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View Full Version : Would Schaub be better than a Qb in 2nd round?


Wolf
03-23-2007, 06:23 PM
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfldraft/draft/tracker/position?draftyear=2007&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl draft%2fdraft%2ftracker%2fposition%3fdraftyear%3d2 007

Link is off all QB's listed in draft by ESPiN

who possibly could have been available in 2nd round (what we gave up this year)and would they have been a better prospect than what Schaub is?

Ole Miss Texan
03-23-2007, 06:26 PM
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfldraft/draft/tracker/position?draftyear=2007&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl draft%2fdraft%2ftracker%2fposition%3fdraftyear%3d2 007

Link is off all QB's listed in draft by ESPiN

who possibly could have been available in 2nd round (what we gave up this year)and would they have been a better prospect than what Schaub is?

Drew Stanton, Kevin Kolb, Trent Edwards, John Beck, Troy Smith...etc.

i'd take schaub over all of these guys...they'd all have to wait 2 years...scaub has been studying for 3 years already in a wco system and has more upside than any of these qb's...scouts/nfl personal all say he is going to be very good...these rookies have a lot more ?'s. thats what the 2nd rd pick next year was for...less risk than these and immediate results.

i used to think it was a lot but i think it was a great trade.

grahamcracker977
03-23-2007, 06:28 PM
Agreed, we got the best deal available...a qb with three years seasoning who can start immediately...

Vinny
03-23-2007, 06:30 PM
Schaub will have 4 NFL training camps under his belt come spring....all in the wco offense. If we draft a QB we have 2 to 3 years to wait to groom him as he learns the nuances of NFL defenses. After this Carr fiasco I much prefer to get on with life in the NFL with a young Vet like Schaub.

Wolf
03-23-2007, 06:31 PM
Schaub will have 4 NFL training camps under his belt come spring....all in the wco offense. If we draft a QB we have 2 to 3 years to wait to groom him as he learns the nuances of NFL defenses. After this Carr fiasco I much prefer to get on with life in the NFL with a young Vet like Schaub.

Very true

Nawzer
03-23-2007, 06:41 PM
Well the Texans obviously seems to think so. I think Schaub with the knowledge and exeperience he has playing in this type of system will be much better than any 2nd round qb we would've drafted.

thunderkyss
03-23-2007, 11:32 PM
Schaub will have 4 NFL training camps under his belt come spring....all in the wco offense. If we draft a QB we have 2 to 3 years to wait to groom him as he learns the nuances of NFL defenses. After this Carr fiasco I much prefer to get on with life in the NFL with a young Vet like Schaub.

All in a WCO, with a ZBS in place.

threetoedpete
03-23-2007, 11:58 PM
I just love the way you guys are throwing away that second eight pick on all of your analysis on the Scaub factor. Lowering the cost. Like little boys who've been caught with the cookies on the counter and the cookie jar lid open and granny just made the door jam, you're tring to shovel the cookies back behind the jar. We got caught and we got caught bad.

You can spin it any which way you want. We just over paid for Chriss Chandler...nothing more. And, you've put him behind an aged bad line. It's not going to hurt this draft. It's realy going to sting in '08. Quinn and Russel will be better QBs three years from now than Schaub. Can't make the same statement
about the second teird guys. So throw away the top five pick in the second in '08, considering the choices at the 39, yeah you got prety good value there....for three years. You can have your cookies and milk now. Granny just smiled. Or was that the Atlanta front office.

kiwitexansfan
03-24-2007, 05:17 AM
There is no telling what Quinn and Russell are going to bring to the NFL.

Russell is condisered to have a significant bust factor with what is considered to be a slack attitude and Quinn is considered to not be able to step things up in big games.

There is more than one highly touted QB to fail miserably. Many would say that we just got rid of one ourselves.

I think the time to assess whether the 2008 #2 was thrown away needlessly is not now, possibly not even in 2008 but in a couple of years when we can see how far we have come with Schaub under centre.

We might have the second coming of Chris Chandler, or it could be Steve Young or it could be Ryan Leaf (dread the thought) fact is no one can no for sure, we haven't seen enough of Schaub and we have never seen Schaub in a Texans uniform playing in the Texans scheme.

Schaub was the best option we knew we could get right away and we made a decisive, big-stoned move. I like that kind of front office leadership.

whiskeyrbl
03-24-2007, 06:41 AM
I agree he was the best option for now. He has been in a WCO for the last 6 years counting college. Also he has been under Alex Gibbs whom Kubiak coached with in Denver so the systems are practically identical. Kubes even said the terminology is the same or similar so he comes in with a fairly good knowledge of what we are running, unlike a QB that would be considered in the draft this year.

HuttoKarl
03-24-2007, 06:51 AM
I just love the way you guys are throwing away that second eight pick on all of your analysis on the Scaub factor. Lowering the cost. Like little boys who've been caught with the cookies on the counter and the cookie jar lid open and granny just made the door jam, you're tring to shovel the cookies back behind the jar. We got caught and we got caught bad.

You can spin it any which way you want. We just over paid for Chriss Chandler...nothing more. And, you've put him behind an aged bad line. It's not going to hurt this draft. It's realy going to sting in '08. Quinn and Russel will be better QBs three years from now than Schaub. Can't make the same statement
about the second teird guys. So throw away the top five pick in the second in '08, considering the choices at the 39, yeah you got prety good value there....for three years. You can have your cookies and milk now. Granny just smiled. Or was that the Atlanta front office.


Were you a Carr Lover or Carr Hater?

Was that second rounder next year going to be Gaffney, Joppru or Ryans?

We did better by getting Schaub, who NFL teams across the board feel is ready to be a starter. The only reason he wasn't is because some owner OVERPAID for Mike Vick.

Honoring Earl 34
03-24-2007, 08:51 AM
There is no telling what Quinn and Russell are going to bring to the NFL.

Russell is condisered to have a significant bust factor with what is considered to be a slack attitude and Quinn is considered to not be able to step things up in big games.

There is more than one highly touted QB to fail miserably. Many would say that we just got rid of one ourselves.

I think the time to assess whether the 2008 #2 was thrown away needlessly is not now, possibly not even in 2008 but in a couple of years when we can see how far we have come with Schaub under centre.

We might have the second coming of Chris Chandler, or it could be Steve Young or it could be Ryan Leaf (dread the thought) fact is no one can no for sure, we haven't seen enough of Schaub and we have never seen Schaub in a Texans uniform playing in the Texans scheme.

Schaub was the best option we knew we could get right away and we made a decisive, big-stoned move. I like that kind of front office leadership.

Pete is really Dale from King of the Hill .

rickyb
03-24-2007, 09:17 AM
I just love the way you guys are throwing away that second eight pick on all of your analysis on the Scaub factor. Lowering the cost. Like little boys who've been caught with the cookies on the counter and the cookie jar lid open and granny just made the door jam, you're tring to shovel the cookies back behind the jar. We got caught and we got caught bad.

You can spin it any which way you want. We just over paid for Chriss Chandler...nothing more. And, you've put him behind an aged bad line. It's not going to hurt this draft. It's realy going to sting in '08. Quinn and Russel will be better QBs three years from now than Schaub. Can't make the same statement
about the second teird guys. So throw away the top five pick in the second in '08, considering the choices at the 39, yeah you got prety good value there....for three years. You can have your cookies and milk now. Granny just smiled. Or was that the Atlanta front office.

Only time will tell. Your crystall ball must be a little clearer than mine. :)

Please_Evolve
03-24-2007, 12:41 PM
The question should be the other way around. What second round QB would be better then Schaub?

IMO the bigger gamble is on the ATL front office. A Rookie headcoach who is debating turning over play calling duties to Mike Vick. Yeah i'd need two seconds for that gamble too.

Oldbird69
03-24-2007, 01:26 PM
Schaub is going to be a very good QB in your system. I wish we could have given you Vick we had kept Matt.

NederlandTexan
03-24-2007, 01:36 PM
I just love the way you guys are throwing away that second eight pick on all of your analysis on the Scaub factor. Lowering the cost. Like little boys who've been caught with the cookies on the counter and the cookie jar lid open and granny just made the door jam, you're tring to shovel the cookies back behind the jar. We got caught and we got caught bad.

You can spin it any which way you want. We just over paid for Chriss Chandler...nothing more. And, you've put him behind an aged bad line. It's not going to hurt this draft. It's realy going to sting in '08. Quinn and Russel will be better QBs three years from now than Schaub. Can't make the same statement
about the second teird guys. So throw away the top five pick in the second in '08, considering the choices at the 39, yeah you got prety good value there....for three years. You can have your cookies and milk now. Granny just smiled. Or was that the Atlanta front office.

Here's some spin, since this was a trade and we all have access to trade value charts, the real question becomes...Is Matt Schaub worth a mid-late first round pick? http://www.thehuddlereport.com/nickelpackage/tradechart.shtml
Now enlighten us about the studs we have passed over in the '08 draft.

playa465
03-24-2007, 04:18 PM
I'm sure Schaub (today) would be better than a 2nd round QB pick....He has limited NFL experience, so at least he has some aspect of what to expect...I just don't like the fact we gave up next year's 2nd rd pick....for all those that say thats basically all we gave up IF we were to take a QB in this years 2nd rd or even from a production stand point that Schaub will outperform any 2nd rd pick this year, I have a distinct difference....No 2nd rd pick would have ever received the money that Schaub is getting...you can say its on par for a starting QB but thats not the point..we are talking about the the 2nd round picks vs Schaub...I hope the team does better otherwise its gonna stink reallll bad

thunderkyss
03-24-2007, 04:23 PM
I just love the way you guys are throwing away that second eight pick on all of your analysis on the Scaub factor. Lowering the cost. Like little boys who've been caught with the cookies on the counter and the cookie jar lid open and granny just made the door jam, you're tring to shovel the cookies back behind the jar. We got caught and we got caught bad.

I think most of us are saying we need to see how Schaub handles the starting job in '07 before we can say next year's 2nd round pick was too much.

If there is no ifs &s or buts about it, if you agree that Schaub should be our starter in '08, would you think we gave up too much to get him??

kastofsna
03-24-2007, 04:37 PM
I just love the way you guys are throwing away that second eight pick on all of your analysis on the Scaub factor. Lowering the cost. Like little boys who've been caught with the cookies on the counter and the cookie jar lid open and granny just made the door jam, you're tring to shovel the cookies back behind the jar. We got caught and we got caught bad.

You can spin it any which way you want. We just over paid for Chriss Chandler...nothing more. And, you've put him behind an aged bad line. It's not going to hurt this draft. It's realy going to sting in '08. Quinn and Russel will be better QBs three years from now than Schaub. Can't make the same statement
about the second teird guys. So throw away the top five pick in the second in '08, considering the choices at the 39, yeah you got prety good value there....for three years. You can have your cookies and milk now. Granny just smiled. Or was that the Atlanta front office.
schaub was a backup because of the starter in front of him. think more steve young in san francisco than anything else.

NederlandTexan
03-24-2007, 04:42 PM
....No 2nd rd pick would have ever received the money that Schaub is getting...you can say its on par for a starting QB but thats not the point..

Please do some reading on professional contracts, or read some of the other posts that explain them. We didn't break the bank to sign Schaub.

beerlover
03-24-2007, 05:02 PM
honestly I had considered a trade up to the 1st rd. to secure a QB (considering the need) but anyone available certainly would have to be a stretch. Schuab fits that bill however, so even though I'm not happy & have a hard time dealing with a little ball of hate well'ed up in my chest towards the Texans right now, to trade up into the first rd. (late 20's) would cost us about what we paid. a high price indeed but thats what you get for poor planning & projecting wrong lets just hope he turns out better than Babin :yikes:

playa465
03-24-2007, 05:57 PM
Please do some reading on professional contracts, or read some of the other posts that explain them. We didn't break the bank to sign Schaub.

where did I say the bank was broken? I know the terms of the deal and I still say no 2nd rd draft pick would sign their 1st contract for the amount of money Schaub gets...this aint a debate on contracts...the topic asked a question and I answered with more insight

keyfro
03-24-2007, 06:15 PM
is schaub better than any of the QB's that would be available in round 2...only time will tell but here is why i think we did the deal

kubiak knows this city and the team is tired of building towards a winning season...so he went out and got a guy he considered a long-term answer at the QB position who he wouldn't have to bring up slowly

any of the rookie QB's he would have to bring up slowly...and remember he did wait and decided on this after brady quinn's pro day...obviously jamarcus russell was never in the picture because i believe kubiak know's al davis well enough to know he's not gonna pass up on russell...then i believe kubiak realized there was no point in doing a draft day trade to get up to take quinn...quinn was the only rookie QB he could start this year and there not be a huge learning curve

kolb, smith, and stanton all had way too many mechanical and mental areas that he would have to develop

so he made the decision so that the team could be expected to win now and in the future instead of waiting on a rookie to develop

painekiller
03-25-2007, 06:20 PM
Drew Stanton, Kevin Kolb, Trent Edwards, John Beck, Troy Smith...etc.

i'd take schaub over all of these guys...they'd all have to wait 2 years...scaub has been studying for 3 years already in a wco system and has more upside than any of these qb's...scouts/nfl personal all say he is going to be very good...these rookies have a lot more ?'s. thats what the 2nd rd pick next year was for...less risk than these and immediate results.

i used to think it was a lot but i think it was a great trade.

Schaub also played in the WCO in college. His college coach and last position coach at Atlanta was Bill Musgrave, who played for Kubaik in SF and Denver. I would bet Kubaik and Musgrave talked.

MATRIX
03-25-2007, 06:52 PM
In Street & Smith only Troy Smith is listed as a 2nd RD pick.

And yes, Schaub is better.

Stanton is a 3rd pick and Kolb is a 4th same with Beck.

Navy_Chris
03-25-2007, 06:55 PM
Matt Schaub is hands down better than a 2nd round QB. He'd be a household name already if he hadn't been drafted by a team with Michael Vick. Eli and Philip have gotten their chances already to prove what they can do. Now it's Matt's turn.

kastofsna
03-25-2007, 08:14 PM
stanton is without a doubt a 2nd rounder. and i expect miami to draft kolb with their 2nd second rounder.

Wolf
03-25-2007, 08:23 PM
stanton is without a doubt a 2nd rounder. and i expect miami to draft kolb with their 2nd second rounder.

what do you feel about this kid (don't watch much college ball except bowl games)


Word around the football world is former Stanford quarterback Trent Edwards is a prospect that might really surprise people on draft day. After finally getting healthy and displaying his considerable skills at Pro Day recently, he is picking up some serious momentum leading up to the draft. We know, for a fact, that some respected N.F.L. execs and coaches have privately suggested Edwards might not make it to the 2nd round after his great workout last Wednesday. Even if he isn't selected in round one, just about everyone we've talked to thinks he's a virtual lock to be picked in the top two rounds.

At the Combine, Trent had 14 team interview requests, which is extremely high. He possesses prototype qualities - Size (6042, 231 at the Combine, 10.5 inch hands), speed (4.70 at his pro day), strength (19 bench reps at the Combine despite being very ill and not sleeping from the flu), intelligence (he has a degree from Stanford), toughness (he was hit as much as any QB over 4 seasons starting), character (teams have said his interviews were amongst the best) and build (he and Brady Quinn are in the "freak" category for QBs). Scouts love his arm strength, unusually quick release and footwork. Matter of fact, Bill Walsh, perhaps the greatest offensive football mind ever, has said that Edwards has the best footwork and overall mechanics of any college quarterback he's seen since Joe Montana!

Edwards and Vince Young were the top two quarteback recruits in their class coming out of high school, so this isn't a player that just suddenly appeared on the scene. N.F.L. scouts have been watching him since the moment he arrived at Stanford. The only reason he isn't widely talked about at the top of the draft is because Stanford's struggling teams during his four seasons starting, and because he missed the second half of 2006 with a small broken bone in his foot. No surgery was required, but he didn't recover in time to play in the Senior Bowl or Shrine Game.

Edwards' Pro Day was attended by over 30 N.F.L. personnel, including Mike Martz (Detroit OC), Rick Neuheisel (Baltimore QBs), Dick Curl (Kansas City QBs) and Mike McCoy (Carolina QBs). All the teams listed above are in need of a young, talented quarterback. Out of roughly 60 passes he threw at Pro Day, he missed narrowly on 3 and had some drops due to velocity. He ran on Astroturf but threw on grass, and it rained constantly. Overall, it's tough for a quarterbacks to look better in a workout, so he should only generate stronger admirers as this process continues. He has private workouts scheduled with 4 additional teams

http://www.draftdaddy.com/blog/blog.cfm

Sco-tai
03-25-2007, 09:44 PM
With so many teams having question marks around the QB position I wouldn't be a bit surprised to see Edwards, KOLB, Stanton and maybe even Smith taken by the top of the 3rd.

Some have the Ravens taking KOLB in the 1st...but I think that's a bit high.
However, where you had QB's dropping below where you expected in 2006...I think this year could be the opposite.

:poker:

MATRIX
03-25-2007, 11:42 PM
stanton is without a doubt a 2nd rounder. and i expect miami to draft kolb with their 2nd second rounder.



I agree about Stanton...but Kolb can be had in the 3rd or 4th. The report on him is:
Source- Street & Smith

8th best QB in this draft.
6-2 7/8 220

Strong points: Good football IQ and good size.Makes plays under pressure and rush. Stays in pocket. Dose not flush easily. Will stand in pocket w/ people in his face. A take charge guy who normaly makes positive plays. Natural feel and awareness to slide and adjust in the pocket. A sixth sence in the pocket. Anticipates and times throws. Good vision, quick set up to throwing point. Steps toward the target. Can throw the ball on the run.

Weak points: Throws too much horizontal than vertical.Has been in one system from HS to Coll. could be a product of system. Low release point. Several passes batted down. Forced to throw into coverage at times, and made bad judgment.

Overall: Solid pick, but nothing stands out. Many teams think he is a product of the system as his HS coach is his Coll. coach. Must learn to throw vertical better. Should go in round 4 or high in 5th.

kastofsna
03-26-2007, 06:36 AM
you can't call any one player a definite lock for any round based on one scouting report. miami loves kolb, and i don't think they let him fall past #70.