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View Full Version : Time for Martyball or CowherPower. We need a tough blue collar attitude


TexansFight
10-29-2007, 10:42 AM
Seriously, if I was Bob McNair I would have been on the phone immediately after yesterday's embarrassment with BOTH of these guys to see who is interested into coming in and fixing this mess. I know this, both Cowher and Marty would hold our players accountable and wastes of space like Faggins and Ron Dayne would not see the field. You think Cowher would tolerate a team that does NOTHING when their QB gets nearly decapitated on a cheap shot.

Marty has a great track record in turning around programs and fielding playoff caliber teams. Yes his teams have choked and folded in the playoffs. At this point, I WOULD love to have a team in the playoffs finally. I wax nostalgic for the R&S Oilers since that is the last time I rooted for a winning Houston NFL team.

The Texans are a cash cow. McNair needs to pony up whatever it will cost to get winners in here to turn this mess around. This is a blue collar town that craves a hard hitting, hard working team that is a winner. We have a team that plays like gutless pansies. We need to burn this thing to the ground and start from the ground up with a guy like Cowher or Marty.

Hookem Horns
10-29-2007, 10:58 AM
Kubes will be here at least another 2 seasons regardless of the result. However, it's WAY too early to start coming down on Kubiak.

powerfuldragon
10-29-2007, 10:59 AM
impluse thread.

Vinny
10-29-2007, 11:01 AM
Kubes will be here at least another 2 seasons regardless of the result. However, it's WAY too early to start coming down on Kubiak.
I donno about that. This Texans team isn't even competitive. They have not looked like a NFL team the last 3 weeks giving up 108 points between the Jags, Chargers and Titans. This team has been outcoached and plays soft. Not a good combination.

gtexan02
10-29-2007, 11:02 AM
Frankly I just think we need someone like that on defense. A defensive coordinator with a take no prisoners, hit them in the mouth attitude. I think the offense will be OK

The1ApplePie
10-29-2007, 11:04 AM
Kubes will be here at least another 2 seasons regardless of the result. However, it's WAY too early to start coming down on Kubiak.

Kubes gets to be the goat. Let him go to A&M and find someone better.

Garrett
Martz
Saunders
Rivera
Pees (NE D-Coordinator)

All would be a good fit

Texans_Chick
10-29-2007, 11:04 AM
No matter how much money McNair has, who wants to come to Houston?

If you are a respected coach, you want to go to a great situation. Houston situation is uh, not the bestest.

We have a greater likelihood to be able to get quality assistants than head coaches. McNair is not afraid to pay assistants.

TexansFight
10-29-2007, 11:15 AM
Marty and Cowher are available right now. Both would be a serious upgrade in coaching. Kubiak is not head coaching material. I think he knew that himself and that is why he never went after a HC gig while married to the hip with Shanahan. From everything that I read, Shanahan was the brains behind the Denver offense and still had tremendous amount of control over offensive playcalling.

Kubiak's coaching has been awful. The team is unprepared, the schemes suck, and there is no fire. Repeat with me BURN THIS MOTHERF&$&* DOWN. Start from scratch. I can't take Capers-Kubiak coaching and teams anymore.

Leahmic223
10-29-2007, 11:22 AM
No matter how much money McNair has, who wants to come to Houston?

If you are a respected coach, you want to go to a great situation. Houston situation is uh, not the bestest.

We have a greater likelihood to be able to get quality assistants than head coaches. McNair is not afraid to pay assistants.

Yeah I would think that Cowher and Marty would like to go to situations with a established team. We are more likely to get coaches who are still trying to prove themselves, not a superbowl champion like Cowher unless he feels has plenty of years left in him to help build the team.

Hookem Horns
10-29-2007, 11:25 AM
I was hoping Cowher would get the Giants job (the rumor is he was too), however unless they follow the pattern of the last couple of seasons and fall apart in the second half of the season I don't see Coughlin getting axed.

You can have Marty, I went through enough build up followed by playoff chokes with the Oilers.

Vinny
10-29-2007, 11:26 AM
I was hoping Cowher would get the Giants job (the rumor is he was too), however unless they follow the pattern of the last couple of seasons and fall apart in the second half of the season I don't see Coughlin getting axed.

You can have Marty, I went through enough build up followed by playoff chokes with the Oilers.One certain thing about Marty was that his teams were always tough to play, inspired, and most of all...winners. Dude has the same knock that lots of great coaches had not being able to win the big one...but that's better than not being able to build a winning franchise.

Mr. White
10-29-2007, 11:30 AM
We oughtta get a blue-collar defensive mind like that guy in Miami. Word has it that he's one of the best Defensive Coordinators around. :joker:

Carr Bombed
10-29-2007, 11:48 AM
You can have Marty, I went through enough build up followed by playoff chokes with the Oilers.

I would rather be heartbroken in January than bitter by the end of October, year after year, after year, after year, after year, after year......(if anyone's counting that's 6 seasons. :gun: )

nunusguy
10-29-2007, 11:52 AM
You can have Marty, I went through enough build up followed by playoff chokes with the Oilers.

As a long-suffereing Texans fan, I would welcome the problem of having a coach who can't win in the playoffs, though has little trouble getting his teams into the palyoffs.
And in particular, I'm a big fan of Marty-Ball.

Goldensilence
10-29-2007, 11:59 AM
knee jerk reaction.

nunusguy
10-29-2007, 12:01 PM
knee jerk reaction.

If Kubiak ends with less than 6 wins, you might see McNair have a knee jerk reaction.

Carr Bombed
10-29-2007, 12:16 PM
knee jerk reaction.

After 6 years of watching this team, I'm developing parkinson's

Porky
10-29-2007, 12:20 PM
Cohwer would be my first choice because I think this team is soft. You can't be soft and last on a Cohwer team. Marty would be choice 2. The question is does one of them have so much of an ego that he wants to be the one to be seen as the savior, to show the world how great of a coach he is? Otherwise, they will end up with much better, ready to contend right away teams.

I'm not ready to bail on Kubes at this point UNLESS one of these two is available. Otherwise, he gets at least one more yr from me....of course pending the rest of the season as a caveat. This team needs to show a pulse, and soon.

hollywood_texan
10-29-2007, 12:24 PM
There probably is very little chance of ever getting a big name coach here and for two reasons:

1. As everyone has said earlier, team is too much in disarray and would require too much work and effort.

2. Bob McNair puts too many requirements on coaches so they can't do their job effectively. A good coach is not going to be told what to do when it comes to winning. One good example, the Carr extension.

The biggest problem the Texans have when it comes to winning is Bob McNair. You can't run an NFL football team by selecting coaches and players according to white-collar corporate standards.

Texans_Chick
10-29-2007, 12:26 PM
Cohwer would be my first choice because I think this team is soft. You can't be soft and last on a Cohwer team. Marty would be choice 2. The question is does one of them have so much of an ego that he wants to be the one to be seen as the savior, to show the world how great of a coach he is? Otherwise, they will end up with much better, ready to contend right away teams.

I'm not ready to bail on Kubes at this point UNLESS one of these two is available. Otherwise, he gets at least one more yr from me....of course pending the rest of the season as a caveat. This team needs to show a pulse, and soon.

I want Richard Smith gone. He has shown nothing. He has no track record. His defense is rated like crap with both offense and defense. And he comes across as a out of touch buffoon.

I see at least some life on the offensive side of the ball, even if it is put together like some sort of McGuyver thingy of duct tape, chewing gum, and random practice squad players.

The team likes Kubiak generally. I can't say the same thing about Smith.

Carr Bombed
10-29-2007, 12:31 PM
I want Richard Smith gone. He has shown nothing. He has no track record. His defense is rated like crap with both offense and defense. And he comes across as a out of touch buffoon.

I see at least some life on the offensive side of the ball, even if it is put together like some sort of McGuyver thingy of duct tape, chewing gum, and random practice squad players.

The team likes Kubiak generally. I can't say the same thing about Smith.

I also want a new DB coach, I think Hoke gets too much credit for Dunta's rookie season and Glenn on the oppisite side. This secondary never forces any TOs and is continually among the bottom of the league in just about every catagory. I think a new voice would be good for our secondary.

nunusguy
10-29-2007, 12:32 PM
There probably is very little chance of ever getting a big name coach here and for two reasons:

1. As everyone has said earlier, team is too much in disarray and would require too much work and effort.

2. Bob McNair puts too many requirements on coaches so they can't do their job effectively. A good coach is not going to be told what to do when it comes to winning. One good example, the Carr extension.

The biggest problem the Texans have when it comes to winning is Bob McNair. You can't run an NFL football team by selecting coaches and players according to white-collar corporate standards.
It would be interesting to see just how a really capable NFL coach would do with this talent. Is it yesterday bad, or actually closer to what we saw in Charlotte ?
The price to land a big name coach, if its possible, clearly would be the whole package - GM/HC package. I dunno if McNair would pay that price, but by now he has to be awfully desperate for success no matter what the price.

badboy
10-29-2007, 12:40 PM
First things first, Mike Sherman and his gang of Gbay cast offs need to go. I like the idea of having Sherman on board as a sounding board for Kubes but time to go. His input on players he brought is horrible. Second, Smith the D coach should hold Sherman's belt loop so he too can make it out the door without the door slapping his fanny.

The angriest I got was the series after our QB got assassinated by #29 and no one went after Rivers. I don't care if it cost 15yds or a TD but TJ or someone should have leveled their QB. "You don't do that to my QB!" is what ever defensive guy should have been screaming the next 4 downs.

I did not expect a win but I expected the team to look like they knew they were in a football game. That is a coaching issue.

Porky
10-29-2007, 12:43 PM
I want Richard Smith gone. He has shown nothing. He has no track record. His defense is rated like crap with both offense and defense. And he comes across as a out of touch buffoon.

I see at least some life on the offensive side of the ball, even if it is put together like some sort of McGuyver thingy of duct tape, chewing gum, and random practice squad players.

The team likes Kubiak generally. I can't say the same thing about Smith.

Another good post TC. I pretty much feel the same, but at some point, the buck has to stop here (meaning with Kubes). Exactly how much rope we the fans give him is uncertain, but my patience is beginning to wear thin. He needs to step up, because on game days lately, he is getting his ass handed to him by the opposing coach every week. Wouldn't it have been nice to steal Fisher from Bud? :specnatz:

ATX
10-29-2007, 12:49 PM
The angriest I got was the series after our QB got assassinated by #29 and no one went after Rivers. I don't care if it cost 15yds or a TD but TJ or someone should have leveled their QB. "You don't do that to my QB!" is what ever defensive guy should have been screaming the next 4 downs.


Exactly, they do it in baseball. That was a blatant cheap shot.

Maddict5
10-29-2007, 12:51 PM
I donno about that. This Texans team isn't even competitive. They have not looked like a NFL team the last 3 weeks giving up 108 points between the Jags, Chargers and Titans. This team has been outcoached and plays soft. Not a good combination.


both NO and the giants looked the same early on and managed to turn it around

Hagar
10-29-2007, 01:02 PM
Another good post TC. I pretty much feel the same, but at some point, the buck has to stop here (meaning with Kubes). I don't disagree on any one point here, but would like to point out that this defense showed great promise at the end of last year. It would have been hard to go in and make a bunch of changes to the defensive coaching staff that looked like it was on the right track. Personally, I didn't think Smith was a good choice when we hired him, but I was on the bandwagon during the training camp and the first two games this season. Lets face it, the defense was flying to the ball early this year.

Also, you have to remember, the defense has been on the field a lot this season (particularly in Jacksonville and Tennesse games). The defense has to be feeling the pain right now. Don't be suprised if there aren't any or at least only minimal changes to the defensive coaching staff this off season.

Ckw
10-29-2007, 01:13 PM
Can someone please explain to me what has been so terrible about Kubiak? His clock management will get better, and he will learn to stop throwing stupid challenges. Some of his play calling has been suspect, but the first three weeks of the season he looked like a genius. He was throwing the ball down field, and we were running the ball pretty damn well. Now, we can't do any of that. Why? Well we lost the leader of our OL (McKinney), our star RB is broken down and never should have been counted on, and our best WR is out. Yes, Kubiak has looked bad for 5 weeks now. But when we had the pieces, he looked great. Where real coaches show up is what they do when their stars go down. That's when the depth chart comes into play and well guess what: our depth chart sucks!!

Assistants being fired I'm all for. But I'm sorry, Kubiak is not the problem. Why not start calling for Schaub's head after what could have been a 4 INT game if he hadn't been taken out by that cheap shot? But hey it's got to be the Ag's fault right?

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 01:13 PM
There probably is very little chance of ever getting a big name coach here and for two reasons:

1. As everyone has said earlier, team is too much in disarray and would require too much work and effort.

2. Bob McNair puts too many requirements on coaches so they can't do their job effectively. A good coach is not going to be told what to do when it comes to winning. One good example, the Carr extension.

The biggest problem the Texans have when it comes to winning is Bob McNair. You can't run an NFL football team by selecting coaches and players according to white-collar corporate standards.

I don't think either of these are true.

1.) The ground work is laid, the talent is there. Cowher would have his Blue Collar guys working hard in Schaub, Johnson, and Walter. Cowher knows how to build a dominant Oline and a dominant defense. If you can coach in Pittsburgh you can coach anywhere. I also believe you have coach's out there like Cowher that would love a crack at coaching Williams.

The only draw back, and hold on for this one, we go back to the 34 defense. But at least this guy knows how to run it.

2.) I believe after the Carr and Bush thing has gone down McNair has let Rick Smith run with it bringing in good Talent.

Ckw
10-29-2007, 01:16 PM
Don't be suprised if there aren't any or at least only minimal changes to the defensive coaching staff this off season.

I really hope you are wrong. I mean can we start a petition for Frank Bush? And get rid of Sherman! I really believe one of the biggest problems Kubiak and our offense are having is they are being pulled in too many different directions with Kubiak's scheme and Sherman's scheme. A team can't have two head coaches!

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 01:16 PM
Can someone please explain to me what has been so terrible about Kubiak?

Have you seen the team play?

Fisher has less talent to work with and year in and year out has his team be competitive, work hard, and win games b/c he understands how to play within his team.

There is no way with the amount of talent Fisher has on the Titans should they in anyway be going to the playoffs and they are. It turns my stomach to even think about it.

Ckw
10-29-2007, 01:23 PM
Have you seen the team play?

Fisher has less talent to work with and year in and year out has his team be competitive, work hard, and win games b/c he understands how to play within his team.

There is no way with the amount of talent Fisher has on the Titans should they in anyway be going to the playoffs and they are. It turns my stomach to even think about it.

Yes I've watched. I've seen an offensive line provide zero pass protection. I've seen my quarterback scared out of his mind. I've seen us have no running game until the slight one we saw yesterday.

Don't get me started on Fisher. Offensive line on a bad day is better than our's at our best. He actually has a running back and has had one for a few years in Chris Brown. Not to mention Chris Henry, Lendale White, Ahmad Hall, etc. Keep trying to find ways to blame Kubiak but don't come back here jumping up and down saying "I told you so!" if Kubiak does something for this team. In my opinion, none of you guys already bashing Kubiak should be a part of it.

We've been exposed. As about the only sane person in here, KJ, said we are only two seasons removed from 2-14. All you guys expecting a miracle season after all of our injuries are obviously on something. But hey, on with the bashing!

badboy
10-29-2007, 01:24 PM
Have you seen the team play?

Fisher has less talent to work with and year in and year out has his team be competitive, work hard, and win games b/c he understands how to play within his team.

There is no way with the amount of talent Fisher has on the Titans should they in anyway be going to the playoffs and they are. It turns my stomach to even think about it.Fisher is a very good coach that had 10 draft picks and a ton of money last off season. The team basically set on it's hands during free agency. Their team talent is their own problem.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/2007/draft/teams/titans.html

Porky
10-29-2007, 01:37 PM
Have you seen the team play?

Fisher has less talent to work with and year in and year out has his team be competitive, work hard, and win games b/c he understands how to play within his team.

There is no way with the amount of talent Fisher has on the Titans should they in anyway be going to the playoffs and they are. It turns my stomach to even think about it.

Fischer consistently gets more out of less than just about any coach in the league.

Ckw
10-29-2007, 01:46 PM
Oh and our piss poor offense that Kubiak is having such a horrible effect on. Well it's 10th in the league in scoring per game and 9th in yardage per game. Man our play calling sucks! :sarcasm:

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 01:47 PM
Yes I've watched. I've seen an offensive line provide zero pass protection. I've seen my quarterback scared out of his mind. I've seen us have no running game until the slight one we saw yesterday.




We have spent the last six seasons picking high round draft picks and you are telling me that this team still has no talent?

Don't get me started on Fisher. Offensive line on a bad day is better than our's at our best. He actually has a running back and has had one for a few years in Chris Brown. Not to mention Chris Henry, Lendale White, Ahmad Hall, etc. Keep trying to find ways to blame Kubiak but don't come back here jumping up and down saying "I told you so!" if Kubiak does something for this team. In my opinion, none of you guys already bashing Kubiak should be a part of it.
You know why Fisher has all those things? B/C he makes them so. None of those players, not one, could go onto another team and do what they do. You don't lose two hall of fame lineman in five years and keep plugging away like nothing happens unless you are a fantastic caoch.

The Browns! We have more talent than the Browns and they are playing better.

I don't even get that last statement. So what you are saying is that you are hanging with Kubiak so you can say "I told you so" instead of giving an honest evaluation of the team. How many times is Kubiak going to come out to each of his pressers and all but say "I suck as a head coach" before we start to listen?

"Its my fault, I put this loss on us as coach's, we didn't come out prepared, and so on and so on.

We've been exposed. As about the only sane person in here, KJ, said we are only two seasons removed from 2-14. All you guys expecting a miracle season after all of our injuries are obviously on something. But hey, on with the bashing!

2005 was the 2-14 season. Its now 2007 and still playing like 2005.

This is a fluff schedule and we are getting hammered each week.

Kubiak is not the guy. Don't fall in love with players or coach's. Look at the state of your team and give an honest evaluation and admit to yourself what needs to be done so we are not the Cardinals of the AFC.

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 01:49 PM
Oh and our piss poor offense that Kubiak is having such a horrible effect on. Well it's 10th in the league in scoring per game and 9th in yardage per game. Man our play calling sucks! :sarcasm:

You still have to get it into that thing called an End Zone.

Your explosive offensive weapon is not supposed to be your kicker.

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 01:50 PM
Fischer consistently gets more out of less than just about any coach in the league.

Thats my point, Fisher is an example of what a good coach looks like.

Compared to Dom Capers of course Kubiak looks good.

austintexanite
10-29-2007, 02:02 PM
I don't think they should get rid of Kubiak, but I definitely think we need to get a new defenisve staff. However, something were to happen and we did get rid of Kubiak, I would want Cohwer because I feel is a better coach than Schottenheimer and he has won in the playoffs.

Vinny
10-29-2007, 02:04 PM
Oh and our piss poor offense that Kubiak is having such a horrible effect on. Well it's 10th in the league in scoring per game and 9th in yardage per game. Man our play calling sucks! :sarcasm:

gotta love what garbage time (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=772262&postcount=4) can do for your stats. I haven't seen a team coached this bad since Hugh Campbell was coaching the Oilers and looking confused the entire time. It's really MUCH worse on the defensive side of the ball...but the offense doesn't look like they are ready to deal with NFL defenses at all lately. I think Hugh always looked at his feet during pressers too.

Ckw
10-29-2007, 02:08 PM
We have spent the last six seasons picking high round draft picks and you are telling me that this team still has no talent?

Sadly, yes. In the all of our drafts we have come out with a pretty short list of good picks: AJ, DROB, Demeco, OD, and maybe a few others.


You know why Fisher has all those things? B/C he makes them so. None of those players, not one, could go onto another team and do what they do. You don't lose two hall of fame lineman in five years and keep plugging away like nothing happens unless you are a fantastic caoch.

Yes he is a fantastic coach. Maybe better than Kubiak will ever be. But to compare Kubiak to one of the greatest coaches alive is asinine. But to say that Chris Brown or Lendale White wouldn't do anything on another team is questionable.

The Browns! We have more talent than the Browns and they are playing better.

Yes they are better. Joe Jurevicius, Braylon Edwards, Kellen Winslow, Joe Thomas, Kevin Shaffer, LeCharles Bentley (when he comes back), Jamal Lewis, Orpheus Roye, Andra Davis, Kamerion Wimbley, D'Qwell Jackson, Willie McGinest, Sean Jones,etc. Yes overall, they are a better football team except they have no QB.

I don't even get that last statement. So what you are saying is that you are hanging with Kubiak so you can say "I told you so" instead of giving an honest evaluation of the team. How many times is Kubiak going to come out to each of his pressers and all but say "I suck as a head coach" before we start to listen?

No, I'm hanging with Kubiak because I believe he is a good coach and has already made strides with a terrible team. We have a serious lack of talent and have a long way to go. I really should not have even put the last statement in. It was more of just a rant. Yes, it is quite irritating to hear Kubiak continue saying "The loss is on me." I'm as sick of it as anybody. But what else is he supposed to say? "Man, the team sucked! These guys can't play worth crap." Or "These guys couldn't execute if their lives depended on it." I feel he's taking the high road.

2005 was the 2-14 season. Its now 2007 and still playing like 2005.

This is a fluff schedule and we are getting hammered each week.

Kubiak is not the guy. Don't fall in love with players or coach's. Look at the state of your team and give an honest evaluation and admit to yourself what needs to be done so we are not the Cardinals of the AFC.

When we had our players in, did we look like the 2005 Texans? When we had a center who could run block AND pass protect, did we look like the 2005 Texans?

Ckw
10-29-2007, 02:09 PM
You still have to get it into that thing called an End Zone.

Your explosive offensive weapon is not supposed to be your kicker.

I'm changing what I originally wrote because much of our scoring has been off of field goals which is ticking me off. So I agree with you here.

Vinny
10-29-2007, 02:10 PM
And we're 10th in the league in scoring offense!!! Do you even read?
read this (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=772262&postcount=4)

Ckw
10-29-2007, 02:11 PM
gotta love what garbage time (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=772262&postcount=4) can do for your stats. I haven't seen a team coached this bad since Hugh Campbell was coaching the Oilers and looking confused the entire time. It's really MUCH worse on the defensive side of the ball...but the offense doesn't look like they are ready to deal with NFL defenses at all lately. I think Hugh always looked at his feet during pressers too.

Totally agree. Lately, we have looked confused. And honestly, I'd be confused too if I was Kubiak. I'd be confused over what to do with a team with the lack of depth Kubiak is dealing with right now.

Ckw
10-29-2007, 02:15 PM
read this (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=772262&postcount=4)

You responded too quick for me to change my response. Our red zone offense has sucked, no doubt. We have not gotten into the end zone and that is a problem. My problem with you guys is wait until we get a semblance of a team before calling for the guy's head. When we had a team, we had results. And that included getting in the red zone against some good defenses.

Vinny
10-29-2007, 02:24 PM
You responded too quick for me to change my response. Our red zone offense has sucked, no doubt. We have not gotten into the end zone and that is a problem. My problem with you guys is wait until we get a semblance of a team before calling for the guy's head. When we had a team, we had results. And that included getting in the red zone against some good defenses.
Kubiak has coached this team for 24 games now. We are no better than when we started despite having "more talent". I'm serious when I say that I haven't seen coaching this bad since we saw the overmatched Hugh Campbell look dazed and confused on the Oiler sideline.

Ckw
10-29-2007, 02:38 PM
Kubiak has coached this team for 24 games now. We are no better than when we started despite having "more talent". I'm serious when I say that I haven't seen coaching this bad since we saw the overmatched Hugh Campbell look dazed and confused on the Oiler sideline.

Well I guess everything is in the eye of the beholder, because I certainly find it a giant stretch to say we are no better. I just think what we are seeing and finally having to acknowledge is that we will never win without a line. We might be able to do it for a few games, but you can't go a full season with a patch work line. What's been the big difference between week 2 and week 8? Same coach, very different results.

Ckw
10-29-2007, 02:40 PM
We are no better than when we started despite having "more talent".

And by more talent do you mean more depth? Because if that's what you're saying I have to disagree. When our starters are on the field and doing their jobs, yes we have more talent. Throw in the injuries and get our second stringers on the field and I see the same ole Texans.

TexansFight
10-29-2007, 02:41 PM
This situation is even worse than the Hugh Campbell era Oilers (uhh thanks for bringing back those wonderful memories Vinny). Back then, we at least had MIKE HOLOVAK picking players (yes I remember Ladd was the GM but Mike was the personnel guy, if Mike is still alive and has brain activity he would be the best personnel guy the Texans could have despite being 100 years old). He used our top picks to stock a team loaded with talent and got guys in the later rounds to help as well. We didn't whiff on guys but got studs like Bruce Matthews and Mike Munchak to anchor our line for more than a decade.

We have bad coaching and bad personnel decisions. All the Oilers needed was a good coach in Glanville to turn things around. Our situation is not nearly as good.

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 02:41 PM
LET THE COWHER ERA BEGIN - by wd

someone on another thread said it best when they said, and I am paraphrasing, 'kubiak wasn't ready to be a head coach 5 years ago and I am not sure he is ready even now'...i gotta agree

McNair needs to stop being skimpy on head coaches and make Cowher the highest paid HC in NFL history...just GET IT DONE. Cowher would give us proven HC experience and the ability to win with the players he is given. He managed a program that was constantly losing players and you know he would do wonders with our drafting. I also think he would be willing to work with a guy like Rick Smith who has done a pretty good job to date. Green hasn't worked out but we knew injuries were a possibility. it was a gamble that hasnt paid off and looks less likely to do so as the season progresses.

I tried to give Kubiak some time but its obvious he just gets outcoached on a weekly basis. not necessarily always him, but his coaches and himself get outcoached weekly....journeyman QBs become Unitas and losing teams look like contenders when we face us...that is Coaching. this isn't college football where recruiting matters or stuff like that. Coaching is the MOST important thing in the NFL. When you try and nickle and dime it, you get burned. Kubiak wasn't the best guy for the job when he was hired, he was just one that was willing to work with DC and had the sentimental hometown link. This isn't a popularity contest. He isn't running for mayor. Bottom line. Can he coach and does he have lots of friends who can coach that will come work for him? Cowher trumps Kubiak in that department.

oh and when you look in the camera and say that Mario is playing fine and that you are happy with his work, then you are also a bad head coach. You have to be willing to bench a guy or at least rip him a new one where you may not hear it in the media but you would hear about it in the media after the smoke clears. Mario. Greenwood. Weaver. Everyone. All MIA.

I'll do the right thing as a fan and stick by Schaub as he is just a rookie as a starter and QB is the toughest position to play especially when you have little to no running game post-McKinney and lost your #1 guy. Its not an excuse for his mental mistakes but you can't really judge him yet. richard smith was our 5th choice as DC to begin with and its obvious why that was the case...the guy just sucks. he needs to go....there is talent. it has to be used and if its not playing up to its ability, it must be benched and give hungry guys a chance and let the 'stars' get hungry.

OT - but Dunta should be in the Pro Bowl with how well he is playing this year. Yeah you could argue he cost us the game last week but that would be a bit harsh. He has shown so much heart and skill. We need to get him some freaking help back there. I absolutely love the guy and his heart.

it's obvious we may need a more fiery and demonstrative coach because with our lack of veteran leadership and winning attitude we will never get anywhere. The fact that Smith still has a job is just puzzling. We have NEVER gotten a pash rush against anyone. We have been relatively injury free on our DL as well. No excuses, other teams get a pass rush even if they have to send the kitchen sink at them, but we get no pass rush and we have sense of urgency on either side of the ball.

KUBIAK MUST GO

Best Case Scenario: A&M fires Fran and lures Kubiak from Texans. Texans then hire Cowher, he brings Dick LeBeau out of Pittsurgh, and we sign Alan Faneca, one of his former players. And don't give me this 3-4 or 4-3 garbage. We have players that can play both ways and some would say that Mario (which is where practically all of our $$ is at) may be a good fit as a 3-4 DE. Lord knows he is a crappy 4-3 DE.

TexansFight
10-29-2007, 02:44 PM
Give me a break Ckw, we are lucky not to be 0 for our last 6 games. Yeah, there is defeintely a lot of improvement going on here. In the NFL, you measure improvement with your W-L record not how hard you try or how much of a good person you are. Our team is so soft they deserve to be fed orange slices and juice boxes at the end of games and be taken to Cici's to celebrate even after getting embarrassed

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 02:46 PM
Kubiak has coached this team for 24 games now. We are no better than when we started despite having "more talent". I'm serious when I say that I haven't seen coaching this bad since we saw the overmatched Hugh Campbell look dazed and confused on the Oiler sideline.

haha. Pardee had some moments of just awkward befuddledment too. Ed Biles too. glad your on board with the whole 'horrible coaching' argument. I am worried that McNair is going to Care Bear this whole scenario like he did with Carr. Kubiak will be back and then the following year no good head coaches will be available like there are presently.

Cowher or Marty would be huge for us. Marty would have a HUGE axe to grind and has lines of people wanting to work for him. Cowher brings the whole Cowher mystique, the ability to coach players up and put them in positions to succeed, and of course the possiblity of him bringing Faneca and LeBeau with him.....omg that would insane if we could pull that off.....and the fact is THERE IS NOTHING STOPPING McNAIR FROM DOING SO.

sorry bout the caps but I am a bit peeved today.....

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 02:47 PM
Give me a break Ckw, we are lucky not to be 0 for our last 6 games. Yeah, there is defeintely a lot of improvement going on here. In the NFL, you measure improvement with your W-L record not how hard you try or how much of a good person you are. Our team is so soft they deserve to be fed orange slices and juice boxes at the end of games and be taken to Cici's to celebrate even after getting embarrassed

that is some great stuff.....oh and its true

TexansSeminole
10-29-2007, 02:48 PM
No, I'm hanging with Kubiak because I believe he is a good coach and has already made strides with a terrible team. We have a serious lack of talent and have a long way to go. I really should not have even put the last statement in. It was more of just a rant. Yes, it is quite irritating to hear Kubiak continue saying "The loss is on me." I'm as sick of it as anybody. But what else is he supposed to say? "Man, the team sucked! These guys can't play worth crap." Or "These guys couldn't execute if their lives depended on it." I feel he's taking the high road.

Does Kubiak have nothing to do with the players that are chosen to play on this team??? To think that is rediculous. He has had ALOT of money to work with and two drafts and has come up with obviously not enough.

It's so great to watch Kubiak take the high road and say the games are on him...why hold player's accountable? He clearly means "My players suck" when he says "this is my fault", huh?

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 02:49 PM
All the Oilers needed was a good coach in Glanville to turn things around.

I am reading the words but they don't make since.

Peanut-butter banana sandwich anyone?

TexansSeminole
10-29-2007, 02:51 PM
And by more talent do you mean more depth? Because if that's what you're saying I have to disagree. When our starters are on the field and doing their jobs, yes we have more talent. Throw in the injuries and get our second stringers on the field and I see the same ole Texans.

Great so all of our starters just have to not get injured. We must avoid any and all injuries. You don't need quality backups in football, nobody ever gets injured. Why would a coach try and get quality backups??? What ***** would do that? I hope Faggins doesn't get injured...the guy is just such a valuable player. God forbid our rookie cornerback comes in and doesn't get beat on every passing play.

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 02:51 PM
This situation is even worse than the Hugh Campbell era Oilers (uhh thanks for bringing back those wonderful memories Vinny). Back then, we at least had MIKE HOLOVAK picking players (yes I remember Ladd was the GM but Mike was the personnel guy, if Mike is still alive and has brain activity he would be the best personnel guy the Texans could have despite being 100 years old). He used our top picks to stock a team loaded with talent and got guys in the later rounds to help as well. We didn't whiff on guys but got studs like Bruce Matthews and Mike Munchak to anchor our line for more than a decade.

We have bad coaching and bad personnel decisions. All the Oilers needed was a good coach in Glanville to turn things around. Our situation is not nearly as good.

ok...ok...i was right alongside with you until the Glanville comment....i may have vomited in my mouth a tad..

that being said, Glanville did have his team ready to play most Sundays and they showed a lot of courage and fight. Something that can't be said for our current coaching staff. Oh and he was willing to take some risks too and wasn't afraid to ruffle a few feathers or call a player out for subpar performances. Remember his whole 'NFL stands for Not For Long' quote from NFL Films footage....

TexansFight
10-29-2007, 02:58 PM
Cowher here would be perfect. Houston is a blue collar town and we can relate to a guy like Cowher. What he brings is what our fans desperately crave. McNair to me embodies the worst of the lame corporate ethos that has infested this city and represented by scumbags like Lay, Skilling, Fastow, and the rest of the Enron criminals.

Bud was a jerk, but he at least was colorful, hired colorful people, was not an ***** and realized the benefits of picking a legend from Texas. His litmus test in selecting a coach that would keep Carr was mind boggling.

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 03:00 PM
Bud was a jerk, but he at least was colorful, hired colorful people, was not an ***** and realized the benefits of picking a legend from Texas. His litmus test in selecting a coach that would keep Carr was mind boggling.

I draw the line at reflecting on Bud in a positive light.

Texans_Chick
10-29-2007, 03:01 PM
Let's get Jimmy Johnson here too.

Oh wait, he wanted nothing to do with coaching here.

Let's talk about the litany of coaches who aren't likely to come to Houston.

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 03:03 PM
Let's get Jimmy Johnson here too.

Oh wait, he wanted nothing to do with coaching here.

Let's talk about the litany of coaches who aren't likely to come to Houston.

Tom Landry

Chuck knoll

Mike Ditka

Dick Vermile

Vinny
10-29-2007, 03:04 PM
I draw the line at reflecting on Bud in a positive light.Bud was and always will be a marketing disaster but he has always hired good football people and let them build his team as he got the heck out of the way. One of the biggest reasons the team had to give up two picks for Schaub was McNair getting in the way and not having the ability to see that Carr was garbage and insisted on extending him the MAX contract extension. That totally altered the draft and the future of the team...not to mention that McNair hired a coach based on what was best for Carr, and not the team.

TexansSeminole
10-29-2007, 03:05 PM
Bud was a jerk, but he at least was colorful, hired colorful people, was not an ***** and realized the benefits of picking a legend from Texas. His litmus test in selecting a coach that would keep Carr was mind boggling.

If McNair hasn't realized by now that his football insight is worth absolutely nothing and that he should make zero football decisions I just can't see us going anywhere by plan. We would have to get a good coach by accident.

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 03:08 PM
Bud was and always will be a marketing disaster but he has always hired good football people and let them build his team as he got the heck out of the way. One of the biggest reasons the team had to give up two picks for Schaub was McNair getting in the way and not having the ability to see that Carr was garbage and insisted on extending him the MAX contract extension. That totally altered the draft and the future of the team...not to mention that McNair hired a coach based on what was best for Carr, and not the team.

HALLELUJAH!!

TexansFight
10-29-2007, 03:08 PM
Second Honeymoon: I will agree that Glanville went too far with some of his shenanigans. However, he doesn't get the credit he deserves for turning around a loser program like we have right now and getting them to become a hard hitting, winning football team.

When your team is a loser, you have to first rebuild pride and his whole army helmet given to the most ferocious special team player built the fire you needed to turn a loser to a winner. I remember that he had physical football teams that would NEVER stand for their QB getting nearly decapitated without retribution. You bet your ass Cris Dishman, William Fuller, Ray Childress et al. would have dished out some payback. There was a reason why the Dome was called the House of Pain back then. BTW, that era when all the AFC Central teams hated each other was my fondest time as an NFL fan

This team has no personality or spark. I am tired of plastic emotionless coaches leading this team. You can get by being no-personality if you are Bill Belichick who is one of the greatest defensive minds of all time. We need a guy here in the mold of Mike Leach, Cowher, Mark Richt (loved that he wanted his team to have an all team TD celebration to turn their losing streak to UF around).

Vinny
10-29-2007, 03:10 PM
When your team is a loser, you have to first rebuild pride and his whole army helmet given to the most ferocious special team player built the fire you needed to turn a loser to a winner.actually, I think that was the idea of the special teams coach....Richard Smith's idea...you know him, he's our DC.

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 03:13 PM
Bud was and always will be a marketing disaster but he has always hired good football people and let them build his team as he got the heck out of the way. One of the biggest reasons the team had to give up two picks for Schaub was McNair getting in the way and not having the ability to see that Carr was garbage and insisted on extending him the MAX contract extension. That totally altered the draft and the future of the team...not to mention that McNair hired a coach based on what was best for Carr, and not the team.

This is all true.:shots:

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 03:17 PM
Let's get Jimmy Johnson here too.

Oh wait, he wanted nothing to do with coaching here.

Let's talk about the litany of coaches who aren't likely to come to Houston.

so you don't think Cowher would come here? why not? we would have to pay him a lot of $$ but there are a lot of positives to coming here. i don't think this job scares anyone off. Jimmy just likes to fish and make a cool million showing up in a studio 20 days out of 365....I hope you have a higher opinion of Houston professional football than to think that a coaching candidate wouldn't want to come here.

For crying out loud, Cowher remembers the good ole days of Oiler football. He knows it can work here and he knows we have the facilities, fanbase, $$, and some important core pieces of personnel already in place. We got a QB, a bonafide #1 WR, some potential at DL and LB. He would make it work. He always did regardless of who left the Steelers roster on a perennial basis.

Coaching is in Cowher's blood. He is the PERFECT candidate to turn this thing around. Kubiak was not. He was just the sentimental favorite and went to A&M and had local ties. BFD. Russ Grimm or Al Saunders would have been a better fit as developing head coaches....but for some reason everyone thought Kubiak was ready....obviously he was not.

Cowher knows that whatever job he gets he is going to have job security and ultimate authority. He could look at this as a challenge. If he goes to the Eagles, then hire Andy Reid. Both would bring far superior staffs with them.....if we move fast in the offseason.

Lord, please let A&M lure Kubiak away from the Texans. It would just make everything so much easier for everyone.

powerfuldragon
10-29-2007, 03:18 PM
i'm going to new orleans next week to find a good voodoo shaman. if anyone else wants to throw down some cash, we can have a zombie lombardi here in houston in about two weeks.

Vinny
10-29-2007, 03:19 PM
Lord, please let A&M lure Kubiak away from the Texans. It would just make everything so much easier for everyone.just don't let them see any Texans games. Showing Titan or Cowboy games in College Station may not be such a bad marketing move after all.

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 03:20 PM
i'm going to new orleans next week to find a good voodoo shaman. if anyone else wants to throw down some cash, we can have a zombie lombardi here in houston in about two weeks.

How much you need?

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 03:22 PM
Second Honeymoon: I will agree that Glanville went too far with some of his shenanigans. However, he doesn't get the credit he deserves for turning around a loser program like we have right now and getting them to become a hard hitting, winning football team.

When your team is a loser, you have to first rebuild pride and his whole army helmet given to the most ferocious special team player built the fire you needed to turn a loser to a winner. I remember that he had physical football teams that would NEVER stand for their QB getting nearly decapitated without retribution. You bet your ass Cris Dishman, William Fuller, Ray Childress et al. would have dished out some payback. There was a reason why the Dome was called the House of Pain back then. BTW, that era when all the AFC Central teams hated each other was my fondest time as an NFL fan

This team has no personality or spark. I am tired of plastic emotionless coaches leading this team. You can get by being no-personality if you are Bill Belichick who is one of the greatest defensive minds of all time. We need a guy here in the mold of Mike Leach, Cowher, Mark Richt (loved that he wanted his team to have an all team TD celebration to turn their losing streak to UF around).

The guys want to play for guys like that....that may come back to bite him in the SEC but it worked on Saturday.....as for fiery yet stoic coaching, watch Fisher coach. Intensity, focus, and he is in the game. Kubiak looks puzzled half the times and always a step behind the opposition. I wish Bud would have been stupid enough not to lock him up.

inschaubwetrust
10-29-2007, 03:23 PM
While I am not fond of the idea of kicking Kubiak to the curb after just two seasons, the idea of having either Cowher or Schottenheimer tickles my fancy. One interesting idea could be this, bring in Marty as the head coach and Cowher as the defensive coordinator. Cowher used to work under Marty as special teams coach for the Browns from 1985-1988 and as the defensive coordinator for the Chiefs from 1989-1992.

Yeah it's just a dream, but I would be down for that combination.

TexansSeminole
10-29-2007, 03:23 PM
What sucks is that if the Texans got more national media coverage there would be alot more heat on Kubiak. Nobody knows what's going on with the Texans, Kubiak will never be on the national media hotseat.

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 03:24 PM
just don't let them see any Texans games. Showing Titan or Cowboy games in College Station may not be such a bad marketing move after all.

your killin' me, man....

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 03:28 PM
While I am not fond of the idea of kicking Kubiak to the curb after just two seasons, the idea of having either Cowher or Schottenheimer tickles my fancy. One interesting idea could be this, bring in Marty as the head coach and Cowher as the defensive coordinator. Cowher used to work under Marty as special teams coach for the Browns from 1985-1988 and as the defensive coordinator for the Chiefs from 1989-1992.

Yeah it's just a dream, but I would be down for that combination.

that may be past dream status and more like a utopia....

something tells me that Cowher isn't going to take a Defensive Coordinator position :)

FWIW - giving Kubiak 2 years is not 'kicking him to the curb'. it's either fire kubiak now or re-sign him. that is where we are at. if we don't resign him then he is a lame duck coach in the final year of his deal in 2008. if we resign him we only seal our losing fate further. a 3 year deal is essentially a 2 year window in the NFL for a coach to show improvement....personally, I havent seen enough improvement to warrant him being resigned and a lame duck coach will equal another horrible season of Texans football.

Silver Oak
10-29-2007, 03:31 PM
I sure don't want the Texans to become one of "those" teams that churns through coaches every few years. I was hoping we would become something of what Cowher, Landry, Fisher have done and been allowed to stay and establish some kind of franchise personality.

However, if we're all going to throw names out there...how about that crazy looking dude in Oakland. Buddy Ryans son right? That guy looks like someone I would love to have watching my back walking into a rough bar.

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 03:37 PM
I sure don't want the Texans to become one of "those" teams that churns through coaches every few years. I was hoping we would become something of what Cowher, Landry, Fisher have done and been allowed to stay and establish some kind of franchise personality.

However, if we're all going to throw names out there...how about that crazy looking dude in Oakland. Buddy Ryans son right? That guy looks like someone I would love to have watching my back walking into a rough bar.

Rob Ryan would be a GREAT candidate as DC but I just can't see him as Head Coach anywhere outside of Oakland. Call me old-fashioned, but I don't want my head coach looking like he works in the offseason as a roadie for Iron Maiden.

powerfuldragon
10-29-2007, 03:41 PM
How much you need?

$400 in gold doubloons, some arrowroot, and a rooster.

Ckw
10-29-2007, 03:44 PM
Great so all of our starters just have to not get injured. We must avoid any and all injuries. You don't need quality backups in football, nobody ever gets injured. Why would a coach try and get quality backups??? What ***** would do that? I hope Faggins doesn't get injured...the guy is just such a valuable player. God forbid our rookie cornerback comes in and doesn't get beat on every passing play.

You need quality starters first. We don't even have quality starters at CB (other than Drob), safety, OLB, and the entire offensive line. Yes, depth is the goal, but it takes a while to get there.

Silver Oak
10-29-2007, 03:44 PM
Rob Ryan would be a GREAT candidate as DC but I just can't see him as Head Coach anywhere outside of Oakland. Call me old-fashioned, but I don't want my head coach looking like he works in the offseason as a roadie for Iron Maiden.

if Pee Wee Herman could get us to the playoffs, I wouldn't care if he spent the offseason in a lot of adult theaters...just give us wins baby!

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 03:50 PM
I sure don't want the Texans to become one of "those" teams that churns through coaches every few years. I was hoping we would become something of what Cowher, Landry, Fisher have done and been allowed to stay and establish some kind of franchise personality.



The Oilers were one of those teams, he constantly fired coach's till he got the right fit. I think he even went through five coachs in seven years at one point.

But it worked, Glanville filled in as HC midway through a season, the next we were in the playoffs, fired Glanville, Hired Pardee, still in the playoffs, fired Pardee, got Fisher, went to the superbowl.

We could hang on to projects and end up like the Bengals.

HOU-TEX
10-29-2007, 03:56 PM
The Oilers were one of those teams, he constantly fired coach's till he got the right fit. I think he even went through five coachs in seven years at one point.

But it worked, Glanville filled in as HC midway through a season, the next we were in the playoffs, fired Glanville, Hired Pardee, still in the playoffs, fired Pardee, got Fisher..........................


Fixed it for ya. :)

Porky
10-29-2007, 03:58 PM
I sure don't want the Texans to become one of "those" teams that churns through coaches every few years. I was hoping we would become something of what Cowher, Landry, Fisher have done and been allowed to stay and establish some kind of franchise personality.

However, if we're all going to throw names out there...how about that crazy looking dude in Oakland. Buddy Ryans son right? That guy looks like someone I would love to have watching my back walking into a rough bar.

24 games in, and I don't know what the personality or identity is on this team, do you? It's like mashed potatoes is the closest I can come up with.

Bland, whipped, and soft. :devilpig:

Ckw
10-29-2007, 04:00 PM
24 games in, and I don't know what the personality or identity is on this team, do you? It's like mashed potatoes is the closest I can come up with.

Bland, whipped, and soft. :devilpig:

Well this is why I will say my number one gripe with Kubiak is he needs to get some stones and tell the old farts Sherman and Smith to take a hike. It's his team, not Sherman's. Sometimes I wonder if because of Kubiak's young age (in coaching terms) if he gets bullied around by these guys and feels like he can't step up to them.

TexansSeminole
10-29-2007, 04:00 PM
You need quality starters first. We don't even have quality starters at CB (other than Drob), safety, OLB, and the entire offensive line. Yes, depth is the goal, but it takes a while to get there.

I could understand this if our problems were much more limited in the amount and we didn't have as much money to use. We have problems ALL over the field. The only thing opposing offenses are having trouble with is finding out WHICH weakness they want to exploit.

TEXANRED
10-29-2007, 04:04 PM
Fixed it for ya. :)

Fisher went to the Superbowl, played the Rams.

Or are you talking about not as an Oiler? If so I was referring to the organization since they lay claim to all of our history.

Maddict5
10-29-2007, 04:09 PM
btw just a comment on the great coaches we have to obviously get... what's their offensive philosophy again? yeah they'd fit right in here

http://texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=43764

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 04:31 PM
btw just a comment on the great coaches we have to obviously get... what's their offensive philosophy again? yeah they'd fit right in here

http://texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=43764

This isn't about the offense. Cowher would bring someone in to handle the offense and get the job done. This is about changing the mentality and the direction of this franchise and VASTLY improving the quality of our assistant head coaching staff. This is about instilling some fire, emotion, and most importantly, ACCOUNTABILITY for sub-par play. This is about not letting your team lose a game by the end of the 1st Quarter. This is about bringing in someone with TRUE credibility and championship respect and giving them a challenge in turning a fledgling franchise into a program that we could all be proud of.

It's not often when the timing aligns to make such a huge move and we should learn from our past mistakes and make the BLOCKBUSTER move.

It would take some money but you could effectively buy the services of Cowher, LeBeau, AND Faneca this offseason. Why not? Only Faneca would count against the salary cap and it would improve our team greatly on both sides of the ball. It can be done. You are going to be bidding against other teams but in today's league there should be no limit to what you are willing to spend in regards to coaching.

Look at Snyder in Washington. He spent all willy-nilly on players for years and never did crud, he then realized that he could spend the big money on coaching and it wouldn't hurt the team. He went out and lured one of the all time great coaches and the staff that comes with him.

Look at Jerrah up in Big D. He needed a facelift for his franchise to go along with his facelift for his face...so what does he do? he goes out and signs Parcells to rebuild and next thing you know they have a legitimate NFC contender a few years later. Granted, Parcells leaves but he left behind some quality infrastructure of coaches and developed players behind.

There is admittedly a lot to be said about stability but if you look at it, does anyone really think that Kubiak has what it takes to reach the Super Bowl? I don't. That is what this is all about after all. Shoot for the moon and you are more likely to reach the highest of highs.

Vinny
10-29-2007, 04:34 PM
Well this is why I will say my number one gripe with Kubiak is he needs to get some stones and tell the old farts Sherman and Smith to take a hike. It's his team, not Sherman's. Sometimes I wonder if because of Kubiak's young age (in coaching terms) if he gets bullied around by these guys and feels like he can't step up to them.Not that I agree with your assessment but how can you lead strong willed football players if you can't even lead your assistant coaches?

Second Honeymoon
10-29-2007, 04:40 PM
Basically, if Cowher says he wants 'Joe Gibbs' money, you draft up the contract that same day and get the deal done. Make it Joe Gibbs salary with huge incentives on top of it regarding playoffs, playoff wins, championships, etc. just get it done.

If there is one thing you don't go cheap on, that is coaching...

its down to either re-signing Kubiak to an extension or making him a lame duck coach in 2008...both bad choices...OR they could push him out the door justifiably by hiring Cowher and Co. to coach and manage the football franchise.

i think it would be perfect for Cowher as he has a bit of an ego. He would be THE MAN here in Houston so he would love that. In Philly, you are just another coach and a Steeler coach at that. Where else is he going to go that has that much of a better future in it than the Texans. The Texans have the youngest roster in the NFL. There is talent on the team. We just need an identity and Cowher would bring that in spades. You bring in Cowher and his assistants in and the Texans are the talk of the league.

Exithios
10-29-2007, 04:43 PM
:includeme:

dickieb
10-29-2007, 05:33 PM
If Kubiak ends with less than 6 wins, you might see McNair have a knee jerk reaction.

That's hillarious!

Wolf
10-29-2007, 07:57 PM
I am not in for getting a new coach yet, but like TC said.. our defense needs a boost in coaching.

offense is soft, yeah, we run a finesse offense like denver's.. I am not sure what y'all expected out of the offense.. if it was smashmouth.. well you should have known that was not coming with Kubiak's hiring..

I don't like to make excuses, but what can you say.. this team still is trying to build depth.. is a coincidence that when AJ went down, this offense isn't the same? Spencer down,McKinney down..Ahman Green hasn't helped much..

defensively.. simply overmatched and it is a shame with all the "talent" that we have drafted and we are still struggling.. (well we knew secondary was weak outside of D-rob)

Every team has injuries and they just "plug and play" but this team has drafted poorly and it is showing big time along with our coaching on defense

nut
10-29-2007, 08:02 PM
Most of Cowher's players didn't like him. Kubiak might be too far in the other direction.

BattleRedToro
10-29-2007, 08:44 PM
If Kubiak were to get fired, I would hope for Marty Schottenheimer to be the next Head Coach, because he has a long history of turning around losing franchises. I don't care about his supposed inability to win in the playoffs. If your team can't even get to the playoffs, then how can you even complain about his playoff record?

Dread-Head
10-29-2007, 08:56 PM
MARTY! MARTY! MARTY! Let us have...a Marty party!:fans:

Texans_Chick
10-29-2007, 09:00 PM
so you don't think Cowher would come here? why not? we would have to pay him a lot of $$ but there are a lot of positives to coming here. i don't think this job scares anyone off. Jimmy just likes to fish and make a cool million showing up in a studio 20 days out of 365....I hope you have a higher opinion of Houston professional football than to think that a coaching candidate wouldn't want to come here.



No, I do not think that Cowher would want to come to Houston. Even if the Texans wrote him a huge ole check and then doubled it.

IIRC, his family built a big house in NC. He is not from here. I could see him going to the Panthers if he were interested in unretiring.

Some coaches have picks of whatever jobs they want. I don't see him wanting this job. Most hot head coaches have Phil Jackson syndrome--they go to the place that they think is prestigious and has the base talent to give them an opportunity to win. Nothing like a sorry situation to torpedo your career (see Mike Sherman not getting a $$$ NFL head coaching job offer again--he should have asked for less money in AZ). The Texans have never been over .500, most of the country doesn't know squat about them other than punchlines, and much of the personnel is transitional from 3-4 to 4-3 or are system guys or make-dos.

Ckw
10-30-2007, 12:15 AM
Not that I agree with your assessment but how can you lead strong willed football players if you can't even lead your assistant coaches?

In Kubiak's case, I think he could have done a very good thing by bringing in intelligent and experienced minds to help him out his first couple of years on the job. Guys he can look up to and ask for guidance. I mean Sherman his first season was called Assistant Head Coach IIRC. But I do think it can become problematic when he no longer wants or needs that advice, yet feels pressured to listen to it due to the amount of respect he has for the older, wiser individual. I think anyone can struggle with this, yet still be fully capable of leading his team. I'm not saying he's not leading the assistants, but perhaps he just isn't pushing off enough to fully be on his own and make this HIS team not he and Sherman's team.

dskillz
10-30-2007, 10:22 AM
I donno about that. This Texans team isn't even competitive. They have not looked like a NFL team the last 3 weeks giving up 108 points between the Jags, Chargers and Titans. This team has been outcoached and plays soft. Not a good combination.

Kubes has one more season left. If he can't turn it around next season, I am thinking we will be on our 3rd coach. Of course if the ship rights itself by the end of this season and next year we are 13-3, then he will get an extension. But I am not holding my breath on that one.

Offensively the team is paper thin in terms of depth and injuries have made the team worst than last season. But even in those first 3 games, Schaub did show a habit of throwing the ball up for grabs 2 or 3 times a game. Remember Kubiak saying they needed to correct that? So him throwing picks now is not exactly surprising. Defensively there is no excuse for this crap. Remember going into the season, everyone was harping on the way this same defense closed out the season last year? Remember how everyone was expecting that to continue? What happened!?!?!?

Vinny
10-30-2007, 11:27 AM
Kubes has one more season left. If he can't turn it around next season, I am thinking we will be on our 3rd coach. Of course if the ship rights itself by the end of this season and next year we are 13-3, then he will get an extension. But I am not holding my breath on that one.

Offensively the team is paper thin in terms of depth and injuries have made the team worst than last season. But even in those first 3 games, Schaub did show a habit of throwing the ball up for grabs 2 or 3 times a game. Remember Kubiak saying they needed to correct that? So him throwing picks now is not exactly surprising. Defensively there is no excuse for this crap. Remember going into the season, everyone was harping on the way this same defense closed out the season last year? Remember how everyone was expecting that to continue? What happened!?!?!?Schaub was also completing 69% of his passes with one of the highest YPA's in the NFL. QB's throw picks...ask Favre, ask Moon...it happens with the guys who challenge teams deep. The flip side is guys like David Carr who don't make any courageous passes but don't make plays down the field either.

TEXANRED
10-30-2007, 11:36 AM
Schaub was also completing 69% of his passes with one of the highest YPA's in the NFL. QB's throw picks...ask Favre, ask Moon...it happens with the guys who challenge teams deep. The flip side is guys like David Carr who don't make any courageous passes but don't make plays down the field either.


The flip side to that is throwing TD's.

I don't think Schaub has thrown a TD since week 3.

Vinny
10-30-2007, 11:41 AM
The flip side to that is throwing TD's.

I don't think Schaub has thrown a TD since week 3.I've talked several times about how he's moved the ball in between the 20's but also how it's hard to score in the red zone without your skill guys. When the field shrinks the defense no longer has to defend vertically and can play you more straight up and if you don't have any elite skill guys on the field it's tough to score. It's one reason the Titans kicked 8 FG's against us (they were missing their WR1, RB, and QB).

TEXANRED
10-30-2007, 11:47 AM
I've talked several times about how he's moved the ball in between the 20's but also how it's hard to score in the red zone without your skill guys. When the field shrinks the defense no longer has to defend vertically and can play you more straight up and if you don't have any elite skill guys on the field it's tough to score. It's one reason the Titans kicked 8 FG's against us (they were missing their WR1, RB, and QB).

Makes you kinda wonder if its not the system that we are running. Denver has had a hard time punching into the Redzone lately as well. Schaub running the same system can't cross the line either. Last year Carr went 10 games without getting it into the EZ. Some would make a case for Sage but thats after the game has already been lost by half time.

This is a team with Putz and OD and for some reason we continue to try and run the ball when inside the 20.

Second Honeymoon
10-30-2007, 11:55 AM
No, I do not think that Cowher would want to come to Houston. Even if the Texans wrote him a huge ole check and then doubled it.

IIRC, his family built a big house in NC. He is not from here. I could see him going to the Panthers if he were interested in unretiring.

Some coaches have picks of whatever jobs they want. I don't see him wanting this job. Most hot head coaches have Phil Jackson syndrome--they go to the place that they think is prestigious and has the base talent to give them an opportunity to win. Nothing like a sorry situation to torpedo your career (see Mike Sherman not getting a $$$ NFL head coaching job offer again--he should have asked for less money in AZ). The Texans have never been over .500, most of the country doesn't know squat about them other than punchlines, and much of the personnel is transitional from 3-4 to 4-3 or are system guys or make-dos.

I guess I have a higher opinion of the Texans than you do.

as for as make-do coaches...that is what Kubiak is and that is what his staff is

until we start ponying up money for some real quality coaching we will never shake the tag as a losing franchise and you will probably be able to maintain your low opinion of the franchise.

I could see him wanting to go to Carolina because of proximity to his family but what is wrong with Houston? It's not like he couldn't afford to buy another house down here and move his family down here. Plus I know his daughters are athletes and Texas has some of the best female athletics programs in the USA.

I would glady take Marty if Cowher was unwilling. I just want some decent assistant coaches and a decent scheme. Kubiak is a freaking joke.

Vinny
10-30-2007, 11:56 AM
Makes you kinda wonder if its not the system that we are running. Denver has had a hard time punching into the Redzone lately as well. Schaub running the same system can't cross the line either. Last year Carr went 10 games without getting it into the EZ. Some would make a case for Sage but thats after the game has already been lost by half time.

This is a team with Putz and OD and for some reason we continue to try and run the ball when inside the 20.Carr has never gotten anyone into the end zone on any regular basis. Most of Sage's stuff has been in garbage time. Historically, if you look at many zone blocking teams (Broncos and the Gibbs O-line coached Falcons and the current Packers for that matter) they aren't real good in short yardage or red zone rushing since it is a finesse technique in a part of the field that requires smash mouth football (field shrinks). Football is a game of countermeasures though. You have to both run and pass because teams can take away any one-dimensional strength you may have unless of course you have a true superstar like Earl Campbell or John Elway that can impose their will on you. We have AJ but he's out.

TEXANRED
10-30-2007, 12:10 PM
Carr has never gotten anyone into the end zone on any regular basis. Most of Sage's stuff has been in garbage time. Historically, if you look at many zone blocking teams (Broncos and the Gibbs O-line coached Falcons and the current Packers for that matter) they aren't real good in short yardage or red zone rushing since it is a finesse technique in a part of the field that requires smash mouth football (field shrinks). Football is a game of countermeasures though. You have to both run and pass because teams can take away any one-dimensional strength you may have unless of course you have a true superstar like Earl Campbell or John Elway that can impose their will on you. We have AJ but he's out.

I don't have the answer for our scoring woe's. Scary part is I don't think Kubiak does either. I don't want to sit here and say that Schaub sucks but in eight weeks he has thrown 5 TD's and 7 INT. Now granted for the last three weeks we have been down 30 plus points by half time and that certainly plays a factor. As far as having a super star it is my opinion that OD could very well be the next Gates but this offense does not seem design scoring plays for him when we are in that area.

Kubiak is having the same problems with his offensive style as the Run-N-Shoot had, sure you can get down there, but can you score.

Texans_Chick
10-30-2007, 03:29 PM
I guess I have a higher opinion of the Texans than you do.
as for as make-do coaches...that is what Kubiak is and that is what his staff is

until we start ponying up money for some real quality coaching we will never shake the tag as a losing franchise and you will probably be able to maintain your low opinion of the franchise.

I could see him wanting to go to Carolina because of proximity to his family but what is wrong with Houston? It's not like he couldn't afford to buy another house down here and move his family down here. Plus I know his daughters are athletes and Texas has some of the best female athletics programs in the USA.

I would glady take Marty if Cowher was unwilling. I just want some decent assistant coaches and a decent scheme. Kubiak is a freaking joke.

My opinion and your opinion of Houston and the Texans does not matter. It's what the coach thinks.

The problem isn't being able to spend money on coaches. Marty and Cowher will get paid by someone, so then it is a question of which situation do THEY want to be in. And generally, coaches who are commodities want to get into great situations. Houston has it's good points, but as far as the league is concerned, they are either invisible or punch lines.

Double Barrel
10-30-2007, 03:37 PM
I guess I have a higher opinion of the Texans than you do.

Why?

Judging by your post history, I've always thought you've been steadily pissed at the Texans. Capers, Casserly, Carr, Mario, and now Kubiak have always seemed to have you ranting and raving at what a joke this franchise is.

TC, on the other hand, invests a lot of thought into writing informative articles about the team. I get more from her efforts than I do from our own newspaper's sports writers.

Never in a million years would I take your above statement at face value after reading you for so long. And I mean that with all due respect and not trying to single you out. But you've always struck me as a 'glass half empty' kinda' guy.

TexansFight
10-30-2007, 03:43 PM
Yeah, Second Honeymoon's opinion does not matter and he is not as much of a fan as TC because he is upset with the 6 years of suck we have had to endure. Bitching and complaining about sucky football shows that he cares. You don't have to buy the Kool-Aid that McNair and Kubiak are trying to pass off to be a passionate Texans fan. That this team still has fans after mind numbingly bad and boring football is a testament to the character of the fans of Houston.

Corrosion
10-30-2007, 03:47 PM
My opinion and your opinion of Houston and the Texans does not matter.

Thats where you are wrong ..... Its our opinion that pays the bills .

Double Barrel
10-30-2007, 03:48 PM
Yeah, Second Honeymoon's opinion does not matter and he is not as much of a fan as TC because he is upset with the 6 years of suck we have had to endure. Bitching and complaining about sucky football shows that he cares. You don't have to buy the Kool-Aid that McNair and Kubiak are trying to pass off to be a passionate Texans fan. That this team still has fans after mind numbingly bad and boring football is a testament to the character of the fans of Houston.

I don't call out people's devotion to the team. But some are obviously more positive, negative, realistic, or cynical about things.

You can take your character judgements and put them somewhere I shall not mention. It's a rather weak take on your part.

Care to talk football or is it easier for you to just snipe at fans? :howdy:

AnthonyE
10-30-2007, 03:50 PM
Kubes has one more season left. If he can't turn it around next season, I am thinking we will be on our 3rd coach. Of course if the ship rights itself by the end of this season and next year we are 13-3, then he will get an extension. But I am not holding my breath on that one.

Offensively the team is paper thin in terms of depth and injuries have made the team worst than last season. But even in those first 3 games, Schaub did show a habit of throwing the ball up for grabs 2 or 3 times a game. Remember Kubiak saying they needed to correct that? So him throwing picks now is not exactly surprising. Defensively there is no excuse for this crap. Remember going into the season, everyone was harping on the way this same defense closed out the season last year? Remember how everyone was expecting that to continue? What happened!?!?!?

Think if Andre was in there. If Schaub threw the ball up for grabs 2-3 times a game, those would be 2-3 catches a game.

TexansFight
10-30-2007, 03:51 PM
Care to talk football or is it easier for you to just snipe at fans?

That's what I have been doing, I started this thread. I place no value in being "positive" when there is nothing to be positive about.

Texans_Chick
10-30-2007, 03:51 PM
Thats where you are wrong ..... Its our opinion that pays the bills .

As it relates to the topic of hot head coaches wanting to come to Houston, our opinion doesn't matter. Head coaches who are hot commodities tend to have Phil Jackson syndrome, they want to go to the biggest stages, the most storied franchises, and where there are already most of the parts and pieces in place.

Please put my quote in context, thankyouverymuch.

Double Barrel
10-30-2007, 03:54 PM
That's what I have been doing, I started this thread. I place no value in being "positive" when there is nothing to be positive about.

I understand your pov. But being positive does not make anyone lesser of a fan.

Second Honeymoon
10-30-2007, 05:41 PM
Why?

Judging by your post history, I've always thought you've been steadily pissed at the Texans. Capers, Casserly, Carr, Mario, and now Kubiak have always seemed to have you ranting and raving at what a joke this franchise is.

TC, on the other hand, invests a lot of thought into writing informative articles about the team. I get more from her efforts than I do from our own newspaper's sports writers.

Never in a million years would I take your above statement at face value after reading you for so long. And I mean that with all due respect and not trying to single you out. But you've always struck me as a 'glass half empty' kinda' guy.

Well I may not be happy with the Texans moves but I think its a good place for an established HC to go. If Cowher truly wants to solidy a HOF career, lets see him turn around a losing franchise and create one. I don't think Cowher is looking for a situation where he can make the SB instantly. He wants to get paid, he wants to feed his ego, and he wants pretty much full autonomy in personnel decisions after being the victim of so much penny pinching during his time with the Steelers.

I love my Texans and think that Houston is a perfect place for the NFL to succeed. And I wasn't calling TC out as I think she is knowledgeable and more honest than most but I don't think the word 'Houston Texans' scares anyone away. Put the right number on the paycheck and he will come. Trust me.

As for not having a high opinion of my team, I was more pointing towards our system, our youngest roster in the league, our quality resources $$ and facilities....and our good fans. Cowher was here when Houston played in the Dome and he remembers that we have fans and a tradition. To be the coach to finally bring a football championship to Houston would be a nice feather on the cap...especially with a young franchise. This town would be Bill's town. What other situtations could he go to, DB?

Possible Cowher Destinations
----------------------------

Philly - If Reid is let go, then Cowher is a candidate but there would be little patience from the fans and ownership and its Philadelphia. Worst Fans Ever. Plus, their organization is also known for being cheap and letting quality players go all the time...something Cowher was never happy about but he dealt with it...in spades. Is it that attractive a destination?

NY Giants - Coughlin seems to have saved his job. Looked to be the early favorite to get Bill but things are presently on the right path in Jersey.

Cincy or Cleveland - I will lump them together because its a similar situation. Each coach may get another year to try and turn things around because of past and current success, respectively. Cowher would probably like to play in the AFC North though and play the steelers twice so both teams are gonna be on any Cowher destination short list.

Baltimore - Will probably make a run at him after the season. I think we can outbid Baltimore and their roster is pretty old. Once again, he could choose them because he would be in AFC North.

Minnesota - I don't think he would choose Minny over Texas. Houston is a much more desirable place to live than Minny as well.

St. Louis - cmon. I am from St.Louis and I know Cowher would come here before he ever thought of coaching there with that ownership.

Carolina - The one place that scares me. He is local and his daughter's athletic careers are important to him. It would be tough to entice Bill to come to Houston over Carolina. Hopefully Fox gets another year and the Panthers win the division.

Houston - GET IT DONE.

Sunshine. Nice Stadium. Biggest $$. No State Taxes. Good Housing Market.
Youngest Roster. Unharvested talent on the roster. Decent Cap Room as most of the dead money is going away...finally.

COWHER, LeBEAU, FANECA......Call me a dreamer......

infantrycak
10-30-2007, 05:42 PM
I understand your pov. But being positive does not make anyone lesser of a fan.

Maybe positive isn't the best word--how about constructive?

Attacking every ill, real and imaginary, isn't constructive. This BS about Kubiak being unemotional is a perfect example. Fine they are losing--doesn't mean Schaub=Carr or Kubiak=Capers in quality or persona. Kubiak has yelled at players and refs on the sideline repeatedly. Acting as if he is an automaton is made up BS which since it isn't accurate doesn't even arise to glass half empty--it is just straight BS.

Even if he weren't "emotional" on the sideline, somebody remind me of the last time Dungy or Belicheck laid down on the sideline, sucked their thumb and threw a hissy fit as SH endorses and frankly posts. Basic problem with SH's position is you demonstrably do not have to act like a baby or an ogre to be a successful coach.

Second Honeymoon
10-30-2007, 05:54 PM
Maybe positive isn't the best word--how about constructive?

Attacking every ill, real and imaginary, isn't constructive. This BS about Kubiak being unemotional is a perfect example. Fine they are losing--doesn't mean Schaub=Carr or Kubiak=Capers in quality or persona. Kubiak has yelled at players and refs on the sideline repeatedly. Acting as if he is an automaton is made up BS which since it isn't accurate doesn't even arise to glass half empty--it is just straight BS.

Even if he weren't "emotional" on the sideline, somebody remind me of the last time Dungy or Belicheck laid down on the sideline, sucked their thumb and threw a hissy fit as SH endorses and frankly posts. Basic problem with SH's position is you demonstrably do not have to act like a baby or an ogre to be a successful coach.

wow - well, I guess I missed the part where I said I wanted Kubiak to act like a baby or an ogre. I could care less how Kubiak acts personally, does he get the team fired up and ready to play? are they being properly motivated? the players come out flat game after game. the team has gotten progressively worse as the season has gone alone. How is that about Kubiak being a baby or an ogre? I am talking Cowher because its obvious our coaching staff is 3rd Rate. Cowher would fix that.

Where is the brotherhood? the players arent stepping up for one another. when Schaub was cheapshot like he was, the players should have taken it upon themselves to send a message....where is the brotherhood. we let SD punk us and we didn't do a dang thing. Same thing against the Titans, Haynesworth does a belly flop on our QB and we lack the sack to go after Collins. We are soft just like the coach. Is not being soft being a baby or an ogre? we are soft. the coach is responsible for letting this mentality continue.

Get rid of the guy and bring in someone who is qualified and has capable people willing to work for him. Is that so wrong? Cowher and Schotty would improve our team more than an extra #1 overall pick. Lord knows we don't know what to do with them when we get 'em. Things would turn around and you can take that to the bank.

Just wondering, Icak. Should the Texans let Kubiak play out his final year of his contract as a lame duck, re-sign him to an extension, or find someone else to do the job? I am with the latter but I don't think everyone that feels differently are morons or negative or too positive. I just feel they may have a little too much wishful thinking. I just don't see it.

digitalswim
10-30-2007, 06:32 PM
Some of you guys are living in fantasy land. The chances of Cowher coaching for anyone anytime soon is remote. One of the main reasons he retired was to spend time with his family, get to stay at home and attend his daughters sports events etc. Doing weekend commentary on the morning pregame shows is just a gravy job.

Him getting paid is not an issue that is effecting his life. Fans always put his name on wish lists but the guy has been really clear about what he is doing.

What would you do? You have reached the pinnacle of coaching in your sport by winning the Superbowl after years of hard work. You can now happily retire with a sweet commentary job on the weekends that has no effect on the rest of your week with your family or you could go back to an 80 hour a week grind coaching an under talented team that is YEARS away from achieving playoff success much less an actual Superbowl appearance.

Add on all the zeros you want in your magical checkbook but it's just not happening. If money was the reason the guy wasn't coaching that would have been solved a long time ago.

Vinny
10-30-2007, 06:34 PM
Maybe positive isn't the best word--how about constructive?

Attacking every ill, real and imaginary, isn't constructive. This BS about Kubiak being unemotional is a perfect example. Fine they are losing--doesn't mean Schaub=Carr or Kubiak=Capers in quality or persona. Kubiak has yelled at players and refs on the sideline repeatedly. Acting as if he is an automaton is made up BS which since it isn't accurate doesn't even arise to glass half empty--it is just straight BS.

Even if he weren't "emotional" on the sideline, somebody remind me of the last time Dungy or Belicheck laid down on the sideline, sucked their thumb and threw a hissy fit as SH endorses and frankly posts. Basic problem with SH's position is you demonstrably do not have to act like a baby or an ogre to be a successful coach.I know I'm not educating you but you don't have to be loud to have a deep brooding fire or intensity/will. Dungy and Belicheck are pretty quiet but you can see a firey underbelly to them and you can tell they just have the total respect of their team. I'm not sure we see that in Kubiak's quiet nature although you can point to him being mad here and there and make a case for his intensity, but I'm still not sure I see the total confidence and command of his team that I see in either of the coaches you threw out there as examples. I still think Kubiak should have some time....but it's fair game to talk about imo.

Brando
10-30-2007, 07:30 PM
I'm all for keeping Kubes, I wanted him originally in 2002 but that didn't work out. I wanted him to be the coach last year, we finally have him as a coach. That being said after Sunday's hangover when I was very upset I might have thought about a new coach but I have calmed down. Kubes will at least be here through the end of 2008. I don't want a franchise that fires coaches on a almost yearly basis like the previous franchise owner did.

I'm ok with him until 2008 but he needs to take a deep look at his assistants, starting on the defense side of the ball.

:texflag:

RDillon
10-30-2007, 07:46 PM
Can see if we go .500 first. The team isn't going to the playoffs. If Sage steps up all is not lost. I hope they fire Faggins shortly and let some of the other guys play. We need the running game back too.

nut
10-30-2007, 07:57 PM
Why would an established coach want to come here more than somewhere else? The organization (McNair and his coaches & GM's) has stunk it up from day one (well actually, day two, remembering the cowgirl game)

infantrycak
10-30-2007, 08:36 PM
Just wondering, Icak. Should the Texans let Kubiak play out his final year of his contract as a lame duck, re-sign him to an extension, or find someone else to do the job? I am with the latter but I don't think everyone that feels differently are morons or negative or too positive. I just feel they may have a little too much wishful thinking. I just don't see it.

Well I guess we will cross that bridge a couple more years from now. Kubiak signed a 5 year deal, not a 3 year deal. Count on him being here at least 4 of those years unless they hit 2-14 again next year so all the carping about getting a new coach is useless. Fine criticize specific calls, but you can wish in one hand and...about him leaving soon.

I know I'm not educating you but you don't have to be loud to have a deep brooding fire or intensity/will. Dungy and Belicheck are pretty quiet but you can see a firey underbelly to them and you can tell they just have the total respect of their team. I'm not sure we see that in Kubiak's quiet nature although you can point to him being mad here and there and make a case for his intensity, but I'm still not sure I see the total confidence and command of his team that I see in either of the coaches you threw out there as examples. I still think Kubiak should have some time....but it's fair game to talk about imo.

Fair enough, but from what I saw last year and this in training camp, in vignettes on the sidelines and the way the team came into this season, they buy into him. Now some of the other coaches...but ultimately that falls on Kubiak's shoulders. Passion helps towards success but doesn't guarantee it. I've watched a far more passionate team on the sidelines and on the field this year than any year before even if success in W's hasn't followed. That's why this criticism seems out of left field to me.

Second Honeymoon
10-31-2007, 09:12 AM
color me corrected on the 3 year deal thing. who the hell signs an unproven head coach to a 5 year deal. mcnair needs a freaking lobotomy.

but yeah, unless we lose the rest of our games it looks like Flatlining Gary will be our Head Coach. Well at least we have another season of uninspired and losing football to look forward to.......thanks Bob.

Specnatz
10-31-2007, 12:38 PM
color me corrected on the 3 year deal thing. who the hell signs an unproven head coach to a 5 year deal. mcnair needs a freaking lobotomy.

but yeah, unless we lose the rest of our games it looks like Flatlining Gary will be our Head Coach. Well at least we have another season of uninspired and losing football to look forward to.......thanks Bob.

What coach would only sign a three year deal to fix what Casserly and Capers screwed up, that would be completely moronic.

Arizona - Named Ken Whisenhunt coach and signed him to a four-year contract with a club option.

Flacons - Petrino has accepted a five-year, $24 million offer from the Atlanta Falcons to become their new coach. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2723700

Dolphins - Cam Cameron agreed to a four-year contract. Terms of the deal were not disclosed. http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/dolphins/2007-01-19-cameron-hiring_x.htm

Pittsburgh - Pittsburgh to offer him a four-year contract worth about $2.5 million annually. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16723895/

The five year deal is not out of line. Yet again you are talking without saying anything. I think you are the one who needs the lobotomy.

Vinny
10-31-2007, 01:27 PM
Passion helps towards success but doesn't guarantee it. I've watched a far more passionate team on the sidelines and on the field this year than any year before even if success in W's hasn't followed. That's why this criticism seems out of left field to me.I am on board with this and it's a fine point.

badboy
10-31-2007, 01:55 PM
But will fans settle for "better team" if the Ws are not there? For me it is yes. I just hate to see silly mistakes like clock management or players not blocking/tackling.

Vinny
10-31-2007, 01:57 PM
But will fans settle for "better team" if the Ws are not there? For me it is yes. I just hate to see silly mistakes like clock management or players not blocking/tackling.The team we have seen the last 3 weeks has been awful when the game was on the line. What we got there is no W's and sloppy, awful football.

Second Honeymoon
10-31-2007, 05:14 PM
What coach would only sign a three year deal to fix what Casserly and Capers screwed up, that would be completely moronic.

Arizona - Named Ken Whisenhunt coach and signed him to a four-year contract with a club option.

Flacons - Petrino has accepted a five-year, $24 million offer from the Atlanta Falcons to become their new coach. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2723700

Dolphins - Cam Cameron agreed to a four-year contract. Terms of the deal were not disclosed. http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/dolphins/2007-01-19-cameron-hiring_x.htm

Pittsburgh - Pittsburgh to offer him a four-year contract worth about $2.5 million annually. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16723895/

The five year deal is not out of line. Yet again you are talking without saying anything. I think you are the one who needs the lobotomy.

5 year deal is out of line with the contracts you listed. Only Petrino got a 5 year deal and we see how well that is working out.

Kubiak is 2nd rate and his staff is even worse. But whatever, keep honking and supporting a loser head coach....wouldn't surprise me....why not just give him a 10 year extension and erect a statue of the guy.

kubiak has been a failure
kubiak's staff is horrible
the team has gotten worse progressively
the team comes out flat
the team makes stupid mistake after stupid mistake
the players aren't gettin coached up and improving if anything they are regressing
the guy just looks completely overwhelmed on the sideline, press conferences, and the fact that he would use 'exceptional' and 'Mario' in the same sentence is the exact opposite of what we need from a coach on a young team.

but whatever, God forbid we try and improve our coaching. what a horrible fan I am.....

Texan_Bill
10-31-2007, 05:25 PM
8-24

Anybody know what that means?!??

Porky
10-31-2007, 05:40 PM
8-24

Anybody know what that means?!??

Our record in the last 32 games??

Texan_Bill
10-31-2007, 05:50 PM
8-24

OKay, Okay.....

That was Jimmy Johnson's record with the Cowgirls after his first two seasons.