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View Full Version : Leavin' On A Jet Plane....don't Know When........


CloakNNNdagger
08-11-2007, 10:14 PM
Van Pelt and Stanley will be roomies with DC pretty soon.

Dexter Wynn may be waiting tables on them.......

Complete the list......................

powerfuldragon
08-11-2007, 10:16 PM
i must admit that turk was indeed better than stanley.

Hagar
08-11-2007, 10:22 PM
Mario did absolutely nothing tonight. I made it a point of specifically watching him on every play. Mario showed little in the way of effort.

Even though Babin was burned on the 2Q TD, he outplayed Mario.
This is not good.

281
08-11-2007, 10:25 PM
if van pelt makes it, i'll cut off my right hand.

Thorn
08-11-2007, 10:25 PM
Mario did absolutely nothing tonight. I made it a point of specifically watching him on every play. Mario showed little in the way of effort.

Even though Babin was burned on the 2Q TD, he outplayed Mario.
This is not good.

You have no idea of how much I hate agreeing with you on this hurts me.....

I expected more of him tonight. http://www.trekbbs.com/threads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

powerfuldragon
08-11-2007, 10:26 PM
I expected more of him tonight. http://www.trekbbs.com/threads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

[Generic RB/VY comment] :user:

Thorn
08-11-2007, 10:30 PM
[Generic RB/VY comment] :user:

um...if you know my history, then you would know I supported his selection in the draft. I'm a defense first kind of guy. And I still support Mario and I still think he will be an all star and kick ass.

It's just he didn't do so well tonight. What can I say?

beerlover
08-11-2007, 10:33 PM
Van Pelt and Stanley will be roomies with DC pretty soon.

Dexter Wynn may be waiting tables on them.......

Complete the list......................

Kevin Walters
Jordan Black
David Anderson
Wali Lundy

all really dissapointed today :whip:

MEGA SWATT
08-11-2007, 10:35 PM
Van Pelt is crap
Mario in not motivated
Lundy has butterfingers

New_Texans
08-11-2007, 10:38 PM
I'm not worried about Mario...he had 2 series...just 2 series guys! Id rather have him save it all for the regular season...and maybe the game against the Cowboys since he'll be in there for a half or maybe 3 quarters. Also, da bears have a very nice O'line.

Jacoby Jones impressed me.

Jason Babin did what I expected honestly. I don't understand why so many people are down on him. Hes a good DE.

Earl Cochran was good as well.

Thorn
08-11-2007, 10:43 PM
I'm not worried about Mario...he had 2 series...just 2 series guys! Id rather have him save it all for the regular season...and maybe the game against the Cowboys since he'll be in there for a half or maybe 3 quarters. Also, da bears have a very nice O'line.

Jacoby Jones impressed me.

Jason Babin did what I expected honestly. I don't understand why so many people are down on him. Hes a good DE.

Earl Cochran was good as well.

Jacoby looked good for what we could have expected, didn't he? This is a plus.

Babin looked good, but I still have my doubts about him in real life.

Mario will some day disprove all nay sayers and prove he is worth it. Really.

TEXANRED
08-11-2007, 10:45 PM
Van Pelt and Stanley will be roomies with DC pretty soon.

Dexter Wynn may be waiting tables on them.......

Complete the list......................

I would buy every seat on a 747 just to make sure Van Pelt had a seat to get out of town.

Bethal Johnson has my vote to go.

TEXANRED
08-11-2007, 10:47 PM
Earl Cochran was good as well.

He definitely has got a good motor.

That roughing the kicker was a crap call though.

Hagar
08-11-2007, 10:54 PM
Bethal Johnson has my vote to go.I know he had the one kick return which looked pretty good, but I don't recall him getting in on any other plays. Granted I wasn't specifically watching him either.

TEXANRED
08-11-2007, 10:57 PM
I know he had the one kick return which looked pretty good, but I don't recall him getting in on any other plays. Granted I wasn't specifically watching him either.

not that he did bad but he didn't do anything to stand out or separate himself from the pack. We have Mathis, Davis, and Jones. I think Bethel is the odd man out.

gwallaia
08-12-2007, 12:21 AM
Van Pelt is crap
Mario in not motivated
Lundy has butterfingers

I think the Lundy fumble was Van Pelt's fault.

Insideop
08-12-2007, 12:57 AM
I think the Lundy fumble was Van Pelt's fault.

I agree with that! Van Pelt didn't do himself any favors tonight :gun: , and I'll be surprised if he is around next week! JMHO!

Buffi2
08-12-2007, 01:12 AM
Van Pelt was horrendous and worse. A few of his passes were pretty much the level of a very small child. One of his last passes that went into the ground was almost laughable. Ye Gads! He needs to be out of here yesterday.

Did I miss Andre Davis doing anything besides dropping passes? No one has mentioned him. He is #2 on the depth chart and unless I missed some huge plays, he needs to be demoted.

I haven't been concerned about Mario as I figured he would pick himself up and get with the program once his foot/feet were better. I have now reached the almost concerned level. If he performs against Arizona the way he did tonight, I will go to concerned and begin to be worried.

The1ApplePie
08-12-2007, 02:26 AM
God Lundy was terrible. He's as good as cut. Too slow and no power.

Van Pelt managed to lose the game. The kid couldn't hit the broad side of a barn.

ObsiWan
08-12-2007, 06:38 AM
I'm not worried about Mario...he had 2 series...just 2 series guys! Id rather have him save it all for the regular season...and maybe the game against the Cowboys since he'll be in there for a half or maybe 3 quarters. Also, da bears have a very nice O'line.

Jacoby Jones impressed me.

Jason Babin did what I expected honestly. I don't understand why so many people are down on him. Hes a good DE.

Earl Cochran was good as well.

That's my problem with Mario. No fire in his belly. He never seems to turn it on. He needs to treat everyone that lines up in front of him like that's the guy who keyed his brand new Lamborgini. He spends too much time "boxing". If the O-lineman can occupy his man for 3-4 seconds he's done his job. Mario makes that too easy.

ObsiWan
08-12-2007, 06:41 AM
He definitely has got a good motor.

That roughing the kicker was a crap call though.

Totally crap. That's one of those "factors" we talked about before. "Top Tier" teams get the benefit of the doubt on iffy calls. We don't.

ObsiWan
08-12-2007, 07:19 AM
Kevin Walters
Jordan Black
David Anderson
Wali Lundy

all really dissapointed today :whip:

Good call on Jordan Black.
his he still under warranty?
can we get our money back??

I've seen Lundy play better. I don't know what his issue was tonight. Darius Walker looked better than he did.

If we only keep 5 WRs I figure they'll be Johnson, Davis, McCardell, Jones, & Mathis. Walter will stay around if he can contribute on ST.

Speaking of WRs, for all the chatter about Harry Williams at the end of last week, I don't think he saw the field last night. I'd like to see him get a few snaps.

Grams
08-12-2007, 07:32 AM
I would think Van Pelt is done.

Think Lundy better step it up or he will be also. Think that fumble was him not Van Pelt. He also looked very, very slow.

Stanley - Turk was much better.

Bethel Johnson - looked just ok on the returns, but not near as good as Jones and Mathis.

Walters needs to learn how to hang onto the ball, like Abbate did, or he might also be looking for a job.

threetoedpete
08-12-2007, 07:40 AM
Totally crap. That's one of those "factors" we talked about before. "Top Tier" teams get the benefit of the doubt on iffy calls. We don't.

No top tier teams find a way to pull one out if calls go against them. Defense forced two fumbles in the last drive. And no one could find the ball.
From what I saw....David anderson may well be gone. But i only saw him get one target tonight that was "catchable". He caught it. TBS, eight guys for four spots, somone is going to have to go. All the cring about Van Pelt, could be Kubiak really likes the guy personally. And as a favor, gave him the second half, so other teams could get film on him to give him a fair chance to catch on somewhere else. Rosenfeld's locked down the #2. They are not going to carry four QBs. I got no problems with Van Pelt getting the second half of a meaningless game.

Jordan Black is just like P-buck was, as advertised by the K.C. boards. He is what he is. A warm body just in case. May the Good lord Keep Epheriam safe from harm for as long as possible. Ahmen.

CloakNNNdagger
08-12-2007, 08:53 AM
Even though I agree with what was the original motivation for Van Pelt's lengthy appearance, if I were Van Pelt I would find some way to burn down the practice facility offices............to make sure that the game film "dissapears" with it. :backsout:

ObsiWan
08-12-2007, 09:03 AM
Even though I agree with what was the original motivation for Van Pelt's lengthy appearance, if I were Van Pelt I would find some way to burn down the practice facility offices............to make sure that the game film "dissapears" with it. :backsout:

I recorded the game on DVR. I'll transfer it to tape and make 100 copies if it keeps him off my squad.

DocBar
08-12-2007, 09:10 AM
[Generic RB/VY comment] :user:

That burns my butt like a blowtorch on my hemorrhoids.:wild: :specnatz:

Hervoyel
08-12-2007, 09:14 AM
I draw zero conclusions about starters from the first preseason game. It's always such a dog to watch no matter who it's against and no matter what's changed. In week one of preseason you get starters for one or two series and it seems like almost instantly they start pulling them for scrubs. If you're a starter and you know it's going to take you more time to get dressed than you'll spend on the field I imagine that it's not easy to get a whole bunch of fire in your belly for this one.

Next week will be marginally better. Some guys will get longer looks and everybody will have another week of practice under them.

Week 3 is the only preseason game that's truly worth watching. It's the one where the starters "warm up" for the regular season.

Fourth preseason game is last call for guys who are going home the next day. You're not even watching your team in week four. You're watching a bunch of guys who won't make your team. You do sometimes get some entertaining football in that game because players who have no chance of making the team are trying to get on film for other teams or pull out that miracle play that gets them a spot on the roster.

Of all the preseason games though I think the first one is the most worthless.

tsip
08-12-2007, 09:20 AM
Even though I agree with what was the original motivation for Van Pelt's lengthy appearance, if I were Van Pelt I would find some way to burn down the practice facility offices............to make sure that the game film "dissapears" with it. :backsout:


...yea, Kubiak did Van Pelt no favors keeping him in there, helping to lose the game--now I know why we had no one to replace Carr with last year.

How does a qb 'guru' waste a spot--TC or not--on someone who doesn't even perform at a HS level? How can he help the receivers in camp/practice when he can't get the ball to them?...many posters have mentioned he also looks bad in practice.

DocBar
08-12-2007, 09:20 AM
That's a real good dose of reality, Herv. We've all been chompin at the bit to see this team in action so we may be putting too much emphasis on the first preseason game.

ObsiWan
08-12-2007, 09:21 AM
No, top tier teams find a way to pull one out if calls go against them. Defense forced two fumbles in the last drive. And no one could find the ball.
From what I saw....David anderson may well be gone. But i only saw him get one target tonight that was "catchable". He caught it. TBS, eight guys for four spots, somone is going to have to go. All the crying about Van Pelt, could be Kubiak really likes the guy personally. And as a favor, gave him the second half, so other teams could get film on him to give him a fair chance to catch on somewhere else. Rosenfeld's locked down the #2. They are not going to carry four QBs. I got no problems with Van Pelt getting the second half of a meaningless game.

Jordan Black is just like P-buck was, as advertised by the K.C. boards. He is what he is. A warm body just in case. May the Good lord Keep Epheriam safe from harm for as long as possible. Ahmen.

I do, when he blows the game for us.

The K.C. folks tried to tell us. Well, he's not a starter for sure. Maybe Frye or the guy Sherman brought in from Green Bay, Kevin Barry will step up.

...wonder if we can get a refund

Texans_Chick
08-12-2007, 09:44 AM
I draw zero conclusions about starters from the first preseason game. It's always such a dog to watch no matter who it's against and no matter what's changed. In week one of preseason you get starters for one or two series and it seems like almost instantly they start pulling them for scrubs. If you're a starter and you know it's going to take you more time to get dressed than you'll spend on the field I imagine that it's not easy to get a whole bunch of fire in your belly for this one.

Next week will be marginally better. Some guys will get longer looks and everybody will have another week of practice under them.

Week 3 is the only preseason game that's truly worth watching. It's the one where the starters "warm up" for the regular season.

Fourth preseason game is last call for guys who are going home the next day. You're not even watching your team in week four. You're watching a bunch of guys who won't make your team. You do sometimes get some entertaining football in that game because players who have no chance of making the team are trying to get on film for other teams or pull out that miracle play that gets them a spot on the roster.

Of all the preseason games though I think the first one is the most worthless.

Pretty much.

I think the only thing that you can decide from this game is:

a. that BVP with no practice squad eligibility is gone.

b. I want to see more of Turk. Nice placement of the corner punt. That last Chad Stanley punt was unpleasant.

c. the Mathis show could be fun this year, and that the special teams could end up being great this season. Really nice field position. You get enough nice field position and good things happen. When he was back there, everybody around us was just waiting for something cool to happen. Everyone, all pray together for the continued health of Mr. Mathis.

d. I know the Texans would not likely call Ron Dayne down the middle three times in a real game, but still....Ron Dayne as a designated goal line back doesn't do it for me. Big guy doesn't run like a big guy.

In general:

What the Texans was showing was really vanilla. The defensive line wasn't doing any stunts. The offense didn't show that much either.

The Schaub non-TD throw in the corner was a little unnerving. There was actually pretty nice pass protection on that play.

The good part about the first team offensive play is that it was fairly clean. Yeah, there were dump offs, but I'd much rather see dump offs than negatory yards from a sack.

Texans_Chick
08-12-2007, 09:49 AM
Even though I agree with what was the original motivation for Van Pelt's lengthy appearance, if I were Van Pelt I would find some way to burn down the practice facility offices............to make sure that the game film "dissapears" with it. :backsout:

BVP was just part of the plan for the game. Trying to survive preseason.

A quarter of Schaub, Rosenfels in the middle and then BVP in cleanup with some of the backup linemen. No matter how they play. Zabransky and Porter weren't suppose to play this game.

Basically, complaining about BVP losing the game is like Colts fans complaining about watching Jim Sorgi. (though it is a wonder that they don't try someone better out at that position.)

tsip
08-12-2007, 09:51 AM
I too am hoping this game is not a 'mirror' of things to see this year. We've spent 5 yrs in the 'coaching not to lose' camp, and tonight was no different. Even at his post game talk, we heard some 'old' familiar words, like-"we've got to find a way to win."

Sure, it's pre-season, but that doesn't mean you keep coaching the same losing way we have for 5+ yrs. When are we going to put this team in a position to win? Do any of the following sound familiar?


*kick field goals instead of tds
*'you don't score, we won't score'
*last team with time on clock scores winning points
*sit on lead
*1st and goal at the 5-run 3 times up the middle (hold onto the ball)
*3rd down conversion is horrible
*YPA (4.2) is even worse
*score 1 offensive td

As long as we our 'coached not to lose' and play safe/conservative, we are going to continue--pre season or not--to get results like this...

Two things Kubiak promised when hired-- find ways to win (mentioned this last night) and coaching to our players strengths...oh,sure, this was just a pre-season game, but it's going to be a long year if we continue to play 'not to lose.'

...you can beat me up now

Pantherstang84
08-12-2007, 09:56 AM
Pretty much.

c. the Mathis show could be fun this year, and that the special teams could end up being great this season. Really nice field position. You get enough nice field position and good things happen. When he was back there, everybody around us was just waiting for something cool to happen. Everyone, all pray together for the continued health of Mr. Mathis.


I agree. The Jerome and Jacoby Show should be very fun to watch indeed. Additionally, they both had a couple of pretty nice catches on offense. It's pretty hard for me to imagine that either one of them will not be WR dos by the end of the season.

Jacoby's performance last night should have silenced the draft critics.

Pantherstang84
08-12-2007, 10:00 AM
I too am hoping this game is not a 'mirror' of things to see this year. We've spent 5 yrs in the 'coaching not to lose' camp, and tonight was no different. Even at his post game talk, we heard some 'old' familiar words, like-"we've got to find a way to win."

Sure, it's pre-season, but that doesn't mean you keep coaching the same losing way we have for 5+ yrs. When are we going to put this team in a position to win? Do any of the following sound familiar?


*kick field goals instead of tds
*'you don't score, we won't score'
*last team with time on clock scores winning points
*sit on lead
*1st and goal at the 5-run 3 times up the middle (hold onto the ball)
*3rd down conversion is horrible
*YPA (4.2) is even worse
*score 1 offensive td

As long as we our 'coached not to lose' and play safe/conservative, we are going to continue--pre season or not--to get results like this...

Two things Kubiak promised when hired-- find ways to win (mentioned this last night) and coaching to our players strengths...oh,sure, this was just a pre-season game, but it's going to be a long year if we continue to play 'not to lose.'

...you can beat me up now

I can certainly see your concern. However, I'm patient. I look at it this way. Had our #1 offense played the whole game, I feel we would have won it. They looked sharped during their last 6 plays.

Texans_Chick
08-12-2007, 10:06 AM
I too am hoping this game is not a 'mirror' of things to see this year. We've spent 5 yrs in the 'coaching not to lose' camp, and tonight was no different. Even at his post game talk, we heard some 'old' familiar words, like-"we've got to find a way to win."

Sure, it's pre-season, but that doesn't mean you keep coaching the same losing way we have for 5+ yrs. When are we going to put this team in a position to win? Do any of the following sound familiar?


*kick field goals instead of tds
*'you don't score, we won't score'
*last team with time on clock scores winning points
*sit on lead
*1st and goal at the 5-run 3 times up the middle (hold onto the ball)
*3rd down conversion is horrible
*YPA (4.2) is even worse
*score 1 offensive td

As long as we our 'coached not to lose' and play safe/conservative, we are going to continue--pre season or not--to get results like this...

Two things Kubiak promised when hired-- find ways to win (mentioned this last night) and coaching to our players strengths...oh,sure, this was just a pre-season game, but it's going to be a long year if we continue to play 'not to lose.'

...you can beat me up now


Glass half empty or half full.

I was actually happy to see Kris Brown make 4 kicks of various distances, including distances that he has sometimes struggles from in the past. Kicking is a game of confidence, and Brown has no competition. So it is good for him to make 4 kicks in a game.

I don't think that the Texans played not to lose. Players dropped passes.
Some close missed opportunities in the red zone. The Texans probably win that game if BVP doesn't give us the BVP experience. And even with that, we got those goofy mistakes at the end.

It's a preseason game. I'd be really concerned if it looked like the sort of preseason the Texans had in 2005, where the first team looked like a chinese fire drill of opposing defenses crushing the old quarterback. Basically in 2005, everything looked like garbage in the preseason.

It's a good first preseason game. Lots of teaching points come from that game but not so many that it is a freaking horror show.

TEXANRED
08-12-2007, 10:19 AM
Pretty much.

I think the only thing that you can decide from this game is:

a. that BVP with no practice squad eligibility is gone.

b. I want to see more of Turk. Nice placement of the corner punt. That last Chad Stanley punt was unpleasant.

c. the Mathis show could be fun this year, and that the special teams could end up being great this season. Really nice field position. You get enough nice field position and good things happen. When he was back there, everybody around us was just waiting for something cool to happen. Everyone, all pray together for the continued health of Mr. Mathis.

d. I know the Texans would not likely call Ron Dayne down the middle three times in a real game, but still....Ron Dayne as a designated goal line back doesn't do it for me. Big guy doesn't run like a big guy.

In general:

What the Texans was showing was really vanilla. The defensive line wasn't doing any stunts. The offense didn't show that much either.

The Schaub non-TD throw in the corner was a little unnerving. There was actually pretty nice pass protection on that play.
The good part about the first team offensive play is that it was fairly clean. Yeah, there were dump offs, but I'd much rather see dump offs than negatory yards from a sack.
To be honest I think if it were AJ, Jones, or Mathis, (guys with more speed) that ball would have been caught.

Hervoyel
08-12-2007, 10:20 AM
Pretty much.


a. that BVP with no practice squad eligibility is gone.

There was never a doubt in my mind. The moment he got here I knew he was "filler" until Sage got healthy again. The #3 guy is always going to be somebody they think can develop. I'm positive that Kubiak knew how far Van Pelt could be "developed" before the Texans signed him. Somebody's got to play if David went down. Van Pelt's presence in camp this year is a courtesy being extended to him by the Texans because they need extra QB's and he'd like to stay in football (get on film, make a friend, get a reference, etc).

b. I want to see more of Turk. Nice placement of the corner punt. That last Chad Stanley punt was unpleasant.

Yeah, Chad always had that "consistency" factor but he was never consistently impressive. Just consistent. Yesterday I thought he looked a lot like Cliff Parsley from back in the day. I remember always thinking that the Oilers had the worst punter. Every week we played someone who had a punter who kicked farther and more accurately than Cliff. It's time we parted ways with Chad Stanley I think.

c. the Mathis show could be fun this year, and that the special teams could end up being great this season. Really nice field position. You get enough nice field position and good things happen. When he was back there, everybody around us was just waiting for something cool to happen. Everyone, all pray together for the continued health of Mr. Mathis.

We'll need it and if he's willing to grow up (seems to be) then I'm sure there's a spot for him on the roster. It would be nice for that to work out.

d. I know the Texans would not likely call Ron Dayne down the middle three times in a real game, but still....Ron Dayne as a designated goal line back doesn't do it for me. Big guy doesn't run like a big guy.

Yeah, he never did in limited action and he was never much of a goal line back. There's an art to running in that much congestion. If you don't have that "talent" then those are a hard two yards to get. Dayne runs like a big back in the late 3rd and 4th quarters after he's been getting 2.4 yards per carry over the first half. Then he comes on. I don't look for him to be very successful this year unless Green goes down with an injury or is just plain ineffective and the Texans pile a load on his shoulders. Then he'll show us what he did last year at the end. This will probably be his last season here.

I wonder what last year would have looked like if we'd had him here from the start of camp and if he'd not been nursing a sore toe for much of the year. I'm thinking 8 wins would have been easy.

In general:

What the Texans was showing was really vanilla. The defensive line wasn't doing any stunts. The offense didn't show that much either.

The Schaub non-TD throw in the corner was a little unnerving. There was actually pretty nice pass protection on that play.

The good part about the first team offensive play is that it was fairly clean. Yeah, there were dump offs, but I'd much rather see dump offs than negatory yards from a sack.

Clean and the fact that nobody truly important got more than a little bruised makes this a successful preseason game in my book. Schaub will come around. New team, new teammates, new stadium, new fans, new everything. This was his first game as a Texans. He started out a little jittery, settled down a bit, and then got excited and overthrew his target. Happens everywhere to just about everybody.

Vinny
08-12-2007, 10:21 AM
In general:

What the Texans was showing was really vanilla. The defensive line wasn't doing any stunts. The offense didn't show that much either.

The Schaub non-TD throw in the corner was a little unnerving. There was actually pretty nice pass protection on that play.

The good part about the first team offensive play is that it was fairly clean. Yeah, there were dump offs, but I'd much rather see dump offs than negatory yards from a sack.
I saw some stunts...go back and watch Mario in one of his series...he is clearly stunting (he certainly wasn't getting any pressure stunting or otherwise)....why would that Schaub pass unnerve you? It was a perfect read and the pass was like 12 inches too far. That's just a minor issue.

As far as sacks go....just watch the panther game rebroadcast today....the panthers were on the 30 (in field goal range) and Jerrry Lewis breaks into a huge selfsacking three stooges moment and stumbles backwards 13 yards and they have to punt the ball....Schaub was in a similar situation and if Walters holds on to his ball he gets a first down.....Carr would have taken the huge sack.

TEXANRED
08-12-2007, 10:27 AM
I saw some stunts...go back and watch Mario in one of his series...he is clearly stunting (he certainly wasn't getting any pressure stunting or otherwise)....why would that Schaub pass unnerve you? It was a perfect read and the pass was like 12 inches too far. That's just a minor issue.

As far as sacks go....just watch the panther game rebroadcast today....the panthers were on the 30 (in field goal range) and Jerrry Lewis breaks into a huge selfsacking three stooges moment and stumbles backwards 13 yards and they have to punt the ball....Schaub was in a similar situation and if Walters holds on to his ball he gets a first down.....Carr would have taken the huge sack.
Did you hear Tillman take a shot at Carr about that play?

He said if it were the other number 8 that play would have been disastrous. I thought it was funny.

I really liked the way Shaub was able to make reads and decisions last night. The ball really does come out of his hand in a hurry. That should make it hard to sack him.

I am not comparing him by no means, but Manning does the same thing, drops, makes his read, and gets rid of the ball. That is one reason why he is so hard to get a hold of. Again, not comparing Shaub to Manning or saying Shaub is the next Manning. Just talking about QB's who get rid of the ball quick.

CloakNNNdagger
08-12-2007, 10:40 AM
I think that even though it would be nice to win all of our preseason games, we can't lose sight of the reason that we have preseason games........and that is to evaluate the players. At this point in time, the coaches are no doubt looking at particulars in each individual player on the field and secondarily how the team is gelling to win games. A closer balancing of these evaluations probably doesn't come until the 1st teams engage 3 quarters in the 3rd preseason game. Disappointing?.....maybe.
Wise?........undoubtedly.

Texans_Chick
08-12-2007, 10:54 AM
I saw some stunts...go back and watch Mario in one of his series...he is clearly stunting (he certainly wasn't getting any pressure stunting or otherwise)....why would that Schaub pass unnerve you? It was a perfect read and the pass was like 12 inches too far. That's just a minor issue.

As far as sacks go....just watch the panther game rebroadcast today....the panthers were on the 30 (in field goal range) and Jerrry Lewis breaks into a huge selfsacking three stooges moment and stumbles backwards 13 yards and they have to punt the ball....Schaub was in a similar situation and if Walters holds on to his ball he gets a first down.....Carr would have taken the huge sack.

Nice catch on Mario--I didn't see that but I will rewatch.

I was a little unnerved by the Schaub pass because: a. he had great protection; b. the receiver was so blasted wide open. But yeah, that is quibbling. Nice read.

Jerry Lewis and Three Stooges reference in the same paragraph. Classic.

Brando
08-12-2007, 11:34 AM
I saw some stunts...go back and watch Mario in one of his series...he is clearly stunting (he certainly wasn't getting any pressure stunting or otherwise)....why would that Schaub pass unnerve you? It was a perfect read and the pass was like 12 inches too far. That's just a minor issue.

As far as sacks go....just watch the panther game rebroadcast today....the panthers were on the 30 (in field goal range) and Jerrry Lewis breaks into a huge selfsacking three stooges moment and stumbles backwards 13 yards and they have to punt the ball....Schaub was in a similar situation and if Walters holds on to his ball he gets a first down.....Carr would have taken the huge sack.


:user:

I will watch the game later. By the way John McClain said that "Jerry Lewis" had 2 TD's in todays Chronicle but he only passed for 1.

jdog
08-12-2007, 11:39 AM
:user:

I will watch the game later. By the way John McClain said that "Jerry Lewis" had 2 TD's in todays Chronicle but he only passed for 1.

He didn't write about how Vince Young didn't play for violating a team rule? It's nice how they pick and choose their comparison stories. Young has a good game, and we should have picked him. Carr throws a touchdown, and we should have kept him. I don't need drama in my sports reporting which is why I'm not a fan of professional wrestling.

Vinny
08-12-2007, 11:41 AM
c. the Mathis show could be fun this year, and that the special teams could end up being great this season. Really nice field position. You get enough nice field position and good things happen. When he was back there, everybody around us was just waiting for something cool to happen. Everyone, all pray together for the continued health of Mr. Mathis.


One of my favorite memories as a kid was when I used to go to games with my Dad at the Astrodome and the fans would all buzz when Billy "white shoes" Johnson jogged back to take a punt. The stadium noise would build and the air was electric when he touched the ball....this could be the same type thing with Mathis if he can stay out of the tub. You just knew that you may be watching something special every time he trotted out there with Johnson.

Honoring Earl 34
08-12-2007, 11:49 AM
One of my favorite memories as a kid was when I used to go to games with my Dad at the Astrodome and the fans would all buzz when Billy "white shoes" Johnson jogged back to take a punt. The stadium noise would build and the air was electric when he touched the ball....this could be the same type thing with Mathis if he can stay out of the tub. You just knew that you may be watching something special every time he trotted out there with Johnson.

I think Mathis and Jacoby bring a big play element . I think if I'm on special teams I got to be stoked at being on one of the best ST in the business .

I saw the stunt with Mario ... he kinda just leaned into the blocker .

Walters got tangled with the CB I think and the CB fell . Schaub timed his pass and threw to the outside shoulder thinking Walters would be covered .

infantrycak
08-12-2007, 11:59 AM
I was a little unnerved by the Schaub pass because: a. he had great protection; b. the receiver was so blasted wide open. But yeah, that is quibbling.

I believe he was so open and the ball was overthrown because there was contact with the DB about 5 yards prior (ball already in the air). The contact slowed the WR or the ball would have been spot on.

The Pencil Neck
08-12-2007, 01:01 PM
To be honest I think if it were AJ, Jones, or Mathis, (guys with more speed) that ball would have been caught.

That's a very good point. I hadn't thought about that.

He threw the ball when Walter and the CB were still locked up and I just thought that it was a timing throw and the CB threw off the timing. But you're right. A speedier guy gets there.

Pantherstang84
08-12-2007, 01:02 PM
I believe he was so open and the ball was overthrown because there was contact with the DB about 5 yards prior (ball already in the air). The contact slowed the WR or the ball would have been spot on.


That's what I saw as well. It was a pretty ball though. Geez. This team excites me this year.

ObsiWan
08-12-2007, 02:49 PM
He didn't write about how Vince Young didn't play for violating a team rule? It's nice how they pick and choose their comparison stories. Young has a good game, and we should have picked him. Carr throws a touchdown, and we should have kept him. I don't need drama in my sports reporting which is why I'm not a fan of professional wrestling.

Actually, McClain did post a story about Prince Vince breaking team rules. It was filed about 12:45 a.m.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/5047354.html


Saturday was not a good day for Tennessee Titans quarterback Vince Young, who didn't play in the preseason opener because he violated what the club called an unspecified team rule.

The Tennessean newspaper reported that Young spent Friday night at his home in Nashville rather than at the team's hotel, which is against team rules.

ObsiWan
08-12-2007, 02:54 PM
I think Mathis and Jacoby bring a big play element . I think if I'm on special teams I got to be stoked at being on one of the best ST in the business .

I saw the stunt with Mario ... he kinda just leaned into the blocker .

Walters got tangled with the CB I think and the CB fell . Schaub timed his pass and threw to the outside shoulder thinking Walters would be covered .

Which makes one wonder why we didn't get an "illegal contact past 5 yards" call from the refs??? The zebras should throw the flag at the illegal contact then sort out later whether we make a play for a TD or whatever.

okay, I'm griping about officiating. Sue me.

tsip
08-12-2007, 05:15 PM
I think that even though it would be nice to win all of our preseason games, we can't lose sight of the reason that we have preseason games........and that is to evaluate the players. At this point in time, the coaches are no doubt looking at particulars in each individual player on the field and secondarily how the team is gelling to win games. A closer balancing of these evaluations probably doesn't come until the 1st teams engage 3 quarters in the 3rd preseason game. Disappointing?.....maybe.
Wise?........undoubtedly.

Good points. However, going into our 6th year in the league, do we know how to score points yet? Take the 1st at the 5-did Dayne really need to practice running up the middle 3 times/did the OL just need run blocking work and not pass/what? Don't these same players need work on the other ways to get the ball over the /line.'

Kubiak talks about how pis--- he was after the game-why? He talked about scoring tds in the red zone, but that's kinda hard to do when you insist on doing it 'one' way almost all the time. On that last 3rd down, the Bears 'shot' everyone to the 'gut'--TV showed our QB all by himself with his field totally wide open. From past tendencies, maybe the bears knew the play

You don't have to be a rocket scientist to know that if we'd tried a more 'agressive' play there---whether we scored or not--our pre season routine would still be intact...and, Gary and the team and the fans would be feeling better today--sure, it's just pre season, but what if?

...just how many times does a team get a 1st and 5 in any game?

Pantherstang84
08-12-2007, 05:42 PM
Double post.

Pantherstang84
08-12-2007, 05:44 PM
Take the 1st at the 5-did Dayne really need to practice running up the middle 3 times/did the OL just need run blocking work and not pass/what? Don't these same players need work on the other ways to get the ball over the /line.'


Excellent point. On 3rd and 1 Sage could have walked into the endzone on a fake hand off boot.

CloakNNNdagger
08-12-2007, 05:58 PM
Good points. However, going into our 6th year in the league, do we know how to score points yet? Take the 1st at the 5-did Dayne really need to practice running up the middle 3 times/did the OL just need run blocking work and not pass/what? Don't these same players need work on the other ways to get the ball over the /line.'

Kubiak talks about how pis--- he was after the game-why? He talked about scoring tds in the red zone, but that's kinda hard to do when you insist on doing it 'one' way almost all the time. On that last 3rd down, the Bears 'shot' everyone to the 'gut'--TV showed our QB all by himself with his field totally wide open. From past tendencies, maybe the bears knew the play

You don't have to be a rocket scientist to know that if we'd tried a more 'agressive' play there---whether we scored or not--our pre season routine would still be intact...and, Gary and the team and the fans would be feeling better today--sure, it's just pre season, but what if?

...just how many times does a team get a 1st and 5 in any game?


Although I was speaking in generalities, you also make some valid points. I wonder though if Kubes could have been trying to evaluate the OL personel in at the time..........If so, he would still be p**sed for not reaching the endzone.

ObsiWan
08-12-2007, 07:09 PM
Although I was speaking in generalities, you also make some valid points. I wonder though if Kubes could have been trying to evaluate the OL personel in at the time..........If so, he would still be p**sed for not reaching the endzone.

Agreed.
I could be wrong but I think Kubiak was conducting a 'Nad check. I believe his mindset was, "Its only preseason. Let's play smash-mouth with da big bad Bears." I suspect we would have seen a totally different set of plays had this been the regular season.

TexanSam
08-12-2007, 08:33 PM
Jordan Black is just like P-buck was, as advertised by the K.C. boards. He is what he is. A warm body just in case. May the Good lord Keep Epheriam safe from harm for as long as possible. Ahmen.

At least until week 6 or 8 or whenever Spencer is eligible to come off the PUP list. I hope to god we don't see Jordan Black as our starting LT.

DBCooper
08-12-2007, 08:33 PM
i must admit that turk was indeed better than stanley.

I feel for ya Dragon, its hard when our idols fall.


Vinny,

"Jerrry Lewis breaks into a huge selfsacking three stooges moment and stumbles backwards 13 yards and they have to punt the ball...."

you slay me!

texasguy346
08-12-2007, 09:00 PM
I draw zero conclusions about starters from the first preseason game.

...

Of all the preseason games though I think the first one is the most worthless.

I agree with you for the most part especially when it pertains to offensive players. The offense is always a little behind the defense in the first preseason game, and I think most of that is because it's always easier to destroy than to create. The offense is based on chemistry & timing and executing the play properly. The defense only has to disrupt the offense to be effective. I was still very encouraged to see guys like Jones and Abbate make some nice plays out there. Got to throw Mathis in there as well as he showed some nice hands.

We'll find out more about alot of our players as the preseason progresses. The first game seems to be more about shaking off rust than anything else. I do have to say that I think the fourth preseason game is the most worthless. I really think most the guys who're going to make the final 53 have already earned their spots before that time. It may decide a practice squad spot or two, or at best maybe a bottom of the roster position battle. The only time you see the starters in the fourth preseason game is when they're cheering on their team from the sidelines in a baseball cap.

TexanAddict
08-13-2007, 02:01 PM
i must admit that turk was indeed better than stanley.

:shocked I agree of course, but surprised to hear this coming from the most famous Stanley supporter on this board.

GP
08-13-2007, 04:32 PM
Good points. However, going into our 6th year in the league, do we know how to score points yet? Take the 1st at the 5-did Dayne really need to practice running up the middle 3 times/did the OL just need run blocking work and not pass/what? Don't these same players need work on the other ways to get the ball over the /line.'

Kubiak talks about how pis--- he was after the game-why? He talked about scoring tds in the red zone, but that's kinda hard to do when you insist on doing it 'one' way almost all the time. On that last 3rd down, the Bears 'shot' everyone to the 'gut'--TV showed our QB all by himself with his field totally wide open. From past tendencies, maybe the bears knew the play

You don't have to be a rocket scientist to know that if we'd tried a more 'agressive' play there---whether we scored or not--our pre season routine would still be intact...and, Gary and the team and the fans would be feeling better today--sure, it's just pre season, but what if?

...just how many times does a team get a 1st and 5 in any game?

Not trying to throw gas on your fire, tsip....

But Tillman made a fairly reasonable assessment when he said "Maybe trying to NOT show too much by handing it off to the running back there...save it for the regular games..."

We did it last year with David, and he walked into the endzone.

Why use it now? At least some teams wills cout film of this game and not know whether we would have ran the boot or still handed off. But if we had ran the boot, then teams would scout it and tell the defense to stay home and watch the QB on that type of down and yardage situation.

Just saying....what does it matter? We could have scored. There's all kinds of variables that enter into this equation.

We scored on that same type of situation last year, so it really doesn't bother me that we didn't score in the 1st preseason game on the same type of situation.

I really think the NFL needs to institute a level playing field on preseason games: A maximum amount of times that a defense can blitz the QB, etc., that would create a true environment and not a situation of one team just trying to blow through another team. Sort of like in softball games where you get two homeruns and then a homerun after that is equal to an out.

It's just preseason. We just want to see what guys are "in the game" and which are on their way out (Wynn cough cough, Van Pelt cough cough). We don't need to see two teams trying to win a meaningless preseason game at any cost. Not that it happened last night, but I have seen it like that in last year's preseason games. Some teams are just punks, IMO.

Runner
08-13-2007, 05:12 PM
Jordan Black is just like P-buck was, as advertised by the K.C. boards. He is what he is. A warm body just in case. May the Good lord Keep Epheriam safe from harm for as long as possible. Ahmen.

I watched Black a bit during the season last year, and he's about what I expected. I'm glad everyone gets a chance to watch him now so I don't have to hear how I get my misguided opinion of Black from the KC message board. The "he must be good, he started for KC" theory may need some revising by the end of camp.

Porky
08-13-2007, 05:29 PM
I watched Black a bit during the season last year, and he's about what I expected. I'm glad everyone gets a chance to watch him now so I don't have to hear how I get my misguided opinion of Black from the KC message board. The "he must be good, he started for KC" theory may need some revising by the end of camp.

I don't think many, if any, said he is a God. The point that I did see many people say is that he started at LT for a playoff team. Doesn't make him God, but capable of being the starter for a playoff team.

Vinny
08-13-2007, 05:30 PM
I don't think many, if any, said he is a God. The point that I did see many people say is that he started at LT for a playoff team. Doesn't make him God, but capable of being the starter for a playoff team.
we brought him into be a back up tackle...to me, he kinda looks like a back up tackle.
:pirate:

Runner
08-13-2007, 05:34 PM
we brought him into be a back up tackle...to me, he kinda looks like a back up tackle.
:pirate:

Don't you think he was brought in to seriously challenge for the starting job? I know $1.3 M is considered cheap, but wasn't that a pretty good bonus for a designated back-up? Do I have the number wrong?

Porky
08-13-2007, 05:40 PM
we brought him into be a back up tackle...to me, he kinda looks like a back up tackle.
:pirate:


Agreed, but the point is he started for a play-off team. Not saying he should start here, as Salaam is clearly better, and if healthy, Spencer is better than Salaam. He is a halfway decent backup swing tackle who can spot start...however if pressed into longer term duty, given that he started for a playoff team, that factor alone should not be enough to throw the season away.

Vinny
08-13-2007, 05:42 PM
Agreed, but the point is he started for a play-off team. Not saying he should start here, as Salaam is clearly better, and if healthy, Spencer is better than Salaam. He is a halfway decent backup swing tackle who can spot start...however if pressed into longer term duty, given that he started for a playoff team, that factor alone should not be enough to throw the season away.
isn't that what back up tackles are supposed to do. :pirate:

Vinny
08-13-2007, 05:43 PM
Don't you think he was brought in to seriously challenge for the starting job? I know $1.3 M is considered cheap, but wasn't that a pretty good bonus for a designated back-up? Do I have the number wrong?
not really. I think they wanted a credible player with some experience at LT in the NFL till Spencer was fully healed....gotta pay for that a bit too. Even semi-decent back up LT's cost.

Runner
08-13-2007, 05:45 PM
not really. I think they wanted a credible player with some experience at LT in the NFL till Spencer was fully healed....gotta pay for that a bit too. Even semi-decent back up LT's cost.

Here's to Spencer being healed next year. :drunk:

Vinny
08-13-2007, 06:26 PM
Here's to Spencer being healed next year. :drunk:
Until then we have Salaam starting and have a guy with experience as the 3rd team Tackle in Black. Seems like a good plan to me.

threetoedpete
08-13-2007, 11:42 PM
I do, when he blows the game for us.

The K.C. folks tried to tell us. Well, he's not a starter for sure. Maybe Frye or the guy Sherman brought in from Green Bay, Kevin Barry will step up.

...wonder if we can get a refund

Well OW unless the guy was going to fall down and fake a broke leg or something...WTF were they going to do ? Put Sage back in ? Behind the third sting guys ? And if Sage got his knee wrecked in mop up duty in a meaningless game then what ? I mean you guys can scream and cry about van pelt all you want. Kubiak isn't stupid. If you yahoos can figure this one out I'm sure the guy with thirty years experence had it figured out also. It's just a GD preseason game for chirst sakes. Let it go. Now I'm not a mind reader. But Kubiak had a reason for doing what he did. He ain't up there twenty hours a day jackin' off. He's thinking this stuff out.

The Pencil Neck
08-13-2007, 11:47 PM
Well TC unless the guy was going to fall down and fake a broke leg or something...WTF were they going to do ? Put Sage back in ? I mean you guys can sream and cry about van pelt all you want. Kubiak isn't stupid. If you yahoos can figure this one out I'm sure the guy with thirty years experence had it figured out also. It's just a GD presean game for chirst sakes. Let it go. Now I'm not a mind reader. But Kubiak had a reason for doing what he did. He ain't up there twenty hours a day jackin' off. He's thinking this stuff out.

I'm telling ya. He knew that BVP was going to go in there and stink up the joint. He was wanting our 3rd and 4th string defenders to step up and win the game for us. He was wanting someone else to step up and make some plays.

threetoedpete
08-13-2007, 11:52 PM
Until then we have Salaam starting and have a guy with experience as the 3rd team Tackle in Black. Seems like a good plan to me.

Agreed Vinny. And as aggrovated as I am at the situation, they did do a great job for what was available and what the cap situation was. I mean you got top teired gaurds draggin' sacks of cash away now, I shudder to think what a front line frachise OLT is going to cost us. It hasn't been cheap fixin' Bosselli.

ObsiWan
08-14-2007, 04:40 AM
Well OW unless the guy was going to fall down and fake a broke leg or something...WTF were they going to do ? Put Sage back in ? Behind the third sting guys ? And if Sage got his knee wrecked in mop up duty in a meaningless game then what ? I mean you guys can scream and cry about van pelt all you want. Kubiak isn't stupid. If you yahoos can figure this one out I'm sure the guy with thirty years experence had it figured out also. It's just a GD preseason game for chirst sakes. Let it go. Now I'm not a mind reader. But Kubiak had a reason for doing what he did. He ain't up there twenty hours a day jackin' off. He's thinking this stuff out.

I had to go back two pages to see what you were rambling about.

I see now that Kubiak was giving Van Pelt a chance to show that he could be a "solid #3 QB" like he said during a post TC interview a while back. He knows this is probably BVP's last shot to hang on in the league so he gave the fella his shot.

I'll admit, at first I was pretty P.O.'d that BVP had screwed up what, to that point, was a pretty decent night for the Texans. But its just preseason. Now is the time to decide who to cut and to let those guys you like as people (but have no intention whatsoever to keep on your squad) to show what they can do so maybe someone else will give them a shot.

ObsiWan
08-14-2007, 05:04 AM
I'm telling ya. He knew that BVP was going to go in there and stink up the joint. He was wanting our 3rd and 4th string defenders to step up and win the game for us. He was wanting someone else to step up and make some plays.

...riiiiiiiiight.....
;)

ObsiWan
08-14-2007, 05:20 AM
Back to topic... "Leavin' On A Jet Plane..."
These are guys I think didn't exactly help their "stock" to make the squad. The good news, for them, is they have two more games to redeem themselves.

1. Bradlee Van Pelt (nuff said)
2. Dexter Wynn
3. David Anderson
4. Charlie Adams (dropped nice pass)
5. Wali Lundy (fumble)
6. Jameel Cook, FB (because Abbate and Pass are playing so well he may not get back in)
7. Bethel Johnson, WR (outshined by Mathis & Jones)
8. Fred Bennett, CB (beaten deep)
9. Trent Bray, LB (poor pass coverage)

Guys who's "stock" went up...

1. Jerome Mathis
2. Jacoby Jones
3. Ben Steele (special teams play)
4. Earl Cochran
5. Zach Diles
6. Jason Babin

Who did I miss?

The Pencil Neck
08-14-2007, 08:56 AM
Back to topic... "Leavin' On A Jet Plane..."
These are guys I think didn't exactly help their "stock" to make the squad. The good news, for them, is they have two more games to redeem themselves.

1. Bradlee Van Pelt (nuff said)
2. Dexter Wynn
3. David Anderson
4. Charlie Adams (dropped nice pass)
5. Wali Lundy (fumble)
6. Jameel Cook, FB (because Abbate and Pass are playing so well he may not get back in)
7. Bethel Johnson, WR (outshined by Mathis & Jones)
8. Fred Bennett, CB (beaten deep)
9. Trent Bray, LB (poor pass coverage)

Guys who's "stock" went up...

1. Jerome Mathis
2. Jacoby Jones
3. Ben Steele (special teams play)
4. Earl Cochran
5. Zach Diles
6. Jason Babin

Who did I miss?

I don't think that Fred Bennett is gone quite yet. And they like what Bray brings to the special teams.

ObsiWan
08-14-2007, 09:03 AM
I don't think that Fred Bennett is gone quite yet. And they like what Bray brings to the special teams.
I realize Bennett's a rookie and will be given a little leeway. Tha's why I named the catagory, "didn't help their stock" as opposed to "Heeeee's OUTTA HERE!!".

But seriously, Bray may make it as a ST-er, but he kept getting beat on pass coverage while playing LB. The 2nd Bear TD was on him.

HOU-TEX
08-14-2007, 09:04 AM
not really. I think they wanted a credible player with some experience at LT in the NFL till Spencer was fully healed....gotta pay for that a bit too. Even semi-decent back up LT's cost.

This is something I hate seeing our backups do. Take notice of Black. You can see his man behind Sage getting ready to lower the boom. lol

Courtesy of BullPenPhotos:

http://www.texansbullpen.com/07photogallery/Preseason/2007-08-11-Bears-Texans/2ndQuarter/DSC_0422.JPG

DBCooper
08-14-2007, 09:06 AM
Guys who's "stock" went up...

1. Jerome Mathis
2. Jacoby Jones
3. Ben Steele (special teams play)
4. Earl Cochran
5. Zach Diles
6. Jason Babin


Speaking of Diles, how did he look?

HuttoKarl
08-14-2007, 09:11 AM
I'm not worried about Mario...he had 2 series...just 2 series guys! Id rather have him save it all for the regular season...and maybe the game against the Cowboys since he'll be in there for a half or maybe 3 quarters. Also, da bears have a very nice O'line.

Jacoby Jones impressed me.

Jason Babin did what I expected honestly. I don't understand why so many people are down on him. Hes a good DE.

Earl Cochran was good as well.


2 series is enough to get at least 4 sacks, 3 hurries and a pressure or two. A good DE should get a sack on every play...even the first game of the preseason. :shades:

ObsiWan
08-14-2007, 09:19 AM
2 series is enough to get at least 4 sacks, 3 hurries and a pressure or two. A good DE should get a sack on every play...even the first game of the preseason. :shades:

Then there are no "good DE's" in the NFL. No one had a stat line like that.
:)

Twitch-Houston
08-14-2007, 10:11 AM
Back to topic... "Leavin' On A Jet Plane..."
These are guys I think didn't exactly help their "stock" to make the squad. The good news, for them, is they have two more games to redeem themselves.

9. Trent Bray, LB (poor pass coverage)



I don't remember the pass coverage, but it seemed like he was involved on every play in some form. He seemed like a ball hawk. I remember liking what I saw. That said, we were 3 rows up from the field and sometimes I couldn't see all the action from my vantage point.