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3rd and Inches
10-12-2008, 03:01 PM
Is it just me or is Matt Schaub's performances this season less than stellar? I'm getting really tired of seeing him not give 150% every game. I'm really sick of having to see us go 3 and out over and over again.

Does anyone else feel this way too? Or is it just me?

bah007
10-12-2008, 03:02 PM
Bad timing on this thread...

WesmanTexanfan
10-12-2008, 03:05 PM
bad timing on this thread...

hahahaha, lol!!!

3rd and Inches
10-12-2008, 03:05 PM
No it's not, because 1 play doesn't make up for consistently bad passes.

Runner
10-12-2008, 03:07 PM
No it's not, because 1 play doesn't make up for consistently bad passes.


For most teams/players maybe.

Tejas Bruja
10-12-2008, 03:10 PM
No it's not, because 1 play doesn't make up for consistently bad passes.

Amen.. Schaub is startin' to look like the next Carr to me. :bat:

jaayteetx
10-12-2008, 03:11 PM
well he just won the game for us, in spite of all the turnovers we had

3rd and Inches
10-12-2008, 03:12 PM
well he just won the game for us, in spite of all the turnovers we had

1 person doesn't win a game my friend. It's a collaborative team effort. I just think he's lacking the luster he had last year is all.

Leahmic223
10-12-2008, 03:12 PM
Almost let that win slip away again.

Matt helped us out but he really needs to cut the INTs down. The only problem is he seems to throw INTs under pressure.

PapaL
10-12-2008, 03:13 PM
No it's not, because 1 play doesn't make up for consistently bad passes.

Yeah but a WIN sure does. Just ask Sage.

J-Russ
10-12-2008, 03:13 PM
Almost let that win slip away again.

Matt helped us out but he really needs to cut the INTs down. The only problem is he seems to throw INTs under pressure.
Well.... he was under pressure. Are you surprise he would make bad throws under pressure?

3rd and Inches
10-12-2008, 03:14 PM
Almost let that win slip away again.

Matt helped us out but he really needs to cut the INTs down. The only problem is he seems to throw INTs under pressure.

I agree. I also think his defender vision is pretty poor. He always seems clueless when he gets hit and when he throws picks. To me, he just doesn't look like the same QB. He had confidence last year.. played with swagger. I'm not seeing that this year yet.

GuerillaBlack
10-12-2008, 03:14 PM
Yeah but a WIN sure does. Just ask Sage.

Who single-handily lost the game for us last week.

buddyboy
10-12-2008, 03:15 PM
1 person doesn't win a game my friend. It's a collaborative team effort. I just think he's lacking the luster he had last year is all.

Exactly, and one player doesn't take all the blame for losses either, it's a collaborative team effort. Had we lost today, there was pressure all day, two turnovers that weren't Schaub's fault, and, yes, while he does deserve his fair share of the blame (had we lost), again, you cant blame him entirely.

Flip flopping from, blame Schaub to well, it wasn't all him, it's a team game is not fair to players.

New_Texans
10-12-2008, 03:15 PM
Well.... he was under pressure. Are you surprise he would make bad throws under pressure?

He also made that great throw underpressure to Walter :O

mussop
10-12-2008, 03:16 PM
well he just won the game for us, in spite of all the turnovers we had

If anyone won that game for us it was AJ with that INT saving catch on the last drive. Schaub just isnt that good.

3rd and Inches
10-12-2008, 03:16 PM
Yeah but a WIN sure does. Just ask Sage.

1-4.. yes the win helps. But the 4 losses still hurts and holds us back in standings a great deal. A win is a win. It's a start. But the 4 losses also say something as well. Maybe I'm a pessimist. I just don't think he's playing at great caliber.

eriadoc
10-12-2008, 03:17 PM
Taking the wins and losses out of the equation, I have been less and less impressed with Schaub. The turnovers are killing us. Maybe the Texans just need a QB that can perform under greater-than-normal pressure; I don't know. I do know that this is mostly the pass protection that this team gives its QB. So if that's as good as it gets, then we need a better QB.

J-Russ
10-12-2008, 03:19 PM
He also made that great throw underpressure to Walter :O

yep yep yep. This guy is aweeesome. Amazing play down the stretch by AJ, Schaub, and Walter. A freaking mazing. I take back every negative thing I said about AJ, this guy is simply just a beast.

4-0 against Dolphins, keep the streak alive baby!

TexansSeminole
10-12-2008, 03:20 PM
No it's not, because 1 play doesn't make up for consistently bad passes.

Exactly.

Almost and probably should have thrown in interception on third down at the end of the game.

3rd and Inches
10-12-2008, 03:21 PM
Taking the wins and losses out of the equation, I have been less and less impressed with Schaub. The turnovers are killing us. Maybe the Texans just need a QB that can perform under greater-than-normal pressure; I don't know. I do know that this is mostly the pass protection that this team gives its QB. So if that's as good as it gets, then we need a better QB.

I agree fully.

I think we need a guy who's consistent. I always know that AJ is gonna play his heart out, that Owen will play his heart out and the Defense will. But, every week I'm shaky on how Schaub will perform. I never know if he's going to be the unsure QB who's throwing INTs or if he's going to be the confident QB leader that the team needs. I'm tired of his inconsistency. Quite frankly every week, I'm developing ulcers from wondering how Schaub is going to perform for the team.

DexmanC
10-12-2008, 03:21 PM
I agree. I also think his defender vision is pretty poor. He always seems clueless when he gets hit and when he throws picks. To me, he just doesn't look like the same QB. He had confidence last year.. played with swagger. I'm not seeing that this year yet.

Same was said about Jacoby Jones until today. The way he led the team on
the final drive should go towards a good week this coming Sunday.

Errant Hothy
10-12-2008, 03:23 PM
If anyone won that game for us it was AJ with that INT saving catch on the last drive. Schaub just isnt that good.

Neither is your boy Sage.

Leahmic223
10-12-2008, 03:23 PM
Well.... he was under pressure. Are you surprise he would make bad throws under pressure?

And he threw two INTs under pressure.

That is what prevents him from being Franchise QB.

You look at all the Franchise QBs and they make plays underpressure or don't turn it over. Matt and Sage both turn it over under pressure. Yeah he toughened up the 2nd half. I hope I'm wrong and he turns out to be great...

I'm just calling it how I see it. We don't have years to see if he will develop. We did when we had Carr...difference is we had guys that were willing to grow with Carr and the team. IT is different now, we have guys that expect to win NOW. When does doesn't happen they leave and we'll have a hard time holding onto talent.

New_Texans
10-12-2008, 03:25 PM
1-4.. yes the win helps. But the 4 losses still hurts and holds us back in standings a great deal. A win is a win. It's a start. But the 4 losses also say something as well. Maybe I'm a pessimist. I just don't think he's playing at great caliber.

Of course hes not playing at great caliber but, after seeing Sage play wonderfully for 56 minutes then squander the game in the last 4, it makes me appreciate the QB doing something to help the team WIN in the last few minutes of the game.

Also, Schaub can run that 2 minute drill.

Another thing i noticed is that the deep ball wasn't really there for, maybe it was still the lingering effects from illness, Matt's ball seemed a bit flat today. Hopefully next week that'll be corrected.

J-Russ
10-12-2008, 03:26 PM
And he threw two INTs under pressure.

That is what prevents him from being Franchise QB.

You look at all the Franchise QBs and they make plays underpressure or don't turn it over. Matt and Sage both turn it over under pressure. Yeah he toughened up the 2nd half. I hope I'm wrong and he turns out to be great...

I'm just calling it how I see it. We don't have years to see if he will develop. We did when we had Carr...difference is we had guys that were willing to grow with Carr and the team. IT is different now, we have guys that expect to win NOW. When does doesn't happen they leave and we'll have a hard time holding onto talent.
And we do with a new QB you want to bring in? Look this guy shown enough when hes not pressured, hell he shown enough when he was pressured to make me believe we will keep him for another year, without drafting a new QB. Now I'm just hoping that we could possibly reconstruct his contract, but even if we don't we're not paying him like a franchise QB. There's plenty of QB thats getting pay more then him, so I'm comfortable with his contract and his play.

If you get him a B+ O-line, theres no doubt in my mind that this guy can be great for us. I rather draft Duke Robinson right now, then Matthew Stafford.

HJam72
10-12-2008, 03:27 PM
I won't knock him much this week, but I don't think Schaub is our starter next season. I believe he becomes our backup to somebody--not Rosencopter, who will be gone.

New_Texans
10-12-2008, 03:29 PM
I won't knock him much this week, but I don't think Schaub is our starter next season. I believe he becomes our backup to somebody--not Rosencopter, who will be gone.

Who? a rookie?

PapaL
10-12-2008, 03:29 PM
Schaub has an excuse this game and still pulled it out (sick, stomach thing, 7 lbs lost in a week) - what was Sage's excuse last week when they were winning?

mussop
10-12-2008, 03:29 PM
Exactly.

Almost and probably should have thrown in interception on third down at the end of the game.

Yes if it wasnt for Schaubs inconsistant play we wouldnt of had to scrap for a win at the end of the game against a far less talented team. I hope he gets better Im rooting for him but so far he has SUCKED!!!!!

J-Russ
10-12-2008, 03:30 PM
Who? a rookie?

No! Obviously we want to give up another two 2nds plus a 1st to finally get our franchise QB! :rolleyes:

b0ng
10-12-2008, 03:30 PM
So yeah, it must've been the running game that won us the game today?

:confused:

mussop
10-12-2008, 03:31 PM
Neither is your boy Sage.


WRONG! Sage aint my boy either! Dont think either one is a quality NFL QB right now.

HJam72
10-12-2008, 03:31 PM
Who? a rookie?

That is possible you know.

PapaL
10-12-2008, 03:31 PM
Yes if it wasnt for Schaubs inconsistant play we wouldnt of had to scrap for a win at the end of the game against a far less talented team. I hope he gets better Im rooting for him but so far he has SUCKED!!!!!

Are you David Carr?

New_Texans
10-12-2008, 03:31 PM
Schaub has an excuse this game and still pulled it out (sick, stomach thing, 7 lbs lost in a week) - what was Sage's excuse last week when they were winning?

Yeah i think thats why his throws seemed a bit flat. He looked much smaller as well but hey, he took hits and got the ball out there to his receivers.

Not to mention, if AJ hadn't fumbled it wouldn't have been close. The ENTIRE team is making stupid mistakes!!! Not just Schaub. If we correct those stupid plays, we will be fine.

Leahmic223
10-12-2008, 03:31 PM
And we do with a new QB you want to bring in? Look this guy shown enough when hes not pressured, hell he shown enough when he was pressured to make me believe we will keep him for another year, without drafting a new QB. Now I'm just hoping that we could possibly reconstruct his contract, but even if we don't we're not paying him like a franchise QB. There's plenty of QB thats getting pay more then him, so I'm comfortable with his contract and his play.

If you get him a B+ O-line, theres no doubt in my mind that this guy can be great for us. I rather draft Duke Robinson right now, then Matthew Stafford.


I think the difference is if we bring in a new QB whoever it may be, he will have way more weapons to work with.

We just can't be patient with Matt at all. I feel all of our guys want to win now.

TheRealJoker
10-12-2008, 03:31 PM
Gotta give Schaub his due atleast for this week. He earns all the kudos he gets after leading the gamewinning td drive. Say what you want about whether or not you think he's the long term answer but that drive just proved he's got heart.

That's a start for now, lets build on this win for an improbable run to the playoffs!!! :fans:

New_Texans
10-12-2008, 03:32 PM
That is possible you know.

Isnt this draft a bad QB draft?

J-Russ
10-12-2008, 03:32 PM
That is possible you know.

No way, and I mean no way does Kubiak put Schaub behind a rookie. We might draft a QB to groom(not preferred by me) but no way do we keep Schaub and bench him for a rookie QB next year.

J-Russ
10-12-2008, 03:34 PM
Isnt this draft a bad QB draft?

Exactly! Everyone lets rally around Cullen Harper! He'll be healthy for us next year, just in time to led us to our first playoff berth! :thud:

PapaL
10-12-2008, 03:34 PM
Yeah i think thats why his throws seemed a bit flat. He looked much smaller as well but hey, he took hits and got the ball out there to his receivers.

Not to mention, if AJ hadn't fumbled it wouldn't have been close. The ENTIRE team is making stupid mistakes!!! Not just Schaub. If we correct those stupid plays, we will be fine.

I said it back in warmups, he looked small this week. I don't know how much, if any, it affected his play. It looked to me that even his deep ball hung as opposed to the zip he normally has.

mussop
10-12-2008, 03:35 PM
No way, and I mean no way does Kubiak put Schaub behind a rookie. We might draft a QB to groom(not preferred by me) but no way do we keep Schaub and bench him for a rookie QB next year.

No what we need is a quality veterin.

Scooter
10-12-2008, 03:39 PM
we win and the first post i read is bitching. :mcnugget:

J-Russ
10-12-2008, 03:39 PM
No what we need is a quality veterin.

Well we have two right now. We're not going to get a better QB in the FA, and unless you wanna pull a Mike Ditka, we're not getting a better one in the draft either.

Stemp
10-12-2008, 03:40 PM
Tim Tebow should be coming out this year. We might have a shot at him depending on how our season goes. He might be worth grooming for a year.

mussop
10-12-2008, 03:42 PM
Schaub has an excuse this game and still pulled it out (sick, stomach thing, 7 lbs lost in a week) - what was Sage's excuse last week when they were winning?

PALEASE!!!! Excuses are for loosers!!! For every 4 good throws Schaub had 1 horrible one. He really got lucky he didnt have 4 or 5 INT's today. Im not a Sage supporter but he played flawlessy until the end of that game. I doubt he would do it again if he had the chance.

The Pencil Neck
10-12-2008, 03:42 PM
I think Schaub is going to be OK. He's got strengths and he's got weaknesses. Right now, I think that you have to get him started and get him in rhythm with good playcalling at the beginning of the game. I think he needs to get his confidence early in the game and then he's fine.

One of his early interceptions was just a bad decision. But his other one was because he was hit as he threw. His near inteception late in the game was also because he was hit as he threw. You can't blame a guy for his throws going haywire when he's being hit as he throws it.

I mean, come on. The guy made same great throws today and he made some bad throws today. But we moved the ball with him playing QB.

It's just like AJ. AJ had a MONSTER game today... but he also had some bad plays.

I think we'll probably draft a QB fairly early to groom next year but that QB isn't going to start for a couple of years.

The Pencil Neck
10-12-2008, 03:43 PM
For every 4 good throws Schaub had 1 horrible one.

You were watching a different game than the one I was watching.

mussop
10-12-2008, 03:44 PM
Well we have two right now. We're not going to get a better QB in the FA, and unless you wanna pull a Mike Ditka, we're not getting a better one in the draft either.



You obviously havent gotten over David Carr.

utahmark
10-12-2008, 03:44 PM
Is it just me or is Matt Schaub's performances this season less than stellar? I'm getting really tired of seeing him not give 150% every game. I'm really sick of having to see us go 3 and out over and over again.

Does anyone else feel this way too? Or is it just me?

are you serious, we drove the ball all over the field. he had almost 400 yards passing, most in our history. you really need to think about what your posting.

J-Russ
10-12-2008, 03:45 PM
You obviously havent gotten over David Carr.

Well, I don't understand this post at all. I'm thinking you meant that he had a bad game overall today, which is untrue. He made history today by throwing for the most yards in one game for a Texans QB.

Schaub threw down field all day and put us in position to score and win(unlike Carr), I don't know what more you want with the kind of protection he was getting.

WesmanTexanfan
10-12-2008, 03:46 PM
No it's not, because 1 play doesn't make up for consistently bad passes.

That play did...

utahmark
10-12-2008, 03:48 PM
And he threw two INTs under pressure.

That is what prevents him from being Franchise QB.

You look at all the Franchise QBs and they make plays underpressure or don't turn it over. Matt and Sage both turn it over under pressure. Yeah he toughened up the 2nd half. I hope I'm wrong and he turns out to be great...

I'm just calling it how I see it. We don't have years to see if he will develop. We did when we had Carr...difference is we had guys that were willing to grow with Carr and the team. IT is different now, we have guys that expect to win NOW. When does doesn't happen they leave and we'll have a hard time holding onto talent.

every qb throws int. thats not what makes a franchise qb. what makes a franchise qb is how well you play when it counts. matt did well today. he also did well against the jags.

Leahmic223
10-12-2008, 03:50 PM
every qb throws int. thats not what makes a franchise qb. what makes a franchise qb is how well you play when it counts. matt did well today. he also did well against the jags.

Yeah but he also did bad against the Steelers and Titans. I'm not protecting him or attacking him...he's shown me he's a mediocre QB...and this team seems to have problems winning with mediocre QBs.

Spled
10-12-2008, 03:51 PM
Schaub is the future. Draft Moreno and then we can run the wildcat.

utahmark
10-12-2008, 03:51 PM
Yes if it wasnt for Schaubs inconsistant play we wouldnt of had to scrap for a win at the end of the game against a far less talented team. I hope he gets better Im rooting for him but so far he has SUCKED!!!!!

he had 2 int early. after halftime we dominated on offense. its our defense thats keeping teams in games.

utahmark
10-12-2008, 03:53 PM
PALEASE!!!! Excuses are for loosers!!! For every 4 good throws Schaub had 1 horrible one. He really got lucky he didnt have 4 or 5 INT's today. Im not a Sage supporter but he played flawlessy until the end of that game. I doubt he would do it again if he had the chance.

he already did it again. did the same thing in jacksonville.

TheRealJoker
10-12-2008, 03:54 PM
Yeah but he also did bad against the Steelers and Titans. I'm not protecting him or attacking him...he's shown me he's a mediocre QB...and this team seems to have problems winning with mediocre QBs.

Every QB has done bad against the Steelers and Titans...especially in their house.

Leahmic223
10-12-2008, 03:56 PM
Every QB has done bad against the Steelers and Titans...especially in their house.

I'd say that too, but it can't be a excuse. Top offenses score on anyone and everyone. I'm not making anymore excuses for our QBs...they either make plays or they don't, I don't care who they are playing anymore i'm sorry. I used to make excuses for Carr and in the end look how that turned out.

utahmark
10-12-2008, 03:59 PM
I'd say that too, but it can't be a excuse. Top offenses score on anyone and everyone. I'm not making anymore excuses for our QBs...they either make plays or they don't, I don't care who they are playing anymore i'm sorry. I used to make excuses for Carr and in the end look how that turned out.

no they dont. the best defenses in the league have always shut down the best offenses in the league throught the history of the nfl. thats why they say defense wins championships.

3rd and Inches
10-12-2008, 04:00 PM
I'm not bitching about it. I'm just wondering if anyone else felt the same way I do. I honestly hope he does turn me into a doubting Thomas. But, thus far I haven't been impressed.

Jackie Chiles
10-12-2008, 04:00 PM
We used the same formula from last week, get AJ involved early and often. Schaub still has to work on his brain farts (who on our team doesn't) and Duane Brown needs to step up. That was his worst game so far imo and I don't think its close. 3-4s seem to give him a really hard time, hopefully he steps up fast cause he shows a lot of promise.

mussop
10-12-2008, 04:02 PM
he already did it again. did the same thing in jacksonville.

What????? Im talking about Sage. I doubt he would not protect the ball in that situation again and go for the big play.


Question for all the Schaub slobbers. Who looked better leading this team

Take away the last 4 min of the last game Sage.

Or Schaub this game?


Once again im not lobbying for Sage to be the starter just trying to show that Schaub hasnt played that great.

Leahmic223
10-12-2008, 04:05 PM
no they dont. the best defenses in the league have always shut down the best offenses in the league throught the history of the nfl. thats why they say defense wins championships.

Not every year. Defense HELPS wins championships, you need to be balanced on both sides.

Matt played well today but seriously...we could easily have lost this game obviously. I am calling it how I see it.

I'm sure most people in the nation think he's a mediocre QB despite what happened today. He's going to have to prove that he's not. I'm not making excuses for him.

Scooter
10-12-2008, 04:06 PM
Take away the last 4 min of the last game Sage.

Or Schaub this game?

sage has a 2 minute drive to come from behind against indy after two turnovers.

schaub has a 2minute drive to come from behind against miami after two turnovers.

you really want to go there?

3rd and Inches
10-12-2008, 04:08 PM
I do think the O-line needs to step up and buy him some more time. They do need to do their part to protect the QB. But, it's also Schaub's job to have awareness of the goings on around him. He needs better field vision in seeing defenders that are in pursuit of him and the football.

lol My first post back from the hospital would be a pessimistic analytical one.

HJam72
10-12-2008, 04:09 PM
I do think the O-line needs to step up and buy him some more time. They do need to do their part to protect the QB. But, it's also Schaub's job to have awareness of the goings on around him. He needs better field vision in seeing defenders that are in pursuit of him and the football.

lol My first post back from the hospital would be a pessimistic analytical one.

This O-line has a hard time against the 3-4.

mussop
10-12-2008, 04:17 PM
sage has a 2 minute drive to come from behind against indy after two turnovers.

schaub has a 2minute drive to come from behind against miami after two turnovers.

you really want to go there?

YES!! LETS DO IT!!! If it wasnt for a GREAT catch by AJ it would of been the same result but if you would read and comprehend what I wa saying you cant even compare the 2.

Scooter
10-12-2008, 04:18 PM
YES!! LETS DO IT!!! If it wasnt for a GREAT catch by AJ it would of been the same result but if you would read and comprehend what I wa saying you cant even compare the 2.

IF werent for a great FUMBLE by AJ we might've been kneeling at that point.

HJam72
10-12-2008, 04:22 PM
IF werent for a great FUMBLE by AJ we might've been kneeling at that point.

That is very true, but AJ doesn't fumble very often.

mussop
10-12-2008, 04:23 PM
IF werent for a great FUMBLE by AJ we might've been kneeling at that point.

And if it wasnt for a great punt return we wouldnt of even been in the game.

mussop
10-12-2008, 04:24 PM
Also if it wasnt for Miami dropping several of Schaubs passes we wouldnt of been in the game either.

Scooter
10-12-2008, 04:26 PM
i hope you're starting to get the picture. all the if's in the world dont mean squat ... schaub lead the texans to a win today. you can if sage for the indy game or if anything else. schaub kept fighting and kept the offense focused and we beat a team that couldnt have felt better coming into the game.

mussop
10-12-2008, 04:27 PM
IF werent for a great FUMBLE by AJ we might've been kneeling at that point.

Here is another one for you. If AJ hadnt made that catch it wa an interception and Schaub is getting run out of town instead of getting love.

mussop
10-12-2008, 04:29 PM
i hope you're starting to get the picture. all the if's in the world dont mean squat ... schaub lead the texans to a win today. you can if sage for the indy game or if anything else. schaub kept fighting and kept the offense focused and we beat a team that couldnt have felt better coming into the game.

Youre not getting the point. We won but it wa not because of good QB play. We won despite the QB making several horrible boneheaded playes agains an inferior team.

Scooter
10-12-2008, 04:30 PM
:fans:

Brandon420tx
10-12-2008, 04:34 PM
Youre not getting the point. We won but it wa not because of good QB play. We won despite the QB making several horrible boneheaded playes agains an inferior team.

And here I was thinking the Texans were the inferior team coming into this match up. Oh the light you have shown me.

ATXtexanfan
10-12-2008, 04:42 PM
Schaub sucks

mussop
10-12-2008, 04:51 PM
And here I was thinking the Texans were the inferior team coming into this match up. Oh the light you have shown me.

Glad I could help! If you really think Miami has the same talent level as us youre not very smart.

TexansSeminole
10-12-2008, 05:15 PM
Amazing how many weak excuses are made for Schaub's play when we win, but when we lose it's like a firing squad in here.

Look, Schaub did not play that well. He made some nice throws, he made some terrible throws. He made some throws to wide open receivers, and he missed some throws to wide open receivers.

The Dolphins secondary is probably the worst in the league, and we should have known that we were going to throw it alot on them today. Atleast, I did. I don't know about you guys.

He made terrible decisions on those two picks. There were 3 other throws where he should have been picked off. One was a tipped ball, the other two he just threw directly into the chest of the defender.

I don't care if he is pressured. Good QBs don't make mistakes OFTEN under pressure like Schaub does. Good QBs move around the pocket and make plays. Good QBs don't throw 5 passes into the chest of defenders in one game on a NORMAL BASIS. I understand that the Dolphins only capitlized on two, doesn't change the fact that they are all bad decisions.

You guys are funny. Had the Dolphins defender caught that pass Schaub threw to AJ in the endzone, that hit the defender square in the chest, on third down at the end of the game you guys would be going crazy. But he dropped it and some of you guys are hailing Schaub.

Goofy funny.

b0ng
10-12-2008, 05:17 PM
Leave it to a guy to throw for almost 400 yards, 1 TD 2 picks 1 TD run and he's getting shat on.

Meanwhile, some Rosencopter throws for about half of that, has a huge undeniable meltdown late in the game (Which has happened on multiple occasions) and is hailed as a savior.

Some of you guys seem to just want to hate the quarterback. Face it, it wasn't our running game or our defense that really won this one. It was the passing game, the good and bad parts of it.

HJam72
10-12-2008, 05:20 PM
I don't know who's calling for Sage, but not being real impressed with Schaub today does not necesarilly mean wanting Rosencopter out there. What's so bothersome is that Schaub was lucky not to have about 6 picks instead of 2.

dtran04
10-12-2008, 05:21 PM
ESPN throws a jab at Houston fans by writing how fans were shouting "We want Sage" and then the same ones cheering for Schaub as he ran in.

ObsiWan
10-12-2008, 05:22 PM
Leave it to a guy to throw for almost 400 yards, 1 TD 2 picks 1 TD run and he's getting shat on.

Meanwhile, some Rosencopter throws for about half of that, has a huge undeniable meltdown late in the game (Which has happened on multiple occasions) and is hailed as a savior.

Some of you guys seem to just want to hate the quarterback. Face it, it wasn't our running game or our defense that really won this one. It was the passing game, the good and bad parts of it.

We could have Joe Montana and some folks would be griping.

ATXtexanfan
10-12-2008, 05:24 PM
Leave it to a guy to throw for almost 400 yards, 1 TD 2 picks 1 TD run and he's getting shat on.

Meanwhile, some Rosencopter throws for about half of that, has a huge undeniable meltdown late in the game (Which has happened on multiple occasions) and is hailed as a savior.

Some of you guys seem to just want to hate the quarterback. Face it, it wasn't our running game or our defense that really won this one. It was the passing game, the good and bad parts of it.

He outplayed ronnie brown, big deal

b0ng
10-12-2008, 05:33 PM
He outplayed ronnie brown, big deal

Nope, he outplayed the other QB on the Texans roster.

Thorn
10-12-2008, 05:37 PM
Schaub has the physical talent to make a good QB in the NFL. But his decision making is not that great yet, and he still tries to force throws into double coverage.

But he won the game for us today, so kudos for Schaub.

ReliantTexan
10-12-2008, 05:42 PM
Take away the last 4 min of the last game Sage.

Or Schaub this game?



It's funny how we have to take away those last 4 minutes, but the last 4 minutes are the most important minutes of a game. That's when you make plays to win a game or lose a game. I'll take a Qb who starts off bad but then comes back and makes plays to win rather than a QB who plays great for 4 and a half qrts. and single handedly blows a 17 point lead in the last 5 minutes.

TexansSeminole
10-12-2008, 05:50 PM
It's funny how we have to take away those last 4 minutes, but the last 4 minutes are the most important minutes of a game. That's when you make plays to win a game or lose a game. I'll take a Qb who starts off bad but then comes back and makes plays to win rather than a QB who plays great for 4 and a half qrts. and single handedly blows a 17 point lead in the last 5 minutes.

Not everybody is calling for Sage, just criticizing Schaub's play.

Tell me, had the Dolphins defender caught the third down pass to AJ at the end of the game, as he should have (it hit him in the chest), would you be talking about how Schaub "made plays to win"?

If anything OUR RECEIVERS won this game for us. ****, AJ saved the drive on 4th and 10 when he snagged an almost impossible catch that Schaub forced. Don't really blame Schaub on THAT throw because it's 4th and 10.

The receivers were getting open ALL game. Making nice catches. I think they were the #1 reason we won this game. How about Walter getting WIDE OPEN at the end of the game for like a 40 yards catch, put us in the red zone?

It's funny when the Dolphins drop interceptions and people ignore it as a bad throw/decision.

Mike Kerns
10-12-2008, 05:56 PM
Just got back from the game and honestly I really didnt expect to see this thread when the guy threw for almost 400 yards today. But, to each their own I figure.

Mike Kerns
10-12-2008, 05:58 PM
ESPN throws a jab at Houston fans by writing how fans were shouting "We want Sage" and then the same ones cheering for Schaub as he ran in.

Rightly so. Just like those idiots screaming "We Want Steve" at the Rockets games last year.

hradhak
10-12-2008, 05:59 PM
I'd like to point out that Schaub had 2 INTs but still won the game
Rosenfels had 3 TOs but lost the game (and singlehandedly lost it at that)
Schaub gave up 2 turnovers but one was covered up by our defense
Rosefels gave up a game with his turnovers late in the game to a team that you need to play perfectly against.
I agree Schaub made a lot of mistakes that could have turned the game the other way. But in the end Schaub's play won us the game.

ReliantTexan
10-12-2008, 06:08 PM
Not everybody is calling for Sage, just criticizing Schaub's play.

Tell me, had the Dolphins defender caught the third down pass to AJ at the end of the game, as he should have (it hit him in the chest), would you be talking about how Schaub "made plays to win"?

If anything OUR RECEIVERS won this game for us. ****, AJ saved the drive on 4th and 10 when he snagged an almost impossible catch that Schaub forced. Don't really blame Schaub on THAT throw because it's 4th and 10.

The receivers were getting open ALL game. Making nice catches. I think they were the #1 reason we won this game. How about Walter getting WIDE OPEN at the end of the game for like a 40 yards catch, put us in the red zone?

It's funny when the Dolphins drop interceptions and people ignore it as a bad throw/decision.And how many of those near int's were tipped balls or because Schaub was hit as he threw? And yes Walter ran great routes today, But Schaub mad some good throws to get him the ball. And there were some great throws to Daniels to. That was an amazing grab by Andre, Schaub had to gamble there,and your superstar has to make a play,which he did.

I'm just giving Schaub props for grinding it out and rebounding from the 2 picks.

TexansSeminole
10-12-2008, 06:13 PM
And how many of those near int's were tipped balls or because Schaub was hit as he threw? And yes Walter ran great routes today, But Schaub mad some good throws to get him the ball. And there were some great throws to Daniels to. That was an amazing grab by Andre, Schaub had to gamble there,and your superstar has to make a play,which he did.

I'm just giving Schaub props for grinding it out and rebounding from the 2 picks.

1. 1 was a tipped ball.

Schaub has his moments. He isn't a terrible QB, he is just inconsistent. It's either inconsistency throughout the game or from game to game. He needs to fix that if he wants to remain a starter for years to come.

You still didn't answer my question:

Had the Dolphins defender caught the third down pass to AJ at the end of the game, as he should have (it hit him in the chest), would you be talking about how Schaub "made plays to win"? Or maybe I should say would you be talking about how Schaub made plays at the end of the game.

WWJD
10-12-2008, 06:15 PM
I agree with you..he is very inconsistent.

To his credit he won the game.

buddyboy
10-12-2008, 06:20 PM
1. 1 was a tipped ball.

Schaub has his moments. He isn't a terrible QB, he is just inconsistent. It's either inconsistency throughout the game or from game to game. He needs to fix that if he wants to remain a starter for years to come.

You still didn't answer my question:

Had the Dolphins defender caught the third down pass to AJ at the end of the game, as he should have (it hit him in the chest), would you be talking about how Schaub "made plays to win"? Or maybe I should say would you be talking about how Schaub made plays at the end of the game.

I hate all these ifs. He made mistakes, no doubt, but the end result was that we pulled out a win. There are hundreds of ifs that we could be making right now. What if Spencer was still around, maybe the pressure from Brown's growing pains wouldn't have affected Schaub so much. What if Eugene Wilson hadn't fumbled? What if AJ hadn't fumbled? What if Jacoby hadn't run in the TD return? What if we had picked Reggie Bush?

Also, is anyone else getting annoyed by ATX coming in with one liners like "Schaub sucks." constantly?

TexansSeminole
10-12-2008, 06:24 PM
I hate all these ifs. He made mistakes, no doubt, but the end result was that we pulled out a win. There are hundreds of ifs that we could be making right now. What if Spencer was still around, maybe the pressure from Brown's growing pains wouldn't have affected Schaub so much. What if Eugene Wilson hadn't fumbled? What if AJ hadn't fumbled? What if Jacoby hadn't run in the TD return? What if we had picked Reggie Bush?

Also, is anyone else getting annoyed by ATX coming in with one liners like "Schaub sucks." constantly?

It's a point to show you that had the Dolphins capitilized on that throw, people would be singing a different tune around here. The defender's ability to catch a ball is something that Schaub has no control over.

Regarding the bolded part, my point is that if the Dolphins defender catches the pass that hits him in the chest, it's not a win. Schaub has no control over that. He, and we, are lucky that it wasn't picked.

What do you people expect after a game like this. Everyone to type YESSSSSSS, YAYYYY, WOOOOHOOO, for hours?

I already had my WOOOOOOO post, I am already to the point where I am analyzing the play of the team. Maybe I am just moving too fast here.

ReliantTexan
10-12-2008, 06:32 PM
Had the Dolphins defender caught the third down pass to AJ at the end of the game, as he should have (it hit him in the chest), would you be talking about how Schaub "made plays to win"? Or maybe I should say would you be talking about how Schaub made plays at the end of the game.To answer your question no I wouldn't, but it wasn't, so I'm not going to criticize him for int's that didn't happen. There are several passes in every game that a QB gets away with.

Buffi2
10-12-2008, 06:36 PM
Maybe I am just moving too fast here.

Highly possible since some of us are just now getting home and meeting with negativity and that is just surprising....I don't know why, it just is.

I think the jury is still out on Schaub. I'll grant you that, at this red hot moment, he sure ain't the best QB in the NFL - or even #4. But, as a starter, he hasn't even played one whole season yet - unless this was his 16th start- given the fact that he was hurt so much last year.

I heard that Eli Manning said that it took him almost 3 years to learn the most important QB lesson - when not to pass. Schaub will be a much better QB if and when he learns this lesson.

One thing I will say - he is calm under pressure and he doesn't let a few interceptions slow him down - he doesn't give up. OK, that's two.

I, for one, am going to be happy we managed to win this game when I didn't think we could pull it out and hope we got enough confidence to not fall apart next week. We have a few winnable games ahead of us.

TexansSeminole
10-12-2008, 06:39 PM
To answer your question no I wouldn't, but it wasn't, so I'm not going to criticize him for int's that didn't happen. There are several passes in every game that a QB gets away with.

I understand that but do you understand my point? We can't always count on the defender to drop those, much less the ones they dropped before that.

I'll give Schaub his props, as I should, I just expected a little more realistic analysis rather than:

WE WON, so, STFU.

ReliantTexan
10-12-2008, 06:45 PM
I understand that but do you understand my point? We can't always count on the defender to drop those, much less the ones they dropped before that.

I'll give Schaub his props, as I should, I just expected a little more realistic analysis rather than:

WE WON, so, STFU.Yeah, I understand. It's just that when an offense is asked to go the length of the field and score a TD in that amount of time, it's tough. You don't see it happen too often, especially not from the Texans.

GlassHalfFull
10-12-2008, 07:13 PM
it's funny how we have to take away those last 4 minutes, but the last 4 minutes are the most important minutes of a game. That's when you make plays to win a game or lose a game. I'll take a qb who starts off bad but then comes back and makes plays to win rather than a qb who plays great for 4 and a half qrts. And single handedly blows a 17 point lead in the last 5 minutes.

qft

The Pencil Neck
10-12-2008, 09:27 PM
I understand that but do you understand my point? We can't always count on the defender to drop those, much less the ones they dropped before that.


There are always a ton of "if's" in a game.

IF Eugene Wilson hadn't fumbled, we could have run the clock out and won the game then.

If AJ hadn't fumbled, we probably would have scored and iced the game.

If Mario had made that tackle, we would have lost.

In lots of games, you can look at a QB (even good ones) and pick out a bunch of questionable decisions during a game that the defense didn't capitalize on. Schaub made some great throws, he made some questionable throws, he made some bad decisions, he had some good throws that could have been picked off.

I understand that you're saying that this game could have easily gone against us and if a few of these other passes had been picked off, it would have. But I think that's an unfair and unrealistic criticism. That's like criticising Favre or Manning when they throw into tight coverage because they believe they can make the throw AND that their receivers will step up and make a play for them. I want him to take some of those risks because it allows AJ and KW to show just how amazing they are.

eriadoc
10-12-2008, 10:08 PM
There are always a ton of "if's" in a game.

IF Eugene Wilson hadn't fumbled, we could have run the clock out and won the game then.

If AJ hadn't fumbled, we probably would have scored and iced the game.

If Mario had made that tackle, we would have lost.

In lots of games, you can look at a QB (even good ones) and pick out a bunch of questionable decisions during a game that the defense didn't capitalize on. Schaub made some great throws, he made some questionable throws, he made some bad decisions, he had some good throws that could have been picked off.

I understand that you're saying that this game could have easily gone against us and if a few of these other passes had been picked off, it would have. But I think that's an unfair and unrealistic criticism. That's like criticising Favre or Manning when they throw into tight coverage because they believe they can make the throw AND that their receivers will step up and make a play for them. I want him to take some of those risks because it allows AJ and KW to show just how amazing they are.

It's unfair and unrealistic to look at those plays within the scope of a single game. Taken as a whole, however, you can definitely notice trends. Schaub has developed a pattern of making several bad throws a game, dating back to his first game as a Texan. Sometimes it comes back to bite him and sometimes it doesn't. If you want to compare his situation to Favre, or to an early Elway, then Schaub has to make more positive plays than negative plays, and he has to more directly affect the wins of the team than he affects the losses of the team.

Schaub is only a dozen or so games into his starting career. My own personal barometer for gauging his value to this team is about 32 starts. Hence, I am about 12/32 of the way toward forming my final opinion. So far, I can say that the gauge is on the negative side, but not hopelessly so.

TexansSeminole
10-12-2008, 10:22 PM
I understand that you're saying that this game could have easily gone against us and if a few of these other passes had been picked off, it would have. But I think that's an unfair and unrealistic criticism. That's like criticising Favre or Manning when they throw into tight coverage because they believe they can make the throw AND that their receivers will step up and make a play for them. I want him to take some of those risks because it allows AJ and KW to show just how amazing they are.

The difference is that Manning and Favre are proven, consistent winners. Schaub hasn't proven to be consistent yet. He hasn't strung 3 games together where he has played well. You know Favre and Manning will come back from it. Schaub I don't. I get worried.

Main point I was making in this thread is that some people are so happy about how Matt played but had the defenders caught the balls he threw to them, people would be singing a different tune.

I look at things a bit different than the lot here it seems. I see those throws as bad decisions, picked or not picked. Just as bad as a pick when it comes to grading his decision making. May not effect the game, but it's a negative on the grade sheet.

I'm just trying to figure out if Schaub can be a consistent QB and this game didn't prove it to me. I saw alot of inconsistency and alot of bad decisions that don't show up on the stat sheet. I also saw alot of nice plays, and good throws.

It'd be one thing if Schaub sucked, it'd be an easy decision. But he doesn't. He is just inconsistent, and that can be just as bad as being a bad QB. It's hard to grade him because of this, and I think that's why you have so many different opinions of him.

Texecutioner
10-12-2008, 10:44 PM
Seminole is right and hilarious how so many of you can jump on and off the band wagon of a guy that was a career back up that has been inconsistent since he got here.

He made several bad decisions and continued to throw into double coverage throughout the game today. He made a few nice throws and all, but he is still the same Shaub and how you guys forget that the Texans were a few quick seconds from being 0-5.

The WR's are the ones that put the game on their back in the end. ANDRE JOHNSON took this team down the field at the end of the game with that amazing catch that he shouldn't have gotten.

Shaub is not the QB that will take this team any where and there isn't any evidence to support that he is at this point. The Texans are 1-4 and still have a lot of improving to do.

mussop
10-12-2008, 10:51 PM
I understand that but do you understand my point? We can't always count on the defender to drop those, much less the ones they dropped before that.

I'll give Schaub his props, as I should, I just expected a little more realistic analysis rather than:

WE WON, so, STFU.

Dont worry some of us get it! I have been trying to get the same point across all day but people are blinded by the win. Everyones fav thing to say is "youre just a Sage guy","Schaub grinded out a victory you should be happy". Rolleyes!

utahmark
10-12-2008, 11:50 PM
anyone notice johnson had his helment off after schaub's td. isnt that a 15 yarder? not that it would of mattered, well knowing our team it might have mattered.

HJam72
10-13-2008, 12:26 AM
anyone notice johnson had his helment off after schaub's td. isnt that a 15 yarder? not that it would of mattered, well knowing our team it might have mattered.

Shshshshsshshshshshshsh?! :texflag:

HJam72
10-13-2008, 12:28 AM
I think Schaub needs to have AT LEAST as many TD passes as ints. Otherwise, it will be real easy to see the problem, because his QB rating will suck donkeys.

He's not even even so far this year, IIRC. That's not good.

The Pencil Neck
10-13-2008, 12:59 PM
The difference is that Manning and Favre are proven, consistent winners. Schaub hasn't proven to be consistent yet. He hasn't strung 3 games together where he has played well. You know Favre and Manning will come back from it. Schaub I don't. I get worried.


But my point is that you need to compare Schaub at this stage of his career to Favre and Elway and guys like that at the same stage in their careers and not at the end of their careers after they became known as consistent winners. And then you have to realize that you're comparing Schaub to HOF players.

Favre was always considered inconsistent and erratic during the first few years of his career. And much more inconsistent than Schaub has been.

Schaub is still relatively inexperienced. Maybe he'll develop into a great QB and maybe he won't but it's way too early to judge. Sometimes you've got to give the QB time to work through these things and I think this is one of those times. We've all seen that when Schaub is on, he can be seriously good. He makes deep completions and he throws for a high completion percentage without throwing only -2 to 2 yard passes.

But, at least a part of my point, is that it seems to me that you're holding him to a higher level of consistency than is reasonable. No QB is going to make only good decisions and make only good throws. A good QB has to take risks and some of those risks are going to look like bad or questionable decisions and ultimately you have to judge them on whether it actually worked out or not. If you have a QB that only plays it safe, then you've got a guy that doesn't have the cojones to really be a good QB.

GP
10-13-2008, 01:08 PM
anyone notice johnson had his helment off after schaub's td. isnt that a 15 yarder? not that it would of mattered, well knowing our team it might have mattered.

Looked like the helmet was rolling around on the field between the back end zone line and the stands...so, I think there's a good chance that AJ was technically off the field of play when he did it.

I noticed the same thing: A helmet bouncing onto the ground, but no person near it for me to i.d. whose helmet it was. The refs are always on top of those things, so I figured the person took it off after stepping outside of the playing field's lines.

Because there's no distinction between sidelines and the area between the back line of the end zone & the end zone stands, right? They're both technically OFF the field of play.

otisbean
10-13-2008, 02:21 PM
The difference is that Manning and Favre are proven, consistent winners. Schaub hasn't proven to be consistent yet. He hasn't strung 3 games together where he has played well. You know Favre and Manning will come back from it. Schaub I don't. I get worried.

Main point I was making in this thread is that some people are so happy about how Matt played but had the defenders caught the balls he threw to them, people would be singing a different tune.

I look at things a bit different than the lot here it seems. I see those throws as bad decisions, picked or not picked. Just as bad as a pick when it comes to grading his decision making. May not effect the game, but it's a negative on the grade sheet.

I'm just trying to figure out if Schaub can be a consistent QB and this game didn't prove it to me. I saw alot of inconsistency and alot of bad decisions that don't show up on the stat sheet. I also saw alot of nice plays, and good throws.

It'd be one thing if Schaub sucked, it'd be an easy decision. But he doesn't. He is just inconsistent, and that can be just as bad as being a bad QB. It's hard to grade him because of this, and I think that's why you have so many different opinions of him.

So if a QB gets hit when throwing and the ball is picked is that his fault (which happened in this game)? All QBs will try to force some balls into tight coverage, especially when throwing at their playmakers. That last catch AJ had is a perfect example. AJ was covered but Schaub gave him a chance to make a play.

Schaub will end up being a better then average QB when all is said and done. HE will always be a guy that needs help around him, and there is nothing wrong with that. Let's not forget that he has faced very tough defenses in each game as well, and the OL has struggled providing protection at times. That can certainly effect decision making ability, even in top level QBs. He is not in the same league as Manning, BRady, Farve, McNabb ect.. but neither are most of the other QBs in the league, those guys are hard to find. To me Schaub can more of a game manager type of QB. Give him a strong running game and he can be effective. Will he take us to the SB I don't know, but neither does anyone else. Even the star Qbs tend to struggle early in the careers.

The Pencil Neck
10-13-2008, 04:54 PM
So if a QB gets hit when throwing and the ball is picked is that his fault (which happened in this game)? All QBs will try to force some balls into tight coverage, especially when throwing at their playmakers. That last catch AJ had is a perfect example. AJ was covered but Schaub gave him a chance to make a play.

Schaub will end up being a better then average QB when all is said and done. HE will always be a guy that needs help around him, and there is nothing wrong with that. Let's not forget that he has faced very tough defenses in each game as well, and the OL has struggled providing protection at times. That can certainly effect decision making ability, even in top level QBs. He is not in the same league as Manning, BRady, Farve, McNabb ect.. but neither are most of the other QBs in the league, those guys are hard to find. To me Schaub can more of a game manager type of QB. Give him a strong running game and he can be effective. Will he take us to the SB I don't know, but neither does anyone else. Even the star Qbs tend to struggle early in the careers.

I agree with this.

But I'm going to expand on one point. Schaub as "game manager." Most "game manager" types of QB's really don't do all that well with the deep ball. One thing I really like about Schaub is his ability to get the ball down the field. I think he's eventually going to be one step back from the Manning/Brady/Favre level: not as steady as Brady, not as smart as Manning, not as gutsy and resilient as Favre. And I think that's good enough to get us into the playoffs and win a SB at some point.

I don't look at this guy and see a backup QB. And I think some people on this board DO look at him and just see a backup QB and I think that's way too harsh of a judgment.