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View Full Version : How do we make up ground in the AFC South?


TheRealJoker
12-23-2007, 10:47 PM
Alright, here's my kneejerk thread of the day.

We're 0-5 against the AFC South and 7-3 against the rest of the NFL.

Its obvious we need to build this team to beat our division opponents. You look at our division, its the toughest in the NFL. The Jags and Tacks are run first stiff defense type teams so obviously we need to find a way to shore up our run defense to compete with those teams.

The Colts have everything, they're the 2nd best team in the NFL right now to the Pats. If we can beat the Colts we can beat any team because the Colts can beat teams any way you can think of.

So what do we need the most to make up ground in the AFC South? Even if we get a 3-3 record next season, that's 10 wins and more often than not that's playoffs. So let it be known what you think we need the most to compete in the toughest division in football.

b0ng
12-23-2007, 11:05 PM
Alright, here's my kneejerk thread of the day.

We're 0-5 against the AFC South and 7-3 against the rest of the NFL.

Its obvious we need to build this team to beat our division opponents. You look at our division, its the toughest in the NFL. The Jags and Tacks are run first stiff defense type teams so obviously we need to find a way to shore up our run defense to compete with those teams.

The Colts have everything, they're the 2nd best team in the NFL right now to the Pats. If we can beat the Colts we can beat any team because the Colts can beat teams any way you can think of.

So what do we need the most to make up ground in the AFC South? Even if we get a 3-3 record next season, that's 10 wins and more often than not that's playoffs. So let it be known what you think we need the most to compete in the toughest division in football.

If we can have a defense that will shut down the Colts, we can shutdown anybody. I think thats what McNair wants to see for his team.

It seems like the South is comprised of one team that is known for having a highly efficient offense and the other 3 teams have stout defenses that try to stop the Colts. This year, we really got bent over the barrel in our division.

TheRealJoker
12-23-2007, 11:14 PM
I think our defense has the talent to compete with a team like the Colts but I also think that Richard Smith is shackling down our talent with his bend but dont break scheme.

Our defense should be a swarming defense like the Chicago Bears that force turnovers and get after opposing offenses. They dont blitz much either but they also scheme to get their DL in position to put pressure on the qb to force errant throws. Plus you always see a defender trying to strip the ball when they make tackles. That made me really happy today when Fred Bennet did that to Wayne. They play the Tampa 2 just like the godfather Monte Kiffin has run in Tampa for years.

This is why im hoping we go after Ron Rivera hard in the offseason to be our DC. He was Chicago's DC last season and is currently San Diego's LB coach/Asst. HC.

I think he is waiting for a HC job to open but I think its worth a shot to throw Greg Williams at the guy to see if he'll bring his brand of defense to the Houston Texans. Think about how the defenses match up...sure we dont have ALL the pieces the Bears do, or do we have that and we just dont know it because the talent isn't used properly?

Amobi Okoye = Tommie Harris

DeMeco Ryans = Brian Urlacher

Mario Williams = Tool the Bears dont have, closest comparison probably Ogunleye

Dunta/Bennet = Vasher/Tillman

Will Demps = Mike Brown

We've got the tools, but I fear our defense will not unlike its potential until Richard Smith leaves and takes his bend but dont break defense with him.

TheRealJoker
12-23-2007, 11:17 PM
Another thing about hiring Ron Rivera is that it would shift the coaching advantage a little bit in our favor.

You look at the coaches we play 6x a year:

Tony Dungy

Jeff Fisher

Jack Del Rio

These guys are among the best in the NFL at what they do. Kubes cant compete with them right now, he's new to being a HC and there is an adjustment period...look at that guy in New England when he coached Cleveland!!!

If we got a big name assistant like Rivera I would like to think there would be a lot less people claiming we got "outcoached" whenever we lose because we decide to play our corners 5-10 yards off the WR and let the one of the best qbs of all time pick who he would like to get the 1st down on the next upcoming 3rd down play.

TexanSam
12-23-2007, 11:37 PM
I forgot Riviera was let go by the Bears! I don't know if he would be a good fit as a DC here though. Wasn't he a 3-4 guy in Chicago?

TheRealJoker
12-24-2007, 12:07 AM
I forgot Riviera was let go by the Bears! I don't know if he would be a good fit as a DC here though. Wasn't he a 3-4 guy in Chicago?

He ran the Tampa 2 in Chicago. 4-3 all the way, match made in heaven imo.

The1ApplePie
12-24-2007, 01:31 AM
Rivera went to San Diego to learn the 3-4, so he can be a head coach next year. He only wants to be a HC, and has no desire to be a coordinator any more.

HJam72
12-24-2007, 07:54 AM
I kind of hate to say this, but I think the only D that beats Peyton Manning is a 3-4 with a lot of hidden and unexpected blitzers. Generally, I prefer the 4-3, but getting to Peyton is a science all its own. Only way to get to him is for him not to ever see it coming. It would also have to be a very disciplined, well-coached 3-4 D with a lot of talent. I don't see how even the best 4-3s EVER could beat him in any way.

Think about it. Who has beaten the Colts over the last 5 years with any regularity at all? Patriots and (for a while) Steelers is all I can think of. I can see this team making great strides in the coming years and still being Peyton's boy until he retires. Yeah, we can beat them, but it'll never happen regularly. We'd have better luck facing the Pats twice a year, and that's no disrespect to them at all.

Texan_Bill
12-24-2007, 08:02 AM
Re: How do we make up ground in the AFC South?

First - Stay healthy for a change. Something doesn't seem right when we have had 17 guys on IR the last two seasons. Our starting running back yesterday was once 6th on the depth chart.

Second - build quality depth. It's much better than it was two years ago, but still has a long way to go in some areas.

Third - either Richard Smith lets go of the reigns (like the Denver game) or he has to go.

Fourth - draft - still several key positions need to be filled. DB's OLB and ADDRESS THAT O-LINE!! I noticed Morlon Greenwood blitzed from the edge. Suffice to say he didn't come close to Manning.

Address all positions, not named Defensive line or receivers (and of course MLB). Everything else should be looked at to upgrade.

WWJD
12-24-2007, 08:04 AM
It all starts with the front office and drafting.

If the Texans draft well they'll be fine. Miss on a few high choices and it sets your team back and we'll be talking next year at this same time about "what might have been"...

I noticed yesterday that even when the Colts brought in their second team guys they still moved the ball and their defense was good all game long no matter who was playing.

They draft well!

otisbean
12-24-2007, 08:22 AM
Actually, Rivera would be a great addition. Make him assistant HC/DC and throw some money at him maybe he will come over.

I think we still need help in four areas:

Oline - all the teams in our division have stellar Dlines, so we have to improve our Oline to compete, especially against the Colts. We have to be able to run the ball effectively against them to shorten the game and control TOP

Secondary: Some improvements will come as every one gets healthy but I really think we need a SS with better coverage ability. I have no problem w/ CC as a backup, but I think he is our weak link on D. Bennett and Drob should be a great duo (provided Drob comes back healthy) Demps is showing some promise. I almost wonder if he could be moved to SS against pass happy teams like the Colts if we could add a good FS to the mix (maybe Harrison next season). I also wonder if Boulware could play some WLB?

LBS - we need to improve our LB play. We have been run on too often this year. Outside of the human tackling machine that is Demeco Ryans we are very pedestrian at OLB.

QB - the evolution of Schaub should help sort this out, but we have got to stop turning the ball over. We cannot keep giving the other team chances to
score.

In short, we need to get more 3 and outs on D, control the ball on O, and stop turning the ball over. We are not far from being a PO team. Hopefully all of our guys get healthy and we add some cogs to the machine in the off season. We are close people, hang in there!

The1ApplePie
12-24-2007, 09:09 AM
I would love to see the Texans run a 3-4/4-3 hybrid. They kind of do now, but more 3-4 sets would be cool. Parcels even said that Mario would be a better fit at OLB, and he's had some nasty results playing from that position this year.

Get MLB/OLB Dan Conner in the 1st, and find a big fatass DT someplace, and the Texans could have a great 3-4

Leahmic223
12-24-2007, 10:54 AM
Man Rivera would help a lot...I just don't see it happening though.

Peyton tears our defense up its so vanilla. Its like basic math to him when he plays us 1+1=2 TOUCHDOWN.

I do think better talent would also help, a stud safety would help drastically and a OLBs that can cover their TEs and reciving backs. We have a good offseason maybe we can beat them next year.

nunusguy
12-24-2007, 01:44 PM
Put a contract out on Peyton Manning ?

Ole Miss Texan
12-24-2007, 01:55 PM
From where we are now, the first thing we must do is build our offensive line. Another thing in common with really all the teams in our division is the strength of the Defensive Lines.

Build the OL up to protect our QB and open up running lanes. That's the most important thing we can do to get to the playoffs and succeed once we're there.

austintexanite
12-24-2007, 01:58 PM
Let other teams have our injuries for two years and we stay healthy for the same span. Seriously though, need to build the big boys up front (both sides of the ball.) Dline is getting there, but need to mature a bit more. Some OLB's would be nice as well.

TEXANRED
12-24-2007, 08:21 PM
How do we gain ground in the AFC South? Win a game is a start.

Let me throw out a number, 7-27. That is our record in the AFC South.

1-11 -vs- Indy

2-10 -vs- Titans

6-6 -vs- Jags.

I already counted us losing this Sunday. I don't think we have a snowballs chance. All year the Texans have played flat and uninspired after having there ass handed to them.

We finish this season 7-9. So on that note, try not to throw beer on any of the Texan players relatives.

Pantherstang84
12-24-2007, 08:34 PM
How do we gain ground in the AFC South? Win a game is a start.

Let me throw out a number, 7-27. That is our record in the AFC South.

1-11 -vs- Indy

2-10 -vs- Titans

6-6 -vs- Jags.

I already counted us losing this Sunday. I don't think we have a snowballs chance. All year the Texans have played flat and uninspired after having there ass handed to them.

We finish this season 7-9. So on that note, try not to throw beer on any of the Texan players relatives.

Stole my thunder. I would like to add....


Quit being the punks of the division!!!

Pantherstang84
12-24-2007, 08:35 PM
Put a contract out on Peyton Manning ?

Here. Here.

Vinny
12-24-2007, 10:59 PM
How do we make up ground in the AFC South?win more games

threetoedpete
12-26-2007, 12:27 PM
Put a contract out on Peyton Manning ?

LOL, the guy was money Sunday. Never know for a fact...but I believe the end around to Clark was picked off of film by Manning and inserted just for the Texan's game. Brady may have the most hardware but Manning is a stinking...what comes after genius ?

Double Barrel
12-26-2007, 06:08 PM
A lot of thought being put into the defense, and it makes sense.

BUT, I'd say establishing a solid, consistent running game is truly the way to beat our division opponents.

Think about our win over Indy last season. We ran the ball - Dayne with 152 yards - and kept Manning off the field. This philosophy should serve us to beat all of our opponents. Eat the clock, put points on the board with long 8-10 minute drives. Our defense stays rested while our offense chews up the clock.

mexican_texan
12-26-2007, 06:25 PM
We need another offensive lineman and another playmaker on defense.

TEXANRED
12-26-2007, 06:46 PM
How do we gain ground in the AFC South? Win a game is a start.

Let me throw out a number, 7-27. That is our record in the AFC South.

1-11 -vs- Indy

2-10 -vs- Titans

6-6 -vs- Jags.

I already counted us losing this Sunday. I don't think we have a snowballs chance. All year the Texans have played flat and uninspired after having there ass handed to them.

We finish this season 7-9. So on that note, try not to throw beer on any of the Texan players relatives.
I would like to thank all who did not make fun of my mathmatic skills :cowboy1:

9-27

Lucky
12-26-2007, 07:01 PM
The Texans have allowed over 34 points per game in their 5 division losses. They allow only 18.5 ppg in non-division games. It seems to me that our division foes have our defensive schemes down cold.

I don't know if shoring up the secondary, finding help at OLB, and getting an edge rusher is the entire answer (it couldn't hurt). But, a re-evaluation of how the Texans are attacking Indy, Tennessee, and Jacksonville's offenses seems in order. Whatever they're doing now is not working.

barberman
12-26-2007, 09:55 PM
Houston must be much more aggresive on defense, blitze and put pressure on the recievers instead of 5 to 10 yard cushions and soft coverage. It sure can`t get any worse than what we are currently doing. Also would be nice to have a Javorskie Lane type of bulldozing RB to keep Payton off the field. Dayne can`t stay healthy enough to be out there consistantly.

Bulluck53
12-27-2007, 02:15 AM
Start with defense... you know its bad when we hang up 38 and 28 on you, even with the 8 field goals.

Defensive line will be great for years to come. Unless the talk of TJ leaving is legit, then depth will be an issue at tackle. Find an overachiever like Odom/LaBoy for us this year and it's tops in the league.

Secondary, I'd start with safety for help over the top on the opposite side of Robinson. Then go out and get a guy at corner and add depth. Just know that a good pass rush works wonders.

The linebacking core I think is pretty solid. Young but they could develope. Maybe spend a few mid-round picks, or maybe even a second round or trade for a guy who is good in coverage.


Offensively it's running back all the way. The line to me is much much better then years past. Once they're all healthy it will be a solid group. Maybe a bookend takcle to protect Schaub from KVB, McCray and Freeney.

Running back is so important in this division, though. If you can control the clock you can beat anyone in the South, and anyone in the league.

Andre Davis looks like a solid #2 opposite AJ and Walter has done nice with Rosenfels.

maddogmrb
12-27-2007, 08:01 AM
We'd have better luck facing the Pats twice a year, and that's no disrespect to them at all.

HJam, if you look at how we've played the Pats the last couple of times versus the Colts, we've been much more competitive against the Colts ...... I believe.:fans:

Mr. White
12-27-2007, 09:51 AM
I kind of hate to say this, but I think the only D that beats Peyton Manning is a 3-4 with a lot of hidden and unexpected blitzers. Generally, I prefer the 4-3, but getting to Peyton is a science all its own. Only way to get to him is for him not to ever see it coming. It would also have to be a very disciplined, well-coached 3-4 D with a lot of talent. I don't see how even the best 4-3s EVER could beat him in any way.


I think that you're onto something here. Seems like all the best D's are 3-4's. When Capers got fired, then it seemed like running a 3-4 wasn't even an option anymore. In hindsight, it might have been a better short-term solution to stay with it since we already had 3-4 personnel.

I think if Capers actually ran the defense when he was here (instead of meddling with the offense,) they might have been a decent unit.

Honoring Earl 34
12-27-2007, 10:47 AM
I think that you're onto something here. Seems like all the best D's are 3-4's. When Capers got fired, then it seemed like running a 3-4 wasn't even an option anymore. In hindsight, it might have been a better short-term solution to stay with it since we already had 3-4 personnel.

I think if Capers actually ran the defense when he was here (instead of meddling with the offense,) they might have been a decent unit.

How do the 3-4s matchup vs power football teams like the Jags and Titans . That's the problem ... we have to worry about matchups against three really good but different teams .

Joe Texan
12-27-2007, 10:53 AM
How do we make up ground in the AFC South?

WIN