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eriadoc
11-25-2007, 03:52 PM
I've been talking about it all season long, and the problem is still there. Schaub consistently underthrows his WRs. Yeah, yeah ... I know he plays well for the most part. I'm not going into a wholesale rant against Schaub. I like the guy, and I wanted the guy when no one thought it was possible. That doesn't stop me from recognizing his underthrows. I'm wondering why the staff hasn't picked up on it and done something to correct it (scheme, whatever) - or if that's even possible.

It's getting old. The two underthrown balls to AJ took us out of this game as much or moreso than OD's fumble.

Ryan
11-25-2007, 03:57 PM
that has been his fault today, hope kubes and co. will work on that before the titans next week. An ugly game for the texans today:gun:

Ckw
11-25-2007, 03:59 PM
I've been talking about it all season long, and the problem is still there. Schaub consistently underthrows his WRs. Yeah, yeah ... I know he plays well for the most part. I'm not going into a wholesale rant against Schaub. I like the guy, and I wanted the guy when no one thought it was possible. That doesn't stop me from recognizing his underthrows. I'm wondering why the staff hasn't picked up on it and done something to correct it (scheme, whatever) - or if that's even possible.

It's getting old. The two underthrown balls to AJ took us out of this game as much or moreso than OD's fumble.

You're right. I won't disagree. It may be why Schaub is never an elite quarterback but an elite quarterback in our system. We have know running game. It's forcing us to go to the air. The fact is when Schaub has to bomb it, he always has to lob it. With the lob, he is having a lot less accuracy.

austintexanite
11-25-2007, 03:59 PM
Really can't argue with that, it appeared that he was floating the ball today instead of throwing some lasers.

austintexanite
11-25-2007, 04:00 PM
You're right. I won't disagree. It may be why Schaub is never an elite quarterback but an elite quarterback in our system. We have know running game. It's forcing us to go to the air. The fact is when Schaub has to bomb it, he always has to lob it. With the lob, he is having a lot less accuracy.

I think our running game was pretty good today, Schaub just played like A** today.

adam
11-25-2007, 04:04 PM
When we dumped David for Matt, all we did was trade arm strength for pass accuracy. Matt seems to feel pressure when none is there and throws to recievers who are behind the first down marker. Sound familiar? Yes, Matt is better than Dave, and in anger I am probably over-reacting. None-the-less, Matt Slob is not the future of this franchise. Hell, isn't Anderson a free agent next season? At this rate, I would settle for Chad Pennington.

eriadoc
11-25-2007, 04:08 PM
When we dumped David for Matt, all we did was trade arm strength for pass accuracy. Matt seems to feel pressure when none is there and throws to recievers who are behind the first down marker. Sound familiar? Yes, Matt is better than Dave, and in anger I am probably over-reacting. None-the-less, Matt Slob is not the future of this franchise. Hell, isn't Anderson a free agent next season? At this rate, I would settle for Chad Pennington.

You're definitely overreacting. Schaub has what it takes in most of the important areas. Arm strength is definitely an issue. However, I have seen other noodle-armed QBs have very good seasons. I think the arm strength issue can be overcome, but it appears that it hasn't been addressed at all by the coaching staff, in terms of scheme. I'm sure Matt needs to work on it in the offseason as well, but he's never going to have a gun.

TEXANRED
11-25-2007, 04:08 PM
Matt Schaub had a David Carr day. He just let the 32nd ranked D make him look like a fool.

nut
11-25-2007, 04:09 PM
Schaub will be an average nfl quarterback at best. Have never seen what everybody was talking about. Sage has done about the same, except for his comeback. Matt is a slight upgrade over Carr.

And I still don't see why we took Ahman Green other than what Sherman wants, Sherman gets.

Ckw
11-25-2007, 04:13 PM
When we dumped David for Matt, all we did was trade arm strength for pass accuracy. Matt seems to feel pressure when none is there and throws to recievers who are behind the first down marker. Sound familiar? Yes, Matt is better than Dave, and in anger I am probably over-reacting. None-the-less, Matt Slob is not the future of this franchise. Hell, isn't Anderson a free agent next season? At this rate, I would settle for Chad Pennington.

I think you're overreacting man. Think about it. Schaub's first INT was a fluke. It wasn't a bad throw. Then we still keep momentum, start driving down the field, and Owen fumbles the freakin ball! After that, momentum was gone. Schaub made 1 really bad throw today by under throwing AJ. But Chad Pennington? Schaub is fine. And everyone questioning his arm, well he's not great but I believe we lead the league in passes of 40+. Schaub is fine.

adam
11-25-2007, 04:17 PM
You're definitely overreacting. Schaub has what it takes in most of the important areas. Arm strength is definitely an issue. However, I have seen other noodle-armed QBs have very good seasons. I think the arm strength issue can be overcome, but it appears that it hasn't been addressed at all by the coaching staff, in terms of scheme. I'm sure Matt needs to work on it in the offseason as well, but he's never going to have a gun.

What are the important areas? Because, if Schaub is doing something right, I don't know what it is. Have you noticed that the only time he shows up is when Andre shows up? When Andre is not in the line up, Schaub looks pathetic and throws horrid passes. When Andre has a bad game, Schaub has a bad game. We have a very talented WR corps, and I think they make Schaub look much better than he really is. Which is sad, because he doesn't look that great. He crumbles under pressure, throws it behind the first down marker, can't put any zip on the ball, and can't complete any passes unless the reciever makes a miraculous move to catch the ball, he is no precision passer. Yeah, he might develop eventually...but to be frank, I am sick and tired of eventually. Eventually we all grow old and die. Eventually, the franchise packs it up and moves to Tennesee. I am not willing to waste 5 years on a QB who can't get it done. We did that with Carr, I hope that the front office has learned better since then.

TheIronDuke
11-25-2007, 04:20 PM
What are the important areas? Because, if Schaub is doing something right, I don't know what it is. Have you noticed that the only time he shows up is when Andre shows up? When Andre is not in the line up, Schaub looks pathetic and throws horrid passes. When Andre has a bad game, Schaub has a bad game. We have a very talented WR corps, and I think they make Schaub look much better than he really is. Which is sad, because he doesn't look that great. He crumbles under pressure, throws it behind the first down marker, can't put any zip on the ball, and can't complete any passes unless the reciever makes a miraculous move to catch the ball, he is no precision passer. Yeah, he might develop eventually...but to be frank, I am sick and tired of eventually. Eventually we all grow old and die. Eventually, the franchise packs it up and moves to Tennesee. I am not willing to waste 5 years on a QB who can't get it done. We did that with Carr, I hope that the front office has learned better since then.

Dude, after watching the abortion of QB play that Carr did for 5 years here, Schaub looks like Favre and Joe Montana had a love child blessed by Jesus Christ himself. I think you're over-reacting and I understand. But Schaub has at least looked good at some times this season. He had a bad game, it happens.

adam
11-25-2007, 04:27 PM
Dude, after watching the abortion of QB play that Carr did for 5 years here, Schaub looks like Favre and Joe Montana had a love child blessed by Jesus Christ himself. I think you're over-reacting and I understand. But Schaub has at least looked good at some times this season. He had a bad game, it happens.

I am pretty pissed, and no...Schaub is not as bad as Carr. I'll give him that. However, I have noticed that, without Andre Johnson playing a hell of a game, Schaub just doesn't produce. He makes a lot of stupid passes and doesn't have the arm strength to avoid getting picked off on the short routes. He is mediocre, which is not good enough for me. Dave was horrible, really horrible. However, that doesn't make Matt's mediocrity feel much better. We need a QB we can count on, and Schaub can not be counted on in pressure situations.

Ckw
11-25-2007, 04:28 PM
Man I really think you guys are losing it. Our line had a horrible day, offensively and defensively. Schaub did well statistically, going for 256 yds and 2 tds. Yeah, he gutted us with his late INT but he should overcome that. It was a bad throw. That was Tony Romo all of last year. So chill out guys. It wasn't a good game for Schaub. It also wasn't a Carr game either.

Ckw
11-25-2007, 04:37 PM
I think our running game was pretty good today, Schaub just played like A** today.

Oh and if you call 77 yards TOTAL rushing a good running game, then how can you call Schaub's game bad?

Marcus
11-25-2007, 04:44 PM
Yeah, you guys are overreacting. Schaub had a bad game, but that's no reason to go off the deep end. Schaub will take us where we need to go. We need a good running back, and some more help on the offensive line, but we all knew that before the season began.

To repeat, Schaub didn't have a good game today. But I've seen enough from him so far, season-wise, to tell me that QB is not something that needs addressing in the offseason.

I mean, look at the bright side. We could have been stuck with that schlep that plays QB with the Titans.:heh:

HoustonFrog
11-25-2007, 04:46 PM
Sorry there are plenty of passes that aren't "underthrow" but that Schaub puts in position for his receivers. I wrote it in the game thread and the announcers said it multiple times..sometimes your receivers have to go up and get balls and or come back to balls. Today Andre and Jacoby and others waited on passes to get to them. That isn't on the QB. Schaub made some mistakes but did what he could today. People are fairweathered. Schaub is above mediocre and has shown an arm and ability to get the ball in spaces. We had drops and a bunch of plays where the receivers were of no help. People who praise him one week and then start this b.s. just have no clue.

GP
11-25-2007, 04:48 PM
I would argue that Andre Johnson did not show up to play today.

Maybe the cooler weather made his knee tighten up, restricting his explosiveness or something. But the guy was going half-speed all day today, IMO, except for the play he made at the end of the game.

AJ can't let short, no-name DBs manhandle him like #22 did today. This was not the AJ who was all over the field last week.

And Owen Daniels needed to receive a huge reear-chewing, IMO, when he came to the sideline after fumbling. This is beginning to feel like a paper cut just under my fingernail: Just when it heals, I accidentally open it up again and it hurts...and we have to start the mending process all over again.

This also marks another game where we let a team's best player beat us down all game long (MJD, Gates, Winslow). Why can we not see that the QB is doing 3-step drops and zinging it to Winslow every other play?

Seems Cleveland figured out what the Saints didn't: The underneath pass is there ALL DAY. The Saints foolishly kept running the ball, and the Browns decided they would spread us out and pick up 5 yards a pop by just throwing little slants and curls all game long. Then, bust Lewis off on a few well-executed run plays...it was classic Richard Smith defense: Bend, bend, bend, bend, bend, bend...

nut
11-25-2007, 04:48 PM
Yeah, you guys are overreacting. Schaub had a bad game, but that's no reason to go off the deep end. Schaub will take us where we need to go. We need a good running back, and some more help on the offensive line, but we all knew that before the season began.

To repeat, Schaub didn't have a good game today. But I've seen enough from him so far, season-wise, to tell me that QB is not something that needs addressing in the offseason.

I mean, look at the bright side. We could have been stuck with that schlep that plays QB with the Titans.:heh:

You are keeping the VY/RB debate alive. The FO would flip-flop that pick if they could.

TheRealJoker
11-25-2007, 04:49 PM
Every qb underthrows balls in a game. Nobody can throw a perfect game and sometimes plays are designed to be underthrown based on the coverage.

The difference between when someone like Schaub underthrows the ball and when a guy like Brady does is that Brady's got guys that will bail him out like Randy Moss. I love AJ but one of his weaknesses is the fact that he doesn't fight for the ball like an elite WR should.

EX: The play where he let the ball come into his body and Mcdonald knocked it out of his hands. That was "underthrown" but if it were Moss he would've gotten up and got it instead of waiting for it to come to him.

That being said, Schaub got worse as the game wore on and needs to play a complete game for us to be a winner.

austintexanite
11-25-2007, 04:52 PM
Oh and if you call 77 yards TOTAL rushing a good running game, then how can you call Schaub's game bad?

Yah, pretty much all those yards where Dayne's. We got too pass happy and didn't stick with the run. Ron had a good game, but we didn't capitalize on that all day. Ron is not an all pro but he did play well today and Schaub didn't play well. I like Matt and still think he's our QB no matter what, it was just one of those days.

SheTexan
11-25-2007, 04:53 PM
As usual this year, we were out coached!!

HoustonFrog
11-25-2007, 04:55 PM
Every qb underthrows balls in a game. Nobody can throw a perfect game and sometimes plays are designed to be underthrown based on the coverage.

The difference between when someone like Schaub underthrows the ball and when a guy like Brady does is that Brady's got guys that will bail him out like Randy Moss. I love AJ but one of his weaknesses is the fact that he doesn't fight for the ball like an elite WR should.

EX: The play where he let the ball come into his body and Mcdonald knocked it out of his hands. That was "underthrown" but if it were Moss he would've gotten up and got it instead of waiting for it to come to him.

That being said, Schaub got worse as the game wore on and needs to play a complete game for us to be a winner.

Exactly what I said in this thread. The announcers noticed it and I was talking about it in the game thread. You can't wait for a ball to get to your body..you have to go get the ball.

RTP2110
11-25-2007, 05:01 PM
I've noticed Schaub's inaccuracy since the preseason. It's rare you see a reciever catch one of his passes in stride. Some of it may be attributed to lack of arm strength. What I like about Schaub is that he makes up for his arm with his decision making. I think it's too early to write the book on him either way though.

nunusguy
11-25-2007, 05:26 PM
I think you're overreacting man. Think about it. Schaub's first INT was a fluke. It wasn't a bad throw. Then we still keep momentum, start driving down the field, and Owen fumbles the freakin ball! After that, momentum was gone. Schaub made 1 really bad throw today by under throwing AJ. But Chad Pennington? Schaub is fine. And everyone questioning his arm, well he's not great but I believe we lead the league in passes of 40+. Schaub is fine.
Good analysis.
The first pick was a pure fluke. The second one was a bad throw.
Schaub didn't lose the game today. He sure didn't win it for us, but he didn't lose it either. And he's clearly better, much better than Carr was.

Ckw
11-25-2007, 05:27 PM
I've noticed Schaub's inaccuracy since the preseason. It's rare you see a reciever catch one of his passes in stride. Some of it may be attributed to lack of arm strength. What I like about Schaub is that he makes up for his arm with his decision making. I think it's too early to write the book on him either way though.

Good points. Rep.

Thorn
11-25-2007, 06:24 PM
Good analysis.
The first pick was a pure fluke. The second one was a bad throw.
Schaub didn't lose the game today. He sure didn't win it for us, but he didn't lose it either. And he's clearly better, much better than Carr was.

He's an improvement over Carr, that's for sure. In reality, this is his rookie year. I'm willing to cut him some slack.

The Texans just don't have a kick their ass attitude yet. As soon as they get one of those things there are a lot of teams that will fall before us.

ObsiWan
11-25-2007, 06:38 PM
Really can't argue with that, it appeared that he was floating the ball today instead of throwing some lasers.

His under-throws have cost us points and yds all season. Most of the time the WRs can make a play on the ball but sometimes his balls just don't have the zip one would like to see.

Somebody get that boy into the weight room.

Runner
11-25-2007, 07:08 PM
I'm wondering why the staff hasn't picked up on it and done something to correct it (scheme, whatever) - or if that's even possible.


Really can't argue with that, it appeared that he was floating the ball today instead of throwing some lasers.

seems to feel pressure when none is there and throws to recievers who are behind the first down marker.

but it appears that it hasn't been addressed at all by the coaching staff, in terms of scheme.

Our line had a horrible day,

did well statistically, going for 256 yds and 2 tds.

We need a good running back, and some more help on the offensive line, but we all knew that before the season began.


This sounds so familiar for some reason...

The more things change the more they stay the same.

ObsiWan
11-25-2007, 07:38 PM
Yeah, you guys are overreacting. Schaub had a bad game, but that's no reason to go off the deep end. Schaub will take us where we need to go. We need a good running back, and some more help on the offensive line, but we all knew that before the season began.

To repeat, Schaub didn't have a good game today. But I've seen enough from him so far, season-wise, to tell me that QB is not something that needs addressing in the offseason.

I mean, look at the bright side. We could have been stuck with that schlep that plays QB with the Titans.:heh:

I agree. Some of you are really over-reacting. Slow down and think clearly. This is Schaub's, what? 9th or 10th start ...Ever. He's throwing to Andre Johnson, a whodat (Walter), a cast-off (Davis), a rookie (JJ), and a TE who can catch but can't keep the ball after he's hit. Remember, this is their first season together. Yet you guys want Tom Brady/Peyton Manning performances. Not yet. We don't have Lawrence Maroney/Joseph Addai at RB. We don't have a Pats/Colts O-line or their defenses who can regularly stop the other guys from scoring.

I know its irritating to be so close and not get there. And its really-freakin' irritating to know that if we had won we'd be tied, at 6-5, with Tennessee.

TexanMike tried to tell us several games ago, that this would not be a playoff season. Growing pains, too many positions (AND coaching spots) that need upgrades, too many injuries.

But this is still better than being 3-8 like we were last year after 11 games. And as one who predicted this to be an 7-9 or 8-8 year, I'm disappointed - both this and the Atlanta games could/should have been wins - but not too surprised.

Next year should be the one where we seriously threaten.

:fans:

HoustonFrog
11-25-2007, 08:08 PM
This sounds so familiar for some reason...

The more things change the more they stay the same.

If this is any way a reference to Carr don't even go there. The two are night and day and I think people are a little quick to jump on the guy. If you watched the game and thought it looked familiar then you aren't watching the same guys. ear Lord, the guy has looked sharp for the most part when he has had the full compliment. He didn't even look terrible today and people are nitpicking like we are supposed to be the Patriots.

Maddict5
11-25-2007, 08:15 PM
jesus we have a bad game and suddenly its time to blow everything up... young guys have bad games, unfortunately alot of ours had bad ones today

seriously-just got online and thought i was back on the official board again

and the guys comparing schaub to carr are obviously clueless...

Originally Posted by adam
seems to feel pressure when none is there

go take a look at his td pass to dressen last week and wonder why that is.. ok? thanks (again lol at the carr comparisons)

and OD has had a rough season.. i think i even mentioned it during the chargers game but he'll get past it hopefully.. he was fine last yr

Wolf
11-25-2007, 08:21 PM
it's called http://www.panthershuddle.com/newforum/images/smilies/bricks.gif after a loss

Runner
11-25-2007, 08:23 PM
If this is any way a reference to Carr don't even go there. The two are night and day and I think people are a little quick to jump on the guy. If you watched the game and thought it looked familiar then you aren't watching the same guys.

I said the posts sound familiar. Same complaints we've seen for years. I didn't compare the two QBs at all.

If you watched the game and thought it looked familiar then you aren't watching the same guys.

If you don't think the posts look familar, you aren't reading the same ones.

===============================================

I'm not surprised anyway. I'm on record that the line wouldn't be fixed by changing QBs, and it isn't. A lot of Schaub's bad throws are because he's pressured, can't step into the throw, etc. He's getting nervous back there. Again, no surprise.

Oh, and the above isn't a reference to Carr either. It is a reference to the bad o-line.

Carr was bad; the o-line was bad. They fixed one.

Wolf
11-25-2007, 08:25 PM
I said the posts sound familiar. Same complaints we've seen for years. I didn't compare the two QBs at all.



If you don't think the posts look familar, you aren't reading the same ones.

===============================================

I'm not surprised anyway. I'm on record that the line wouldn't be fixed by changing QBs, and it isn't. A lot of Schaub's bad throws are because he's pressured, can't step into the throw, etc. He's getting nervous back there. Again, no surprise.

Oh, and the above isn't a reference to Carr either. It is a reference to the bad o-line.

Carr was bad; the o-line was bad. They fixed one.

true runner.. I looked at stats and we have given up 13 sacks (might be 15 if it wasn't updated as of a few minutes ago)... we fixed the QB (like you said) and yes, we need to fix the OL before we ruin this QB

Maddict5
11-25-2007, 08:32 PM
agreed on the o-line.. we better fix it this year this offseason before it affects schaub long term.. we need a big FA aswell to fix the other stuff like rb and secondary

TheRealJoker
11-25-2007, 08:32 PM
I think its crazy when I hear people say anything but OL should be our top priority in the offseason.

ObsiWan
11-25-2007, 08:33 PM
I think its crazy when I hear people say anything but OL should be our top priority in the offseason.

Unless they say it should be CB/FS.

HoustonFrog
11-25-2007, 09:12 PM
I said the posts sound familiar. Same complaints we've seen for years. I didn't compare the two QBs at all.



If you don't think the posts look familar, you aren't reading the same ones.

===============================================

I'm not surprised anyway. I'm on record that the line wouldn't be fixed by changing QBs, and it isn't. A lot of Schaub's bad throws are because he's pressured, can't step into the throw, etc. He's getting nervous back there. Again, no surprise.

Oh, and the above isn't a reference to Carr either. It is a reference to the bad o-line.

Carr was bad; the o-line was bad. They fixed one.

Just wanted a clarification. Thanks! I know the complaints sound the same but I still don't think they are justified overall. Our sacks are way down this year and I think Schaub still looked pretty good today. People are talking about all of these underthrown balls but as I have said in this thread and in the game thread the announcers were even saying that many of his balls could have been caught if the receiver didn't keep drifting an dletting it get to their body. They need to go up and get it before the DB gets there. Schaub was sharp last week and this week had one real bad throw. The one int was interference and a tip that wasn't his fault. Do I think our O-line needs to improve next year and we need to upgrade..hell yes,...but the jumping on and off the Schaub bandwagon by people after a game like today is ridiculous. The O-line complaints...I can take and know that it is an area of concern, along with DB and safety.

maddogmrb
11-25-2007, 09:17 PM
Just wanted a clarification. Thanks! I know the complaints sound the same but I still don't think they are justified overall. Our sacks are way down this year and I think Schaub still looked pretty good today. People are talking about all of these underthrown balls but as I have said in this thread and in the game thread the announcers were even saying that many of his balls could have been caught if the receiver didn't keep drifting an dletting it get to their body. They need to go up and get it before the DB gets there. Schaub was sharp last week and this week had one real bad throw. The one int was interference and a tip that wasn't his fault. Do I think our O-line needs to improve next year and we need to upgrade..hell yes,...but the jumping on and off the Schaub bandwagon by people after a game like today is ridiculous. The O-line complaints...I can take and know that it is an area of concern, along with DB and safety.


Why is it okay to complain about the oline and DB's but, not Schaub? What makes him untouchable?

bckey
11-25-2007, 09:18 PM
Next year should be the one where we seriously threaten.:fans:

Its always next year for Houston. We are already used to it. Six years and counting... And that isn't counting the Oilers lean years.

As far as Schaub goes his worst play was taking that 12 yard sack. He got happy feet after that and threw the int. He did under throw a lot but we were in it until the sack and int.

Not sure what happened to Andre but he was a non factor. The Texans continue to kill drives with critical penalties and turnovers while allowing the opposing teams big 3rd down plays over and over.

One final note. Is it too much to ask CBS that we please not get Steve Tasker as an announcer?

HoustonFrog
11-25-2007, 11:03 PM
Why is it okay to complain about the oline and DB's but, not Schaub? What makes him untouchable?

I didn't say he was untouchable. I just think the complaints are unfounded. I think he has made his share of mistakes but I also think if you've watched every game that he has been a major plus. I think people complaining about todays game have really no legit reason to place the blame on him. The guy has maybe 9 total pro starts and he is still better than anything we have seen at QB when it comes to pocket presence and running the offense. Last week people thought he was a stud and he makes a couple of bad plays this week and people nitpick. I think it is unreasonable. JMO. The DBs have been getting burned for years and the O-line, while improved, still has its problems....something we have had to deal with.

Dan B.
11-26-2007, 12:12 AM
What are the important areas? Because, if Schaub is doing something right, I don't know what it is. Have you noticed that the only time he shows up is when Andre shows up? When Andre is not in the line up, Schaub looks pathetic and throws horrid passes. When Andre has a bad game, Schaub has a bad game. We have a very talented WR corps, and I think they make Schaub look much better than he really is. Which is sad, because he doesn't look that great. He crumbles under pressure, throws it behind the first down marker, can't put any zip on the ball, and can't complete any passes unless the reciever makes a miraculous move to catch the ball, he is no precision passer. Yeah, he might develop eventually...but to be frank, I am sick and tired of eventually. Eventually we all grow old and die. Eventually, the franchise packs it up and moves to Tennesee. I am not willing to waste 5 years on a QB who can't get it done. We did that with Carr, I hope that the front office has learned better since then.

Two of his best games of the year were against Atlanta and Miami, neither of which Andre appeared in. Schaub had his worst game this year today, except for Tennessee, in which he barely appeared before being clobbered into oblivion. I was really disappointed in several facets of our team, especially Richard Smith's playcalling. I thought we should have capitalized on our chances, but that offensively the team continually missed the opportunities available.

I really don't understand the negativity on this thread towards Schaub. He definitely had one of his worst games of the year, but he was still solid through the first half. Just looking at what Carr and VY were doing --combining for less than Schaub's total points and leading thoroughly listless teams to a listless finish -- I'm inclined to think we chose well at least short term, and that there are a lot of other positions on this team to worry about besides QB.

Schaub has a disturbing tendency to force one play a game at a really bad time, I'll admit. I'm willing to give him and Kubiak through next year though, since there's been so many injuries this year -- I'm honestly shocked we're only a game under .500 to be honest. There had better be some real improvement in the offseason, and I'm hoping we can either get Spencer back or get a LT any way possible.

As for this year, we'll know next week what our chances are like for finishing near what I thought would be a .500 season. Tennessee is plummeting right now, and if we can't beat them with the team we have right now, then I wouldn't expect any higher than last year at 6-10. If we do, then we follow with two very winnable games against Tampa and Denver, and might even be able to finish 9-7, thereby ruining at least one team's postseason hopes as well as closing with a strong finish. I'm not done yet, but I'm close to throwing in the towel on the year as far as any expectation of competing.

austintexanite
11-26-2007, 12:15 AM
I didn't say he was untouchable. I just think the complaints are unfounded. I think he has made his share of mistakes but I also think if you've watched every game that he has been a major plus. I think people complaining about todays game have really no legit reason to place the blame on him. The guy has maybe 9 total pro starts and he is still better than anything we have seen at QB when it comes to pocket presence and running the offense. Last week people thought he was a stud and he makes a couple of bad plays this week and people nitpick. I think it is unreasonable. JMO. The DBs have been getting burned for years and the O-line, while improved, still has its problems....something we have had to deal with.

I think Schaub has played well all year, today just wasn't his day. His passes didn't look like some of the bullets he's thrown this year and that was one of his picks. His first INT, in my opinion, wasn't one and the Browns should have been called for pass interference.

eriadoc
11-26-2007, 10:19 AM
To be clear, this isn't a case of piling on after one bad game. I have been saying from the beginning of the year that Schaub consistently underthrows his deep balls. He's been completing them, but almost every one of his deep balls, even his TDs, have been underthrown. The WRs have made some very good plays on them. Think about every long pass ADavis has caught - they've all been underthrown. Most of the long balls to AJ have been underthrown, but he's been so wide open that no one pays attention to the fact that AJ has to slow up or even stop for the ball. It's a recurring problem that hasn't risen up and bitten Schaub too often - yet.

That is the focus of what I am referring to. Schaub makes great reads, and for the most part, when there is one, he hangs in the pocket well. He doesn't usually force the ball, and he challenges all parts of the field. I think he has the potential to be a very good QB. The underthrows concern me, however, and those who write them off now will be talking about them in upcoming years.

Vinny
11-26-2007, 10:34 AM
Shaub had a good first quarter but the more the Texans went away from the run and the more unbalanced the offense got the more his game degenerated as it unfolded. To me it looked like when he had time and nobody was open....its impossible to see downfield on TV but there were lots of times he held on to the ball a long time and still had nowhere to throw the ball at times. Winston didn't have a very good game either. Schaub had lots of pressure from the edges yesterday.

pappy
11-27-2007, 06:29 PM
Every qb underthrows balls in a game. Nobody can throw a perfect game and sometimes plays are designed to be underthrown based on the coverage.

The difference between when someone like Schaub underthrows the ball and when a guy like Brady does is that Brady's got guys that will bail him out like Randy Moss. I love AJ but one of his weaknesses is the fact that he doesn't fight for the ball like an elite WR should.

EX: The play where he let the ball come into his body and Mcdonald knocked it out of his hands. That was "underthrown" but if it were Moss he would've gotten up and got it instead of waiting for it to come to him.

That being said, Schaub got worse as the game wore on and needs to play a complete game for us to be a winner.

It is not all his fault when you see that fat tub of lard dayne on a screen pass . After catching it , indecisive and clearly scared going nowhere you know schaubs being tentative and scared is not the only problem . We can all just ignore flannigan and his crappy day as we have no option there . where does it end ? we need some petal to the metal bad to the bone real men on this offense .

CloakNNNdagger
11-27-2007, 06:55 PM
I think you're overreacting man. Think about it. Schaub's first INT was a fluke. It wasn't a bad throw. Then we still keep momentum, start driving down the field, and Owen fumbles the freakin ball! After that, momentum was gone. Schaub made 1 really bad throw today by under throwing AJ. But Chad Pennington? Schaub is fine. And everyone questioning his arm, well he's not great but I believe we lead the league in passes of 40+. Schaub is fine.


Even though I am far from giving up on Schaub for this ugly team and personal performance, let me point out that the "passes of 40+" statistic, I believe, is based on yardage including after the catch.

Lucky
11-27-2007, 07:35 PM
Schaub & his receivers had a bad day. It happens. Schaub looked a little rusty, as did AJ & Jacoby. Daniels needs to hang on to the ball. I believe in these guys and I'm sure they will have better days. That they laid an egg in such a big game is disappointing, but you move on to the next big game.

One aspect I haven't heard mentioned was the wind at Browns Stadium. It may not have been as bad as it once was at the Mistake by the Lake, but there were wind gusts up to 20 MPH during the game. Browns QB Anderson has a strong arm, but he fared much better with passes on a line than with the touch passes. Sometimes, you have to take into account the field conditions. And the Browns did a better job in that regard.

As far as arm strength goes, I'd put Schaub no worse than middle of the pack among NFL starters. Combine that with his ability to read defenses, his accuracy, and his poise, I think Matt is more part of the solution than part of the problem.

infantrycak
11-27-2007, 08:22 PM
Even though I am far from giving up on Schaub for this ugly team and personal performance, let me point out that the "passes of 40+" statistic, I believe, is based on yardage including after the catch.

Correct but in this case, all but 2-3 came from passes to Davis and Walter with almost zero YAC. Take those 2-3 out and they still rank highly even though the other 31 teams are still including YAC.