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Htownsportsfan
10-05-2008, 11:04 PM
I have watchined the game twice since I got home and the people blaming Kubiak are off base! Sage screwed the damn pooch! I have watched the whole game again and the last 5 minutes about a dozen (call it shock therapy)O.

Colts scored with 4:04 left putting us up by 10, the onside attempt failed and we got the ball on the 38.

1st play Run Green 1 yard gain
2nd play run Green 1 yard gain
3rd play Sage rolls out with room to run fails to slide or run to the sideline at the 35 (FG range?) and instead goes flying Wallenda and you know the rest.


Colts kick off we get he ball at our 19 with 3:36 to go.

1st. play Slaton 2 yard run
2nd play Pick play with quick pass to Slatonin behind AJ, Sage puts the ball in the ground.
3rd play: Sage rolls out with room open field in front but trys to point and direct traffic and fails to protect the ball striped from behind by Mathis at the 17 Again you know the rest!

In both cases the line was stacked with Colts defends knowing we would run and the naked boot worked great except for the failure to protect the ball!

I wont usually blame a loss on one guy even if an int for a td or missed kick cost us a victory because usually others left points on the field or allowed points. But in this case Sage gave up esentially 14 points on his own by failing to protect the ball. On the last drive you can see the intensity on Sage's face trying to make amends for the first fumble.

What a waste of a great effort of the entire team and coaching staff today vs a team that has had our number!

Kaiser Toro
10-05-2008, 11:19 PM
Look no further than the first drive you quoted - Green, Green. No Slaton? Kubiak just getting cute again.

The second drive you quoted, the one after Rosencopter's feeble rushing attempt, is missing the shotgun formation on third down. Putting the ball in Rosenfels hands after the whole team was having an oh shit moment, like we all were, was idiotic. Kubiak does not know how to win and is to cute for is own good.

Leahmic223
10-05-2008, 11:24 PM
Look no further than the first drive you quoted - Green, Green. No Slaton? Kubiak just getting cute again.

The second drive you quoted, the one after Rosencopter's feeble rushing attempt, is missing the shotgun formation on third down. Putting the ball in Rosenfels hands after the whole team was having an oh shit moment, like we all were, was idiotic. Kubiak does not know how to win and is to cute for is own good.


Green did alright though, yeah he didn't do good those carries but at that point it's very hard to run the ball.

The next fumble he HAD to go for the win. A 3 point lead WAS NOT going to stand up against the Colts...it WAS NOT going to. So calling to pass for 8 yards was correct...but Sage just messed up again.

TEXANRED
10-05-2008, 11:25 PM
Look no further than the first drive you quoted - Green, Green. No Slaton? Kubiak just getting cute again.

The second drive you quoted, the one after Rosencopter's feeble rushing attempt, is missing the shotgun formation on third down. Putting the ball in Rosenfels hands after the whole team was having an oh shit moment, like we all were, was idiotic. Kubiak does not know how to win and is to cute for is own good.

Totally agree. For Kubiak to call a pass play in that situation shows his inability to finish a game.

Kaiser Toro
10-05-2008, 11:30 PM
Green did alright though, yeah he didn't do good those carries but at that point it's very hard to run the ball.

The next fumble he HAD to go for the win. A 3 point lead WAS NOT going to stand up against the Colts...it WAS NOT going to. So calling to pass for 8 yards was correct...but Sage just messed up again.

Green played well, but Slaton can break off a run at anytime. I know Sage is a professional, but once he went aerial and lost the ball - our best offense was run, run, run and leave it to our best unit on this day to close out the game - the defense.

LonerATO
10-05-2008, 11:30 PM
The thing that still bothers me is that when you have a good lead and little time is left in the game you run the ball "I mean hello you play to win the game." Sorry had to throw that in there

Htownsportsfan
10-05-2008, 11:32 PM
I would disagree, just like on the first drive of the game for the Texans we had to set up the run with short pasees. Up by three we had to get a first and get off our of 17, if we had to punt from our 17 they are damn near in AV's field goal range already. Slaton was good for a yard or two when they stacked the box like they did at the end of the game when they knew we were going to try and burn clock. Slatin did not get any running room until we strated passing in our second possession. If Sage had rollled out on that boot and protected the ball, or felt the presence of colt defense we get more rushing yards from him than all RB's combined on the last 8 plays!

Jackie Chiles
10-05-2008, 11:34 PM
Totally agree. For Kubiak to call a pass play in that situation shows his inability to finish a game.

No way, I will argue with anybody about this all day long. I was sitting at home watching the game praying for a PA exactly like that and everything went great until the fumble. I would not have had a problem with a third running play either to burn a TO but we get the same result or better with Sage rolling out and either making an easy first down completion or sliding.

texanmojo
10-05-2008, 11:35 PM
Sage single handedly caused the worst loss in Texans history...

...Bribg back Tony Banks...end this contriversy

Kaiser Toro
10-05-2008, 11:35 PM
I would disagree, just like on the first drive of the game for the Texans we had to set up the run with short pasees. Up by three we had to get a first and get off our of 17, if we had to punt from our 17 they are damn near in AV's field goal range already. Slaton was good for a yard or two when they stacked the box like they did at the end of the game when they knew we were going to try and burn clock. Slatin did not get any running room until we strated passing in our second possession. If Sage had rollled out on that boot and protected the ball, or felt the presence of colt defense we get more rushing yards from him than all RB's combined on the last 8 plays!

Sage was a liability after the first fumble. The defense was rock solid all day. Until we gave a 74 yard drive on what was pretty much a prevent defense we had held them to ~250 yards through 3.5 quarters.

Jackie Chiles
10-05-2008, 11:35 PM
Wait, are you talking about the second fumble or the first?

Leahmic223
10-05-2008, 11:38 PM
Green played well, but Slaton can break off a run at anytime. I know Sage is a professional, but once he went aerial and lost the ball - our best offense was run, run, run and leave it to our best unit on this day to close out the game - the defense.

I agree that Slaton should have had the ball 3 times and Kubiak got cute. But i'm sure Kube's never told Sage to dive for it as conservative as Kubes plays sometimes.

The second drive...we were up by 3 right? I don't care what defense you put on the field, you tell Peyton Manning he has a shot to take the lead and win the game...he'll win it 9/10. Once Sage fumbled the first it was over simply because our players were still in shock...and then post game quotes...one of the Colts players felt that once that fumbled happened...THEY KNEW they were going to win.

On the other hand i'm mad because the players are all saying how great of a game they played...despite losing. Yet the Colts are pissed at themselves despite winning. I think THIS is where Kubiak fails.

LonerATO
10-05-2008, 11:40 PM
Ah man ******* Tom Jackson talking about how Manning won he ********** game for the Colts because hes that good.

Scooter
10-05-2008, 11:40 PM
Look no further than the first drive you quoted - Green, Green. No Slaton? Kubiak just getting cute again.

The second drive you quoted, the one after Rosencopter's feeble rushing attempt, is missing the shotgun formation on third down. Putting the ball in Rosenfels hands after the whole team was having an oh shit moment, like we all were, was idiotic. Kubiak does not know how to win and is to cute for is own good.

just so that i'm understanding correctly ... with 4 minutes left in the game it's getting cute to use a veteran starter at runningback instead of a 4th game rookie? it seems like the smart move for a coaching staff with a lead is to keep the ball in the hands of your veterans. when the veteran runningback cant get past a 9 in the box defense, you move your veteran quarterback into space where he can make a smart decision.

what happens if slaton fumbles on one of those runs? "what moronic coach gives the ball to a rookie?!?!" fire him!

i understand being frustrated but these posts are just getting silly.

Kaiser Toro
10-05-2008, 11:43 PM
I agree that Slaton should have had the ball 3 times and Kubiak got cute. But i'm sure Kube's never told Sage to dive for it as conservative as Kubes plays sometimes.

The second drive...we were up by 3 right? I don't care what defense you put on the field, you tell Peyton Manning he has a shot to take the lead and win the game...he'll win it 9/10. Once Sage fumbled the first it was over simply because our players were still in shock...and then post game quotes...one of the Colts players felt that once that fumbled happened...THEY KNEW they were going to win.

On the other hand i'm mad because the players are all saying how great of a game they played...despite losing. Yet the Colts are pissed at themselves despite winning. I think THIS is where Kubiak fails.

We are not good enough to get cute, bad teams that play cute have this type of shit happen to them. I said it in the stands and I will say it now - I wanted the ball in Manning's hands more than I wanted it in Sage's after the first fumble. I am not surprised at the outcome, just sick to my stomach that our coach does not get his own team's strength and weaknesses. He has no feel for in-game play in my opinion.

Kaiser Toro
10-05-2008, 11:46 PM
just so that i'm understanding correctly ... with 4 minutes left in the game it's getting cute to use a veteran starter at runningback instead of a 4th game rookie? it seems like the smart move for a coaching staff with a lead is to keep the ball in the hands of your veterans. when the veteran runningback cant get past a 9 in the box defense, you move your veteran quarterback into space where he can make a smart decision.

what happens if slaton fumbles on one of those runs? "what moronic coach gives the ball to a rookie?!?!" fire him!

i understand being frustrated but these posts are just getting silly.

Yeah it was cute, when your best back this year is not in the backfield and we give it to a veteran who has struggled to be in the line up for the last two years. Sage is a veteran, how did that work out?

Scooter
10-05-2008, 11:51 PM
did the best back do anything on the next series? no, he got stuffed also. the outside slant was cute, i'll give you that one. the reason we lost is sage rosenfels. sage slides or throws it out of bounds (like he's supposed to) and we probably win. if sage throws it away when nothing's available the second time (like he's supposed to) we probably win.

sage got too cute. i'm amazed someone would place his singular blame on someone else.

Kaiser Toro
10-05-2008, 11:55 PM
did the best back do anything on the next series? no, he got stuffed also. the outside slant was cute, i'll give you that one. the reason we lost is sage rosenfels. sage slides or throws it out of bounds (like he's supposed to) and we probably win. if sage throws it away when nothing's available the second time (like he's supposed to) we probably win.

sage got too cute. i'm amazed someone would place his singular blame on someone else.

The coaches put players in position to make plays via having them on the field and the play that is called. All I know is that when Sage fumbled the first time I did not want him dropping back or running it on the next drive. Kubiak, thought otherwise. That is a problem. This is not all on Sage, he is like Mongo - just a pawn in the game of life.

IlliniJen
10-06-2008, 12:23 AM
Look no further than the first drive you quoted - Green, Green. No Slaton? Kubiak just getting cute again.

The second drive you quoted, the one after Rosencopter's feeble rushing attempt, is missing the shotgun formation on third down. Putting the ball in Rosenfels hands after the whole team was having an oh shit moment, like we all were, was idiotic. Kubiak does not know how to win and is to cute for is own good.

I was freakin' dumbfounded with Kubiak giving Green the ball. Your best RB should have been in the backfield, and that's not Green. Slaton had been running all over the Colts the whole damn day, and he should be the one to get the ball. He can pick up yardage. Green up the gut twice for one yard apiece? PLEASE.

Kubes is giving me a case of the horribles. Bill Cowher even leaves his house to go get the morning paper, I would be on him like white on rice if I were McNair. This football team needs a hard nosed coach who will put the "balls" back into football. I want a mean and nasty coach who spits on people when he yells and gets his guys to go out there and hurt people.

Kaiser Toro
10-06-2008, 12:28 AM
I was freakin' dumbfounded with Kubiak giving Green the ball. Your best RB should have been in the backfield, and that's not Green. Slaton had been running all over the Colts the whole damn day, and he should be the one to get the ball. He can pick up yardage. Green up the gut twice for one yard apiece? PLEASE.

Kubes is giving me a case of the horribles. Bill Cowher even leaves his house to go get the morning paper, I would be on him like white on rice if I were McNair. This football team needs a hard nosed coach who will put the "balls" back into football. I want a mean and nasty coach who spits on people when he yells and gets his guys to go out there and hurt people.

I haver not called for Kubiak to be fired, but I sure would like the identity and attitude that a Cowher regime would bring. We have never had attitude here.

IlliniJen
10-06-2008, 12:39 AM
I haver not called for Kubiak to be fired, but I sure would like the identity and attitude that a Cowher regime would bring. We have never had attitude here.

To me, that's the kicker. You can't say we're a hard-nosed football team, a finesse team or whatever. We're the football equivalent of nougat.

I'm not a fire Kubes bandwagoner either, but his decisions are questionable at times. There always seems to be a major breakdown per game to cost us. Whether it's the coaching staff asleep at the wheel or the defense not making a critical stop or Sage pooping the bed...there's always something spinning off the team at any given moment to make us falter.

I want a team with an identity that isn't one of losing. Today's loss was epic. GOOD TEAMS DO NOT EVER, EVER LOSE UP 3 SCORES WITH 5 MINUTES LEFT. Sad sack Texans. Oh well, they just can't get anything right. I'm sorry, maybe I'm morally wrong, but I'd rather have a team that has a "plays nasty" reputation and breaks some heads than be a nice guy team that snatches defeat from the jaws of victory.

Leahmic223
10-06-2008, 12:47 AM
I haver not called for Kubiak to be fired, but I sure would like the identity and attitude that a Cowher regime would bring. We have never had attitude here.

This is where I blame Kubes. The team has no personality. I do not doubt that Kubes can build a great offense if you give him the chance, not doubting that one bit...but i'm kind of like...Hire Cowher and move Kubes down to OC until he LEARNS HOW TO BE A HEAD COACH.

To me this is the only problem with him. He just doesn't seem to know how to be a head coach. Would Kubiak accept Mcnair saying "I'll give you back this team when Cowher is done with it." I would accept it.

I think Kubiak will eventually be a good Head Coach. He shows that a lot of times his team is in position to win games...but one reason or another they just don't.

I'm not really for firing Kubiak though if we're not bringing in a established guy like Bill Cowher or Marty.

Corrosion
10-06-2008, 12:52 AM
This is where I blame Kubes. The team has no personality. I do not doubt that Kubes can build a great offense if you give him the chance, not doubting that one bit...but i'm kind of like...Hire Cowher and move Kubes down to OC until he LEARNS HOW TO BE A HEAD COACH.

To me this is the only problem with him. He just doesn't seem to know how to be a head coach. Would Kubiak accept Mcnair saying "I'll give you back this team when Cowher is done with it." I would accept it.

I think Kubiak will eventually be a good Head Coach. He shows that a lot of times his team is in position to win games...but one reason or another they just don't.

I'm not really for firing Kubiak though if we're not bringing in a established guy like Bill Cowher or Marty.

I wouldnt mind Cowher .... Marty on the other hand , I'll pass.

Maybe we should all go watch the Bad News Bears .... might make us feel a little better. :grouphug:

Scooter
10-06-2008, 01:00 AM
cowher's a horrible example of identity, he didnt bring the steel curtain, he inherited it during a slump. kubiak's "identity" is scoring points. we're averaging 20.8 right now despite having already played 3 of the top 10 defenses in points allowed. what you're looking for is a defensive coordinator. kubiak is offense, he's a former quarterback, quarterback's coach, and offensive coordinator - we knew this going in. we dont have a talented offensive line to run all day with and build a perfect ZBS. our best back is a rookie in his 4th game. what we do is play effective offense and put points on the board.

the team identity yall are looking for is done on defense and with 10+ years of drafting offensive linemen.

Shaft75
10-06-2008, 01:32 AM
Let's bring in Ditka like the Saints did... His attitude transferred well there. Or maybe Jimmy Johnson like the Dolphins...

Give it a break about firing Kubiak right now. This team needs consistancy on defense. They need to find their own identity. Whether they play clean or dirty doesn't mean anything. They started the season with a winning attitude, and now are doubting themselves. Kubes is still learning, but has overhauled our offense. BIG TIME. We have had our ass handed to us ONCE this year, by Pittsburgh.

We need a bright mind on the defensive side of the ball, period.

OR......... We need to plan on scoring more than 35 a game. It seems like that is what we are allowing this year.

El Tejano
10-06-2008, 09:21 AM
I know Sage had 3 bad plays but so did the defense. I'm talking about all 3 4th downs where we didn't stop the Colts. When they kept going for it on 4th down, I was thinking how the Colts had no respect for our D. Then on the 3rd 4th down attempt with 4th and 7, we had a chance to stop them and end this game once and for all. No stop and we give them a TD.

It's not just Sage but the D also. I'm saying that though because the D played real well too. It's just Sage and the D made 3 bad plays.

HoustonFrog
10-06-2008, 09:25 AM
I know Sage had 3 bad plays but so did the defense. I'm talking about all 3 4th downs where we didn't stop the Colts. When they kept going for it on 4th down, I was thinking how the Colts had no respect for our D. Then on the 3rd 4th down attempt with 4th and 7, we had a chance to stop them and end this game once and for all. No stop and we give them a TD.

It's not just Sage but the D also. I'm saying that though because the D played real well too. It's just Sage and the D made 3 bad plays.

No, its all Sage. They gave up one drive. If Sage slides and we punt, then we would see if the defense can hold a 10 pt lead and make them march it down. But we gave them scores.

Errant Hothy
10-06-2008, 09:37 AM
No, its all Sage. They gave up one drive. If Sage slides and we punt, then we would see if the defense can hold a 10 pt lead and make them march it down. But we gave them scores.

If Sage would have slide it would have been about a 49 yard FG attempt. Is there any doubt that Brown would have drilled it from range?

HoustonFrog
10-06-2008, 09:46 AM
If Sage would have slide it would have been about a 49 yard FG attempt. Is there any doubt that Brown would have drilled it from range?

Sorry forgot to give us that 3. But you are right and we then kickoff and see if they can drive. Either way the defense had done their job up until then. Giving the Colts a short field isn't the Ds fault.

Kaiser Toro
10-06-2008, 09:47 AM
For the Sage folk who are lumping it on him. How about that time out late in the first half where he called it with 19 seconds left on the play clock. Thankfully when Manning got the ball back he threw an interception.

Sage is a great back up for this team and unfortunately for him he will remain as such due to this meltdown. I would imagine Smith's phone will be ringing today by the value vultures.

GP
10-06-2008, 09:49 AM
I was freakin' dumbfounded with Kubiak giving Green the ball. Your best RB should have been in the backfield, and that's not Green. Slaton had been running all over the Colts the whole damn day, and he should be the one to get the ball. He can pick up yardage. Green up the gut twice for one yard apiece? PLEASE.

Kubes is giving me a case of the horribles. Bill Cowher even leaves his house to go get the morning paper, I would be on him like white on rice if I were McNair. This football team needs a hard nosed coach who will put the "balls" back into football. I want a mean and nasty coach who spits on people when he yells and gets his guys to go out there and hurt people.

Now THAT'S the best post this whole season.

Sending you rep, IlliniJen.

YOU NAILED IT.

"I want a mean and nasty coach who spits on people when he yells and gets his guys to go out there and hurt people." -- IlliniJen

Kaiser Toro
10-06-2008, 09:57 AM
cowher's a horrible example of identity, he didnt bring the steel curtain, he inherited it during a slump. kubiak's "identity" is scoring points. we're averaging 20.8 right now despite having already played 3 of the top 10 defenses in points allowed. what you're looking for is a defensive coordinator. kubiak is offense, he's a former quarterback, quarterback's coach, and offensive coordinator - we knew this going in. we dont have a talented offensive line to run all day with and build a perfect ZBS. our best back is a rookie in his 4th game. what we do is play effective offense and put points on the board.

the team identity yall are looking for is done on defense and with 10+ years of drafting offensive linemen.

Steel Curtain? I never mentioned it. Cowher was the identity of that team and Kubiak is ours - we are cute, fluffy, nice and dog-gone giving our best effort. That is fine in college football, but show me some passion, show the team some passion. If we were ever going to see it, surely we would see it now.

I understand identity is an intangible thing that cannot be quantified and there is no right or wrong answer, but right now our players need something to gravitate to in order to break out of this funk of losing and I am not sure where that is on the team to a man or to a coach.

I really liked Kubiak before we hired him, I still think he has he ability to take this team to where we want to go. However, I am not sure he has the moxie to hold this team together and I fully expect them to quit on him should we lose to the Dolphins.

Polo
10-06-2008, 10:03 AM
I really doubt the team will quit on Kubes...


Too many young guys for that to happen...

Some of the vets might quit though...won't be because of Kubiak...

HoustonFrog
10-06-2008, 10:04 AM
Steel Curtain? I never mentioned it. Cowher was the identity of that team and Kubiak is ours - we are cute, fluffy, nice and dog-gone giving our best effort. That is fine in college football, but show me some passion, show the team some passion. If we were ever going to see it, surely we would see it now.

I understand identity is an intangible thing that cannot be quantified and there is no right or wrong answer, but right now our players need something to gravitate to in order to break out of this funk of losing and I am not sure where that is on the team to a man or to a coach.

I really liked Kubiak before we hired him, I still think he has he ability to take this team to where we want to go. However, I am not sure he has the moxie to hold this team together and I fully expect them to quit on him should we lose to the Dolphins.

Right. That is what I hate. I can't even listen to the Kubes show anymore because listening about "kids working so hard" just doesn't get it done for me. It's going to seal it for him at one point....just like Wade will be out in Dallas for me when they flame again. I'll be double screwed.

Kaiser Toro
10-06-2008, 10:07 AM
I really doubt the team will quit on Kubes...


Too many young guys for that to happen...

Some of the vets might quit though...won't be because of Kubiak...

Trust me, if they lose to the Dolphins in a new way that we have not seen yet, then this year's dossier can easily be presented in a nice 2-3 minute segment that will begin to beat the drum internally. Kubiak has left a lot of opportunity out on the field in year 3.

I never expected any of this from a Kubiak coached team, but enough is enough.

Hooston Texan
10-06-2008, 10:32 AM
If Sage would have slide it would have been about a 49 yard FG attempt. Is there any doubt that Brown would have drilled it from range?

Yes, but with three minutes left and up 10, a FG is not really the "nail in the coffin" commensurate with the risk (of giving the Colts the ball on our 39). Had Sage not decided to take the game into his own hands, the right play would have been to punt. The Colts would have had the ball deep in their own end with 3:30 and no timeouts (or 2:50 and 1 timeout) down 10.

FWIW, I liked the bootleg call. I've seen teams do it quite a bit in that situation: the defense is selling everyone out to crash the LOS, so it often goes for a big play. Plus, there is no handoff, so one less thing to go wrong (the Pisarcek factor). You expect your QB to know the situation and know what he can and cannot do. Unfortunately, our QB on that play was Sage, and he was intent on proving something besides making the smart play.

It turned into a classic "his ego is writing checks his body just can't cash" moment.

Polo
10-06-2008, 10:36 AM
Trust me, if they lose to the Dolphins in a new way that we have not seen yet, then this year's dossier can easily be presented in a nice 2-3 minute segment that will begin to beat the drum internally. Kubiak has left a lot of opportunity out on the field in year 3.

I never expected any of this from a Kubiak coached team, but enough is enough.


I definitely agree with what you're saying....

However, I don't see a bunch of guys who lack heart..Lot's of softies on the team, but the heart is there....

If we played every single game like we played against the Colts with the same exact results, I still don't see a team that will quit on Kubes...

Guys know we're close...

Guys are starting to realize that the coaches have given them the formula...It's up to the players to go out there and make plays...I really see no problem at all with how the team was coached yesterday....We only had one penalty....No turnovers till the end when Sage decided to clock out...Yeah we could use more nastiness but I put that on the players....Coaches can only coach...

Honestly, in the long run I think all of this is going to make us a better more prepared team...Guys now have this game in the back of their mind and if this past game doesn't inspire them to play a full four quaters of football, nothing will...

BigBull17
10-06-2008, 12:28 PM
If Sage would have slide it would have been about a 49 yard FG attempt. Is there any doubt that Brown would have drilled it from range?

Or, since your run game has done well all game, maybe you go for it. That would have ended the game in a positive manner.

Hardcore Texan
10-06-2008, 12:46 PM
Bottom line is Sage is supposed to protect the ball better. It says so right on the back of his practice shorts, that's the montra for the offense isn't it? Maybe he should have to wear his old nasty, sweaty practice shorts backwards on his head all week so it doesn't leave his mind.

The worst part of all of this is how we are going to have to hear for weeks and months to come about the "colts amazing comeback".....that's just salt in the wound right there.

Double Barrel
10-06-2008, 01:17 PM
I want a team with an identity that isn't one of losing. Today's loss was epic. GOOD TEAMS DO NOT EVER, EVER LOSE UP 3 SCORES WITH 5 MINUTES LEFT. Sad sack Texans. Oh well, they just can't get anything right. I'm sorry, maybe I'm morally wrong, but I'd rather have a team that has a "plays nasty" reputation and breaks some heads than be a nice guy team that snatches defeat from the jaws of victory.

Exactly. Good teams refuse to lose, especially games that you have your boot on the neck of the opponent. People call Fisherball boring, but the fact is that he has one of the best winning percentages when his team takes a lead in the fourth quarter. There is a reason for this mentality, and it's knowing how to seal the deal as a head coach. Kubiak does not possess that mentality at this point in his career. Hopefully it is something that he can pick up on SOON, because it means the difference in winning and losing in the NFL.

Hardcore Texan
10-06-2008, 01:32 PM
If Sage would have slide it would have been about a 49 yard FG attempt. Is there any doubt that Brown would have drilled it from range?

Yes, but with three minutes left and up 10, a FG is not really the "nail in the coffin" commensurate with the risk (of giving the Colts the ball on our 39). Had Sage not decided to take the game into his own hands, the right play would have been to punt. The Colts would have had the ball deep in their own end with 3:30 and no timeouts (or 2:50 and 1 timeout) down 10.

FWIW, I liked the bootleg call. I've seen teams do it quite a bit in that situation: the defense is selling everyone out to crash the LOS, so it often goes for a big play. Plus, there is no handoff, so one less thing to go wrong (the Pisarcek factor). You expect your QB to know the situation and know what he can and cannot do. Unfortunately, our QB on that play was Sage, and he was intent on proving something besides making the smart play.

It turned into a classic "his ego is writing checks his body just can't cash" moment.

If Sage slides or doesn't lose the ball the play comes back. There was flag on the play agaisnt the Texans and the colts declined it for obvious reasons. We then would have been in the third and long replaying the down and out of FG range.

Just guessing, but probably would have ran something safe, like another telegraphed run and ended up just a bit too long to try a 54+ yarder when punting and trying to pin them deep would have made a lot of sense. They would have ate up too much time getting down the field.

dalemurphy
10-06-2008, 01:46 PM
Look no further than the first drive you quoted - Green, Green. No Slaton? Kubiak just getting cute again.

The second drive you quoted, the one after Rosencopter's feeble rushing attempt, is missing the shotgun formation on third down. Putting the ball in Rosenfels hands after the whole team was having an oh shit moment, like we all were, was idiotic. Kubiak does not know how to win and is to cute for is own good.

Kaiser, I saw you at the game. I'm sure you're as sick as I am about it.

However, this is not on Kubiak. Up 10, he made exactly the right calls, forcing the Colts to burn all three timeouts and likely getting the first down on a low risk bootleg... I've been hard on Kubes game management but he can't coach away mistakes and bad bounces. If he tried, everyone would be screaming about him being too conservative. Unless you think he should've been kneeling there, the blame goes to Sage!

Regarding AGreen being in the game, he did his job. He held on to the ball and stayed in bounds. Only Sage didn't do his job at the end.

We are a pretty good team right now but also losers... It's a hard pill to swallow. However, I think hope remains for this season. If the team doesn't quit it can go on a serious winning streak. I'm still kind of believing.

Regardless, this is clearly the best team we've had. Other than our backup QB making a serious of blunders, the team played near flawless football and outmatched the Colts.

gwallaia
10-06-2008, 02:26 PM
Wikpedia has been updated for Sage the Stupid.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sage_Rosenfels

Scooter
10-06-2008, 02:34 PM
i'm curious what yall think of jon gruden as a coach? he's wild, will get in someone's face, 3 playoff appearances since 02, superbowl champion. heck in 02-03 he won the trophy against the team he'd coached the previous year ... he would've put the colts away for sure. winning mentality, identity, buzz words for teams with a lot of talent and experience. and he was up 21 against the colts with 4 minutes left, on monday night, at home, with arguably the league's best defense. the common factor in both games? peyton manning. he didnt even need sage out there giving the ball away to do it. peyton scores, tampa runs 3 times down to 2 minutes and punts (how many "FIRE GRUDEN! - you have to go for the first down!" threads got started you think?), peyton scores, on-side kick and peyton scores (hell peyton even left 35 seconds on the clock).

this is why you call your consistant plays to move the ball and keep peyton off the field. you dont run 3 for no gain and punt. you try to win the game ... or i hear dom capers might be available for a head coaching job, he'd start running the clock out at halftime - safety first kids. "it's the coach's job to put his team in the best position to win" ... wouldnt that best chance be keep posession, control the ball, and finish the game? or did we fly in the ravens to play defense for us and i missed it? you know, because we have one of the worst pass defenses in the league and all.

by the way, ahman had been averaging 4.5ypc before those last two attempts so he was the right choice and probably should've been the guy on the final drive. outside of slaton's big run, he'd averaged 3.6ypc and hadnt been as consistant.

BigBull17
10-06-2008, 03:58 PM
Kaiser, I saw you at the game. I'm sure you're as sick as I am about it.

However, this is not on Kubiak. Up 10, he made exactly the right calls, forcing the Colts to burn all three timeouts and likely getting the first down on a low risk bootleg... I've been hard on Kubes game management but he can't coach away mistakes and bad bounces. If he tried, everyone would be screaming about him being too conservative. Unless you think he should've been kneeling there, the blame goes to Sage!

Regarding AGreen being in the game, he did his job. He held on to the ball and stayed in bounds. Only Sage didn't do his job at the end.

We are a pretty good team right now but also losers... It's a hard pill to swallow. However, I think hope remains for this season. If the team doesn't quit it can go on a serious winning streak. I'm still kind of believing.

Regardless, this is clearly the best team we've had. Other than our backup QB making a serious of blunders, the team played near flawless football and outmatched the Colts.


And Green was averaging like 5 yards a carry. Whats wrong with the vet in at the end? Its Sage, plain and simple.

texanhead08
10-06-2008, 04:04 PM
Cowher sounds good and all but I dont see him taking this job no matter how much money we offer him. He is not going to coach unless he has a team ready to win and I don't mean contend for a playoff birth, I mean contend for the Super Bowl. I think we are 2yrs away from that and thats if Schaub continues to get better etc. Kube's better turn it around fast if thats going to happen. I want him to be the guy to lead us but frustration is kicking in all around and its looking like he might lose his job in the next 18mos if he doesnt.