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View Full Version : Who would Smith & Kubiak deal for a FS ?


nunusguy
08-31-2007, 05:23 PM
Kubiaks on SR 610 right now talking about the Texans need for a FS as we go
into the season-opener against KC. He's said they have made calls on potential deals and they are taking calls from other teams interested in our players. Wonder who he & Smith would be willing to trade for help at safey, for a player who very well might start for us at some point at FS.

Wolf
08-31-2007, 05:30 PM
http://www.texanstalk.com/forums//showpost.php?p=723356&postcount=35

this was from KC's website about Wesley

J-Russ
08-31-2007, 05:31 PM
Morlon Greenwood, Anthony Weaver??

TheRealJoker
08-31-2007, 05:37 PM
I think with the emergence of Orr at rush DE we may be able to get a semi-decent starter at FS if we trade Babin and maybe someone else.

Marcus
08-31-2007, 05:50 PM
If they get another free safety, it be from picking someone up that got cut. I'd shocked to death if they gave up a draft pick for one, or trade one of our starters. That just ain't gonna happen.

JohnsonFan
08-31-2007, 05:52 PM
i dont know but it would be great for us

Double Barrel
08-31-2007, 05:52 PM
I think with the emergence of Orr at rush DE we may be able to get a semi-decent starter at FS if we trade Babin and maybe someone else.

I'd hate to give up Babin, arguably our best pass rusher at the moment.

aj.
08-31-2007, 05:56 PM
Morlon Greenwood, Anthony Weaver??

No and no.

Because no one wants either player's contract.

the wonger need food
08-31-2007, 06:17 PM
No and no.

Because no one wants either player's contract.



Yep, both of these guys are untradable. Looking down the roster we don't really have a lot to offer.


Maybe Flanagan has some value? Why else would there be 3 Centers on the roster.

76Texan
08-31-2007, 06:58 PM
Yep, both of these guys are untradable. Looking down the roster we don't really have a lot to offer.


Maybe Flanagan has some value? Why else would there be 3 Centers on the roster.

On the other hand, if we are willing to assume a fairly big contract, somebody can be had, I would think.

kiwitexansfan
09-01-2007, 02:31 PM
I think with the emergence of Orr at rush DE we may be able to get a semi-decent starter at FS if we trade Babin and maybe someone else.


Ding, ding, ding... we have a winner, give this man a prize.

MojoMan
09-01-2007, 02:53 PM
Perhaps Charlie Anderson (LB) & Mike Flanagan (C).

TheRealJoker
09-01-2007, 03:35 PM
Ding, ding, ding... we have a winner, give this man a prize.


:splits:

Double Barrel
09-01-2007, 03:42 PM
Ding, ding, ding... we have a winner, give this man a prize.

Great call, though, Joker! Give that man a cigar. :howdy:

Overalls
09-01-2007, 04:25 PM
Great call, though, Joker! Give that man a cigar. :howdy:

No joke Joker. Rep coming your way.

:fans:

Brando
09-01-2007, 04:32 PM
Great call, though, Joker! Give that man a cigar. :howdy:

There is a reason he has Michael Smith as his avatar.:cowboy1:

mexican_texan
09-01-2007, 04:35 PM
We might need to do something with Weaver since Travis Johnson finally decided to play.

gtexan02
09-01-2007, 04:37 PM
Except for the fact that Weaver is a DE and TJ is a DT? How do those conflict?

TheRealJoker
09-01-2007, 04:49 PM
My prediction was so good that I called it several hours after the trade was made!!!:whip:

The Pencil Neck
09-01-2007, 05:08 PM
My prediction was so good that I called it several hours after the trade was made!!!:whip:

You're going to have to work pretty hard to duplicate that sort of success. You should just stop now because I'm afraid it's just downhill from here.

mexican_texan
09-01-2007, 05:11 PM
Except for the fact that Weaver is a DE and TJ is a DT? How do those conflict?
I thought Weaver was listed as a DT

Specnatz
09-01-2007, 05:32 PM
I thought Weaver was listed as a DT

nope

Yankee_In_TX
09-01-2007, 05:36 PM
Kubiaks on SR 610 right now talking about the Texans need for a FS as we go
into the season-opener against KC. He's said they have made calls on potential deals and they are taking calls from other teams interested in our players. Wonder who he & Smith would be willing to trade for help at safey, for a player who very well might start for us at some point at FS.

Wait, wait, I know this one!

MissouriTexan
09-01-2007, 05:37 PM
Wait, wait, I know this one!

Go on.

Yankee_In_TX
09-01-2007, 05:42 PM
Go on.

In other news, Yankee mistook a thread as being old, and Boulware for a FS. Reports state he is NOT funny.

Mr PC
09-01-2007, 10:24 PM
FS Will Demps is no longer with the Giants and is now a free agent. This means Smith and Kubiak will not need to deal any players or draft picks, they can just sign Demps outright. He would be the immediate starter over CC Brown.

Demps (age 27) is coming off his best season last year where he recorded 100 tackles starting at free safety. He has 46 career starts as a FS, which is to say he is not a SS or converted cornerback like all the other safties on our roster. There is nothing preventing him from coming to Houston, if we sign him it would be a huge upgrade in the secondary because it would put CC on the bench.

The Pencil Neck
09-01-2007, 10:28 PM
FS Will Demps is no longer with the Giants and is now a free agent. This means Smith and Kubiak will not need to deal any players or draft picks, they can just sign Demps outright. He would be the immediate starter over CC Brown.

Demps (age 27) is coming off his best season last year where he recorded 100 tackles starting at free safety. He has 46 career starts as a FS, which is to say he is not a SS or converted cornerback like all the other safties on our roster. There is nothing preventing him from coming to Houston, if we sign him it would be a huge upgrade in the secondary because it would put CC on the bench.

Doesn't he have a dislocated elbow or something?

Be that as it may, there are a bunch of possible FS options out there. I'm interested to see what magic Smith and Kubiak are going to work.

J-Russ
09-01-2007, 10:31 PM
Actually, they put him on IR...

link: http://www.nfl.com/preseason/story?id=09000d5d80200778&template=without-video&confirm=true

Lamont Thompson, ex-Titans, was cut today. He started at FS for them last year and had 3 int and 73 tackle. He's another option for FS.

Mr PC
09-01-2007, 10:34 PM
Demps dislocated his elbow in the Giants second preseason game (Aug 19th). Its part of the reason he was cut, because he couldnt practice or play afterward. His recovery time was estimated at 3-5 weeks, but Demps insists he will be ready to play by week 1 of the regular season. I think this guy is exactly what we need. Boulware is a good addition but we still need a ball hawking safety. Demps is solid in pass coverage and wouldnt be a liabilty out there the way CC is right now.



...the Giants parted ways with Demps Saturday after just one season. Demps was placed on injured reserve and Tony Agnone, Demps' agent, said he and the team would work out an injury settlement so his client could become a free agent.
http://www.newsday.com/sports/footba...,5081077.story

MojoMan
09-01-2007, 10:46 PM
Demps dislocated his elbow in the Giants second preseason game (Aug 19th). Its part of the reason he was cut, because he couldnt practice or play afterward. His recovery time was estimated at 3-5 weeks, but Demps insists he will be ready to play by week 1 of the regular season. I think this guy is exactly what we need. Boulware is a good addition but we still need a ball hawking safety. Demps is solid in pass coverage and wouldnt be a liabilty out there the way CC is right now.

http://www.newsday.com/sports/footba...,5081077.story


Do the Giants need a punter? Maybe we can trade Chad Stanley for him.

BattleRedToro
09-01-2007, 10:51 PM
Do the Giants need a punter? Maybe we can trade Chad Stanley for him.

You do know that Stanley has been cut, right?

Mr PC
09-01-2007, 10:51 PM
Do the Giants need a punter? Maybe we can trade Chad Stanley for him.

No dude we dont need to trade at all for him. Demps is about to be a free agent, which means any team is now free to sign him. My guess is Demps will want to play on a team where he can start at FS, which would make him a good fit for the Texans.

The Pencil Neck
09-01-2007, 10:56 PM
You do know that Stanley has been cut, right?

No, we put him on IR along with Abbate, and Earl.

EDIT: And Harrison.

EDIT 2: Sorry, Spencer is PUP'd not IR'd.

BattleRedToro
09-01-2007, 11:00 PM
No, we put him on IR along with Abbate, Spencer, and Earl.

EDIT: And Harrison.

My mistake I thought he was cut. Either way, I don't think Stanley can be traded while on the IR.

MojoMan
09-01-2007, 11:10 PM
You do know that Stanley has been cut, right?

No dude we dont need to trade at all for him. Demps is about to be a free agent, which means any team is now free to sign him. My guess is Demps will want to play on a team where he can start at FS, which would make him a good fit for the Texans.

They have both been put on the IR for their respective teams. Stanley has not been cut, and Demps is not getting ready to be a free agent.

MojoMan
09-01-2007, 11:12 PM
My mistake I thought he was cut. Either way, I don't think Stanley can be traded while on the IR.

This was the question I posed in the Chad Stanley thread.

I get your point, but I am not convinced that we have a clear understanding of this yet.

Mr PC
09-01-2007, 11:18 PM
Demps is not getting ready to be a free agent.

I believe he is. The Giants chose to put a different safety in Demps spot on the active roster. Puting him on the IR list means he cannot play for the entire season. Demps injury was not a season ender, it was a dislocated elbow that he says will be healed by the first game of the season. Demps agent says they are working on an injury settlement righ now. This will allow Demps to be a free agent and play for any team this year instead of sitting on IR for 16 games.


*according to Mike Garafolo (Sept 1, 2007)
The Giants placed S Will Demps on IR. I spoke to his agent, Tony Agnone, a few moments ago and he said his understanding is the team will work out an injury settlement in the near future. That means Demps is Giant property for now but will be set free sometime soon.


http://blog.nj.com/ledgergiants/

BattleRedToro
09-01-2007, 11:23 PM
This was the question I posed in the Chad Stanley thread.

I get your point, but I am not convinced that we have a clear understanding of this yet.

I do not believe that teams can, nor would if they could, trade players on their respective IR's. Part of the trade process is passing a physical, which a player won't be able to do while on the IR.

The Pencil Neck
09-01-2007, 11:31 PM
I do not believe that teams can, nor would if they could, trade players on their respective IR's. Part of the trade process is passing a physical, which a player won't be able to do while on the IR.

You can choose to accept a player even if they do "fail" the physical... can't you? You can sign a player who's currently injured like Brees and Culpepper last year.

quicksilver
09-01-2007, 11:34 PM
Hey, if Boselli could pass a physical to become a Texan in 2002....

TexansSeminole
09-01-2007, 11:36 PM
Lamont Thompson, ex-Titans, was cut today. He started at FS for them last year and had 3 int and 73 tackle. He's another option for FS.

If this is true we should bid hard for this guy.

CloakNNNdagger
09-01-2007, 11:56 PM
I believe he is. The Giants chose to put a different safety in Demps spot on the active roster. Puting him on the IR list means he cannot play for the entire season. Demps injury was not a season ender, it was a dislocated elbow that he says will be healed by the first game of the season. Demps agent says they are working on an injury settlement righ now. This will allow Demps to be a free agent and play for any team this year instead of sitting on IR for 16 games.


*according to Mike Garafolo (Sept 1, 2007)


http://blog.nj.com/ledgergiants/

Although, at least on the surface, Demps may be an option the Texans may wish to pursue, there have been problems secondary to injuries. This is the second time his elbow has dislocated although it must have been minor because he was back in action after only 2 weeks the first time. But obviously a knee injury has been another major factor in the Giants' surprise decision. A recurrent elbow dislocation is also a red flag.:

Giants Begin Roster Trim by Releasing Veteran Safety Will Demps
Posted Sep 1st 2007 1:21PM by Dan Benton
Filed under: NY Giants, NFC East, New York

You will not find one Giants 53-man roster projection without Will Demps' name on it, but they would all be wrong. In a rather shocking decision by Coach Tom Coughlin, the New York Giants have decided to part ways with the six-year veteran safety.


12:01 p.m. S Will Demps has been cut, his agent, Tony Agnone, has confirmed. Agnone said the team will give Demps an injury settlement for his dislocated elbow.
Demps struggled in his first season with New York, but many attributed that to the continued recovery of a serious knee injury. Unfortunately, he never really got it going in training camp and was eventually demoted to the second team before going down with a dislocated elbow in week two of the preseason.DEMPS (http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2007/09/01/giants-begin-cuts-by-releasing-will-demps/)

feebleminded
09-02-2007, 12:03 AM
They have both been put on the IR for their respective teams. Stanley has not been cut, and Demps is not getting ready to be a free agent.

Probably ends up being like the Troy Vincent situation last year

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2622987

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
09-02-2007, 12:11 AM
Demps is no better than C.C. Brown. I've seen him play and he is terrible in coverage. He was constantly burned by TEs in Baltimore.

Mr PC
09-02-2007, 12:30 AM
From what I have heard Demps is quite decent in pass coverage. He has got to be better than CC Brown, I doubt CC could have been a starting FS on Baltimore's defense. Demps is a solid free safety that would start over Brown (my opinion). Thats why most Giants fans are confused about him being released.


CC Brown in 2006
TCKL 76 SCK 1.0 FF 1 INT 1

Will Demps in 2006
TCKL 100 SCK 1.0 FF 1 INT 2


Last season was Demps first year back after a season ending ACL tear. He told the coaches while he was playing that he was not 100% recovered from the surgey. Now entering his second year after the surgery he should have an even stronger season.

MojoMan
09-02-2007, 12:37 AM
Probably ends up being like the Troy Vincent situation last year

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2622987

Remembering that situation and being able to find the story from last year is like finding a needle in a hay stack. Very good catch. Positive rep for you, young man.

This is a great article that really gives us some great insight on the dynamics of this situation. This could be the same situation that applies to Stanley and Abbate as well.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
09-02-2007, 01:06 AM
The only reason Demps was a starter in Baltimore was because they went through a cap purge in 2002 and Demps beat out a another rookie named Chad Williams (who is no longer playing in the NFL) for the starting role. They had too much money invested in the defense so signing a player to replace Demps was out of the question. Ed Reed was the reason they were able to get by with Demps' deficiencies in coverage.

As soon as Demps became a free agent, the Giants offered him a ridiculous contract and the Ravens gladly let him walk. They replaced him with Dawan Landry, a fifth round rookie, who in his rookie season played far better than Demps ever did during his time with the Ravens.

It is of no coincidence that very few Ravens defensive players leave that team to have success with another franchise. Just look at guys like Ed Hartwell, Gary Baxter, Duane Starks, Ma'ake Kemoeatu, and of course Will Demps among others (it's possible Weaver could be added to this list soon). Former starters who left Baltimore for a big contract only to fall incredibly short of expectations. The Ravens do a very good job of hiding weaknesses in their defense so when players leave they become exploited because their deficiencies are no longer masked by the Ravens scheme.

Demps is below average in run support, a poor tackler, terrible in coverage, and drops a lot of potential interceptions. To me, he is no better than C.C. Brown and he comes with the injury baggage. I don't need stats to tell me what kind of player he is. Jay Foreman racked up plenty of tackles on the stat sheet while he was here and the guy was absolute garbage.

Mr PC
09-02-2007, 01:22 AM
Demps is not a probowl safety, but he is better than Brown. He did start playing well towards the end of last season (presumably because his injury was healing). And by most accounts he was having a good camp up until he got injured. I think Demps is poised to have his best season this year. At age 27 he is just hitting his prime and is now 2 years removed from the knee surgery. Dislocating an elbow twice in six years does not qualify as a recurring injury IMO. I would much rather see Demps starting than CC Brown. Anyway Brandon Harrison got put on IR today so he is out for the season, which means we have a spot open at safety.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
09-02-2007, 01:24 AM
That spot was filled when we traded for Michael Boulware. Players that are poised for their best season don't get demoted nor do they have injury settlements. Demps has steadily regressed since his days as a Raven.

bckey
09-02-2007, 01:33 AM
Strong safety was but not free safety.

Mr PC
09-02-2007, 01:37 AM
That spot was filled when we traded for Michael Boulware.

Both Babin and Harrison were on the final 53 correct? Boulware replaced Jason Babin on the active roster, that still leaves Harrison's spot open.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
09-02-2007, 01:40 AM
They were 2 cuts to be made. Killings was one of them and Harrison was placed on IR. Boulware just replaced Babin on the 53 man roster. They are currently no open spots left.

Mr PC
09-02-2007, 01:50 AM
They were 2 cuts to be made. Killings was one of them and Harrison was placed on IR. Boulware just replaced Babin on the 53 man roster. They are currently no open spots left.

Are we currently carrying Dressen and Pittman on the active roster? If so, this is a bit redundant and we could definately benefit from bringing in a FS. We dont need two long snappers when we have zero free safeties on the roster. All of our safeties are either SS or converted from some other position, we have no true free safety.

TexansSB07
09-02-2007, 01:57 AM
Titans dumped their 3 year starter at FS Lamont Thompson onto waiver wire, also Donavan Darius S was cut by Oakland (that cannot be a GOOD sign...when worst doesn't need you).

Went through ALL 31 other teams, pretty much rookies or backups who didn't play at safety. So will probably have to be another trade if we looking for MORE veteran safety help, otherwise we don't have a lot of room.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
09-02-2007, 02:01 AM
I'm pretty sure they are not done making changes to the roster. If they do choose to sign Demps that is fine by me but for people to automatically assume he is by far better than C.C. Brown based on his stats and the fact that he started for the Ravens is completely shortsighted. Kim Herring started for the Ravens in 2000, who had one of the best defenses of all time, and he wasn't even a good player.

Mr PC
09-02-2007, 02:07 AM
I'm pretty sure they are not done making changes to the roster. If they do choose to sign Demps that is fine by me but for people to automatically assume he is by far better than C.C. Brown based on his stats and the fact that he started for the Ravens is completely shortsighted. Kim Herring started for the Ravens in 2000, who had one of the best defenses of all time, and he wasn't even a good player.

Im also basing it on what I have seen from CC. Even this preseason CC looked bad in the Dallas game, and Kubiak himself called out CC for that long pass interference play he gave up. Demps has started over 40 games as a free safety, and he played competently enough to start on a great defense. I do think Will Demps would immediately supplant CC in the depth chart. Boulware is our run defending safety, we need a ball hawking safety to compliment that.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
09-02-2007, 02:13 AM
Will Demps is definitely not the ballhawking safety you are looking for. The problem with your logic is that you are basing it on what you have seen from C.C. Brown and completely disregarding Demps' play since you admittingly have never watched him.

Mr PC
09-02-2007, 02:26 AM
Will Demps is definitely not the ballhawking safety you are looking for. The problem with your logic is that you are basing it on what you have seen from C.C. Brown and completely disregarding Demps' play since you admittingly have never watched him.

...well thats mostly true about my logic process, but I have witnessed CC give up TDs with my own eyes many times. Demps is a real free safety, and probably one of the best available right now.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
09-02-2007, 02:38 AM
You're saying he is probably one of the best free safeties available when you have never seen him play. Umm, something doesn't seem right about what you just said. How about watching the guy play before coming to such conclusions? I'll leave it at that.

Mr PC
09-02-2007, 02:51 AM
Why would you leave it at that? Throw out a couple names that would be better options at FS than Will Demps. Lamont Thompson, a free safety cut from the league's worst defense? Donovan Darius, another old SS? If there are better free safeties available we should get them. So who would it be?

BattleRedToro
09-02-2007, 06:28 AM
Titans dumped their 3 year starter at FS Lamont Thompson onto waiver wire, also Donavan Darius S was cut by Oakland (that cannot be a GOOD sign...when worst doesn't need you).

Went through ALL 31 other teams, pretty much rookies or backups who didn't play at safety. So will probably have to be another trade if we looking for MORE veteran safety help, otherwise we don't have a lot of room.

Oakland is the league's worst team but they aren't the league's worst defense. In fact they have a very good defense. It's their offense that sucks.

TK_Gamer
09-02-2007, 07:25 AM
Darius is a vet, probably at the pricey end of his contract. I think he is a SS type though. I don't know much about lamont Thompson. Anyway have any info on him?

Maddict5
09-02-2007, 07:31 AM
i saw a couple tacks games last yr (giants spring to mind) and thompson was terrible in alot of them... constantly burned

Mr PC
09-11-2007, 03:10 PM
The only reason Demps was a starter in Baltimore was because they went through a cap purge in 2002 and Demps beat out a another rookie named Chad Williams (who is no longer playing in the NFL) for the starting role. They had too much money invested in the defense so signing a player to replace Demps was out of the question. Ed Reed was the reason they were able to get by with Demps' deficiencies in coverage.

As soon as Demps became a free agent, the Giants offered him a ridiculous contract and the Ravens gladly let him walk. They replaced him with Dawan Landry, a fifth round rookie, who in his rookie season played far better than Demps ever did during his time with the Ravens.

It is of no coincidence that very few Ravens defensive players leave that team to have success with another franchise. Just look at guys like Ed Hartwell, Gary Baxter, Duane Starks, Ma'ake Kemoeatu, and of course Will Demps among others (it's possible Weaver could be added to this list soon). Former starters who left Baltimore for a big contract only to fall incredibly short of expectations. The Ravens do a very good job of hiding weaknesses in their defense so when players leave they become exploited because their deficiencies are no longer masked by the Ravens scheme.

Demps is below average in run support, a poor tackler, terrible in coverage, and drops a lot of potential interceptions. To me, he is no better than C.C. Brown and he comes with the injury baggage. I don't need stats to tell me what kind of player he is. Jay Foreman racked up plenty of tackles on the stat sheet while he was here and the guy was absolute garbage.

Hopefully you are wrong in you assesment about Demps. I think he has promise, and I am glad they signed him. My idea from last week doesnt seem so off base now, does it?

HuttoKarl
09-11-2007, 03:16 PM
It's asking quite a bit to expect a perfect player to be picked up off the streets after week one of the regular season is in the books. Demps is what he is. A FS who's at least as good as what we had in week one and provides us with help at a position in which help is welcome.