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View Full Version : Please get OD involved in the red zone!!


alphajoker
10-08-2007, 09:21 AM
I'm thankful for the win today, but I still am concerned with our red zone offense. I believe if we get Daniels involved more, that could solve this problem. Of course, having Johnson and Green healthy would help too, but I just don't think we're utilizing Daniels as effectively as we should. He's shown that he can take the hits over the middle and hold on to the ball, and in my opinion, that's the part of the passing game needed once inside the 20. Just my :twocents: What do you guys think?

PapaL
10-08-2007, 09:24 AM
I'm thankful for the win today, but I still am concerned with our red zone offense. I believe if we get Daniels involved more, that could solve this problem. Of course, having Johnson and Green healthy would help too, but I just don't think we're utilizing Daniels as effectively as we should. He's shown that he can take the hits over the middle and hold on to the ball, and in my opinion, that's the part of the passing game needed once inside the 20. Just my :twocents: What do you guys think?

Oh you mean play action on first down? Throw to the TE that is wide open doing a crossword puzzle?

Yeah that would be a nice option. Never fear though - our vaunted short yardage run game will save us. Four rushes for two yards is what we all dream about.

TexansLucky13
10-08-2007, 09:29 AM
As an OD fantasy owner, I agree with this thread!

gwallaia
10-08-2007, 09:29 AM
Do we have any big ugly linemen that would like to be a running back every once in a while?

ObsiWan
10-08-2007, 09:31 AM
Oh you mean play action on first down? Throw to the TE that is wide open doing a crossword puzzle?

Yeah that would be a nice option. Never fear though - our vaunted short yardage run game will save us. Four rushes for two yards is what we all dream about.

LOL
There's no need for sarcasm.
hahahahaha

HoustonFrog
10-08-2007, 09:33 AM
Oh you mean play action on first down? Throw to the TE that is wide open doing a crossword puzzle?

Yeah that would be a nice option. Never fear though - our vaunted short yardage run game will save us. Four rushes for two yards is what we all dream about.

PapaL, this is what we discussed in the game thread yesterday. I think on 1st or 2nd down, the play action, hit the TE wide open works 99% of the time. Kubes just has this annoying fascination with trying to prove we can run the slowest back in the league right at the teeth of the defense.

GlassHalfFull
10-08-2007, 09:36 AM
Do we have any big ugly linemen that would like to be a running back every once in a while?

As much as I would hate to have him leave A&M early - can we draft Javorski (I know I didn't spell that right- but I'm too lazy to look it up) Lane next year? What a moose!! And did you see that 49 yd pass??

Mr teX
10-08-2007, 09:45 AM
Until these last 2 games without AJ, green & jones, we were doing fine in the red zone. I think you guys are jumping the gun a bit; we're no different than any other team sans Indy & NE. It gets tighter down in there, i suspect it would be harder to punch it in without our 3 top playmakers.

Texan Asylum
10-08-2007, 09:51 AM
I can endorse the use of Daniels more often. I can also agree with the fact that we were doing quite well before the onset of injuries to key players. Can't wait till we're healthy.

Also, has anyone else noticed how open the left side of the field always seems to be, when we're in the in the Red Zone?

:texflag:

HoustonFrog
10-08-2007, 09:51 AM
Until these last 2 games without AJ, green & jones, we were doing fine in the red zone. I think you guys are jumping the gun a bit; we're no different than any other team sans Indy & NE. It gets tighter down in there, i suspect it would be harder to punch it in without our 3 top playmakers.

The problem isn't just red zone though, you can take it to all situations 3rd and short too. They can't get the movement when needed. You are right regarding playmakers so that means instead of forcing it we should mix it up to overcome the talent shortage.

Mr teX
10-08-2007, 10:04 AM
The problem isn't just red zone though, you can take it to all situations 3rd and short too. They can't get the movement when needed. You are right regarding playmakers so that means instead of forcing it we should mix it up to overcome the talent shortage.

agreed, although i'm like kubes & would rather punch it in on the ground b/c i don't like how close in proximity the Defense is when trying to pass in the red zone, it makes me nervous.

alphajoker
10-08-2007, 11:54 AM
The problem isn't just red zone though, you can take it to all situations 3rd and short too. They can't get the movement when needed. You are right regarding playmakers so that means instead of forcing it we should mix it up to overcome the talent shortage.

Isn't OD one of our playmakers? I mean, the guy has been clutch between the 20 yard lines but once the offense gets into scoring position, they go away from him.

HoustonFrog
10-08-2007, 12:04 PM
Isn't OD one of our playmakers? I mean, the guy has been clutch between the 20 yard lines but once the offense gets into scoring position, they go away from him.

Yes he is and as I said I really don't understand not running that play action at the goalline alot more on 1st and 2nd down...3rd down you really aren't fooling anyone. I meant more of Green getting that one yard or AJ on slants.

real
10-08-2007, 12:06 PM
Owen Daniels is more of a stretch the field kind of TE...

I think he can be effective in the red zone, but I don't think it's one of his strengths...

PapaL
10-08-2007, 02:06 PM
PapaL, this is what we discussed in the game thread yesterday. I think on 1st or 2nd down, the play action, hit the TE wide open works 99% of the time. Kubes just has this annoying fascination with trying to prove we can run the slowest back in the league right at the teeth of the defense.

I agree 100%. The only issue I have the play calling is the goal line/short yardage. We have been absolutely horrible.

Play action on 1st. (When they expect the run)
Run on second. (When they expect pass)
Spread them out on third. (Stretch them out)
Kick on 4th. (Kickers need points as well)

Mr PC
10-08-2007, 02:26 PM
I'll sign this petition. Owen always seems to come up big when the ball is thrown to him. I'd like to see him get involved in the red zone offense. he is a truly underrated player, and one of our best offensive weapons. Throw it to OD for the TD.

Vinny
10-08-2007, 02:27 PM
I'm thankful for the win today, but I still am concerned with our red zone offense. I believe if we get Daniels involved more, that could solve this problem. Of course, having Johnson and Green healthy would help too, but I just don't think we're utilizing Daniels as effectively as we should. He's shown that he can take the hits over the middle and hold on to the ball, and in my opinion, that's the part of the passing game needed once inside the 20. Just my :twocents: What do you guys think?

When you are in the red zone the defenders have less space to protect and the end zone is only 10 yards deep...so you no longer have to cover and defend the field vertically. This is where you miss your skill guys the most....hence our problems.

alphajoker
10-08-2007, 03:26 PM
When you are in the red zone the defenders have less space to protect and the end zone is only 10 yards deep...so you no longer have to cover and defend the field vertically. This is where you miss your skill guys the most....hence our problems.

Yeah, I agree we definitely are missing our skill players, but why not take a shot into the end zone once we cross the 20? It seems like the offense is just working it's way to the goal line and when they get to within 5yds., they stall. I'm just saying they need to take a shot when they get to just within the 20. Schaub has been very effective with pass plays of 20 yards or more and Owens has that speed to get into the end zone. And quite frankly, I'm tired of Dayne.

Vinny
10-08-2007, 03:27 PM
Yeah, I agree we definitely are missing our skill players, but why not take a shot into the end zone once we cross the 20? It seems like the offense is just working it's way to the goal line and when they get to within 5yds., they stall. I'm just saying they need to take a shot when they get to just within the 20. Schaub has been very effective with pass plays of 20 yards or more and Owens has that speed to get into the end zone. And quite frankly, I'm tired of Dayne.like I said...we are missing our skill guys and the field shrinks. Believe it or not, players matter and there is smaller margin for error as there is less space to defend.

Texans_Chick
10-08-2007, 03:31 PM
When you are in the red zone the defenders have less space to protect and the end zone is only 10 yards deep...so you no longer have to cover and defend the field vertically. This is where you miss your skill guys the most....hence our problems.


How many times did you look at a play and think what Ahman Green or Andre Johnson would have done with that play?

Vinny
10-08-2007, 03:34 PM
How many times did you look at a play and think what Ahman Green or Andre Johnson would have done with that play?

teams have to play you different when you have elite skill guys....If you over play Andre it opens up creases for Green...If you stack the box Andre may get his crease....when you roll into the red zone with average players you can play straight up and not worry about some elite talent making you pay for not over playing them.

Texans_Chick
10-08-2007, 03:55 PM
teams have to play you different when you have elite skill guys....If you over play Andre it opens up creases for Green...If you stack the box Andre may get his crease....when you roll into the red zone with average players you can play straight up and not worry about some elite talent making you pay for not over playing them.

And when you are playing with below average players, you make it easy for them.

Ron Dayne in backfield. He has no speed to the corner and isn't much of a pass rushing threat. So why do you have to respect that run at all?

I mean 59 yards between Dayne and Gado. Against the Dolphins. Even in the annals of bad Texans football that is bad.

Vinny
10-08-2007, 03:58 PM
And when you are playing with below average players, you make it easy for them.

Ron Dayne in backfield. He has no speed to the corner and isn't much of a pass rushing threat. So why do you have to respect that run at all?

I mean 59 yards between Dayne and Gado. Against the Dolphins. Even in the annals of bad Texans football that is bad.
Walters is an 'ok' talent...probably doesn't start anywhere but here (probably won't even start here once JJ is fully acclimated). Andre Davis has nice speed but isn't that physical and can't just overpower the jam like Andre Johnson can. Dayne and Gado both have zero ability to make people miss in what I call "short space"....this whole thing is compounded by having a soft Center in the middle of the line who's best days were at his last team a few years back. Salaam got his ass kicked most of the game too.

real
10-08-2007, 04:22 PM
I dunno...I like Kevin Walter...I like the element of toughness he brings...

I like David Anderson a lot too...I'm happy he's getting more of a shot...

Vinny
10-08-2007, 04:25 PM
I dunno...I like Kevin Walter...I like the element of toughness he brings...

I like David Anderson a lot too...I'm happy he's getting more of a shot...
I'm not saying they aren't good players, I'm just making a case that when the field shrinks, the difference in talent is more noticeable since defenders no longer have to defend vertically and can jam and play closer to the WR's and the line.

real
10-08-2007, 04:27 PM
I'm not saying they aren't good players, I'm just making a case that when the field shrinks, the difference in talent is more noticeable since defenders no longer have to defend vertically and can jam and play closer to the WR's and the line.

Oh definintely....

I agree...

alphajoker
10-08-2007, 08:14 PM
I'm not saying they aren't good players, I'm just making a case that when the field shrinks, the difference in talent is more noticeable since defenders no longer have to defend vertically and can jam and play closer to the WR's and the line.

That's why they need to get Daniels involved in the red zone. He may not be elite material (yet) but along with Davis, he's been our best playmaker. And to not use him in goal line situations is bad coaching. He didn't go out for one pass during the two times they were on the goal line. Just stayed in and blocked, which is another good quality of his but at least send him on a boot leg or an out or something. Mix up the offense and give him a chance to make plays in the end zone...he's already doing it out between the 20's.

Vinny
10-08-2007, 08:45 PM
That's why they need to get Daniels involved in the red zone. He may not be elite material (yet) but along with Davis, he's been our best playmaker. And to not use him in goal line situations is bad coaching. He didn't go out for one pass during the two times they were on the goal line. Just stayed in and blocked, which is another good quality of his but at least send him on a boot leg or an out or something. Mix up the offense and give him a chance to make plays in the end zone...he's already doing it out between the 20's.perhaps the coverage or read dictated that Schaub keep him in to block when we got down deep...I have a hard time calling it bad coaching since we certainly used Daniels all day and he was a key player in the winning drives.

alphajoker
10-08-2007, 09:03 PM
perhaps the coverage or read dictated that Schaub keep him in to block when we got down deep...I have a hard time calling it bad coaching since we certainly used Daniels all day and he was a key player in the winning drives.

Well, yeah, I guess to call it bad coaching is pretty extreme but what I'm trying to say is...at least involve him as a receiver. Regardless of coverage or read, Daniels is a weapon that needs to be utilized and they didn't take advantage of that.

barrett
10-09-2007, 01:02 AM
call it whatever you want....

i'm calling it "Open" Daniels from now on. I'm lovin' it!

TexanSam
11-18-2007, 12:43 AM
Thought I would bump this thread. Hopefully Daniels gets his first TD (and more) of the season tomorrow