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NeViKaN
12-28-2004, 05:07 PM
I've heard the Seahawks coach Mike Holgren may want to come to H-town. Has Capers done enough to keep this from happening. I like him as a person but is he better for our future than Holgren? I have read over and over again in this forum about the Texans not receiving respect nationally. Well Holgren would instantly give us primetime respect. He said that one of the reasons he wanted to come south was that David Carr reminded him of Brett Favre. Whos he? I do believe that Carr is not being used to the best of his ability and Holgren has proven to be a great QB couch and I like his offense better. One gripe that I have with Capers is I think that he is loosing the team. By this I mean, in our first year we consistently played aggressive :hairpull: and stayed in games. We never seemed to come out flat (exept Cinci), now we seem to be hit or miss. Kill or be killed and not able to play a full four quarters. Maybe with a couching change :BananaWav we can change that. What do yall think? :hmmm:

Vinny
12-28-2004, 05:12 PM
No chance. Capers is not going anywhere. I think he has done a fine job.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
12-28-2004, 05:16 PM
I think the couches in the Texans training facility are fine. :)




Edit: Nevermind. You fixed the title. :heh:

AlexVanderpool
12-28-2004, 05:18 PM
where exactly did you read this???

i think that holmgren is a highly overrated coach. he was more lucky than good in greenbay, and has had menial success with a very talented seattle team. Though he is a high profile coach, he isnt half as good as his protege andy ried.

that being said, i think that carr and johnson would be a natural fit in the west coast offense... IMO, best case scenerio would be to keep the capers' 3-4 D and hire a west coast oriented offensive coordinator to manage the offense.

donbmt
12-28-2004, 05:23 PM
Well Holgren would instantly give us primetime respect.
As far as primetime respect, the Texans have played in primetime twice and both times had as respectable showings as you could ever ask for. I don't think HolMgren would do any good on that front.

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 05:29 PM
What has Holmgren ever done without Favre? I think you guys are fine with Capers.

Harry Biped
12-28-2004, 06:05 PM
I think that the Texans should shake things up a bit, but I'm still not sure that Capers is the entire problem or that Holmgren would actually be that different. Holmren's success at Green Bay had a lot to do with the people around him, most of which have moved on to better coaching positions. If we could attract a decent Offensive Coordinator, I think that we would see a major improvement in the Texans performance. But I'm not sure that swapping Capers out is the answer just yet. I'll say this though, if Capers does not realize that Palmer is not getting it done, the whole staff will be sent packing. Contrary to what a few posters on this site think, the majority of Texans fans are more than ready for a change. When that happens, change is never far behind.

TheTim5125
12-28-2004, 06:06 PM
Capers has done a fine job. We've progressed every year what more can you ask.

Dime
12-28-2004, 06:10 PM
Capers has done a fine job. We've progressed every year what more can you ask.

ummmm... Quicker Progress.... :rofl: .. you asked...

Harry Biped
12-28-2004, 06:23 PM
We have not progressed that much. We improved 1 game last season and 2 games so far this season against a much weaker schedule than last year. Improvement is more productivity from the offense. We haven't gotten that. Improvement is not making the same old stupid mistakes. We still do that. In terms of talent this team has grown by leaps and bounds. In terms of success on the field, there has been little improvement. The improvement that we have seen is far more from the influx of more talent thru the draft than anything that coaching has brought us. San Diego, Pittsburgh, and the Jets are all teams that have about the same amount of talent that the Texans have. The difference is better coaching. The Texans are building a team with good players, but they will need the appropriate coaching to progress further. Carr is a talented guy, but he has been coached into a hole. He makes bad decisions often and is not fundamentally sound with his throwing motion or they way he handles himself in the pocket. That is because he has not been taught the position of NFL QB very well. That's Palmer's job and he's not very good at it.

NeViKaN
12-28-2004, 06:24 PM
where exactly did you read this???

I heard it on sports radio 610 with John Mclain.

NeViKaN
12-28-2004, 06:26 PM
I love the Texans. Ive traveled a couple of times to see them (yes Chicago was that cold) so please dont think Im jumping off of a band wagon. First I agree that Capers is not the problem. I like him personally, but can you change Palmer without Capers? Run-run-pass. I also agree that Holgren has not done much since GB, I kinda made the same point, but I think hed be better for Carr. Im glad that we have made improvement, but like I said, we have taken steps back as well. All I have to say is playoff next year.

Hey Jag fan 21-0

Thanks for your responses

Vinny
12-28-2004, 06:31 PM
San Diego, Pittsburgh, and the Jets are all teams that have about the same amount of talent that the Texans have. The difference is better coaching. Funny you should use these teams as examples. San Diego (4-12), Pittsburgh (6-10), and the Jets (6-10), all had worse records than we have this year and made no drastic changes and are all playoff teams this year. Looks to me, we have a better record than all of them before they made a solid playoff run this year.

wags
12-28-2004, 06:35 PM
Funny you should use these teams as examples. San Diego (4-12), Pittsburgh (6-10), and the Jets (6-10), all had worse records than we have this year and made no drastic changes and are all playoff teams this year. Looks to me, we have a better record than all of them before they made a solid playoff run this year.

There also teams that could have given up on their coaches, but they decided to stick it out. :hmmm:

Harry Biped
12-28-2004, 06:44 PM
Funny you should use these teams as examples. San Diego (4-12), Pittsburgh (6-10), and the Jets (6-10), all had worse records than we have this year and made no drastic changes and are all playoff teams this year. Looks to me, we have a better record than all of them before they made a solid playoff run this year.
Yeah, but they improved this year, the Texans did not. Why is that? My best guess and that of most Texans fans and many around the NFL is coaching. Holgren would not be making statements like that if he did not feel that there was a significant chance that the Texans would make a change. I don't doubt that there will not be a coaching change, but there should be some significant shake up at this point, cause things aren't working.

Vinny
12-28-2004, 06:45 PM
Yeah, but they improved this year, the Texans did not. Why is that? We went from a 2nd year, start-from-scratch NFL expansion team to 8-8. You have no patience at all apparently.

Porky
12-28-2004, 06:49 PM
The run-run-pass everyone complains about is more about Capers philosphy than Palmer. Personally, I would love to see Capers as the 3-4 D coordinator, Palmer as the O-coordinator, and someone else as the head coach. Having said that, all in all, we are at 7 wins, which was my prediction coming into this year. If we get to 8, then that's all gravy as far as I am concerned. If Mr. Biped is unhappy with 8-8, then he needs to get a reality check. We are in no way as mature of a team as those he mentioned. In addtion, we are far ahead of Cleveland, who was the last expansion team, AND they have had about 3 more years to do it. I think every GM in the league would take the Texans 53 man roster vs. the Browns roster, and we have been in business 3 years. Relax! Rome wasn't built in a day. Conficious say - The fire that burn hottest also burn out quickest. :hmmm:

Marcus
12-28-2004, 08:01 PM
I'm just wondering if Harry Biped and Ibar Harry have the same IP address.

Or is it just a chicken-little attitude that comes from anyone named Harry? :bouncey:

Harry Biped
12-28-2004, 08:48 PM
We went from a 2nd year, start-from-scratch NFL expansion team to 8-8. You have no patience at all apparently.
The Texans are not 8-8 yet and they have a terrible record when it comes to games like this one coming up. Certainly, I'm hoping for 8-8, but it is still just a mediocre showing from a franchise that has many more advantages that most in the NFL do right now. When this team was put together, there was an emphasis on winning by year 3. Now everybody is saying it was a four year plan. I have seen and heard Charley Casserly contradict all of that. His intention was to become winners as quickly as possible without hurting the team's long term future. He has express disappointment several times over the last 2 seasons about the way things have not gone as planned and inferred in a interview on TV about half way thru this year that they would make "whatever changes they had to make to improve the team in the offseason". You may not have been paying attention to that, but I was. I know that there is the sentiment that I'm not being patient, but my point is that some things that don't work today, won't work in a year or 2 either, because it is a flawed philosophy. Make the changes now and be ahead of the game. That's all. I'm not looking to completely overhaul the entire system, just improve the offense. With a better offensive philosophy, we are a playoff team right now and everyone is happy.

TexansTrueFan
12-28-2004, 08:57 PM
The Texans are not 8-8 yet and they have a terrible record when it comes to games like this one coming up. Certainly, I'm hoping for 8-8, but it is still just a mediocre showing from a franchise that has many more advantages that most in the NFL do right now. When this team was put together, there was an emphasis on winning by year 3. Now everybody is saying it was a four year plan. I have seen and heard Charley Casserly contradict all of that. His intention was to become winners as quickly as possible without hurting the team's long term future. He has express disappointment several times over the last 2 seasons about the way things have not gone as planned and inferred in a interview on TV about half way thru this year that they would make "whatever changes they had to make to improve the team in the offseason". You may not have been paying attention to that, but I was. I know that there is the sentiment that I'm not being patient, but my point is that some things that don't work today, won't work in a year or 2 either, because it is a flawed philosophy. Make the changes now and be ahead of the game. That's all. I'm not looking to completely overhaul the entire system, just improve the offense. With a better offensive philosophy, we are a playoff team right now and everyone is happy.

Oh lord harry i expected you to say something like this. Ok OK lets be like the chicago bears or the cleveland browns, maybe the arizona cardinals they seem to get a new coach every year just cause things dont work out !!! And WOW look at how great their organizations are !!! Some people are so ignorant !!!

Ibar_Harry
12-28-2004, 09:25 PM
I'm not related nor do I know Biped. I too just read the postings. However, I still tend to agree with some of what he is saying. By the way changing your head coach after 3 years, is not changing every year. I too feel the direction of the team has been down hill this year. Is AJ in the PRO Bowl? Did everyone want DRob in the PRO bowl? While AJ has done things on this team, he's not getting that because of our offensive productivity. He's being reconginized as being a far better player than he shows while playing for Houston. The development of the O-line has been a dismal failure. What started this, however, was a statement about Holgren by perhaps McLain. I find that interesting, because there was another article in the Chronicle a couple of weeks ago which said everything was just fine with the Houston coaches. My comment was that comment was like the kiss of death. Many times such comments are followed by terminations at the end of the season. At that point in time there appeared to be some real disention on the team. Seems to be a lot of rumors flying. Is this a rumor by Holgren to solidify his job? McLain is not known for leaking misinformation. There's usually smoke where there is fire. McNair is a successfull businessman and I would think the excuses we hear week after week, and by the way they are generally the same, may not sit too well. He's not the vocal type and he's not going to outwardly undermine his head coach during the season. However, it would not surprise me if Capers were fired at the end of the season, particularly if Casserly is on the hot seat because of Caper's performance. I will still say that the Jaguars game could have been lost by a poor game management decision at a critcial point. They almost got a touchdown because of it. We were lucky Brown made the tackle. I simply do not think Capers is a good head coach.

TexansTrueFan
12-28-2004, 09:29 PM
awww so the blocked field goal was capers fault huh ?? Yeah i thought i saw him sneak into a jersey and go out on the field !!!!

profan
12-28-2004, 09:38 PM
Holgrem is about to be run out of Seattle, why would we take him? Bob McNair has a plan for success and he will stick to it. He will not stray from the plan when we are on the right track. What are you going to gripe about next year when we make the playoff Harrybibed? I can already here people b tching because we did not score enough points in our wins.

TexansTrueFan
12-28-2004, 09:45 PM
Holgrem is about to be run out of Seattle, why would we take him? Bob McNair has a plan for success and he will stick to it. He will not stray from the plan when we are on the right track. What are you going to gripe about next year when we make the playoff Harrybibed? I can already here people b tching because we did not score enough points in our wins.


haha you are right people always complain about one thing or the other. So if we were to win the superbowl there would still be unhappy people !

Ibar_Harry
12-28-2004, 10:00 PM
awww so the blocked field goal was capers fault huh ?? Yeah i thought i saw him sneak into a jersey and go out on the field !!!!

You miss the point entirely. It has to do with where you are on the field, the time left in the ball game, what happens if the other team gets the ball back, and what it means if you get or do not get a 1st down. Over many years of watching football, I have seen others do what we did not do. I still say we should have attempted to run for the 1st down. It was a much safer play that was relatively risk free. The problem with the attempted field goal was exactly what happened and if made, it gave the other team the ball with relatively good field position compared to where they would have had it if we ran the ball and didn't make it. If we make the 1st down we win the game then and there literally. The field goal does not necessarilly win the game at that point. Brown made the tackle I won't debate that. But if he doesn't and the Jags score its 14-7 and I bet you see an onside kick. If they get it they can then score to tie or go ahead in the ball game after our players played their guts out for most of the game. I still think its an example of game mismanagement. We won and thats great.

AndreJ
12-28-2004, 10:09 PM
You miss the point entirely. It has to do with where you are on the field, the time left in the ball game, what happens if the other team gets the ball back, and what it means if you get or do not get a 1st down. Over many years of watching football, I have seen others do what we did not do. I still say we should have attempted to run for the 1st down. It was a much safer play that was relatively risk free. The problem with the attempted field goal was exactly what happened and if made, it gave the other team the ball with relatively good field position compared to where they would have had it if we ran the ball and didn't make it. If we make the 1st down we win the game then and there literally. The field goal does not necessarilly win the game at that point. Brown made the tackle I won't debate that. But if he doesn't and the Jags score its 14-7 and I bet you see an onside kick. If they get it they can then score to tie or go ahead in the ball game after our players played their guts out for most of the game. I still think its an example of game mismanagement. We won and thats great.

What if, What if, What if,.......... give me a break. All of those what ifs and you never mentioned once that we would have won the game if Brown had made the field goal. The chances of a blocked field goal are far less than running the ball for a first.

And if your objective is to gripe about the playcalling. Two weeks ago we did decide to go for it on a fourth down in a similar situation and we went on to score.

You people discuss me. We beat a rival playoff contender team 21-0 and yet you make up all these once in a lifetime situations and say we should have done something else. Be happy damnit, go out and buy soem icecream or whatever makes you happy. Give me a break.

profan
12-28-2004, 10:13 PM
haha you are right people always complain about one thing or the other. So if we were to win the superbowl there would still be unhappy people !
Yes, when we win the Superbowl, there will be still be people wanting Capers head. These same people who want to see Capers gone, will say the team won it with talent and Capers had nothing to do with it or will complain about what if's. These people will blame Capers for the losses and give credit elsewhere for the wins.

HJam72
12-28-2004, 10:19 PM
What if, What if, What if,.......... give me a break. All of those what ifs and you never mentioned once that we would have won the game if Brown had made the field goal. The chances of a blocked field goal are far less than running the ball for a first.

And if your objective is to gripe about the playcalling. Two weeks ago we did decide to go for it on a fourth down in a similar situation and we went on to score.

You people discuss me. We beat a rival playoff contender team 21-0 and yet you make up all these once in a lifetime situations and say we should have done something else. Be happy damnit, go out and buy soem icecream or whatever makes you happy. Give me a break.

Is he ordering us to discuss him or saying that we already do it too much?

Ibar_Harry
12-28-2004, 10:21 PM
What if, What if, What if,.......... give me a break. All of those what ifs and you never mentioned once that we would have won the game if Brown had made the field goal. The chances of a blocked field goal are far less than running the ball for a first.

And if your objective is to gripe about the playcalling. Two weeks ago we did decide to go for it on a fourth down in a similar situation and we went on to score.

You people discuss me. We beat a rival playoff contender team 21-0 and yet you make up all these once in a lifetime situations and say we should have done something else. Be happy damnit, go out and buy soem icecream or whatever makes you happy. Give me a break.

And if you read my postings on that call you will see I said that was the call that needed to be made and was made for all of the right reasons and congradualted the coaches for making that call. I said that was the call that won the ball game...........................

AndreJ
12-28-2004, 10:23 PM
Is he ordering us to discuss him or saying that we already do it too much?

LoL, i meant disgusts me

AndreJ
12-28-2004, 10:25 PM
I still say we should have attempted to run for the 1st down. It was a much safer play that was relatively risk free.

What the hell are you talking about, make up your mind. Should we have kicked the field goal or not? :hmmm:

Texan Gal 312
12-28-2004, 10:34 PM
, the majority of Texans fans are more than ready for a change. When that happens, change is never far behind.

Feel free to spew forth your ridiculous ramblings but please don't generalize the majority of the Texan fans agree with you. I certaintly don't.

And it is Holmgren not Holgren.

jhawktx
12-28-2004, 10:41 PM
What is all the stink about anyway? We'll probably end up 8-8 in only our 3rd year as a team. Not bad. You'd think we were about to finish 2-14 or something. Chill.

infantrycak
12-28-2004, 10:58 PM
but it is still just a mediocre showing from a franchise that has many more advantages that most in the NFL do right now.

Really??? Other than the coaching staff you think is incompetent, please name the "many more advantages than most in the NFL" the Texans have right now--in other words instead of a self-serving generalization identify the specifics.

infantrycak
12-28-2004, 11:10 PM
While AJ has done things on this team, he's not getting that because of our offensive productivity. He's being reconginized as being a far better player than he shows while playing for Houston.

AJ is in the pro-bowl (a) because he was in the top 4 AFC WR's on the field for the vast majority of the season and (b) because he is a physical freak that opposing D's have to respect and game plan for--and he still gets the yards much of the time.

Seems to be a lot of rumors flying. Is this a rumor by Holgren to solidify his job?

One is now "a lot?" And if you are going to act like you are a good judge of coaches at least learn to spell their names--and no it isn't a typing error, you did it more than once.

I will still say that the Jaguars game could have been lost by a poor game management decision at a critcial point. They almost got a touchdown because of it. We were lucky Brown made the tackle. I simply do not think Capers is a good head coach.

You have to be kidding. 5 minutes left in a 14-0 game and you call it bad coaching to kick a field goal to make it a three score game against the cardiac cats rather than go for a 4th and 2 attempt against a 7th ranked run D that while it had given up some big plays had also stuffed DD a number of times? That is proof you will make up anything to call bad coaching. Every coach from high school on up in the country would have made that call.

Harry Biped
12-29-2004, 01:45 AM
Really??? Other than the coaching staff you think is incompetent, please name the "many more advantages than most in the NFL" the Texans have right now--in other words instead of a self-serving generalization identify the specifics.
The Texans have the best stadium and facilities in the NFL. There is no state income tax in Texas and that is a huge benefit to prospective players. The mild winter weather is also an attractant to many NFL players. Many live in Houston now and did not grow up there and never played for a Houston team. The Texans have been afforded more picks in the draft the last 2 seasons by the NFL, however they did trade some of them away. Not to mention all of the talent they were able to get from other teams especially the Jets and the Jags in the expansion draft. They have no major long term salary cap issues to deal with. The franchise is the 3rd most valuable in the NFL. The owner is the 2nd richest in the NFL. The city does a great job supporting the team, right now anyway. That is a few of many. Is that specific enough.

Feel free to spew forth your ridiculous ramblings but please don't generalize the majority of the Texan fans agree with you. I certainly don't.

And it is Holmgren not Holgren.

First of all, I could care less about how to spell Holmgren. It's obviously a typo and for you or anyone else to point it out is very childish. What it reflects, is that since you lack the intellect to offer a real meaningful statement about the status of the team or my opinion of that, you choose to strike out at me to try and make me look foolish to make yourself feel better. Did it work? Do you feel better?

Secondly, you should start to read the papers, this website and listen to sports talk radio sometime. And if you go to the games, listen to the people around you when the offense is screwing away another opportunity. If you don't go to the games, just listen to the fans boo Palmer and his offense on TV or radio after said screwing away of another opportunity. The fans, especially the ones that buy the tickets, want Palmer gone ASAP. If you don't, then you are in the minority and that is your problem, not mine. If you don't agree, then make an intelligent statement of such, don't just let your misguided emotions lead you to taking a shot at me because I stated a fact.

It is far worse for the team and it's cause to lay back and let them present a team that is playing well below it's potential because of the leadership. There is nothing wrong with calling for change, even if you don't like it. I'll state again, my issues are with Palmer's failed offensive philosophy, not with the team, except for the extent that they allow it to negatively impact the team and its fans, without changing it. I'm not calling for Capers' head yet, but he has one more year to get things right and if he doesn't they'll all be gone and the team will have to start over from scratch. All I want is to rid them of what the problem is in the 1st place, Chris Palmer.

infantrycak
12-29-2004, 01:55 AM
Is that specific enough.

Ummm, in a word--no, since only the extra draft picks has anything to do with on field performance and anybody that doesn't fall completely into one or both of the knee-jerk or un-football knowledgeable categories knows it takes time for rookies to develop and time to build team with not only starters but quality depth.

And if you go to the games, listen to the people around you when the offense is screwing away another opportunity. If you don't go to the games, just listen to the fans boo Palmer and his offense on TV or radio after said screwing away of another opportunity. The fans, especially the ones that buy the tickets, want Palmer gone ASAP.

Once again, ummm, no. Have been to every single home game and there have been very few occassions with booing, a few granted, but then in a group of 70,000 people you are likely to find someone that agrees with you--of course you will also find some people that believe they can talk to their dog, doesn't make them right.

Harry Biped
12-29-2004, 02:33 AM
Ummm, in a word--no, since only the extra draft picks has anything to do with on field performance and anybody that doesn't fall completely into one or both of the knee-jerk or un-football knowledgeable categories knows it takes time for rookies to develop and time to build team with not only starters but quality depth.
Being that, the Texans have chosen to use the draft almost exclusively to build/improve their team, it is undenyably an advantage to have had extra draft choices. Rookie development has little to do with the question at hand. Did the Texans have advantages over most of the other teams in the league? The most certainly did, by this and all of the other points I listed as well.

Once again, ummm, no. Have been to every single home game and there have been very few occassions with booing, a few granted, but then in a group of 70,000 people you are likely to find someone that agrees with you--of course you will also find some people that believe they can talk to their dog, doesn't make them right.

If you haven't heard the boos, then you must have been high or drunk or hidden away in the suites on the club level. The fans have booed the offense at every home game this season and usually more than once and it has been pointed out by the media several times this season alone. I too have been to every game this season and I have 1st hand knowledge of it along with the 60,000-65,000 other fans who actually show up for the games.

Grid
12-29-2004, 04:17 AM
If he wants an O-coordinator job I think we can help him out. if he wants to run the ball game, he better go to san fran.

ledzeppelin229
12-29-2004, 04:34 AM
And some teams have had 10, 20, 30, 40+ years to get their team and fanbase established. I'd say that outweighs any advantages some meager draft picks might have given Houston.

Fanbase was largely there because of the Oilers football fans, but If you went to each team and said "You can keep 2 players, but everyone else that has been here longer than 3 years, you're gone. The team can try to sign a few decent FAs and the rest have to be journeymen and rookies." And that doesn't even take into account that some coaches have been with their teams longer than 3 years.

Maybe that isn't an accurate comparison, but you get the idea. It's 3:30. Sucks being about the only poster left at this point. (But I get up late as hell right now so it's my own fault.)

I'm not posting this to complain, I'm just saying the Texans are far from having advantages as far as the team they are capable of fielding at this point.

Ibar_Harry
12-29-2004, 04:56 AM
You have to be kidding. 5 minutes left in a 14-0 game and you call it bad coaching to kick a field goal to make it a three score game against the cardiac cats rather than go for a 4th and 2 attempt against a 7th ranked run D that while it had given up some big plays had also stuffed DD a number of times? That is proof you will make up anything to call bad coaching. Every coach from high school on up in the country would have made that call.

The Texans took a time out at the 4:12 mark to setup for the field goal. They were on the Jaguars 16 with 2 to go for the 1st. The Jaguars blocked the field goal and got it on the Houston 49 at the 4:04 mark. People had beeen pouring through our line the entire day. They needed to make something happen, so its not too surprising that they would try to block the field goal. Its also not surprising that it happened. Our kicking game of late hasn't been the best for a lot of reasons, but I suspect O-line play and pressure has something to do with it. Our defense has a lot more options with them on the 16 than our 49. You feel the way you do and I feel the way I do.

fresno8
12-29-2004, 05:06 AM
I've watched all the games this year and I'll admit I have called for Capers/Palmers head. I think Capers deserves another year because when the going got tough he turned things around, we played the Colts tough and won two good road games. In our third year going 8-8 is a good accomplishment. I would have liked to been above .500, but we all would. From 4-12 to 5-11 to 8-8 that's good solid progression. I like good steady progression rather than a rapid accent followed by a rapid fall. Lets hope to get to 8-8 and I know we will. If we don't though then the progress we've made this year and in the last three games won't seem as good as it has this season . I'm less than thrilled w/ Palmer, but Carr does audible to the run a lot so maybe it's not all his fault and the line hasn't solidified, but I would like to see a more wide open attack when the line solidifies. If not then Palmer should go, I don't think they've used Carr to his full capabilities. And the field goal was the right call @ 14-0 you try and go up by 3 scores. I was thrilled we beat the Jags the way we did. There have been other times this year when I thought Capers should go for it and he didn't, but he was just trying to get points then. Capers for another year is ok w/ me.

MichaelMC
12-29-2004, 09:38 AM
Personally I am not a big fan of Capers or Palmer, but don't give up on them yet. As an organization builds from NOTHING they have to not only add talent, but also give that talent some time to develope together. Teams don't become teams without playing together for a few years. Can someone tell me how many of our Starters have more that 5 years in the NFL and none of them have more than three with this franchise. What Harry wants is the Panthers, he wants to go to the playoffs this year and be a joke for the next five. To say that we have added great players and we have the talent but the coaching is the problem is just crazy. This guy wont even give the o-line a full year to learn a completely different scheme. I guess next he will say that switching to zone blocking was a coaching mistake. Souds to me like he is the biggest Monday morning QB on this board. Would our talent have developed the way it did with out the couches *cough* Tim Couch *cough* Ryan Leaf *cough* Let me ask you this then is it not the coaches that develope talented players. Is it not the decisions coaches make that determines what a player learns about the NFL and how to handle situations. So in Andre's case your telling me that he could have walked strait out of college and into the Pro Bowl. I don't think so, college is a different game and you can thank the coaches to the talent we have. :hairpull:

NeViKaN
12-29-2004, 11:41 AM
but Carr does audible to the run a lot so maybe it's not all his fault .

Hes taught that.

aj.
12-29-2004, 11:51 AM
Can someone tell me how many of our Starters have more that 5 years in the NFL Before Coleman and Foreman went down, 8 of our 11 starters on defense had 5 or more years in the NFL - most have a lot more than 5 years - and most of those years in starting roles. Now that Simmons and Polk are in there, it dropped the starting experience level a bit.

Lucky
12-29-2004, 12:31 PM
The starting offense in the JAX game averaged almost 6 years in the league with zero rookies. The starting defense in the JAX game averaged almost 6 years in the league with 3 rookies. Any excuses for the Texans youth & inexperience should be null & void for the 2005 season.

MichaelMC
12-29-2004, 02:16 PM
I agree the fourth year everything should have time to come together. But this year there ave been a lot of scheme changes as well a personel, so you almost can't compare say the O-lines performace last year to this year because it is completely different. IMO you have to compare the O-line this year to 2002 and there is definately improvment. Capers has actually done a fine job building this team. I don't personaly like his or palmer's style of offence but it has been proven to work if the defense is top notch. That is why capers focuses on D more than O. His game plan is time of possesion. He wants the ball on our side for as long as possible, that means running the ball. While we may have an O that can put up Colt like days that is not how Capers and Palmer feel is our best chance to win. If you can keep the other team out of the endzone and without the ball most of the time you don't have to take chances in the air and on 4th and that is what they are working towards. 11 quarters anyone? I know now days a lot of people like to see a shootout and that is why they hate Capers so much, I understand believe me, but that does not make him a bad coach or Palmer a bad OC it is just not the style of footbal you like but give credit where credit is due....

shinerbock_girl
12-29-2004, 04:17 PM
I've heard the Seahawks coach Mike Holgren may want to come to H-town. Has Capers done enough to keep this from happening. I like him as a person but is he better for our future than Holgren? I have read over and over again in this forum about the Texans not receiving respect nationally. Well Holgren would instantly give us primetime respect. He said that one of the reasons he wanted to come south was that David Carr reminded him of Brett Favre. Whos he? I do believe that Carr is not being used to the best of his ability and Holgren has proven to be a great QB couch and I like his offense better. One gripe that I have with Capers is I think that he is loosing the team. By this I mean, in our first year we consistently played aggressive :hairpull: and stayed in games. We never seemed to come out flat (exept Cinci), now we seem to be hit or miss. Kill or be killed and not able to play a full four quarters. Maybe with a couching change :BananaWav we can change that. What do yall think? :hmmm:

I haven't read or heard any one saying they were dissatified with Capers other then a few angry fans when they would lose...I don't think they would risk getting rid of him and chance going backwards instead of expanding on the progess they have made...I have to admit, i was discouraged with him a while back also, but he has done alot for this team and i think he needs to stay around a bit longer before any judgemants can be passed on him to get rid of him....

Wolf
12-31-2004, 03:17 AM
funny how you mention all that Ibar (about draft picks and expansion pics) and come to the conclusion to Fire Palmer(again)... Lets recap the expansion picks we got how many starters for the offense on that draft? Well Glenn,Walker,Sharper,Coleman,Payne can play offe....oh wait that is defense starters .. and young and Boselli are perennial probowlers on our team , so our OL is set for a few more years . seems Palmer got the better end of the deal with the expansion draft.. yeah lets fire Palmer...(hope yall are noting all the sarcasm in this post) and on our drafts.I think Palmer has done above average on draft day, For every Charles hill there is a DD in the draft. Yeah Palmer could have drafted a little better (figure being Palmer is getting blamed for the team he might as well be the GM also)

TexansTrueFan
12-31-2004, 03:30 PM
we have a chance to go 8-8 with capers in just our 3rd year, we swept the jags, the titans, and held manning to a season low a few weeks ago, and we are talking about a coaching change ?? Yes great idea lets bring in new people get rid of all the new schemes we have been learning and start from 0 AGAIN ??? Are you crazy ? Capers is a good coach and has this team in the right direction !

Human Highlight Reel
12-31-2004, 05:09 PM
We've got to be a little bit more patient the thing is when a city gets a team the fans are so excited and they expect big things from the hometown team or close to hometown team for some people.

They expect your team to go to the playoffs in their 2nd year, and make it to the Conference Championship their 3rd and to the Superbowl their 4th but that's not the case. Just be patient with Capers and Palmer right now. Give them another 2 seasons and see where we at from there at quickest the end of next season.

Me being a Big Time Texans fan, the last thing I want is Carr, Davis and Johnson to be flip flopping through a lot of offensive coaches right now. Right is a very important time for all of their growths. So just be patient right now and it pays off. Defense is playing tough, if we could just upgrade just a little bit more and inject a little bit more youth and talent there.

Then we WILL be heading to the playoffs before you know it. Defense wins Championships.