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View Full Version : Todd Mcshay says he'd take Chris Long over Mario!!!


TheRealJoker
04-10-2008, 02:58 PM
If both were in the same draft. His reasoning was Mario didn't have fast times coming out and Chris Long with a 4.75 40 is plenty fast for him. Does he not realize that Mario at around 290 ran a 4.6 40?

Typical ESPiN *****.

PS: Kiper said he'd take Mario...but still managed to mention Bush

chicagotexan2
04-10-2008, 03:02 PM
Well everyone knows that VY would have made a better than either of them. They didn't say that, but I but jerome soloman would.

Hervoyel
04-10-2008, 03:04 PM
If both were in the same draft. His reasoning was Mario didn't have fast times coming out and Chris Long with a 4.75 40 is plenty fast for him. Does he not realize that Mario at around 290 ran a 4.6 40?

Typical ESPiN *****.

PS: Kiper said he'd take Mario...but still managed to mention Bush

Good! I hope he keeps saying it until the draft and then it's picked up by sport wonks all over the country. I hope people are asking Mario about it before the season opener and every time Long gets a sack or has a good game somebody brings it up in the Texans locker room.

Mario plays really hard when he's pissed off. You tell em' Todd!

Double Barrel
04-10-2008, 03:12 PM
If any of these 'experts' were so smart, they'd be working for an NFL team instead of just talking about NFL teams.

DiehardChris
04-10-2008, 03:16 PM
Heh, let the haters keep on keepin' on. Meanwhile, Mario is working out, getting stronger and faster, and getting ready to sniff 20 sacks next season.

If I was ever going to buy a jersey, I would very loudly, very proudly wear Mario's.

RipTraxx
04-10-2008, 03:20 PM
If any of these 'experts' were so smart, they'd be working for an NFL team instead of just talking about NFL teams.

Nicely said.

Polo
04-10-2008, 03:24 PM
David Carr didn't want Mario either.

badboy
04-10-2008, 03:28 PM
I want to send Mario a jersey that says "psst Mario, I think he called you a girl". 30 sacks guaranteed.

RipTraxx
04-10-2008, 03:32 PM
I want to send Mario a jersey that says "psst Mario, I think he called you a girl". 30 sacks guaranteed.

LOL GAAAATTTTOOORRAAAAADDEEEE

Errant Hothy
04-10-2008, 03:35 PM
Couldn't we just bash up his ride and spray paint "Go Titans" on it?

badboy
04-10-2008, 03:43 PM
Couldn't we just bash up his ride and spray paint "Go Titans" on it?
Nah, he'd probably think Chester Pitts took it for a ride.

Second Honeymoon
04-10-2008, 03:45 PM
If any of these 'experts' were so smart, they'd be working for an NFL team instead of just talking about NFL teams.

ding ding ding ding...we have a winner

Silver Oak
04-10-2008, 04:00 PM
let's look at the bright side...at least they're using Mario in a favorable comparison instead of something more negative.

:texflag:

huckdabuck
04-10-2008, 04:20 PM
LOL GAAAATTTTOOORRAAAAADDEEEE

H 2 O

rush2112mn
04-10-2008, 04:50 PM
:spit: Kiper can't mention Mario without mentioning the name Bush as well. Jake Long is no Mario....Like to see how good Jake Long would do if he had the same injury as Mario had his first year in the NFL. Mario is just going to keep getting better and better......

TEXANRED
04-10-2008, 05:03 PM
Good! I hope he keeps saying it until the draft and then it's picked up by sport wonks all over the country. I hope people are asking Mario about it before the season opener and every time Long gets a sack or has a good game somebody brings it up in the Texans locker room.

Mario plays really hard when he's pissed off. You tell em' Todd!

That would be great, the same D.A.'s that call sports 610 now screaming about how we didnt draft Peterson can now call and scream about how we didn't draft Long.

bah007
04-10-2008, 06:29 PM
I'm surprised that McShay was able to finish a segment without mentioning how Matt Ryan is the best QB he has ever seen.

nunusguy
04-10-2008, 06:33 PM
PS: Kiper said he'd take Mario...but still managed to mention Bush
You don't mean that Kiper said he still thinks the Texans should have taken Bush ?

TheRealJoker
04-10-2008, 07:17 PM
You don't mean that Kiper said he still thinks the Texans should have taken Bush ?

Kiper always says that when mentioning Mario. Reggie got the Saints to the NFC championship after all...

Grid
04-10-2008, 07:35 PM
if by "got the Saints to the NFC championship" you mean "Happened to be a saint the year that they got to the NFC championship"..you are absolutely correct.

TheRealJoker
04-10-2008, 07:37 PM
if by "got the Saints to the NFC championship" you mean "Happened to be a saint the year that they got to the NFC championship"..you are absolutely correct.

Tell that to Kiper, he's never wrong you know!!!

mexican_texan
04-10-2008, 07:44 PM
If any of these 'experts' were so smart, they'd be working for an NFL team instead of just talking about NFL teams.
It's comments that those that bring more attention to ESPN, especially the website. There's no such thing as journalistic integrity on TV, just about everything they do is done for ratings.

On another note, the NFL Network isn't as good as it used to be. I used to watch it every day for hours, but now I'll only watch one show if that.

281
04-10-2008, 07:48 PM
chris long is gonna be a helluva pro... he has the potential to be as good or better than mario. we'll find out soon enough, though. there's nothing wrong with mcshay's opinion.

edo783
04-10-2008, 07:52 PM
On another note, the NFL Network isn't as good as it used to be. I used to watch it every day for hours, but now I'll only watch one show if that.

I agree. My problem with NFLN is they repeat so much stuff. I know it's hard to have new fresh stuff all the time, but they repeat the same stuff 20 times a day it seems.

Trap_Star
04-10-2008, 08:14 PM
Kiper still thinks Indy shoulda taken Leaf instead...:rolleyes:

TheRealJoker
04-10-2008, 08:24 PM
chris long is gonna be a helluva pro... he has the potential to be as good or better than mario. we'll find out soon enough, though. there's nothing wrong with mcshay's opinion.

Except for the fact he was wrong when saying that Mario ran some slow times (even though he ran 4.6) and then immediately following that up by saying Chris Long's 4.75 40 is plenty fast for him (despite the fact he ran slower than Mario despite being smaller).

BigBull17
04-10-2008, 09:28 PM
Except for the fact he was wrong when saying that Mario ran some slow times (even though he ran 4.6) and then immediately following that up by saying Chris Long's 4.75 40 is plenty fast for him (despite the fact he ran slower than Mario despite being smaller).

Thats what gets me, Long doesnt even truly have a position in the NFL. Hes kind of a tweener, to small for end, to slow for OLB. Im not saying he isnt a player, but he is a pretty big risk.

gtexan02
04-10-2008, 10:43 PM
I don't see all the fuss. Chris Long is going to be the penultimate pro player. I've never seen a college player play as hard as Chris week in week out. His motor never stops. If they were both in the draft, of course I'd pick Mario because he is already a 10+ sack NFL player. ButI think both are very good

TheRealJoker
04-10-2008, 10:54 PM
I don't see all the fuss. Chris Long is going to be the penultimate pro player. I've never seen a college player play as hard as Chris week in week out. His motor never stops. If they were both in the draft, of course I'd pick Mario because he is already a 10+ sack NFL player. ButI think both are very good

Did you not read my post? Mcshay's reasoning for the pick mentioned none of these points. It was the speed difference which is an outright lie.

PHAROAH
04-11-2008, 01:30 AM
chris long is gonna be a helluva pro... he has the potential to be as good or better than mario. we'll find out soon enough, though. there's nothing wrong with mcshay's opinion.If that is true in what your saying then why are the Dolphins negotiating with Jake Long & Vernon Gholston? I like Chris Long but to be the overall #1 pick no way and Mario williams is a beast I would take Mario all day long over Chris Long.

cuppacoffee
04-11-2008, 10:45 AM
chris long is gonna be a helluva pro... he has the potential to be as good or better than mario. we'll find out soon enough, though. there's nothing wrong with mcshay's opinion.


Momma...I told you to wait out in the truck.

Signed..Chris

Ole Miss Texan
04-11-2008, 11:33 AM
I think Chris Long should be a solid player in the NFL. I doubt he gets a lot of sacks but I think he'll just be an all around solid player that any team would love to have on the field and in the locker room.

Mario Williams is a guy that just has an ungodly amount of upside (going into the nfl). His ceiling is much higher than Chris' is, imo. I do think Chris is a 'safer' pick (higher floor), but we have the advantage of seeing Mario after 2 seasons in the NFL and can see he's developing quite nicely.

I think it also probably depends on what the team needs are and what schemes they may run as to who may be a better fit, but who knows.

All in all if we had to do the 2006 Draft over again and had to choose from Mario Williams, Reggie Bush, Vince Young, and Chris Long (if he was a senior then).... I'd choose Mario Williams.

nunusguy
04-11-2008, 11:44 AM
chris long is gonna be a helluva pro... he has the potential to be as good or better than mario. we'll find out soon enough, though. there's nothing wrong with mcshay's opinion.
Chris Long & Mario both turned 23 earlier this year, so they are the same age yet Mario has 2 years in the league, and has firmly established himself as one of the best young DLineman in the leauge, yet we don't really know how good Long will be ? Mario can play any position in the DLine of a 4-3 or 3-4, while Long does not have that kind of versatility. He's about 20 pounds heavier, with much better length (height and arms), and is more athletic. No brianer, Mario hands down. Actually I don't think Long is even the best DE in this Draft, that would be Vernon Gholston.

Lucky
04-11-2008, 11:56 AM
WWTD? Bill Parcells has said that if he had the 1st pick in the 2006 draft, he would have selected Mario Williams. There's no doubt in my mind that he'd choose Williams over Long if both were coming out of the same draft. That's not a knock on Long, who is a top 10 prospect in any draft. Just that Mario is one of the top two defensive line prospects over the past 10 years.

Has Todd McShay ever gotten anything right? Seriously.

Double Barrel
04-11-2008, 12:44 PM
On another note, the NFL Network isn't as good as it used to be. I used to watch it every day for hours, but now I'll only watch one show if that.

I agree. My problem with NFLN is they repeat so much stuff. I know it's hard to have new fresh stuff all the time, but they repeat the same stuff 20 times a day it seems.

But, you'd have to admit, The Network does make the off-season a little less lonely. The time between Super Bowl and the draft always seems like forever, but with NFLN, I can still get my football fix when I need it.

They do repeat a lot of stuff, but it's the slow news time of year for them. I bet it picks up after the draft and we get closer to camps.

beerlover
04-11-2008, 12:52 PM
WWTD? Bill Parcells has said that if he had the 1st pick in the 2006 draft, he would have selected Mario Williams. There's no doubt in my mind that he'd choose Williams over Long if both were coming out of the same draft. That's not a knock on Long, who is a top 10 prospect in any draft. Just that Mario is one of the top two defensive line prospects over the past 10 years.

Has Todd McShay ever gotten anything right? Seriously.

Just Say No, disregard/boycott Todd McShay period :mario2:

bah007
04-11-2008, 01:05 PM
Has Todd McShay ever gotten anything right? Seriously.

Not on his own.

Most of his "stuff" is stolen from Kiper & Mayock anyway.

Hooston Texan
04-11-2008, 01:19 PM
Put Chris Long's motor in Mario's chassis and you would have one ungodly machine. Throw in a little anti-social nastiness (they're both very nice kids), and you'd have the ultimate defensive player.

Still, I have to think that Mario would be the choice over Long. You can theoretically train someone to go all-out, all the time, but you can't train someone to have Mario's size and athleticism.

That said, I would be surprised if the Dolphins pick someone other than Chris Long at #1. He's got the bloodlines and is a natural leader. He was groomed by one of Parcells' own lieutenants. His ability to bring it every down is off the charts. And his name is never going to show up on a police blotter.

edo783
04-11-2008, 01:29 PM
But, you'd have to admit, The Network does make the off-season a little less lonely. The time between Super Bowl and the draft always seems like forever, but with NFLN, I can still get my football fix when I need it..


Yup, it's kind of like Methadone for Heroin addicts. Not the real deal, but takes the edge off. The worst day with some NFL is better than the best day without any.

aj.
04-11-2008, 06:26 PM
Total Access is a staple at my house. It's the hour of NFL-N I dont miss every evening at 6. Schefter usually breaks stuff. Lombardi just presented an interesting scenario just now about McFadden falling to the Bengals, citing seven premium OLs and DLs going in the top ten being the better investment of multi-millions, the short shelf life on RBs, and using Reggie Bush as an example of all boots no cattle - followed by debate with Eisen and Faulk.

Faulk is right there with Emmitt in his dullness though. Yesterday he said (during a discussion of OLs) that there's "a lot of Walter Jones' out there" in the context of some team taking either a CB or RB high in the first and waiting on an OL for later. Yeahright....

Between NFLTA, Florio's site, and redzone or Sportspages that's about all you need to stay up with what's going on.

I honestly don't know who Todd McShay is, so I guess I'm not missing much. But I don't understand why it would upset people for someone to say that Chris Long might be really really good. Long is going to be a top five pick and in the right situation he could make a major impact in his rookie season.....

The look on the Dolphins fans faces (not to mention Quinn) when Goodell said the name 'Ted Ginn' is as priceless as any Jets fan draft day meltdown...

bah007
04-11-2008, 07:07 PM
Total Access is a staple at my house. It's the hour of NFL-N I dont miss every evening at 6. Schefter usually breaks stuff. Lombardi just presented an interesting scenario just now about McFadden falling to the Bengals, citing seven premium OLs and DLs going in the top ten being the better investment of multi-millions, the short shelf life on RBs, and using Reggie Bush as an example of all boots no cattle - followed by debate with Eisen and Faulk.

Faulk is right there with Emmitt in his dullness though. Yesterday he said (during a discussion of OLs) that there's "a lot of Walter Jones' out there" in the context of some team taking either a CB or RB high in the first and waiting on an OL for later. Yeahright....

Between NFLTA, Florio's site, and redzone or Sportspages that's about all you need to stay up with what's going on.

I honestly don't know who Todd McShay is, so I guess I'm not missing much. But I don't understand why it would upset people for someone to say that Chris Long might be really really good. Long is going to be a top five pick and in the right situation he could make a major impact in his rookie season.....

The look on the Dolphins fans faces (not to mention Quinn) when Goodell said the name 'Ted Ginn' is as priceless as any Jets fan draft day meltdown...

I think that everybody that has posted in this thread agrees that Long will be a really good pro.

The problem I have is that McShay told an outright lie about Long being faster than Mario. You would think that with all the resources that ESPN has at their disposal, they could just look into that before saying it on live TV.

To me, it goes back to the whole thing where the Texans just dont matter to the national media, so they dont care whether they're doing us justice or not.

aj.
04-11-2008, 07:15 PM
To me, it goes back to the whole thing where the Texans just dont matter to the national media, so they dont care whether they're doing us justice or not.

What the national media thinks is not something high on my care radar (whether it's good think or bad think). Maybe it's just me but I don't get too spun up about the whole disrespect thing. The national media is like the flag I'm looking at right now. Yesterday it was blowing out of the south. Today out of the north. I care about the Texans W/L record. The rest takes care of itself.

I care more about our local coverage (or lack of) because there's a friggin gold mine of information over at Reliant Park that doesn't get reported/featured as it should.

Texaninlild
04-11-2008, 07:19 PM
Well everyone knows that VY would have made a better than either of them. They didn't say that, but I but jerome soloman would.

Yeah..you just keep smoking that orange stuff out of Austin.

nunusguy
04-11-2008, 07:25 PM
I care more about our local coverage (or lack of) because there's a friggin gold mine of information over at Reliant Park that doesn't get reported/featured as it should.
Why don't you do something about that AJ ? Step up and give us that info !

aj.
04-11-2008, 07:39 PM
Why don't you do something about that AJ ?
Because I don't have a media credential. But I have seen what's behind the curtain many times over the past several years. No need to re-hash how poor our local print media coverage is.

Kaiser Toro
04-11-2008, 07:58 PM
Because I don't have a media credential. But I have seen what's behind the curtain many times over the past several years. No need to re-hash how poor our local print media coverage is.

I used to get media credentials even after I had gotten out of basketball for two years, regardless of market. You know the biz, you know this town and you know football inside and out....there has got to be a way.

This community is not huge, but TexansTalk (you are a contributing member here) does pull second rank on Google on a Houston Texans web search and as our team scales, then good coverage needs to scale with it.

Unfortunately, there are not that many people who care about the Texans, locally in the media, to drive the national media.

CloakNNNdagger
04-11-2008, 08:01 PM
Credentials or no credentials, AJ is one of those that one can trust to relate information that is “straight” and unfettered.......... when available to him.

aj.
04-11-2008, 08:43 PM
...there has got to be a way.



Precedent says not.

I'll spare you the copious and gory details.

ubecool454
04-11-2008, 09:14 PM
Heh, let the haters keep on keepin' on. Meanwhile, Mario is working out, getting stronger and faster, and getting ready to sniff 20 sacks next season.

If I was ever going to buy a jersey, I would very loudly, very proudly wear Mario's.

Chris, answer me honestly. Were you for the Mario pick 2 years ago or were you for Reggie or Vince? Just asking.

ubecool454
04-11-2008, 10:15 PM
chris long is gonna be a helluva pro... he has the potential to be as good or better than mario. we'll find out soon enough, though. there's nothing wrong with mcshay's opinion.

Chris Long at DE? Isn't this guy kind of a tweener? I really don't think he is even the best DE in the draft. I think he gets a lot more play than he deserves because of his HOF dad. I don't like his chances at DE because out of 64 starting DEs in the NFL last year 12 were lightskinned guys. Talk to me about Long when he reaches the status of say...Kampman, Kearney, Jared Allen or Vandenbosch. Right now I', putting money on him to be another Jason Babin.

Joe Texan
04-11-2008, 10:35 PM
I would certianly vote to get AJ a press credential.

281
04-12-2008, 01:21 AM
I honestly don't know who Todd McShay is, so I guess I'm not missing much. But I don't understand why it would upset people for someone to say that Chris Long might be really really good. Long is going to be a top five pick and in the right situation he could make a major impact in his rookie season.....

yeah, that. jeez you guys, stop being such freakin homers... i love mario, but i think chris long is gonna be a good one too. just wait and see. who'll be better? i really don't know at this point, and neither do any of you.

281
04-12-2008, 01:28 AM
Except for the fact he was wrong when saying that Mario ran some slow times (even though he ran 4.6) and then immediately following that up by saying Chris Long's 4.75 40 is plenty fast for him (despite the fact he ran slower than Mario despite being smaller).

fair enough. i'm simply saying, chris long is gonna be good one. just my opinion. i could care less about 40 times... ESPN gets things like that wrong all the time, we know... move on.

Goldensilence
04-12-2008, 09:57 AM
I think a lot of people see the name behind Chris Long, great bloodline, great motor guy, great character with good measureables. I'm just wondering how much of the national attention he gets is because of the name behind him. Guy hasn't taken a snap in the NFL either so it's kind of unfair to say anything yet. I'd feel comfortable with people saying his game translates to X player.

I think for people like Todd McShay the way that now famous draft has gone down two years later Mario has come back to bite them big time. Honestly a DE is measured by sacks and pressure. Last year Mario ended third in the NFL. By similar comparisons the measures for Running backs and QBs neither Vince or Bush have done anything remotely similar. They might be able to say Vince has gotten the Titans to back to back playoff births but looking at his play and stats this year it becomes evident that.... well he might've contributed but the defense and running game pulled that team. Soon as Deuce went down Reggie's along with the Saints season was doomed. Payton might be behooved to look at game tapes of Dave Meggett.

I hope articles like these keep trickling in and they make their way to Mario's locker with push pins or tape. Would love to see us take a flyer on Blake from TCU in the 4th or 5th. Weaver might be healthy this year but I expect him to have one foot half way out the door this year(barring some miraculous season).

Lucky
04-12-2008, 10:30 AM
I think a lot of people see the name behind Chris Long, great bloodline, great motor guy, great character with good measureables. I'm just wondering how much of the national attention he gets is because of the name behind him. Guy hasn't taken a snap in the NFL either so it's kind of unfair to say anything yet. I'd feel comfortable with people saying his game translates to X player.
I'd say Long compares with the Titans' Kyle Vanden Bosch. Good size, speed, and tremendous effort. Long didn't put up sack numbers until his senior year, but you have to remember that he played DE in a 3-4 defense. It's more difficult for a DE to get to the edge in that defense, and much easier for him to be double teamed. Long is too small to play a 3-4 DE at the pro level, which is why some 3-4 teams have worked him as a OLB. But really, Long is a 4-3 DE who has the skills to play either side.

They might be able to say Vince has gotten the Titans to back to back playoff births...
They could say it, but they would be wrong. The Titans didn't make the playoffs in Young's rookie season.

Goldensilence
04-12-2008, 10:41 AM
I'd say Long compares with the Titans' Kyle Vanden Bosch. Good size, speed, and tremendous effort. Long didn't put up sack numbers until his senior year, but you have to remember that he played DE in a 3-4 defense. It's more difficult for a DE to get to the edge in that defense, and much easier for him to be double teamed. Long is too small to play a 3-4 DE at the pro level, which is why some 3-4 teams have worked him as a OLB. But really, Long is a 4-3 DE who has the skills to play either side.


They could say it, but they would be wrong. The Titans didn't make the playoffs in Young's rookie season.

Thanks for the comparison and yep i did boot that last statement. I should've said winning seasons.

Wolf
04-12-2008, 10:52 AM
What ESPiN does to the viewers

http://www.pubhousedialogues.com/media/blogs/curmudgeon/obi-wan-mind-trick.jpg

ObsiWan
04-12-2008, 11:57 AM
what's the big deal?

the fact that Mario was the comparison benchmark - instead of Gaines Adams or Jared Allen or someone else - speaks volumes of grudging respect. But you guys are totally ignoring that fact. By using Mario for comparison to the "best" lineman in this draft, Long, they're admitting they were wrong in '06.

At least, that's the way I see it.

b0ng
04-12-2008, 01:20 PM
what's the big deal?

the fact that Mario was the comparison benchmark - instead of Gaines Adams or Jared Allen or someone else - speaks volumes of grudging respect. But you guys are totally ignoring that fact. By using Mario for comparison to the "best" lineman in this draft, Long, they're admitting they were wrong in '06.

At least, that's the way I see it.

I'm pretty sure they just said "Mario Williams" because he was the last big name DE drafted really high (Gaines Adams did not have Mario Williams style hype).

All in all, I think that Mario and Chris are probably going to end up competing against each other for the title of "Sack King" in just a few years, but that's just because I think Long is a guy that has a lot of the skills you can't really teach (Heart, guts, motor).

nunusguy
04-12-2008, 02:20 PM
Long didn't put up sack numbers until his senior year, but you have to remember that he played DE in a 3-4 defense. It's more difficult for a DE to get to the edge in that defense, and much easier for him to be double teamed.
As I said earlier in this thread, my vote definitely goes to Mario anyway, but this is a good point about Long and really a testimony to his ability as a pass rusher since he was able to compile an impressive sack total (12, 13, whatever in '07 ?), from a defensive scheme that isn't the most advantagous for a pass-rushing DE to play from.

ATXtexanfan
04-12-2008, 05:34 PM
what's the big deal?

the fact that Mario was the comparison benchmark - instead of Gaines Adams or Jared Allen or someone else - speaks volumes of grudging respect. But you guys are totally ignoring that fact. By using Mario for comparison to the "best" lineman in this draft, Long, they're admitting they were wrong in '06.

At least, that's the way I see it.

nice post, funny thing about mcshay is that i haven't seen him say anything that i didn't already know, i guess we browse the same websites. how ever his 40 times were wrong on one of the most contoversial picks ever. it makes him look like a dumbass. we were victims of a workout warrior, remember, mario didn't do crap in college but posted obscene workout numbers