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View Full Version : Just Re-watched Steeler game on DVR, WOW!


dalemurphy
09-10-2008, 11:23 AM
Well, I watched the first half with my eyes on the two lines. Here are some surprising observations:

1. Okoye actually won his individual battle most of the time and certainly wasn't manhandled.

2. The DL has a whole was pretty good in the 1st half. Though, I agree with LZ that TJ can't hold his grown in the 3 technique.

3. Winston was awesome!, particularly sealing and getting to the second level in the run game. It's clear to see that once the blocking tightens up a little more and the backs make their reads a little quicker there will be some big plays in the run game.

4. Brown played excellent in the first half.

5. Pitts was very agressive on the back side and did a good job on the second level as well.

6. Leach struggled in the run game and missing the blitzer on the second drive cost the Texans the game, because.....

7. I can't overemphasize the reality of this enough: Schuab received a concussion on that first sack late in the first quarter. Up until that point he was sharp, poised, and accurate. While the hit didn't look violent, he was clearly shaken up. Then, he literally doesn't make another good pass or decision the entire half. After halftime, he comes out and looks pretty much like himself again (after he's cleared up some in the head) but the team and circumstances around him had deteriorated beyond repair. HUGE MISTAKE BY THE TEXAN'S STAFF TO LEAVE HIM IN THERE AND RISK HIS HEALTH AND COST THE TEAM A CHANCE TO WIN!!!


Rewatch the game if you can. It's very illuminating!

Malloy
09-10-2008, 11:28 AM
Thanks for re-watching the game though i must admit I'm not terribly excited about doing it myself. Anywho, you sold me, I'll see if I can get the time later today or tomorrow... preferebly with beer involved :)

HJam72
09-10-2008, 11:35 AM
What I want to know is where were Greenwood and Weaver on all those bounces out to the weak side.

Actually, I know where they were. Greenwood bit inside and got stuck with weaver and his blocker in his way.

So, we've had TJ playing the wrong position for what? 4 years? Meanwhile, we spent a #10 pick on Okoye, who plays where TJ should've been in the first place. Meanwhile, our secondary didn't get the help it needed and, unless our big rookie (Okam) turns out to be a steal, we still don't have the right player to start where TJ is still getting owned on run plays now. Then there's Greenwood and Weaver, who is supposed to be far better at run-stuffing; but, where was he Sunday?: getting shoved into Greenwood toward the middle of the LOS while Willie Parker bounced outside. Wonderful.

If Greenwood is such a student of the game, why did he bite on the faked run inside over and over and over and over again?

MeLoveTexans
09-10-2008, 11:37 AM
Do you enjoy inflicting self-punishment??? You coulda just cut yourself, woulda been less painful!

eriadoc
09-10-2008, 11:39 AM
Well, I watched the first half with my eyes on the two lines. Here are some surprising observations:

1. Okoye actually won his individual battle most of the time and certainly wasn't manhandled.

I have refrained from commenting on the Okoye threads because my memory from watching was in line with this observation. He didn't show up on the stat sheet, which is all anyone seems to care about, but I seemed to recall he did a good job. I wasn't so confident in my recollection (especially as the beer intake increased), so I haven't said anything about it to this point.

4. Brown played excellent in the first half.
This one I have commented on. Brown did some good things in the first half, and didn't really start getting owned until the Steelers were able to pin their ears back and come after the QB. Furthermore, in the series after the sack/fumble/attempted recovery by Brown, the team put Salaam in, who promptly got owned on a pass rush. If you have the DVR, maybe you could pinpoint the time on the play. I was so annoyed, I deleted mine.

6. Leach struggled in the run game and missing the blitzer on the second drive cost the Texans the game, because.....

That whiff by Leach looked like a Matt Stevens tackle.

7. I can't overemphasize the reality of this enough: Schuab received a concussion on that first sack late in the first quarter. Up until that point he was sharp, poised, and accurate. While the hit didn't look violent, he was clearly shaken up. Then, he literally doesn't make another good pass or decision the entire half. After halftime, he comes out and looks pretty much like himself again (after he's cleared up some in the head) but the team and circumstances around him had deteriorated beyond repair. HUGE MISTAKE BY THE TEXAN'S STAFF TO LEAVE HIM IN THERE AND RISK HIS HEALTH AND COST THE TEAM A CHANCE TO WIN!!! I'd buy that. The sack he took while out of the tackle box after that hit was completely unacceptable. He didn't have his wits about him, and as bad as it sounds, I would rather that be because of a concussion than because of poor decision-making. On the other hand, it reinforces an opinion of mine from last season that our sack numbers were largely smoke and mirrors. There's no question our line is better than it was pre-2006, but 22 sacks? We're not THAT good yet. We have our bookends now in Winston and Brown, though, and as they improve, this line will be very good, I think.

Thanks for doing what I could not - a re-watching of the game.

Texan JBZ
09-10-2008, 11:46 AM
Okoye actually won his individual battle most of the time and certainly wasn't manhandled.

Okay...I'll point this out again - Steelers had 39 rush attempts. Amobi Okoye, the starting DT, had 0 Unassisted Tackles, 0 Assisted Tackles. The Steelers had 18 pass attempts. Amobi Okoye, THE STARTING DT, #10 OVERALL PICK, PASS RUSH SPECIALIST, had 0 Sacks, 0 QB Pressures. If he won so many of his indvidual battles, and I'm not disputing you that he did, where the hell is his production?

Polo
09-10-2008, 11:51 AM
Okay...I'll point this out again - Steelers had 39 rush attempts. Amobi Okoye, the starting DT, had 0 Unassisted Tackles, 0 Assisted Tackles. The Steelers had 18 pass attempts. Amobi Okoye, THE STARTING DT, #10 OVERALL PICK, PASS RUSH SPECIALIST, had 0 Sacks, 0 QB Pressures. If he won so many of his indvidual battles, and I'm not disputing you that he did, where the hell is his production?


He's saying he watched the game and you're giving numbers from a statsheet...

He's a DT...Would two or three tackles have made you happy ?

Texan JBZ
09-10-2008, 11:55 AM
He's saying he watched the game and you're giving numbers from a statsheet...

He's a DT...Would two or three tackles have made you happy ?

Yes! Something, damn! I just don't get where you guys are getting your logic from. If he played so well and won so many of his individual battles, then why didn't he have at least 1 DAMN TACKLE?!? Okay, TJ is just such garbage and gets blown up and pushed around all the them. He had 3 tackles, and was getting dominated. If Amobi played sooooo well, then where is his production? Anything! That's a fair question.

eriadoc
09-10-2008, 12:01 PM
Yes! Something, damn! I just don't get where you guys are getting your logic from. If he played so well and won so many of his individual battles, then why didn't he have at least 1 DAMN TACKLE?!? Okay, TJ is just such garbage and gets blown up and pushed around all the them. He had 3 tackles, and was getting dominated. If Amobi played sooooo well, then where is his production? Anything! That's a fair question.

A DTs production is not tied to stats. In fact, if you watch TJ's tackles, he gets several of them in pursuit to the sidelines. So does Okoye, for that matter. I don't want DTs pursuing to the sidelines on a regular basis. The DTs are there to disrupt the play, and that usually results in a tackle by a LB. In our case, our linebackers suck, for the most part, and the Steelers linemen are pretty good at getting to the second level.

Stats mean jack when you're talking about DTs.

dalemurphy
09-10-2008, 12:13 PM
Okay...I'll point this out again - Steelers had 39 rush attempts. Amobi Okoye, the starting DT, had 0 Unassisted Tackles, 0 Assisted Tackles. The Steelers had 18 pass attempts. Amobi Okoye, THE STARTING DT, #10 OVERALL PICK, PASS RUSH SPECIALIST, had 0 Sacks, 0 QB Pressures. If he won so many of his indvidual battles, and I'm not disputing you that he did, where the hell is his production?


Just watch the game. I've been fairly critical of Okoye this pre-season. I was surprised to see him look as good as he did. And, I only watched the first half. It's possible he was awful in the second half. I just couldn't watch that crap in the second half. I saw plenty to see that he belonged out there. The reality is that our DLine played the run really well in the first half. There were three runs of over 5 yards in the first half:

1. Mendenhall went off left tackle and got wide because they caught Mario and TJ in a stunt and TJ wasn't able to get to the edge quickly enough- I think the LB had outside contain but wasn't there either.

2. Parker 13 yd touchdown on a draw... It was a draw and the Safety and WLB didn't make the play.

3. Parker 8 yards around the right end... Bennett clearly had contain, was totally unblocked and should've turned it in for a gain of 1 yard but he took a bad angle and whiffed to give Parker the edge.

Other than that, they couldn't run on us. By the way, in addition to Mario making plays against the run at the line, even Weaver made a play at the LOS on a sweep to the right. IT was a very good play, actually.

Texanfan4ever
09-10-2008, 12:14 PM
On Schaub, I hope you are right. thankyou for re-watching. Now that really makes sense. Cuz he sure lost it there for awhile, then he got it back again. I remember that hit, he didn't look too good, but he was tough and came right back to play. he tried....

bigbrewster2000
09-10-2008, 12:15 PM
Well, I watched the first half with my eyes on the two lines. Here are some surprising observations:

1. Okoye actually won his individual battle most of the time and certainly wasn't manhandled.

2. The DL has a whole was pretty good in the 1st half. Though, I agree with LZ that TJ can't hold his grown in the 3 technique.

3. Winston was awesome!, particularly sealing and getting to the second level in the run game. It's clear to see that once the blocking tightens up a little more and the backs make their reads a little quicker there will be some big plays in the run game.

4. Brown played excellent in the first half.

5. Pitts was very agressive on the back side and did a good job on the second level as well.

6. Leach struggled in the run game and missing the blitzer on the second drive cost the Texans the game, because.....

7. I can't overemphasize the reality of this enough: Schuab received a concussion on that first sack late in the first quarter. Up until that point he was sharp, poised, and accurate. While the hit didn't look violent, he was clearly shaken up. Then, he literally doesn't make another good pass or decision the entire half. After halftime, he comes out and looks pretty much like himself again (after he's cleared up some in the head) but the team and circumstances around him had deteriorated beyond repair. HUGE MISTAKE BY THE TEXAN'S STAFF TO LEAVE HIM IN THERE AND RISK HIS HEALTH AND COST THE TEAM A CHANCE TO WIN!!!


Rewatch the game if you can. It's very illuminating!

I did what you did yesterday. I agree with you on all accounts. A few things I would add though.

8. The LB's, were very bad in pass pro. It appeared that the majority of the catches made by Pitt WR's were were due to poor awareness. They gave too much in the zones and didnt react to the ball. The CB's for the most part didnt play too bad. Pretty tight coverage for the most part and you cany forget that Pitt's WR's arent exactly scubs.


That being said, They came out in the 2nd half and looked demoralized. And their defensive display was terrible. They need to put it all together for 4 quarters regardless of how the game is going. Thats the only way to be a winner in the NFL.

hadaad
09-10-2008, 12:22 PM
Well done. Fantastic post. Rep to you.

rmartin65
09-10-2008, 12:24 PM
You are a brave person. I just want to forget that game.

BigBull17
09-10-2008, 12:24 PM
A DTs production is not tied to stats. In fact, if you watch TJ's tackles, he gets several of them in pursuit to the sidelines. So does Okoye, for that matter. I don't want DTs pursuing to the sidelines on a regular basis. The DTs are there to disrupt the play, and that usually results in a tackle by a LB. In our case, our linebackers suck, for the most part, and the Steelers linemen are pretty good at getting to the second level.

Stats mean jack when you're talking about DTs.

Quoted fortruth. If im not mistaken, Amobi was the guy who laid the hit on Big Ben that hurt him. He got penetration and was disruptive, but when there is a gaping hole weak side, there is nothing he can do to stop it. When Ben was shook up, we should have put 9 in the box to force the pass.

We have so many holes on this D, coordinator included, we have plenty to point at before Okoye.

Hardcore Texan
09-10-2008, 12:33 PM
Thanks for rewatching it, I notice a couple of the things you mentioned the first time around. But I won't be rewatching, I deleted it off the DVR, I usually watch all the games twice but just couldn't bring myself to do it this time around.

BuffaloglennTX
09-10-2008, 12:44 PM
Quoted fortruth. If im not mistaken, Amobi was the guy who laid the hit on Big Ben that hurt him. He got penetration and was disruptive, but when there is a gaping hole weak side, there is nothing he can do to stop it. When Ben was shook up, we should have put 9 in the box to force the pass.

We have so many holes on this D, coordinator included, we have plenty to point at before Okoye.

I wanted to start this same thread after I re-watched and studied the first half last night. I agree completely with your comments. Amobi did bull rush two lineman, or a lineman and tight end, that ultimately had him bash into Rotlessburger and shake him up.

Also notable was that CC Brown got pressure on Ben Rotless and made a few early tackles. If you watch it again you will see that the Steelers running game was not all that great in the first half, and the longer runs were missed tackles.

What was shocking was how Chris Myers was manhandled most of the first half, and how the Steelers did not miss ANY open field tackles in the first half. I plan to watch the second half tonight and may post on it tomorrow. I would not be surprised if Schaub did get a concussion on that hit. The Texans basically played Pittsburg to a draw in the first quarter. Watch it again - you will see.

Silver Oak
09-10-2008, 12:59 PM
3. Winston was awesome!, particularly sealing and getting to the second level in the run game. It's clear to see that once the blocking tightens up a little more and the backs make their reads a little quicker there will be some big plays in the run game.



are you sure about that? I watched it on Short Cuts two times yesteday, and I saw Winston getting pushed around/back alot. In addition, it was his man who got past him and sacked MS when MS was running to the sidelines. Maybe you have a better eye for OL talent than I do, but from what I saw, Winston was pretty much manhandled.

Carr Bombed
09-10-2008, 01:14 PM
You are a brave person. I just want to forget that game.

Yeah I didn't even bother rewatching it....as soon as it was over I deleted it right off my DVR.

nunusguy
09-10-2008, 01:19 PM
Well, I watched the first half with my eyes on the two lines. Here are some surprising observations:

1. Okoye actually won his individual battle most of the time and certainly wasn't manhandled.

2. The DL has a whole was pretty good in the 1st half. Though, I agree with LZ that TJ can't hold his grown in the 3 technique.

3. Winston was awesome!, particularly sealing and getting to the second level in the run game. It's clear to see that once the blocking tightens up a little more and the backs make their reads a little quicker there will be some big plays in the run game.

4. Brown played excellent in the first half.

5. Pitts was very agressive on the back side and did a good job on the second level as well.

6. Leach struggled in the run game and missing the blitzer on the second drive cost the Texans the game, because.....

7. I can't overemphasize the reality of this enough: Schuab received a concussion on that first sack late in the first quarter. Up until that point he was sharp, poised, and accurate. While the hit didn't look violent, he was clearly shaken up. Then, he literally doesn't make another good pass or decision the entire half. After halftime, he comes out and looks pretty much like himself again (after he's cleared up some in the head) but the team and circumstances around him had deteriorated beyond repair. HUGE MISTAKE BY THE TEXAN'S STAFF TO LEAVE HIM IN THERE AND RISK HIS HEALTH AND COST THE TEAM A CHANCE TO WIN!!!


Rewatch the game if you can. It's very illuminating!

Good stuff Dale.
Here's some questions for you:
OLine -
We knew that Winstin & Pitts were our best OLinemen, and your take on
Brown, atleast how he did in the first half, is encouraging.
Your thoughts on the rest of the OLine starters - Myers & the RG (Briesle?) ?
DLine -
In spite of your favorable comments on Okoye, you probably know he made not a single tackle, not even an assist ? Did Mario do as well as we initially thought ? And Weavers performance ?

Texans_Chick
09-10-2008, 01:26 PM
7. I can't overemphasize the reality of this enough: Schuab received a concussion on that first sack late in the first quarter. Up until that point he was sharp, poised, and accurate. While the hit didn't look violent, he was clearly shaken up. Then, he literally doesn't make another good pass or decision the entire half. After halftime, he comes out and looks pretty much like himself again (after he's cleared up some in the head) but the team and circumstances around him had deteriorated beyond repair. HUGE MISTAKE BY THE TEXAN'S STAFF TO LEAVE HIM IN THERE AND RISK HIS HEALTH AND COST THE TEAM A CHANCE TO WIN!!!


Rewatch the game if you can. It's very illuminating!

Texans Style Guide Note: You are not supposed to say "concussion." The proper terminology is "ding" or "dinged-up" or "knocked around."

Runner
09-10-2008, 01:35 PM
I wonder about the "dinged-up" thing.

If he had a concussion, what are the odds he plays this week? If your observations and deductions are accurate*, it must have been mild if he looked better in the second half.


*I don't know though, I would like to think the Texans staff could identify a concussion.

CloakNNNdagger
09-10-2008, 01:50 PM
Texans Style Guide Note: You are not supposed to say "concussion." The proper terminology is "ding" or "dinged-up" or "knocked around."

Schaub looked that way in the Dallas game........without the ding. I am one that is still quite skeptical of this being mostly a pattern of sporadic play........we'll just have to see if the "bell tolls" again during the next game or two. If so, it's time for Sage.

Kubiak in some of his post game quotes was speaking of the need to "dumb down" the offense to allow Schaub some faith healing. This is so earily reminiscent of another Texans era.


Shorter drops needed (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/5992889.html)

Counting Schaub’s poor start in his last preseason performance at Dallas in which his passes were off target under a relentless pass rush, he has started poorly in two games in a row. Sunday is the ideal time for Schaub to recover and restore the fans’ faith in him.

The offense is predicated on quick passes to receivers who have the size and strength to break tackles. That means the quarterback has to get rid of the ball fast and be accurate.

It makes sense that if the offensive linemen are getting pushed back into Schaub’s facemask that he should take a shorter drop and fling it. Or use the shotgun. But Schaub isn’t comfortable in the shotgun. Only Seattle used it less last season than the Texans.

One thing that’s impressive about Sage Rosenfels is that he excels at taking the short drop, making quick decisions and getting rid of the ball in a hurry. And he’s accurate, too.

And speaking of Rosenfels, if the Texans lose to the Ravens and Schaub doesn’t play well again, this franchise is going to have its first big-time quarterback controversy.

Polo
09-10-2008, 01:51 PM
Who wrote that ?

SICLICK
09-10-2008, 01:53 PM
We basically sucked on Sunday.

Runner
09-10-2008, 01:53 PM
McClain according to the link.

dalemurphy
09-10-2008, 02:00 PM
Good stuff Dale.
Here's some questions for you:
OLine -
We knew that Winstin & Pitts were our best OLinemen, and your take on
Brown, atleast how he did in the first half, is encouraging.
Your thoughts on the rest of the OLine starters - Myers & the RG (Briesle?) ?
DLine -
In spite of your favorable comments on Okoye, you probably know he made not a single tackle, not even an assist ? Did Mario do as well as we initially thought ? And Weavers performance ?


1. Myers was pushed around in the run game some of the time. His pass protection looked fine but not special. Briesel had a couple plays where he couldn't make his assignments on the run play. I had a hard time discerning whether he got physically beat or simply took a wrong step. As a rule though, they looked like decent but I never saw them dominate or execute at a high level. Winston, on the other hand, in the run game either drove his man back 3+ yards or was able to block and seal him and then get to the second level and get his guy there to. It's really the first time I saw clearly how good he can be.

2. Okoye generally shot the gap. Being on Mario's side, the play often flowed away from him. I certainly didn't mean to imply that he had a great game. However, he was surprisingly strong at the line and often created penetration especially when blocked with one. On plays to his side he tended to get lost in the mess a bit but I never saw him driven back.


3. Mario was awesome. Both his sacks were essentially blown assignments, but he was the one that made the play. Basically every other pass he was collapsing the tackle or the guard if it was a stunt and putting pressure on Ben R. And, on running downs he was very sturdy, held his ground, shed blocks and then assisted on the play. He was great!

Texans_Chick
09-10-2008, 02:01 PM
Who says Schaub isn't comfortable in the shot gun? I thought Kubiak just didn't like using it.

Nice generalization about Rosenfels. Ask how accurate he is when he is throwing interceptions. Or maybe look at how he performed on the road against a good team last year with Andre Johnson in the lineup:

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter?game_id=29425&displayPage=tab_gamecenter&season=2007&week=REG16

Key stat
On the Texans' opening drive, Rosenfels completed 4 of 5 passes for 51 yards, including a 17-yard TD pass to Kevin Walter. Following that drive, Rosenfels went 18 of 31 for 182 yards, one touchdown and three interceptions.

All quarterbacks have strengths and weakness. But I got to give that an eh.

Mailman
09-10-2008, 02:02 PM
Quoted fortruth. If im not mistaken, Amobi was the guy who laid the hit on Big Ben that hurt him.

Wasn't he hurt on the Mario sack?

dalemurphy
09-10-2008, 02:04 PM
Schaub looked that way in the Dallas game........without the ding. I am one that is still quite skeptical of this being mostly a pattern of sporadic play........we'll just have to see if the "bell tolls" again during the next game or two. If so, it's time for Sage.

Kubiak in some of his post game quotes was speaking of the need to "dumb down" the offense to allow Schaub some faith healing. This is so earily reminiscent of another Texans era.

In the Dallas game, Studdard was flopping around right in front of him. And, he didn't make nearly the poor decisions there as he did in the Steeler game though the pressure was much worse in Dallas. In Dallas he just made about 4 bad throws but not the same kind of inexplicable decisions that he did in Pittsburgh.

dalemurphy
09-10-2008, 02:05 PM
Wasn't he hurt on the Mario sack?

Yes, it was Mario that hurt him.

rollinstone18
09-10-2008, 02:08 PM
The missed block by Leach just may have been a game changer. Schaub played scared and stupid for nearly the rest of the game. I wouldn't go as far to say we would have won, but I will say Schaub would not have played nearly as bad as he did.

It was a wicked hit.

disaacks3
09-10-2008, 02:44 PM
FWIW - Brown mentioned at the P&P breakfast yesterday that he had cramped up REAL bad in the 3rd quarter, but forced himself to play through it. He said he needed to keep himself better hydrated in the future.

TexansLucky13
09-10-2008, 02:49 PM
FWIW - Brown mentioned at the P&P breakfast yesterday that he had cramped up REAL bad in the 3rd quarter, but forced himself to play through it. He said he needed to keep himself better hydrated in the future.

That's a great thing to hear from a rook. He fought through the pain (just like Mario), and he is learning how to be better prepared.

I really think we have an anchor at LT and RT for years to come. I just hope our inside guys can figure out how to deal with those big NT's in the 3-4, or even just in general. Chester does good as usual, but Brisiel and Myers not so much.

Polo
09-10-2008, 02:51 PM
I like Meyers...

He has a little nastiness to his game...

eriadoc
09-10-2008, 02:53 PM
I like Meyers....

Signed, Casey Hampton Fans everywhere

Vinny
09-10-2008, 02:54 PM
I like Meyers...

He has a little nastiness to his game...

Yeah he gets real pissed after he gets steamrolled. :pirate:

as for this thread, I don't have as upbeat a take on our front 7 myself....I thought just about everyone was getting pushed around and blocked easily.

dalemurphy
09-10-2008, 02:54 PM
After watching the 2nd half:

Okoye continued to play well and so did Mario.

The Oline blocking in the run game looked bad largely due to our RBs. Slaton, three times, missed the hole for what would've been a big run. If you have DVR, check out the run left at 5:17 to go in the 4th quarter. Daniels and the oline have the outside totally sealed for Slaton for what would've surely been a big gain. Instead, he puts his head down right into the DE. There are other plays like that but that one will clearly show what I'm talking about.

Brown had a bad third quarter, otherwise I thought he looked good

Where are the LBs and Safeties??????????

TexansLucky13
09-10-2008, 02:54 PM
I like Meyers...

He has a little nastiness to his game...

Casey Hampton ripped us apart in the middle, but then again the dude is a beast and a 4 time Pro Bowler. They have to find a way to bulk up inside.

HOU-TEX
09-10-2008, 02:55 PM
I like Meyers...

He has a little nastiness to his game...

I like him too, but he was often overpowered Sunday.

He's light years better than Flabbygan. That guy was horrible (with the Texans)

Polo
09-10-2008, 02:55 PM
Yeah he gets real pissed after he gets steamrolled. :pirate:

Considering everyone was getting manhandled a bit atleast he showed some fire.

BuffaloglennTX
09-10-2008, 03:04 PM
Yes, it was Mario that hurt him.

Actually it was Amobi - in my other post on this thread I mentioned it. Amobi bullrushed two lineman and sort of half dove/rolled into Rottedburger down low. That's when big ben came up limping and nearly fell down handing the ball off on the next play. It was the second quarter.

dalemurphy
09-10-2008, 03:16 PM
Texans Style Guide Note: You are not supposed to say "concussion." The proper terminology is "ding" or "dinged-up" or "knocked around."

I wish the Houston sports media would call him out on that. And by the way, what happens after Kubiak says, "you'll have to talk to Kevin"... Does anyone follow up and talk to Kevin?

KEYE SUX
09-10-2008, 03:27 PM
Does Schaub's concussion scare anybody? Was it a nasty hit? Yes. But I don't want to think (again) about going through a season where our starting QB is always "one play" from being sidelined. Especially since this is probably the last year we have Sage.

Carr Bombed
09-10-2008, 03:50 PM
Considering everyone was getting manhandled a bit atleast he showed some fire.

Nobody got manhandled like Myers......he was pratically thrown 3 yards back right into Slaton. Honestly even watching the guy play throughout the preseason and Sunday, he still really hasn't been able to hold the point in the running game. He needs to atleast hold the line so we don't have defenders playing in our backfield and god forbid, is it too much to ask for him to consistently drive people off the ball in the running game?

It's times like this where I miss Steve McKinney.....Steve played really well in the running game and with a healthy McKinney the Texans were atleast respectable running the ball. As of right now, I'm not sold on Myers. I hope it's just the new "scheme thing", but what scares me about Myers is he already has a couple of years experience in this scheme....he should be ahead of every other lineman.

Malloy
09-10-2008, 04:43 PM
Too lazy to start a new thread, but I was wondering, what happened to Daniel Owens, Short of a catch I dont recall seeing anything from him. Was he on pass protection all night or... ?

Texan JBZ
09-10-2008, 04:45 PM
Okay, this question is for all the "Amobi played a good game" bloggers: If you're taking an algebra test and show all your work, as far as doing the right formulas, but put the wrong answer down on your scantron, does the instructor give you credit just because you showed your work? Survey says - Aaaannnnnnnnnnn! If he played so well, and was so disruptive, then where are his final results?

And for you guys that don't think DTs are supposed to make plays in a 4-3 (especially the 3-technique DT), you're wrong. This is not a 3-4 where the DLmans job is keep blockers off of the ILBs so they can run and make plays. 4-3 DT, especially the 3-technique which Amobi plays, are supposed to make plays because most of the time they are facing single blocking. Travis, who plays the 1-technique, faces a double team almost every play. The reason why he's not that productive of a player is because he doesn't have enough bulk to hold his ground. The Texans need a BIG BODY there. Still, I don't care if he was running plays down from behind-there is no way he should have finished with more productivity than Amobi. I'll reiterate this one more time: There is no way a starter on the DL should finish with no productivity on the stat sheet against a run-first team. That's absurd!

CloakNNNdagger
09-10-2008, 04:51 PM
Don't you at least just once in a while get a little feeling of deja vu..........and the interchangeability of the #8?

http://www.squibkick.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/david-carr-on-ground.bmp

Texans_Chick
09-10-2008, 06:52 PM
Don't you at least just once in a while get a little feeling of deja vu..........and the interchangeability of the #8?



Usually not. Eating sacks or throwin ints instead of throwing the ball out of bounds, more so.

Teh Schaub hasn't looked like himself. But the offensive line has done him no favors either.

ChampionTexan
09-10-2008, 07:02 PM
Don't you at least just once in a while get a little feeling of deja vu..........and the interchangeability of the #8?

http://www.squibkick.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/david-carr-on-ground.bmp

We may get to the same endpoint, but it will be via a different route.

I've got a good friend in Atlanta who's a big Falcon fan, and I told him after last season that I was confident we hadn't traded for Scott Mitchell or Rob Johnson, but I wasn't as sure about Chris Chandler or Chris Miller.

b0ng
09-10-2008, 07:10 PM
Okay, this question is for all the "Amobi played a good game" bloggers: If you're taking an algebra test and show all your work, as far as doing the right formulas, but put the wrong answer down on your scantron, does the instructor give you credit just because you showed your work? Survey says - Aaaannnnnnnnnnn! If he played so well, and was so disruptive, then where are his final results?


Explain to me again how a physically demanding game that relies on the body being fit and able to perform as well as the mind is the same as a high school algebra test?

Texan JBZ
09-10-2008, 08:25 PM
Explain to me again how a physically demanding game that relies on the body being fit and able to perform as well as the mind is the same as a high school algebra test?

Sorry if you don't get the analogy. What I'm saying is if he put in so much work in that game being disruptive (ala, showing his work on the test-or game), then where are the final results of that work (ala, doing all the work that you're supposed to, but still making a ZERO on the test). There, is that better for ya :laughjump:

J-Russ
09-10-2008, 08:33 PM
Sorry if you don't get the analogy. What I'm saying is if he put in so much work in that game being disruptive (ala, showing his work on the test-or game), then where are the final results of that work (ala, doing all the work that you're supposed to, but still making a ZERO on the test). There, is that better for ya :laughjump:

All of that come in after the coaches review the game with the team the next day, you have no idea what grade Kubiak/Franklin would give Amobi. Dalemurphy pretty much zoom in on Amobi and gave us a review of his game, and you refuse to hear it. Jay Foremon and Morlon Greenwood makes a bunch of tackles and on stat looks like elite LBs in the NFL, so when other poster bash them how come I don't see you defending them? They're a beast(stat-wise) but you don't say anything about it. Yet you're going to bash Amobi because his effort doesn't show up on the stats? You're really starting to come off as a Amobi hater.

TexansLucky13
09-10-2008, 08:54 PM
Sorry if you don't get the analogy. What I'm saying is if he put in so much work in that game being disruptive (ala, showing his work on the test-or game), then where are the final results of that work (ala, doing all the work that you're supposed to, but still making a ZERO on the test). There, is that better for ya :laughjump:

There isn't a single person in the NFL that thinks like that (except maybe Al Davis), and for good reason. Numbers don't mean ****, it's how they contribute to the team that's important.

For example, say Amobi is really beating his guy. The offense may adjust to double team him, which takes pressure off of the ends. Mario could end up getting a sack because Amobi is playing so well. The defense succeeds and fails as a unit.

You really gotta lay off the fantasy football mentality, bro.

kiwitexansfan
09-10-2008, 09:18 PM
There isn't a single person in the NFL that thinks like that (except maybe Al Davis), and for good reason. Numbers don't mean ****, it's how they contribute to the team that's important.

For example, say Amobi is really beating his guy. The offense may adjust to double team him, which takes pressure off of the ends. Mario could end up getting a sack because Amobi is playing so well. The defense succeeds and fails as a unit.

You really gotta lay of the fantasy football mentality, bro.

Well said Lucky13, the only stat that matters is wins, especially in an area as murky as the DL.

Texan JBZ
09-10-2008, 10:14 PM
All of that come in after the coaches review the game with the team the next day, you have no idea what grade Kubiak/Franklin would give Amobi. Dalemurphy pretty much zoom in on Amobi and gave us a review of his game, and you refuse to hear it. Jay Foremon and Morlon Greenwood makes a bunch of tackles and on stat looks like elite LBs in the NFL, so when other poster bash them how come I don't see you defending them? They're a beast(stat-wise) but you don't say anything about it. Yet you're going to bash Amobi because his effort doesn't show up on the stats? You're really starting to come off as a Amobi hater.

Look, I've been on Amobi's ass all preseason. I'm not a hater. Ya'll are just not f'ing realist! Amobi has been getting bashed since the preseason by other teams offensive lines. I saw Mario controlling and dominating his guy more than a few times, and the important part-HE MADE THE DAMN PLAY! I like Zac Diles, but he can play a lot better. What I gave Zac credit for is that a SAM LB isn't supposed to make that many tackles in a game. He may not be doing everything right like Amobi seems to be doing, but at least he's making plays. Morlon is what he is. I don't expect anything out of him. And just b/c somebody gave me their review doesn't mean that I'm swayed on my opinion. And don't give me this effort crap. Mark Simmons gave great effort. Kevis Coley gave great effort. B4 he was injured, Harry Williams gave great effort. What do Simmons and Coley get for their outstanding effort-Practice Squad Jobs! Yeahhhhh efforttttt! Hell, Jacques Reeves gives great effort. What the hell kind of slack do people cut him? Exactly.

Texan JBZ
09-10-2008, 10:22 PM
There isn't a single person in the NFL that thinks like that (except maybe Al Davis), and for good reason. Numbers don't mean ****, it's how they contribute to the team that's important.

For example, say Amobi is really beating his guy. The offense may adjust to double team him, which takes pressure off of the ends. Mario could end up getting a sack because Amobi is playing so well. The defense succeeds and fails as a unit.

You really gotta lay off the fantasy football mentality, bro.


Okay guy, here's Amobi Okoye's Contribution to the team so far this season: 0 Unassisted Tackles, 0 Assisted Tackles, 0 QB Pressures, 0 Sacks. And did you say that teams will look to double team Amobi Okoye when MARIO WILLIAMS is playing next to him :spit::goodpost: That's too funny! You have one of the most dominate DEs in the league right now playing next to Amobi, and they're going to double team Amobi? Really? :mcnugget::gun: Bwahahaha! Tell you what, I'll lay off the fantasy football mentality if you lay off the bong pipe. Deal?

Texan JBZ
09-10-2008, 10:29 PM
Well said Lucky13, the only stat that matters is wins, especially in an area as murky as the DL.

Steelers 38 - Texans 17! Steelers: 39 attempts, 183 yards, 3 rushing TDs, 4.7 (that's 4.7) yards/carry. Texans..nevermind. Steelers: 5 sacks. Mario: 2 sacks. ADVANTAGE: STEELERS!

eriadoc
09-10-2008, 10:38 PM
Dude, are you actually trying to convince us of something? Get over it. You're not reaching the same conclusions as everyone else. It happens. Go back and re-watch the game and iso on Okoye and convince yourself. If you're really interested in evaluating Okoye's play, you'll figure it out. I'm pretty sure we're all disinterested in convincing you of anything.

HJam72
09-10-2008, 10:43 PM
When you rewatch it the 10th time, you will finally go back to your original conclusion. :mcnugget:

buddyboy
09-10-2008, 10:43 PM
Okay, this question is for all the "Amobi played a good game" bloggers: If you're taking an algebra test and show all your work, as far as doing the right formulas, but put the wrong answer down on your scantron, does the instructor give you credit just because you showed your work? Survey says - Aaaannnnnnnnnnn! If he played so well, and was so disruptive, then where are his final results?

And for you guys that don't think DTs are supposed to make plays in a 4-3 (especially the 3-technique DT), you're wrong. This is not a 3-4 where the DLmans job is keep blockers off of the ILBs so they can run and make plays. 4-3 DT, especially the 3-technique which Amobi plays, are supposed to make plays because most of the time they are facing single blocking. Travis, who plays the 1-technique, faces a double team almost every play. The reason why he's not that productive of a player is because he doesn't have enough bulk to hold his ground. The Texans need a BIG BODY there. Still, I don't care if he was running plays down from behind-there is no way he should have finished with more productivity than Amobi. I'll reiterate this one more time: There is no way a starter on the DL should finish with no productivity on the stat sheet against a run-first team. That's absurd!

The fact of the matter is, usually during math tests the professor will give you upwards of 1/2 to 3/4 credit for a problem if you set it up correctly and made a mistake somewhere along the way that scewed your answer. This is because although your answer may or may not be right, your procedure was correct, and for that, you get credit, even if your final result was not correct. You don't get counted off full credit for inserting a wrong value or making a small math mistake. Those are mistakes that can be fixed easily, but it's the procedure and the foundation of the knowledge that counts.

The same can be said for Okoye, and for many players. While they may not be getting the results, those are what will come if they keep doing the right things. Okoye may be doing the right things, but the tackles aren't coming, or the running backs aren't running his way. The simple truth is that as long as he does the procedure correctly, then the results will come with a few minor tweaks. Just because a player doesn't get a tackle, or a sack, or a hurry, doesn't mean that they aren't doing things right. Sometimes, things just don't go the right way, and sometimes, you just have to make minor fixes to get the results.

Texan JBZ
09-10-2008, 10:56 PM
Dude, are you actually trying to convince us of something? Get over it. You're not reaching the same conclusions as everyone else. It happens. Go back and re-watch the game and iso on Okoye and convince yourself. If you're really interested in evaluating Okoye's play, you'll figure it out. I'm pretty sure we're all disinterested in convincing you of anything.

Conclusions? Iso on Okoye? Why? I know exactly what Amobi did-NOTHING! I didn't see him make any plays the first time I watched it. And I don't care if you're disinterested. You don't have to try and convince me of anything. You have an opinion, and so do I. It's as simple as that.

TexansLucky13
09-10-2008, 10:58 PM
Okay guy, here's Amobi Okoye's Contribution to the team so far this season: 0 Unassisted Tackles, 0 Assisted Tackles, 0 QB Pressures, 0 Sacks. And did you say that teams will look to double team Amobi Okoye when MARIO WILLIAMS is playing next to him :spit::goodpost: That's too funny! You have one of the most dominate DEs in the league right now playing next to Amobi, and they're going to double team Amobi? Really? :mcnugget::gun: Bwahahaha! Tell you what, I'll lay off the fantasy football mentality if you lay off the bong pipe. Deal?

It's not really worth my time, but oh well. I am good at wasting time.

Once again you are equating contribution solely to stats. If you don't understand the problem with that, you really don't know much about football. Seriously.

If Amobi is getting penetration in the middle, you better damn well believe that the offense will adjust to it. If the center or guard can't handle him (like Brisiel and Myers couldn't handle Casey Hampton), you're going to have to help them out (unless you want your guys to just get manhandled). That will free up somebody... in a 4-3, it could be the other tackle, or it could be either end. If they insert a blocking TE it will help your second level because that is one less guy to cover.

Texan JBZ
09-10-2008, 11:01 PM
The fact of the matter is, usually during math tests the professor will give you upwards of 1/2 to 3/4 credit for a problem if you set it up correctly and made a mistake somewhere along the way that scewed your answer. This is because although your answer may or may not be right, your procedure was correct, and for that, you get credit, even if your final result was not correct. You don't get counted off full credit for inserting a wrong value or making a small math mistake. Those are mistakes that can be fixed easily, but it's the procedure and the foundation of the knowledge that counts.

The same can be said for Okoye, and for many players. While they may not be getting the results, those are what will come if they keep doing the right things. Okoye may be doing the right things, but the tackles aren't coming, or the running backs aren't running his way. The simple truth is that as long as he does the procedure correctly, then the results will come with a few minor tweaks. Just because a player doesn't get a tackle, or a sack, or a hurry, doesn't mean that they aren't doing things right. Sometimes, things just don't go the right way, and sometimes, you just have to make minor fixes to get the results.

Okay then. Let's give Amobi his final grade for the first exam of the year: Effort (or procedures) - A, Execution (or lack thereof) - F. I equate the effort grade to a citizenship grade-All you have to do is show up, be quiet, and do nothing at all to get an A in that.

b0ng
09-10-2008, 11:04 PM
Conclusions? Iso on Okoye? Why? I know exactly what Amobi did-NOTHING! I didn't see him make any plays the first time I watched it. And I don't care if you're disinterested. You don't have to try and convince me of anything. You have an opinion, and so do I. It's as simple as that.

So I'm going to go ahead and guess that you haven't re-watched the game at all.

Texan JBZ
09-10-2008, 11:10 PM
It's not really worth my time, but oh well. I am good at wasting time.

Once again you are equating contribution solely to stats. If you don't understand the problem with that, you really don't know much about football. Seriously.

If Amobi is getting penetration in the middle, you better damn well believe that the offense will adjust to it. If the center or guard can't handle him (like Brisiel and Myers couldn't handle Casey Hampton), you're going to have to help them out (unless you want your guys to just get manhandled). That will free up somebody... in a 4-3, it could be the other tackle, or it could be either end. If they insert a blocking TE it will help your second level because that is one less guy to cover.


:spit::spit::spit: Keep going bruh. This is getting even better! Naw, seriously-You do know who plays the other tackle and one of the either ends for us, don't you? You are a Texans fan, aren't you? Amobi Okoye's impact compared to Casey Hampton's impact..Dude, are you freaking kidding me? For real

dalemurphy
09-10-2008, 11:27 PM
:spit::spit::spit: Keep going bruh. This is getting even better! Naw, seriously-You do know who plays the other tackle and one of the either ends for us, don't you? You are a Texans fan, aren't you? Amobi Okoye's impact compared to Casey Hampton's impact..Dude, are you freaking kidding me? For real


Another issue: if Okoye was #59 he would have been credited with at least 2 tackles, maybe three. I don't know if he was officially credited with a QB pressure or not, but I clearly saw him collapse the pocket and put pressure on the Pitt QBs.

Do you know how many sacks and tackles Dwight Freeney had the year Indianapolis won the superbowl? first, let me preface this by saying that he played in all 16 games:

SACKS: 5.5
TACKLES/ASSISTS: 26/3

He actually had the same amount of sacks and fewer tackles as Okoye did last year. Would you argue that Okoye's '07 season was more productive than Freeney's '06 season?.... I wouldn't!

buddyboy
09-10-2008, 11:32 PM
Okay then. Let's give Amobi his final grade for the first exam of the year: Effort (or procedures) - A, Execution (or lack thereof) - F. I equate the effort grade to a citizenship grade-All you have to do is show up, be quiet, and do nothing at all to get an A in that.

The point I was trying to make was that even if the "effort" didn't show up on the stat sheet *this* game, as long as Okoye continues doing the right things, the stats will come. Remember, this is only one game. Mario had games last year when he was a non-factor, but look what happened towards the end of the season. The sacks and tackles were coming, even though earlier in the season he may not be as effective. Did he magically become an exponentially better player? Not necessarily. Stats come and go, but the law of averages dictate that Okoye will have his games with not many stats, and will have his games where he might have an inflated number.

Texan JBZ
09-10-2008, 11:38 PM
Another issue: if Okoye was #59 he would have been credited with at least 2 tackles, maybe three. I don't know if he was officially credited with a QB pressure or not, but I clearly saw him collapse the pocket and put pressure on the Pitt QBs.

Do you know how many sacks and tackles Dwight Freeney had the year Indianapolis won the superbowl? first, let me preface this by saying that he played in all 16 games:

SACKS: 5.5
TACKLES/ASSISTS: 26/3

He actually had the same amount of sacks and fewer tackles as Okoye did last year. Would you argue that Okoye's '07 season was more productive than Freeney's '06 season?.... I wouldn't!

Dalemurphy, I respect your opinions bruh. I read a number of your posts and you're very even-handed in your approach. Here's the thing about me though-I don't care what Freeney did. I want Freeney to do terrible. I hate the Ponys. I'm a Texan fan. All I care about is what Texan players do. And I don't do hyperboles. He's not #59. He's #91. And "IF" is a word I just don't like. As it is, the only one I saw the whole game put pressure on Big Ben was #90. The only time I ever saw Amobi in the backfield was when Mario would pinch down inside and Amobi would loop around him to the outside. I also saw one play where he got into the backfield and let the RB run right past him. Plus, this is a new year. Right off the top of your head, I bet you can't name the last game Amobi got a sack in. He hit the wall hard last year, and still seems to be trying to break it down this year. So as far as his production in '07, that's '07. Another thing, and this goes back to the Casey Hampton thing, you can't compare Amobi to Freeney. It's not even a fair comparison for Amobi. He's not even in the same league as Freeney.

TexansLucky13
09-11-2008, 12:23 AM
:spit::spit::spit: Keep going bruh. This is getting even better! Naw, seriously-You do know who plays the other tackle and one of the either ends for us, don't you? You are a Texans fan, aren't you? Amobi Okoye's impact compared to Casey Hampton's impact..Dude, are you freaking kidding me? For real

I wasn't comparing them directly, I was presenting a "for instance" scenario. You continue to dance around a true discussion by arguing semantics and the only thing you take seriously is statistics.

You have no argument. I know Amobi didn't have a great game, but the lack of stats doesn't mean he had zero impact, like you are implying. We all know he needs to improve and we are all aware of the rookie wall he hit last season.

kiwitexansfan
09-11-2008, 12:36 AM
Conclusions? Iso on Okoye? Why? I know exactly what Amobi did-NOTHING! I didn't see him make any plays the first time I watched it. And I don't care if you're disinterested. You don't have to try and convince me of anything. You have an opinion, and so do I. It's as simple as that.

I have come to realise that most casual or even passionate fans of the game, don't fully appreciate the millions of nuances in a players performance and technique.

Even watching a game numerous times as many of our contributors to the board do, they still don't always have the expertise to appreciate, scheme, technique, play design etc. Even fulltime professional football scouts, make mistakes and get players ability impact wrong, have you not seen the draft.

I'm sorry, while agreeing you are entitled to your opinion, I also reserve the right to take it pretty lightly if you haven't put the work in to study the tape.

Unless of course your an expert in disguise, is that you Charley Casserley? Hold on Casserley expertise didn't exactly get us far...

dalemurphy
09-11-2008, 12:36 AM
Dalemurphy, I respect your opinions bruh. I read a number of your posts and you're very even-handed in your approach. Here's the thing about me though-I don't care what Freeney did. I want Freeney to do terrible. I hate the Ponys. I'm a Texan fan. All I care about is what Texan players do. And I don't do hyperboles. He's not #59. He's #91. And "IF" is a word I just don't like. As it is, the only one I saw the whole game put pressure on Big Ben was #90. The only time I ever saw Amobi in the backfield was when Mario would pinch down inside and Amobi would loop around him to the outside. I also saw one play where he got into the backfield and let the RB run right past him. Plus, this is a new year. Right off the top of your head, I bet you can't name the last game Amobi got a sack in. He hit the wall hard last year, and still seems to be trying to break it down this year. So as far as his production in '07, that's '07. Another thing, and this goes back to the Casey Hampton thing, you can't compare Amobi to Freeney. It's not even a fair comparison for Amobi. He's not even in the same league as Freeney.

I know Freeney and Okoye aren't in the same league. That's the point I'm making- that the stats don't tell the whole story.

We probably are in general agreement when it comes down to our opinion of Okoye. I watched the game at a bar and left there with the impression that Okoye and the whole defense, other than Mario, played poorly. I was very surprised to see that not to be the case.

I'm singling out Okoye's play, not because it was exceptional, but because it was surprisingly solid. I had expected to see him getting washed on running plays and being ineffective in the pass rush. Instead, I saw a DT that generally won his one on one battles. Of course he didn't have a great game. He didn't make any plays. And, I agree with you that playmaking is a pretty essential component of playing well. I was excited and relieved, however, to see that Okoye wasn't the problem with the defense. And, one thing I gathered from the second viewing is there is reason to hope/expect that Okoye will be a playmaker for this team this season- and certainly doesn't look (at least in week one) to be part of the problem)... And, that's a good thing.

Texan JBZ
09-11-2008, 04:26 AM
I have come to realise that most casual or even passionate fans of the game, don't fully appreciate the millions of nuances in a players performance and technique.

Even watching a game numerous times as many of our contributors to the board do, they still don't always have the expertise to appreciate, scheme, technique, play design etc. Even fulltime professional football scouts, make mistakes and get players ability impact wrong, have you not seen the draft.

I'm sorry, while agreeing you are entitled to your opinion, I also reserve the right to take it pretty lightly if you haven't put the work in to study the tape.

Unless of course your an expert in disguise, is that you Charley Casserley? Hold on Casserley expertise didn't exactly get us far...


I just got finished watching the replay of the game on NFL Network. I focused primarily on the o-line and d-line to see what kind of problems the team was having stopping the run and running the ball. The one thing that stood out to me was how bad Amobi Okoye played. I mean, he flat out stunk. He had no burst off the ball, wasn't strong at the point of attack, was blown off the line of scrimmage several times, played too high, and showed absolutely no penetration. No motor at all!

I came out of high school playing MLB in a 3-4 system. I played in a 3-3-5 system at one college and a 4-3 Multiple at the other. I am very well-versed in defensive fronts, alignments, stunts, coverages, etc., because I had to be. I look at things different from the average football fan. I know on certain loop stunts that Amobi had outside contain that kept him from going after the QB. I saw that. They ran that stunt with him and Mario a couple of times during the game.

But, I also watched his pad level, his burst off the line, his strength at the point of attack when the Saints ran the ball at him. It was not good. He was consistently pushed off the ball and was a non-factor. I saw at least three times when they weren't running a stunt and Amobi had one man blocking him on pass protection. His man wore him out every time. I am not claiming to be an expert, but I know my stuff when it comes to football.

And your right about a DT's technique. That was my whole issue with Amobi. He played with horrible technique.

You know what they say about the word "Assume" don't you? But I can sit here and tell you what I know about football all day. Do you really even give a damn? I can tell you that I've played with NFL DLman like Osi Umenyiora and Ellis Wyms, but do you care? Probably not. Just like I don't care what you think about my football knowledge. I just want to let you know that I'm not some average couch potato ass fan. I've studied more film than I care to remember. I can tell you the in-and-outs of running a Tampa 2 defense because I had to study Tampa Bay's defense. But you don't care about that. So that means I also reserve the right to let you know that you don't know a thing about what I know about the nuances of football. You just "Assume"

Polo
09-11-2008, 09:26 AM
I know this is the NFL and we want guys to "produce now", but one thing I always consider with Amobi is his age....

A guy that I think about when I think about Amobi is Tommie Harris...

Both came into the leauge as 20 yr olds...Obviously Harris was a bit older...Both are quicker, gap shooting DT's...

Amobi had more sacks his first year...Harris had about 10 more tackles...Harris had 1 more tackle than Amobi this past Sunday...

Point is: He needs time to develop, that was only game one of his second NFL season as a 21 yr. old...

I don't know if Harris had problems against the run early in his career, but since we're just looking at stats...

TexansLucky13
09-11-2008, 10:27 AM
You know what they say about the word "Assume" don't you? But I can sit here and tell you what I know about football all day. Do you really even give a damn? I can tell you that I've played with NFL DLman like Osi Umenyiora and Ellis Wyms, but do you care? Probably not. Just like I don't care what you think about my football knowledge. I just want to let you know that I'm not some average couch potato ass fan. I've studied more film than I care to remember. I can tell you the in-and-outs of running a Tampa 2 defense because I had to study Tampa Bay's defense. But you don't care about that. So that means I also reserve the right to let you know that you don't know a thing about what I know about the nuances of football. You just "Assume"

What conclusion did you expect us to come up to? You, being so well versed in defensive schemes, should understand exactly why hinging on statistics is foolish.

I suppose I am proud of you for rewatching the game. Do you see how much more impressive it is for you to say "I watched his play, and he was a non-factor" rather than "I looked at his stats, and he was a non-factor". Now you can actually discuss this properly.