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View Full Version : I don't know if we've noticed yet, but...


Texan JBZ
10-16-2008, 06:30 PM
The Texans have a very solid offensive attack. Our offensive attack is pretty damn potent right now. We are 5th in total offense in the entire league and 2nd in the AFC behind the Broncos (Note to all Schaub haters: He has started four of the five games for the Texans this season. Just saying.)

The thing is that our offense hasn't even reached its peak yet. Think about it: Johnson is balling, Walter is balling, Slaton is da man, Owen is producing in a major way, and even Green is running the ball effectively. What the offense missing is Jacoby Jones. That's right, JACOBY JONES! Andre Davis and David Anderson (as much as I like DA) aren't getting the job done as the 3rd WR. It's time to insert JJ back into the line-up. I don't know what the beef is between JJ and Kubes, but whatever it is they need to grill it up and chew it down. Jacoby needs to be in the rotation at the slot. Check this out: Slaton in the single back formation, OD at TE, Dre and Walt split out wide, and JJ in the slot! Rock and Roll Vandermeer style :texflag:

nero THE zero
10-16-2008, 06:39 PM
We still have room for improvement.

1. Cut down on turnovers
2. Turn red zone FGs into TDs

Once we can find a way to do that we will be a true "top 5" offense.

Texan JBZ
10-16-2008, 06:45 PM
We still have room for improvement.

1. Cut down on turnovers
2. Turn red zone FGs into TDs

Once we can find a way to do that we will be a true "top 5" offense.

Yes, we do have room for improvement. But, we are still #5 in the league in total offense despite what you feel makes a "top 5" offense. Like our record, we are what we are.

Texan JBZ
10-16-2008, 06:55 PM
To add to it, the Texans offense is 2nd in the AFC in passing and receiving yards, and 8th in the league in rushing yards. Yes, the Texans need to improve their red zone efficiency but I think it is coming. I think Kyle Shanahan is doing a great job and headed for great things (like, the future HC of the Texans).

Norg
10-16-2008, 07:01 PM
and just to think over the past for years are mind set was Defense Defense Defense thats all we been drafting and FA signing well not 100% we have been pretty balanced in terms of O/D

Sideline
10-16-2008, 07:02 PM
We still have room for improvement.

1. Cut down on turnovers



That is the key to eternal offensive power though.

Malloy
10-16-2008, 07:14 PM
Yes, we do have room for improvement. But, we are still #5 in the league in total offense despite what you feel makes a "top 5" offense. Like our record, we are what we are.

Gotta agree with Nero on that one, production (yards) is a good indicator of how good an offense is, but untimately it is irrelevant if those yards do not result in points.

1: Fewer turnovers (make those yards = points)

2: Redzone effeciency (basically the same, if we work our way into the redzone, let it result in points)

Goldensilence
10-16-2008, 07:38 PM
Good things to point out and I do agree about JJ but he also evidently has to show something in pratice if he wants to bust into top 3 WRs.

Got to work on red zone efficency. Can't keep settling for FGs and holding onto the ball. That'll help both sides of the ball.

Tejas Bruja
10-16-2008, 07:43 PM
(Note to all Schaub haters: He has started four of the five games for the Texans this season. Just saying.)

And we've lost four of the five games this season with Rosenfels only starting and losing in one of those games. Just saying...:thinking:

Thorn
10-16-2008, 07:53 PM
Churning out lots of yards makes us look good as far as stats go, which is all that ranking is. What we need is for them to score points along with racking up all those yards. Houston is 17th in the league in scoring points.

But, I will have to say the offense does look better than it did last year. Fix that red zone problem and beef up the defense, and we are talking play offs. That's a lot of fixin' to do, though.

nero THE zero
10-16-2008, 08:42 PM
Yes, we do have room for improvement. But, we are still #5 in the league in total offense despite what you feel makes a "top 5" offense. Like our record, we are what we are.

Unfortunately, points win games, not yards.

will742
10-16-2008, 08:45 PM
Being 5th in offense is a great feat, but it's nothing to brag about as long as we are still leading the league in turnover differential.

Imagine if we could cut down on the turnovers, the sky is the limit!

The Pencil Neck
10-17-2008, 02:09 AM
and just to think over the past for years are mind set was Defense Defense Defense thats all we been drafting and FA signing well not 100% we have been pretty balanced in terms of O/D

I think the real point of drafting Defense was that Kubes figured he could build an offense without having to spend a lot of draft choices on it. So to build the D, spend the higher draft picks to bring in talented players that will make almost any scheme look good. Almost. Almost any scheme.

The Pencil Neck
10-17-2008, 02:15 AM
Gotta agree with Nero on that one, production (yards) is a good indicator of how good an offense is, but untimately it is irrelevant if those yards do not result in points.

1: Fewer turnovers (make those yards = points)

2: Redzone effeciency (basically the same, if we work our way into the redzone, let it result in points)

Cold Hard Football facts takes a simpler approach: points per yard. That's their Scoreability Index. If your special teams and defense score points, then your scoreability index goes up. If you're efficient in the red zone, that also makes it go up. We're 22nd on the Scoreability Index.

BuffaloglennTX
10-17-2008, 08:17 AM
The Texans have a very solid offensive attack. Our offensive attack is pretty damn potent right now. We are 5th in total offense in the entire league and 2nd in the AFC behind the Broncos (Note to all Schaub haters: He has started four of the five games for the Texans this season. Just saying.)

The thing is that our offense hasn't even reached its peak yet. Think about it: Johnson is balling, Walter is balling, Slaton is da man, Owen is producing in a major way, and even Green is running the ball effectively. What the offense missing is Jacoby Jones. That's right, JACOBY JONES! Andre Davis and David Anderson (as much as I like DA) aren't getting the job done as the 3rd WR. It's time to insert JJ back into the line-up. I don't know what the beef is between JJ and Kubes, but whatever it is they need to grill it up and chew it down. Jacoby needs to be in the rotation at the slot. Check this out: Slaton in the single back formation, OD at TE, Dre and Walt split out wide, and JJ in the slot! Rock and Roll Vandermeer style :texflag:

I like what they have done as well but a reduction in turnovers and increased efficiency in the red zone is really all they need, not a substituition for Andre Davis. AD is most often the third or fourth option on passing downs (behind AJ, Walters, Owen Daniels) so to substitute for him won't make much difference since there are not that many balls thrown his way to begin with. Don't forget that AD was in the top 5 last year in yards per catch - he's a good receiver and is faster than anyone else on the team. JJ is getting better but there is a reason he is not starting in the slot just yet. He will in time.

Malloy
10-17-2008, 08:26 AM
Cold Hard Football facts takes a simpler approach: points per yard. That's their Scoreability Index. If your special teams and defense score points, then your scoreability index goes up. If you're efficient in the red zone, that also makes it go up. We're 22nd on the Scoreability Index.

Cool, I did not know that any stats were around dealing with the 'scoreability'.
Scoreability without special teams and defensive scores would be a fairly accurate indicator of our offenses' effeciency then, right ?

sakebomb
10-17-2008, 09:19 AM
That is what is so frustrating for me. We have the talent on offense to really do some damage, but we keep shooting ourselves in the foot with the turnovers.

We are getting there but Matt better stop throwing into double and triple coverage.............and maybe hit wide open WR's in stride.

Tedc
10-17-2008, 11:08 AM
I think that you guys aren't considering one thing...

We ARE 5th in total yards and we did it against 3 of the top 5 defenses...one reason we may be leading in turnovers. Let us see how we do against similar or weaker opponents.

We may have something special on offense. I think we will all be surprised by season's end.

The Pencil Neck
10-17-2008, 12:42 PM
Cool, I did not know that any stats were around dealing with the 'scoreability'.
Scoreability without special teams and defensive scores would be a fairly accurate indicator of our offenses' effeciency then, right ?

That would be. You have to calculate it for all 32 teams to get a feel for relative efficiency.

barrett
10-17-2008, 01:07 PM
What the offense missing is Jacoby Jones. That's right, JACOBY JONES! Andre Davis and David Anderson (as much as I like DA) aren't getting the job done as the 3rd WR. It's time to insert JJ back into the line-up. I don't know what the beef is between JJ and Kubes, but whatever it is they need to grill it up and chew it down. Jacoby needs to be in the rotation at the slot. Check this out: Slaton in the single back formation, OD at TE, Dre and Walt split out wide, and JJ in the slot! Rock and Roll Vandermeer style :texflag:

excellent point. Davis really let us down after the sack to start the final drive for a win. jeeze, catching a 13 yard pass for a first down to get us out of a hole. what a looser. who pays these guys? fire rick smith. what a tool.

PapaL
10-17-2008, 01:11 PM
I honestly don't care about yardage, I'm more concerned about all the FGs we kick. Let's punch these in and stop kicking FGs.

Vinnie
10-17-2008, 01:16 PM
And we've lost four of the five games this season with Rosenfels only starting and losing in one of those games. Just saying...:thinking:

Exactly! Defense lost the other three.

barrett
10-17-2008, 01:22 PM
QB turnovers and Red Zone TD eff % on both sides of the ball are all that are keeping us from being one of the top 5 teams in the NFL.

that's alot, but generally all the other cylinders are firing.

Malloy
10-17-2008, 01:27 PM
I think that you guys aren't considering one thing...

We ARE 5th in total yards and we did it against 3 of the top 5 defenses...one reason we may be leading in turnovers. Let us see how we do against similar or weaker opponents.

We may have something special on offense. I think we will all be surprised by season's end.

I think most people realize that being fifth in yardage is pretty good, regardless of who our opponents have been. However, if yardage were the primary indicator of an effective offense, should'nt we be ~#5 in W/L ratio also?

Porky
10-17-2008, 01:53 PM
Cold Hard Football facts takes a simpler approach: points per yard. That's their Scoreability Index. If your special teams and defense score points, then your scoreability index goes up. If you're efficient in the red zone, that also makes it go up. We're 22nd on the Scoreability Index.


I like that stat. Interesting. It gives you a real good idea on efficiency.

I will say that at least this offense is entertaining to watch. We are very high up in the number of big plays so far, we usually only have a couple of 3 and outs in a game. And instead of having to get on my hands and knees and pray that we can actually put one decent drive together with Mr. Mittens at the helm, I am now more surprised when we go 3 and out. Win or lose, this team is so much more fun to watch.

PapaL
10-17-2008, 02:01 PM
I like that stat. Interesting. It gives you a real good idea on efficiency.

I will say that at least this offense is entertaining to watch. We are very high up in the number of big plays so far, we usually only have a couple of 3 and outs in a game. And instead of having to get on my hands and knees and pray that we can actually put one decent drive together with Mr. Mittens at the helml, I am now more surprised when we go 3 and out. Win or lose, this team is so much more fun to watch.

Now we pray that the D can get a 3 and out.

Hooston Texan
10-17-2008, 02:39 PM
Exactly! Defense lost the other three.

Each loss tells a different story:
We just got dominated by Pittsburgh in every aspect. We weren't ready to play. That was as complete a teamwide failure as you'll see.

Redzone offense was the biggest cuprit against Tennessee. Yes, we turned the ball over five times, but four of those five came on fourth down. In other words, the turnovers were, to a large degree, by-products of our ineptitude in the redzone that game. And only one Tennessee score--the last, meaningless one--came off of our turnovers.

The defense lost the Jags' game. The offense did not turn it over and only settled for a FG once (not counting the two-minute drill when we were clearly playing for the tie).

I think we've discussed the culprit for the Indy game, but, to avoid naming names, we'll just say it was turnovers.

So our losses have had different primary causes (though some overlap), but each of our three obvious failures: redzone offense, defense and turnovers took a turn at giving us a death blow.

Texan JBZ
10-17-2008, 04:57 PM
excellent point. Davis really let us down after the sack to start the final drive for a win. jeeze, catching a 13 yard pass for a first down to get us out of a hole. what a looser. who pays these guys? fire rick smith. what a tool.


Wow, got me there! What is the nerve of me calling Andre Davis out for doing did-ly squat so far this year. Get outta here Barrett. The eye test of Andre Davis so far is that he is ineffective as a kick returner and as a WR. He's done nothing this year worth talking about. Oh, except for that pass he caught last week. Here's one for ya - how about when he was streaking down the seam wide open and tripped over his own feet when the ball would have hit him in the hands and he could have jogged to the endzone for a TD. Remember that one?

Hooston Texan
10-17-2008, 05:48 PM
Wow, got me there! What is the nerve of me calling Andre Davis out for doing did-ly squat so far this year. Get outta here Barrett. The eye test of Andre Davis so far is that he is ineffective as a kick returner and as a WR. He's done nothing this year worth talking about. Oh, except for that pass he caught last week. Here's one for ya - how about when he was streaking down the seam wide open and tripped over his own feet when the ball would have hit him in the hands and he could have jogged to the endzone for a TD. Remember that one?

While I'm normally game for any amount of Hokie-bashing, this is a bum rap for Davis. He is our #3 wideout, but that spot may put him as the fifth and final option in our passing game behind AJ, Daniels, Slaton and Walter. He racked up his stats last year when he moved into AJ's position after the injury. Once AJ returned and got comfortable, Davis only had one reception per game the last five games last year.

As for kickoff returns, he sure did look tentative bringing back Miami's last kickoff (when we really could have used a big return). But he did have an excellent--and quite important--return in the second quarter: after Miami went up 14-3, he brought the ensuing kickoff back to the Miami 42. After only one first down, we were able to kick a FG to trim the lead to 8. That return got lost in the shuffle when JJ took the punt back a few minutes later, but it really helped to stop the early bleeding.

When we were forced to play Davis in AJ's spot last year, we still managed to move the ball. That, to me, is Davis' value--a reasonable insurance policy for AJ who can return kickoffs with the best of them. I don't think we can expect our #3 wideout to wow us with receiving stats.