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View Full Version : Last Place - 3 years in a row?


the wonger need food
12-13-2004, 12:21 PM
If the Titans win tonight Houston will be in last place once again.

Considering the fact that Tennessee has games remaining against KC, Oakland, Detroit and Denver, they will probably finish 7-9. I can see the Texans maybe winning the Cleveland game since it is at home which would put them at 6-10 and sole possession of last place in the division for the 3rd year in a row. When/If this happens, where does the organization go from there? How can anyone be convinced that this is progress?

OzzO
12-13-2004, 12:36 PM
If it happens... life will go on. The offices / coaches will make adjustments that they feel will benefit the team. From there, they will progress into the 2005 season... and if they do win one more game this season, then that's one more than last year even though we have additional rookies, a new blocking system, and a sophmore RB that had something to prove.

... and we beat the Titans twice along with a few back to back wins... that's progress.

Harry Biped
12-13-2004, 12:37 PM
I hate to say this, but I knew at the beginning of the season that things would end up this way. Unfortunately the Texans have shown no real marked improvement since the first season. Sure they've gotten more talent, but haven't really played any better since then. I picked them to be in the 5 to 6 win area and well, here we are. As a charter season ticket holder and someone who has spent literaly thousands of dollars on the team, I feel like they have failed to provide a quality product for my investment. As things are right now, I can't see myself forking over the money to keep supporting a franchise that does not seem to be as committed to winning as they told us they were. It is time to make some big changes in the organization.

El Tejano
12-13-2004, 12:39 PM
I will be more than happy to take your tickets. Thank you and don't let the door hitcha!

nunusguy
12-13-2004, 12:57 PM
Unfortunately the Texans have shown no real marked improvement since the first season. Sure they've gotten more talent, but haven't really played any better since then.
Yup, I really agree with this. I'm not gonna stop supporting them, but then
I'm not a season ticket holder - only go to a game or two a year. Too much of a hassle going to games. But the party who posted this - Bob McNair does not want to lose his business. Season ticket holders want to see the team play full tilt to the end of the game, every game. They did that in 2002 & 2003, but not this year. And with the W-L record shaping up to be about the same and no playoffs in sight.........

TexansTrueFan
12-13-2004, 01:03 PM
well hey i'm sure by you not buying season tickets next season it will really help the organization :hmmm: ! I suppose our stands will look like the Arizona games come next season huh :hmmm:

Doug
12-13-2004, 01:03 PM
I hate to say this, but I knew at the beginning of the season that things would end up this way. Unfortunately the Texans have shown no real marked improvement since the first season. Sure they've gotten more talent, but haven't really played any better since then. I picked them to be in the 5 to 6 win area and well, here we are. As a charter season ticket holder and someone who has spent literaly thousands of dollars on the team, I feel like they have failed to provide a quality product for my investment. As things are right now, I can't see myself forking over the money to keep supporting a franchise that does not seem to be as committed to winning as they told us they were. It is time to make some big changes in the organization.

I'm sorry but this too funny....

ThaShark316
12-13-2004, 01:06 PM
2004 AFC South Final Standings

Colts 12-4
Jaguars 8-8
Texans 8-8
Titans 6-10

:twocents:

TexansTrueFan
12-13-2004, 01:08 PM
2004 AFC South Final Standings

Colts 12-4
Jaguars 8-8
Texans 8-8
Titans 6-10

:twocents:


:coolb: now thats the spirit !!!!!!!!!

Harry Biped
12-13-2004, 01:12 PM
Let me just clarify my statement that I might stop supporting the Texans. I mean in terms of not renewing season tickets. I will always root for them through good and bad, but since the league has chosen to make the NFL more business than it is a sport by driving up ticket, merchandising and concession prices, it is at the point that I or anyone else would be foolish to continue paying them to take my money, when they deliver very little in return. I won't be the only one and it does not mean that I'm a bad fan because of it. I have an obligation to my self in terms of finances, not to the Texans or any of their fans. If I was to go to a steak house and get a bad meal only 1 time out of every 4 or 5 times I went there, it wouldn't be smart to keep going there. Why is it any different with the Texans and the NFL. If the prices were half of what they are now it would not be a problem, but they're not. The NFL is worried more about serving people with a lot of expendable income than they are football fans. I don't owe them or anyone else anything. But after the investment that I have made, I feel like they owe me more and have every right to express that.

gcolby
12-13-2004, 01:14 PM
I picked them to be in the 5 to 6 win area and well, here we are. As a charter season ticket holder and someone who has spent literaly thousands of dollars on the team, I feel like they have failed to provide a quality product for my investment. As things are right now, I can't see myself forking over the money to keep supporting a franchise that does not seem to be as committed to winning as they told us they were. It is time to make some big changes in the organization.

Let me get this straight: you picked them to get 5 or 6 wins, so they ARE performing to your expectations. What's your problem here?

We're dealing with a third year team that is dealing with turning that final corner that adolescent teams need to turn. The second youngest expansion team, the BROWNS have been around since 1999 and they don't have a CLUE when they are going to get to where we are, buddy. That one playoff game they got was a fluke. We're doing great compared to other 3rd year franchises.

Glen

gcolby
12-13-2004, 01:20 PM
Let me just clarify my statement that I might stop supporting the Texans. I mean in terms of not renewing season tickets. I will always root for them through good and bad, but since the league has chosen to make the NFL more business than it is a sport by driving up ticket, merchandising and concession prices, it is at the point that I or anyone else would be foolish to continue paying them to take my money, when they deliver very little in return. I won't be the only one and it does not mean that I'm a bad fan because of it. I have an obligation to my self in terms of finances, not to the Texans or any of their fans. If I was to go to a steak house and get a bad meal only 1 time out of every 4 or 5 times I went there, it wouldn't be smart to keep going there. Why is it any different with the Texans and the NFL. If the prices were half of what they are now it would not be a problem, but they're not. The NFL is worried more about serving people with a lot of expendable income than they are football fans. I don't owe them or anyone else anything. But after the investment that I have made, I feel like they owe me more and have every right to express that.

Oh, I see. You boil it all down to getting the 'W's.

I'll keep paying my money, because the atmosphere on gameday is where a good chunk of 'the product' is at. The tailgating. The clean stadium. Throwing the football in a parking lot game of football with my kids. Bull Pen Pep Band. The Plaza. Scoring a gamepin from Verizon. And so on.

But that seems to mean nothing to you. Go to a cruddy, moldering 30-year-old stadium where they have the wins but cheap ownership, and you'll get those wins but your gameday experience suffers greatly.

gwallaia
12-13-2004, 01:25 PM
If the Titans win tonight Houston will be in last place once again.

Hate to disappoint you, but even if the Titans win tonight, they will still be in last place. We are 2-0 against Bud's tacks and have a better division record.

Harry Biped
12-13-2004, 01:27 PM
Keep in mind that you have to pay for your season tickets before the draft and free agent season. When you buy, you can only hope that the team will make the moves to get better. When I paid for my tickets last year, I had much higher expectations of the team. But by the beginning of the season it was painfully clear that they had made no real improvement. I figured that out quickly because I'm an educated fan with a strong football background, that goes to games to watch quality professional football, not just someone who goes there to have something to do on a Sunday afternoon. This season has been very difficult to endure because so many people are so willing to accept the mediocrity in exchange for having an NFL franchise. I want a winning NFL franchise not one that takes my money and time and delivers little in return. If that was the case why didn't we just keep the Oilers. I was a big fan of theirs as well. I was one of the few fans that went to their home games in their lame duck season before they moved, when that team started to improve. Those were some of the funnest games I ever attended because I didn't have to put up with the people who only pretended to care. I certainly got my money's worth then.

TexansTrueFan
12-13-2004, 01:29 PM
harry bi why dont ya just leave ya season tickets for some real fans, cause i'm sure plenty more people want season tickets. And its fans like you that make a team like the cardnials what it is today, all of us fans have a passion for this team and the game. If i'm alive in 40 yrs and the texans still havent been to the SB or play-offs thats ok, i still enjoy watching this team play every sunday ! and why dont ya go ahead and quit wasting space on the message board, nobody wants to hear you !

Chance_C
12-13-2004, 01:29 PM
As a charter season ticket holder and someone who has spent literaly thousands of dollars on the team, I feel like they have failed to provide a quality product for my investment. As things are right now, I can't see myself forking over the money to keep supporting a franchise that does not seem to be as committed to winning as they told us they were

That would make you "fair weather"

Harry Biped
12-13-2004, 01:47 PM
That would make you "fair weather"

You couldn't be more wrong. It's not the way they play that makes me want to give up my tickets. It's how much it costs me to see them play badly. Like I said before, if the tickets were reasonably priced, it wouldn't be an issue. But it is not reasonably priced and the product is less than acceptable at this point. For those of you who think that it is people like me that creates a bad team like the Cardinals, then you haven't got a clue. The reason that the Cardinals suck is because not enough of their fans call on them to improve. If they go to the games, they do it like so many that go to Texans games, just to have something to do. THAT makes you a bad fan and makes it harder for real fans to attend. At this point, the only thing I can do as a fan to express my displeasure of the product is to lodge a complaint and stop buying the product. That's how it works in the business world and they(the NFL) are the ones who made pro football a business. I have no obligation to any of you or the Texans to continue buying a bad product and right now, from a football stand point, that is what the Texans are. That position has nothing to do with whether I'm a good or bad fan. Nothing at all. Stop thinking that you are more of a fan of a team because you accept mediocrity, because that is a stupid and lazy ideal.

I NEVER said I would stop rooting for the Texans, they are my team and I will root for them until the day I die or until they move.

TexansTrueFan
12-13-2004, 02:10 PM
yes and i'm asking you, do you think that by NO fans going to the cardinals games does that make them a better team ??? When they can see noone expects them to win and they have no support i doubt that is much of a boost of confidence !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So you go ahead and give up ya season tickets, us STILL in the stands or at home wont notice your gone ! BYE !

Porky
12-13-2004, 02:32 PM
That would make you "fair weather"

I have to disagree with Chance here. A fair weather fan is someone who jumps on the bandwagon when things are going good, and hops off at the first sign of distress. If I understand Harry B's point, he is saying (I think) that everything a consumer buys has a value. If I perceive that the value I am receiving, is not equal to the money I am giving up, then it's not a good value, and I will stop buying that product or service. Some people, like myself, don't have an unlimited budget. I also think the tickets are over priced, along with the consessions, etc. I am excersising my consumer rights now by not buying a ticket. I haven't gone to one game, nor do I intend to. Does that make me a fair weather, or bad fan? No! It makes me a smart consumer. Blind consumerism without regard to how that effects the marketplace isn't very smart either imo, but I don't call you an ***** for buying a way over-priced brew at the stadium. I support Harry's position whole heartedly. It's his right as a consumer to define for himself whether the team is meeting it's value compared to the prices they charge.

gcolby
12-13-2004, 02:54 PM
Well then, let's keep going down this path.

Supply and demand drives market price. People waiting on the season ticket list signals the Texans front office that their high price is justified, considering that demand is out stripping supply.

Now if HB will kindly relinquish his season tickets, we can get one more name off of the waiting list. Demand will (marginally) decrease, and we'll be one step closer to the Texans having to lower their prices as demand has dwindled.

Lower prices being more in line with what HB is expecting, I would say the next move is his... :hmmm:

LenMan
12-13-2004, 02:56 PM
So you think anyone who is not happy with the way the Texans are are performing is not a true fan? I am way over here in Germany and not buying tickets to the games, but I am still mad as hell when the Texans lose. I have suffered throughout the years with all the Houston teams...and have on many ocassions bad-mouthed the teams only to come back the next season and pull for them. The Texans have not improved from their innaugural season, in that they still make turnovers at the worst times and give up the big plays. (Cliche') Good teams find a way to win and bad teams find a way to lose. So, they are in some closer games..but they are still losing. They have cut down on the sacks, however sacks are still allowed at the most crucial moments in a game. Drives are still being halted with penalties. It is all about the wins and losses. I don't want to hear about them being an expansion team, 3 years removed. If this team looks like this next year, there will be more Harry Bipeds complaining. And they will all be fans!! This fan is now pulling for a better position in next year's draft!

TheOgre
12-13-2004, 03:32 PM
I think we have the following chances of winning each game:

at Chicago 60%
at Jacksonville 35-40%
Cleveland 75% (that team has packed it in)

I expect us to go 7-9 and possibly 6-10.

Harry Biped
12-13-2004, 05:53 PM
Thanks Porky, you're absolutely right about what I was trying to say. Some on here would imply that because I have chosen the position that it is not a good value that makes me a bad fan, but that is not true. I have a closet full of Texans gear and have had season tickets since the day they went on sale. I've come to the conclusion, that in my current financial situation, with the Texans failing to deliver a quality product, my money would best be spent somewhere else. I don't know why those who don't understand that are so pompous as to think that they have a right to concern themselves with whether or not I retain my season tickets or should have the right to post on this website. It's not like they are the Texans welcoming committee anyway. It won't be long before the novelty of the games will wear off and those folks will stop caring about the Texans just like they did with the Oilers. I'll go on record once again and state that I am a huge Texans fan and it hurts me to see them not perform to the level that the organization is capable. If they don't make significant changes then I'll spend my money on the Astros and watch the Texans on TV.

bckey
12-13-2004, 11:00 PM
Let me get this straight: you picked them to get 5 or 6 wins, so they ARE performing to your expectations. What's your problem here?

We're dealing with a third year team that is dealing with turning that final corner that adolescent teams need to turn. The second youngest expansion team, the BROWNS have been around since 1999 and they don't have a CLUE when they are going to get to where we are, buddy. That one playoff game they got was a fluke. We're doing great compared to other 3rd year franchises.

Glen

No. Only compared to one. The Browns. And might I remind you who drafted that junk heap of a team they have, Chris Palmer. The Jags and Panthers were in the playoffs their 2nd year.

Wolf
12-13-2004, 11:47 PM
No. Only compared to one. The Browns. And might I remind you who drafted that junk heap of a team they have, Chris Palmer. The Jags and Panthers were in the playoffs their 2nd year.

in all fairness (to your hatred of Chris Palmer) he had a week or 2 to get his staff assembled before the draft... That is impossible.

Harry Biped
12-13-2004, 11:51 PM
The Texans had their staff in place an entire year before they made their 1st draft pick.

Wolf
12-13-2004, 11:53 PM
and teams didn't know the "ART" of free agency yet and how to keep their good players when Jacksonville and Carolina came in

gcolby
12-14-2004, 10:10 AM
Plus JAcksonville and Carolina loaded up on aging veterans. After the first two years, they cratered (Carolina) or put themselves into salary cap hell (Jags).

the wonger need food
12-14-2004, 10:48 AM
For keeping us out of last place for one more week!

TexansTrueFan
12-14-2004, 10:53 AM
:bguitar: :bguitar:

infantrycak
12-14-2004, 10:55 AM
For keeping us out of last place for one more week!

As someone pointed out above, even if TN had won last night, the Texans would not have been in last place since they beat TN head-to-head this year twice and have a better division record 3-2 v. 1-5.

Yankee_In_TX
12-14-2004, 10:57 AM
Ok, trying to get back on topic.

I've been a fan since the Dallas game in 02. I lived in Ohio, born and raised. No idea I was going to move to Texas.

I get sad when we lose on Sundays. I got to as many games as I can hoping every day for a win.

So yeah, I can see season ticket holders wanting to not pay that much for losing seasons.

On the flip side...

I HAVE seen marked improvment. We have the talent. We have the drive. We have the desire.

Being a young team, we often get too excited and fail to gel. And it's those games (or halves) where everything clicks, and we play like the team we should, that make me proud I'm a Texans fan.

So the question isn't what do we do in the draft, who do we blame, etc- it's how do we play Texans football all year long?

As for playoffs- we're a long term team. It might take us a bit longer than other expansion teams to get there, but we're not gonna' crash the year after.

My thoughts :-)
Proud to be a new member to the message board.

big sarge
12-14-2004, 11:12 AM
Hell I'll take a ticket, and I don't care if it is a game where they win or loose. I'm stuck at FT. Campbell,ky where all they show is the d a m n Tennesee Traitors loose close game(HE!HE!). Just like last season I'll will be in Iraq and miss the 2005 season, and not get to see my Texans beat the Titans or the Colts next year. My last sweet memory before this season was when the Texans beat the dreadful Steeler's 24-6 with only 47 yards of offense, and there are alot of Steeler fans in the Army. You can bet that I gave them hell.
1.GOD
2.Family
3.Country
4Texans!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Vinny
12-14-2004, 11:17 AM
Hey Big Sarge, I used to work in Clarksville (used to eat at some down home steakhouse up there in Ft Cambell all the time) and hooked up a lot of you guys with auto loans up there. You are certainly deep in Titanville.

TexansTrueFan
12-14-2004, 11:24 AM
Ok, trying to get back on topic.

I've been a fan since the Dallas game in 02. I lived in Ohio, born and raised. No idea I was going to move to Texas.

I get sad when we lose on Sundays. I got to as many games as I can hoping every day for a win.

So yeah, I can see season ticket holders wanting to not pay that much for losing seasons.

On the flip side...

I HAVE seen marked improvment. We have the talent. We have the drive. We have the desire.

Being a young team, we often get too excited and fail to gel. And it's those games (or halves) where everything clicks, and we play like the team we should, that make me proud I'm a Texans fan.

So the question isn't what do we do in the draft, who do we blame, etc- it's how do we play Texans football all year long?

As for playoffs- we're a long term team. It might take us a bit longer than other expansion teams to get there, but we're not gonna' crash the year after.

My thoughts :-)
Proud to be a new member to the message board.


well welcome to the message board, and as you can see there are some of us fans who look at the team as (glass half full, and some half empty) i say the glass is 3/4 full. And it wont be long to we're a force to be reckoned with !