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LORK 88
03-24-2007, 10:06 PM
Fools in the Hands of an Aggravated Texan!!
By Brad Lorkovic


Ladies and gentlemen: make sure to keep your arms and hands inside the cart at all times and make sure you seat is secured safely because we are about to go on one hell of a roller coaster if we already havenít. In the past few months, all us Texan fans have heard about is Brady Quinn, Carr trade rumors, Jake Plummer, and even Jeff Garcia. In spite of all the speculation and the assertiveness some fans had, just about nobody couldíve guessed what happened the other day when we traded for Matt Schaub as well as released David Carr and Domanick Williams. Since then, I donít think Iíve seen more coverage of the Texans since exactly 1 year ago. Just like last year too, I donít think Iíve ever found myself more defensive or annoyed with all the ignorance and unawareness then I have been the past few days. Instead of taking the time to try to understand the decisions the Texans front office is making, most choose just to take the easy route and laugh at the decisions and crack jokes. But instead of trashing them and taking the low road like they have, I have therefore taken the time to not only get you to suffer from my drawn out introduction, but to also hopefully suffer from the rest of it. So here it is my thoughts on the state of the Texans as of now, better known as Fools in the Hands of an Aggravated Texan!


We Gave Too Much?!
To start off, what better way than to discuss the Schaub trade itself. The trade is very simple, we move down 2 picks in the 1st round and give up our 2nd rounder this and next year. For the most part, the general consensus is that we paid way too much for a career backup who hasnít proved anything (to put it nicely). However, when you think about what we are potentially getting, is it really too much to ask? When you think about it, teams sometimes spend several picks trying to find their QB of the future. For instance, the Oakland Raiders drafted Marques Tuiasosopo in 2001 as the eventual replacement to Rich Gannon. However, after a few years of showing very little improvement, Andrew Walter was drafted in the 2nd round of 2005 to end the QB situation. While itís too early to label Walter a bust, he has shown so little in the time heís been seen that the Raiders are considering using the 1st overall on a QB, trading for a QB, or bringing in Carr. So in the long term, did we really give up a huge amount when we couldíve ended up using more picks on QBs in the future than what we gave up?

The second part to acquiring Schaub was the tricky part. His contract is a maximum of 6 years, $48 million dollars. Most think this is way too much for Schaub, but in all reality itís built in our favor. Over the first 3 years, heíll make $20 million. Itís an interesting deal because itís a two bonus deal that will pay $7 million dollars in guarantees and will pay another $10 million dollar bonus if we decide to keep his contract past year 3. In essence, itís like the Carr deal, but we have a chance to do it right this time. So while people think this contract is ridiculously overpriced (even with the consideration that FA contracts this year have jumped up a ridiculous amount), the truth is that Schaub wonít even see half of that if he underperforms or doesnít prove heís worth it. So in the end, if this trade ends up not working, we donít pay too much financially. If it does, we could actually be underpaying for a top talent at QB based on how big of a rate free agent contracts are increasing by.


Schaub vs. the 2007 NFL Draft QB Class
Next, I feel itís necessary to discuss Schaub himself because of all the talk surrounding how unproven he is. In essence, yes he is ďunprovenĒ because he hasnít been through an entire NFL season as a starter. But when you think about it, whatís the bigger risk: wasting a high 1st round pick on a player who has only been comparable to mostly obsolete talent at the college level or someone who has played in the NFL and had an incredible game against one of the leagues premier teams? Yes, itís only one game, but Schaub has played and shown serious potential in that NFL game than any college QB prospect could show in any collegiate game. Consider it less of a risk than taking someone like Brady Quinn in the crapshoot known as the NFL draft if anything. Also, most of what Iíve heard from Schaub from fans, players, several others has been better more helpful than any draft workout could ever be. He has an accurate arm, calm demeanor under pressure, great leadership, and has great size. While this could be said for draft prospects, consider this: in the combine, you get 15 minutes to ask as many questions about the player trying to figure out whatever you can. You try to gauge their personality, demeanor, character, and what type of player they are in 15 minutes before itís on to the next guy. You can have a private workout with a certain draft prospect, but youíre so set on poking and prodding them physically that you canít gauge them nearly as much as you could if they were already in the NFL. Kubiak on the other hand was able to ask close NFL coaching friends who were trusted and he knew for years, as well as go golfing with Schaub in a much more personal and relaxed environment. He also was able to look at what Schaub has done in the NFL, not just in college. So in the end, Kubiak was able to get a better idea of Schaub on several levels and truly figure out how big of a risk he was.


The Carr Era
During the regular season, I never saw more disregard and distaste for Carr than ever before. The media didnít think too highly and too often compared him to Vince Young. Speculation was he was on his way out to the likes of Brady Quinn or some of the other aforementioned players in my introduction. Problem is that now that weíve changed around our QB group, the media is flaming up about it because we did something they werenít expecting. Now all of the sudden, the world has Carrís back and weíre nothing short of morons for letting him go. What people donít realize is that Carr had nothing to gain from another year in Houston as did we. Truthfully, it wouldíve been the same thing over again and nobody would benefit from another year. Carr needed a fresh start with a new team and Houston needed to see someone else at QB. Carr still has great potential, but the odds of him succeeding in Houston were on the decline. He still has a good arm, is very mobile, and can be a solid QB. The only problem is that in Houston he also became rattled, locked onto WRs, and was depended on too much. And while everyone wants to blame every problem on everything else in our offense, in reality it was a little bit of both. For every time Carr was pummeled by an O Linemen for missing a block, there was another instance where he couldíve made a deeper throw downfield but dumped it off. In the end, when you think about it, everyone needed a change of scenery. Houston needs to know what another QB can do and Carr needs to know that we were what was holding his potential back. It sucks that it had to come down to what it did, but it seemed inevitable. For all the hell heís caught in Houston, I wish him the best and hope that he finds success elsewhere.


But What About the Divine Ones Known as Vince and Reggie!!!
We didnít draft them, get over it. Reggie fit in well in New Orleans, Vince lead the Titans to almost making the playoffs, and Mario played his ass off with an injured foot that limited him. Did we draft Reggie? No. Did we draft Vince? No. Should we of drafted either of them? That question is irrelevant. We did make a mistake to extend Carr (and McNair even admitted it), but we just did everything possible to correct that mistake as best we could. There is no point to dwelling on the Ďwhat ifsí of the 2006 draft, all we can do is move forward and progress as a team. Itís understood that people will continue to focus on last yearís draft and hold it against us, but who knows what happens next year. Vince could get depended on too much and crack, Bush might not progress, and Mario could make the pro bowl. Then again, it could be the opposite. Nobody knows, thatís all in the future and its unfair comparing apples to oranges to bananas to begin with. All we need to focus on is out of all this is how our team performs as a whole, the rest will take care of itself.


What the Future Holds
Please keep in mind that a lot of my opinionated stances are based on dreaded Ďwhat ifsí. However, when you really think about it, everyoneís opinions are at this point. Nobody knows for certain what Schaub will do, what we couldíve done with our picks, what Atlanta will do with their picks, or anything else of this nature; and if they do, itís a complete guess and not based on future statistics or the win column. In fact, everything to this point that everyone has said about Schaub is nothing more than sheer speculation of the unknown. The true answer is that nothing can be certain until Schaub actually plays and we truly see what has been and I hope that everyone can realize that in the end. I know that I will catch a lot of flack for this and people will also get upset and angry by reading this, I just felt it necessary to express a different view on Schaub and the state of the team than what has been published lately in the media. Take it for what itís worth and hereís to a better 2007 season!

thetexanator
03-24-2007, 10:10 PM
can someone summarize this for the less attentive readers?

mexican_texan
03-24-2007, 10:12 PM
can someone summarize this for the less attentive readers?
No, he lost me after the first paragraph. You won't see me posting more than two paragraphs.

MarcoMaterazzi
03-24-2007, 10:13 PM
Great post as usual Lork, keep it up!

LORK 88
03-24-2007, 10:15 PM
I swear its worth the read!! I normally keep my posts short, but whenever I write articles and detailed posts like this, I have no choice but to put serious effort and thought into it.

mexican_texan
03-24-2007, 10:17 PM
I swear its worth the read!! I normally keep my posts short, but whenever I write articles and detailed posts like this, I have no choice but to put serious effort and thought into it.
I meant no offense, you're a pretty good writer, I just have a short attention span

TexanSam
03-24-2007, 10:19 PM
No, he lost me after the first paragraph. You won't see me posting more than two sentences.

Edited it for you.

Andrew6
03-24-2007, 10:19 PM
short version, I think is Get over it, and wait and see what happens.

mexican_texan
03-24-2007, 10:20 PM
Edited it for you.
Tru dat.

Bubbajwp
03-24-2007, 10:22 PM
Is it wierd that I love U. lol J/K

But seriously great post.

Bubbajwp
03-24-2007, 10:24 PM
It wont let me give you good rep. Says I need to spread it around more.

Stop taking all the good rep lork.

JCTexan
03-24-2007, 10:25 PM
But What About the Divine Ones Known as Vince and Reggie!!!
We didnít draft them, get over it.

I wish everyone in the Country would get over it. I hate hearing about VY or RB everytime I hear the Texans mentioned in the media. :hunter:

Andrew6
03-24-2007, 10:25 PM
Simplified it for my small brain

We Gave Too Much?! - compared to whats out there we did well.

Schaub vs. the 2007 NFL Draft QB Class - experince is always better and not much worth in the draft (atleast that we could acquire w/o losing a lot of other picks)

The Carr Era - Too much pain for David, broken battered etc... might do better elsewhere.

But What About the Divine Ones Known as Vince and Reggie!!! - they are not here but if they woulda whose to say they would have done as well anyway.

What the Future Holds - with what we've seen over the past few monthes who the hell knows.

LORK 88
03-24-2007, 10:26 PM
I meant no offense, you're a pretty good writer, I just have a short attention span
I know you didn't, Im usually the same way with long posts, but Im biased on this one because I wrote it!

short version, I think is Get over it, and wait and see what happens.
Short version is I basically spin whats happened the past few days in a better light and its a different take on everything. The end of the intro and the closing statement are the most important for all you lazy people.

El Tejano
03-24-2007, 10:26 PM
Rack it!!!

Andrew6
03-24-2007, 10:28 PM
if it makes you feel better Lork I read it all. Great post and I agree with most everything you wrote

BSofA04
03-24-2007, 10:31 PM
Great post! After listening to some of the radio talk shows, it's clear that they believe the Texans are destined for doom. They should actually do their job and analyze the off-season moves and use whatever "inside" source they have to formulate an opinion.

BTW....When you were talking about McNair admitting to his mistake of extending Carr's contract, you accidently put "Adams". Otherwise, it's a tremendous post.

LORK 88
03-24-2007, 10:46 PM
Great post! After listening to some of the radio talk shows, it's clear that they believe the Texans are destined for doom. They should actually do their job and analyze the off-season moves and use whatever "inside" source they have to formulate an opinion.

BTW....When you were talking about McNair admitting to his mistake of extending Carr's contract, you accidently put "Adams". Otherwise, it's a tremendous post.
Fixed it, thanks for locating the error. As for the radio talk shows saying were doomed, they were my main motivation for writing this. I'm not sure if they fear change, but I see positive steps in the right direction. Thanks to everyone for the positive feedback too, keep it up!

It wont let me give you good rep. Says I need to spread it around more.

Stop taking all the good rep lork.
I cant help it!!!

phantom17
03-24-2007, 10:48 PM
LORK 88- good stuff! We all need to move forward & support the team!:elmo: :)

Let's try this again
03-24-2007, 10:50 PM
On th subject of giving up too much while trying to forecast what the future holds for Schaub, I like to look at it like this......

Imagine if we took DeMeco Ryans with the #1 overall selection in the past draft........ Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE would have been like WTF!!!!!!. But knowing now what we didn't know then, it would've made perfect sense.

Which brings me to this Schaub situation. Swapping spots in the 1st rd is no different to me than winning one of the close losses we had. And the 2nd rd this year is essentially the same as drafting a QB (it just happens to be a 3 yr NFL Vet). Next years pick?.....Who Gives a F$%@. It's called running the business and if this is what works for them the so be it.

Also, nothing draft wise from here on out is gonna be as bad as the poor decisions they made last year so i say bring on the creative draft moves to put us in a better spot to win now.

threetoedpete
03-24-2007, 10:52 PM
can someone summarize this for the less attentive readers?

Shut the f)(* up and give him three years. A. it was cheap...IF he reaches any kind of potentail at all it is equvilant to the Raiders seach for a QB the last six years. . B. He isn't vincent so what. C. Draft picks are marginal. We don't hit second round guys anyway.

GNTLEWOLF
03-24-2007, 10:58 PM
I have not often seen eye to eye with you, but great post. fair and balanced and reasonable.

CarolinaTexan
03-24-2007, 11:08 PM
Love the post, hope VY trolls read it, but they are probobly too busy jerking off to his highlight vids on youtube.

Andrew6
03-24-2007, 11:09 PM
Love the post, hope VY trolls read it, but they are probobly too busy jerking off to his highlight vids on youtube.

:Now that's funny, I don't care who ya are.

carrlover
03-24-2007, 11:14 PM
If I am reading this right it seems to me that you are not the only person who thinks that Carr has been treated unfairly, I will miss him with all my heat. Everytime I think of the Texans I think of Carr. This is one Carr fan who will be watching him if "no, where ever" he goes

michaelm
03-24-2007, 11:23 PM
Sorry to rain on the parade Lork, but there is a MAJOR strategic flaw with your post.

First off, I agree with what you said, and suspect a high percentage of those who actually read it through will agree as well.

The tragic flaw is that your target audience is the group of people who won't read a post that long...

In our catch phrase crazy society, the one that describes your post most accurately might be "preaching to the choir". http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/preaching-to-the-choir.html

threetoedpete
03-24-2007, 11:23 PM
If I am reading this right it seems to me that you are not the only person who thinks that Carr has been treated unfairly, I will miss him with all my heat. Everytime I think of the Texans I think of Carr. This is one Carr fan who will be watching him if "no, where ever" he goes

Well I've been pro DC too. I really hope he gets a decent shot. I 'm willing to betcha...the new guy will get a hole lot more love in terms of tallent support than DC ever got. DC is just one more in a very long list of QBs who got thrown to the wolves by a Houston franchise. I thought it was really decent of McNair to cut him out right rather than let him twist in the wind for a low day two pick.

SAMURAITEXAN
03-24-2007, 11:32 PM
Good post Lork.

Schuab and what the future holds: I think it was a good trade. We gave up two 2nd rd and two spots down on 1st. that is about 1st rd 20th pick value? And, we get a QB that can start now with NFL experience( only a few but still played) and a few years to study with Falcons(watching from sideline). Therefore, it is a good trade IMO.

We should know more about this trade was in fact good or not in a year or two. Only time will tell.

REGGIE and VY: They are not TEXAN. We have Mario and I like it.

CARR: I wish him best.

GO TEXANS!!

DocBar
03-24-2007, 11:35 PM
Fools in the Hands of an Aggravated Texan!!
By Brad Lorkovic


Ladies and gentlemen: make sure to keep your arms and hands inside the cart at all times and make sure you seat is secured safely because we are about to go on one hell of a roller coaster if we already havenít. In the past few months, all us Texan fans have heard about is Brady Quinn, Carr trade rumors, Jake Plummer, and even Jeff Garcia. In spite of all the speculation and the assertiveness some fans had, just about nobody couldíve guessed what happened the other day when we traded for Matt Schaub as well as released David Carr and Domanick Williams. Since then, I donít think Iíve seen more coverage of the Texans since exactly 1 year ago. Just like last year too, I donít think Iíve ever found myself more defensive or annoyed with all the ignorance and unawareness then I have been the past few days. Instead of taking the time to try to understand the decisions the Texans front office is making, most choose just to take the easy route and laugh at the decisions and crack jokes. But instead of trashing them and taking the low road like they have, I have therefore taken the time to not only get you to suffer from my drawn out introduction, but to also hopefully suffer from the rest of it. So here it is my thoughts on the state of the Texans as of now, better known as Fools in the Hands of an Aggravated Texan!


We Gave Too Much?!
To start off, what better way than to discuss the Schaub trade itself. The trade is very simple, we move down 2 picks in the 1st round and give up our 2nd rounder this and next year. For the most part, the general consensus is that we paid way too much for a career backup who hasnít proved anything (to put it nicely). However, when you think about what we are potentially getting, is it really too much to ask? When you think about it, teams sometimes spend several picks trying to find their QB of the future. For instance, the Oakland Raiders drafted Marques Tuiasosopo in 2001 as the eventual replacement to Rich Gannon. However, after a few years of showing very little improvement, Andrew Walter was drafted in the 2nd round of 2005 to end the QB situation. While itís too early to label Walter a bust, he has shown so little in the time heís been seen that the Raiders are considering using the 1st overall on a QB, trading for a QB, or bringing in Carr. So in the long term, did we really give up a huge amount when we couldíve ended up using more picks on QBs in the future than what we gave up?

The second part to acquiring Schaub was the tricky part. His contract is a maximum of 6 years, $48 million dollars. Most think this is way too much for Schaub, but in all reality itís built in our favor. Over the first 3 years, heíll make $20 million. Itís an interesting deal because itís a two bonus deal that will pay $7 million dollars in guarantees and will pay another $10 million dollar bonus if we decide to keep his contract past year 3. In essence, itís like the Carr deal, but we have a chance to do it right this time. So while people think this contract is ridiculously overpriced (even with the consideration that FA contracts this year have jumped up a ridiculous amount), the truth is that Schaub wonít even see half of that if he underperforms or doesnít prove heís worth it. So in the end, if this trade ends up not working, we donít pay too much financially. If it does, we could actually be underpaying for a top talent at QB based on how big of a rate free agent contracts are increasing by.


Schaub vs. the 2007 NFL Draft QB Class
Next, I feel itís necessary to discuss Schaub himself because of all the talk surrounding how unproven he is. In essence, yes he is ďunprovenĒ because he hasnít been through an entire NFL season as a starter. But when you think about it, whatís the bigger risk: wasting a high 1st round pick on a player who has only been comparable to mostly obsolete talent at the college level or someone who has played in the NFL and had an incredible game against one of the leagues premier teams? Yes, itís only one game, but Schaub has played and shown serious potential in that NFL game than any college QB prospect could show in any collegiate game. Consider it less of a risk than taking someone like Brady Quinn in the crapshoot known as the NFL draft if anything. Also, most of what Iíve heard from Schaub from fans, players, several others has been better more helpful than any draft workout could ever be. He has an accurate arm, calm demeanor under pressure, great leadership, and has great size. While this could be said for draft prospects, consider this: in the combine, you get 15 minutes to ask as many questions about the player trying to figure out whatever you can. You try to gauge their personality, demeanor, character, and what type of player they are in 15 minutes before itís on to the next guy. You can have a private workout with a certain draft prospect, but youíre so set on poking and prodding them physically that you canít gauge them nearly as much as you could if they were already in the NFL. Kubiak on the other hand was able to ask close NFL coaching friends who were trusted and he knew for years, as well as go golfing with Schaub in a much more personal and relaxed environment. He also was able to look at what Schaub has done in the NFL, not just in college. So in the end, Kubiak was able to get a better idea of Schaub on several levels and truly figure out how big of a risk he was.


The Carr Era
During the regular season, I never saw more disregard and distaste for Carr than ever before. The media didnít think too highly and too often compared him to Vince Young. Speculation was he was on his way out to the likes of Brady Quinn or some of the other aforementioned players in my introduction. Problem is that now that weíve changed around our QB group, the media is flaming up about it because we did something they werenít expecting. Now all of the sudden, the world has Carrís back and weíre nothing short of morons for letting him go. What people donít realize is that Carr had nothing to gain from another year in Houston as did we. Truthfully, it wouldíve been the same thing over again and nobody would benefit from another year. Carr needed a fresh start with a new team and Houston needed to see someone else at QB. Carr still has great potential, but the odds of him succeeding in Houston were on the decline. He still has a good arm, is very mobile, and can be a solid QB. The only problem is that in Houston he also became rattled, locked onto WRs, and was depended on too much. And while everyone wants to blame every problem on everything else in our offense, in reality it was a little bit of both. For every time Carr was pummeled by an O Linemen for missing a block, there was another instance where he couldíve made a deeper throw downfield but dumped it off. In the end, when you think about it, everyone needed a change of scenery. Houston needs to know what another QB can do and Carr needs to know that we were what was holding his potential back. It sucks that it had to come down to what it did, but it seemed inevitable. For all the hell heís caught in Houston, I wish him the best and hope that he finds success elsewhere.


But What About the Divine Ones Known as Vince and Reggie!!!
We didnít draft them, get over it. Reggie fit in well in New Orleans, Vince lead the Titans to almost making the playoffs, and Mario played his ass off with an injured foot that limited him. Did we draft Reggie? No. Did we draft Vince? No. Should we of drafted either of them? That question is irrelevant. We did make a mistake to extend Carr (and McNair even admitted it), but we just did everything possible to correct that mistake as best we could. There is no point to dwelling on the Ďwhat ifsí of the 2006 draft, all we can do is move forward and progress as a team. Itís understood that people will continue to focus on last yearís draft and hold it against us, but who knows what happens next year. Vince could get depended on too much and crack, Bush might not progress, and Mario could make the pro bowl. Then again, it could be the opposite. Nobody knows, thatís all in the future and its unfair comparing apples to oranges to bananas to begin with. All we need to focus on is out of all this is how our team performs as a whole, the rest will take care of itself.


What the Future Holds
Please keep in mind that a lot of my opinionated stances are based on dreaded Ďwhat ifsí. However, when you really think about it, everyoneís opinions are at this point. Nobody knows for certain what Schaub will do, what we couldíve done with our picks, what Atlanta will do with their picks, or anything else of this nature; and if they do, itís a complete guess and not based on future statistics or the win column. In fact, everything to this point that everyone has said about Schaub is nothing more than sheer speculation of the unknown. The true answer is that nothing can be certain until Schaub actually plays and we truly see what has been and I hope that everyone can realize that in the end. I know that I will catch a lot of flack for this and people will also get upset and angry by reading this, I just felt it necessary to express a different view on Schaub and the state of the team than what has been published lately in the media. Take it for what itís worth and hereís to a better 2007 season!
I've had WAY too much to drink tonite to answer this post, so I will do so menana. Please stay tuned.

joshri
03-25-2007, 12:01 AM
Enjoyed the read. Thanks

DocBar
03-25-2007, 12:04 AM
Shut the f)(* up and give him three years. A. it was cheap...IF he reaches any kind of potentail at all it is equvilant to the Raiders seach for a QB the last six years. . B. He isn't vincent so what. C. Draft picks are marginal. We don't hit second round guys anyway.

WOW!!! Pete, you don't often get worked up. Just remember.....IF your Aunt had balls, she'd be your Uncle.

:victory:
And Demeco's gonna kick your butt for saying that. And so's someother 2nd round pick we've chosen. The name escapes me right now, though...

SamuraiSword
03-25-2007, 12:34 AM
Fools in the Hands of an Aggravated Texan!!
By Brad Lorkovic


Ladies and gentlemen: make sure to keep your arms and hands inside the cart at all times and make sure you seat is secured safely because we are about to go on one hell of a roller coaster if we already havenít. In the past few months, all us Texan fans have heard about is Brady Quinn, Carr trade rumors, Jake Plummer, and even Jeff Garcia. In spite of all the speculation and the assertiveness some fans had, just about nobody couldíve guessed what happened the other day when we traded for Matt Schaub as well as released David Carr and Domanick Williams. Since then, I donít think Iíve seen more coverage of the Texans since exactly 1 year ago. Just like last year too, I donít think Iíve ever found myself more defensive or annoyed with all the ignorance and unawareness then I have been the past few days. Instead of taking the time to try to understand the decisions the Texans front office is making, most choose just to take the easy route and laugh at the decisions and crack jokes. But instead of trashing them and taking the low road like they have, I have therefore taken the time to not only get you to suffer from my drawn out introduction, but to also hopefully suffer from the rest of it. So here it is my thoughts on the state of the Texans as of now, better known as Fools in the Hands of an Aggravated Texan!


We Gave Too Much?!
To start off, what better way than to discuss the Schaub trade itself. The trade is very simple, we move down 2 picks in the 1st round and give up our 2nd rounder this and next year. For the most part, the general consensus is that we paid way too much for a career backup who hasnít proved anything (to put it nicely). However, when you think about what we are potentially getting, is it really too much to ask? When you think about it, teams sometimes spend several picks trying to find their QB of the future. For instance, the Oakland Raiders drafted Marques Tuiasosopo in 2001 as the eventual replacement to Rich Gannon. However, after a few years of showing very little improvement, Andrew Walter was drafted in the 2nd round of 2005 to end the QB situation. While itís too early to label Walter a bust, he has shown so little in the time heís been seen that the Raiders are considering using the 1st overall on a QB, trading for a QB, or bringing in Carr. So in the long term, did we really give up a huge amount when we couldíve ended up using more picks on QBs in the future than what we gave up?

The second part to acquiring Schaub was the tricky part. His contract is a maximum of 6 years, $48 million dollars. Most think this is way too much for Schaub, but in all reality itís built in our favor. Over the first 3 years, heíll make $20 million. Itís an interesting deal because itís a two bonus deal that will pay $7 million dollars in guarantees and will pay another $10 million dollar bonus if we decide to keep his contract past year 3. In essence, itís like the Carr deal, but we have a chance to do it right this time. So while people think this contract is ridiculously overpriced (even with the consideration that FA contracts this year have jumped up a ridiculous amount), the truth is that Schaub wonít even see half of that if he underperforms or doesnít prove heís worth it. So in the end, if this trade ends up not working, we donít pay too much financially. If it does, we could actually be underpaying for a top talent at QB based on how big of a rate free agent contracts are increasing by.


Schaub vs. the 2007 NFL Draft QB Class
Next, I feel itís necessary to discuss Schaub himself because of all the talk surrounding how unproven he is. In essence, yes he is ďunprovenĒ because he hasnít been through an entire NFL season as a starter. But when you think about it, whatís the bigger risk: wasting a high 1st round pick on a player who has only been comparable to mostly obsolete talent at the college level or someone who has played in the NFL and had an incredible game against one of the leagues premier teams? Yes, itís only one game, but Schaub has played and shown serious potential in that NFL game than any college QB prospect could show in any collegiate game. Consider it less of a risk than taking someone like Brady Quinn in the crapshoot known as the NFL draft if anything. Also, most of what Iíve heard from Schaub from fans, players, several others has been better more helpful than any draft workout could ever be. He has an accurate arm, calm demeanor under pressure, great leadership, and has great size. While this could be said for draft prospects, consider this: in the combine, you get 15 minutes to ask as many questions about the player trying to figure out whatever you can. You try to gauge their personality, demeanor, character, and what type of player they are in 15 minutes before itís on to the next guy. You can have a private workout with a certain draft prospect, but youíre so set on poking and prodding them physically that you canít gauge them nearly as much as you could if they were already in the NFL. Kubiak on the other hand was able to ask close NFL coaching friends who were trusted and he knew for years, as well as go golfing with Schaub in a much more personal and relaxed environment. He also was able to look at what Schaub has done in the NFL, not just in college. So in the end, Kubiak was able to get a better idea of Schaub on several levels and truly figure out how big of a risk he was.


The Carr Era
During the regular season, I never saw more disregard and distaste for Carr than ever before. The media didnít think too highly and too often compared him to Vince Young. Speculation was he was on his way out to the likes of Brady Quinn or some of the other aforementioned players in my introduction. Problem is that now that weíve changed around our QB group, the media is flaming up about it because we did something they werenít expecting. Now all of the sudden, the world has Carrís back and weíre nothing short of morons for letting him go. What people donít realize is that Carr had nothing to gain from another year in Houston as did we. Truthfully, it wouldíve been the same thing over again and nobody would benefit from another year. Carr needed a fresh start with a new team and Houston needed to see someone else at QB. Carr still has great potential, but the odds of him succeeding in Houston were on the decline. He still has a good arm, is very mobile, and can be a solid QB. The only problem is that in Houston he also became rattled, locked onto WRs, and was depended on too much. And while everyone wants to blame every problem on everything else in our offense, in reality it was a little bit of both. For every time Carr was pummeled by an O Linemen for missing a block, there was another instance where he couldíve made a deeper throw downfield but dumped it off. In the end, when you think about it, everyone needed a change of scenery. Houston needs to know what another QB can do and Carr needs to know that we were what was holding his potential back. It sucks that it had to come down to what it did, but it seemed inevitable. For all the hell heís caught in Houston, I wish him the best and hope that he finds success elsewhere.


But What About the Divine Ones Known as Vince and Reggie!!!
We didnít draft them, get over it. Reggie fit in well in New Orleans, Vince lead the Titans to almost making the playoffs, and Mario played his ass off with an injured foot that limited him. Did we draft Reggie? No. Did we draft Vince? No. Should we of drafted either of them? That question is irrelevant. We did make a mistake to extend Carr (and McNair even admitted it), but we just did everything possible to correct that mistake as best we could. There is no point to dwelling on the Ďwhat ifsí of the 2006 draft, all we can do is move forward and progress as a team. Itís understood that people will continue to focus on last yearís draft and hold it against us, but who knows what happens next year. Vince could get depended on too much and crack, Bush might not progress, and Mario could make the pro bowl. Then again, it could be the opposite. Nobody knows, thatís all in the future and its unfair comparing apples to oranges to bananas to begin with. All we need to focus on is out of all this is how our team performs as a whole, the rest will take care of itself.


What the Future Holds
Please keep in mind that a lot of my opinionated stances are based on dreaded Ďwhat ifsí. However, when you really think about it, everyoneís opinions are at this point. Nobody knows for certain what Schaub will do, what we couldíve done with our picks, what Atlanta will do with their picks, or anything else of this nature; and if they do, itís a complete guess and not based on future statistics or the win column. In fact, everything to this point that everyone has said about Schaub is nothing more than sheer speculation of the unknown. The true answer is that nothing can be certain until Schaub actually plays and we truly see what has been and I hope that everyone can realize that in the end. I know that I will catch a lot of flack for this and people will also get upset and angry by reading this, I just felt it necessary to express a different view on Schaub and the state of the team than what has been published lately in the media. Take it for what itís worth and hereís to a better 2007 season!

Isn't this what blogs are meant for and message boards are for people like me with A.D.D. who love short messages???:lightbulb:

MATRIX
03-25-2007, 12:55 AM
I agree 100%

I have a friend emailing me an article coming ou in Street & Smiths Preview. It will hlp cure the VY fans and show what scouts and teams feelabout our new QB.


Time to move on guy...and the future is looking good:snobord:

VaBandWaggonFan
03-25-2007, 01:07 AM
If I am reading this right it seems to me that you are not the only person who thinks that Carr has been treated unfairly, I will miss him with all my heat. Everytime I think of the Texans I think of Carr. This is one Carr fan who will be watching him if "no, where ever" he goes



It's obvious your just trying to stir up an alrdy empty pot....
:deadhorse

beerlover
03-25-2007, 01:09 AM
very good post & well taken/intended.

We Gave Too Much?! its not too much if it works out & if the Texans can trade down & re-aquire some picks to address needs.

thats some pretty big ifs, like if David Carr can become a better QB under Kubiak.

Schaub vs. the 2007 NFL Draft QB Class at one time he too was a 3rd round pick. I understand the time frame concept, this is key. right now, right here he is a better option, but why not wait til draft day give less & get more, maybe even Quinn could have slipped to #8. regardless he is still a projection I'll have to trust coach Kubes on this one I guess.

The Carr Era we gave Carr millions & millions of dollars, a shot to be the starting QB for five years & control his own destiny. the Texans owe him nothing more, nothing less. why fold your hand before its played I can't beleive something could not have been gained by shopping him pre-season at the worst, at the best maybe he could have turned it around, we'll never know.

But What About the Divine Ones Known as Vince and Reggie!!! while history it is, it will never be forgotton, never!!!

What the Future Holds true that :)

The Pencil Neck
03-25-2007, 01:16 AM
Great post, man.

I'd really like to see the number of draft picks teams "waste" trying to find a franchise QB. That puts a whole new light on the 2 2's.

NederlandTexan
03-25-2007, 08:26 AM
Don't be afraid of the length of the post.........well thought out and a great read.

whiskeyrbl
03-25-2007, 08:54 AM
Great post..Tried to give rep but told me to spread it around

DocBar
03-25-2007, 09:02 AM
Great post, man.

I'd really like to see the number of draft picks teams "waste" trying to find a franchise QB. That puts a whole new light on the 2 2's.
Just saw this article in the Comical(:sarcasm: ) and it puts a little perspective on this.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/4658920.html

big sarge
03-25-2007, 09:41 AM
[QUOTE=LORK 88;640373]Fools in the Hands of an Aggravated Texan!!
By Brad Lorkovic


Ladies and gentlemen: make sure to keep your arms and hands inside the cart at all times and make sure you seat is secured safely because we are about to go on one hell of a roller coaster if we already havenít. In the past few months, all us Texan fans have heard about is Brady Quinn, Carr trade rumors, Jake Plummer, and even Jeff Garcia. In spite of all the speculation and the assertiveness some fans had, just about nobody couldíve guessed what happened the other day when we traded for Matt Schaub as well as released David Carr and Domanick Williams. Since then, I donít think Iíve seen more coverage of the Texans since exactly 1 year ago. Just like last year too, I donít think Iíve ever found myself more defensive or annoyed with all the ignorance and unawareness then I have been the past few days. Instead of taking the time to try to understand the decisions the Texans front office is making, most choose just to take the easy route and laugh at the decisions and crack jokes. But instead of trashing them and taking the low road like they have, I have therefore taken the time to not only get you to suffer from my drawn out introduction, but to also hopefully suffer from the rest of it. So here it is my thoughts on the state of the Texans as of now, better known as Fools in the Hands of an Aggravated Texan!


We Gave Too Much?!
To start off, what better way than to discuss the Schaub trade itself. The trade is very simple, we move down 2 picks in the 1st round and give up our 2nd rounder this and next year. For the most part, the general consensus is that we paid way too much for a career backup who hasnít proved anything (to put it nicely). However, when you think about what we are potentially getting, is it really too much to ask? When you think about it, teams sometimes spend several picks trying to find their QB of the future. For instance, the Oakland Raiders drafted Marques Tuiasosopo in 2001 as the eventual replacement to Rich Gannon. However, after a few years of showing very little improvement, Andrew Walter was drafted in the 2nd round of 2005 to end the QB situation. While itís too early to label Walter a bust, he has shown so little in the time heís been seen that the Raiders are considering using the 1st overall on a QB, trading for a QB, or bringing in Carr. So in the long term, did we really give up a huge amount when we couldíve ended up using more picks on QBs in the future than what we gave up?

The second part to acquiring Schaub was the tricky part. His contract is a maximum of 6 years, $48 million dollars. Most think this is way too much for Schaub, but in all reality itís built in our favor. Over the first 3 years, heíll make $20 million. Itís an interesting deal because itís a two bonus deal that will pay $7 million dollars in guarantees and will pay another $10 million dollar bonus if we decide to keep his contract past year 3. In essence, itís like the Carr deal, but we have a chance to do it right this time. So while people think this contract is ridiculously overpriced (even with the consideration that FA contracts this year have jumped up a ridiculous amount), the truth is that Schaub wonít even see half of that if he underperforms or doesnít prove heís worth it. So in the end, if this trade ends up not working, we donít pay too much financially. If it does, we could actually be underpaying for a top talent at QB based on how big of a rate free agent contracts are increasing by.


These are the cold hard facts that we gave too much.

Matt Schaub 6'5" 237
cmp: 84; att: 161; yds: 1033; cmp%: 52.2; ypa: 6.42; lng: 59; td: 6; int: 6; sacks:12; rating: 69.2

Sage Rosenfels 6'4" 225
cmp: 81; att: 148; yds: 1041; cmp%: 54.7; ypa: 7.03; lng: 77; td: 9; int: 7; sacks: 4; rating: 77.6

This was what came up when I did a player search on espn.com. If I was Sage I would be on a hotline to my agent cursing him.

HuttoKarl
03-25-2007, 10:11 AM
TRUTH!!!

afcman
03-25-2007, 10:17 AM
I wish everyone in the Country would get over it. I hate hearing about VY or RB everytime I hear the Texans mentioned in the media.

It will keep going until we start winning lots of games. Winning is the cure.

bigTEXan8
03-25-2007, 10:47 AM
in my opinion, r.bush wouldn't have lived up to the hype if he came to houston. the same goes for v.young. the texans were complete and utter **** coming into the 2006 season.

r.bush went to orleans...who got a great coach, a decent line, and bush had a great compliment in mccalister. v.young went to a team who had a great coach, and a promising potential in team completeness (jmo). this just proves my opinion of drafting m.williams was the best move last year. the texans d the previous year was horrible.

the addition of williams and d.ryans was a great step forward last year for the texans. that's going to be a sure-shot combo for years to come. and i hate to go john madden on all of you, but "the team with the most points at the end of the game wins." r.bush and v.young couldn't stop the colts, jags, etc. from scoring more than the texans, so lat year was a great step forward.

w/ schaub, it's hard for me to believe the texans didn't overpay. in my opinion, to prove this guy isn't a schmuck, he's going to have to seriously contribute to the texans getting a winning season. 9-7 or better. if not, i would believe they overpaid. and i don't even want to know what's going to happen if he comes in and just k***'s all over the field.

Erratic Assassin
03-25-2007, 11:03 AM
Instead of taking the time to try to understand the decisions the Texans front office is making, most choose just to take the easy route and laugh at the decisions and crack jokes.

someone who has played in the NFL and had an incredible game against one of the leagues premier teams? Yes, itís only one game, but Schaub has played and shown serious potential in that NFL game

For 5 years there has been a steady stream of posters telling us not to question the front office.

We knew the front office was making bad decisions and we were right. I can't tell you how many times I've read, "If you're so much smarter than Casserly, then why aren't YOU the GM?" The truth is that our front office ran this franchise into the ground.

Before this offseason I thought we were about 3 or 4 offseasons away from being competitive (assuming the current GM makes good decisions). Now that we've given up 2 second round picks for a backup QB, we can probably add another year onto that estimate. I'm also starting to question the current front office's ability to make good decisions.

Matt Schaub had one good game? That's awesome! So did Giff Nielson! So did Bucky Richardson! In fact most backup QBs are capable of one good game. It means nothing.

We should have used our picks to draft the most talented players available and pick up a QB in the draft the next time a good one is available (not this year). Only time will tell who's right or who's wrong, but don't tell me we can't question the front office.

Marcus
03-25-2007, 11:44 AM
For 5 years there has been a steady stream of posters telling us not to question the front office.

We knew the front office was making bad decisions and we were right. I can't tell you how many times I've read, "If you're so much smarter than Casserly, then why aren't YOU the GM?" The truth is that our front office ran this franchise into the ground.

I think your persistant "All of you were wrong, and I was right, I told you so" schtick is geeting a little old. I don't know if you've been keeping up with current events, but Casserly was let go awhile back.

Only time will tell who's right or who's wrong, but don't tell me we can't question the front office.

You certainly have the right to question to question front office moves, but don't automatically assume that just because the previous regime was a failure, then that means this one will too! You're dwelling on too much past and negative, IMO.

Marcus
03-25-2007, 11:52 AM
Lork, superior post!

I don't usually read long posts myself, but that's because most don't make the effort to make their long posts 'readable'. You took the time to separate your major points, and not run them all together. Made it seem like you actually took an English composition class in school.

Positive rep coming your way.

TexansSB07
03-25-2007, 12:00 PM
can someone summarize this for the less attentive readers?

We paid a lot for Schaub, BUT we would pay a lot more for a guy who might turn out to be a bust.

Forget about 2006 draft, we need to look forward. Not what if the heck out of past mistakes, Mario did a good job consdiering his injury.

Malloy
03-25-2007, 12:18 PM
I will miss him with all my heat.

Also known as 'manlove' :)

Malloy
03-25-2007, 12:24 PM
These are the cold hard facts that we gave too much.

Matt Schaub 6'5" 237
cmp: 84; att: 161; yds: 1033; cmp%: 52.2; ypa: 6.42; lng: 59; td: 6; int: 6; sacks:12; rating: 69.2

Sage Rosenfels 6'4" 225
cmp: 81; att: 148; yds: 1041; cmp%: 54.7; ypa: 7.03; lng: 77; td: 9; int: 7; sacks: 4; rating: 77.6

This was what came up when I did a player search on espn.com. If I was Sage I would be on a hotline to my agent cursing him.

Talk about reaching.

I think you should refrain from bringing Madden logic into the discussion.

Malloy
03-25-2007, 12:27 PM
Oh, before I forget: Great post Lork, even if people do not agree with you (I do), the amount of effort and thought in your post is quite refreshing.

Three thumbs up, all that jazz! :)

thunderkyss
03-25-2007, 12:30 PM
Before this offseason I thought we were about 3 or 4 offseasons away from being competitive (assuming the current GM makes good decisions).

What do you consider competitive?? 8-8, or a shot at the play-offs.

Now that we've given up 2 second round picks for a backup QB, we can probably add another year onto that estimate. I'm also starting to question the current front office's ability to make good decisions.

I'd really like to hear you explain this one. IMHO, it's like adding a Kolb, or a Stanton, without having to wait two years for them to get up to speed, with the same second round pick it would cost to acquire them.

Matt Schaub had one good game? That's awesome! So did Giff Nielson! So did Bucky Richardson! In fact most backup QBs are capable of one good game. It means nothing.

I'm fine with that. I can agree. But I know our front office based their decision on more than that one game.

We should have used our picks to draft the most talented players available and pick up a QB in the draft the next time a good one is available (not this year). Only time will tell who's right or who's wrong, but don't tell me we can't question the front office.

Question the front office, no one is stopping you.

But with this pick-up, with the Ahman Green pick-up, my front office is telling me we're going to be competitive in '07. I like their outlook much better than yours.

LORK 88
03-25-2007, 12:39 PM
These are the cold hard facts that we gave too much.

Matt Schaub 6'5" 237
cmp: 84; att: 161; yds: 1033; cmp%: 52.2; ypa: 6.42; lng: 59; td: 6; int: 6; sacks:12; rating: 69.2

Sage Rosenfels 6'4" 225
cmp: 81; att: 148; yds: 1041; cmp%: 54.7; ypa: 7.03; lng: 77; td: 9; int: 7; sacks: 4; rating: 77.6

This was what came up when I did a player search on espn.com. If I was Sage I would be on a hotline to my agent cursing him.
How is that a fact that we gave too much? If anything, it just means that Rosenfels is a cabable backup. Rosenfels has been around much longer which is why his numbers as a backup look much better.

For 5 years there has been a steady stream of posters telling us not to question the front office.

We knew the front office was making bad decisions and we were right. I can't tell you how many times I've read, "If you're so much smarter than Casserly, then why aren't YOU the GM?" The truth is that our front office ran this franchise into the ground.

Before this offseason I thought we were about 3 or 4 offseasons away from being competitive (assuming the current GM makes good decisions). Now that we've given up 2 second round picks for a backup QB, we can probably add another year onto that estimate. I'm also starting to question the current front office's ability to make good decisions.

Matt Schaub had one good game? That's awesome! So did Giff Nielson! So did Bucky Richardson! In fact most backup QBs are capable of one good game. It means nothing.

We should have used our picks to draft the most talented players available and pick up a QB in the draft the next time a good one is available (not this year). Only time will tell who's right or who's wrong, but don't tell me we can't question the front office.
2 things: 1) Until the Front Office makes a big, visible mistake, I will continue to support them. Until they do, its nothing more than being paranoid worried that they're Casserly and Capers. Also, where did I say that you couldn't question the current FO? 2) Read what I said in the "What the Future Holds" section.


I thank everyone else for taking the time to read it and all the positive feedback, I really appriciate it and Im glad everyones enjoyed it!

Ole Miss Texan
03-25-2007, 01:38 PM
great post lork!

It's all about minimizing risk and maximazing return to the best you can.

Quite simply the FO felt Schaub has a lot of potential and can lead our team to great things. They also felt that IF either of the qb's fell to us at 8, they would come with more risk than schaub. (we also get to use our 1st rd pick on another elite player that will help our team)

There is no telling how long any of the qb's would have to learn whether we drafted them in the 1st or 2nd this year. Schaub will start day 1, therefore we are getting more bang for the buck than sitting a first round pick for the better half of half a season.

DocBar
03-25-2007, 04:47 PM
in my opinion, r.bush wouldn't have lived up to the hype if he came to houston. the same goes for v.young. the texans were complete and utter **** coming into the 2006 season.

r.bush went to orleans...who got a great coach, a decent line, and bush had a great compliment in mccalister. v.young went to a team who had a great coach, and a promising potential in team completeness (jmo). this just proves my opinion of drafting m.williams was the best move last year. the texans d the previous year was horrible.

the addition of williams and d.ryans was a great step forward last year for the texans. that's going to be a sure-shot combo for years to come. and i hate to go john madden on all of you, but "the team with the most points at the end of the game wins." r.bush and v.young couldn't stop the colts, jags, etc. from scoring more than the texans, so lat year was a great step forward.

w/ schaub, it's hard for me to believe the texans didn't overpay. in my opinion, to prove this guy isn't a schmuck, he's going to have to seriously contribute to the texans getting a winning season. 9-7 or better. if not, i would believe they overpaid. and i don't even want to know what's going to happen if he comes in and just k***'s all over the field.

R. Bush didn't live up to his hype at all. If the rest of the sAints hadn't played so well, we would be hearing how smart we were to pass on him. VY made some things happen, but got VERY lucky through most of it. In the NFL, I prefer to rely on skill than luck. Busted plays don't break your way every time. Eventually they will average out and then we'll see how VY does when relying on more than his legs.

Yankee_In_TX
03-25-2007, 07:54 PM
LOL, well said. Props for you. My friends complained about Carr. My friends complained about out FA. My friends complained about Schaub.

I really would like someone to create the "You're Rick Smith" game. Then they can figure out how unrealistic all their "plans" were/are. People don't seem to understand with TONS of needs on the team, and little money to spend on FA's, you really can't sign LT, Merriweather, PacMan Jones and then go draft Brady Quinn. I think because of our losing history, people will be unhappy with ANY move we make until we win, plain and simple. I'm sure if we signed Peyton Manning people here would be complaining.

BTW, I can't say this enough:


But What About the Divine Ones Known as Vince and Reggie!!!
We didnít draft them, get over it. Reggie fit in well in New Orleans, Vince lead the Titans to almost making the playoffs, and Mario played his ass off with an injured foot that limited him. Did we draft Reggie? No. Did we draft Vince? No. Should we of drafted either of them? That question is irrelevant. We did make a mistake to extend Carr (and McNair even admitted it), but we just did everything possible to correct that mistake as best we could. There is no point to dwelling on the Ďwhat ifsí of the 2006 draft, all we can do is move forward and progress as a team. Itís understood that people will continue to focus on last yearís draft and hold it against us, but who knows what happens next year. Vince could get depended on too much and crack, Bush might not progress, and Mario could make the pro bowl. Then again, it could be the opposite. Nobody knows, thatís all in the future and its unfair comparing apples to oranges to bananas to begin with. All we need to focus on is out of all this is how our team performs as a whole, the rest will take care of itself.

Yankee_In_TX
03-25-2007, 07:55 PM
R. Bush didn't live up to his hype at all. If the rest of the sAints hadn't played so well, we would be hearing how smart we were to pass on him. VY made some things happen, but got VERY lucky through most of it. In the NFL, I prefer to rely on skill than luck. Busted plays don't break your way every time. Eventually they will average out and then we'll see how VY does when relying on more than his legs.

If we had taken Bush he'd currently be on the IR with a bad knee :)

sk8termom
03-25-2007, 08:24 PM
Great post Lork!

deucebigalow4
03-25-2007, 09:29 PM
How about this spin on the 2 2nd rounders:

1) This year's 2 for Schaub (bargain)

2) Next year's 2 for 7 million in cap relief and no QB controversy. I'm not sure, but I feel like 7 million allows us to "fill holes" and "address needs" in FA like one pick in next year's second round could have done.

Granted, this washes away our 1st pick on Carr which we could have used on Julius Peppers, but who's counting?

V Man
03-25-2007, 10:25 PM
Great Post Lork. When you get down with school, maybe you can be the Texans writer for the Express News here in SA (since we need one that actually now something about the team).

V Man
03-25-2007, 10:27 PM
These are the cold hard facts that we gave too much.

Matt Schaub 6'5" 237
cmp: 84; att: 161; yds: 1033; cmp%: 52.2; ypa: 6.42; lng: 59; td: 6; int: 6; sacks:12; rating: 69.2

Sage Rosenfels 6'4" 225
cmp: 81; att: 148; yds: 1041; cmp%: 54.7; ypa: 7.03; lng: 77; td: 9; int: 7; sacks: 4; rating: 77.6

This was what came up when I did a player search on espn.com. If I was Sage I would be on a hotline to my agent cursing him.

When will people learn you can't go by stats alone. Hell if you went by Carr's comp. % he is an upper level QB.

MATRIX
03-25-2007, 10:48 PM
Originally Posted by big sarge
These are the cold hard facts that we gave too much.

Matt Schaub 6'5" 237
cmp: 84; att: 161; yds: 1033; cmp%: 52.2; ypa: 6.42; lng: 59; td: 6; int: 6; sacks:12; rating: 69.2

Sage Rosenfels 6'4" 225
cmp: 81; att: 148; yds: 1041; cmp%: 54.7; ypa: 7.03; lng: 77; td: 9; int: 7; sacks: 4; rating: 77.6

This was what came up when I did a player search on espn.com. If I was Sage I would be on a hotline to my agent cursing him.

Yea I'd love to hear that call, would go like this...

Sage: WTF, I'm a better QB and he is starting and I didn't even get more money.

Agent: Sage, calm down...

Sage: CALM DOWN! I got shafted.

Agent: Sage, we have been over this before.

Sage: We have not, the even had me thinking I was the new starter.

Agent: Sage, I meant in Miami to name one team.

Sage: What about Miami, this is Houston.

Agent: Yea, and they know you couldn't make the starters spot on that team.

Sage: What are you saying?

Agent: That your a good backup. But, this guy Schaub is younger and more talented than you.

Sage: Says who?

Agent: Many...plus Houston knows you couldn't beat out A.J. or...

Sage: Ok,ok... I got it, I don't have the ability.

Agent: Right, this kid is younger and most in the NFL feel better a top 15 QB. They don't think you are one, and so far they are right.

Sage: Yea, maybe I should just be glad I have a job.

Agent: Thats right Sage... I'll talk to you soon.

Hangs up, and thinks to self
* The NFL thinks Schaub is a legit QB and my guy can't beat out bad QBs and he feels he should start. I need to drop this guy, I don't need the headache every year he fails to win a starting job*

Hervoyel
03-25-2007, 11:10 PM
in my opinion, r.bush wouldn't have lived up to the hype if he came to houston. the same goes for v.young. the texans were complete and utter **** coming into the 2006 season.

I was very much against drafting Vince Young last year (and obviously very wrong) and so I'm going to say that (in hindsight) I disagree with the part of your post that I put in bold.

Vince Young surprised a large number of people and, truth be told the Titans were pretty much "complete and utter ****" too before he took the field. No he didn't play defense or any of the other stuff that's brought up to illustrate that he wasn't responsibile for their turnaround but I have eyes and I see a leader who elevates the play of people around him. That's special and I'm now sorry that we all didn't make the pressure a little heavier on the Texans last season. It probably wouldn't have made much difference but still, he should be here playing QB.

Sco-tai
03-25-2007, 11:59 PM
Am I the only one that is a bit curious as to the title of this thread.

So...Lork...are you the Aggravated Texan...and the front office would be the fools. Or are Carr & Davis/Williams the fools...and the F.O would represent the Aggravated Texan.

Your article wasn't very A.D.D friendly...but I made it. Yet I still found no answers as to how your title fits the content.

I'm having a blonde-moment, I suppose. Thanks in advance.

:victory:

Marcus
03-26-2007, 12:13 AM
I was very much against drafting Vince Young last year (and obviously very wrong) and so I'm going to say that (in hindsight) I disagree with the part of your post that I put in bold.

Vince Young surprised a large number of people and, truth be told the Titans were pretty much "complete and utter ****" too before he took the field. No he didn't play defense or any of the other stuff that's brought up to illustrate that he wasn't responsibile for their turnaround but I have eyes and I see a leader who elevates the play of people around him. That's special and I'm now sorry that we all didn't make the pressure a little heavier on the Texans last season. It probably wouldn't have made much difference but still, he should be here playing QB.

Next to kidnapping Bob McNair's family and telling him he would never see them alive again if he didn't draft Vince, I didn't see how the pressure could have been heavier. McNair's mind was made up.

LORK 88
03-26-2007, 01:46 AM
Am I the only one that is a bit curious as to the title of this thread.

So...Lork...are you the Aggravated Texan...and the front office would be the fools. Or are Carr & Davis/Williams the fools...and the F.O would represent the Aggravated Texan.

Your article wasn't very A.D.D friendly...but I made it. Yet I still found no answers as to how your title fits the content.

I'm having a blonde-moment, I suppose. Thanks in advance.

:victory:
Its a play off Jonathan Edward's "Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God". I am the aggrivated Texan and the fools are represented well by the media and everyone who decides to misjudge what has transpired the past week and mock us rather than take the time to understand why we did what we did.

swtbound07
03-26-2007, 02:54 AM
If I am reading this right it seems to me that you are not the only person who thinks that Carr has been treated unfairly, I will miss him with all my heat. Everytime I think of the Texans I think of Carr. This is one Carr fan who will be watching him if "no, where ever" he goes

....not that there is anything wrong with that. All your "heat"? Does mrs. carr know about your bond?

TexanExile
03-26-2007, 08:20 AM
These are the cold hard facts that we gave too much.

Matt Schaub 6'5" 237
cmp: 84; att: 161; yds: 1033; cmp%: 52.2; ypa: 6.42; lng: 59; td: 6; int: 6; sacks:12; rating: 69.2

Sage Rosenfels 6'4" 225
cmp: 81; att: 148; yds: 1041; cmp%: 54.7; ypa: 7.03; lng: 77; td: 9; int: 7; sacks: 4; rating: 77.6



Interesting point, but not exactly the whole story. The guy Schaub couldn't beat out of a job is a gazillion-dollar-contract media darling who inexplicably gets a pass for everything he does poorly on the field. Atlanta can't possibly admit the Vick experiment's failure yet. Rosenfels, on the other hand, couldn't beat out the following QBs, including several SECOND-stringers, who had no such protection from getting benched: Jay Fiedler, AJ Feeley, Gus Frerotte, Brian Griese, and Ray Lucas.

I gotta think "potential" is measured with a few more variables than you listed there. But yeah, the straight-stats comparison is interesting to look at. I think the Texans paid fair market value and can't wait to see whether we're all right or wrong here.

HuttoKarl
03-26-2007, 08:25 AM
Interesting point, but not exactly the whole story. The guy Schaub couldn't beat out of a job is a gazillion-dollar-contract media darling who inexplicably gets a pass for everything he does poorly on the field. Atlanta can't possibly admit the Vick experiment's failure yet. Rosenfels, on the other hand, couldn't beat out the following QBs, including several SECOND-stringers, who had no such protection from getting benched: Jay Fiedler, AJ Feeley, Gus Frerotte, Brian Griese, and Ray Lucas.

I gotta think "potential" is measured with a few more variables than you listed there. But yeah, the straight-stats comparison is interesting to look at. I think the Texans paid fair market value and can't wait to see whether we're all right or wrong here.

You forgot "David Carr". :)

thunderkyss
03-26-2007, 11:46 AM
These are the cold hard facts that we gave too much.

Matt Schaub 6'5" 237
cmp: 84; att: 161; yds: 1033; cmp%: 52.2; ypa: 6.42; lng: 59; td: 6; int: 6; sacks:12; rating: 69.2

Sage Rosenfels 6'4" 225
cmp: 81; att: 148; yds: 1041; cmp%: 54.7; ypa: 7.03; lng: 77; td: 9; int: 7; sacks: 4; rating: 77.6

This was what came up when I did a player search on espn.com. If I was Sage I would be on a hotline to my agent cursing him.

I honestly don't think we could have paid too much at all. While I agree, we know more about Sage on our team, than we do about Schaub..... & Sage may be every bit as good(maybe even better). & we paid a lot less for Sage, than we did for Schaub.

But we got rid of David. I'd give up our remaining picks in '07 & '08 to be able to say that, if I had to.

Think about it. Rick Smith & Gary Kubiak were ready to deal David for a 5th..... of Whiskey. Then McNair got into the mix, and all of a sudden, we had to find a better option.

I think Kubiak sold McNair on Plummer being that "better option" but Shanahan screwed us(I think we should demote little Shanahan to Ice Machine Supervisor).

So now what??

I don't think Kubiak would have had a problem going with Sage & Drew Stanton(or Kevin Kolb) in '07, but McNair wasn't having it. But he bought Matt Schaub, and Kubiak & Smith moved quickly, silently, and surely.

If David couldn't get the job done in '06... I had no problem with Kubiak going with Sage. After what I saw in the preseason, I had no doubt that Sage would be as good as David(not saying much) & most likely better. That our season wouldn't be lost, if David got hurt.

I feel the same way now.

Oh, I'll be upset, if we end up cutting Schaub, or realize he is at best a back-up. But at least I know the best QB will start on Sunday, and not the one we hope will someday be the best QB we got.

big sarge
03-26-2007, 06:25 PM
The title of this thread was did we overpay for Schaub???? I personally think we did. I am not saying he will never come to fruit, but that would be like buying the first car u see on the lot because everyone says it has a pretty paint job and they saw it on the road a few times. I was merely making a point that according to his performance, and lack of experience we overpaid. I didn't hear anyone talking about how Rosenfels lost out to crappy QB's when they wanted to bench Carr and put him in.

Basically alot of people think Carr was a crappy QB. He showed exactly that on the field. Schaub maybe the answer to the question in Houston, but I still think we overpaid for him. I wish Sage and Schaub and Carr the best and I hope they all get a chance to prove themselves.

texansfanquecaneh
03-26-2007, 09:50 PM
Great post. I like what you said.
Tough to say if we overpaid for Schaub, but we needed a QB. I was thinking of the defense & Kalil this year, blue chip LT next year. If the GM thought the same, we wouldn't pick a QB until 2009 & then have him sit a year. Obviously they weren't going to wait that long-that's why they made the trade.
My concerns are (the lack of a real) C, having to draft a WR because of releasing Moulds (I wasn't expecting that)-with one less pick, and giving up a pick next year in a loaded draft.
But, I guess it's still better than waiting 4 years for a QB.

Sco-tai
03-27-2007, 08:28 AM
Its a play off Jonathan Edward's "Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God". I am the aggrivated Texan and the fools are represented well by the media and everyone who decides to misjudge what has transpired the past week and mock us rather than take the time to understand why we did what we did.

Yeah, I got the reference, I was just trying to figure out how you were relating it to the Texans and who made who (to reference AC/DC...hehe).

Thanks.

Texan_Bill
03-27-2007, 08:36 AM
Thank You!!! Great post!!

Rep your way.

texans83
03-27-2007, 09:27 AM
I did it, read it all!! thanks for the good post.