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View Full Version : Power Rankings, I disagree obviously.


Hervoyel
12-28-2004, 12:34 PM
Yes, of course i know that the ESPN Power Rankings mean nothing. As I've said before it's just part of my Tuesday routine during the season. It's also become routine to see the Texans get shanked but this week it's pretty bad. The 21-0 win over the Jaguars moved us from, get this #19 to... #19. We went absolutely nowhere according to these knuckleheads. Jacksonville on the other hand dropped from their overrated #9 spot to #12.

Complete rubbish. You can apparently beat a team twice in a convincing fashion and their one additional win merits ranking them 7 spots higher? I notice the Chiefs are also 4 spots ahead of us according to ESPN despite having the exact same record and a loss to the Texans this year.

I wonder if they'll have Jacksonville ranked higher than the Texans next week if/when we're both 8-8?

TexansTrueFan
12-28-2004, 12:37 PM
stupid power rankings mean little. They rank which ever team they like better higher. I'm guessing they are all saying our wins over jacksonville are all flukes ! I still feel a lack of respect here :hmmm: guess we'll have to win the superbowl before we get recognized as a contender

Bayern
12-28-2004, 12:48 PM
Ahhh... this isn't really anything new. ESPN gives Houston the shaft alot it seems. I think its particularly odd that the 7-8 Panthers are put in the 11th spot. :hmmm:

TheOgre
12-28-2004, 12:59 PM
I think there are a lot of teams lumped in the middle. It is hard to differentiate between them. We drew the short straw.

LBC_Justin
12-28-2004, 01:01 PM
Ahhh... this isn't really anything new. ESPN gives Houston the shaft alot it seems. I think its particularly odd that the 7-8 Panthers are put in the 11th spot. :hmmm:
The Panthers are 6-1 in their last 7 games so they have a hot hand and deserve some praise for turning it around.

But LMAO..... The Jags are a garbage team. They are so overrated it is not even funny.

The Texans maybe could be a few spots higher.

But like the rest of you I am praying the Texans beat the Browns and the Jags lose to the Raiders. (Oh it would be so great to see the Texans ranked higher than the Jaguars.)

infantrycak
12-28-2004, 01:16 PM
Well you are really going to hate CBS's power rankings then:

Link (http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/powerrankings)

Somehow winning against a "better" team moved the Hags down from 8 to 13 AND moved the Texans down from 17 to 20. Yeah, that makes sense.

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 01:28 PM
But LMAO..... The Jags are a garbage team. They are so overrated it is not even funny.

A few bad games and we are overrated? What happened when you played Denver, and what happened when we played them? How bout Indy in Indy? Green Bay? Must be nice to see us twice in a year, both with our two best offensive players hurt. :rolleyes:

Sarg01
12-28-2004, 01:32 PM
A few bad games and we are overrated? What happened when you played Denver, and what happened when we played them? How bout Indy in Indy? Green Bay? Must be nice to see us twice in a year, both with our two best offensive players hurt. :rolleyes:

No, you were overrated before the season began (anyone remember the "this year's Panthers" talk?) and have remained overrated since.

Nawzer
12-28-2004, 01:51 PM
Even though I pay little attention to power rankings and whatnot, I am surprised to see the Texans didn't move up a few spots. We are better than some of these teams in the NFC who will make the playoffs, so I don't know why we didn't climb up in the ESPN poll's. But whatever..all I'm concerned about is the Browns this week.

Sco-tai
12-28-2004, 01:57 PM
Well you are really going to hate CBS's power rankings then:

Link (http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/powerrankings)

Somehow winning against a "better" team moved the Hags down from 8 to 13 AND moved the Texans down from 17 to 20. Yeah, that makes sense.

I just don't get it. Sure, these things don't mean anything. But it's a great measuring tool to see how the national media respects the teams.
HOW DOES A TEAM shut out a team that is viewed (according to said media) as a TOP 10 TEAM, and then slip down 3 spots!? :loser

I believe an honest ranking would put us right in the middle. We can beat anyone any week...and are also capable of laying bad performances like in Denver. But to drop us 3 slots after we performed the way we did against the Jags is a complete joke.

Even if we smoke the Browns and end the season on a 3 game win-streak, I can bet the only coverage on the Texans this summer will simply say "This is the 4th year for Capers, now or never". In stead of looking at the job Capers & crew have done since 2002 and seeing that the plan is right on schedule.

:thud:

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 02:15 PM
No, you were overrated before the season began (anyone remember the "this year's Panthers" talk?) and have remained overrated since.

And David Carr has been overrated since his first snap (anyone remember the "this is his breakout year" talk?), and has remained overrated since.

Hervoyel
12-28-2004, 02:21 PM
And David Carr has been overrated since his first snap (anyone remember the "this is his breakout year" talk?), and has remained overrated since.

Except of course when he's beating the spots off of the Jaguars right?

Sarg01
12-28-2004, 02:27 PM
And David Carr has been overrated since his first snap (anyone remember the "this is his breakout year" talk?), and has remained overrated since.

Umm ...

David Carr's stats
2002 HOU 16 16 233 444 52.5 2592 5.8 9 81 15 62.8
2003 HOU 12 11 167 295 56.6 2013 6.8 9 78 13 69.5
2004 HOU 15 15 271 442 61.3 3425 7.7 15 69 14 83.6

5% better completion rate, 900 more yards, 6 more TDs for the same number of INTs and 14 more points of passer rating is a pretty darn good improvement for the year.

His stats (completion %, TDs, passer rating) are nearly identical to media-golden-boy-Leftwich's apart from Carr getting nearly one full extra yard per attempt.

TheOgre
12-28-2004, 02:47 PM
One of the reasons that we are not ranked higher is that we cannot beat good teams. The Jags (8-7) are the only team with a winning record that we have beaten all year. Even that will change if they lose to the Raiders. If we want respect, we need to finish off games like the ones against the Vikings, Packers, Chargers, and Colts (the home game). Those came down to the end and we blew it.

Fiddy
12-28-2004, 03:00 PM
Well you are really going to hate CBS's power rankings then:

Link (http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/powerrankings)

Somehow winning against a "better" team moved the Hags down from 8 to 13 AND moved the Texans down from 17 to 20. Yeah, that makes sense.Doesnt surprise me. Prisco is from Florida and has been on the Jags bandwagon form the start of the season. He doesnt give any credit to a team that beats the Jags...

the wonger need food
12-28-2004, 03:01 PM
I remember earlier in the year when they were ranked as high as 12 in the foxsports.com power ranking. Realistically, they are probably the 15 or 16th best team right now.

Hey Jagoff fan, shouldn't you be on the Raiders board annoying them this week? You guys just can't get beat down enough I guess.

TexansTrueFan
12-28-2004, 03:15 PM
jags fans still talking mess, i mean come on havent they learned by now ? I wonder if their message board is as empty as their stadium, if so no wonder they hang around here :heh:

Porky
12-28-2004, 03:24 PM
This kind of stuff is so subjective. I really don't think they are that far off really. I think the Ogre hit the nail on the head. We beat the bad teams, and with the exception of Jax, we got killed by the good teams for the most part. I think Jax rating should be mid teens, and I think the Texans around 17-21 makes sense. If the Texans want to be respected by the national media, they should think about shellacking a team like the Bolts. Respect must be earned.

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 03:25 PM
Except of course when he's beating the spots off of the Jaguars right?

Domanick Davis, our shtty tackling and our shtty offense beat us. I'd hardly csll throwing for 130 yards and 2 picks beating the spots off us.

Umm ...

David Carr's stats
2002 HOU 16 16 233 444 52.5 2592 5.8 9 81 15 62.8
2003 HOU 12 11 167 295 56.6 2013 6.8 9 78 13 69.5
2004 HOU 15 15 271 442 61.3 3425 7.7 15 69 14 83.6

5% better completion rate, 900 more yards, 6 more TDs for the same number of INTs and 14 more points of passer rating is a pretty darn good improvement for the year.

His stats (completion %, TDs, passer rating) are nearly identical to media-golden-boy-Leftwich's apart from Carr getting nearly one full extra yard per attempt.

If you want to call 15 tds to 14 ints a breakout season, you go right ahead.

Also, remember Leftwich is in his 2nd year, Carr his 3rd. Let's see what Leftwich does next year.

Fiddy
12-28-2004, 03:27 PM
jags fans still talking mess, i mean come on havent they learned by now ? I wonder if their message board is as empty as their stadium, if so no wonder they hang around here :heh:No, people are at their board. They are talking about Reggie Williams being 21 years of age and thats why he is struggling and how Leftwich isnt as good as advertised. Mass hysteria. I love it.

Dime
12-28-2004, 03:36 PM
[QUOTE=jagsfanincanada]Domanick Davis, our shtty tackling and our shtty offense beat us. QUOTE]

Ok... Did I miss something here... Bevis (thats you Jagsfanincanada) just told us his team has ummmm poor defense (tackling) and poor offense... He is basicly agreeing we are the better team this year.... he has seen the light.

Congrats Jagsfanincanada, you have passed the test of reality. Good Job!


Oh, Fred was out excuse dont cut it btw. He is one man and he does not make your entire team... We had Coleman, and a few others out... We are not yelling "If Coleman would have been in, you would have lost 40 to 0." Quoting Rumsfield here - You go to battle with what you have. You did... you lost.... Game and discussion OVER>

Sarg01
12-28-2004, 04:05 PM
If you want to call 15 tds to 14 ints a breakout season, you go right ahead.

Also, remember Leftwich is in his 2nd year, Carr his 3rd. Let's see what Leftwich does next year.

You're forgetting the Texans also have 15 rushing TDs to go with the Jags 8. Our backs just get a greater share of the TDs than J-villes, that's not Carr's fault.

HJam72
12-28-2004, 04:14 PM
Even though I pay little attention to power rankings and whatnot, I am surprised to see the Texans didn't move up a few spots. We are better than some of these teams in the NFC who will make the playoffs, so I don't know why we didn't climb up in the ESPN poll's. But whatever..all I'm concerned about is the Browns this week.

There's the biggest reason we're not ranked higher. Too many teams in the NFC that have a chance at the playoffs but are not actually better than us. We should be ahead of like 4 of those teams and we should be like 15th or 16th. The Jaguars could have been ranked below us, but I don't really think we should complain about the fact that they're not. They've played a lot better than we have against other teams in general. We just have their number right now.

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 04:18 PM
No, people are at their board. They are talking about Reggie Williams being 21 years of age and thats why he is struggling and how Leftwich isnt as good as advertised. Mass hysteria. I love it.

Our board is always like that. It really sucks, truth be told.

Ok... Did I miss something here... Bevis (thats you Jagsfanincanada) just told us his team has ummmm poor defense (tackling) and poor offense... He is basicly agreeing we are the better team this year.... he has seen the light.

Congrats Jagsfanincanada, you have passed the test of reality. Good Job!


Oh, Fred was out excuse dont cut it btw. He is one man and he does not make your entire team... We had Coleman, and a few others out... We are not yelling "If Coleman would have been in, you would have lost 40 to 0." Quoting Rumsfield here - You go to battle with what you have. You did... you lost.... Game and discussion OVER>

For that game, absolutely you were the better team. Same with the previous game. You handed us our asses. But you will not convince me your team is better than ours overall. Like you, we lack consistency. But when you can hold Peyton to less than 5 tds at home, come talk to me about being a better team through and through.

Also, if you don't think Taylor being out didn't affect the game, I don't know what to say. I don't think we would have necessarily won had he been in because of Leftwich's bad play, but if definitely affected the game, much more so than your free safety being out.

I also love the irony that when you guys lose last year 27-0, it's all because of injuries to Carr and Davis. But when we lack Taylor and have a gimpy Leftwich for both games this year, injuries aren't an excuse. How convenient.

The Jaguars could have been ranked below us, but I don't really think we should complain about the fact that they're not. They've played a lot better than we have against other teams in general. We just have their number right now.


THANK YOU! :D

HJam72
12-28-2004, 04:22 PM
Ya know, it really does tick me off though that we just won (no, demolished actually) 2 games in a row that we were supposed to lose, according a lot to our rankings by the way, and we are ranked either the same now or worse, depending on which rank list you look at. That's terrible. They need to stop giving NFC teams so much credit just for not having better competition in their divisions.

Chance_C
12-28-2004, 04:27 PM
because of Leftwich's bad play

Leftwich's bad play (and I like Leftwich) was caused by the Texans' defense. Fred Taylor being out definately hurt the Jags on sunday, as it will on any Sunday. Also, the reason he was out against us the first meeting was because we knocked him out.


But when you can hold Peyton to less than 5 tds at home, come talk to me about being a better team through and through

Try two the last meeting. Not bragging about the game, because we still lost. But, he threw two in the first quarter. As a matter of fact, that was the last TD our defense has allowed. 11 1/2 quarters without a TD allowed. Get back to me about being a better team through and through when you can do that .

gwallaia
12-28-2004, 04:34 PM
I also love the irony that when you guys lose last year 27-0, it's all because of injuries to Carr and Davis. But when we lack Taylor and have a gimpy Leftwich for both games this year, injuries aren't an excuse. How convenient.


Its ironic that you post the word irony. After the Texans defeated the Jags 24-20 last season. Your fellow Jaguars fans blamed it on Jacksonville injuries and how Leftwich was starting his first NFL game.

Easy come, easy go.

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 04:45 PM
Leftwich's bad play (and I like Leftwich) was caused by the Texans' defense. Fred Taylor being out definately hurt the Jags on sunday, as it will on any Sunday. Also, the reason he was out against us the first meeting was because we knocked him out.

It was caused by a concussion. Leftwich was missing wide open guys. Both times he missed Jimmy Smith, Smith was open. And for fans who ceaselessly rip us for being thugs, cheap, etc, you seem awfully proud of hurting Leftwich.


Try two the last meeting. Not bragging about the game, because we still lost. But, he threw two in the first quarter. As a matter of fact, that was the last TD our defense has allowed. 11 1/2 quarters without a TD allowed. Get back to me about being a better team through and through when you can do that .

The Colts have not scored more than 24 points the last 5 times they have played us. If only your team could say the same. Also, at the beginning of the year our defense went through a similar stretch without giving up a TD (1st quarter of the Buffalo game to the 4th quarter of the Tennessee game).

Its ironic that you post the word irony. After the Texans defeated the Jags 24-20 last season. Your fellow Jaguars fans blamed it on Jacksonville injuries and how Leftwich was starting his first NFL game.

Easy come, easy go.

Meh, other fans might have blamed that loss on injuries, but I definitely didn't. We just lost a hard fought game on the last play.

ledzeppelin229
12-28-2004, 04:49 PM
I also love the irony that when you guys lose last year 27-0, it's all because of injuries to Carr and Davis. But when we lack Taylor and have a gimpy Leftwich for both games this year, injuries aren't an excuse. How convenient.
[/b]

I would take it as an excuse, no problem, except for the fact we tried the same thing when our guys were missing and the Jags would have none of it. We were only missing:

QBs Carr and Banks
RBs Davis and Mack
DL Payne and Walker (and some backups)
CB Glenn
OLB Clemons
FB Baxter (He was starting early but was overtaken by Norris during his injury)

So between our ragtag of defensive journeymen, our 3rd string rookie QB and 3 string rookie RB coming off an ACL tear/and surgery, we lost 27-0.

We tried saying "But look at all our injuries! We stood almost no chance!"

Jaguars: "No, no sireebob, Houston is just full of excuses! Always them excuses with them 'Texicans'.

and then there was:
"This is the NFL, you have to be ready to play despite injuries, because every team gets injuries and you have to just play through them! That means the Slackjaws were the better team today"

I think at that point, atleast one of us probably told them "If you get hurt next year and get your due, don't pull the injury **** with us"

And here they are now, tripping overthemselves in mass panic as they come up with excuses for why their team is so crappy against "that pathetic team in Houston" who is obviously "inferior to us" even though they were beat down like the red-headed stepchild of Jack Del Rio.

Dime
12-28-2004, 04:52 PM
Our board is always like that. It really sucks, truth be told.



For that game, absolutely you were the better team. Same with the previous game. You handed us our asses. But you will not convince me your team is better than ours overall. Like you, we lack consistency. But when you can hold Peyton to less than 5 tds at home, come talk to me about being a better team through and through.

Also, if you don't think Taylor being out didn't affect the game, I don't know what to say. I don't think we would have necessarily won had he been in because of Leftwich's bad play, but if definitely affected the game, much more so than your free safety being out.

I also love the irony that when you guys lose last year 27-0, it's all because of injuries to Carr and Davis. But when we lack Taylor and have a gimpy Leftwich for both games this year, injuries aren't an excuse. How convenient.



THANK YOU! :D


Last year, Davis and Carr were not the only ones out there.. At that time, I stated we lost.. Period. You have to come with what you have. Last year, we had a HUGE amount of injuries and our record showed it. This year, we are better, more come together team. Now... that being said..

I think your team thought the Texans would roll over for them. From the remark during to coin toss to the first TD, I think your team didnt take us seriously.. Once the first TD was done, I think your team then went into shock and couldnt recover until half time. After the half, you showed more strength, but down 14 to zero, I think you all could not believe we could do that in your house..

BTW, Next years game, I think your team will take us seriously then. As much **** as Jags fans and media have been given the last few days, if you dont win at LEAST 1 game against us.. (Even if you have a 15-2 record), you are going to be slain by the media and fans.

Team wise.. I think you have a good team.. But they arent clicking together right now. They are in dis-array. Someone on that team better step up quick. Our team, however, is clicking right now. We are on a roll and have 'faith' right now. Dude... Your team or fans (by not showing up, dont give me this christmas c r a p) are missing the 'faith' right now... Like the confidence is gone.

My breakdown
Better QB - Houston right now with Jags having better backup.
Better RB - Fred is better then Davis, but Davis isnt hurt and Fred is..
Better WR - Jimmy is good, very good, but he aint a Andre Robinson. You do have about even with us on WR 2 and 3
Better Oline - Both are not doing very well, but I have to give houston's oline a VERY small margin here.
Better D line - Stroud and Henderson... - Monsters, you win there...
Better Backs - Robinson, Glenn, Sharper, Wong, sorry man... Houston rocks a bit here...
Better S/FS - Have to go with Jags on the edge here...
K/PK - Your rook and our guys the last few have looked horrible... we both lose here.

4 to 3 on position score here.. We are close.... but I have to give Houston the edge... sorry man..

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 05:08 PM
I would take it as an excuse, no problem, except for the fact we tried the same thing when our guys were missing and the Jags would have none of it. We were only missing:

QBs Carr and Banks
RBs Davis and Mack
DL Payne and Walker (and some backups)
CB Glenn
OLB Clemons
FB Baxter (He was starting early but was overtaken by Norris during his injury)

So between our ragtag of defensive journeymen, our 3rd string rookie QB and 3 string rookie RB coming off an ACL tear/and surgery, we lost 27-0.

We tried saying "But look at all our injuries! We stood almost no chance!"

Jaguars: "No, no sireebob, Houston is just full of excuses! Always them excuses with them 'Texicans'.

and then there was:
"This is the NFL, you have to be ready to play despite injuries, because every team gets injuries and you have to just play through them! That means the Slackjaws were the better team today"

I think at that point, atleast one of us probably told them "If you get hurt next year and get your due, don't pull the injury **** with us"

And here they are now, tripping overthemselves in mass panic as they come up with excuses for why their team is so crappy against "that pathetic team in Houston" who is obviously "inferior to us" even though they were beat down like the red-headed stepchild of Jack Del Rio.

I can't speak for any other Jag fans. Obviously you guys had a brutal injury situation last year and it showed.

Leftwich and Taylor weren't the only ones hurt for this game either. We have 4 DEs on IR. Our LT is also on IR (you might have noticed the human turnstile named Ephraim Salaam replacing him).

Chance_C
12-28-2004, 05:11 PM
It was caused by a concussion. Leftwich was missing wide open guys. Both times he missed Jimmy Smith, Smith was open. And for fans who ceaselessly rip us for being thugs, cheap, etc, you seem awfully proud of hurting Leftwich.

Typical jaguars fan reading something and digesting it any old way you want to. Where did I say anything about taking pride in hurting Leftwich? In fact I said I like Leftwich. The only thing I said was that Leftwich played bad because of our D. Hell I wish Lefty could've stayed in the game (I hate to see anyone get hurt, especially someone I respect). We put the pressure on your starter and your backup, that was the problem with your QB's. Please do not put words in my mouth.

shinerbock_texas
12-28-2004, 05:14 PM
A few bad games and we are overrated? What happened when you played Denver, and what happened when we played them? How bout Indy in Indy? Green Bay? Must be nice to see us twice in a year, both with our two best offensive players hurt. :rolleyes:

Its even better when we knocked your so called "great" QB out of 2 different games

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 05:17 PM
My breakdown
Better QB - Houston right now with Jags having better backup.
Better RB - Fred is better then Davis, but Davis isnt hurt and Fred is..
Better WR - Jimmy is good, very good, but he aint a Andre Robinson. You do have about even with us on WR 2 and 3
Better Oline - Both are not doing very well, but I have to give houston's oline a VERY small margin here.
Better D line - Stroud and Henderson... - Monsters, you win there...
Better Backs - Robinson, Glenn, Sharper, Wong, sorry man... Houston rocks a bit here...
Better S/FS - Have to go with Jags on the edge here...
K/PK - Your rook and our guys the last few have looked horrible... we both lose here.


QB - Push. This last game notwithstanding, Leftwich has been the equal of Carr this year.
RB - Taylor missed one game. Saying Davis is better because he didn't miss last game is laughable.
WR - You guys win here. And it's Andre Johnson, btw. How long have you been following your team?
OL - Our OL is better. You guys have had protection issues all year. Carr has been sacked much more than Leftwich despite his large advantage in mobility (43 to 24), even with garbage Salaam playing practically all year for us. We also average 4.3 ypc to your 3.8.
DL - Us no question.
LB - Push. We both have talented starters at every LB position, including a good looking rook.
CB - You win here hands down. Bolden and Washington are garbage.
S - Slight edge to us.
K/P - We win. Our kicker has a 75% percantage to your kicker's 70%, and our kicker is 4th in the league in touchbacks. The punters have very similar stats.

I score it 4-2, with pushes at QB and LB. :)

shinerbock_texas
12-28-2004, 05:18 PM
And David Carr has been overrated since his first snap (anyone remember the "this is his breakout year" talk?), and has remained overrated since.

Stop with the Carr smack. Over-Left-Sandwich has been hyped ever since he walked into the league. This guy has done nothing but ride the coattails of an above average DL and RB. Can you say Big Ben? Lefty has done nothing to prove himself. He has to be the biggest joke ever. His arm is barely above average, and he is less moble than P Manning.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
12-28-2004, 05:20 PM
Texans > Jags


nuff said

shinerbock_texas
12-28-2004, 05:23 PM
But when you can hold Peyton to less than 5 tds at home, come talk to me about being a better team through and through.

THANK YOU! :D

Actually genius Peyton threw 2TDS in the first 8 minutes of the game and zilch after that. Oh yeah you must have missed that. And by the way the Texans have held their oppents out of the end zone for 11 straight quarters

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 05:24 PM
Typical jaguars fan reading something and digesting it any old way you want to. Where did I say anything about taking pride in hurting Leftwich? In fact I said I like Leftwich. The only thing I said was that Leftwich played bad because of our D. Hell I wish Lefty could've stayed in the game (I hate to see anyone get hurt, especially someone I respect). We put the pressure on your starter and your backup, that was the problem with your QB's. Please do not put words in my mouth.

Also, the reason he was out against us the first meeting was because we knocked him out.

What way would you like me to interpret that statement? I also submit this from another texican fan:

Its even better when we knocked your so called "great" QB out of 2 different games

Now I don't want to lump you all together but this fellow sure seems to be proud of it.

Stop with the Carr smack. Over-Left-Sandwich has been hyped ever since he walked into the league. This guy has done nothing but ride the coattails of an above average DL and RB. Can you say Big Ben? Lefty has done nothing to prove himself. He has to be the biggest joke ever. His arm is barely above average, and he is less moble than P Manning.

That's odd, I didn't see Stroud, Henderson and Taylor throwing touchdowns to rally the team for 4 wins in the last minute. We must have been watching different games.

For a first overall pick, Carr has authored some pretty mediocre seasons. Obviously he plays for an expansion team, and that must factor into it, but the fact that Leftwich's 2nd year numbers compare favorably to Carr's 3rd year numbers cannot be disputed.

shinerbock_texas
12-28-2004, 05:26 PM
I But when we lack Taylor and have a gimpy Leftwich for both games this year, injuries aren't an excuse. How convenient.
THANK YOU! :D

Injuries are not an excuse when its the other team beating your Arssssss. Remember it has been the Texans who have knocked the snot out of Lefty both games.

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 05:26 PM
Actually genius Peyton threw 2TDS in the first 8 minutes of the game and zilch after that. Oh yeah you must have missed that. And by the way the Texans have held their oppents out of the end zone for 11 straight quarters

Actually, genius, you must have missed him throwing for 5 tds when he was at home, like my post said.

shinerbock_texas
12-28-2004, 05:30 PM
I score it 4-2, with pushes at QB and LB. :)

Your score in about as skewed as the scoreboard.

FINAL SCORE 21-0

shinerbock_texas
12-28-2004, 05:37 PM
Actually, genius, you must have missed him throwing for 5 tds when he was at home, like my post said.

Your statement did not reference whose home you were commenting on. Your post did not include 'his home'.

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 05:47 PM
Your statement did not reference whose home you were commenting on. Your post did not include 'his home'.

Meh I assumed you would remember the 5 TDs he put up in Indy and make the connection. I know the Texans help them to a then-season-low 23 in Houston and I commend them for that. But they still got pasted in Indy, a place the Jags went into and won.

shinerbock_girl
12-28-2004, 05:51 PM
It was caused by a concussion. Leftwich was missing wide open guys. Both times he missed Jimmy Smith, Smith was open. And for fans who ceaselessly rip us for being thugs, cheap, etc, you seem awfully proud of hurting Leftwich.

GEE Guys, we should all start a new post "HOW MANY EXCUSES WILL THE JAGS USE FOR LOSING"......LMAOOOOO..

Dime
12-28-2004, 05:57 PM
QB - Push. This last game notwithstanding, Leftwich has been the equal of Carr this year.
RB - Taylor missed one game. Saying Davis is better because he didn't miss last game is laughable.
WR - You guys win here. And it's Andre Johnson, btw. How long have you been following your team?
OL - Our OL is better. You guys have had protection issues all year. Carr has been sacked much more than Leftwich despite his large advantage in mobility (43 to 24), even with garbage Salaam playing practically all year for us. We also average 4.3 ypc to your 3.8.
DL - Us no question.
LB - Push. We both have talented starters at every LB position, including a good looking rook.
CB - You win here hands down. Bolden and Washington are garbage.
S - Slight edge to us.
K/P - We win. Our kicker has a 75% percantage to your kicker's 70%, and our kicker is 4th in the league in touchbacks. The punters have very similar stats.

I score it 4-2, with pushes at QB and LB. :)


RB - I was saying Fred is better...
WR - Rofl.. Andre Robinson..... I have Robinson on the brain, Johnson of course...
LB - I have to say here is where I feel we really differ. I think we have a better LB crew then you all do. Not saying your all are bad, I just feel mine our better.
O-Line - I think your probably right here...
S- I see this more of a push...
K/P - Our guys have been horrible this year for some reason. Many bad punts and missed FG's.

Chance_C
12-28-2004, 06:01 PM
What way would you like me to interpret that statement?

Well for starters, you should interpret it exactly as it was stated, which is: Also, the reason he was out against us the first meeting was because we knocked him out. Is it a true statement or not? Now if you want to interpret it that I took great joy out of that you go ahead.

jagsfanincanada
12-28-2004, 06:05 PM
Well for starters, you should interpret it exactly as it was stated, which is: Also, the reason he was out against us the first meeting was because we knocked him out. Is it a true statement or not? Now if you want to interpret it that I took great joy out of that you go ahead.

He wasn't out though, he played hurt, like he did in this game.

GEE Guys, we should all start a new post "HOW MANY EXCUSES WILL THE JAGS USE FOR LOSING"......LMAOOOOO..

As many as you used last year when you got shut out, I'd assume. Of course our **** effort is magnified because the playoffs were on the line.

Dime
12-28-2004, 06:06 PM
People, get off Leftwich...

I am a TEXANS FAN but this kid isnt that bad as you all say. After hearing about him and in his college days of play and how he , like David, has taken some hard shots and got up, that shows heart and goes a long ways for me. I dont feel he has Carrs arm, but he does have better accuracy then Carr does. They are about even to me. Both will be stars... I see Carr being a Steve Young later in days (Since Andre is like Rice, Rice baby), and I see Byron being a Daunte Culpepper in a few years. Both will be good..

shinerbock_texas
12-28-2004, 06:11 PM
Well for starters, you should interpret it exactly as it was stated, which is: Also, the reason he was out against us the first meeting was because we knocked him out. Is it a true statement or not? Now if you want to interpret it that I took great joy out of that you go ahead.


Chance I will say it. I would rather our Defense knock the snot out of the opposing QB every week rather than play back in the that consevative Cover-2 (bend and don't break) we seem to get caught in so much. We have 2 really good Corners, who I believe can cover just about anyone. We should allow our corners to play more man-up/ bump and cover defense, while we blitz the extra LBS to put the extra pressure on the other teams. I personally loved when the Oilers played the 4-6 Defense.

And if we knock a few QBS out of the game so be it. I am sure the other teams would Love to hurt Carr and have to face either Banks or Ragone.

Anyone remember how effective it was when we hit Manning? Or even back when the Oilers ran the run-in-shoot? The best defense against the Oilers was the Steelers blind side Blitzing that just killed Warren Moon.

Rosusu
12-28-2004, 06:12 PM
Ok, I like Leftwich, and I like the Jags. They are a great rival for us, and we always have great games against them. BUT, Jags fans need to GET OVER IT! It doesnt matter who was hurt, or any of the circumstances, YOU LOST to us twice this season. So quit your bit ching and wait until next season (you will have awhile because no playoffs). :BananaWav

Fiddy
12-28-2004, 06:48 PM
We went down one in the Fox Sports power poll, too...

http://msn.foxsports.com/story/3280114

southtexan
12-28-2004, 07:00 PM
One of the reasons that we are not ranked higher is that we cannot beat good teams. The Jags (8-7) are the only team with a winning record that we have beaten all year. Even that will change if they lose to the Raiders. If we want respect, we need to finish off games like the ones against the Vikings, Packers, Chargers, and Colts (the home game). Those came down to the end and we blew it.


Excellent quote

BigDTexansFan
12-28-2004, 07:22 PM
stupid power rankings mean little. They rank which ever team they like better higher. I'm guessing they are all saying our wins over jacksonville are all flukes ! I still feel a lack of respect here :hmmm: guess we'll have to win the superbowl before we get recognized as a contender


I used to be one howling respect us, now after seeing how little respect we get and how our team comes out and kicks butt...DISRESPECT us all you want...I want all 13 teams we paly in 2005 to trash talk us at every opportunity.

Dallas Cowboys trash talked us we sent them home hurting, Miami said we were a practice game we practiced being 1st expansion team to win Back 2 Back season openers.

Jacksonville players saying we weren't rivals to them and they looked at it as another game

Dis us and learn so what DRob isn't in pro bowl let QB's throw at him next season he will get double digit INT's. Dis our D and get pounded.

I LOVE THIS lack o respect :jumpbanan

Hervoyel
12-28-2004, 07:34 PM
Dime, just my 2 cents here but...

I for one do not particularly care for Byron Leftwich. I've got nothing against him personally or anything and I'm sure he's a stand-up kind of guy. I just don't see what makes this guy a great quarterback. I see a guy with legs of stone. I see a guy who comes apart when you get to him. I don't see any innate pocket presence or ability to feel the pressure coming. He's always been (against the Texans at any rate) pretty easy to get to and pretty much lousy when he's plodding for his life.

In games against the Texans he's been innacurate and fumble prone. I've seen him drop balls when nobody was even near him. Not fumble a bad snap or botch a handoff. I mean standing there with nobody around him or plodding along outside the pocket and just flat out dropping the ball.

I read where Byron's tough. He keeps getting hit and keeps getting back up. Newsflash people, learning that your quarterback can get his head beaten in and still stay in a game is not a good thing. If your quarterback is getting pounded hard enough to have people around the NFL talking about what a tough guy he is for getting back up then you're not a team with a tough quarterback. You're a team that can't protect your quarterback. The Texans and David Carr can tell you all about that. Is it a good thing that Steve McNair can play through injuries that would send a lesser man to the sideline? Well maybe but the fact that he's been so banged up over the years that he's talking about retirement (however passing that might be) is a sign that the rep he got from being so tough isn't worth it.

Tough is good. Tough like I saw Sunday is stupid. I give Byron no points for that nor do I give the Jags any for having a "tough" QB. They've got an accurate, immobile, and easily flustered target back there. That type of QB is in the process of being run out of the NFL by speed rushing ends and linebackers as we speak.

Congrats on drafting a younger, less mobile (but mighty tough!) wannabe Dan Marino. You better learn to protect him like he's made of glass because just sitting there being able to take a lick is going to get him to where Steve McNair's mind is a lot faster than Steve got there.

I don't get all worried that Byron Leftwich is going to tear the Texans up. When McNair starts leading the Titans back on us I get nervous. When Manning comes to the line I hope we can keep him under some kind of control. When Leftwich gets ready to take the snap I actually feel better when I know it's a passing down and he's likely to throw. As poor as the Texans pass rush has been at times this season I was sure that if there was one guy the Texans could catch it would be Leftwich.

Chance_C
12-28-2004, 08:14 PM
He wasn't out though, he played hurt, like he did in this game.

Whatever dude, you win. We suck and the Jags rock.

TexansTrueFan
12-28-2004, 09:11 PM
We went down one in the Fox Sports power poll, too...

http://msn.foxsports.com/story/3280114



thats freakin unbelievable !!!! How we gonna go down 1 after shuting out a team that was looking at play offs !

Dime
12-28-2004, 09:18 PM
Dime, just my 2 cents here but...

I for one do not particularly care for Byron Leftwich. I've got nothing against him personally or anything and I'm sure he's a stand-up kind of guy. I just don't see what makes this guy a great quarterback. I see a guy with legs of stone. I see a guy who comes apart when you get to him. I don't see any innate pocket presence or ability to feel the pressure coming. He's always been (against the Texans at any rate) pretty easy to get to and pretty much lousy when he's plodding for his life.

In games against the Texans he's been innacurate and fumble prone. I've seen him drop balls when nobody was even near him. Not fumble a bad snap or botch a handoff. I mean standing there with nobody around him or plodding along outside the pocket and just flat out dropping the ball.

I read where Byron's tough. He keeps getting hit and keeps getting back up. Newsflash people, learning that your quarterback can get his head beaten in and still stay in a game is not a good thing. If your quarterback is getting pounded hard enough to have people around the NFL talking about what a tough guy he is for getting back up then you're not a team with a tough quarterback. You're a team that can't protect your quarterback. The Texans and David Carr can tell you all about that. Is it a good thing that Steve McNair can play through injuries that would send a lesser man to the sideline? Well maybe but the fact that he's been so banged up over the years that he's talking about retirement (however passing that might be) is a sign that the rep he got from being so tough isn't worth it.

Tough is good. Tough like I saw Sunday is stupid. I give Byron no points for that nor do I give the Jags any for having a "tough" QB. They've got an accurate, immobile, and easily flustered target back there. That type of QB is in the process of being run out of the NFL by speed rushing ends and linebackers as we speak.

Congrats on drafting a younger, less mobile (but mighty tough!) wannabe Dan Marino. You better learn to protect him like he's made of glass because just sitting there being able to take a lick is going to get him to where Steve McNair's mind is a lot faster than Steve got there.

I don't get all worried that Byron Leftwich is going to tear the Texans up. When McNair starts leading the Titans back on us I get nervous. When Manning comes to the line I hope we can keep him under some kind of control. When Leftwich gets ready to take the snap I actually feel better when I know it's a passing down and he's likely to throw. As poor as the Texans pass rush has been at times this season I was sure that if there was one guy the Texans could catch it would be Leftwich.


Good comments.. the one reason I do like Leftwich is heart tho. In college, this boy (if you didnt know) was playing in a playoff game and had his knee blown out. The coaches went to get him out... he wouldnt let them till he finished the drive. Against his coaches wishes, he lead the team down the field (being carried to each play by his Oline) till he threw a touchdown. Then, he was out. Was this stupid.... yes... But it showed me someone who would fight through a injury for the love of competition and the game. Its the heart of this kid I like. In both the games against the Texans this year, you didnt see Byron.. He wasnt playing or even acting like himself. All I have to say, is love him or hate him, lets just not underestimate him...

Ibar_Harry
12-28-2004, 09:38 PM
Herv so much of the ESPN power rating is based on w-l record. Therefore, the Jags didn't drop much because of that. We simply were put in a larger grouping with similar records. When that happens we tend to wind up on the bottom of that group. The Bears win was not a quality win. In reality the Jags win is probably questionable by many. Right or wrong that is just the way it is. However, having said that I still say this team has as much talent as any team out there, but it has never been developed by this coaching staff. We probably have a top 15 or better team.

utahmark
12-29-2004, 12:17 AM
i know the rankings dont mean anything but this one is annoying. we go on the road and beat the jag's and we move from 17th down to 20th and the jags are still ranked 7 spots ahead of us. didnt we beat them both times we played them? how do you lose 3 spots after a win on the road to a team that was ranked 9 spots ahead of you? and the game wasnt even close.

BWPaint
12-29-2004, 12:22 AM
i know the rankings dont mean anything but this one is annoying. we go on the road and beat the jag's and we move from 17th down to 20th and the jags are still ranked 7 spots ahead of us. didnt we beat them both times we played them? how do you lose 3 spots after a win on the road to a team that was ranked 9 spots ahead of you? and the game wasnt even close.

Personnaly I want all the media to say we stink...we are a bunch of losers...

...if you think about it, when is the last time that the press was right?
they are usually correct when they "REPORT the NEWS", but when they "Give Their Opinion", they are wrong 99% of the time!

Don't let it get you down...this will work to our benefit

Can anyone name me one time any of these "self-proclaimed experts" were right....hell this board knows more than any sports (I could never play the games, so I write about it) writer....

All the players of other teams read their columns and take it for gospel...THAT IS THE BEST THING WE CAN HAVE GOING FOR US.....just another arrow in our bow....I love it actually....


let them cut us down...it will be so much sweeter....

jagsfanincanada
12-29-2004, 08:28 AM
Dime, just my 2 cents here but...

I for one do not particularly care for Byron Leftwich. I've got nothing against him personally or anything and I'm sure he's a stand-up kind of guy. I just don't see what makes this guy a great quarterback. I see a guy with legs of stone. I see a guy who comes apart when you get to him. I don't see any innate pocket presence or ability to feel the pressure coming. He's always been (against the Texans at any rate) pretty easy to get to and pretty much lousy when he's plodding for his life.

In games against the Texans he's been innacurate and fumble prone. I've seen him drop balls when nobody was even near him. Not fumble a bad snap or botch a handoff. I mean standing there with nobody around him or plodding along outside the pocket and just flat out dropping the ball.

I read where Byron's tough. He keeps getting hit and keeps getting back up. Newsflash people, learning that your quarterback can get his head beaten in and still stay in a game is not a good thing. If your quarterback is getting pounded hard enough to have people around the NFL talking about what a tough guy he is for getting back up then you're not a team with a tough quarterback. You're a team that can't protect your quarterback. The Texans and David Carr can tell you all about that. Is it a good thing that Steve McNair can play through injuries that would send a lesser man to the sideline? Well maybe but the fact that he's been so banged up over the years that he's talking about retirement (however passing that might be) is a sign that the rep he got from being so tough isn't worth it.

Tough is good. Tough like I saw Sunday is stupid. I give Byron no points for that nor do I give the Jags any for having a "tough" QB. They've got an accurate, immobile, and easily flustered target back there. That type of QB is in the process of being run out of the NFL by speed rushing ends and linebackers as we speak.

Congrats on drafting a younger, less mobile (but mighty tough!) wannabe Dan Marino. You better learn to protect him like he's made of glass because just sitting there being able to take a lick is going to get him to where Steve McNair's mind is a lot faster than Steve got there.

I don't get all worried that Byron Leftwich is going to tear the Texans up. When McNair starts leading the Titans back on us I get nervous. When Manning comes to the line I hope we can keep him under some kind of control. When Leftwich gets ready to take the snap I actually feel better when I know it's a passing down and he's likely to throw. As poor as the Texans pass rush has been at times this season I was sure that if there was one guy the Texans could catch it would be Leftwich.

This is exactly what I am talking about when I say I feel bad that we always play like **** against you guys. I doubt you've watched any Jags games but the two against you. I doubt you watched him lead us down the field against Kansas City or trade scoring drives with Peyton Manning.

You also have to remember Leftwich is a second year QB. A lot of people, both Jags fans and otherwise, seem to expect so much of him, but he's still very young and still developing. People have been spoiled by guys like Manning and Big Ben doing so well in their first or second year, and forget guys like Carr, Brees, Favre, McNair, etc took a little longer to develop.

And what QB isn't going to get flustered when the protection gets to him? Even greats like Favre still make bad decisions in the face of pressure. It's not Leftwich's fault his LT is out and the backup is absolute garbage. And before you cite his lack of mobility as the reason he's sacked, Carr, Culpepper and Vick are among the most sacked QBs in the league, despite their large mobility advantage over Leftwich. Conversely, Manning and Favre are sacked very little.

texman8
12-29-2004, 10:27 AM
Sorry, Manning and Favre play behind two of the best OLs in NFL.

TexanBacker93
12-29-2004, 10:47 AM
A few bad games and we are overrated? What happened when you played Denver, and what happened when we played them? How bout Indy in Indy? Green Bay? Must be nice to see us twice in a year, both with our two best offensive players hurt. :rolleyes:

Denver lost the game to the Jags because they wanted Elam to kick from the center of the field. It was an unforced fumble by Quentin Griffin. That wasn't a win as much as a loss by the Broncos. It was also in Florida instead of Denver.

I could care less where ESPN has the Texans ranked. The fact of the matter is when it comes to Jacksonville the Texans have big time Scoreboard. Carr has lost only 1 game to the Jags in his brief career. Taylor started the first game but came out limp as usual. Leftwich only missed a few plays in the first matchup. He was pulled because he stunk up the joint in the rematch.

I don't remember Jacksonville giving up the 27-0 win last season against a Texans team with Ragone in his first game ever and Hollings in his first start.

On a side note, Brees threw for 3200 yards in his 2nd season, his first season as a starter, and 17 TDs. . He slipped up last season behind a bad line and Marty's QB juggling job. He didn't take longer to develop. Favre threw for 3200 yards and 18 TDs in his 2nd season, also his first as a starter. Carr was hurt much of his 2nd season so it's hard to tell where he is, but I've watched him lead the Texans back against good teams and trade scoring drives with the best in the game as well.

jagsfanincanada
12-29-2004, 10:51 AM
Denver lost the game to the Jags because they wanted Elam to kick from the center of the field. It was an unforced fumble by Quentin Griffin. That wasn't a win as much as a loss by the Broncos. It was also in Florida instead of Denver.

We still held them to 6, while you got blown out.

Carr has lost only 1 game to the Jags in his brief career. Taylor started the first game but came out limp as usual. Leftwich only missed a few plays in the first matchup. He was pulled because he stunk up the joint in the rematch.


As usual? Taylor is almost never injured anymore. And maybe Leftwich stunk it up because he had a concussion? I suppose you've played professional football with a concussion before? :rolleyes:

jagsfanincanada
12-29-2004, 10:52 AM
Sorry, Manning and Favre play behind two of the best OLs in NFL.

Manning has had a bunch of rookies and no names starting at guard pretty much the entire year. Maybe he makes them look better than they are?

TexanBacker93
12-29-2004, 10:55 AM
We still held them to 6, while you got blown out.



As usual? Taylor is almost never injured anymore. And maybe Leftwich stunk it up because he had a concussion? I suppose you've played professional football with a concussion before? :rolleyes:

I realize he had a concussion, but he wasn't exactly doing anything before the hit. You think it was preconcussion symptoms that caused him to drop the ball???

Doug
12-29-2004, 11:21 AM
It's funny how all the talk is about Fred and Leftwich in this game yet I can't count how many dropped balls there were from several recievers. They all just looked scared! LOL

brickmantexanfan
12-29-2004, 11:27 AM
Well you are really going to hate CBS's power rankings then:

Link (http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/powerrankings)

Somehow winning against a "better" team moved the Hags down from 8 to 13 AND moved the Texans down from 17 to 20. Yeah, that makes sense.


That just goes to show that the only rankings you should rely are the NFL's ranking people at espn and cbs and others don't really pay attention to whats going on they just have to fill some space or time so they get together and drink bourbon and throw out what they think(IMO) :hairpull:

jagsfanincanada
12-29-2004, 11:38 AM
I realize he had a concussion, but he wasn't exactly doing anything before the hit. You think it was preconcussion symptoms that caused him to drop the ball???

He threw 2 passes before the fumble.

gwallaia
12-29-2004, 11:39 AM
This has to be the most quoted thread ever on this board.

TexasJedi
12-29-2004, 01:06 PM
We did better in Dr. Z's rankings. :)

13 19 (previously) Houston Texans (7-8)

No, the 21-0 victory over Jacksonville didn't earn them the six-position jump, although it helped. I have to keep them ahead of the Jags, whom they have beaten twice -- and Jacksonville is better than the middle-range teams that follow, so I'm kind of pinned here.

14 8 (previously) Jacksonville Jaguars (8-7)

Speak of the devil. OK, excuses abound, I know. Fred Taylor was out. Byron Leftwich was knocked goofy. But when you're a playoff-caliber team you have to respond with a serious defensive effort, and allowing Domanick (can't really believe that's spelled right) Davis a career high 150 yards doesn't qualify.


http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/writers/dr_z/12/29/z.rankings/index.html

edo783
12-29-2004, 03:33 PM
I think Dr. "Z" is a putz, but at least he recognises that we beat J-ville twice and that counts for a better ranking.

jagsfanincanada
12-29-2004, 04:09 PM
Did you have 7 bad games? no eight, cause you barely beat the titans. if we are talking about injuries, Denver, alot of injuries this year. Indy, Peyton Manning, nuff said. Green Bay came down to the end. And yes it is nice to see you twice a year, do you know how many people we had hurt this past week? and davis was hurt when we played you the first time

a) I have no idea what point you're trying to make with the Denver thing. Are you blaming your loss to them on your injuries, or their loss to us on their injuries?
b) Peyton Manning threw 2 tds at home to us, and lost. He threw 5 against you, and won by 35 points.
c) You lost to Green Bay, in Houston. We beat them, in Lambeau. Nuff said.
d) Our two best offensive players are hurt both times we play you, and you're whining about injuries?! Need I remind you what happened to your team when you played us last year without your RB and QB? I think they make a little more difference than a guard and a free safety. :)

jagsfanincanada
12-29-2004, 04:27 PM
a)yours
b)what happened the other time yall played
c)thats true, good for you
d)do you know who our free saftey was last year? Matt stevens, and im merely noting your injuries make no difference if your "a playoff contender"
e)next time i want your opinion, ill smack it out of you

Good times :)

a) It was the 2nd game of the year. Who did they have injured?
b) He threw 2 tds and we lost by 7.
c) It sure is. Too bad we sucked it up the next game :thumbdown :thud:
d) I was talking about your guard and free safety being out for this last game we just played.
e) No.

And no, no jaguars in Jacksonville. It's just alliteration.

Fiddy
12-29-2004, 06:18 PM
And no, no jaguars in Jacksonville. It's just alliteration.Dang. I owe my english teachers apologies. I told them that I would never hear the word alliteration outside of school...