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Texanmike02
08-04-2007, 12:59 AM
Alot has been made about what Schaub has to accomplish this year. People have talked about stats and play mostly but the biggest thing he's going to have to change will be the mindset of the offense. The Texans have been horrible at two things (barring the Indy,Dallas,Pitt and Jax games) their entire existence. Overcoming mistakes and taking advantage of the oppositions mistakes. How many times in our history can you point to one or two plays that would have changed the entire face of the game. We've thrown INTs, we've fumbled, run out of bounds, misused the clock etc in so many losses that it is mind numbing.

The first time things go badly on offense everyone who's been here a while will be thinking "oh no, here we go again". On offense there are two people who have to change that. Schaub and Green. Green has been a winner. He has been among the best in the game before. He was lead by Brett Farve who ,while he was a great QB, was also a great leader. Schaub is, by all accounts, a great leader. These guys are going to have to take charge when things go wrong.

I was a fan of Carr's to the end, but this isn't about Carr any more. This is about it being ok to make mistakes. This is about being able to do that no Texans team before them has done. When a fumble is lost the defense will have to step up. When someone blows coverage, the offense will have to respond.

If you point to one play which might finally turn this franchise around, it may be that first turnover by Indy last year. We scored off of it. I haven't seen any statistics but I know just from watching every game in our existence that we have been horrible at these things. Look at the Dallas game last year, or the Miami or Buffalo games. How many times in our short history have teams handed us the ball only to get it back with in two or three plays? We absolutely have to score more points when teams give us the ball.

Our defense has been better, over the last half of the season, at keeping the opponent from marching down the field and scoring after a turnover, but watching the games I just got this sick feeling it was still going to happen.

When people look and see the team and rate them basically the same way that I do, but give them two or three more wins... I think this is where we differ. I think this will be something they learn how to do. You hear talk about teams learning how to win. This is one of the key ingredients, and so far we've been horrible at it. I do thing Schaub will change it... I just think it will take time. We're going to have to turn the ball over (as wierd as that sounds) and see that we don't implode. We're going to have to survive a few hardships and build some character on this team. It won't be until this team learns to trust the other 52 that they will finally take off.. Here's to hoping that happens sooner rather than later.

Mike

ObsiWan
08-04-2007, 01:55 AM
I agree. It'll be how we bounce back from adversity that defines this team. If. as in times past, we slink away with our tails between our legs, then all the changes meant nothing. If we toughen up and fight until the final gun, then we've made progress as a franchise.

Its all about attitude. That attitude has to be "we EXPECT to win every time we step on the field. And we don't care who is on the other sideline."

And we, the fans, can't lump that responsibility on Schaub or Green. That's not fair because Green and Schaub and all the starters can do all the right things only to have some sub miss an assignment or give a half-a$$ed effort and cost us the game. It has to permeate the entire team all the way down to practice squad guys.

There should be no one on the team who is just playing to get a check.

No one.

And I think the transformation is in work. Even Jerome and Travis "got the memo".

The Pencil Neck
08-04-2007, 02:52 AM
From about the middle of 2004 to the last bit of last year, I agree. We wouldn't capitalize on our opponents mistakes and we had a problem of making an early mistake and then having all the wheels just come flying off. We did that in the Dallas game last year. We played them hard for a half. Then we throw a pick, then another pick, then we fumble the kick off... It's like one mistake happens, and then another, and they just start falling like dominos.

Last year, I think we started to learn how to beat those sorts of mistakes and keep them from getting out of hand. When you look at the Raiders and the Browns games, we were able to overcome those sorts of things. With the Raiders, we would have folded after the fumble returned for a TD. With the Browns, we would have caved after that interception early in the game close to the goal line. But we were able to bounce back and win those games.

Even with the Colts game, we got up by 14, they came back and tied it. At that point, I'm thinking "here it comes..." But instead of folding, we hit the brakes and get back up by 7 by halftime.

I think that's Kubiak's coaching and I think that bodes well for the future. Hopefully, we'll have that hard-nosed fight to the end attitude so that we can bounce back from mistakes and start forcing the other team to make them instead.

TK_Gamer
08-04-2007, 03:40 AM
we also need the coach in the mix as far as learning to win too. I swear if I see one more game where we have 2 and half minutes left in the half and we run 3 draw plays and dink to AJ I'm gonna scream.

DBCooper
08-04-2007, 09:20 AM
I know what you mean.

We need to feel like, even if we are down, we always have a chance to win.

And if we have the lead, the ability to put the game away.

Texanmike02
08-04-2007, 11:12 AM
we also need the coach in the mix as far as learning to win too. I swear if I see one more game where we have 2 and half minutes left in the half and we run 3 draw plays and dink to AJ I'm gonna scream.

I agree, and that's all about clock management. But I think that is secondary really, as funny as that sounds. That is about putting your foot on someone's throat. Right now we need to keep our own foot off our own throat.

Mike

The Pencil Neck
08-04-2007, 01:46 PM
we also need the coach in the mix as far as learning to win too. I swear if I see one more game where we have 2 and half minutes left in the half and we run 3 draw plays and dink to AJ I'm gonna scream.

I don't think it was our coaching staff being dumb.

I think those calls were a perfect display of the distrust our coaching staff had for our previous QB. I think that was playcalling to minimize the probabilities of an almost sure mistake. You saw what happened when they tried to run a 2-minute drill against the Titans in the first game... TD Titans.

tsip
08-04-2007, 02:21 PM
Since day one, the Texans have been one of the least aggressive offensive teams in the NFL. Capers coached not to lose and ball control was his goal. His primary goal was to be in a position to win on the last drive of the game, ignoring putting points on the board at any other part of the contest.

IMO, no team game plans better than the Patriots. First, they play one game at a time and focus on beating that team that week. Whatever it takes to win-other teams say it and then go out and play every team the same way- not the Pats. Second, the Pats use their players strengths--no other team has changed out their personnel more than the Pats and kept winning. With a 'patched up' WR corp last year, they still almost made the SB, and then go out this off season and strengthen their team.

So, my biggest concern going into this year will be Kubiak's coaching philosophy. Will he be creative/innovative with his game plans and play calling? Like last year, will he let certain players limit the use of his playbook? For 5 yrs (with 3 OC, 2 HC), we've been told that the team has never installed- let alone used it's entire playbook! What are we waiting for? If, like Gary said, he's coaching to the strengths of his players...what is in his playbook they can't comprehend and execute?

It's one thing to go 'toe to toe' with another team--giving it 'team wise' everything you've got, but losing--than losing because you don't want to try 'this or that' or you don't want to hurt a player's 'psychy.' Here's hoping Kubiak sets high standards of goals/expectations for the entire team and coaches to win,,,whatever it takes, one game at a time.

Personally, I don't want to lose another game and then here a post game press conference full of excuses why we didn't try this or that to win--whatever it takes...

barberman
08-04-2007, 10:19 PM
This team must develope a "Killer Instinct" in order to take the next step in becoming the team we all hope they soon will be. Teams like the Patroits have that mentality and thats why they win Superbowls and are the Team almost everyone agrees is the best in the NFL. Texansmike`s thread is right on target and the team must face and overcome adversity and when presented with opportunity take advantage and score. The feedback I been getting from the website, messageboards, newspaper stories, etc gives me the feeling the Texans are poised to take that next step. Can`t wait for the games to start and watch our team grow.

ObsiWan
08-05-2007, 12:37 AM
Since day one, the Texans have been one of the least aggressive offensive teams in the NFL. Capers coached not to lose and ball control was his goal. His primary goal was to be in a position to win on the last drive of the game, ignoring putting points on the board at any other part of the contest.

IMO, no team game plans better than the Patriots. First, they play one game at a time and focus on beating that team that week. Whatever it takes to win-other teams say it and then go out and play every team the same way- not the Pats. Second, the Pats use their players strengths--no other team has changed out their personnel more than the Pats and kept winning. With a 'patched up' WR corp last year, they still almost made the SB, and then go out this off season and strengthen their team.

So, my biggest concern going into this year will be Kubiak's coaching philosophy. Will he be creative/innovative with his game plans and play calling? Like last year, will he let certain players limit the use of his playbook? For 5 yrs (with 3 OC, 2 HC), we've been told that the team has never installed- let alone used it's entire playbook! What are we waiting for? If, like Gary said, he's coaching to the strengths of his players...what is in his playbook they can't comprehend and execute?

It's one thing to go 'toe to toe' with another team--giving it 'team wise' everything you've got, but losing--than losing because you don't want to try 'this or that' or you don't want to hurt a player's 'psychy.' Here's hoping Kubiak sets high standards of goals/expectations for the entire team and coaches to win,,,whatever it takes, one game at a time.

Personally, I don't want to lose another game and then here a post game press conference full of excuses why we didn't try this or that to win--whatever it takes...

Just because a play is in the playbook doesn't mean your players can successfully execute it. That's why you run them in practice. If they can't pull them off in practice, then why would a coach try it in a game??

Kubiak didn't take things out of the playbook because he was afraid of damaging YKW's psyche. It was because the play called for reads that YKW never demonstrated he could correctly make.

If TC is any indication, the play selection will be a little more adventurous this season.

tsip
08-05-2007, 02:48 AM
Just because a play is in the playbook doesn't mean your players can successfully execute it. That's why you run them in practice. If they can't pull them off in practice, then why would a coach try it in a game??

Kubiak didn't take things out of the playbook because he was afraid of damaging YKW's psyche. It was because the play called for reads that YKW never demonstrated he could correctly make.

If TC is any indication, the play selection will be a little more adventurous this season.

You're proving my point--why devise a playbook for which you don't have the players that can run it? As a HC, Kubiak says he wants to coach to his players strengths, so he devises and sticks with a playbook his qb can't run?! Yes, that's what he did last year--could any or all of the other qbs execute it? We don't know because he stuck with the 1 qb he knew couldn't...

Coaching to a players strength-especially the starting qb-is crucial...so is doing whatever it takes to win. I hope Kubiak never ever puts 1 player above the team who can't do the job and sticks with them...especially a player that didn't feel like playing the last 2+ yrs.

Finally, where were you when Gary tripped over his own feet to get to Carr after the Titan game to make sure Carr knew he was still the 'man?'

cuppacoffee
08-05-2007, 11:37 AM
I was a fan of Carr's to the end, but this isn't about Carr any more.


Everyone take a deep breath and repeat after Mike...

:gotexans1


:coffee:

Vinny
08-05-2007, 11:44 AM
we also need the coach in the mix as far as learning to win too. I swear if I see one more game where we have 2 and half minutes left in the half and we run 3 draw plays and dink to AJ I'm gonna scream.

Call that the "david Carr" syndrome. Palmer's offenses were wide open with Brunell, Bledsoe and last year's pro bowl invitee Cowboy QB. It is no coincidence that Kubiak had to do what Capers did when he coached Carr too. The coaches had to take the ball out of Carr's hands to give the team a chance to win. One reason he was cut and nobody in the NFL wanted him as a starter.

Vinny
08-05-2007, 12:15 PM
Sure, Vinny, you still got it... It was David's fault. Even the coaching, along with anything negative. You really going to be lost this season, your whipping boy is gone.
I think it spoke volumes that Carr was a FA and couldn't find a team that wanted him as a starter....for ZERO compensation.

I ain't gonna miss much of that.

rickyb
08-05-2007, 01:41 PM
I think it spoke volumes that Carr was a FA and couldn't find a team that wanted him as a starter....for ZERO compensation.

I ain't gonna miss much of that.

And as the kids say....True dat.

Now, let his name be buried and put in our rear-view window. Can I get an amen?

The Pencil Neck
08-05-2007, 01:52 PM
And as the kids say....True dat.

Now, let his name be buried and put in our rear-view window. Can I get an amen?

Amen.

ObsiWan
08-05-2007, 03:55 PM
You're proving my point--why devise a playbook for which you don't have the players that can run it? As a HC, Kubiak says he wants to coach to his players strengths, so he devises and sticks with a playbook his qb can't run?! Yes, that's what he did last year--could any or all of the other qbs execute it? We don't know because he stuck with the 1 qb he knew couldn't...

Coaching to a players strength-especially the starting qb-is crucial...so is doing whatever it takes to win. I hope Kubiak never ever puts 1 player above the team who can't do the job and sticks with them...especially a player that didn't feel like playing the last 2+ yrs.

Finally, where were you when Gary tripped over his own feet to get to Carr after the Titan game to make sure Carr knew he was still the 'man?'

I think you're putting the cart before the horse.
You're assuming Kubiak waited until AFTER he got here to devise his playbook. Common sense says that he had to have an offensive strategy in mind BEFORE he arrived. That means his playbook was probably already composed. You can't wait until OTAs and training camp to see what you have and THEN invent a playbook. That's just nuts. When you get to OTAs and TC you get to see which guys can best execute the plan you have in mind.

Kubiak's mistake was looking at film to see whether YKW had the arm strength to make the required throws to make his offense work. Then he got to take them onto the practice field and watch them actually executed. And, as other posters have said, YKW looked good in OTAs and TC last year.

But looking good in practice, when you know you won't get hit, is quite different than effectively executing under game heat. Even Carr admitted he knew he wasn't doing the right thing, but couldn't stop himself. [check the ESPN Insider piece on Carr by Seth Wickersham]

And tailoring a playbook isn't unique to our team. Lots of teams cut back on their playbook when they have a rookie QB or have installed a brand new system.

ObsiWan
08-05-2007, 03:59 PM
And as the kids say....True dat.

Now, let his name be buried and put in our rear-view window. Can I get an amen?

As I've said before:

He's glad he's someplace else.

We're glad he's not here.
(some because they think he sucks others because they want him to have a fresh start)

Everybody wins.

Amen.