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View Full Version : Wand is this his big test???


ArlingtonTexan
11-12-2004, 05:40 PM
Unless I am mistaken, wand has not faced a great speed rusher this year and has seemed to hold his own at left tackle. Dwight Freeny represets great speed off the corner and it will be interesting to seehow wand adjusts to one the quickest of the edge rushers in the league.

Vinny
11-12-2004, 06:27 PM
As a pass blocker, Wand has a great base. Watch how he can bend at the knees and hips to maintain is balance like a much smaller man. Many tall 330 pounders are stiff and Herman Munster-like when they move. He may struggle against Freeney as much as any NFL lineman could but I am not worried about Wand being a good decision. From what I see he was an excellent pick when you look at the Tackle position in his draft class.

I'm not arguing your point AT, just expanding on it.

Here are all the first day Tackles in the 2003 NFL Draft...

First round
Jordan Gross Panthers - Gross was a top ten pick and struggles at Left Tackle.
George Foster Broncos Georgia - Mr Ankle-breaker. Solid young player, rarely on the active roster his first year.
Kwame Harris 49ers Stanford - Plays behind someone named Kyle Kosier

Second round
Jonathan Stinchcomb Saints - Georgia - Don't know much about his development but plays behind Wayne Gandy. Gandy is still a solid NFL Tackle.

Third round
Wayne Hunter Seahawks - Plays behind Chris Terry
Seth Wand Texans Northwest Missouri State
Wade Smith Dolphins - Solid player. A Chester Pitts clone @ LT. Not sure if he still starts.

ArlingtonTexan
11-12-2004, 09:24 PM
Did not take you as arguing...even though it has been quite a while since we have found something we really disagreed about :boxing:

Lucky
11-12-2004, 09:53 PM
Wand did struggle early against Steve Foley, James Hall, & Jared Allen (Jared Allen?). That was to be expected. I think he's improved since then and that's to be expected, as well. But 5 of the next 7 games have the Texans facing legit pass rushers at RDE. And Freeney is the best of the bunch. I feel that the Texans need to run at Freeney early and allow Seth to lean a bit on Dwight.

From a thread this preseason (http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?t=1916).

...I read somewhere that the Colts will be moving Freeney from right to left this year to create a bit more opportunity for him and for teams to have more to scheme for...
That's happening on some passing downs, as the Colts have flipped Freeney to LDE and put pass rush specialist Robert Mathis at RDE. With Todd Wade's injury, Freeney vs. Marcus Spears isn't the greatest matchup, either. Speaking of Mathis, he has 5 sacks thus far (Freeney has 6) and has become one of the better players taken in the 2nd day of the '03 draft. I'm hesitant to mention this for fear that Bill's Fan is lurking, but Mathis was selected with the 5th round pick the Texans traded the Colts. Not a bad pick at all considering he's an ace on special teams, too.

ArlingtonTexan
11-12-2004, 10:37 PM
My only thought was that Wand has not been an embarrassment, so i probaly not going to fight you either. Allen, btw, has 4 sacks for Chiefs and has a decent combination of moves.

drdjsmm
11-13-2004, 11:52 PM
After Jared Allen gets in the weight room with the chiefs, he'll be a force to be reconned with!!

DreamCatcher
11-14-2004, 03:12 AM
Wand will have to be at his best against Freeney but i that is how you keep on improving by playing against good opponents.The way the Texans are playing we can also put good pressure on Manning.

TheTim5125
11-14-2004, 10:50 AM
I noticed that Freeny switches sides when rushing... at least he did that against the vikings

wags
11-14-2004, 08:08 PM
Both tackles were bad today. Wand couldn't handle Freeney's spin move and Spears was just too slow. Whoever it was just ran right around Spears all day. Wasn't Pitts better at LT last year? Didn't he do a good job on Freeney? Freeney only had one sack in two games against us last year. I'm not even sure if that one sack came against Pitts. Watching today made me wonder about putting Pitts back in, especially with another rusher like KGB coming next week. Our O-line can't get any worse, and how long can a QB stay healthy behind a bad line.

Vinny
11-14-2004, 08:22 PM
Lots of players can't handle Freeney. How many sacks did Freeney end up with today? One?

I know Mathis had 3 on the other side against our back up Tackle.

georgewashington
11-14-2004, 08:35 PM
THe offensive line was lousy, and even if freeny only had one sack he still had a lot of pressure, and it seemed to me he just pushed the tackles straight back with power moves a lot, not even using his speed. They were terrible today, adn carr is lucky he didnt get hurt again this year like last year against the colts

utahmark
11-14-2004, 08:39 PM
i think wand will be alright. its the rest of the line that im worried about. we need a new center and a couple of backups that can actually play. then we could be an average o-line. we need a complete overhaul for us to have a good or dominating o-line.

Vinny
11-14-2004, 08:41 PM
I just looked up the NFL game book. Freeny had no sacks and two tackles with one assisted tackle.

D. Freeney 2-1 0.0 0 0

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/gamebook/NFL_20041114_HOU@IND

utahmark
11-14-2004, 08:44 PM
I just looked up the NFL game book. Freeny had no sacks and two tackles with one assisted tackle.

D. Freeney 2-1 0.0 0 0

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/gamebook/NFL_20041114_HOU@IND

he did blow by wand at least once. and another time he pushed wand back into the qb.

Vinny
11-14-2004, 08:46 PM
Didn't say Freeney didn't have a good game. I just don't think he took over the game quite like most are posting in relation to Wand. Our biggest line problems were on the right side today. Freeney was held down despite him being far quicker than Wand. He was disruptive but the bottom line is he was in on 3 tackles.

utahmark
11-14-2004, 08:49 PM
it seams like we run alot to the right on short yardage. i would like to see how wand and pitts held up in a short yardage play.

texasguy346
11-14-2004, 08:52 PM
I think Freeney does a great job of not only using his speed to get around the T, but he also uses his quickness to keep the T off balance which makes it easier to push him back into the QB. Freeney is tough to handle for any LT, but the Texans' OLine made the Colts' DLine look like it was full of All Pros. The OLine had yet another horrible game. Credit the Colts DLine for playing well, and although they might not be among the better DLines in the league they certainly played as if they were today. The way the OLine played is absolutely inexcusable, and they've got to step it up and play with some intensity and toughness against GB. If they don't then we'll be in for yet another long game.

ArlingtonTexan
11-14-2004, 09:09 PM
Wand did not have a great game, but it the right side of the line played as well as the left side the offense may have had a chance. Spears had a terrible game. when i paid attention it seemed as if Wand was getting more help than Spears.

georgewashington
11-14-2004, 10:05 PM
Didn't say Freeney didn't have a good game. I just don't think he took over the game quite like most are posting in relation to Wand. Our biggest line problems were on the right side today. Freeney was held down despite him being far quicker than Wand. He was disruptive but the bottom line is he was in on 3 tackles.

This coming from the man that said when babin only makes a few tackles it doesnt show what he did. Its the same thing. Freeny was causing hurries all game and i know he laid out carr at least once whether it was a sack or not. He was killing the line all game whether he made the plays himself or not.

Vinny
11-14-2004, 10:07 PM
No, this came from the guy that Illustrated that although Wong only had 30-something tackles he was still a viable player learning the position. You just can't take a sentence out of context and state someone's disposition on a different subject.

ArlingtonTexan
11-14-2004, 10:22 PM
You just can't take a sentence out of context and state someone's disposition on a different subject.

Hey that's what I do for i living :confused: :um: :shocked

edo783
11-14-2004, 11:10 PM
Wand had a bad first quarter and after that he started to catch on to Feeney's speed and did a much better job of running him deep or stuffing him at the line when he came straight in. Not perfect, but not bad for what amounts to a rookie. On the other side a whole nother story. Never seemed to get a handle on that one. Just not enough quickness to deal with the rush. Not sure how Wade would have done, but I expect it would have been better. Middle seemed to be getting pushed back regularly and winding up in Carrs lap. The only time he had time to see the field was when he rolled out. Had to bring back images of year one.

dalemurphy
11-14-2004, 11:23 PM
Well, Wand did a much better job on Freeney than Bryant McKinnie did last week. So, if you want to judge his development that way, he's well ahead of a top 5 pick from 3 years ago. I'm much more alarmed by the fact that Spears was a nightmare and the interior line was getting manhandled all day long. Regardless of the circumstances, if a first year starter at left tackle is going against Freeney on artificial turf and gives up 3 QB pressures and three tackles, he wasn't the problem.

phan1
11-15-2004, 12:00 AM
As a pass blocker, Wand has a great base. Watch how he can bend at the knees and hips to maintain is balance like a much smaller man. Many tall 330 pounders are stiff and Herman Munster-like when they move. He may struggle against Freeney as much as any NFL lineman could but I am not worried about Wand being a good decision. From what I see he was an excellent pick when you look at the Tackle position in his draft class.

I'm not arguing your point AT, just expanding on it.

Here are all the first day Tackles in the 2003 NFL Draft...

First round
Jordan Gross Panthers - Gross was a top ten pick and struggles at Left Tackle.
George Foster Broncos Georgia - Mr Ankle-breaker. Solid young player, rarely on the active roster his first year.
Kwame Harris 49ers Stanford - Plays behind someone named Kyle Kosier

Second round
Jonathan Stinchcomb Saints - Georgia - Don't know much about his development but plays behind Wayne Gandy. Gandy is still a solid NFL Tackle.

Third round
Wayne Hunter Seahawks - Plays behind Chris Terry
Seth Wand Texans Northwest Missouri State
Wade Smith Dolphins - Solid player. A Chester Pitts clone @ LT. Not sure if he still starts.

Nice stats. I guess that means we should look for Olineman in free agency and not the draft?

Vinny
11-15-2004, 01:00 AM
Nice stats. I guess that means we should look for Olineman in free agency and not the draft?Everyone that thinks a rookie lineman is going to come in and 'fix' this line doesn't realize that it is fairly rare for a rookie to come in and start immediately (unless he is a top 5-10 pick...that we likely don't get, or we have pure scrubs starting). The offensive line takes the most time of all the position groups to play well as a unit. As our current group of guys play together they will get better. It's just that most fans have zero patience.

chuckm
11-15-2004, 01:30 PM
Well, Wand did a much better job on Freeney than Bryant McKinnie did last week. So, if you want to judge his development that way, he's well ahead of a top 5 pick from 3 years ago. I'm much more alarmed by the fact that Spears was a nightmare and the interior line was getting manhandled all day long. Regardless of the circumstances, if a first year starter at left tackle is going against Freeney on artificial turf and gives up 3 QB pressures and three tackles, he wasn't the problem.


The above quote says it all ...... McKinnie (who I'm sure everyone in Houston would take over Wand in a heartbeat) was helpless against Freeney's speed .... Wand did a decent job all things considered ....

V Man
11-15-2004, 01:41 PM
Wand didn't have his best game yesterday, granted. But I think he has done better than everyone expected for the year so far. Remember the first year, how many sacks did Pitts give up, and then look at the improvement the next year. Give Wand some time, he has done OK this year, and will be that much better the next time we play the colts, and even better than that the next year.

TexansTrueFan
11-15-2004, 01:44 PM
id give wand a F-. quickness is deadly. id give the whole team a F- for getting humiliated for the second weekend in a row.


D i'm still crying man,,,what a lousy performance, makes me never wanna watch another texans game again ! :shocked

nunusguy
11-15-2004, 01:46 PM
Wand was a 3rd round investment for us and we got value received for value
paid. Wade, the RT, was not - we shelled out 10M cash bonus which is an unreal sum for a RT who was not rated that highly amoung his peers.

Vinny
11-15-2004, 01:49 PM
Wade has done a good job here. It sure beats the journeymen we had here before. I assume you know where we could have picked up a better player cheaper?

nunusguy
11-15-2004, 02:26 PM
Wade has done a good job here. It sure beats the journeymen we had here before. I assume you know where we could have picked up a better player cheaper?
Yes he's done a good job here. Yes he beats his predecessor. And I would have put Weigert @ RT(our origional plan for him), before shelling out a 10M bonus to Wade in free agency. If you don't manage cap, you end up with
inferior personnel to your competition.

Vinny
11-15-2004, 02:40 PM
Weigert is not a very good Tackle. He gets abused in space. He is a much better Guard than a Tackle. The Texans had a need on the line and they went to take care of it with the best RT on the market. Wade is not going to cause us any cap problems. I have a hard time knocking this team for shoring up a need position with one of the top FA's on the market.