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Big Ben Wallets
03-11-2007, 09:07 PM
Hello Bears fan here. I haven't seen too many Texans games over the years, because, quite frankly, they are never on national TV. But I'm hearing rumors that the front office wants to trade Carr. I know his development has plateaued recently...

but my question is, isn't Carr better than everything else on the market? I seriously thought Carr would fit perfectly into Gary Kubiak's West Coast offense. Am I way off base, but doesn't Carr have good mobility, which is a prerequisite in the Denver style of offense?

Anyways can somebody give me a quick scouting report on Carr. What are some of his strengths and weaknesses, and more importantly, why is Houston convinced he's not a franchise QB? Thanks.

Ryan
03-11-2007, 09:17 PM
To put it in simple words, how about a trade?

Rex Grossman for David Carr straight up.


No i'm kidding.

TheRealJoker
03-11-2007, 09:18 PM
He's the next best thing after Peyton/Brady imo. Prolly better behind the Bears ol.

If the Bears were smart they'd give up their entire draft and half their starting defense to get this gem.

gtexan02
03-11-2007, 09:18 PM
Haha look at any thread on this entire messageboard and i guarantee you'll see some scouting reports of Carr.

Heres the quick rundown:

The Good: Carr is a nice person with good morals who doesn't get into trouble. He gets sacked a lot and keeps on playing. He's tough. He has a great QB physique, meaning he's strong, tall, and can throw the ball a long way. He is quick on his feet, and when he decides to run, he can get big chunks of yards. He is very accurate within 10 yards of the LOS, completing 70% of his passes. He is careful about throwing interceptions, and doesn't make risky throws, thus protecting the ball.

The Bad:
Carr loses a lot of his accuracy on deep balls, and is afraid to throw over the middle. He doesn't feel pressure in the pocket well, and instead of stepping up to avoid the edge rushers he runs out of the pocket. He often forgets to throw the ball away and runs out of bounds or takes the sack. He picks the receiver he is going to throw to, locks on, and has trouble looking anwywhere else. He is not a leader in the lockeroom. He has become used to losing, and it doesnt bother him anymore.

The Ugly- He has horrible footwork, that is so bad he tripped over his own OL at least 3-5 times this year. he cannot hang on to the ball when being sacked, and fumbled an incredible amount this year. He is so shell shocked from being sacked that sometimes if a big DL breaks the LOS, he crumples to the ground and gets into the fetal position BEFORE the guy even gets close to him. He is terrible in the red zone, throwing for only 11 TDs the entire year. He is so careful with the football that he won't throw it into coverage unless he absoultely has to. As such, 99% of his passes are within 5 yards of the LOS.

Basically, Carr has a lot of talent and God given ability, but has been developed so poorly that he will never utilize it. He is not a winner at heart, and despite his great image and morals, he cannot lead this football team because they don't believe in him. The coach doesn't trust him, and Carr doesn't trust himself.

Big Ben Wallets
03-11-2007, 09:25 PM
Haha look at any thread on this entire messageboard and i guarantee you'll see some scouting reports of Carr.

Heres the quick rundown:

The Good: Carr is a nice person with good morals who doesn't get into trouble. He gets sacked a lot and keeps on playing. He's tough. He has a great QB physique, meaning he's strong, tall, and can throw the ball a long way. He is quick on his feet, and when he decides to run, he can get big chunks of yards. He is very accurate within 10 yards of the LOS, completing 70% of his passes. He is careful about throwing interceptions, and doesn't make risky throws, thus protecting the ball.

The Bad:
Carr loses a lot of his accuracy on deep balls, and is afraid to throw over the middle. He doesn't feel pressure in the pocket well, and instead of stepping up to avoid the edge rushers he runs out of the pocket. He often forgets to throw the ball away and runs out of bounds or takes the sack. He picks the receiver he is going to throw to, locks on, and has trouble looking anwywhere else. He is not a leader in the lockeroom. He has become used to losing, and it doesnt bother him anymore.

The Ugly- He has horrible footwork, that is so bad he tripped over his own OL at least 3-5 times this year. he cannot hang on to the ball when being sacked, and fumbled an incredible amount this year. He is so shell shocked from being sacked that sometimes if a big DL breaks the LOS, he crumples to the ground and gets into the fetal position BEFORE the guy even gets close to him. He is terrible in the red zone, throwing for only 11 TDs the entire year. He is so careful with the football that he won't throw it into coverage unless he absoultely has to. As such, 99% of his passes are within 5 yards of the LOS.

Basically, Carr has a lot of talent and God given ability, but has been developed so poorly that he will never utilize it. He is not a winner at heart, and despite his great image and morals, he cannot lead this football team because they don't believe in him.

Thanks for the honest assessment. From what I see he has a huge arm and good accuracy. Well, at least that's the impression I got from playing fantasy football. For some reason it seems whenever Carr's about to break out, he takes a couple steps back. Like he'll string together a couple of great games with no bone-headed mistakes (INTs, TOs), then the next week he gets yanked for the backup. I'm so confused.

Anyways we have our hands full in Chicago with FedRex. When he throws the ball we have no idea where it is going. Plus he can't move laterally in the face of a rush, only straight back. It's depressing, but at least our defense is alright.

Good luck with the Carr thing, I hope he gets another shot. You're right, he had some bad coaching because the same guy who ruined Tim Couch's career almost ruined Carr's. I'm talking about Chris Palmer. Who in their right mind installs a vertical passing offense on an expansion team?

threetoedpete
03-11-2007, 09:40 PM
Hello Bears fan here. I haven't seen too many Texans games over the years, because, quite frankly, they are never on national TV. But I'm hearing rumors that the front office wants to trade Carr. I know his development has plateaued recently...

but my question is, isn't Carr better than everything else on the market? I seriously thought Carr would fit perfectly into Gary Kubiak's West Coast offense. Am I way off base, but doesn't Carr have good mobility, which is a prerequisite in the Denver style of offense?

Anyways can somebody give me a quick scouting report on Carr. What are some of his strengths and weaknesses, and more importantly, why is Houston convinced he's not a franchise QB? Thanks.

He'd be an upgrade over Rex if that is what you're sniffing around the edges about. Look go to the search thread tools above and punch up David Carr. Don't have to check them all out . But look at the number and size of them. He has had a lack of progression for sure. Coupled with the fact the franchise passed over Reggie Bush and the Local favorite.... and some folks went balistic and have lost all hope of ever redeeming him.

Breif synopsis. He's Steve Young lite. He needs a change of senery and a decent , not great, offensive line. He's been sacked and banged so much over the last five years he's hearing foot steps now when there are none there. The New England game last year was the abysis. Just go read the game day log on NFL.com. I thought Kubes was going to have a stroke right there on the sidelines. MHO, someone is going to scrap him off the waiver pile and end up with a gem in a couple of years. I wouldn't at all be shocked if David Carr makes the super bowl befor the Texans do.

texansfan1974
03-11-2007, 09:41 PM
Haha look at any thread on this entire messageboard and i guarantee you'll see some scouting reports of Carr.

Heres the quick rundown:

The Good: Carr is a nice person with good morals who doesn't get into trouble. He gets sacked a lot and keeps on playing. He's tough. He has a great QB physique, meaning he's strong, tall, and can throw the ball a long way. He is quick on his feet, and when he decides to run, he can get big chunks of yards. He is very accurate within 10 yards of the LOS, completing 70% of his passes. He is careful about throwing interceptions, and doesn't make risky throws, thus protecting the ball.

The Bad:
Carr loses a lot of his accuracy on deep balls, and is afraid to throw over the middle. He doesn't feel pressure in the pocket well, and instead of stepping up to avoid the edge rushers he runs out of the pocket. He often forgets to throw the ball away and runs out of bounds or takes the sack. He picks the receiver he is going to throw to, locks on, and has trouble looking anwywhere else. He is not a leader in the lockeroom. He has become used to losing, and it doesnt bother him anymore.

The Ugly- He has horrible footwork, that is so bad he tripped over his own OL at least 3-5 times this year. he cannot hang on to the ball when being sacked, and fumbled an incredible amount this year. He is so shell shocked from being sacked that sometimes if a big DL breaks the LOS, he crumples to the ground and gets into the fetal position BEFORE the guy even gets close to him. He is terrible in the red zone, throwing for only 11 TDs the entire year. He is so careful with the football that he won't throw it into coverage unless he absoultely has to. As such, 99% of his passes are within 5 yards of the LOS.

Basically, Carr has a lot of talent and God given ability, but has been developed so poorly that he will never utilize it. He is not a winner at heart, and despite his great image and morals, he cannot lead this football team because they don't believe in him. The coach doesn't trust him, and Carr doesn't trust himself.

I agree, no one has said it better about DC. The only thing I disagree with is that "he is not a winner at heart". I feel he could be a winner and lead a team to the promise land. Just not here in Houston and he needs to trust himself. I know that will be hard to do, but I do wish him luck if he stays here or were ever he goes.

Ole Miss Texan
03-11-2007, 09:41 PM
Haha look at any thread on this entire messageboard and i guarantee you'll see some scouting reports of Carr.

Heres the quick rundown:

The Good: Carr is a nice person with good morals who doesn't get into trouble. He gets sacked a lot and keeps on playing. He's tough. He has a great QB physique, meaning he's strong, tall, and can throw the ball a long way. He is quick on his feet, and when he decides to run, he can get big chunks of yards. He is very accurate within 10 yards of the LOS, completing 70% of his passes. He is careful about throwing interceptions, and doesn't make risky throws, thus protecting the ball.

The Bad:
Carr loses a lot of his accuracy on deep balls, and is afraid to throw over the middle. He doesn't feel pressure in the pocket well, and instead of stepping up to avoid the edge rushers he runs out of the pocket. He often forgets to throw the ball away and runs out of bounds or takes the sack. He picks the receiver he is going to throw to, locks on, and has trouble looking anwywhere else. He is not a leader in the lockeroom. He has become used to losing, and it doesnt bother him anymore.

The Ugly- He has horrible footwork, that is so bad he tripped over his own OL at least 3-5 times this year. he cannot hang on to the ball when being sacked, and fumbled an incredible amount this year. He is so shell shocked from being sacked that sometimes if a big DL breaks the LOS, he crumples to the ground and gets into the fetal position BEFORE the guy even gets close to him. He is terrible in the red zone, throwing for only 11 TDs the entire year. He is so careful with the football that he won't throw it into coverage unless he absoultely has to. As such, 99% of his passes are within 5 yards of the LOS.

Basically, Carr has a lot of talent and God given ability, but has been developed so poorly that he will never utilize it. He is not a winner at heart, and despite his great image and morals, he cannot lead this football team because they don't believe in him. The coach doesn't trust him, and Carr doesn't trust himself.

I'd say that is a very fare assessment on Carr. I loved the good, the bad, and the ugle titles...

but gtexan you forgot one thing and this is very important. Carr sometimes has this mindset that he doesn't have to abide by ALL the rules. For example one game (i forget which one..?) Carr was penalized twice...for throwing the ball when he was past the line of scrimmage.

Now I can undestand doing that once..and you're like aah i can't believe i did that..because he was pressured so much...but if i did it again..in the same game! i'd be like....ahh i can't believe i'm really that retarded!

Ole Miss Texan
03-11-2007, 09:44 PM
Oh sorry about Rex Grossman by the way. I'm not trying to be a jerk or anything at all, but he's one of my least favorite players..well qb's.

I think if y'all somehow got Eli Manning...the Bears would be my favorite NFC team hands down and probably my 2nd fav. team overall. David Carr could do well there maybe...i'd like to see him go to a good team.

How bout a trade of David Carr for Muhsin Muhammid? Y'all need a better QB (carr's better imo but not everyones!) and we need a #2 receiver.

Tulip
03-11-2007, 09:46 PM
I think your overall impression is accurate - he is better than anyone else on the market (unless you count Matt Schaub as "on the market").

His footwork is good in practice, but when he gets in the game, he panics and forgets everything. He has the ability to be mobile, and can scramble for first downs. But he has trouble (mentally, I think) moving around in the pocket.

The Bears are a strong team, and I honestly think David needs a strong team around him to be successful. Unlike Rex, he doesn't risk a lot of interceptions, so I don't see the Bears winning in spite of David like they did with Rex at the end of the 2006 season. He could settle comfortably as a "game manager" quarterback. He has fumbled a lot for the Texans, but I don't necessarily see that problem moving with him to a new team.

mexican_texan
03-11-2007, 09:47 PM
Check out my blog for the latest news & insight on your favorite teams

www.raisingithigher.blogspot.com

Moss for Carr? Wow, I've never thought of that.

gtexan02
03-11-2007, 09:49 PM
I agree, no one has said it better about DC. The only thing I disagree with is that "he is not a winner at heart". I feel he could be a winner and lead a team to the promise land. Just not here in Houston and he needs to trust himself. I know that will be hard to do, but I do wish him luck if he stays here or were ever he goes.

True. he's been conditioned to be a loser though. And through no fault of his own. don't get me wrong. If you lose for 5 straight years, and get angry and upset each time, you'd be in for your 2nd heart operation by now. If you are on a losing team for years, its imopssible not to get a little used to it. Thats why he needs a change of scenery

Ibar_Harry
03-11-2007, 09:50 PM
Hello Bears fan here. I haven't seen too many Texans games over the years, because, quite frankly, they are never on national TV. But I'm hearing rumors that the front office wants to trade Carr. I know his development has plateaued recently...

but my question is, isn't Carr better than everything else on the market? I seriously thought Carr would fit perfectly into Gary Kubiak's West Coast offense. Am I way off base, but doesn't Carr have good mobility, which is a prerequisite in the Denver style of offense?

Anyways can somebody give me a quick scouting report on Carr. What are some of his strengths and weaknesses, and more importantly, why is Houston convinced he's not a franchise QB? Thanks.

I think there is another reason Carr would do well with the Bears and that's because of a certain WR by the name of Berrian. Carr and Berrian were an unbelieveable combination in college. They knew each other like the backs of their hands. They had confidence in each other and I would love to see the two reunited. I would call that the x-factor in a trade regarding Carr going to the Bears. In Carr's senior year Berrian caught 1 out 4 passes thrown by Carr. That's how important a relationship it was.

texansfan1974
03-11-2007, 09:53 PM
I honestly feel Carr could do well in the windy city. He plays tough physically, which would be a perfect fit DA BEARS.

Big Ben Wallets
03-11-2007, 10:00 PM
Rex Grossman for David Carr works for us. Bears fans know very little about David Carr, other than he gets sacked an awful lot. If we traded for him a lot of fans would be very optimistic at first.

I think Rex needs a new home. Every day in Chicago the fans rip him a new one. Each city could solve the other's problem because Bears fans aren't familiar with Carr and Texans fans aren't familiar with Sexy Rexy. You guys might even be optimistic that you've acquired a Super Bowl QB...

At least until Grossman drops back and then you'll have no clue where the ball is going to go.

Pantherstang84
03-11-2007, 10:05 PM
Thanks for the honest assessment. From what I see he has a huge arm and good accuracy. Well, at least that's the impression I got from playing fantasy football. For some reason it seems whenever Carr's about to break out, he takes a couple steps back. Like he'll string together a couple of great games with no bone-headed mistakes (INTs, TOs), then the next week he gets yanked for the backup. I'm so confused.


So. From the information you posted in your blog, all of the talk around here about Quinn being there at #8 is academic. He won't be. So let's see....

1. No BQ
2. No Russell
3. Plummer? (retired)

Yeah we've got to cut Carr and go with Rosenfels or Van Pelt. That's the ticket.

Ryan
03-11-2007, 10:06 PM
Rex Grossman for David Carr works for us. Bears fans know very little about David Carr, other than he gets sacked an awful lot. If we traded for him a lot of fans would be very optimistic at first.

I think Rex needs a new home. Every day in Chicago the fans rip him a new one. Each city could solve the other's problem because Bears fans aren't familiar with Carr and Texans fans aren't familiar with Sexy Rexy. You guys might even be optimistic that you've acquired a Super Bowl QB...

At least until Grossman drops back and then you'll have no clue where the ball is going to go.

at least he throws it past the LOS

Ole Miss Texan
03-11-2007, 10:07 PM
Rex Grossman for David Carr works for us. Bears fans know very little about David Carr, other than he gets sacked an awful lot. If we traded for him a lot of fans would be very optimistic at first.

I think Rex needs a new home. Every day in Chicago the fans rip him a new one. Each city could solve the other's problem because Bears fans aren't familiar with Carr and Texans fans aren't familiar with Sexy Rexy. You guys might even be optimistic that you've acquired a Super Bowl QB...

At least until Grossman drops back and then you'll have no clue where the ball is going to go.

I actually would really want Carr to go to Chicago. Look around this MB and you'll see a lot of Carr haters or Carr lovers. I just says it as I sees it.

Carr is one of THE toughest QB's you'll ever see. Everyone talks about him getting sacked..whether it's his fault or the lines. But Carr gets up every single time. I would think just about any othe quarterback would have said f this and demanded a trade (of course he's getting paid royally). Any other quarterback would have been injured by now.

I think he missed 4 games in 2003 because of injury but other than that he has played in every single game. Tough dude that would fit perfect in Chicago...they are by far the Toughest team.

Tayton
03-11-2007, 10:22 PM
No one here wants Grossman, thanks. Carr is a different type of QB. Grossman throws the ball down the field alot more than Carr. Carr checks down, ALOT. He doesn't throw alot of interceptions but also doesn't make alot of plays. He takes very few chances where Grossman "chucks" the ball up and hopes a WR runs under it. In his defense Carr has never had a receiver that will go up and "take" the ball or make a tough catch (AJ included) Not too make any excuses but he tends to try to take sure things which makes him boring and predictable. Like Grossman I wonder about his football sense. I have never seen a QB throw the ball away after going across the line of scrimmage, last year Carr did it twice. Overall he is damaged goods, hopefully not too damaged.

Navy_Chris
03-11-2007, 10:30 PM
No one here wants Grossman, thanks. Carr is a different type of QB. Grossman throws the ball down the field alot more than Carr. Carr checks down, ALOT. He doesn't throw alot of interceptions but also doesn't make alot of plays. He takes very few chances where Grossman "chucks" the ball up and hopes a WR runs under it. In his defense Carr has never had a receiver that will go up and "take" the ball or make a tough catch (AJ included) Not too make any excuses but he tends to try to take sure things which makes him boring and predictable. Like Grossman I wonder about his football sense. I have never seen a QB throw the ball away after going across the line of scrimmage, last year Carr did it twice. Overall he is damaged goods, hopefully not too damaged.

Timmy Chang should be available. What about Chance Mock? Shaun King just had 10 TDs in the Arena League. Let's hit these guys up.

No, i'm kidding.

freedoggy77
03-11-2007, 10:43 PM
if you take a QB from the AFL you must take Clint Doziel

Second Honeymoon
03-11-2007, 11:05 PM
Moss for Carr? Wow, I've never thought of that.

i have on multiple occassions. basically we are trading two guys with untradable contracts to each other. it makes sense to be honest. we give moss a year to restart his career and if it doesnt work we get rid of him. Same thing with the Raiders, they give Carr a year to start his career anew and if it doesnt work out they get rid of him. it is a win win situation for both teams.

Navy_Chris
03-11-2007, 11:13 PM
i have on multiple occassions. basically we are trading two guys with untradable contracts to each other. it makes sense to be honest. we give moss a year to restart his career and if it doesnt work we get rid of him. Same thing with the Raiders, they give Carr a year to start his career anew and if it doesnt work out they get rid of him. it is a win win situation for both teams.

just speak very slowly and use small words when you present that to a certain NFL owner

A Texan
03-11-2007, 11:25 PM
One thing you should know about Carr is that his worse games are on the road in front of loud, hostile crowds. If it's in a Dome like Indy's he seems to completely go berserk. His best road game performances have been in Jacksonville where they often have a half empty stadium. He's so obsessed with hostile crowds that last fall before the Oakland game he mentioned that he told members of his family not to wear their Texan gear and reccommended that other Texans fans do the same.

Navy_Chris
03-11-2007, 11:26 PM
A typical halftime speech in the Houston Texans' locker room goes something like this I bet:

"Hey guys, we're down 34-21. What's that all about? If we're gonna lose, let's do it right. I'll meet you guys back on the field in a half hour so we can get this game over with. I gotta go take a ____."

The Pencil Neck
03-12-2007, 01:33 AM
A typical halftime speech in the Houston Texans' locker room goes something like this I bet:

"Hey guys, we're down 34-21. What's that all about? If we're gonna lose, let's do it right. I'll meet you guys back on the field in a half hour so we can get this game over with. I gotta go take a ____."

Dude.

Not again.

How many times have you posted this?

DocBar
03-12-2007, 02:02 AM
Moss for Carr? Wow, I've never thought of that.

i have and would love it.

whotex8
03-12-2007, 02:04 AM
A typical halftime speech in the Houston Texans' locker room goes something like this I bet:__________________

____."

And your inside perspective would come from what.......collecting dirty jock straps during half-time in the locker room, (I bet...)?
Are you that "wanna-be guy" in the commercials?

dirty steve
03-12-2007, 02:09 AM
One thing you should know about Carr is that his worse games are on the road in front of loud, hostile crowds. If it's in a Dome like Indy's he seems to completely go berserk. His best road game performances have been in Jacksonville where they often have a half empty stadium. He's so obsessed with hostile crowds that last fall before the Oakland game he mentioned that he told members of his family not to wear their Texan gear and reccommended that other Texans fans do the same.
i think any opposing team would tell family members or those traveling to/attending the same thing. Carr isn't the first person to voice this concern.

DocBar
03-12-2007, 02:09 AM
A typical halftime speech in the Houston Texans' locker room goes something like this I bet:

"Hey guys, we're down 34-21. What's that all about? If we're gonna lose, let's do it right. I'll meet you guys back on the field in a half hour so we can get this game over with. I gotta go take a ____."

Another one of those times I miss negative rep. :(
Makes me proud I was in the Army.

Mr teX
03-12-2007, 08:20 AM
Thanks for the honest assessment. From what I see he has a huge arm and good accuracy. Well, at least that's the impression I got from playing fantasy football. For some reason it seems whenever Carr's about to break out, he takes a couple steps back. Like he'll string together a couple of great games with no bone-headed mistakes (INTs, TOs), then the next week he gets yanked for the backup. I'm so confused.

Anyways we have our hands full in Chicago with FedRex. When he throws the ball we have no idea where it is going. Plus he can't move laterally in the face of a rush, only straight back. It's depressing, but at least our defense is alright.

Good luck with the Carr thing, I hope he gets another shot. You're right, he had some bad coaching because the same guy who ruined Tim Couch's career almost ruined Carr's. I'm talking about Chris Palmer. Who in their right mind installs a vertical passing offense on an expansion team?

Who indeed.

Vinny
03-12-2007, 09:21 AM
Rex Grossman for David Carr works for us. .
lol, because you have never seen Carr play. At least Grossman makes plays in between his screw ups. Carr can't make plays. He had ONE TD in his last 10 games in non garbage time play last year. ONE. Your ticket to 6-10 is David Carr so please, make that deal happen. Carr has a rotten deep ball (it's basically a jump ball), and has a hitch in his delivery and tips off his passes in the intermediate range....if you love dump passes, passes to the flat, and hitch passes you will love Carr. Just don't expect any TD's from the passing game.

tsip
03-12-2007, 09:34 AM
"then the next week he gets yanked for the backup. I'm so confused."

...has never happened to Carr. He got yanked in the 2nd half of a game against the Titans this year for the first and only time in his career for anything that was not injury related. However, the HC 'tripped' all over himself to get to the media to make sure they let it be known that Carr was the 'man,' despite 200yds/3tds passing in less than 2 qtrs of play by the b/u.

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 09:47 AM
"then the next week he gets yanked for the backup. I'm so confused."

...has never happened to Carr. He got yanked in the 2nd half of a game against the Titans this year for the first and only time in his career for anything that was not injury related. However, the HC 'tripped' all over himself to get to the media to make sure they let it be known that Carr was the 'man,' despite 200yds/3tds passing in less than 2 qtrs of play by the b/u.

...in garbage time, whenever Tennessee had already called off the dogs

Say what you will about Carr, I don't care one way or another, but let's not build Sage up as something he's not....

Vinny
03-12-2007, 09:48 AM
Say what you will about Carr, I don't care one way or another, but let's not build Sage up as something he's not....That wasn't garbage time. Sage nearly brought the team back to win that game. "Garbage time" is a TD in the 4th period when behind 23-6 vs the Jets. That's one of Carr's TWO TD's in the last ten games of the year...THAT, is a garbage time TD.

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 09:53 AM
That wasn't garbage time. Sage nearly brought the team back to win that game. "Garbage time" is a TD in the 4th period when behind 23-6 vs the Jets. That's one of Carr's TWO TD's in the last ten games of the year...THAT, is a garbage time TD.

C'mon Vinny... I would expect better than that from you... The Texans never had a chance to win that Tennesse game... THe 28-22 final was way closer than the actual game was...

I have no problem with your assessment of the Jets game. Any stats put up by Carr were bogus...So I agree, that was garbage time as well.

real
03-12-2007, 09:55 AM
C'mon Vinny... I would expect better than that from you... The Texans never had a chance to win that Tennesse game... THe 28-22 final was way closer than the actual game was...

I have no problem with your assessment of the Jets game. Any stats put up by Carr were bogus...So I agree, that was garbage time as well.

I thought that if we could have made a few more plays we could have won that tennesee game...

But on another note...garbage time or not...

Do you think Carr could have brought us back like Sage did ?

Vinny
03-12-2007, 09:57 AM
C'mon Vinny... I would expect better than that from you... The Texans never had a chance to win that Tennesse game... THe 28-22 final was way closer than the actual game was...

I have no problem with your assessment of the Jets game. Any stats put up by Carr were bogus...So I agree, that was garbage time as well.expect better? I've argued till I was blue in the face about this bs in the past. Just because you call it garbage time it doesn't make it garbage time. Carr was only in that game for one series in the 3rd quarter and there was nearly 10 mins left in the 3rd when Sage came in the game. Sage came in and tossed 3 TD's in the final 17 mins of the game....that's more than a quarter of play and the score was only 21-3. This just in, but you can win games with over a quarter and a half of game play if you play well enough. I guess you consider the Bills comeback vs the Oilers by Frank Reich "garbage time" too?

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 10:03 AM
I thought that if we could have made a few more plays we could have won that tennesee game...

But on another note...garbage time or not...

Do you think Carr could have brought us back like Sage did ?

Absolutely not...

Look, I am not picking on Sage. I just don't think people should jump on the Sage bandwagon. He's a good guy and probably the best back-up we've ever had and if we have to start him next season, so be it. But, he is NOT our future at QB.

I'd be curious of how many of those people pimping Sage were the same people pimping Dave Ragone...

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 10:05 AM
expect better? I've argued till I was blue in the face about this bs in the past. Just because you call it garbage time it doesn't make it garbage time. Carr was only in that game for one series in the 3rd quarter and there was nearly 10 mins left in the 3rd when Sage came in the game. Sage came in and tossed 3 TD's in the final 17 mins of the game....that's more than a quarter of play and the score was only 21-3. This just in, but you can win games with over a quarter of game play if you play well enough. I guess you consider the Bills comeback vs the Oilers by Frank Reich "garbage time" too?

Thats a stretch.... A monumental collapse of the Oilers v. a typical 'almost' (sarcasm) comeback.

Just because you and I have a differing opinions of garbage time... Doesn't necessarily mean you are right and I am wrong -or- vice versa. Its opinion.

Vinny
03-12-2007, 10:10 AM
Thats a stretch.... A monumental collapse of the Oilers v. a typical 'almost' (sarcasm) comeback.

Just because you and I have a differing opinions of garbage time... Doesn't necessarily mean you are right and I am wrong -or- vice versa. Its opinion.
Down 21-3 with just about half a game to go is only garbage time for a QB that can't throw TD's. Otherwise, the game is still winnable. Happens all the time in football. You should watch some games.

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 10:17 AM
Down 21-3 with just about half a game to go is only garbage time for a QB that can't throw TD's. Otherwise, the game is still winnable. Happens all the time in football. You should watch some games.

Okay Vinny. You are the superior football master... Teach me, oh wise one..

Whatever, if you want to go into personal attacks, I can go that route too, but I assumed we were having a discussion, not you trying to cyber-bully everyone who disagrees with you...

How may 21-3 comebacks have there actually been in comparison to almost comebacks... I think you will find that it is not "done all the time". In fact, I would venture to say it is in the minority of games played.

thunderkyss
03-12-2007, 10:19 AM
That wasn't garbage time. Sage nearly brought the team back to win that game. "Garbage time" is a TD in the 4th period when behind 23-6 vs the Jets. That's one of Carr's TWO TD's in the last ten games of the year...THAT, is a garbage time TD.

Or against Indy, where we are down by damn near 4 touchdowns Plus PAT before David throws his first TD(3-30, 27points)with 11:43 left in the 4th Qtr, and still damn near 3 TDs after his last. TD(24-43, 19 Points)....

Garbage time, meaning there is not enough time for you to make a comeback.

Where in Tennessee, the score was 21-3(18points) before Sage's first TD, with 1:59 left in the THIRD and we got a TD on every possession except Sage's first. Final score... 28-22(6points).

Vinny
03-12-2007, 10:20 AM
Okay Vinny. You are the superior football master... Teach me, oh wise one..

Whatever, if you want to go into personal attacks, I can go that route too, but I assumed we were having a discussion, not you trying to cyber-bully everyone who disagrees with you...

How may 21-3 comebacks have there actually been in comparison to almost comebacks... I think you will find that it is not "done all the time". In fact, I would venture to say it is in the minority of games played.Personal attacks? I told you to watch some football. I didn't call you any names or accuse you of being anything more than naive.

If a team can score 3 times in the first half you think that it's "garbage time" if the opponent scores 3 times in the second half?

Sco-tai
03-12-2007, 10:23 AM
To put it in simple words, how about a trade?

Rex Grossman for David Carr straight up.


No i'm kidding.

Carr has made dumb decisions at times, but get real.

Carr has WAY more upside than Grossboy...even if I agree he needs a "fresh-start" with a team that can protect.

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 10:25 AM
Personal attacks? I told you to watch some football. I didn't call you any names or accuse you of being anything more than naive.

If a team can score 3 times in the first half you think that it's "garbage time" if the opponent scores 3 times in the second half?

I watch as much football as anyone - if not MORE. So, I take that comment as a back-handed jab - thus attack.

"IF 'if' were a fifth we'd all be drunk."

Were not talking about "if's", were talking about being done. How may times did it happen last year? the year before? ever? Not nearly as many as you would suggest. I understand that in college it tends to happen more.

Vinny
03-12-2007, 10:27 AM
I watch as much football as anyone - if not MORE. So, I take that comment as a back-handed jab - thus attack.

"IF 'if' were a fifth we'd all be drunk."

Were not talking about "if's", were talking about being done. How may times did it happen last year? the year before? ever? Not nearly as many as you would suggest. I understand that in college it tends to happen more.it was a backhanded jab at some dumb commentary, but it's not a personal attack. Scoring 3 times in a half isn't that uncommon....unless you are a Carr fan.

Mr. White
03-12-2007, 10:29 AM
Carr has made dumb decisions at times, but get real.

Carr has WAY more upside than Grossboy...even if I agree he needs a "fresh-start" with a team that can protect.

Pick your poison. If you want a QB that doesn't get the ball down the field, but doesn't make a whole lot of mistakes, then Carr's your guy.

Grossman can rack up passing yards, but then he screws it up by turning the ball over.

thunderkyss
03-12-2007, 10:32 AM
Carr has made dumb decisions at times, but get real.

Carr has WAY more upside than Grossboy...even if I agree he needs a "fresh-start" with a team that can protect.

And we say this because Carr has 5 years starting under his belt, and Grossman has 1??

Or is it because we're Texans Homers??

Vinny
03-12-2007, 10:36 AM
And we say this because Carr has 5 years starting under his belt, and Grossman has 1??

Or is it because we're Texans Homers??Carr has 75 NFL starts and Rex has 23

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 10:41 AM
it was a backhanded jab at some dumb commentary, but it's not a personal attack. Scoring 3 times in a half isn't that uncommon....unless you are a Carr fan.

That answers everything right there.... 'Cause I am NOT!!!

My comment about Sage's inflated numbers in Tennessee were no more dumb than your assessment that it wasn't garbage time and we did have a chance to comeback and win... Either both were dumb, or both were correct. Stand on your side of the fence, and I will stand on mine. (And again, I am not talking about the Carr fence). My points were more in reference to Sage's performance only. Personally, if Sage starts next season, I will be okay with that as long as the Texans do something to upgrade the position over Sage - knowing he's not the future. Maybe we can bring Dave Ragone back. I remember plenty of people pimping him...

Pantherstang84
03-12-2007, 10:43 AM
And we say this because Carr has 5 years starting under his belt, and Grossman has 1??

Or is it because we're Texans Homers??

Are you going to try and rationalize Grossman over Carr now?

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 10:43 AM
Carr has made dumb decisions at times, but get real.

Carr has WAY more upside than Grossboy...even if I agree he needs a "fresh-start" with a team that can protect.

Seriously, Grossman has way more upside than DC. Grossman gets criticized a lot, but look at the facts. He basically is a one year starter (with other starts sprinkled in), but really this was his first complete season... Oh, and by the way and whether it was pretty or not, the Bears did go to the Super Bowl.

Advantage------> Grossman.

Vinny
03-12-2007, 10:44 AM
That answers everything right there.... 'Cause I am NOT!!!

My comment about Sage's inflated numbers in Tennessee were no more dumb than your assessment that it wasn't garbage time and we did have a chance to comeback and win...
stating that you don't have enough time to win a football game down 21-3 early in the 3rd quarter is just idiotic at best.

real
03-12-2007, 10:45 AM
Are you going to try and rationalize Grossman over Carr now?

I'll take Grossman over Carr.

dbspi
03-12-2007, 10:49 AM
Okay Vinny. You are the superior football master... Teach me, oh wise one..

Whatever, if you want to go into personal attacks, I can go that route too, but I assumed we were having a discussion, not you trying to cyber-bully everyone who disagrees with you...

How may 21-3 comebacks have there actually been in comparison to almost comebacks... I think you will find that it is not "done all the time". In fact, I would venture to say it is in the minority of games played.

Have you ever heard or seen Oilers vs Bills in the conference play off. Oiler were ahead 33-3 or something at half time and eventually lost the game. Even now they show that game as a ultimate choke job for the Oilers.

In football anything can happen at any given time and all it takes is one play for momentum to swing. The way Sage was playing vs Titans there was a good chance we could have won the game if he had little more time.

Mr. White
03-12-2007, 10:49 AM
Are you going to try and rationalize Grossman over Carr now?

Grossman can at least find the end zone. That fact in itself makes him better than Carr.

(Disclaimer: This doesn't mean that I want Grossman in Houston.)

Pantherstang84
03-12-2007, 10:50 AM
I'll take Grossman over Carr.

Ok. I guess the grass is always greener....

real
03-12-2007, 10:51 AM
Ok. I guess the grass is always greener....

Yeah...

That's it.

Pantherstang84
03-12-2007, 10:52 AM
Yeah...

That's it.

lol

gtexan02
03-12-2007, 10:57 AM
stating that you don't have enough time to win a football game down 21-3 early in the 3rd quarter is just idiotic at best.

Just to clarify, and I didn't watch the game so Im going on earlier posters, but "early in the 3rd" it was not. According to the previous poster, there was a little over 1 minute left in the 3rd. Practically the 4th quarter

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 10:57 AM
stating that you don't have enough time to win a football game down 21-3 early in the 3rd quarter is just idiotic at best.

OKAY.. Bottom line. We are not a good enough team to overcome a 21-3 deficit... with DC or Sage at the helm...

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 10:59 AM
Have you ever heard or seen Oilers vs Bills in the conference play off. Oiler were ahead 33-3 or something at half time and eventually lost the game. Even now they show that game as a ultimate choke job for the Oilers.

In football anything can happen at any given time and all it takes is one play for momentum to swing. The way Sage was playing vs Titans there was a good chance we could have won the game if he had little more time.

Yes... I have... If you read the entire thread, you would have noticed that both Vinny and I mentioned that game...

Exception not the rule!

Mr. White
03-12-2007, 11:08 AM
Just to clarify, and I didn't watch the game so Im going on earlier posters, but "early in the 3rd" it was not. According to the previous poster, there was a little over 1 minute left in the 3rd. Practically the 4th quarter

Third quarter. 8:13 remaining.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/playbyplay/NFL_20061029_HOU@TEN

The Pencil Neck
03-12-2007, 11:08 AM
Just to clarify, and I didn't watch the game so Im going on earlier posters, but "early in the 3rd" it was not. According to the previous poster, there was a little over 1 minute left in the 3rd. Practically the 4th quarter

Carr fumbled on the first possession of the second half.

Sage came in with 9:53 left in the 3rd. His first pass was a bizarre tip for an interception (that should have been caught, iirc). After that, Sage took us to 3 TD's. Giving up a punt return for a TD killed us. Sage really did almost bring us back in that game.

The Pencil Neck
03-12-2007, 11:10 AM
Third quarter. 8:13 remaining.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/playbyplay/NFL_20061029_HOU@TEN

He came in one possession before that.

Mr. White
03-12-2007, 11:12 AM
He came in one possession before that.

I was talking about when the score was 21-3.

tsip
03-12-2007, 11:44 AM
Carr has made dumb decisions at times, but get real.

Carr has WAY more upside than Grossboy...even if I agree he needs a "fresh-start" with a team that can protect.

Grossman threw for over 3200 yds, over 20 tds, and led his team to the SB in his first complete yr as a starter while-in his 5th yr as a starter-Davey threw 11tds, 1 below his career avg of 12!!

...but Carr's got way more upside!!!!????nottttttttttttttt

tsip
03-12-2007, 11:49 AM
Say what you will about Carr, I don't care one way or another, but let's not build Sage up as something he's not....

...what a new 'low' mark on these threads--adding to someone elses post to make it look like part of their post...man, you are a piece of work, and need some serious help

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 11:53 AM
...what a new 'low' mark on these threads--adding to someone elses post to make it look like part of their post...man, you are a piece of work, and need some serious help

HUH?!? WTF is that supposed to mean??

thunderkyss
03-12-2007, 12:09 PM
Just to clarify, and I didn't watch the game so Im going on earlier posters, but "early in the 3rd" it was not. According to the previous poster, there was a little over 1 minute left in the 3rd. Practically the 4th quarter

CHANCE TO WIN GAME

The score was 21-3 just before Sage threw his first touchdown. Sage threw his first touchdown in that game with 1:59 seconds left in the game. We had a whole Qtr of football to play, and the score was 21-10, An 11 point deficit. There's no reason to believe we couldn't overcome an 11 point deficit in the 4th.


NO CHANCE TO WIN GAME

David's first TD was something like 5 minutes into the 4th Qtr(a Qtr of football is only 15 minutes).... we were down 27 points. So we went into the 4th Qtr in Indy, needing to score 4 TDs in 10 minutes(and shut Indy out)to win the game, when we hadn't scored one TD prior to the 4th Qtr.

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 12:24 PM
CHANCE TO WIN GAME


NO CHANCE TO WIN GAME

TK,

I for one am NOT suggesting that the Indy game was winnable.

My point about the Tennessee game is you are right 21-10 isn't necessarily insurmountable, but our ST gave up that punt return to Pac-man making it a 28-10 lead with only about 11 minutes left in the game. We now needed 3 scores in 11 minutes. Impossible for some teams? NO. For us? probably so.

But then again, Pink Floyd got back together too. :pigfly:

aj.
03-12-2007, 12:32 PM
TK,

I for one am NOT suggesting that the Indy game was winnable.

My point about the Tennessee game is you are right 21-10 isn't necessarily insurmountable, but our ST gave up that punt return to Pac-man making it a 28-10 lead with only about 11 minutes left in the game. We now needed 3 scores in 11 minutes. Impossible for some teams? NO. For us? probably so.

But then again, Pink Floyd got back together too. :pigfly:

Recover that on-side kick and the Texans have the ball, six points down, in TN territory with about 1:55 left. They didn't recover. Ball game. But they had the opportunity to make a play late that would have given them a chance to win the game.

The difference in those two games is that TN fans were puckering late in the 4th, while Indy fans left at halftime due to boredom.

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 12:37 PM
Recover that on-side kick and the Texans have the ball, six points down, in TN territory with about 1:55 left. They didn't recover. Ball game. But they had the opportunity to make a play late that would have given them a chance to win the game.

The difference in those two games is that TN fans were puckering late in the 4th, while Indy fans left at halftime due to boredom.

Thats actually pretty funny!

Hervoyel
03-12-2007, 12:38 PM
Okay Vinny. You are the superior football master... Teach me, oh wise one..

Well, he's trying. You just don't seem to be picking it up.

Perhaps if we gave you another year and a new coach?

idonno:

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 12:42 PM
Well, he's trying. You just don't seem to be picking it up.

Perhaps if we gave you another year and a new coach?

idonno:

I just have been coddled enough...lol.

real
03-12-2007, 12:42 PM
Perhaps if we gave you another year and a new coach?

idonno:

Now, that's comedy. :joker:

aj.
03-12-2007, 12:42 PM
Thats actually pretty funny!

When you think about it, it's really not. That's why we have this thread and a million others like it.

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 12:45 PM
When you think about it, it's really not. That's why we have this thread and a million others like it.

There's one thing we can agree on.

Can't wait for the day when Carr is a distant memory and Sage is candidate for the HOF (j/k), or at least steers the ship long enough to get Kolb ready...

gtexan02
03-12-2007, 12:59 PM
This thread has turned from "David Carr scouting report" to "What is the definition of garbage time"

The fact of that matter is that garbage time doesn't really mean anything. Garbage time should be defined as the time when the defense goes into a prevent mode or becomes less aggressive than it was previously because it believes the team won't lose.

Arguing point differentials is meaningless. If you look at the game film it shoudl clarify everything. Were the Titans in prevent for the first sage TD? Were they in a loose zone? Were the Colts?

Also, just because there is a legitimate chance at the end, doesn't mean there wasn't garbage time before that. The Titans could have been relaxed when Sage came out allowing him to score easily the 1st or 2nd time. Maybe only the last TD was actually legitimate

We don't know

What we do know is that Sage has never started for the Texans. And in his previous starts in the NFL, he has done poorly. He looked great in limited action with the Texans, but until we actually see him string together a full season, we really won't know what type of QB he can be

Pantherstang84
03-12-2007, 01:05 PM
I have an idea.

If we can't trade Carr for Grossman, does anyone have Kerry Collin's number? I think he is looking for a job.

Mr teX
03-12-2007, 01:20 PM
I have an idea.

If we can't trade Carr for Grossman, does anyone have Kerry Collin's number? I think he is looking for a job.

Nope the Titans resigned him, He's the ONLY guy they have signed this year.

Big Ben Wallets
03-12-2007, 01:50 PM
From reading some of these posts it appears most Texans fans want to move on from the David Carr era. And that's probably the right decision. I think Carr can flourish in a new environment, where he's not asked to be the No. 1 overall pick, but just a piece of the puzzle.

What do you guys think about Drew Stanton? I can tell some fans want to draft Kevin Kolb and I'll confess to knowing next to nothing about him. I'm from the Midwest so I'm more familiar with Drew Stanton. He's got excellent mobility and reminds me of a Jay Cutler-lite. He's got size (6-3 220) and a powerful arm. I think he could excel in the Denver system, running the bootleg and throwing on the run.

Personally I think the No. 8 pick is the worst spot in the top ten. The draft is top heavy and there's a good chance all of the players Houston is targeting (Quinn, Russell, Peterson, Thomas, Johnson) could be off the board. Then Houston would be forced to reach to fill a need (Levi Brown) or draft Best Player Available (Alan Branch/Amobi Okoye) but wouldn't necessarily fill any holes.

IMHO I think Houston should trade down if they can get any kind of a decent offer. If you can get 2 top 40 picks, say a mid-first rounder and an early second Houston could fill some serious needs. You could get a kid like Reggie Nelson in the 16-20 range, grab a franchise tackle like Tony Ugoh or Joe Staley in the 32-40 range and use your own 2nd rounder to grab Drew Stanton.

Exiting the draft with Reggie Nelson, Joe Staley and Drew Stanton would be huge in terms of filling needs and building for the future. Stanton is the type of mobile QB that would excel in Shanahan's system. Staley (former TE) is athletic enough to play tackle in the ZBS. And Nelson would fill a need but also present good upside potential.

If you could trade Carr for Randy Moss and pair him with Andre Johnson I think it's reasonable the Texans could become respectable within a year and a half and very competitive by 2009 to say the least.

afcman
03-12-2007, 01:51 PM
why is Houston convinced he's not a franchise QB?

Right or wrong, we're just tired of him. Most of us agree that he could, or could have, been fantastic. He could still work out in the coming years. But personally I think the guy is beat down mentally.

We want a real new start. We feel a little cheated from the FO's past decisions. And I think it would be best for Carr as well.

And frankly, I DO NOT want Grossman. :)

tsip
03-12-2007, 03:02 PM
"What we do know is that Sage has never started for the Texans. And in his previous starts in the NFL, he has done poorly. He looked great in limited action with the Texans, but until we actually see him string together a full season, we really won't know what type of QB he can be"


Well, a person has to wonder-David has never put together a full season and 16tds is his best, so we really don't know what type of QB he could be. We do know he has been the starting QB for the losingest new franchise in NFL history, even worse than the Bucs and Saints were. We know he's thrown more int than tds. We know his legacy is excuses...

JMO, but an avg QB could easily 'blow' Carr's #'s out the window because David has set the bar so low, and they wouldn't need 5 yrs to do it either....
__________________

real
03-12-2007, 03:07 PM
JMO, but an avg QB could easily 'blow' Carr's #'s out the window because David has set the bar so low..

I agree...

It seems like everyone wants to call Carr mediocre, or decent...

I think the guy is terrible..

Mr teX
03-12-2007, 03:14 PM
"What we do know is that Sage has never started for the Texans. And in his previous starts in the NFL, he has done poorly. He looked great in limited action with the Texans, but until we actually see him string together a full season, we really won't know what type of QB he can be"


Well, a person has to wonder-David has never put together a full season and 16tds is his best, so we really don't know what type of QB he could be. We do know he has been the starting QB for the losingest new franchise in NFL history, even worse than the Bucs and Saints were. We know he's thrown more int than tds. We know his legacy is excuses...

JMO, but an avg QB could easily 'blow' Carr's #'s out the window because David has set the bar so low, and they wouldn't need 5 yrs to do it either....
__________________

I don't know if you can say that. This franchise is a losing 1 right now b/c of many reasons not just DC, No matter how well many of you convince yourselves. Do we need to move on: yes, Are DC's numbers lousy: yes, Would anyone else have put up better stats: who knows. Take away his rookie year, which is the year most every QB struggles, & then add in the fact he didn't get a credible recieveing threat until year 3, Short of Manning & Brady & Montana, i don't think anyone's going to throw many TD's or look any better.

As for the Rex Grossman vs. DC, someone said it earlier it's pick your poison. Basically it comes down to how you would like to lose your games with a bunch of turnovers or playing it close to the vest & not trying to make much happen?

tsip
03-12-2007, 03:34 PM
This thread has turned from "David Carr scouting report" to "What is the definition of garbage time"

The fact of that matter is that garbage time doesn't really mean anything. Garbage time should be defined as the time when the defense goes into a prevent mode or becomes less aggressive than it was previously because it believes the team won't lose.

Arguing point differentials is meaningless. If you look at the game film it shoudl clarify everything. Were the Titans in prevent for the first sage TD? Were they in a loose zone? Were the Colts?

Also, just because there is a legitimate chance at the end, doesn't mean there wasn't garbage time before that. The Titans could have been relaxed when Sage came out allowing him to score easily the 1st or 2nd time. Maybe only the last TD was actually legitimate

We don't know

What we do know is that Sage has never started for the Texans. And in his previous starts in the NFL, he has done poorly. He looked great in limited action with the Texans, but until we actually see him string together a full season, we really won't know what type of QB he can be

JMO, but it's not a good idea to compare Carr's stats to anyones. First, while Sage was not thrown into the fire from day one, Carr was-and that fact is credited for a lot of his problems. On the other hand, those same posters criticize Sage for few starts, only 2. It's kinda like a 'flavor' of the day thing, depending upon which flavor looks best on Carr.

This means it's kinda unfair to compare Carr's 75 starts to Sage's 2, considering that you'd think a QB would get better with more playing experience. Anyway, comparing 'career' stats does not favor David. Carr has a better completion % and that's it, Sage has a better ypa/more tds than int/higher QB ranking,etc.

Obviously, giving Sage more playing time is the only way to settle this argument. We already know all we need to know about David...

Texan_Bill
03-12-2007, 03:39 PM
Obviously, giving Sage more playing time is the only way to settle this argument. We already know all we need to know about David...

True. And I can live with Sage starting next year, BUT with some sort of back-up plan in place, i.e. drafting a QB (and not a first rounder). They need to be more flexible in what they do for the next couple of seasons and not lock in on one guy... Have options...

Koolaid Time
03-12-2007, 03:57 PM
Nope the Titans resigned him, He's the ONLY guy they have signed this year.

I heard Kerry Collins' signing bonus was 10 cases of Jack Daniels...

aj.
03-12-2007, 05:21 PM
This thread has turned from "David Carr scouting report" to "What is the definition of garbage time"...


Nature seeks equilibrium.

ArlingtonTexan
03-12-2007, 05:52 PM
I heard Kerry Collins' signing bonus was 10 cases of Jack Daniels...

:drunk: I see nothing wrong with that bonus. :shots: