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badboy
01-14-2008, 10:57 AM
C:\Documents and Settings\debtuser.SERVER\Desktop\Re Texans cap.htm

There has been discussion about how the Texans may choose to extend Williams' contract by offering a $12million bonus. Most comments I've seen indicate that the entire amount would be subtracted from 2008 salary cap leaving only approximately $21- 23 million cap space to sign our FA, any new FA and our draft picks. The link above reflects my interaction with Keith Weiland who writes for houstonprofootball.com and has the most interesting cap page each year for Texans.

I think the exchange offers a clearer understanding of what $ may be available and how Mario's new contract may effect the cap. I think it is entirely possible for the Texans to sign FAs that should plug some holes for us.

Corrosion
01-14-2008, 11:44 AM
That link wont open for me

Dallas_Texan
01-14-2008, 11:54 AM
That link still isn't opening.

badboy
01-14-2008, 12:23 PM
That link still isn't opening.Sorry, my day went nuts and i did not have time to check the link. Will fix ASAP as it is helpful info. Again my apologies.

PapaL
01-14-2008, 12:35 PM
You can't link something from your computer.

badboy
01-14-2008, 01:41 PM
From: Keith [keith@houstonprofootball.com]
Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2008 5:35 PM
To: smeloy@hospitalsolutionsinc.com
Subject: Re: Texans cap

So, yeah, the option bonus is typically spread evenly over the remaining years of the contract from when it is exercised. The team I think has the choice of eating the entire option bonus on the current year's cap, but that is a pretty unusual decision for a team to make. I seem to recall it coming up a few years ago with Michael Vick... I think the Falcons for some reason to an unusually long time to decide to prorate some bonus Vick earned.

To your second question, the base salaries are typically lower in the first couple years of a big multi-year deal, partly because the player is satisfied with pocketing the bonus check that first year (bonuses are prorated for cap purposes, but unless specified to be paid in installments, most bonus checks are paid shortly after the contract is signed). The base salaries just have to at least be at the vet minimum based on the # of seasons played for each year of the contract. And yeah, there is apparently an increasing trend in agents negotiating some or all of the base amounts as guaranteed, particularly for 1st round picks lately. You have calculated your Briggs example below correctly as I understand the rules.

FYI - The Falcons came up with a 'salary cap 101' for fans a couple years ago, and it covers a lot of the stuff that comes up in the offseason - bonuses, dead money, rookie pool, etc. http://www.atlantafalcons.com/People/Fans/Salary_Cap_101.aspx It's a handy reference from time to time.

Keith



----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Meloy
To: keith@houstonprofootball.com
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 1:33 PM
Subject: Texans cap


Keith, first let me thank you for your work on the cap page. I refer the web site and your page several times a week to others. Confusion exist over the Mario Williams option of offering a bonus to extend his contract & lower the base years. Many fans take that to mean the $12million bonus should be subtracted from the estimate available under 2008 projected cap. $35 - $12= apprx. $22 million total cap space. I think this is wrong as bonus should be spread over the contract years left. Which is correct? Also, canít a contract be set to optional amounts in base years agreeable to team and player? I think Nate Clemments contract was done that way. Example: $40 million Lance Briggs OLB for 5 years. $15m bonus with first year base salary of $1m. 2008 cap hit $3m bonus + $1m base = $4m cap for first year. Remaining years would be bonus + negotiated amounts for each year. My offer would guarantee all money. Appreciate your input.


Steve Meloy

Disclaimer: This electronic message may contain information that is Confidential or legally privileged. It is intended only for the use of the individual(s) and entity named in the message. If you are not an intended recipient of this message, please notify the sender immediately and delete the material from your computer. Do not deliver, distribute or copy this message and do not disclose its contents or take any action in reliance on the information it contains.

badboy
01-14-2008, 01:42 PM
Here is the emails I referred to in prior thread. Hope you find it interesting.

Dallas_Texan
01-14-2008, 05:11 PM
Here is the emails I referred to in prior thread. Hope you find it interesting.

So that means we could have a lot more than 22MM in Cap room? I love it!

Hottoddie
01-14-2008, 08:20 PM
So that means we could have a lot more than 22MM in Cap room? I love it!

That's what I've been trying to say.

Leahmic223
01-15-2008, 01:39 AM
I'm really starting to beleive we should go after Jared Allen...

I know I know our Dline already has tons invested in it...but look at the Giants. They have been harrassing QBs all in the post season thus far and despite having a rag tag secondary it really has worked.

If our Dline consisted of Mario, Okoye, TJ, and Allen...I think QBs of opposing teams would have nightmares of those guys before playing us, i'd love it.

Maddict5
01-15-2008, 05:59 AM
jared allen and haynesworth arent going anywhere without a high cost (draft picks)... how do people think they wont be franchised?

PapaL
01-15-2008, 07:10 AM
IMO - We need to pay for Mario now. We're not winning the SB next year - no point in spending mega-bucks on top tier guys. Lets secure our future, build through the draft and keep our guys first. (Like the Patriots theory)

badboy
01-15-2008, 10:20 AM
IMO - We need to pay for Mario now. We're not winning the SB next year - no point in spending mega-bucks on top tier guys. Lets secure our future, build through the draft and keep our guys first. (Like the Patriots theory)
I understand your POV, but there are significant FA such as Maewelde Moore RB who are in mid 20s and could sign for several years. As the email noted most lengthy contracts are back loaded and often the player doesn't play or get any $ from last year or two. Just gives them a reason to puff their chests and say I got 8 years $80m (see Nate Clemment).

Moore and a CB (there are a few possiblities) would strengthen the team NOW and play for several years at significant positions. Why not resign Mario in 09 and give him a reason to want to remain with team as in good players besides just a boost in his income?

infantrycak
01-15-2008, 10:34 AM
Mewelde Moore is hardly a cap consideration at all--he will be signing somewhere for a small bonus on top of league minimum.

aj.
01-15-2008, 01:13 PM
... Just gives them a reason to puff their chests and say I got 8 years $80m (see Nate Clemment).


Moreso it gives the agents a reason to puff 'n thump.

The players are interested in one thing. Guaranteed money, a lot of it, and preferably now as opposed to later.

badboy
01-15-2008, 01:42 PM
Moreso it gives the agents a reason to puff 'n thump.

The players are interested in one thing. Guaranteed money, a lot of it, and preferably now as opposed to later.Exactly. So grab Moore for reasonable price, offer Asoughma a Nate C. type contract and still have enough to go after OLB Lance Briggs. Sure it will cost but two guaranteed starters and a RB would sure help and leave draft possibilites much better.

Even without a trade down, I could see best LT or RB in first and third and a center or DE in 4th.

PHAROAH
01-15-2008, 01:52 PM
Guys I agree lets tie up our franchise player now and open up more cap space so that we can get Nnamdi or marcus trufant I would prefer Nnamdi of the two. Lance Briggs is a product of the tampa 2 defense I think that we can get the same production out of a cheaper Boss Bailey and we can still go after Eugene Wilson or Gabril Wilson at the Safety Spot.

Maddict5
01-15-2008, 01:55 PM
. Lance Briggs is a product of the tampa 2 defense I think that we can get the same production out of a cheaper Boss Bailey and we can still go after Eugene Wilson or Gabril Wilson at the Safety Spot.


i strongly disagree

Vinny
01-15-2008, 01:58 PM
I understand your POV, but there are significant FA such as Maewelde Moore RB who are in mid 20s and could sign for several years. As the email noted most lengthy contracts are back loaded and often the player doesn't play or get any $ from last year or two. Just gives them a reason to puff their chests and say I got 8 years $80m (see Nate Clemment).

Moore and a CB (there are a few possiblities) would strengthen the team NOW and play for several years at significant positions. Why not resign Mario in 09 and give him a reason to want to remain with team as in good players besides just a boost in his income?Moore at best is a 3rd down back and doesn't bring much to the table as far as a feature back goes....he just brings more D Walker type play here. We have enough middle of the road backs imo.

badboy
01-15-2008, 02:08 PM
Moore at best is a 3rd down back and doesn't bring much to the table as far as a feature back goes....he just brings more D Walker type play here. We have enough middle of the road backs imo.I guess I got caught up on some of the comments on FA threads where several thought he was an "awesome" RB.

Hottoddie
01-15-2008, 10:09 PM
Here are some free agents to look at that shouldn't cost the farm, or draft picks, to sign. However, they won't be cheap either.

Demorrio Williams, UFA, Atlanta Falcons (OLB)

Landon Johnson UFA Cincinnati Bengals (OLB)

Justin Smith, UFA, Cincinnati Bengals (DE)

Randy Starks UFA Tennessee Titans (DT)

Corey Williams, UFA, Green Bay Packers (DT) - May be too expensive.

Bryant Johnson, UFA, Arizona Cardinals (WR)

Max Starks, UFA, Pittsburgh Steelers (RT) - Move Winston to RG?

Domonique Foxworth, RFA, Denver Broncos (CB)

Randall Gay UFA New England Patriots (CB)

Of course, my #1 choice at CB is Trufant.

wicked_wayz
01-16-2008, 12:37 AM
hmmmm i know we are (sort of) stacked at the wr, but i wouldnt mind giving byrant johnson a look at during FA

badboy
01-16-2008, 11:59 AM
hmmmm i know we are (sort of) stacked at the wr, but i wouldnt mind giving byrant johnson a look at during FAWe might not be stacked if we do not sign FA Andre Davis. Even if JJ comes on and our TE Owens and then Walter keeps it up, I want Davis. With AJ, that is 5 very strong options not counting RBs.

TK_Gamer
01-17-2008, 11:40 PM
Randal Gay is probably gonna get signed, I would love to have him on the team though. either of the wilson's wouldnt be bad either. Didnt the chiefs make some kind of agreement with Allen not to franchise him next year if he signed this year? even so, he will be top dollar. he is strictly a pass rusher though, not much in the run support area. it would however allow Mario to slide over to LDE on most downs.

The Pencil Neck
01-17-2008, 11:48 PM
Didnt the chiefs make some kind of agreement with Allen not to franchise him next year if he signed this year?

No.

I believe that was Samuel and the Patriots.

Allen has no such agreement. Expect him to be franchised if they don't get a deal done.

b0ng
01-17-2008, 11:54 PM
No.

I believe that was Samuel and the Patriots.

Allen has no such agreement. Expect him to be franchised if they don't get a deal done.

It is no secret that Cal Peterson is probably a worse GM than Charley Casserly. I believe Allen wants out of KC and that if they slap him with a franchise, he is spiteful enough (read: stupid enough) to lower the level of his play to piss them off.

But for some reason, I just don't see Allen being a Chief next year.

EDIT Source (http://rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_previousnews.aspx?sport=NFL&id=2837)

Chiefs DE Jared Allen's agent acknowledges that his client will eventually sign the team's one-year, $2.35 million restricted free agent tender.

There is speculation Allen's agent is looking for Jason Taylor-type money. Allen is meeting teams and making the rounds a year early (he'll be unrestricted next year) but is all but certain to remain a Chief in 2007.

Jason Taylor money. . . ugh. Expect a complete meltdown from Allen if the Chiefs franchise him. They went through a lot of drama last offseason over him and being traded.

HOU-TEX
01-18-2008, 10:27 AM
It is no secret that Cal Peterson is probably a worse GM than Charley Casserly. I believe Allen wants out of KC and that if they slap him with a franchise, he is spiteful enough (read: stupid enough) to lower the level of his play to piss them off.

But for some reason, I just don't see Allen being a Chief next year.

EDIT Source (http://rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_previousnews.aspx?sport=NFL&id=2837)



Jason Taylor money. . . ugh. Expect a complete meltdown from Allen if the Chiefs franchise him. They went through a lot of drama last offseason over him and being traded.

If I were Allen, I'd get out of dodge too. The Chiefs are going nowhere, fast. I might get bashed, but Herm Edwards is a bad coach. I feel sorry for Gonzo too.

bah007
01-18-2008, 10:37 AM
If I were Allen, I'd get out of dodge too. The Chiefs are going nowhere, fast. I might get bashed, but Herm Edwards is a bad coach. I feel sorry for Gonzo too.

Gonzalez was a great player in his prime, but I feel he's been overrated during the past few years....or maybe its just cuz his QBs have sucked so bad.

HOU-TEX
01-18-2008, 10:45 AM
Gonzalez was a great player in his prime, but I feel he's been overrated during the past few years....or maybe its just cuz his QBs have sucked so bad.

That's why I feel sorry for him. :)

HJam72
01-18-2008, 10:47 AM
Demorrio Williams, UFA, Atlanta Falcons (OLB)



I know y'all are gonna kill me for this, but I can't resist:

I didn't know that Demeco and Mario had kid! :specnatz:


Well....he must be good. :shades:

badboy
01-18-2008, 11:19 AM
I know y'all are gonna kill me for this, but I can't resist:

I didn't know that Demeco and Mario had kid! :specnatz:


Well....he must be good. :shades:Not so good if he is unrestricted, eh?:)

threetoedpete
01-18-2008, 01:06 PM
Moore at best is a 3rd down back and doesn't bring much to the table as far as a feature back goes....he just brings more D Walker type play here. We have enough middle of the road backs imo.

Agreed. Let Smith and Kubiak work the draft. There are plenty of options open to them. How many times will we bite this apple. Mind Boggeling. Throw first teired money at a second teired tallent ? Makes no sence to me. I also noticed last weekend the 'Deigo running game became prety ordinary once LT went to the bench and the burner got the call. Thanks, but no thanks.

Specnatz
01-18-2008, 01:55 PM
Agreed. Let Smith and Kubiak work the draft. There are plenty of options open to them. How many times will we bite this apple. Mind Boggeling. Throw first teired money at a second teired tallent ? Makes no sence to me. I also noticed last weekend the 'Deigo running game became prety ordinary once LT went to the bench and the burner got the call. Thanks, but no thanks.

Did you watch LT in the first half of the game, and you say it was not ordinary before he left? I thought the play calling was atrocious throughout the for San Diego. Especialy, in the 4 th quarter wher they ran it up the gut in two different series and linedup so the Colts knew what was coming and they did not have to defend the pass what so ever.

threetoedpete
01-18-2008, 02:01 PM
What I saw was a football team who was witout a major wepon at TE. And when the burner got the call to carry the team in the last quarter...he spit the bit. That is what I saw.

Now what I'm sure of is the burner folks projecting something quite different once we sign him here. Prove it sunday. What I see is an other ordinary player being signed to big, fat contract who in all probablity will not deliver the goods.

Specnatz
01-18-2008, 02:16 PM
What I saw was a football team who was witout a major wepon at TE. And when the burner got the call to carry the team in the last quarter...he spit the bit. That is what I saw.

Now what I'm sure of is the burner folks projecting something quite different once we sign him here. Prove it sunday. What I see is an other ordinary player being signed to big, fat contract who in all probablity will not deliver the goods.

With as deep of a RB class as this draft will be I do not see Turner getting as big of a contract as he would have gotten last year.

adam
01-19-2008, 12:15 PM
I'm really starting to beleive we should go after Jared Allen...

I know I know our Dline already has tons invested in it...but look at the Giants. They have been harrassing QBs all in the post season thus far and despite having a rag tag secondary it really has worked.

If our Dline consisted of Mario, Okoye, TJ, and Allen...I think QBs of opposing teams would have nightmares of those guys before playing us, i'd love it.

I heard somewhere that Allen was considering retirement. Any truth to that?