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badboy
12-06-2007, 10:59 AM
I would appreciate if some of you that watch college football more closely than I would list the junior and senior guys and your thoughts if the juniors would come out. I have reviewed several sites and I would enjoy your thoughts. I have seen some posts on various players but would like one thread to go to and review as season progresses. Please include when you think the player could be drafted. For example, on one mock thread by BeerLover, I mention Alex Boone who may go as low as 4th round but to me seemed worth a low first round if we were able to trade down. If others think he would easily be available at third, I'd re-evaluate using a first on another position. I was really caught off guard last year with Winston and Spencer going in 3rd.

It would be helpful that if you choose to also discuss other needs by Texans such as corners you use a separate post and not mix positions. Thanks!

threetoedpete
12-06-2007, 11:31 AM
It's not Joel Bushbaum, but it is free. This guy puts a premium on the striaght line forty. That's a thing, but it's not the only thing. Cone drills, how many times a guy can jerk 225.... body fat. The most import thing is the tape. How does the guy produce when faced with stiff competition ? Anyway everyone has their own personl favorites. The key is how many of the top end Juniors will come out.

King Dunlop passes the eye ball test. And you can get him in day two...however, the game tape dosen't match the physique. My favorite would be Micheal Oher. He can cover more postions than some of the others. Which makes his bust factor extremly low. He is highly athletic and powerfull. He is also, just like Mario, the rawest of the group. Which means the board will have to have a six pack of patience with him. He is also the guy with the most upside. He won't be as true a RG/RT/OLT prospect as Beerlover's guy out of Pittsburg. He's not that huge. But I believe he has more than a fair shot to cover the left side. Beerlover's guy is not slow mind you, 5.2 if he has the feet, will work very well in this scheme. Beerlover says the guy has the feet to make it at OLT I believe him. Loadholt has blocked everything in front of him with impunity. I look forward to seeing what he posts at the combine. And I hate OU.



http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/NFLDraft/Draft+Extras/2007/positionrptOL.htm


Three junior left tackles — Oklahoma’s Phil Loadholt, Boise State’s Ryan Clady and Mississippi’s Michael Oher — could strengthen the OT class considerably.

Loadholt, at 6-8, 350 pounds, comes in a similar mold as Minnesota Vikings 2002 seventh overall draft pick Bryant McKinnie. He is a junior-college transfer and has started only one season, but he’s very naturally athletic with good footwork and shows the ability to collapse defenders in the run game.

Clady looks every bit the part with a big frame and long arms. The game appears to come easy for him — he’s a natural 300-pounder who can bend and adjust — and he is loaded with upside.

Oher has everything you want in a premier left tackle — he’s big, naturally athletic, quick-footed and flashes strength and power. He has had to overcome a lot in his life, as has been detailed in Michael Lewis’ best-selling book, “The Blind Side,” soon set to become a movie. However, communication and trust issues still remain from a very rough upbringing, when he bounced from home to home, and the coach given the task of developing him will have his work cut out for him.

beerlover
12-06-2007, 12:07 PM
I need to see Oher play but I like everything I've read about him. All Otah has done is go out & improve every week until he may be playing at the highest level in all of College Football @ his position. he has faced & won the battle against the highest rated DE's in the nation (has not played Vernon Gholston, I would pay money for that) but this list includes Chris Long, VT & George Selvie, South Florida. Ryan Clady is a complete looking OT who reminds me somewhat of Levi Brown, who people told me was a 2nd rd. pick this time last year :cool:

badboy
12-06-2007, 12:30 PM
I lost the web site I reviewed yesterday that showed by position where players should go through all 7 rounds. That was interesting. It had some players highlighted so additional info could be looked at. I have mixed feelings about how far to go before grabbing a player that can fill a need positon. We all pretty much have same ideas on where those holes are, just differ on who and when to select and if that guy will be available. If an Alex Boone will be there in fourth, do we take that risk and go for other positions in earlier rounds? I lean toward if a solid guy is at your pick you go with him, but if a trade allows you to acquire another pick and still get another player pretty close to your first option that is hard to turn down.

threetoedpete
12-06-2007, 12:54 PM
I need to see Oher play but I like everything I've read about him. All Otah has done is go out & improve every week until he may be playing at the highest level in all of College Football @ his position. he has faced & won the battle against the highest rated DE's in the nation (has not played Vernon Gholston, I would pay money for that) but this list includes Chris Long, VT & George Selvie, South Florida. Ryan Clady is a complete looking OT who reminds me somewhat of Levi Brown, who people told me was a 2nd rd. pick this time last year :cool:

Oher was pay per veiw every game except one. I've seen him once this year. If he declares, that will mean I'm basing a lot on what I saw last year and what he does at the combine.

I just think you just about summed it up BB. The other guys that come up for second day guys...project guys...read guys that will be much like Erick and Brandon Frye... are the guy from Nebraska and the guy from Virgina Tech. and that what the gamble is. Finding someone who is locked and loaded. How long do you wiat ? I think with the kaos at their C/G depth...they got hit on at least a guy who can fill that role. I'd rather have an OT who is athletic enough and stound eough who can swing inside. I think Kubiak has been prety adimate that the o-line guy has to be able to plug various holes and be very flexiable in their ablity. We need to find a way to hit the DB and one of the dancing bears to have any shot at all next season.

badboy
12-06-2007, 01:55 PM
Oher was pay per veiw every game except one. I've seen him once this year. If he declares, that will mean I'm basing a lot on what I saw last year and what he does at the combine.

I just think you just about summed it up BB. The other guys that come up for second day guys...project guys...read guys that will be much like Erick and Brandon Frye... are the guy from Nebraska and the guy from Virgina Tech. and that what the gamble is. Finding someone who is locked and loaded. How long do you wiat ? I think with the kaos at their C/G depth...they got hit on at least a guy who can fill that role. I'd rather have an OT who is athletic enough and stound eough who can swing inside. I think Kubiak has been prety adimate that the o-line guy has to be able to plug various holes and be very flexiable in their ablity. We need to find a way to hit the DB and one of the dancing bears to have any shot at all next season.Do you think a guy like Faneca would be worth "stupid" money (as someone put it)? I undestand he can play guard and center. I just do not see much in free agency that excites me as starter material that 1) will be there and not a re-sign 2) over pay or not would fill a hole. IMO that is Samuel as only choice for us.

painekiller
12-06-2007, 02:58 PM
I would say the guys that interest me are Clady (I've seen him projected from #11 to early 2nd), Boone (mid 1st to late 2nd)(Also I believe he stays in school), Otah( mid to late 1st - 3rd) (Has aggressive punch, and outstanding feet), Oher (late 1st - 3rd)(believed to be staying in school).

A 3rd round and later guy I am watching is Chris Williams Vanderbilt. He has been solid, a good senior bowl will help him.

I am not thrilled with the USC tackle Sam Baker, his injury concerns me.

I would target Clady, Boone, and or Otah at this time. Unfortunately we can only see Otah in the senior bowl, I wish they would include declared juniors. I am not going to say I know what Kubiak and Smith look for because Spencer numbers (Short Shuttle, weight) broke all the so called rules for the Denver model, but if Otah number come close to Spencer's then his punch and aggression should make him a target for them.

threetoedpete
12-06-2007, 07:22 PM
Anothny Collins. Still under estamating the Jay Hawks. My Bad

TexansSeminole
12-06-2007, 07:41 PM
Gosder Cherlius from Boston College.

b0ng
12-06-2007, 08:20 PM
Gosder Cherlius from Boston College.

He's projecting out to be a RT in the NFL. Something that we actually are okay at.

Insideop
12-06-2007, 09:45 PM
I lost the web site I reviewed yesterday that showed by position where players should go through all 7 rounds. That was interesting. It had some players highlighted so additional info could be looked at. I have mixed feelings about how far to go before grabbing a player that can fill a need positon. We all pretty much have same ideas on where those holes are, just differ on who and when to select and if that guy will be available. If an Alex Boone will be there in fourth, do we take that risk and go for other positions in earlier rounds? I lean toward if a solid guy is at your pick you go with him, but if a trade allows you to acquire another pick and still get another player pretty close to your first option that is hard to turn down.

That's a tough question to answer right now. We have no clue who they will get in FA and what, if any, holes they will fill. My guess, at this point in time, given the O-line problems we are having, would be they will not pass on a LT in the 1st or 3rd if it's someone they think can step in and solidify that position right away (like Spencer). We also have to remember that if we do get a stud LT, and Spencer comes back healthy, we can always move Spencer to Guard. Either way, it gives us some much needed depth.

Another thing to remember is that this is looking like a deep draft for LT, especially if some of the top Jr's come out, like Clady, Oher, and Boone. So the more of them that come out, the better chance we have of getting one late in the 1st (if we trade down), or maybe even in the 3rd. Chris Williams, Chad Rinehart, Max Unger and Otah could all be there when we pick in the 3rd. Not likely, but you never know. It's like you said bb, you didn't expect Winston and Spencer to be there in the 3rd. I know I was surprised about Winston falling that far. JMHO!

TexanSam
12-06-2007, 10:21 PM
We should just draft the guy from Michigan if he's available

b0ng
12-07-2007, 12:40 AM
We should just draft the guy from Michigan if he's available

Probably not going to happen unless we seriously tank. If the Rams are picking before us, they are getting a replacement for Orlando Pace.

beerlover
12-13-2007, 02:01 PM
only a suggestion, but given the depth of this draft @ LT that would seem the most likely item on the menu :fridge:

my projection as of right now suggests that pick to be LT Sam Baker, USC 6052 314 lbs. he should be fully recovered from the hamstring injury & ready to perform in the Rose Bowl against Illinois. I'll be paying extra attention to how well he performs & plays against DE's Derek Walker/Will Davis both with plenty of speed.

The1ApplePie
12-13-2007, 02:14 PM
After Long there is a whole bunch of nothing at LT. I doubt there will be any worthy of our pick between 10-15.

Felix Jones, Talib, Stewart will all be there. Dan Conner might even slip

badboy
12-13-2007, 02:28 PM
only a suggestion, but given the depth of this draft @ LT that would seem the most likely item on the menu :fridge:

my projection as of right now suggests that pick to be LT Sam Baker, USC 6052 314 lbs. he should be fully recovered from the hamstring injury & ready to perform in the Rose Bowl against Illinois. I'll be paying extra attention to how well he performs & plays against DE's Derek Walker/Will Davis both with plenty of speed.Now I am confused. I had thought this was supposed to be a deep LT draft but this week I have read that Jake Long is projected as RTand goes too high regardless; Clady has supposedly moved up to a top 10 pick and Baker is mocked by Walterfootball.com @ #8 and by NFL DraftDog @#14. Cherilus is projected at right and Oher probably will not come out. I am looking at ALex Boone 6'7" 325lbs "best left tackle from Ohio State since Orlando Pace" Per Draft Insiders Digest. I see us struggling to fill this major hole for another year.

Bubbajwp
12-13-2007, 02:58 PM
There is no Top tier LT in this draft. But there is good depth.

badboy
12-13-2007, 03:05 PM
There is no Top tier LT in this draft. But there is good depth.Please identify those depth players that will be available at 15. I am getting depressed.

awtysst
12-13-2007, 06:06 PM
There is no Top tier LT in this draft. But there is good depth.

Depends on who declares. If Clady and Boone declare, either one could be a Top tier LT that would good in a Texans uniform.

kastofsna
12-13-2007, 06:35 PM
Clady's a top 5er to me.

YoungTexanFan
12-14-2007, 02:14 AM
Clady's a top 5er to me.

I've been saying this for weeks. Clady is better than Long by a fair measure.

painekiller
12-14-2007, 03:24 AM
I've been saying this for weeks. Clady is better than Long by a fair measure.

Ditto.

kastofsna
12-14-2007, 03:33 AM
I've been saying this for weeks. Clady is better than Long by a fair measure.
and i've been saying it for months. so ha.

YoungTexanFan
12-14-2007, 08:01 AM
and i've been saying it for months. so ha.

We will call this a draw. For now. :pirate:

Honoring Earl 34
12-14-2007, 10:09 AM
I do think this is the year to draft a LT .

If you draft a LT like Otah and move Spencer to guard ... then you have a big physical bunch to match up with the Titans and Jags ... we are 7-3 outside the division .

A young LT will improve greatly going up against Mario and ND in camp .

So Otah and Ian Johnson ... 1st and 3rd rd .

painekiller
12-14-2007, 10:25 AM
So Otah and Ian Johnson ... 1st and 3rd rd .

Well since Otah is most likely returning to school for another year, I am still calling for a trade down and selecting Clady/Baker/Boone in the first. With newly acquired 2nd, I want to take Alex Mack OC Cal (thanks Beerlover for pointing this guy out).

In the 3rd go BPA, someone like Dom Rodgers-Cromartie CB Tenn St. might fall to mid 3rd, or a OLB like Ezra Butler Nevada.

There is some talent in this draft, and RB might not be the teams prime target like we think it is.

Honoring Earl 34
12-14-2007, 10:31 AM
I'm a anybody but Baker guy ... he gets hurt to much . If you have the measurables and a nasty streak ... I'm interested .

badboy
12-14-2007, 11:04 AM
Well since Otah is most likely returning to school for another year, I am still calling for a trade down and selecting Clady/Baker/Boone in the first. With newly acquired 2nd, I want to take Alex Mack OC Cal (thanks Beerlover for pointing this guy out).

In the 3rd go BPA, someone like Dom Rodgers-Cromartie CB Tenn St. might fall to mid 3rd, or a OLB like Ezra Butler Nevada.

There is some talent in this draft, and RB might not be the teams prime target like we think it is.As I posted earlier, Clady & Baker both may be gone by our pick. Which after whomping the horses last night, probably pushed us further down. It looks like Boone or bust for LT and the farther we fall the more difficult it will be to trade down and get a 2nd.

Walker looked pretty good last night as a rookie RB as did Dayne in a back up and injured role. Dayne should be ok in a back up role. Do we still need a heavy hitter? I say yes and if draft breaks the way I think it now looks, we should go Stewart in first regardless if a trade down occurs and get Boone at next opportunity. I have no idea what role if any that Green plays in 08. The site (that I can no longer find) I reviewed a couple weeks ago showed the college guys in round projected for all 7. Boone was a 4th round. Since then, I've seen some posters on this board suggesting he could go from late first to mid second. If we miss on him, I think we will be in same boat in 08. Salaam looked good last night. Did you see when he hurt his ankle he shook off being replaced? He was pumped. I am thinking more and more we should start fasting and praying that Spencer will be back and 100% cause we ain't getting anyone else.

Honoring Earl 34
12-14-2007, 11:17 AM
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/players.php?genpos=OT&draftyear=2008&sortorder=tsxpos&order=ASC

beerlover
12-14-2007, 11:52 AM
I'm a anybody but Baker guy ... he gets hurt to much . If you have the measurables and a nasty streak ... I'm interested .

I've been quilty hammering on Sam for his injury plagued senior season but the truth is other than some minor hamstring issues, his primary root cause has been due to arthroscopic surgery to remove loose cartlidge in his left knee prior to this season. as happens so many times when rehabing on the fly he may have favoured his knee & over compensated causing his hamstring issues.

Regardless he has been really quite durable. he has started as USC LT four straight years, less one game this season, three times selected all-pac 10 1st team, played in Pro-Style offense, one of the highest profile programs in the nation. Sam Baker is a consistant LT that displays all the traits desired in the position.

Quick feet, blessed with above average balance, long arms, big hands that he knows how to place between the pads or punch controlling his opponent. he is the most polished tackle in this class, smart, along Joe Thomas lines (remember Joe had acl surgery in the offseason prior to his senior season) similar size maybe 1/2 inch shorter & 10 lbs lighter but that's an asset in Kubiak ZBS where fast, athletic smart linemen are desired.

hope this helps clear his injury rap, most of this stuff is generated on sites that unfortunatly don't do their research. watching the game last night Denver would be very tempted to draft him to protect Cutler if an elite DE that can apply a pass rush is unavailable. so its now becoming more of a stretch that Sam Baker would even be available given the Texans late season charge, but if he where I would have no misgivings making him the selection. :)

badboy
12-14-2007, 11:52 AM
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/players.php?genpos=OT&draftyear=2008&sortorder=tsxpos&order=ASC
Hey thanks! Not the same one I reviewed but will be helpful.

threetoedpete
12-14-2007, 01:04 PM
Well, we're slowly moving down the board...so

Plan A take (the pick your position) BPA in the first.

go slumming with the scrapes after the fourth. There are couple of gaurds who have the numbers to make transition out there. And then there is the curl lipped jane who should be the second coming of Orlndo Pace ...but has never played like it, King Dunlap.

Plan B Take the best OLT canidate on the board....that may mean taking the all American out of Kansas , Collins out of position. I'm assuming here that Oher holds course and goes back to old miss.

Plan C Target the small school kid Benedict in the fourth and draft BPA in the first and third. Come back and take one of the wounded gaurds, Erick Young or Tony Hills, in the fifth.

badboy
12-14-2007, 01:33 PM
Well, we're slowly moving down the board...so

Plan A take (the pick your position) BPA in the first.

go slumming with the scrapes after the fourth. There are couple of gaurds who have the numbers to make transition out there. And then there is the curl lipped jane who should be the second coming of Orlndo Pace ...but has never played like it, King Dunlap.

Plan B Take the best OLT canidate on the board....that may mean taking the all American out of Kansas , Collins out of position. I'm assuming here that Oher holds course and goes back to old miss.

Plan C Target the small school kid Benedict in the fourth and draft BPA in the first and third. Come back and take one of the wounded gaurds, Erick Young or Tony Hills, in the fifth.

Don't we have enough guards on team already? Dunlap seems to be falling but that could change as draft gets closer. Baker would be solid but prob not there. If we are going snipe hunting in later rounds and trade down not probable, I say go hard for an RB. Dayne and Walters(for now) with Green, Stewart (first)and whomever can fight it out. I'm on record saying if Dayne continues as he has and Walker can avg 3 1/2 yds, we will not go RB on day one.

Honoring Earl 34
12-14-2007, 02:23 PM
I'm leaning on cashing in my chips on the LT . I do not want to gamble on Salaam again and we don't know about Spencer .

If Spencer is healthy , then you have a massive gaurd who could play tackle ... oh by the way , he's plays with a chip on his shoulder . Might be a nice matchup vs Haynesworth , Stroud , and Henderson . Yeah I know but I'm not a big fan of Pitts or Weary .

We will have cap money so maybe we can address some needs there .

painekiller
12-14-2007, 04:04 PM
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/players.php?genpos=OT&draftyear=2008&sortorder=tsxpos&order=ASC

Thanks for the link, this is senior only, so I am not sure how the juniors affect the projected round.

Honoring Earl 34
12-14-2007, 05:09 PM
Thanks for the link, this is senior only, so I am not sure how the juniors affect the projected round.

That is a good link because they post the workout numbers after the combine.

threetoedpete
12-14-2007, 07:48 PM
Don't we have enough guards on team already? Dunlap seems to be falling but that could change as draft gets closer. Baker would be solid but prob not there. If we are going snipe hunting in later rounds and trade down not probable, I say go hard for an RB. Dayne and Walters(for now) with Green, Stewart (first)and whomever can fight it out. I'm on record saying if Dayne continues as he has and Walker can avg 3 1/2 yds, we will not go RB on day one.

I'm not sure how many starts hills has at OLT for Texas but it is lot. What you know about him for a fact is that he would be the most athletic gaurd on the team once you drafted him. Erick Young of Tennesse is in the same mold. So is the oregon State guard. Both by the numbers are to short for OLT.

I'm just judging by ghosts of drafts past. The more we win the further the likly hood is that we'll be in position to get one in the first round with out reaching. They've been lucky with Salaam twenty six starts and counting.

painekiller
12-17-2007, 06:20 AM
Well since Otah is most likely returning to school for another year, I am still calling for a trade down and selecting Clady/Baker/Boone in the first. With newly acquired 2nd, I want to take Alex Mack OC Cal (thanks Beerlover for pointing this guy out).

In the 3rd go BPA, someone like Dom Rodgers-Cromartie CB Tenn St. might fall to mid 3rd, or a OLB like Ezra Butler Nevada.

There is some talent in this draft, and RB might not be the teams prime target like we think it is.


i made a mistake I often make, Otah is the senior OLT prospect from Pitt, he is not going back to school.

I was thinking of the junior OLT from Mississippi Oher, he is the higher ranked of these two and he is most likely going back to school.

YoungTexanFan
12-17-2007, 10:32 AM
Plan B Take the best OLT canidate on the board....that may mean taking the all American out of Kansas , Collins out of position. I'm assuming here that Oher holds course and goes back to old miss.



Collins, the LT from KU, is only a JR this year and will not declare. He has already stated that he is coming back to KU. However, he is a good "under the radar" guy from next year. He is more valuable to our team than Talib. Anthony Collins was the leader of our dominant running game. Think about it like this, we (KU) replaced all 3 interior OL positions with underclassmen, replaced our All-Big 12 RB, and replaced our QB (thought that worked out very well), and he was pretty much the only constant to remain, and he held everything together and dominated all season.

Anthony Collins is more valuable to the KU football team than Sheron Collins is to our basketball team. (Sheron was an all-American in HS, a 5 star prospect, and a starter as a sophomore for us)

eriadoc
12-17-2007, 11:23 AM
I've been quilty hammering on Sam for his injury plagued senior season but the truth is other than some minor hamstring issues, his primary root cause has been due to arthroscopic surgery to remove loose cartlidge in his left knee prior to this season. as happens so many times when rehabing on the fly he may have favoured his knee & over compensated causing his hamstring issues.

Regardless he has been really quite durable. he has started as USC LT four straight years, less one game this season, three times selected all-pac 10 1st team, played in Pro-Style offense, one of the highest profile programs in the nation. Sam Baker is a consistant LT that displays all the traits desired in the position.

Quick feet, blessed with above average balance, long arms, big hands that he knows how to place between the pads or punch controlling his opponent. he is the most polished tackle in this class, smart, along Joe Thomas lines (remember Joe had acl surgery in the offseason prior to his senior season) similar size maybe 1/2 inch shorter & 10 lbs lighter but that's an asset in Kubiak ZBS where fast, athletic smart linemen are desired.

hope this helps clear his injury rap, most of this stuff is generated on sites that unfortunatly don't do their research. watching the game last night Denver would be very tempted to draft him to protect Cutler if an elite DE that can apply a pass rush is unavailable. so its now becoming more of a stretch that Sam Baker would even be available given the Texans late season charge, but if he where I would have no misgivings making him the selection. :)

QFT.

threetoedpete
12-17-2007, 11:48 AM
Collins, the LT from KU, is only a JR this year and will not declare. He has already stated that he is coming back to KU. However, he is a good "under the radar" guy from next year. He is more valuable to our team than Talib. Anthony Collins was the leader of our dominant running game. Think about it like this, we (KU) replaced all 3 interior OL positions with underclassmen, replaced our All-Big 12 RB, and replaced our QB (thought that worked out very well), and he was pretty much the only constant to remain, and he held everything together and dominated all season.

Anthony Collins is more valuable to the KU football team than Sheron Collins is to our basketball team. (Sheron was an all-American in HS, a 5 star prospect, and a starter as a sophomore for us)

If the Texans send the feelers, he'll come out. Same with Oher. Thirty million is thirty million. Buy a lot with thirty million in the bank. I don't care who you are. He gets wind he's a day one canidate, he'll come out.

badboy
12-17-2007, 04:13 PM
If the Texans send the feelers, he'll come out. Same with Oher. Thirty million is thirty million. Buy a lot with thirty million in the bank. I don't care who you are. He gets wind he's a day one canidate, he'll come out.From your lips to his ears. Does not mean we'd get him but would move the players around a bit.