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steelbtexan
05-06-2008, 10:56 PM
We have had more injuries than any team in the league.

He is the last hold over from the CC regime.

His body of work suggests that we need another strength & conditioning coach. IMO

infantrycak
05-07-2008, 08:59 AM
What strength and conditioning should Riley have had Dunta doing to keep his knee from being crushed by another player? What should have done to keep AJ from getting hyperextended on a hit over the middle? McKinney blowing a knee? Weary breaking a bone? Spencer's leg from breaking?

What injuries can you point to and say a different strength and conditioning program would have prevented them?

On the other hand, you have guys like Salaam saying Riley saved his career with his customized program.

HOU-TEX
05-07-2008, 09:00 AM
Dan Riley's the Alex Gibbs of stregth and conditioning. He's well known and respected around the league for what he does. If he were let go there'd be 31 other teams clammoring for him.

Dan Riley's not going anywhere until he choses to do so, IMO. :cool:

*edit: Dang ICak, what're the odds we'd post at the same time in a thread that's 10 hrs old. Weird, I tell ya

bah007
05-07-2008, 09:05 AM
Dan Riley is one of the top 3 S&C coaches in the history of the NFL (probably the best).

He has been in the NFL for over 25 years.

A S&C coach can prevent injuries to high school & college players, but this is the NFL. Every single one of those guys is a tremendous athlete, and most injuries in the NFL are fluke injuries that cannot be prevented.

D-ReK
05-07-2008, 09:15 AM
Dan Riley joined the Texans as the club’s first strength and conditioning coach on February 1, 2001. Riley enters his 26th year as a strength coach in the National Football League.

Prior to joining the Texans, Riley spent the previous 19 seasons in the same capacity with the Washington Redskins. He served as an integral part of three Super Bowl champions, four NFC champions, and five NFC East champions during his tenure.

Riley has authored four books on weight training. In addition, he wrote a physical fitness column for the Washington Post and also authored the “Power Line,” a monthly fitness column for Coach and Athletic Director magazine. Riley now authors the "Fitness Corner" column on HoustonTexans.com and co-hosts a weekly fitness and nutrition show on Houston's SportsRadio 610 with Texans team nutritionist Roberta Anding.

Prior to his stint with the Redskins, Riley spent five years as the strength coach at Penn State after serving four years as the strength coach at the United States Military Academy at West Point.

A native of Manchester, N.H., Riley graduated from Keene State College with an undergraduate degree in physical education. He has a master’s degree in physical education from Indiana University.

Riley and his wife Brenda have two sons – Marty, who works for Microsoft and lives in Redmond, Wash., and T, who lives in Houston and is employed at the St. John's School as a teacher, coach and assistant athletic director.

RILEY’S COACHING LEDGER
2001-07: Strength & Conditioning, Houston Texans
1982-00: Strength & Conditioning, Washington Redskins
1977-81: Strength & Conditioning, Penn State
1973-77: Strength & Conditioning, Military Academy

LINK (http://www.houstontexans.com/team/coach.asp?coach_id=5)

That's a mighty impressive resume.

Texan_Bill
05-07-2008, 09:26 AM
I know that Dan Riley is well respected around the league. I know that his resume is top notch, etc., etc... But quite honestly, I have questioned this before too..
Last two seasons, at least 17 people on I.R....? I think that speaks volumes, or at the very least deserves some discussion.

bigbrewster2000
05-07-2008, 09:58 AM
I know that Dan Riley is well respected around the league. I know that his resume is top notch, etc., etc... But quite honestly, I have questioned this before too..
Last two seasons, at least 17 people on I.R....? I think that speaks volumes, or at the very least deserves some discussion.

Not when most of the injuries have nothing to do with strength and conditioning.

Texan_Bill
05-07-2008, 10:04 AM
Not when most of the injuries have nothing to do with strength and conditioning.

Unless its a concussion, most injuries are related to strength and conditioning - be it a muscle pull, ligament tear, etc. And there has been more than enough to warrant discussion.

infantrycak
05-07-2008, 10:21 AM
Unless its a concussion, most injuries are related to strength and conditioning - be it a muscle pull, ligament tear, etc.

So Dunta having a 280 lb guy land on his leg in a direction it wouldn't bend is a strength and conditioning issue?

kravix
05-07-2008, 10:41 AM
A couple of those IR guys were stashed there last year. Brown, Brandon, Abatte.

Texan_Bill
05-07-2008, 11:04 AM
So Dunta having a 280 lb guy land on his leg in a direction it wouldn't bend is a strength and conditioning issue?

I don't discount freak injuries, or broken legs or arms, but look below. Some of those injuries might have been prevented with better stretching or lifting techniques - or maybe not.

Date Pos Player Injury Status
12/18/07 S Nick Ferguson Right knee IR
12/09/07 RB Ahman Green knee IR
12/04/07 C Chris White left knee IR
12/04/07 G Fred Weary broken right tibia IR
12/02/07 QB Matt Schaub dislocated left shoulder Day-to-Day
12/02/07 C Chris White left knee Day-to-Day
12/02/07 G Fred Weary broken right tibia Day-to-Day
11/08/07 CB Dunta Robinson right knee IR
11/04/07 CB Dunta Robinson right knee Day-to-Day
10/31/07 LB Shawn Barber neck IR
10/08/07 WR Jerome Mathis fibula IR
09/25/07 DT Cedric Killings neck IR
09/25/07 C Steve McKinney knee IR
09/23/07 C Steve McKinney sprained knee Day-to-Day
09/23/07 DT Cedric Killings neck Day-to-Day
09/11/07 S Jason Simmons left knee IR
09/02/07 S Brandon Harrison hamstring IR
09/02/07 S Will Demps elbow IR
08/24/07 T Kevin Barry biceps IR
08/17/07 CB Jason Horton broken arm IR
08/17/07 S Glenn Earl foot IR
09/21/06 T Charles Spencer Broken leg IR
09/17/06 T Charles Spencer Left leg


I see plenty of others on that list that at least warrants this discussion!!

Texan_Bill
05-07-2008, 11:07 AM
PS... There were about the same amount on that list following the 2006 season.

kravix
05-07-2008, 11:18 AM
Green
Weary
Schaub
Dunta
Barber
Mathis
Killings
McKinney
Demps
Horton
Earl
Spencer

That is 12 right there that no amount of str or conditioning can help.

Green- Deep tissue bruise on knee--

Weary- Break-- Could have fed him more milk i guess?

Schaub- Shoulders pop out especially when you are slammed to the ground the wrong way by someone that outwieghs you by 50+ lbs

Dunta- legs dont bend that way

Barber- Neck injuries arent something you can really strengthen against or want to take chances on.

Mathis- Leg fracture-- See Weary

McKinney- He had serious surgery after this. It is hard to strenthen a knee from moving when 300lb DL are falling on them.

Killings- He is lucky to be walking again.

Demps- His elbow was dislocated before he got here.

Horton- See Weary

Earl- Broken foot-- see Weary

Spencer- See Weary

Harrison- He was clearly stashed here.

D-ReK
05-07-2008, 11:19 AM
Green
Weary
Schaub
Dunta
Barber
Mathis
Killings
McKinney
Demps
Horton
Earl
Spencer

That is 12 right there that no amount of str or conditioning can help.

Green- Deep tissue bruise on knee--

Weary- Break-- Could have fed him more milk i guess?

Schaub- Shoulders pop out especially when you are slammed to the ground the wrong way by someone that outwieghs you by 50+ lbs

Dunta- legs dont bend that way

Barber- Neck injuries arent something you can really strengthen against or want to take chances on.

Mathis- Leg fracture-- See Weary

McKinney- He had serious surgery after this. It is hard to strenthen a knee from moving when 300lb DL are falling on them.

Killings- He is lucky to be walking again.

Demps- His elbow was dislocated before he got here.

Horton- See Weary

Earl- Broken foot-- see Weary

Spencer- See Weary

Harrison- He was clearly stashed here.

Don't forget that Ferguson wasn't even on our team last year.

Texan_Bill
05-07-2008, 11:23 AM
Green
Weary
Schaub
Dunta
Barber
Mathis
Killings
McKinney
Demps
Horton
Earl
Spencer

That is 12 right there that no amount of str or conditioning can help.

Green- Deep tissue bruise on knee--

Weary- Break-- Could have fed him more milk i guess?

Schaub- Shoulders pop out especially when you are slammed to the ground the wrong way by someone that outwieghs you by 50+ lbs

Dunta- legs dont bend that way

Barber- Neck injuries arent something you can really strengthen against or want to take chances on.

Mathis- Leg fracture-- See Weary

McKinney- He had serious surgery after this. It is hard to strenthen a knee from moving when 300lb DL are falling on them.

Killings- He is lucky to be walking again.

Demps- His elbow was dislocated before he got here.

Horton- See Weary

Earl- Broken foot-- see Weary

Spencer- See Weary

Harrison- He was clearly stashed here.

Look, I'm not going to argue with you about who and why.

34+ players in two seasons is more than enough to warrant the discussion in the same way it warrants a discussion about the field... errrrrrrr painted dirt (although most players have said the footing is fine). I beleive in bad luck, but this more than bad luck, this has been serious trend.

HOU-TEX
05-07-2008, 11:23 AM
For discussion sake. I deleted the "day to day" injuries that ended on the IR.

Date Pos Player Injury Status
12/18/07 S Nick Ferguson Right knee IR Not on the team
12/09/07 RB Ahman Green knee IR Bone bruise. IMO not S&C related
12/04/07 C Chris White left knee IR Torn ACL. Debatable
12/04/07 G Fred Weary broken right tibia IR Broken bone. IMO not S&C related
12/02/07 QB Matt Schaub dislocated left shoulder Day-to-Day IMO, he needs to get stronger anyways
11/08/07 CB Dunta Robinson right knee IR Torn everything. Brutal hit. IMO not S&C related
10/31/07 LB Shawn Barber neck IR Don't know about this. IMO, it was just to get him off the roster
10/08/07 WR Jerome Mathis fibula IR Don't know much about it. Weird injury I think. Not on team anymore
09/25/07 DT Cedric Killings neck IR Brutal hit. IMO not S&C related
09/25/07 C Steve McKinney knee IR Torn ACL. Debatable
09/11/07 S Jason Simmons left knee IR Forgot what was wrong. Debatable
09/02/07 S Brandon Harrison hamstring IR Debatable. IMO, he was there to save him for this season
09/02/07 S Will Demps elbow IR Pre-existing injury
08/24/07 T Kevin Barry biceps IR WTF is this guy?
08/17/07 CB Jason Horton broken arm IR WTF is this guy?
08/17/07 S Glenn Earl foot IR LisFranc (sp?) IMO not S&C related
09/21/06 T Charles Spencer Broken leg IR Ron Dayne, nuff said


It's debatable a torn ligament can be avoided by certain excercises/training, but IMHO, none of the injuries above appear to be related to S & C.:cool:

Texan_Bill
05-07-2008, 11:35 AM
For discussion sake. I deleted the "day to day" injuries that ended on the IR.



It's debatable a torn ligament can be avoided by certain excercises/training, but IMHO, none of the injuries above appear to be related to S & C.:cool:

Ah-ha!! The word debatable means that its a viable discussion...

That's all I did... Some folks in their zeal to 'prove themselves right' missed that point..

HOU-TEX
05-07-2008, 11:52 AM
Ah-ha!! The word debatable means that its a viable discussion...

That's all I did... Some folks in their zeal to 'prove themselves right' missed that point..

LOL! Well, the reason why I said it was debatable was because I've been told that a flat-footed person has a higher risk of knee joint problems than a person that is not. I heard this back in the late 80's early 90's from our trainer at SFA, so don't bash me if I'm incorrect.

Also, a person who has or does take steroids has a higher risk of joint injury.

I might be wrong, but I'm just going by what I was told back then.

Texan_Bill
05-07-2008, 11:56 AM
LOL! Well, the reason why I said it was debatable was because I've been told that a flat-footed person has a higher risk of knee joint problems than a person that is not. I heard this back in the late 80's early 90's from our trainer at SFA, so don't bash me if I'm incorrect.

Also, a person who has or does take steroids has a higher risk of joint injury.

I might be wrong, but I'm just going by what I was told back then.

I can attest to the flat-foot bad knee problem - first hand.

*********************************

It must be turning into a long off-season, when we get down to 'debating' the merits of a discussion!! :pirate:

HOU-TEX
05-07-2008, 12:07 PM
I can attest to the flat-foot bad knee problem - first hand.

*********************************

It must be turning into a long off-season, when we get down to 'debating' the merits of a discussion!! :pirate:

Too true Bill, Oh so true. It sucks! I hope we at least get some decent coverage of this weeks mini-camp. Then we can beat the shit out of that for the next month or so until there's something else to beat the shit out of. :wild:

Texan_Bill
05-07-2008, 12:12 PM
Too true Bill, Oh so true. It sucks! I hope we at least get some decent coverage of this weeks mini-camp. Then we can beat the shit out of that for the next month or so until there's something else to beat the shit out of. :wild:

There's always good fall back or fill in material..... see Tracie.

HOU-TEX
05-07-2008, 01:18 PM
There's always good fall back or fill in material..... see Tracie.

Truth be told, I get pissed just thinking about Teabag and the Rockets these days. Actually, the NBA pisses me off these days. I think the WNBA players play harder than NBA players at the sport. Buncha panzy ass windbags who've forgotten how to play the game the way it's supposed to be played. Of course the referees aren't helping either.

Long story short, the NBA in general isn't worth any sort of lengthy conversation on my part, much less Tracie McLady. :gun:

steelbtexan
05-07-2008, 01:28 PM
I'm thinhing we may need a new team chaplain, maybe he can talk to the man upstairs about all of the injuries.

In 06 DR & AJ wre hit with muscle related injuries.

I would like to know C-N-D's thoughts on our injury situation.

I was just thowing out a new topic for conversation.

Riley seems to have a good reputation.

kiwitexansfan
05-07-2008, 05:25 PM
I see the time in the offseason for the Dan Riley thread has arrived.

See you again next year.

Texans_Chick
05-07-2008, 09:34 PM
Dan Riley video (http://www.houstontexans.com/tv/index.asp?mm_file_id=2238&play_clip=Y)


I don't see a transcript of it.

Basically, he says that this year is only a little different in that assistant Ray Wright has them doing football specific drills earlier in the season and that they got a little bit more equipment.

He says that their program is different than some in that some programs have the players doing more plyometric stuff in the offseason. It's his belief that if you don't use a particular function you lose it, so his in-season program is the program.

I know in other talks I've heard him give, he talks about how he wants nothing in the weight program to possibly hurt the players. That, for example, he prefers them to do machine squats that do not compress the spine.

Overall, I don't think that I know enough about the program to say anything yay or nay about it. As has been said before, lots of the injuries have been flukey.

I do know that the most fit guy on the team is Andre Johnson, and from what I understand, he does a lot of plyometric stuff with the Miami people in his offseasons.

I also don't really understand Riley's belief as far as off-season/on-season as it relates to plyometrics. In the offseason, I would think you should be doing powerful movements that mimic football movements to get your body ready for the explosive activities you do in football. And once the season starts, you don't have to continue those plyometric movements because you are doing that through football actions--you just need to maintain strength.

In the video, they show someone doing very controlled strength exercises, which certainly make sense--it makes sure that you don't injure yourself cheating with heavier weights. I don't see how it prepares the body for the need for explosive strength.

And while I understand how your body needs to do things to preserve strength, I am a big believer in the muscle confusion priciple that weight lifters all know that if you do the same activities over and over again, even with increasing weight, you may not get as good results as doing a variety of strength training activities.

But even with the variety of weight equipment that they have, I would not be comfortable with the focus on weight training that only works on slow controlled movement. Strength is just one aspect of fitness and an important one for football obviously, but I don't see how what they are doing relates to explosive power and balance--which the focus of a lot of the plyometric training.

Early in the video, he seems to suggest that muscular strength is the basis of all the things you need to do to play football speed, power, burst etc. I think that might over simplify.

One thing that a more plyometric program risks for that many players is that they injure themselves while doing it. You have to have very good conditioning and not overdo and very good supervision--that can be hard with large groups of people training.

This is just thinking outloud and is not meant to be a criticism of Dan Riley's program because clearly we have only seen a snippet of it, and I have just heard generalized information about it from lectures. Clearly I don't have his exercise background but just have a personal interest in fitness issues. Just things to think about.

Texans_Chick
05-07-2008, 09:41 PM
Oh, and if you want to see the strength and conditioning manual they give to players, check out this pdf from the HT.com site (http://assets.houstontexans.com/assets/fanzone/Texans%20strength%20manual.pdf).

Page 39 says, they do not like plyometrics.

Texans_Chick
05-07-2008, 09:58 PM
Dan Riley is a HIT practitioner, and as such I do not believe in his program at all. The S&C field is so backwards, people keep their jobs because nobody knows better.

The fact is, HIT produces a high amount of injuries -- and what do you know, our team leads the league in them. You can try to justify the coincidence of the incidents, but the facts speak for themselves.

Your user name makes me laugh. I'm wondering if you are the person that I talked to about this subject before, because I once had an interesting conversation with someone who was cranky about the Riley way of doing things.

For thems who don't know HIT is weightlifting verbage for "High Intensity Training." Here is a brief wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_intensity_training).

Texans_Chick
05-07-2008, 10:16 PM
It's not a "Riley" way of doing things; its a "HIT" way of doing things -- and its outdated.

The Texans would do very well to hire Sal Alosi out from underneath the Falcons, or someone with a similar background as he.

And yes, I lost my username back in school so I had to recreate.

This is an old Texans story about Riley talking about HIT (http://www.houstontexans.com/fanzone/fitnesscorner12.asp), for thems who care.

Oh, and speaking of things related to your user name, I've spoke to at least one person who believes that the Texans instance on no supplementation other than whey protein (including legal supplements) puts them at a disadvantage relative to other teams.

I've always thought it was funny how the S&T folks for the Texans preach against water weight gain but that Kubiak wears a gray sweat shirt as a weight loss method.

(BTW, I am guessing you are not a small guy).

kiwitexansfan
05-07-2008, 11:18 PM
I find it fascinating he prefers machine based exercises to avoid injuries when it is well known that training on machines limits the recruitment of supporting muscles therefore making the body less prepared for real life situations where you are not moving in uniform paths of motion.

Thanks for the info T_C.

otisbean
05-08-2008, 07:35 AM
I am a strength and conditioning coach and I have to say I am not a big believer in what Riley does. Machine training is ridiculous. Machine squats not compressing the spine so they are safer - he should read Stuart McGill's material. McGill states it is easier to seriously hurt yourself on a leg press then by doing squats, additionally leg press does little to train hip extension which is the key element to power and speed. Saying you don't like plyometrics is like saying I don't like how the body works - ignorant. Sprinting is a plyometric activity, do you not like that either Riley? The only thing he has said that I would agree with is that strength is the foundation of athletic ability, it is a bit simplified but it is true. I can explain later if anyone is interested - I have to go to work.

HOU-TEX
05-08-2008, 08:52 AM
I am a strength and conditioning coach and I have to say I am not a big believer in what Riley does. Machine training is ridiculous. Machine squats not compressing the spine so they are safer - he should read Stuart McGill's material. McGill states it is easier to seriously hurt yourself on a leg press then by doing squats, additionally leg press does little to train hip extension which is the key element to power and speed. Saying you don't like plyometrics is like saying I don't like how the body works - ignorant. Sprinting is a plyometric activity, do you not like that either Riley? The only thing he has said that I would agree with is that strength is the foundation of athletic ability, it is a bit simplified but it is true. I can explain later if anyone is interested - I have to go to work.

I'm willing to listen. Heck, I consider myself old school when it comes to S & C. Of course my body really can't do any heavy lifting anymore, but I'm always willing to learn. This is a good subject to cuss and dicuss. Hit us back when you have time. :)

steelbtexan
05-08-2008, 09:41 AM
Thanks for the info

The proof is in the pudding

The only thing we have led the league in is injuries

Xetuoh1836
05-08-2008, 09:45 AM
I am a strength and conditioning coach and I have to say I am not a big believer in what Riley does. Machine training is ridiculous. Machine squats not compressing the spine so they are safer - he should read Stuart McGill's material. McGill states it is easier to seriously hurt yourself on a leg press then by doing squats, additionally leg press does little to train hip extension which is the key element to power and speed. Saying you don't like plyometrics is like saying I don't like how the body works - ignorant. Sprinting is a plyometric activity, do you not like that either Riley? The only thing he has said that I would agree with is that strength is the foundation of athletic ability, it is a bit simplified but it is true. I can explain later if anyone is interested - I have to go to work.

Any info or enlightenment, I'd appreciate!

Texans_Chick
05-08-2008, 11:40 AM
I am a strength and conditioning coach and I have to say I am not a big believer in what Riley does. Machine training is ridiculous. Machine squats not compressing the spine so they are safer - he should read Stuart McGill's material. McGill states it is easier to seriously hurt yourself on a leg press then by doing squats, additionally leg press does little to train hip extension which is the key element to power and speed. Saying you don't like plyometrics is like saying I don't like how the body works - ignorant. Sprinting is a plyometric activity, do you not like that either Riley? The only thing he has said that I would agree with is that strength is the foundation of athletic ability, it is a bit simplified but it is true. I can explain later if anyone is interested - I have to go to work.

You should read what is in the manual. It may be a little dated like a lot of stuff on the website because it still has Capers references in it.

He wants people to practice running, running in a specific way specific to what they do on the field. He believes practicing running fast gets you running fast--you can't really argue with that.

But basically, the program is running and lifting and some stretching. I don't think running and lifting alone is good preparation for football.

I think you can lift all you want but it may not make you football strong.

I believe in muscle specificity like he talks about--but you lift weights, it makes you good at lifting weights. Moving heavy things in action gets all that connective stuff working.

I've become a big believer in things that you do that improve balance and and muscles working in sports-oriented ways. Strength in movement.

I also believe in rest and active rest.

The concept of active rest reducing soreness I understand, but I'm not sure that maximal exersion on Mondays after games is the best idea I've heard. I would think that would get you wore down. It's when you are worn down that it is easier to get hurt.

RipTraxx
05-08-2008, 03:57 PM
The one thing i really focus on that i got from Riley (in my own workouts) is exploding to lift the weight. and then to SLOWLY let the wieght back down. You use the same muscles to to retract as you do to let the weight down.

Of course this was in my 'gym rat days"

otisbean
05-08-2008, 04:05 PM
Here are a couple of points:

I think you can lift all you want but it may not make you football strong

Strength is a big part of athletic ability but you are correct in that there is a big difference between weight room strength and what you see on the football field. The main difference is that there is no time constraint to force production in the weight room, meaning that all you have to do is lift the weight. No one gets a prize for the fastest lift, just the most weight lifted. On the football field it is all about how much force you can produce in a given amount of time. When a lineman fires out of the hole he has a couple of tenths of a sec to produce enough force to knock his guy back. If both the OLman and the DLman can both squat 500lbs in the weightroom, but on the field the OL can produce 350lbs of force before contact and the DL can only produce 300lbs - guess whose getting knocked on their butt? Hopefully that kind of explains "football"strength. In actuality it is power that is important to an athlete (which is basically the amount of force produced with in a certain amount of time).

Unfortunately I have to go back to work so I will address more later. Peace from sunny San Diego

RipTraxx
05-08-2008, 04:09 PM
Here are a couple of points:

I think you can lift all you want but it may not make you football strong

Strength is a big part of athletic ability but you are correct in that there is a big difference between weight room strength and what you see on the football field. The main difference is that there is no time constraint to force production in the weight room, meaning that all you have to do is lift the weight. No one gets a prize for the fastest lift, just the most weight lifted. On the football field it is all about how much force you can produce in a given amount of time. When a lineman fires out of the hole he has a couple of tenths of a sec to produce enough force to knock his guy back. If both the OLman and the DLman can both squat 500lbs in the weightroom, but on the field the OL can produce 350lbs of force before contact and the DL can only produce 300lbs - guess whose getting knocked on their butt? Hopefully that kind of explains "football"strength. In actuality it is power that is important to an athlete (which is basically the amount of force produced with in a certain amount of time).

Unfortunately I have to go back to work so I will address more later. Peace from sunny San Diego


Well said. Vernon Davis was an absolute MONSTER at the combine. 475 bench press. 600 squat 4.3/40? and NONE of it has transfered. Football/Functional strengh cant be done in weight room IMO.

HOU-TEX
05-08-2008, 04:14 PM
Well said. Vernon Davis was an absolute MONSTER at the combine. 475 bench press. 600 squat 4.3/40? and NONE of it has transfered. Football/Functional strengh cant be done in weight room IMO.

So was Mario. It was said he didn't have the "fast twitch" muscles to be a great DE though. :hides:

RipTraxx
05-08-2008, 04:16 PM
So was Mario. It was said he didn't have the "fast twitch" muscles to be a great DE though. :hides:

WHAT? i missed that at the combine. Im just not sure that his 35 reps of 225 are transfering to the feild. He almost seems a finesse instead of a bull rusher. Either way i love em LOL



Could be wrong.

D-ReK
05-08-2008, 04:22 PM
WHAT? i missed that at the combine. Im just not sure that his 35 reps of 225 are transfering to the feild. He almost seems a finesse instead of a bull rusher. Either way i love em LOL



Could be wrong.

Mario is far from a finesse rusher. He has been criticized at times for trying too hard to bull rush on every play and having a lack of pass rushing moves. This, of course, was the gripe before he started playing really well, in the last half of last season. Go back and watch him absolutely level Jahri Evans of the Saints and tell me that his strength doesn't transfer to the field.

RipTraxx
05-08-2008, 04:24 PM
Mario is far from a finesse rusher. He has been criticized at times for trying to hard to bull rush on every play and having a lack of pass rushing moves. This, of course, was the gripe before he started playing really well, in the last half of last season. Go back and watch him absolutely level Jahri Evans of the Saints and tell me that his strength doesn't transfer to the field.

Granted but theres only one problem Jahri Evans isnt good at ALL.

Texan_Bill
05-08-2008, 04:34 PM
...........I consider myself old school when it comes to S & C. Of course my body really can't do any heavy lifting anymore, but I'm always willing to learn.

HOU-TEX,

I consider myself old school too.. That's why the 'ol 16 o.z. curls always worked well for me....

http://beerinfood.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/beer_tramp.gif



Also, notice the stretching of the lower back...

BigTimeTexanFan
05-08-2008, 04:59 PM
Mario is far from a finesse rusher. He has been criticized at times for trying too hard to bull rush on every play and having a lack of pass rushing moves. This, of course, was the gripe before he started playing really well, in the last half of last season. Go back and watch him absolutely level Jahri Evans of the Saints and tell me that his strength doesn't transfer to the field.
I agree 100%. I remember opposing Olineman commenting on how strong he was. Up until the last half of last season he has relied heavily on his stength and athleticism.

D-ReK
05-08-2008, 05:08 PM
Granted but theres only one problem Jahri Evans isnt good at ALL.

Evans nailed down a starting spot at right guard in training camp, as the aggressive young lineman turned heads upon his arrival with his maturity, work ethic and physical play. He became a fixture in the lineup and opened all 16 regular-season games and both playoff contests. A left tackle in college, Evans immediately took over at right guard and made a seamless transition despite his inexperience. In a season where Saints’ rookies made headlines on a weekly basis with their outstanding play, Evans was the lone first-year player to start all 16 games, and his blocking was part of an offensive line that paved the way for the club’s No. 1-ranked offense to average 391.5 yards per contest. Polished in pass protection and rugged when opening holes for the rushing attack, Evans is expected to be part of the foundation of the unit for years to come.
LINK (http://www.neworleanssaints.com/Team/Roster/People/Jahri%20Evans.aspx)

I went back and watched about 5 games of Evans playing right guard for the Saints this year. He is just a great player; he displays excellent technique, great knee bend, uses his hands well, good balance and has a nasty punch out of his stance. If you watched the 2006 playoff game against the Eagles, most of Deuce McAllister's long runs were behind punishing Jahri Evans blocks. Deuce ran for 143 yards with a 6.8 yards per carry average and 1 TD. The 6 foot 4 inch, 318 pound Evans was probably the top prospect coming out of Division II for the 2006 NFL Draft, but still lasted until the 4th round. The Saints got quite a steal.
LINK (http://nfl-prospects.blogspot.com/2007/01/value-of-small-school-nfl-draft.html)

I'm sorry, but players that aren't good don't start every game on a team that makes it to their conference finals. Saints fans think this guy is one of the best up-and-coming OGs in the league, and Mario absolutely devastated him. Mario beat the RT, came around the edge, Evans tried to get underneath Williams, and Mario just blasted him. It was great.

otisbean
05-08-2008, 06:40 PM
Ok, few more things:
TC stated
I believe in muscle specificity like he talks about--but you lift weights, it makes you good at lifting weights. Moving heavy things in action gets all that connective stuff working.

This is one of the problems with lifting on machines. Muscles function in coordinated groups. If the machine stabilizes the load for you then obviously your stabilizers aren't working. We have all heard that you are only as strong as your weakest link, well if your stabilizers are weak then performance will be compromised.

Another big topic in fitness is your "core". One of the best ways to train your core is squats and deadlifts. When you have a load on your shoulders or in your hands and your legs are providing the force to lift the weight the core is very active to stabilize the body. This is definitely a functional way to train the core. The cores main role is as a stabilizer. Think about it if you are attempting to drive someone off the line and you have a weak midsection you will lose energy there and some of the force will be lost. If your core is strong and stiff then more of the force generated by the legs will be transferred to the opponent. All of this related to showing strength on the field. I would rather have an athlete deadlift 400lbs then leg press 1000. I can almost guarantee that if all else is equal my deadlifter will out perform the leg presser on the field.

TC stated
I've become a big believer in things that you do that improve balance and and muscles working in sports-oriented ways. Strength in movement.

If you want to improve strength in sports oriented ways then you better teach athletes to learn to absorb force. The body cannot produce more force then it can absorb. You ever notice that most athletes get injured when they are cutting or trying to quickly change direction? It is because forces were put on the body in such a way that tissues couldn't handle it and they tear. Teaching the body to decelerate is ultra important and guess what is one of the best ways to do this - plyometrics - the same ones Riley says he isn't crazy about.

Also, lifting with a slow controlled negative is not always the best way to train. Using exercises with a fast eccentric contraction and reversal can teach the body to absorb force thus helping prevent future injuries and improve sports performsnce. Of course it goes without saying that it must be performed properly, but when done properly it can devastatingly effective. It all goes back to a couple of comments I made earlier, the forces produced on the football all have some type of time constraint, meaning that everything happens quickly, both force absorption and force production. Your body has an instant to absorb the force of an oncoming tackler, or you have a fraction of a second to generate more force then the guy across from you to knock him back. There are some things you can do in the weightroom to help with this and some of the ways athletes train can actually hinder this. From what I have seen from Rileys stuff and admittedly I haven't seen all his material he may do more of the later. However, very few athletes at the professional level need much performance enhancement, unfortunately the ones that do probably aren't getting what they need. Could you imagine how effective Darius Walker could be if he could run a 4.4 forty!

HOU-TEX
05-09-2008, 11:27 AM
HOU-TEX,

I consider myself old school too.. That's why the 'ol 16 o.z. curls always worked well for me....

http://beerinfood.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/beer_tramp.gif



Also, notice the stretching of the lower back...

LOL! Yep, this is what I've been limited to as well. I tried arguing with the Doc, but he'd have none of it.

Is that "Special Brew" an import? LMAO!

Nice to see you've done something with your hair. Is that a fohawk? :spit:

Texan_Bill
05-09-2008, 11:32 AM
Damn the hair... I got me a beer and a smoke and that's all I need.

Yes, I scraped enough change together for an import... Carlsberg.

Damn the doctor too. He started giving me crap, so I didn't sign the check for the office visit. He eventually came around and told me what I wanted to hear so I signed it... *Little did he know it was someone else's check.*

Life is grand!!

HOU-TEX
05-09-2008, 11:41 AM
Damn the hair... I got me a beer and a smoke and that's all I need.

Yes, I scraped enough change together for an import... Carlsberg.

Damn the doctor too. He started giving me crap, so I didn't sign the check for the office visit. He eventually came around and told me what I wanted to hear so I signed it... *Little did he know it was someone else's check.*

Life is grand!!

You look awesome in that photo. Was it professionally done? Where was it taken? You look dressed a bit warm for Houston.

I might have to snag a 40oz OE on the way home today to keep up with your physique.

Texan_Bill
05-09-2008, 11:47 AM
It was shot professionally by Annie Leibovitz. I have another where I am merely draped in a sheet. It's too hot for the boards, so I have it framed at home. It was actually shot downtown, near my house - the Main Street Bridge. It was December so Annie wanted to catch the 'Essence' that is Texan_Bill..

Old English is swell, but it lacks the punch, carbs and calories of a Carlsberg Special Brew.

HOU-TEX
05-09-2008, 12:04 PM
It was shot professionally by Annie Leibovitz. I have another where I am merely draped in a sheet. It's too hot for the boards, so I have it framed at home. It was actually shot downtown, near my house - the Main Street Bridge. It was December so Annie wanted to catch the 'Essence' that is Texan_Bill..

Old English is swell, but it lacks the punch, carbs and calories of a Carlsberg Special Brew.

The photo is screaming 'The' Essence of TB.

Forward the TB in a sheet photo if you will. I'm looking at doing a photo shoot for a Biking team. If you notice this photo really doesn't truly show my Zeuslike physique..

http://bikehugger.com/images/blog/fatguyinspandex-1-01.jpg

sakebomb
05-09-2008, 12:20 PM
Maybe they should start taking Flintstone vitamins.

Texan_Bill
05-09-2008, 12:25 PM
The photo is screaming 'The' Essence of TB.

Forward the TB in a sheet photo if you will. I'm looking at doing a photo shoot for a Biking team. If you notice this photo really doesn't truly show my Zeuslike physique..

http://bikehugger.com/images/blog/fatguyinspandex-1-01.jpg

:spit:

I highly recommend Annie Leibovitz. She has techniques she uses that will capture your 'Zeuslike physique'. Quite amazing, really.

HOU-TEX
05-09-2008, 01:19 PM
:spit:

I highly recommend Annie Leibovitz. She has techniques she uses that will capture your 'Zeuslike physique'. Quite amazing, really.

LMAO! Man, we really know how to screw a thread up! :spit:

Maddict5
05-09-2008, 04:28 PM
just for the record, jahri evans is an excellent G... however i think its a case of misidentity as D-rek was possibly talking about the saints RT?

D-ReK
05-09-2008, 04:37 PM
just for the record, jahri evans is an excellent G... however i think its a case of misidentity as D-rek was possibly talking about the saints RT?

I could be wrong, but I could have swore that Mario beat the RT (Stinchcomb?) and then came around the edge and annihilated Evans before getting to Brees. I could be mistaken though. I tried finding video of it, but came up dry.

Maddict5
05-09-2008, 04:57 PM
nfl.com is great

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d8044a8e5

2 mins in.. it was stinchcomb (#78). jahri (#73) is stonewalling the DT