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Maddict5
06-27-2007, 06:04 PM
from John Clayton's burning:gun: questions:

5. Is Matt Schaub the savior of the Texans' offense?
The answer is he had better be. For five years, David Carr tried every configuration of offense, but it didn't work because of poor offensive-line blocking. He tried quick throws. He tried roll-outs. The results still ended up being too many sacks. Head coach Gary Kubiak felt change was needed, so he traded for former Atlanta backup Schaub, who is a tall, smart quarterback who gets rid of the ball fast.

First, Kubiak has to establish a running game with Ahman Green. Second, he needs to find a receiver on the other side of Andre Johnson; Kevin Walter is the leading candidate. The team is considering the signing of Keenan McCardell, which wouldn't be a bad idea. The Texans' starters are the youngest in the NFL. The team is particularly young on defense. Offense has been the biggest problem, and Kubiak is banking on Schaub to be the answer to the problems.

and from floyd reese's 'Feeling the Heat':gun: column
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=reese_floyd&id=2916762

Houston Texans: Matt Schaub

The Texans' recent focus has been on defense, after they used their first-round draft choice on another defensive lineman (Amobi Okoye). His addition should help the defense. For the first time in team history, the Texans will be starting a quarterback other than David Carr. Because the quarterback play has been the focal point of the franchise since its inception, Matt Schaub will be feeling the heat in Houston

personally, while all the texans will be feeling the heat (not only because its very hot in houston, but because of our new higher expectations), i think mario will be under the most pressure to perform at a really high level- its his second yr (no more rookie mistakes) and injury free so he has to justify being taken before the saints HWWNBN and the tack's HWWNBN

the wonger need food
06-27-2007, 06:15 PM
"For five years, David Carr tried every configuration of offense, but it didn't work because of poor offensive-line blocking."


Yeah... that's why it didn't work. John Clayton is a football genius stuck in a Dungeons and Dragons body.

Double Barrel
06-27-2007, 06:19 PM
Imagine, an ESPiN talking head spouting the same old same old. I always have a feeling that the fluff from Clayton is meant for more casual fans. Simple, black and white perspectives, and easy to digest. After years of watching their NFL shows, I often feel like I've eaten whip cream for supper.

Good analysis [IMO] will often be shades of gray (i.e. our offensive struggles are not the fault of one aspect, but a mixture of elements that did not work out), and can be difficult to pinpoint with simplicity.

TexanSam
06-27-2007, 07:12 PM
I want to hear Ron Jaworski's point of view on Matt Schaub. He's the only ESPN analyst I trust.

hollywood_texan
06-27-2007, 10:04 PM
For better or worse, it looks like this whole Carr situation is going to be put to bed both for Carr and the Texans.

Things could get really rough for Carr if Schuab lights it up while he is riding the bench as a backup. Then, when Carr gets his chance, if he screws up, particarly with the sacks another team, everyone will go see...

eriadoc
06-28-2007, 08:46 AM
After years of watching their NFL shows, I often feel like I've eaten whip cream for supper.

But whipped cream is gooood!! :heart:

Porky
06-28-2007, 12:04 PM
The good news is this weekend marks the 4 week countdown to training camp. It will be here before we know it, and FINALLY, all of this offseason crapola can be put to rest, and we can start to see what we have with Schaub, along with the rest of the guys. I can't wait! :devilpig:

Double Barrel
06-28-2007, 12:21 PM
I want to hear Ron Jaworski's point of view on Matt Schaub. He's the only ESPN analyst I trust.

I agree. Jaws is the only reason for me to even pay any attention to ESPiN.

Blazing Arrow
06-28-2007, 12:42 PM
i think mario will be under the most pressure to perform at a really high level- its his second yr (no more rookie mistakes) and injury free so he has to justify being taken before the saints HWWNBN and the tack's HWWNBN

And the pressure really begins on the fireball throwing plummer.

IF Young sneaks the Titans into the Playoffs .....

IF Bush gets 1500 Rushing/Rec yards and 10 TDs ....

How many sacks does Mario need to make the pick worth passing on the two?

Porky
06-28-2007, 01:35 PM
And the pressure really begins on the fireball throwing plummer.

IF Young sneaks the Titans into the Playoffs .....

IF Bush gets 1500 Rushing/Rec yards and 10 TDs ....

How many sacks does Mario need to make the pick worth passing on the two?

Can you talk in English? Oh I forgot, you are a meatball fan. That explains it. Does anyone have a Meatball to English dictionary?:texflag:

the wonger need food
06-28-2007, 01:38 PM
And the pressure really begins on the fireball throwing plummer.

IF Young sneaks the Titans into the Playoffs .....

IF Bush gets 1500 Rushing/Rec yards and 10 TDs ....

How many sacks does Mario need to make the pick worth passing on the two?

In reality it doesn't matter what Crazy Legs and Scatback do. If Mario makes the defense better, has a long productive career, he earns his money and our respect. I just can't see a running QB and 3rd down RB making this team any better than it is with Schaub and/or Green.

Blazing Arrow
06-28-2007, 01:46 PM
Can you talk in English? Oh I forgot, you are a meatball fan. That explains it. Does anyone have a Meatball to English dictionary?:texflag:

Sorry I did not shoot something in my post so you could understand. I will try my hardest for the next post.

The1ApplePie
06-28-2007, 01:46 PM
They always fail to mention the injuries on the O-Line or the fact that our 2nd best offense weapon was Ron "Bust" Dayne.

But, Mario does have a long way to catch Bush and VY since he wasn't exactly lighting it up last year.

dalemurphy
06-28-2007, 01:57 PM
They always fail to mention the injuries on the O-Line or the fact that our 2nd best offense weapon was Ron "Bust" Dayne.

But, Mario does have a long way to catch Bush and VY since he wasn't exactly lighting it up last year.

Rookie RBs almost always make a bigger impact than rookies at other positions. Regarding VYoung, talk to me when he throws more TD than interceptions or when he is asked to throw the ball 30 times to win a game. How about eclipsing a 200 yd per game average or throwing for 60% completion.

dalemurphy
06-28-2007, 02:02 PM
There is no doubt that VYoung, with a lot of help from THenry, made a bad Titan offense much better. However, that's the history of most physically gifted, athletic QBs- they immediately make a bad team better. However, rarely do they make a good team great.

Examples that fit this description: Randall Cunningham, Mike Vick, Dante Culpepper are three clear examples that resemble VYOung in a lot of ways...

I'm not saying that Young won't be more successful than those guys but the media, the NFL, and the fans were all fawning on these guys at this point in there careers as well. If Young's path is similar, which it certainly good be, then fans are going to be grateful we didn't draft him last year.

The1ApplePie
06-28-2007, 02:03 PM
Don't D-Linemen get the same kind of deal as RBs? Imediate impact.

Texans Horror
06-28-2007, 02:14 PM
IMO, offensive and defensive linemen usually take a couple years to develop. Granted, Mario had a debilitating injury last year, so a healthy Mario in his second year will probably be a huge upgrade over last year's Mario.

Blazing Arrow
06-28-2007, 02:19 PM
In reality it doesn't matter what Crazy Legs and Scatback do. If Mario makes the defense better, has a long productive career, he earns his money and our respect. I just can't see a running QB and 3rd down RB making this team any better than it is with Schaub and/or Green.

Well I was speaking more of next season and the hypothetical(s) I suggested.

To me a great DE can help a team allot but does not produce as much as a RB or QB. A DE that produces 10 sacks a season would defiantly help but a RB that is throwing up 1000+ yards and catching another 50 for 500 seems a little more valuable in the grand scheme. Same with a QB who has shown he is a leader and was a home town hero.

I was just wondering if the ‘what if’ is still the hearts or not. Is Mario's production this season crucial to justify the pick?

Blazing Arrow
06-28-2007, 02:27 PM
Rookie RBs almost always make a bigger impact than rookies at other positions. Regarding VYoung, talk to me when he throws more TD than interceptions or when he is asked to throw the ball 30 times to win a game. How about eclipsing a 200 yd per game average or throwing for 60% completion.

When compared to elite QBs rookie season, Young was right in line. Would you say the same of Manning, Elway, Moon, Aikman, S Young? All of them failed to meet at least two of you listed requirements in there first season and all turned out to have a pretty solid career.

Double Barrel
06-28-2007, 02:28 PM
I think Mario's forced fumble against the Colts last 12/24 showed a determination in his game. In spite of less than stellar rookie numbers on a bum foot all season, he still played hard and continued to push himself.

Honestly, judging draft picks by rookie seasons seems a bit premature, so this season will be a good indication of where these guys are headed.

I certainly have nothing against VY or RB, but I do not think either of them were good fits for a Kubiak offense. We need a QB that is more of a WCO passer, and a back that can contribute every down (either through the running game or pass protection). Neither of these players fit the bill.

If you look at the big picture, I think the best pick would've been D'brick, considering our need at LT. Mario can still pan out, and I think this year will give us a good idea of what he's about. No hurt foot, starting at one position, a year of experience, and good coaching now, should all be positive factors in his development.

dalemurphy
06-28-2007, 02:29 PM
Well I was speaking more of next season and the hypothetical(s) I suggested.

To me a great DE can help a team allot but does not produce as much as a RB or QB. A DE that produces 10 sacks a season would defiantly help but a RB that is throwing up 1000+ yards and catching another 50 for 500 seems a little more valuable in the grand scheme. Same with a QB who has shown he is a leader and was a home town hero.

I was just wondering if the ‘what if’ is still the hearts or not. Is Mario's production this season crucial to justify the pick?


Why should it matter to anyone that Vince Young is from the Houston area? Do Texan fans really want the organization to operate in that way- taking local heroes when their football analysis suggests someone else?

TK_Gamer
06-28-2007, 02:33 PM
Well I was speaking more of next season and the hypothetical(s) I suggested.

To me a great DE can help a team allot but does not produce as much as a RB or QB.

A DE that produces 10 sacks a season would defiantly help but a RB that is throwing up 1000+ yards and catching another 50 for 500 seems a little more valuable in the grand scheme. Same with a QB who has shown he is a leader and was a home town hero.

I was just wondering if the ‘what if’ is still the hearts or not. Is Mario's production this season crucial to justify the pick?

I agree totally. Most interviews and analysis of DE's has shown they make an impact on about 1 out of 20 snaps. I would say a QB or RB would be at least double that. Another interesting note, hardly ever is praise give to the DE that ties up 2 blockers so someone "ELSE" can make the sack or tackle the RB behind the LOS.

swtbound07
06-28-2007, 02:34 PM
i wonder what would happen if the titans fan drank bleach?

Blazing Arrow
06-28-2007, 02:35 PM
Why should it matter to anyone that Vince Young is from the Houston area? Do Texan fans really want the organization to operate in that way- taking local heroes when their football analysis suggests someone else?

I was using the "Home Town Hero" flag as a reason but not the only reason why to pick Young. I could have easily mentioned the OT run, OROY, greatest comeback in NFL history by a rookie QB, Rookie Pro-Bowler (yeah yeah yeah), Managing to pull out 8 wins with the 32nd ranked D in the NFL, and the fact that you had Carr as your QB at the time of the draft.

Blazing Arrow
06-28-2007, 02:36 PM
i wonder what would happen if the titans fan drank bleach?

It's not your smack forum I am trying to keep it friendly here. If you noticed I have not gone off on bashing the Texans in the thread, just trying to get a feel for how the fans feel plus it is offseason.

Blazing Arrow
06-28-2007, 02:39 PM
I agree totally. Most interviews and analysis of DE's has shown they make an impact on about 1 out of 20 snaps. I would say a QB or RB would be at least double that. Another interesting note, hardly ever is praise give to the DE that ties up 2 blockers so someone "ELSE" can make the sack or tackle the RB behind the LOS.

I understand that. When the Titans had Kearse and Carter on opposite ends our QB pressure was amazing. We lost that strength and have struggled to get pressure on the QB for at least two seasons now. It does not help we have had a merry-go-round of injuries at DE the last two season not to mention DT.

Specnatz
06-28-2007, 02:51 PM
I was using the "Home Town Hero" flag as a reason but not the only reason why to pick Young. I could have easily mentioned the OT run, OROY, greatest comeback in NFL history by a rookie QB, Rookie Pro-Bowler (yeah yeah yeah), Managing to pull out 8 wins with the 32nd ranked D in the NFL, and the fact that you had Carr as your QB at the time of the draft.

He did all of this by himself.

Forget the phantom call regarding the sack. the same guy was flagged for unneccessary roughness earlier in the game and had vy but the refs are inconsistant with that call. Forget the returns by quebert, the int in the giants game. If you think I am taking anything away, nope I am just pointing out that it was not a one man show as most titans think and what espin reports.

Are you saying he had the number to be a probowler, c'mon he got that because of hype not stats. Well unless you count his as a runningback probowler. His passing darn sure did not make him a probowler. This is what is wrong espin hypes a guy because what they can show on a highlight versus actually football knowledge and everything gets skewed.

One play in overtime makes a guy worth drafting or having on your team, great football analysis. Every one hit wonder would love you to be the gm of a team now.

Does not fit a system or does should be more of an indicator not hype.

Specnatz
06-28-2007, 02:54 PM
Don't D-Linemen get the same kind of deal as RBs? Imediate impact.

NO! Most lineman, be it on offense or defense usually take a year to see great impacts. Not to say there are not those that do show that kind of impact. D'Brick did not show that great impact is he a bust as well or do you give him a free pass because he is not the guy you wanted. You repeated hatred of players is just about played out. You act more like a troll than most of the titans fans who come here.

Silver Oak
06-28-2007, 02:57 PM
I was using the "Home Town Hero" flag as a reason but not the only reason why to pick Young. I could have easily mentioned the OT run, OROY, greatest comeback in NFL history by a rookie QB, Rookie Pro-Bowler (yeah yeah yeah), Managing to pull out 8 wins with the 32nd ranked D in the NFL, and the fact that you had Carr as your QB at the time of the draft.


Accolades? Did someone mention accolades?

How about a league worst passer rating of 66.7? Or how about throwing more int's. than td's(13/12)? That outstanding 51.5% completion percentage also should be mentioned. And losing that last game of the season...the one that would have put them in the playoffs. That's good stuff too!

He had a heck of a supporting cast last year so don't throw them under the bus! The long ass FG, pacman's defense, and a very good running game helped alot.

infantrycak
06-28-2007, 03:06 PM
Are you saying he had the number to be a probowler

He got it because 5 QB's in front of him declined to go to the pro-bowl from the AFC. That isn't taking anything away from VY, but the system really is silly and needs to be worked out on who gets called pro-bowler.

Specnatz
06-28-2007, 03:08 PM
He got it because 5 QB's in front of him declined to go to the pro-bowl from the AFC. That isn't taking anything away from VY, but the system really is silly and needs to be worked out on who gets called pro-bowler.

Exactly. That was my point.

ReliantTexan
06-28-2007, 03:16 PM
I was using the "Home Town Hero" flag as a reason but not the only reason why to pick Young. I could have easily mentioned the OT run, OROY, greatest comeback in NFL history by a rookie QB, Rookie Pro-Bowler (yeah yeah yeah), Managing to pull out 8 wins with the 32nd ranked D in the NFL, and the fact that you had Carr as your QB at the time of the draft.So your saying we should have analyzed VY's rookie season before we drafted Mario.:yes:

Blazing Arrow
06-28-2007, 03:17 PM
Forget the phantom call regarding the sack. the same guy was flagged for unneccessary roughness earlier in the game and had vy but the refs are inconsistant with that call.

It was actually a couple weeks prior that he was reacting to. It is a game you do not tackle you do not win. Check Honeymoon's avatar for an example.

Forget the returns by quebert, the int in the giants game. If you think I am taking anything away, nope I am just pointing out that it was not a one man show as most titans think and what espin reports.

I never said it was a one man show, I just mentioned accolades atributed to Young. No more no less. I was mainly point out that he has worth above your run of the mill rookie QB who did not get those accolades.

Are you saying he had the number to be a probowler, c'mon he got that because of hype not stats. Well unless you count his as a runningback probowler. His passing darn sure did not make him a probowler. This is what is wrong espin hypes a guy because what they can show on a highlight versus actually football knowledge and everything gets skewed.

You will notice the "yeah yeah yeah" after the probowl comment. I am aware of how he got in but then again no matter how he got in he was still there. Again accolade nothing more nothing less.

whiskeyrbl
06-28-2007, 03:19 PM
Well I was speaking more of next season and the hypothetical(s) I suggested.

To me a great DE can help a team allot but does not produce as much as a RB or QB. A DE that produces 10 sacks a season would defiantly help but a RB that is throwing up 1000+ yards and catching another 50 for 500 seems a little more valuable in the grand scheme. Same with a QB who has shown he is a leader and was a home town hero.

I was just wondering if the ‘what if’ is still the hearts or not. Is Mario's production this season crucial to justify the pick?

I think production IS crucial. However that production does not necessarily have to be sacks. A high number would be nice, but I would rather see a disruptive force in the backfield with TFL's, QB hurries, and stopping the run. I expect and would be happy with 8 1/2 to 12 sacks as long as the defense as a whole can dominate games.:d:

Double Barrel
06-28-2007, 03:19 PM
I was using the "Home Town Hero" flag as a reason but not the only reason why to pick Young. I could have easily mentioned the OT run, OROY, greatest comeback in NFL history by a rookie QB, Rookie Pro-Bowler (yeah yeah yeah), Managing to pull out 8 wins with the 32nd ranked D in the NFL, and the fact that you had Carr as your QB at the time of the draft.

The man has a point. :hmmm:

It is rather bizarre twist of events that the player we signed for $8 million is gone a year later, no doubt about it.

While I do not regret passing on Young, he is still a good player with a ton of potential. To be honest, I'm looking forward to playing him twice a year...while I'm not looking forward to playing him twice a year. He's a dynamic talent that can be a big playmaker (as we have witnessed).

Of course, a QB cannot do it by his lonesome (if anyone knows this to be true it's Texans fans). So I'm not going to knock VY when I've got respect for the guy's game. However, I will take some satisfaction should Mario and the rest of the defense take care of business, especially in Reliant.

And I still do not think that Young is a QB that would flourish in a Kubiak WCO.

Blazing Arrow
06-28-2007, 03:22 PM
Accolades? Did someone mention accolades?

How about a league worst passer rating of 66.7? Or how about throwing more int's. than td's(13/12)? That outstanding 51.5% completion percentage also should be mentioned. And losing that last game of the season...the one that would have put them in the playoffs. That's good stuff too!

He had a heck of a supporting cast last year so don't throw them under the bus! The long ass FG, pacman's defense, and a very good running game helped alot.

I meantioned before that when compaired to the elite QBs that have played in the NFL Youngs first season was not better but was also not worst then most of the players. Are you telling me that Manning sucks because he has more INTs then TDs his first season and passed 56.7%? Who is living in a fatasy now.

Pacman and Brionis (sp?) were not avalible at the time of the draft. My question that has started this came off of the choice between: Bush, Young, and Mario. No one more. My poinst were made to show that Young did contribute and he is not a bust.

Specnatz
06-28-2007, 03:25 PM
My poinst were made to show that Young did contribute and he is not a bust.

Who ever called vy a bust is a moron. the same can be said for anyone who calls bush or Mario a bust. I give ya crap about young cause it is fun, I respect the guys game but I am not sold on him as an elite qb by any stretch of the imagination.

the wonger need food
06-28-2007, 03:27 PM
My poinst were made to show that Young did contribute and he is not a bust.

Yet... There's no way to make that determination after half of one season. Jeff George had a better rookie season than Young and I would consider him a bust.

Without Travis Henry, the Offensive Line, your Kicker and Pacman the Titans don't win a game last year.

Blazing Arrow
06-28-2007, 03:31 PM
Yet... There's no way to make that determination after half of one season. Jeff George had a better rookie season than Young and I would consider him a bust.

Without Travis Henry, the Offensive Line, your Kicker and Pacman the Titans don't win a game last year.

Yes, if the Titans O had played down 6 guys, I doubt the Titans would have won a game. Like wise if we had tried to snap the ball to no one because the kicker was not on the field, it would have been a disaster.

Overalls
06-28-2007, 03:52 PM
Chris Chandler won more games as a rookie than Young did. So Vince does have somehing to look forward to.

real
06-28-2007, 04:35 PM
I'm sorry, but VY is going to be a thorn in our side for years to come...

ReliantTexan
06-28-2007, 04:38 PM
I'm sorry, but VY is going to be a thorn in our side for years to come...And hopefully,Mario will be a thorn in Vince's side for years to come.:texflag:

real
06-28-2007, 04:41 PM
And hopefully,Mario will be a thorn in Vince's side for years to come.:texflag:
He will...

Talent wise (considering his position) Mario is just as capable as any player taken in the top 5 of that years draft...

Whether or not that will translate to on field production has yet to be seen though I think this year Mario will show why he was considered an elite prospect...

GuerillaBlack
06-28-2007, 05:27 PM
He got it because 5 QB's in front of him declined to go to the pro-bowl from the AFC. That isn't taking anything away from VY, but the system really is silly and needs to be worked out on who gets called pro-bowler.

Exactly. That is the truth.

GuerillaBlack
06-28-2007, 05:34 PM
I'm sorry, but VY is going to be a thorn in our side for years to come...

Man, Amobi and Mario will be a thorn, with a little alcohol to make it burn in Vince's side for years to come.

threetoedpete
06-28-2007, 06:18 PM
I'm sorry, but VY is going to be a thorn in our side for years to come...

Nope. No he is not. His legs will only take him so far. He's too hardheaded and stuborn to change.
There are no spread QBs in the NFL. And there is a very good reason for that. There are old quarterbacks and there are bold qurterbacks. But there are no old bold quarterbacks in the NFL. Vincent will be no different.

hollywood_texan
06-28-2007, 07:00 PM
Nope. No he is not. His legs will only take him so far. He's too hardheaded and stuborn to change.
There are no spread QBs in the NFL. And there is a very good reason for that. There are old quarterbacks and there are bold qurterbacks. But there are no old bold quarterbacks in the NFL. Vincent will be no different.

IMO, VY's running style is to make plays, not to just run if he is running. Besides, the way he runs, he doesn't take a lot of punishment.

If he learns to read defenses properly and can communicate well with his receivers, he will probably have a very successful career with no greater risk of serious injury than any other QB in the league.

VY is just a unique player that doesn't fit in any known box.

The guy just wins where he plays.

real
06-28-2007, 07:41 PM
Nope. No he is not. His legs will only take him so far. He's too hardheaded and stuborn to change.
There are no spread QBs in the NFL. And there is a very good reason for that. There are old quarterbacks and there are bold qurterbacks. But there are no old bold quarterbacks in the NFL. Vincent will be no different.

LOL...ok....

I suppose you thought he'd get killed in his rookie season too, eh ?

Now it's his sophomore year, then it'll be year three, then it'll be....blah, blah, blah....

The1ApplePie
06-28-2007, 07:46 PM
Man, Amobi and Mario will be a thorn, with a little alcohol to make it burn in Vince's side for years to come.

Hopefully

I don't want them to turn out to be like Babin and TJ, who were suposed to thorn's in Manning's side.

GuerillaBlack
06-28-2007, 08:19 PM
Hopefully

I don't want them to turn out to be like Babin and TJ, who were suposed to thorn's in Manning's side.

Nah, I doubt they will. Mario looks a lot better than Babin and Amobi better than TJ. I have no worries between the two.

Texans Horror
06-28-2007, 08:47 PM
Is this a Matt Schaub thread, or should it be moved to the NFL section with the other VY threads?

rickyb
06-28-2007, 09:11 PM
I suppose you thought he'd get killed in his rookie season too, eh ?

Now it's his sophomore year, then it'll be year three, then it'll be....blah, blah, blah....

VY is going on the cover of Madden NFL, all but assuring his poor performance this year.

OzzO
06-28-2007, 09:44 PM
... so, ANYWAY............personally, while all the texans will be feeling the heat (not only because its very hot in houston, but because of our new higher expectations), i think mario will be under the most pressure to perform at a really high level- its his second yr (no more rookie mistakes) and injury free so he has to justify being taken before the saints HWWNBN and the tack's HWWNBN

Ya know, I'm not sure if he has to "justify" being taken number 1. By that, I mean he's gonna be a piece of the Texan's puzzle that is working towards a long term team foundation. Yeah, I'm sure the Texans could've gone for immediate impact with someone that will touch the ball every play for the quick fix, I'm pretty sure Bud took VY just to stick it to Houston when he saw all the hype and "Mac ads"... IMO. But hey, if Young is a vital part to the Titans and Bush is a missing piece to the Saints, more power to them. What makes the NFL more interesting to follow is good for the fans. Keep on hawking them video games and Subway sandwiches...

Maybe Kubiak (and now Smith) prefer to build the team a different way. Maybe they saw more of a weakness on one side of the ball (drafting defense early 2 seasons in a row?) Isn't a little harder or more long term to build a defense than an offense? Plus if we're gonna have a cap surplus next year, find that star for the offense to improve that side of the ball - to go along with those we acquired this year.

Tell ya what, their 2 offseasons of work has impressed me a bit more than C&C factory's 6 seasons of "game tape" review and knowing how they did it in the NFL.

For some reason, I just think with Mario being healthy along with Amobi learning (hopefully quickly) this year - we'll see a much improved defense. To have a vet running back who's in "the best shape" his offensive coach has ever seen and a groomed QB who's familiar with the scheme and will do more than lock onto a RB and is giddy in the offseason when he discovers the slant pass.... I look to have an improved offense as well.

Maybe the Texans are seeing that "defense wins championships" and that just like other teams that build for the long haul - get a solid Oline, a key player or 2 on offense, and an all around solid defense, we may just have something.

I think I'm rambling... I'm out. :texflag:

Blazing Arrow
06-28-2007, 11:53 PM
So my opinion on the matter ..... (read all of the post it all it starts out bad but the end is not so bad ....)

So if I am a Houston fan I am fumed about not taking Young. He wins a Nation Championship for a state friendly audience, is a huge fan favorite and loves the state. Big ticket, big potential (kub seems to be more for the proven number then rolling the dice), vs structure.

I think Bush would have been a solid band-aid but then the Texans would have been one of those floater teams that is always a "maybe" for the playoffs but seems to always fall short (check Jaguars as a reference team)

So the Last option was Mario. While the criticism rains and his injury looms the pick seemed pretty lame. (keep reading)

FAST FORWARD 1 YEAR LATER .....

Texans suck again (admit it ... the last part of the season with Ryans was good but the season was pretty bad during the blow outs … I am just saying. Call a spade a spade.)


BUT ...

I think one of the smartest moves was taking Amobi Okoye. He complements Mario and is another top pick. If they both live up to expectations, you should have two guys that deserve a double. When piled w/ a blitzer they should wreak havoc.

So I know what I will get on this board when I pose this question but I would like some of you to actually man up and give a fair estimate of the last ...

2 Year of the draft

Young/Griffen

or

Williams/Okoye

Which combo fairs better? Assume Griffen is moved back to S. I am pretty sure it is a given at this point but my question is based on Griffen being a S.

Specnatz
06-29-2007, 12:19 AM
So my opinion on the matter ..... (read all of the post it all it starts out bad but the end is not so bad ....)

So if I am a Houston fan I am fumed about not taking Young. He wins a Nation Championship for a state friendly audience, is a huge fan favorite and loves the state. Big ticket, big potential (kub seems to be more for the proven number then rolling the dice), vs structure.

I think Bush would have been a solid band-aid but then the Texans would have been one of those floater teams that is always a "maybe" for the playoffs but seems to always fall short (check Jaguars as a reference team)

So the Last option was Mario. While the criticism rains and his injury looms the pick seemed pretty lame. (keep reading)

FAST FORWARD 1 YEAR LATER .....

Texans suck again (admit it ... the last part of the season with Ryans was good but the season was pretty bad during the blow outs … I am just saying. Call a spade a spade.)


BUT ...

I think one of the smartest moves was taking Amobi Okoye. He complements Mario and is another top pick. If they both live up to expectations, you should have two guys that deserve a double. When piled w/ a blitzer they should wreak havoc.

So I know what I will get on this board when I pose this question but I would like some of you to actually man up and give a fair estimate of the last ...

2 Year of the draft

Young/Griffen

or

Williams/Okoye

Which combo fairs better? Assume Griffen is moved back to S. I am pretty sure it is a given at this point but my question is based on Griffen being a S.

Yes great points but if a frong does not have wings he does not bump his ass than you have what all are seeking. You use false info and projections to make your point which is great if yuo use gameboy. If you do not then you are just screwed!!

You want man up it is simple.

I do not thing vy can throw a pass to save his life or create enough pressure to avoid anything with his arm. I want a balanced offense to say hey you can not stop it. Atl or Tenn can not do this. Nor could the early Niners. What I want is having fun and being the nice guy. If that is not you, go F a duck!!

Blazing Arrow
06-29-2007, 01:36 AM
Though out and to the point ... I would have expected nothing less from you Specnatz.

Texans Horror
06-29-2007, 07:42 AM
Tennessee got OROY with their first round pick. Houston got DROY with their second round pick. I think Houston did a damn fine job with their draft last year.

OzzO
06-29-2007, 08:05 AM
...So I know what I will get on this board when I pose this question but I would like some of you to actually man up and give a fair estimate of the last ...

2 Year of the draft

Young/Griffen

or

Williams/Okoye

Which combo fairs better? Assume Griffen is moved back to S. I am pretty sure it is a given at this point but my question is based on Griffen being a S.

Are you talking about Cedric Griffin with the Vikes? I haven't heard much from him and I'm not "fuming" we didn't take Young (especially since I was still in denial about Carr at the time and eventually I think it worked out better) then I'd go with what we got - improving the defense.

... and the added optimism of Schaub and Green on our offense.

ChildressTitanMan
06-29-2007, 09:26 AM
I actually think your beginning to make the right moves. No matter which team you follow all we seem to get from our respective teams at this time of year is spin on how good they're going to be.

Green will be good if indeed he is back to full health but will he stay that way behind your O line?

I still think your taking a gamble by not addressing your O line. As we've seen lately FA O linemen command top dollar for medium talent so even if you have a fat wallet next year it might not be enough to address the line.

O line draft picks typically take 3 years to know what you really have unless your picking in the top ten. Even DaBrick who no one doubts wasn't all that in his first year.

As positive as Texans fans are about their new offensive weapons the odds are that it will be a work in progress for the first few games. The Titans are in a similar position on offense.We won't really know what we have until the season begins.

IMO your biggest improvements between last season & this one will be your D which is really getting there.

I see both teams as likely play off contenders come 2008.

ChildressTitanMan
06-29-2007, 09:29 AM
I give ya crap about young cause it is fun, I respect the guys game but I am not sold on him as an elite qb by any stretch of the imagination.

I always knew that :tease:

Hervoyel
06-29-2007, 09:55 AM
"For five years, David Carr tried every configuration of offense, but it didn't work because of poor offensive-line blocking."


Yeah... that's why it didn't work. John Clayton is a football genius stuck in a Dungeons and Dragons body.


Indeed. I was shocked to learn from John Clayton that "He tried quick throws. He tried roll-outs" constituted "every configuration of offense".

I had no idea that there were only two possible things that any offense could do. That explains why our offense was so predictable. It wasn't their fault, it was football in general and offense in particular. When you can only do two things you're bound to get a little repetative. I can't believe I watch this boring game. I should go find something productive to do on Sundays instead of watching NFL teams running both of their possible plays.

brakos82
06-29-2007, 02:04 PM
Sounds like Tecmo after you've played 5 consecutive seasons. :gun: