petey in single coverage against fast WRs??

Oww, quit it.

Oww, quit it.

Oww, quit it.

Oww, quit it.

Oww, quit it.

Oww, quit it.

Oww, quit it.

Oww, quit it.

etc.

TexansSeminole
10-20-2008, 01:47 PM
Unfortunately, that's probably true.

To the defenses credit, most of the Lions offensive production came off a worthless 2nd half hail mary to CJ, and a huge 96 yard reception. Excluding those, the defense played decent. They still have many problems, though.

P.S. - WHY are we still seeing Petey in single coverage against fast WRs??

It may even be worst than that. Judging by what Kubiak said, we were in a quarter-quarter half coverage. So Petey is supposed to cover deep with two other guys. How he let the WR get passed him I have no idea. I would think the corner would line up in a fashion to make sure the WR doesn't get passed him in that coverage, yet Petey is lining up 2 yards off the line of scrimmage.

Our positioning and movement before the snap on defense seems to be particularly bad.

Polo
10-20-2008, 01:53 PM
I believe Harrison busted on that play...

imatexan
10-20-2008, 01:59 PM
blah blah blah we won! The b**ching will never stop until we are undeafeated and win the super bowl, guess i just have to get use to it. But come on we won 2 in a row and A LOT of people are still complaining as much as when we were 0-4.

DBCooper
10-20-2008, 02:16 PM
blah blah blah we won! The b**ching will never stop until we are undeafeated and win the super bowl, guess i just have to get use to it. But come on we won 2 in a row and A LOT of people are still complaining as much as when we were 0-4.

That's because this defense has real problems.

The problem stems from a DC that does not know what he is doing. We will never have the players we need until this DC is gone. We will not be able to play at the next level until this DC is gone. I will continue to ***** until the day this defense is fixed, and that will be after Richard "Cupcake" Smith is on the street looking for a job.

feebleminded
10-20-2008, 02:17 PM
Our positioning and movement before the snap on defense seems to be particularly bad.

This is one thing about our D that really stands out to me. We seem to be easily confused in assigments and alignments particularly when there is alot of crowd noise.

This team has a real problem with situational awareness, and it is not confined to the defensive side of the ball. It is there in all three phases as well as in overall game management.

mattieuk
10-20-2008, 02:19 PM
blah blah blah we won! The b**ching will never stop until we are undeafeated and win the super bowl, guess i just have to get use to it. But come on we won 2 in a row and A LOT of people are still complaining as much as when we were 0-4.

That won't stop bitching! Theres always something to pick holes in!

utahmark
10-20-2008, 02:21 PM
blah blah blah we won! The b**ching will never stop until we are undeafeated and win the super bowl, guess i just have to get use to it. But come on we won 2 in a row and A LOT of people are still complaining as much as when we were 0-4.

off course we won. we were playing detroit at home and we have one of the best offenses in the league. but we will never be undeafeated and win the super bowl with our defense playing like it is. now we can start fixing it now or we can wait till we lose then worry about it. hopefully our coaches will be proactive and do something now rather than being reactive and wait.

bigbrewster2000
10-20-2008, 02:29 PM
I believe Harrison busted on that play...

eh, Harrison was playing in the box, and Demps had the deep middle not the hash to sideline coverage. That quarter of the field was solely petey's responsibility. He should have been lined up about 7 yards off not playing on the line. Dumb move by petey. Dumber move by Dick to get him into that situation

Vinny
10-20-2008, 02:30 PM
blah blah blah we won! The b**ching will never stop until we are undeafeated and win the super bowl, guess i just have to get use to it. But come on we won 2 in a row and A LOT of people are still complaining as much as when we were 0-4.
this is a forum for football fans breaking down their thoughts on the team, good, bad and ugly. Heck, sometimes you actually learn a bit of football from all these mean guys discussing the problems on the field. This isn't texanspeprally.com where we are all required to just say yay teem, ur da bestest! You do that for your kids in pop warner football.

HOU-TEX
10-20-2008, 02:31 PM
I believe Harrison busted on that play...

FWIW

(on if CB DeMarcus Faggins had single coverage on WR Calvin Johnson) “We were in quarter-quarter-half, so he should be back there in the deep quarter of the field. It’s inexcusable. But that’s not his fault, that’s our fault as coaches. It’s our fault as coaches to not get the player to not do his job in that situation. We’ll get him right and we’ve got to clean that up.”

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=4770

Vinny
10-20-2008, 02:32 PM
eh, Harrison was playing in the box, and Demps had the deep middle not the hash to sideline coverage. That quarter of the field was solely petey's responsibility. He should have been lined up about 7 yards off not playing on the line. Dumb move by petey. Dumber move by Dick to get him into that situationThe coaches were jumping Harrison right after that play and he was pulled from the next series....I think he had some issues on that play from what I saw. Probably multiple breakdowns though.

TexansLucky13
10-20-2008, 02:33 PM
The coaches were jumping Harrison right after that play and he was pulled from the next series....I think he had some issues on that play from what I saw. Probably multiple breakdowns.

He's been having a lot of issues so far. I've seen a few good things from him, but this is the second big play where he blew his assignment.

imatexan
10-20-2008, 02:35 PM
this is a forum for football fans breaking down their thoughts on the team, good, bad and ugly. Heck, sometimes you actually learn a bit of football from all these mean guys discussing the problems on the field. This isn't texanspeprally.com where we are all required to just say yay teem, ur da bestest! You do that for your kids in pop warner football.

I understand this but I am saying I am suprised that I see almost just as much complaining as when we lost 4 in a row.

bigbrewster2000
10-20-2008, 02:35 PM
The coaches were jumping Harrison right after that play and he was pulled from the next series....I think he had some issues on that play from what I saw. Probably multiple breakdowns though.

good to know. Maybe they said "if you see CJ line up on pokey I mean Petey then drop back into cover 2" just a thought. I didnt see Harrison get jumped. I was behind live TV and was fast forwarding between plays to catch up.

Vinny
10-20-2008, 02:37 PM
good to know. Maybe they said "if you see CJ line up on pokey I mean Petey then drop back into cover 2" just a thought. I didnt see Harrison get jumped. I was behind live TV and was fast forwarding between plays to catch up. I was on the 50 yard line with binoculars.

Brando
10-20-2008, 02:39 PM
The coaches were jumping Harrison right after that play and he was pulled from the next series....I think he had some issues on that play from what I saw. Probably multiple breakdowns though.


My bad in a different post, I thought it was Demps that blew the assignment. So it was Harrison's fault.

bigbrewster2000
10-20-2008, 02:41 PM
I was on the 50 yard line with binoculars.

makes even more sense

Vinny
10-20-2008, 02:43 PM
My bad in a different post, I thought it was Demps that blew the assignment. So it was Harrison's fault.

It very well could have been....I'm just adding what I saw to the discussion. I think the only people who really know who blew the call are the coaches who made the defensive call. I just put 2+2 together with one of the coaches talking ONLY to Harrison while he sat on the bench...away from the rest of the defense, and then Harrison was not on the field for the next series.

Brando
10-20-2008, 02:53 PM
It very well could have been....I'm just adding what I saw to the discussion. I think the only people who really know who blew the call are the coaches who made the defensive call. I just put 2+2 together with one of the coaches talking ONLY to Harrison while he sat on the bench...away from the rest of the defense, and then Harrison was not on the field for the next series.


I'll have to watch the game again but I think Bennett replaced Faggins after that play also.

HOU-TEX
10-20-2008, 02:55 PM
I'll have to watch the game again but I think Bennett replaced Faggins after that play also.

Yeah, the first play he was in he came flying over the pile drawing a 15 yard penalty.

He did have nice coverage on a deep route to CJ.

GNTLEWOLF
10-20-2008, 09:41 PM
blah blah blah we won! The b**ching will never stop until we are undeafeated and win the super bowl, guess i just have to get use to it. But come on we won 2 in a row and A LOT of people are still complaining as much as when we were 0-4.

Yes we won, but how many games do you honestly think we will win in the future if the defense still looks like it does?:wild:

Vinnie
10-20-2008, 10:49 PM
Yeah, the first play he was in he came flying over the pile drawing a 15 yard penalty.

He did have nice coverage on a deep route to CJ.

At least he shows hussle! LOL! Honestly, I would like to see him mixed in more, it couldn't hurt. I'll take 15 yard penalties and decent coverage over 96yard toast plays all day.

Brando
10-21-2008, 11:36 AM
It very well could have been....I'm just adding what I saw to the discussion. I think the only people who really know who blew the call are the coaches who made the defensive call. I just put 2+2 together with one of the coaches talking ONLY to Harrison while he sat on the bench...away from the rest of the defense, and then Harrison was not on the field for the next series.


I watched it again and if we are talking about the same play(the Calvin Johnson 96 yard TD) Harrison wasn't one of the safeties, it was Ferguson and Demps as the safeties and Demps was on Faggins side. Like it has been said before the coaches are the ones to really blame, they didn't put the players in the best defense to begin with.

barrett
10-21-2008, 11:39 AM
can someone explain quarter-quarter half in detail?

bigbrewster2000
10-21-2008, 11:46 AM
can someone explain quarter-quarter half in detail?

The safety has the deep middle of the field IE in between the hash marks. Thats half.

The corners each have their respective side of the field IE hash mark to sideline. These are the quarters. So looking at the defensive backs from left to right:

Left corner: Left Quarter
Safety: Middle half
Right Corner: Right Quarter

This coverage is run when you have a safety in the box, so there is only one deep safety.
Does that help?

disaacks3
10-21-2008, 11:54 AM
I watched it again and if we are talking about the same play(the Calvin Johnson 96 yard TD) Harrison wasn't one of the safeties, it was Ferguson and Demps as the safeties and Demps was on Faggins side. Like it has been said before the coaches are the ones to really blame, they didn't put the players in the best defense to begin with.

I re-watched the game last night. I felt better about the Offense afterward, but our Defensive holes were glaring - Okoye really did look as bad as people thought and Petey Faggins actually played a fair game overall.

It was Demps side for Safety coverage on the 96-yarder. Faggins was 1-on-1 w/ CJ and Demps came UP in coverage to backup the LBs on an underneath crossing route. There wasn't any hesitation on Demps' part. He appeared to be following scheme in closing up the 'seam' (the LBs had let the crossing man go behind them...no pursuit) So, either both safeties weren't supposed to come up, or we just had a really lousy scheme on that play.

Asking Petey to cover a 4.3 guy who has a height advantage as well was asking for trouble. That said, it wasn't the only time I'd seen that situation come up on the re-watch. In the other cases, either the QB missed the read, or CJ had insuficient time to separate from Faggins.

Hervoyel
10-21-2008, 12:28 PM
I understand this but I am saying I am suprised that I see almost just as much complaining as when we lost 4 in a row.

You're confusing complaining with constructive criticism in many cases (not that there isn't always an element of complaining around the Texans). Common mistake.

gtexan02
10-21-2008, 12:30 PM
Whats even more disappointing about this stat is that after 40 minutes of wearing out the defense, we couldn't get that last 1st down running the ball.

The Detroit defense was injured and on the field for 40 minutes. How do they stop our offense? Thats disappointing to me

disaacks3
10-21-2008, 12:38 PM
Whats even more disappointing about this stat is that after 40 minutes of wearing out the defense, we couldn't get that last 1st down running the ball.

The Detroit defense was injured and on the field for 40 minutes. How do they stop our offense? Thats disappointing to me We might have, if we were being the least bit creative and if Salaam hadn't jumped & made it 3rd and 7 (instead of 2)

ObsiWan
10-21-2008, 12:43 PM
blah blah blah we won! The b**ching will never stop until we are undeafeated and win the super bowl, guess i just have to get use to it. But come on we won 2 in a row and A LOT of people are still complaining as much as when we were 0-4.

You're right. Even if we were to go undefeated, untied, and unscored-upon we would find something to ***** about.

You're confusing complaining with constructive criticism in many cases (not that there isn't always an element of complaining around the Texans). Common mistake.
oops... you're right Herv... I meant that we would offer "constructive criticism" on such things as playcalling, clock mgmt, and player performance.

We're message board participants.
Its what we do.

:D

barrett
10-21-2008, 12:47 PM
The safety has the deep middle of the field IE in between the hash marks. Thats half.

The corners each have their respective side of the field IE hash mark to sideline. These are the quarters. So looking at the defensive backs from left to right:

Left corner: Left Quarter
Safety: Middle half
Right Corner: Right Quarter

This coverage is run when you have a safety in the box, so there is only one deep safety.
Does that help?


yup. thanks. so harrison was in position then. the secondary played it correctly accept that faggins should have been 7 - 10 yards off the line of scrimmage. i'm not sure even with the cushion that he should be out there one on one with CJ.

they can't win though, the defensive coordinator is calling more aggressive calls and the players are lining up out of position and tackling poorly. i watched the highlights several times and greenwood gave up the other TD. flat out blew the tackle. our tackling has improved but on another play i couldn't tell if it was bennett or faggins but who ever was supposed to seal the edge didn't attack the runner and instead put his head down to take the block. it ended up being a decent gain for detroit. Dale has mentioned to me that bennett puts his head down alot so i'm assuming it was him. again, bad tackling.

if you're watching the highlights not the nflta crap, pay attention at :50 to the TD run. We've got Salaam in as a TE/2nd LT but watch Brown's block on the leaping LB... it's awesome!

Second Honeymoon
10-21-2008, 03:08 PM
I didn't like Harrison when they drafted him and his performance only validates that feeling.

The guy wouldn't even be on most rosters, but we have to validate our selection of him by giving him playing time. classic texans stubborness. The guy just sucks but we picked him so he must be good......

Vinny
10-21-2008, 03:19 PM
I reviewed the game again on DVR and Harrison was already pulled on the long TD pass, so the Safety tandem was Demps and Ferguson. The coaches must have been talking to Harrison from a previous play when I looked down at the bench. It clearly appears that Demps took steps forward towards the out pattern underneath as the Lions scored on the deep ball....just wanted to clear that up for the record. I haven't read the board since I posted yesterday so someone may have corrected this already.