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David's Busted Carr
01-31-2007, 03:17 PM
Recently his stock has seemed to have jumped due to a solid performance at the Senior Bowl (I guess). Now alot of mock drafts have us taking him at #8.

Is this guy a LEGIT BONAFIDE STUD left tackle that will anchor our line for the next 10 years? Or is he just the "next best" after Joe Thomas?

I would hate to waste that high of a pick unless the guy would finally SOLVE our LT problem since there will be so much talent (especially defensively) sitting there at #8...


And to me all of this is awash if Adrian Peterson is available, but it looks more and more like Cleveland will take him and then wait to draft Troy Smith as their QB in round 2 or 3...

Thoughts?

htownfoozball
01-31-2007, 04:00 PM
he's probably the next best OL. he's not elite IMO. he has pretty good feet, but he's not very consistent with his footwork. if peterson is there, id rather take peterson.

texanfan2100
01-31-2007, 04:17 PM
Or is he just the "next best" after Joe Thomas?

Ding, Ding, Ding!!!!

By all accounts, Brown had a disappointing senior season. He may have turned it on for the senior bowl, and potentially the scouting combine and his on campus pro day. But beware of guys who suddenly get a whole lot better when the money is on the line.

Don't get me wrong, there have been many good players who haven't had great college players. And Brown is probably a first round talent. I just have a hard time picking a guy at number 8 who was, by all accounts, barely in the first round after the college season.

Texian
01-31-2007, 04:28 PM
I don't think he has a value of $15 million GTD.

bah007
01-31-2007, 05:25 PM
I think Staley will be better than Brown despite Brown's good showing at the Senior Bowl.

Staley would be a great addition for a zone-blocking offense. He is a great athlete for an o-lineman.

Insideop
01-31-2007, 05:30 PM
If we do get Brown, I hope we can trade down and still get him. I'm not sold on him at the #8 spot yet. If he has a very good Combine, then maybe he's worth it at #8. All I know now is that his stock has been rising since the Sr. Bowl, and before that, he was a mid to late 1st round pick. To me he kinda looks like Spencer with a big powerful upper body, but I don't think he has that "nasty" mentality that they said Spencer has. JMHO!

Football's Future said he may be better at RT. Here's a link: http://www.footballsfuture.com/. Just go to Profiles and click on OL and then Levi Brown.

beerlover
01-31-2007, 05:34 PM
Levi had a mid-season injury that required scoping his knee & doing some reparing, he only missed two games & worked his way back into playing condition getting stronger each week, now he is fully healed and is showing what he can do. He was also limited by a down year overall for a Penn State program that doesn't push the ball down the field by pass but rather the run. his pass protection is under rated because of PSU system & will learn to get set (keep his weight more on the balls of his feet & his butt down) in a more traditional pro system. what he lacks with his footwork he has overcome with strength, long arms & body girth. these raw skills can be improved and will be at the next level.:)

threetoedpete
01-31-2007, 05:48 PM
Is he Ogden ? NO. Is he Pace ? NO. will he catch Tarik Glenn in two seasons as the best OLT in our division...uh huh. The moment we draft him, he will be the best O-lineman this franchise has ever had...that actually made a feild. I can't argue taking Mario over the Brick last season. I can argue taking the OLT over the frachise RB. Rb has a fifty percent bust rate. The running back is a fifty-fifty proposition. The OLT judging from mid ninties to 2002...is an eighty percent lock. The second thing I heard(read) him say after the Senior Bowl was calling out Joe Thomas to come to the combine and compete for the #1 over all OLT. We'll see if JT takes the bait. Anyway reads to me he is a competitor and ready to go to war for someone. I don't know him or his family. But he looks to be a solid citizen and a good face for the franchise. He looks like a Texan. And is going to look damned good in my eyes in that deep steel blue uniform.

beerlover
01-31-2007, 06:43 PM
Is he Ogden ? NO. Is he Pace ? NO. will he catch Tarik Glenn in two seasons as the pest OLT in our division...uh huh. The moment we draft him, he will be the best O-lineman this franchise has ever had...that actually made a feild. I can't argue taking Mario over the Brick last season. I can argue taking the OLT over the frachise RB. Rb has a fifty percent bust rate. The running back is a fifty-fifty proposition. The OLT judging from mid ninties to 2002...is an eighty percent lock. The second thing I heard(read) him say after the Senior Bowl was calling out Joe Thomas to come to the combine and compete for the #1 over all OLT. We'll see if JT takes the bait. Anyway reads to me he is a competitor and ready to go to war for someone. I don't know him or his family. But he looks to be a solid citizen and a good face for the franchise. He looks like a Texan. And is going to look damned good in my eyes in that deep steel blue uniform.

good points ttp :bubble:

ya know what really impressed me about Levi was his presence, of course he's huge, so are a lot of guys, but he comes off as well put together with a quiet confidence, dry wit & intelligence. the big guy is very smart, I've yet to figure out why the offensive lineman are among the smartest football players but they just are. you know exactly what your getting from him- a big, tough, smart tackle that takes pride in his assingments with the skills & size to start LT for the NFL team who drafts him :bowser:

nunusguy
01-31-2007, 07:13 PM
he catch Tarik Glenn in two seasons as the pest OLT in our division...uh huh. The moment we draft him, he will be the best O-lineman this franchise has ever had...that actually made a feild. I can't argue taking Mario over the Brick last season. I can argue taking the OLT over the frachise RB. Rb has a fifty percent bust rate. The running back is a fifty-fifty proposition. The OLT judging from mid ninties to 2002...is an eighty percent lock.

Dang 3toedpete, you and Beerlover must be Levi's co-agents ?
But I hope you guys really know what you're talking about, because we certainly need a real OLT for now and for the longer term.
Of course not the first OT taken last year but the second one turned out to
be the best OLineman taken in the Draft. So just because Thomas goes before Levi is no guarantee that the Badger will be better.
But I think there's a bigger bust factor for OLTs than you seem to think.
And if I understand what you said, you favored taking Mario over Dbrick last
year, but you would take a tackle, Thomas or Levi, over this years potential
franchise RB - Adrian Peterson ?

htownfoozball
01-31-2007, 07:17 PM
if both were a guaranteed "Franchise player," who would you rather have?

threetoedpete
01-31-2007, 07:26 PM
No nunsguy, I'm the guy that's been banging this drum for four years. Some years, there were no legitimate prospect. Other years, we were out of position. Last year, they took a Reggie White/Wiilie Davis prospect. This year there's no excuse. We've waited five years and waisted one good QB prospect. Make an arguement a good RB blue chipper in Dominic Williams. Some say the common theme of DCs demise is his over all lack of ablity. And some say the guy was waisted by lack of draft and free agent suport. I guess it comes down to which way you color your coffee. The sacks speak for themselves. Got the tool and position to heal this five year old wound...my book says you fix that first...this year, then worry about everything else. DC's probably allready a train wecked mess that no one can fix. But...the line needs to be addressed before we bring in the next Judas goat. JMHO. And been that way for four years.

MorKnolle
01-31-2007, 08:24 PM
Recently his stock has seemed to have jumped due to a solid performance at the Senior Bowl (I guess). Now alot of mock drafts have us taking him at #8.

Is this guy a LEGIT BONAFIDE STUD left tackle that will anchor our line for the next 10 years? Or is he just the "next best" after Joe Thomas?

I would hate to waste that high of a pick unless the guy would finally SOLVE our LT problem since there will be so much talent (especially defensively) sitting there at #8...


And to me all of this is awash if Adrian Peterson is available, but it looks more and more like Cleveland will take him and then wait to draft Troy Smith as their QB in round 2 or 3...

Thoughts?

At this point I'd call him more of a "next best after Joe Thomas". He is definitely a solid player but I am far from convinced that he is a legitimate career LT in the NFL, and I think the coaching staff is really sold on Charles Spencer being our LT, so unless Spencer shows before the draft that he is clearly not going to be healthy then I don't see them using the #8 on Brown. If Joe Thomas somehow fell to us at #8 then I think they would likely go ahead and take him then shuffle Spencer to RT and Winston to RG, but I don't think Brown is that good of a prospect.

threetoedpete
01-31-2007, 09:01 PM
At this point I'd call him more of a "next best after Joe Thomas". He is definitely a solid player but I am far from convinced that he is a legitimate career LT in the NFL, and I think the coaching staff is really sold on Charles Spencer being our LT, so unless Spencer shows before the draft that he is clearly not going to be healthy then I don't see them using the #8 on Brown. If Joe Thomas somehow fell to us at #8 then I think they would likely go ahead and take him then shuffle Spencer to RT and Winston to RG, but I don't think Brown is that good of a prospect.

And that makes you wrong...Nothing more.

beerlover
01-31-2007, 09:29 PM
before a couple of the best posters shred each other to bits, lets just agree to keep collecting info and revist this topic later, like after the combine :flowers:

I want to see their short shuttle times, that would give some indication of their foot speed & ability to move in space. also the lifting, how strong is Brown? I know Thomas is a good shotput thrower in track so I know he is strong, also the official measureables like height, weight & reach. wish we could be in on the interviewing sessions, that one I'm confident in Levi.

MorKnolle
01-31-2007, 09:34 PM
before a couple of the best posters shred each other to bits, lets just agree to keep collecting info and revist this topic later, like after the combine :flowers:

I want to see their short shuttle times, that would give some indication of their foot speed & ability to move in space. also the lifting, how strong is Brown? I know Thomas is a good shotput thrower in track so I know he is strong, also the official measureables like height, weight & reach. wish we could be in on the interviewing sessions, that one I'm confident in Levi.

It will be interesting to see their times, although I have my doubts that Joe Thomas will work out at the Combine, especially after skipping the Senior Bowl. I wouldn't at all be surprised to see him wait until his pro day to work out. I expect both will put up pretty solid workouts, but in the end the deciding factor in most picks will be off of game tape, which is what I'm trying to go off of for now.

And that makes you wrong...Nothing more.

We'll see.

beerlover
01-31-2007, 10:32 PM
It will be interesting to see their times, although I have my doubts that Joe Thomas will work out at the Combine, especially after skipping the Senior Bowl. I wouldn't at all be surprised to see him wait until his pro day to work out. I expect both will put up pretty solid workouts, but in the end the deciding factor in most picks will be off of game tape, which is what I'm trying to go off of for now.



We'll see. I'll be waiting http://media.scout.com/Media/Image/27/275366.jpg

threetoedpete
01-31-2007, 10:39 PM
That beastie would look mighty fine in a deep blue steel uniform is all I know. He'll blow the workouts away. I would sure sleep much better between April and August.

bah007
01-31-2007, 11:03 PM
It will be interesting to see their times, although I have my doubts that Joe Thomas will work out at the Combine, especially after skipping the Senior Bowl. I wouldn't at all be surprised to see him wait until his pro day to work out. I expect both will put up pretty solid workouts, but in the end the deciding factor in most picks will be off of game tape, which is what I'm trying to go off of for now.



We'll see.

I wouldnt be surprised in the least if Quinn or Thomas skips the combine.

Their stock is as high as it is gonna get & Quinn can keep playing the mysterious knee injury that kept him out of the Senior Bowl.

Why risk hurting your stock with a bad performance if a good performance isnt going to help it?

MorKnolle
01-31-2007, 11:13 PM
I wouldnt be surprised in the least if Quinn or Thomas skips the combine.

Their stock is as high as it is gonna get & Quinn can keep playing the mysterious knee injury that kept him out of the Senior Bowl.

Why risk hurting your stock with a bad performance if a good performance isnt going to help it?

That's likely the thought that most of these guys have when skipping the Combine. My thought (and my advice if any of them for some reason asked my opinion) would be work out at the Combine so if you do have an off day you can work hard and have a good pro day (most tracks at pro days are faster than at the Combine anyways, so people can run faster at their pro day than in Indy) as a backup plan. If you do really well at the Combine, then you can skip your pro day workout other than whatever drills you might not have done real well with (like Mario and others did last year). If you skip the Combine workout and then have a bad day at your pro day then that's the last impression that teams will have of you (like LenDale White last year). I'd prefer to have two chances at putting up a good workout, but for some guys like Joe Thomas that are a lock to be the top guy chosen at their position I can see why they might not want to work out since they have nothing to gain and can only hurt themselves. Brady Quinn may be feeling some heat from JaMarcus Russell and decide to workout, at this point who knows on him.

beerlover
02-01-2007, 02:14 AM
That's likely the thought that most of these guys have when skipping the Combine. My thought (and my advice if any of them for some reason asked my opinion) would be work out at the Combine so if you do have an off day you can work hard and have a good pro day (most tracks at pro days are faster than at the Combine anyways, so people can run faster at their pro day than in Indy) as a backup plan. If you do really well at the Combine, then you can skip your pro day workout other than whatever drills you might not have done real well with (like Mario and others did last year). If you skip the Combine workout and then have a bad day at your pro day then that's the last impression that teams will have of you (like LenDale White last year). I'd prefer to have two chances at putting up a good workout, but for some guys like Joe Thomas that are a lock to be the top guy chosen at their position I can see why they might not want to work out since they have nothing to gain and can only hurt themselves. Brady Quinn may be feeling some heat from JaMarcus Russell and decide to workout, at this point who knows on him.

high stakes poker w/millions on the line, these are the type of things that can sway a teams decision one way or the other, if you have nothing to hide, enjoy the game & like to be around the action & impress the coaches, scouts & GM's then by all means participate. But if your being held hostage by your agent/advisors or afraid to hurt established draft status then you can choose to hold out. since this is supposed to be Levi's thread lets see what he says,

01/26/07 - The Browns, along with the rest of the NFL, would have liked a look at Wisconsin left tackle Joe Thomas this week. But the 6-6, 310-pounder pulled out of Saturday's Senior Bowl late last week, a common move for players projected at the top of the NFL draft. Though it's agents who typically steer players away from the game, for some scouts, the desire of a top player not to hurt his draft status by risking exposure raises questions about that player's competitiveness. Some of the players here agree. "It shows a little fear sometimes that maybe you have something to hide," said Penn State tackle Levi Brown. Thomas was of such high interest to the Browns because, as one member of the staff said, they are looking for an "infusion" of offensive linemen in this draft. Thomas is probably the only lineman worthy of consideration with the Browns' first pick, which will be at either No. 3 or No. 4 pending a coin flip with Tampa Bay. - Doug Lesmerises, Cleveland Plain Dealer

David's Busted Carr
02-01-2007, 09:06 AM
I personally think people put too much stock in the combine. With all due respect to Mario Williams, but he "became" our #1 pick last year b/c of his combine performance. Before that he was considered a solid prospect (probably top 10), but not the #1 overall.

I would rather evalutate performance on the field and character. Just b/c one guy can run faster or jump higher than another guy does NOT mean he will perform better on the field...

That is why the majority of BONAFIDE top prospects skip the combine, because their play ON THE FIELD speaks for itself...

All this being said, I hope the Texans don't fall into that trap again with Levi Brown if he does have a great combine workout...

beerlover
02-01-2007, 09:30 AM
I personally think people put too much stock in the combine. With all due respect to Mario Williams, but he "became" our #1 pick last year b/c of his combine performance. Before that he was considered a solid prospect (probably top 10), but not the #1 overall.

I would rather evalutate performance on the field and character. Just b/c one guy can run faster or jump higher than another guy does NOT mean he will perform better on the field...

That is why the majority of BONAFIDE top prospects skip the combine, because their play ON THE FIELD speaks for itself...

All this being said, I hope the Texans don't fall into that trap again with Levi Brown if he does have a great combine workout...

true enough, I think more emphasis should be placed on what happens on the field, which is why Adrien Petersons stock has seemingly dropped placing him in the Texans range @ #8 because of the hits/injurys he has taken. but if he is now healthy & wants to prove it @ the combine and blows away NFL teams with his measureables don't you think his stock rises back as one of the top 5 picks?

in a prospects case even @ a big program like Penn State its possible to fly under the radar, for various reasons. could be a very limited system & does not have the complex pro-style formations, or poor performance record due to injurys & losses to the NFL the previous year. then what the combine can display is a prospects real time measureables. they will be anaylized in relation to whats available to the other prospects for that position & broken down to either approve or disapprove what they have on tape/game film. this data will help solidify answears to questions like how fast is he really without pads, how quick can he move in space, change directions laterally, stop & go, how does his strength measure up against his peers, his intelligence, how well does he interview & project himself on a public stage, does he have character issues etc. etc. etc.

Just because a player may have had a steller Collegiate career does not mean he translates well or even at the same position in the NFL, true the same can be said for the combine numbers, but what it does is help scouts/NFL teams define the position and upside for a player to make a fit for their teams future :shades:

Eyeguy
02-01-2007, 10:50 AM
I am SICK of trying to find a LT each year in FA or the draft. I'm OK with drafting someone who MIGHT not be an All Pro, but will be able to play the position for the next 10 years.
If the only player issue solved in this years draft is a dependable long term LT then I will take that just so we don't need to discuss the position in the furture.
Can we PLEASE move on with this team.

beerlover
02-10-2007, 09:00 PM
just received eval from a real NFL scout of the top tackles since 02 (It sure would have been nice to have this issue long since resolved but it has'nt been). with the exception of players in this years draft the Texans have passed on every single one :beerfunnel:

Joe Thomas
Robert Gallery
Bryant McKinnie
Jammal Brown
D'Brickashaw Ferguson
Jordan Gross
Levi Brown
Marcus McNeill
Alex Barron
Kwame Harris
Shawn Andrews

MorKnolle
02-10-2007, 09:06 PM
just received eval from a real NFL scout of the top tackles since 02 (It sure would have been nice to have this issue long since resolved but it has'nt been). with the exception of players in this years draft the Texans have passed on every single one :beerfunnel:

Joe Thomas
Robert Gallery
Bryant McKinnie
Jammal Brown
D'Brickashaw Ferguson
Jordan Gross
Levi Brown
Marcus McNeill
Alex Barron
Kwame Harris
Shawn Andrews

FYI we didn't pass on Gallery, he was drafted #2 in 2004, we had the 10th pick that year.

beerlover
02-10-2007, 09:13 PM
FYI we didn't pass on Gallery, he was drafted #2 in 2004, we had the 10th pick that year.

oops chalk one up for Morknolle after all how could we pass on what was never there to pass on to begin with- how did that work for the Raiders anyway, he should have ended up in Cleveland they wanted him badly if I remember correctly.

bah007
02-10-2007, 09:30 PM
just received eval from a real NFL scout of the top tackles since 02 (It sure would have been nice to have this issue long since resolved but it has'nt been). with the exception of players in this years draft the Texans have passed on every single one :beerfunnel:

Joe Thomas
Robert Gallery
Bryant McKinnie
Jammal Brown
D'Brickashaw Ferguson
Jordan Gross
Levi Brown
Marcus McNeill
Alex Barron
Kwame Harris
Shawn Andrews

Shawn Andrews is a Guard, not a Tackle.

beerlover
02-10-2007, 09:39 PM
Shawn Andrews is a Guard, not a Tackle.

should have included this "Shawn Andrews (I personally ranked exclusively as an OG)." consensus @ the time rated him as a RT (probably why he was included on that list).

threetoedpete
02-11-2007, 01:36 AM
just received eval from a real NFL scout of the top tackles since 02 (It sure would have been nice to have this issue long since resolved but it has'nt been). with the exception of players in this years draft the Texans have passed on every single one :beerfunnel:

Joe Thomas
Robert Gallery
Bryant McKinnie
Jammal Brown
D'Brickashaw Ferguson
Jordan Gross
Levi Brown
Marcus McNeill
Alex Barron
Kwame Harris
Shawn Andrews

The other list that belongs next to this, is the list of the fab five we've brought in and didn't make it. Bosselli, Ryan Young, Todd Wade, Seth Wand..and Victor Riley...pretty damn pathetic if you ask me. Am I missing someone ? You can nit pick beerlovers list all you want. But what the lists shows is people don't let productive OTs walk. And further, this organizations lack of attention to the problem is beyond apathetic. Never a pick beyond a fifty pick is damn near criminal. I guess All Day getting beat up behind our current line will thrill some folks though. I don't get it.

beerlover
02-11-2007, 11:35 AM
The other list that belongs next to this, is the list of the fab five we've brought in and didn't make it. Bosselli, Ryan Young, Todd Wade, Seth Wand..and Victor Riley...pretty damn pathetic if you ask me. Am I missing someone ? You can nit pick beerlovers list all you want. But what the lists shows is people don't let productive OTs walk. And further, this organizations lack of attention to the problem is beyond apathetic. Never a pick beyond a fifty pick is damn near criminal. I guess All Day getting beat up behind our current line will thrill some folks though. I don't get it.

excellent points threetoedpete. also brought up the same postional blunders/misfortunes @ LT as you did. asked him specificly to watch Levi @ the combine & report his findings. seems like either I have a total "man crush" "completely off the mark" on his (Levi Brown) draft stock if you listen to others (that I respect) like Morknoll, or just "too focused on need" to be objective. I don't know anymore.

Levi Brown looks like a LT http://vmedia.rivals.com/IMAGES/Player/photo/BROWN_LEVI_67150.JPG plays like a LT http://www.cumberlink.com/PSUfootball/03/game02/brown0904.jpg sounds like a LT http://www.cumberlink.com/PSUfootball/04/game07/images/1014_levi_brown.jpgthen he must be a LThttp://www.nittanyanthology.com/pic_BROWN_Levi.jpg

from the Penn State offical bios-

http://www.gopsusports.com/pressreleases/pressrelease.cfm?anncid=11717

Levi Brown
Tackle
Norfolk, Va.
An offensive line that was the catalyst in Penn State doubling its scoring average and ranking second in the Big Ten in
rushing in 2005 was rebuilt this season around senior All-America tackle Levi Brown, the unitís lone returning starter. In
the unit where continuity is most critical, several injuries and some ineffective play produced a total of five different
starting lineups, making Brownís leadership role even more difficult. Even team co-captain Brown could not escape the
injury bug, missing the Northwestern and Minnesota games with a sprained knee. Brown started 45 of the last 48 games
of his career and earned second-team All-America accolades from the Walter Camp Football Foundation and The
Sporting News. He also earned third-team All-America accolades from the Associated Press to go with his AP second
team honors from 2005. Penn Stateís best offensive lineman in the past 10 years, the 6-5, 328-pound Brown had started
21 consecutive games before missing the two contests. A two-time All-Big Ten selection, the Norfolk, Va., standout is a
dominating presence. He was instrumental in helping the Nittany Lions rush for a season-high 389 yards against
Youngstown State, their highest total in four years. At Purdue, Brown and the O-Line paved the way for 240 yards on the
ground. The Lions rushed for 212 yards against Temple to record Penn Stateís fourth 200-yard rushing game this season.
The former Granby HS standout helped Tony Hunt become just the sixth Nittany Lion to compiled a pair of 1,000 yard
rushing seasons, with eight 100-yard games this fall. Hunt gained 3,320 career yards, second-best in Penn State annals,
and finished the 2006 season with 1,386 yards, sixth-best in school season history. In the Outback Bowl win over
Tennessee, PSU primarily ran to the left side behind Brown, gaining 183 yards on 40 attempts, including 158 yards from
Hunt. Brown and the O-Line did not allow quarterback Anthony Morelli to be sacked by the Vols. A preseason candidate
for the Outland Trophy and Rotary Lombardi Award, Brownís play on the field does much of his speaking, but he has
become a more vocal leader for the offense this season. He received the Richard Maginnis Memorial Award as the teamís
top offensive lineman. Brown earned his degree in labor and industrial relations in 3 1/2 years, graduating in December
2005. He earned his second degree, in psychology, in December. In the 2007 Senior Bowl, Brown helped the North gain
17 first downs, with 110 yards rushing and 264 yards of total offense in a 27-0 victory.

Maddict5
02-12-2007, 09:01 AM
just received eval from a real NFL scout of the top tackles since 02 (It sure would have been nice to have this issue long since resolved but it has'nt been). with the exception of players in this years draft the Texans have passed on every single one :beerfunnel:

Joe Thomas
Robert Gallery
Bryant McKinnie
Jammal Brown
D'Brickashaw Ferguson
Jordan Gross
Levi Brown
Marcus McNeill
Alex Barron
Kwame Harris
Shawn Andrews

terrible list- levi jones isnt even on it and hes should be no.1 on the 'list'...many of those players arent great ot's

yourfavoritetexan42
02-12-2007, 09:55 AM
We won't draft levi brown. He doesn't fit our scheme in any shape or form. I think he will be a decent player in another scheme...but if we somehow do draft him, he will be a bust because he will be too immobile to be a run blocker, but he might do well pass protecting.

Meloy
02-12-2007, 03:29 PM
We won't draft levi brown. He doesn't fit our scheme in any shape or form. I think he will be a decent player in another scheme...but if we somehow do draft him, he will be a bust because he will be too immobile to be a run blocker, but he might do well pass protecting.Glad you mentioned this. He doesn't seem to meet Kube's
"smaller o linemen with quick feet". Oops, none of our other OL does either. Hey Meloy! you just might have something there. Well, thank you. Thank you very much. Meloy has now left the thread. Ladies please feel free to throw underwear. Sorry, long day. I just crack me up sometimes.:bananasplit:

Buckle
02-12-2007, 05:33 PM
"Has excellent size with a huge frame and long arms...A superb athlete with good quickness for his size...Moves well and has nimble feet...Once he is able to lock on it's over...Slides well and can handle speed off the edge...Strong and able to stun with his initial punch...Solid run blocker who gets a pretty good push...Has 4 years of starting experience versus top competition...Smart, hard working and a leader."

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/ot/levibrown.html

What about that says that he isn't good for our system? From what I have heard about him is that he is a very good athlete and is very mobile. I think I heard on a Penn State game that they also run a form of the zone blocking scheme there. If we could get Brown and Spencer comes back from injury our offensive line would actually be a strength I feel, even if Spencer couldn't come back, Winston was making good strides with the RT position.

beerlover
02-12-2007, 07:10 PM
I'm finished defending him against the ignorant w/cowpatties for brains :deadhorse

I'm now firmly in the trade down camp, who ever the best available pick is & adding one maybe two extra picks :mario:

Texan_Aggie222
02-12-2007, 07:30 PM
I am 100% all for this guy. I have him #3 on my big board behind Calvin Johnson and Joe Thomas. He has everying working for him. He plays the most important position on the football feild and could be a solid franchise player for years. I think he is the right selection for this football them in order to elevate them to the next step. You know we have this discussion every year and I'm tired of it. Lets get a franchise tackle and move on already. No, its not as flashy as a move as selecting a running back or linebacker, but its a solid football move and one we should make.

threetoedpete
02-14-2007, 12:41 PM
We won't draft levi brown. He doesn't fit our scheme in any shape or form. I think he will be a decent player in another scheme...but if we somehow do draft him, he will be a bust because he will be too immobile to be a run blocker, but he might do well pass protecting.

Someone disagrees with your assement.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/6421386

Football Time In Hou.
02-15-2007, 11:12 PM
I found this on youtube.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=igNRxKai1mE&mode=related&search=

threetoedpete
02-15-2007, 11:54 PM
I am 100% all for this guy. I have him #3 on my big board behind Calvin Johnson and Joe Thomas. He has everying working for him. He plays the most important position on the football feild and could be a solid franchise player for years. I think he is the right selection for this football them in order to elevate them to the next step. You know we have this discussion every year and I'm tired of it. Lets get a franchise tackle and move on already. No, its not as flashy as a move as selecting a running back or linebacker, but its a solid football move and one we should make.

agreed: If they fall in love with all Day or they feel Quinn with his knowledge is thier guy, I'll be on board. But sooner or later they will have to adress it. The excuse that "he doesn't fit the system" is the same thing that had us passing on the two pro bowl staters this year, McNeil and Jamall Brown. I mean how prefect does the OLT guy have to be ? And when for goodness sakes, will we ever be in a position to draft the perfect one ? It's just a silly argument. I'm going to be giddy if we pick the guy. I think he's a great pick and will be a bench mark, much like Joe Green was for the Steelers, as the turning point in this franchises history. I can't post it stronger than that. I'm with beerlover at this point though...whatever. I can stand it as long as they can.

run-david-run
02-16-2007, 12:21 AM
I'm finished defending him against the ignorant w/cowpatties for brains :deadhorse

I'm now firmly in the trade down camp, who ever the best available pick is & adding one maybe two extra picks :mario:

Weird how arguments cycle...Daft Reggie, no trade down and get D'Brick, what about Mario....

Right now I would say that AP is my first choice (more hope then realism that he will be there) with Levi Brown second.

David's Busted Carr
02-16-2007, 10:08 AM
If AP or Alan Branch are not available when we pick, I'm really starting to lean towards Levi.

The more I read about him, the more I like him. 4 year starter at in a top notch football program. Has a great work ethic and seems coachable.

And the prospect of filling that GAPING hole that our franchise has had since inception is so tempting...

And all this "he doesn't fit our scheme" talk is nonsense. The same argument is why we passed on PRO BOWLER Jamaal Brown 2 years ago...

beerlover
02-16-2007, 10:24 AM
my source just e-mailed to let me know that he is not worried about how well Levi Brown performs/numbers in any drills unless they are significantly worse or better than the other top rated linemen.

"The proof, as they say, is in the puddin' - and Brown has shown plenty of puddin' as a starter over the years".

from a fans veiwpoint this is a revelation. NFL reveiw game footage, more the better & do not base ratings on performance post season (All Star, combines & workouts). teams just want confirmation, up close look & touch the products before they purchase.

yourfavoritetexan42
02-16-2007, 10:34 AM
He doens't fit our scheme completely; plus he is a definite reach. If we drafted him around 12-15, I wouldn't be against the pickup.

Out of these 3 players, one will be available. If not, I would love to trade down, but trading down wouldn't be available due to no one really wanting to trade up.:

1. Adrian Peterson
2. Alan Branch
3. Brady Quinn

If not, then Levi Brown, Okoye out of Louisville, or Landry out of LSU. It will be kind of a reach pick and I won't be completely satisfied, but whatever.


In Zone blocking you gotta be able to move well, Tony Ugoh I think fits our scheme a lot better than Levi Brown, and that is a 3rd round pickup.

beerlover
02-16-2007, 10:59 AM
He doens't fit our scheme completely; plus he is a definite reach. If we drafted him around 12-15, I wouldn't be against the pickup.

In Zone blocking you gotta be able to move well, Tony Ugoh I think fits our scheme a lot better than Levi Brown, and that is a 3rd round pickup.

I understand your concerns, prefrences & veiwpoint.

trust that Levi & his skill set to be a franchise type of LT in this scenero the 8th pick would be a bargain. not many of you know Levi converted from DT in his redshirt freshman year (02) came to Penn State along with Tama Hali (Kansas City). However, the coaching staff decided to shift their redshirt freshman to the offensive line before August camp. He went on to start 12 games at left tackle, performing in 841 plays. so here you have a player relatively new to his position but with more starting expereince @ LT than anyone in the nation. thats special in itself.

regarding zone blocking this is a system taylor made for Levi. this is what turned heads at the Senior Bowl during practices all week, then the game it was clear he stood out heads & shoulders above the rest of the premier talent at his position. he has the speed to handle the edge, the power to handle the bull rush and the technique/mass to be a dominant drive blocker, like for a zone blocking scheme. for a man his size he has unbeleivable nimbleness, good balance & ability to lead runner to the 2nd level.

damn it you made me do it again :deadhorse

Texan_Aggie222
02-17-2007, 09:51 AM
If you want a tackle that moves well, Levi Brown is the man to fit your bill. Tony Ugoh moves like my grandma compared to Levi Brown, who has the best feet for a lineman in this draft.

Bongo59
02-17-2007, 08:15 PM
if you pass on brown you'll continue to lose............got to get the OL straight...........Titans totally rebuilt their OL..........now they need just depth.............Miami is just praying you all pass on Brown

thunderkyss
02-17-2007, 09:07 PM
if you pass on brown you'll continue to lose............got to get the OL straight...........Titans totally rebuilt their OL..........now they need just depth.............Miami is just praying you all pass on Brown

IT doesn't hurt to have the most elusive QB in the history of the game(my opinion) to make that OL look good.

But I do like Levi..... & I'm starting to think it would be a steal if he is there at 8.

Oakland, Detroit, Cleveland, Tampa, Arizona, Washington & Minnesota...... I don't see one team that doesn't need a left tackle. & Arizona is letting Leonard Davis go....... if Brown has a good combine, we might not have a shot at him.

thunderkyss
02-17-2007, 09:44 PM
agreed: If they fall in love with all Day or they feel Quinn with his knowledge is thier guy, I'll be on board. But sooner or later they will have to adress it. The excuse that "he doesn't fit the system" is the same thing that had us passing on the two pro bowl staters this year, McNeil and Jamall Brown. I mean how prefect does the OLT guy have to be ? And when for goodness sakes, will we ever be in a position to draft the perfect one ? It's just a silly argument. I'm going to be giddy if we pick the guy. I think he's a great pick and will be a bench mark, much like Joe Green was for the Steelers, as the turning point in this franchises history. I can't post it stronger than that. I'm with beerlover at this point though...whatever. I can stand it as long as they can.

I'm open to Levi myself. After watching him at the probowl, and the little bit of scouring I've done on the net, I can't see Joe Thomas being hands down better than Levi Brown, and I truly believe if he is there at 8, it would be a tremendous value.

All that said, I won't doubt our guys going into the draft. They saw Spencer, & they didn't panic & take Winston too early.

There's nothing wrong with having Levi, Spencer, & Winston on our team(I wonder how Winston would do at Center)... & having that kind of depth would be awesome.

But if we pass on Levi... like I said, I'll give our guys the benefit of the doubt.

Navy_Chris
02-17-2007, 09:55 PM
I'm open to Levi myself. After watching him at the probowl, and the little bit of scouring I've done on the net, I can't see Joe Thomas being hands down better than Levi Brown, and I truly believe if he is there at 8, it would be a tremendous value.

All that said, I won't doubt our guys going into the draft. They saw Spencer, & they didn't panic & take Winston too early.

There's nothing wrong with having Levi, Spencer, & Winston on our team(I wonder how Winston would do at Center)... & having that kind of depth would be awesome.

But if we pass on Levi... like I said, I'll give our guys the benefit of the doubt.

I am 100% against ever drafting an offensive lineman in the first round of a draft. In any draft there is, you can get the same quality in the later rounds. Look at this year's draft in the later rounds: Tony Ugoh, Joe Staley, Brandon Frye, Justin Blalock, possibly Arron Sears...All of these guys can end up being just as good as a Top 15 or 20 OL. It's just wasted money when you draft an OL that high. I'm not trying to say guys like D'Brickashaw, Jamaal Brown and Chris Samuels are bad, I'm just saying that I believe it would be wise to concentrate on another area in the 1st round.

Navy_Chris
02-17-2007, 09:57 PM
I am 100% against ever drafting an offensive lineman in the first round of a draft. In any draft there is, you can get the same quality in the later rounds. Look at this year's draft in the later rounds: Tony Ugoh, Joe Staley, Brandon Frye, Justin Blalock, possibly Arron Sears...All of these guys can end up being just as good as a Top 15 or 20 OL. It's just wasted money when you draft an OL that high. I'm not trying to say guys like D'Brickashaw, Jamaal Brown and Chris Samuels are bad, I'm just saying that I believe it would be wise to concentrate on another area in the 1st round.

One more thing, you mentioned Levi Brown at #8 being a tremendous value. You don't draft for value in the 1st Round. You draft the best player available, regardless of need...but, if that player turns out to be a "need", then that's just an added bonus. In my opinion, Levi Brown will be a huge reach...one we can't afford to take.

beerlover
02-17-2007, 10:36 PM
One more thing, you mentioned Levi Brown at #8 being a tremendous value. You don't draft for value in the 1st Round. You draft the best player available, regardless of need...but, if that player turns out to be a "need", then that's just an added bonus. In my opinion, Levi Brown will be a huge reach...one we can't afford to take.

is quoting yourself akin to cross-dressing- then you qualify, congratulations :doot:

listen navy chris don't get all semantic on us, value, bpa whatever....remember its all about making the "best football decision", clearly you lack the knowledge to answear that bell..ding, ding :dangit:

the Texans need an injection of leadership. I don't really care where or how as long as it happens. study & learn grasshopper. its all about character, mental toughness, fight & endurance. the last one standing wins. football is won in the trenches. we draft Mario, fine the defensive line has its leader. while the offensive line plunders along like a mash unit on life support & therefore you think you don't invest in the offensive line with elite talent when available? brilliant. I'm sure the three C's full heartedly agree (Casserly, Cappers & Carr). by not addressing this need you've set this franchise back into expansion mode, once again congratulations.

beleive me I've tried to stay off this subject but it just keeps rising like cream to the top, every draft, every year and frankly alot of us are sick & tired of it. I realize my view doesn't amount to diddly squat & the Texans have never listened to their fan base.......but they need to stay the course with Carr & the first m/f need is to invest in his bodyguard, the man responsible for his blind side as well as his blind decision making. for any QB to thrive & exist in this league it takes chemistry, the will & communication that his linemen/bodyguards are there for him, once this happens everything & I mean everything will fall into place.

is that bpa? is that a "tremendous value"? maybe not. but I call it saving the franchise :drunk:

thunderkyss
02-18-2007, 01:17 AM
I think what Beerlover is trying to say(in my defense...... thanks bro) is when I say "value" I mean Levi should be gone before the 8th pick. If I grade him in the top 5(which I don't know if he is, he might be) and we can get him at 8, then that's great value..... he'll be the best player on my board.

Unless someone I think should be gone at #2 is still on the board.

I'm not Mr. DraftSavy like alot of these guys, I've only started looking at most of these players.

Calvin Johnson, clearly the best player in this draft.

Joe Thomas, Jamaal Anderson, Alan Branch, AD....... then I've got Brown.

Jamarcus is a hell of a prospect. A QB. I would have no problem with him going #1 overall. Even though I don't think he was the best QB of the '06 season. That's the way it goes. QBs are drafted as prospects.

Then you've got to figure in need. to really set the order. then you've got to factor in Free Agency. If Cleveland signs Domonic Rhodes, or somehow gets Michael Turner out of SanDiego, the probability of Peterson falling to 8 goes up quite a bit.

rickyb
02-18-2007, 11:50 AM
If Cleveland signs Domonic Rhodes, or somehow gets Michael Turner out of SanDiego, the probability of Peterson falling to 8 goes up quite a bit.

Hmmm, I also can warm up to the idea of the Texans making a move for Rhodes in FA. Doing so would kinda like be severing your enemy's leg and then beating him to death with the bloody stump. Ew. Sorry. Maybe that's an exaggeration. But certainly, addressing RB thru FA provides the Texans the draft flexibility to address other holes (OL, CB, safety, d-line, OLB).

I really have a good feeling going into this draft.

beerlover
02-23-2007, 10:48 PM
Levi Brown lifted 31 times (3 better than Thomas) but thats not really whats important. what's important is attitude & love for the game to excell @ the next level along with the physical attributes which is what the combine is all about. here are some highlights from his Combine Transcriptis that I'm sure will warm the hearts of a few Texans fans longing for a true fanchise LT.

"Coach Paterno prepares you for football but also prepares you for
life off the field. He gives you a lot of tools to make you successful
even if you're not.able to make it to that next level, makes you a
better person. He's had a lot of experience with a lot of guys, a lot
of guys come back and talk to us who have played in the NFL. Getting
that perspective from the players' side helps you to know what it takes
and things like that. The coaches there are great coaches. They go and
get advice from NFL coaches and things like that and bring it back to
us and teach us everything it takes. Being an offensive lineman, you
just have to learn attitude. You're not going to get a lot of recognition.
You just have to go out there and dominate every player."

also stated "I'm a great athlete, I love to play the game, I have the ability
to dominate anybody. I do plan on making it to a lot of Pro Bowls in my career."
or this "Just being able to dominate a guy who people say you're not
supposed to beat. You go against a premier defensive end and you take
his will away and at the end of the game he shakes your hand and
says 'You got me today.' That's the type of thing I look forward to."

how about "I do a lot of things well but I can get a lot better at all of them.
I definitely love run blocking more than pass blocking. I like to run
into a guy, knock him on his back, talk a little mess on the way down
and help him up, make it look good. Pass blocking you keep the guy
away from the quarterback, just try to dominate all game."

BattleRedToro
02-23-2007, 10:57 PM
IT doesn't hurt to have the most elusive QB in the history of the game(my opinion) to make that OL look good.

They don't have Michael Vick or Ron Mexico for that matter. :shades:

BattleRedToro
02-23-2007, 11:07 PM
I am 100% against ever drafting an offensive lineman in the first round of a draft. In any draft there is, you can get the same quality in the later rounds. Look at this year's draft in the later rounds: Tony Ugoh, Joe Staley, Brandon Frye, Justin Blalock, possibly Arron Sears...All of these guys can end up being just as good as a Top 15 or 20 OL. It's just wasted money when you draft an OL that high. I'm not trying to say guys like D'Brickashaw, Jamaal Brown and Chris Samuels are bad, I'm just saying that I believe it would be wise to concentrate on another area in the 1st round.

Go do the research and tell me that Munchak and Matthews weren't worth the first round picks the then Houston Oilers used on them. In addition they also used a first round pick on Steinkuhler as well. While he hasn't made the Hall of Fame like the other two have, he did help to solidify an outstanding O-Line which led to the Oilers making the playoffs for 7 years in a row. That is what can happen when you are able to identify and are willing and able to spend the picks on top quality O-Linemen.

BattleRedToro
02-23-2007, 11:11 PM
I'm sure the three C's full heartedly agree (Casserly, Cappers & Carr).

Actually, I'll bet David Carr would want the Texans to spend the pick on a LT. :winky:

BattleRedToro
02-23-2007, 11:18 PM
I don't know if you guys have seen this. I posted it in another thread but here it is again.

Levi Brown (http://youtube.com/watch?v=igNRxKai1mE)

dirty steve
02-23-2007, 11:41 PM
kffl reports brown interviewed with baltimore, miami, STL, NYJ, and Jacksonville on 02/23. didnt see anything about the Texans.

Navy_Chris
02-23-2007, 11:45 PM
Recently his stock has seemed to have jumped due to a solid performance at the Senior Bowl (I guess). Now alot of mock drafts have us taking him at #8.

Is this guy a LEGIT BONAFIDE STUD left tackle that will anchor our line for the next 10 years? Or is he just the "next best" after Joe Thomas?

I would hate to waste that high of a pick unless the guy would finally SOLVE our LT problem since there will be so much talent (especially defensively) sitting there at #8...


And to me all of this is awash if Adrian Peterson is available, but it looks more and more like Cleveland will take him and then wait to draft Troy Smith as their QB in round 2 or 3...

Thoughts?

This guy has stardom written all over him. Still, I am loathed to take an OL in the 1st round. However, given our lack of attention to our OL in years past and the injury to Charles Spencer...we HAVE to take him at #8. He's that good.

Ole Miss Texan
02-24-2007, 12:58 AM
kffl reports brown interviewed with baltimore, miami, STL, NYJ, and Jacksonville on 02/23. didnt see anything about the Texans.

at least we pick ahead of all of them. i like the guy a lot.

thunderkyss
02-24-2007, 09:49 AM
I don't think I've seen a LT that fits the ZBS as well as Levi Brown does.

When we passed on D'brickshaw last year, I expected it was becuase we were looking for a guy that looked like Levi. But instead we got a guy who was actually bigger than D'brichshaw, and looked like D'brick.

BattleRedToro
02-24-2007, 10:21 AM
I don't think I've seen a LT that fits the ZBS as well as Levi Brown does.

When we passed on D'brickshaw last year, I expected it was becuase we were looking for a guy that looked like Levi. But instead we got a guy who was actually bigger than D'brichshaw, and looked like D'brick.

I know this is a Levi Brown discussion thread, but when you mentioned the ZBS fit it immediately brought Kalil to mind. I know I shouldn't even think about it because he will almost certainly be gone before the Texans's 2nd Round pick, but I can't help but dream of an O-Line anchored by Brown and Kalil, with the additional possibilities of another O-Lineman drafted later as well and Spencer returning healthy. The O-Line could go from terrible to very good. Then the Texans could start shoving the ball down other teams's throats. :yes:

amazingandre
02-24-2007, 11:00 AM
I am beginning to like him more and more.....i think we should focus on defense in fa and offense in the draft......get brown in the first and if kalil is there in the second then get him too... but he just did 34 reps so i doubt he is there in the second rd....

edo783
02-24-2007, 11:08 AM
I am beginning to like him more and more.....i think we should focus on defense in fa and offense in the draft......get brown in the first and if kalil is there in the second then get him too... but he just did 34 reps so i doubt he is there in the second rd....

Yup a Brown & Kalil draft would put a big smile on my face, but with how Kalil's combine is going and how he looks on film, he isn't dropping out of the first and IMO, might even get into the low 20s. He seems to have everything your looking for in a center, particularly for a ZB scheme.

amazingandre
02-24-2007, 11:12 AM
i agree kalil wont be there in the second......there is a really tall guy not sure of his name though......they say he was a day two pick but now he is making himself into a 3rd or 2nd rd pick....anyone know of him or heard that.....id appreciate his name lol

TEXANRED
02-24-2007, 01:26 PM
i agree kalil wont be there in the second......there is a really tall guy not sure of his name though......they say he was a day two pick but now he is making himself into a 3rd or 2nd rd pick....anyone know of him or heard that.....id appreciate his name lol

I know who you are talking about, he is the guy with the hair, has teeth, speaks those words........:tease:

amazingandre
02-24-2007, 03:18 PM
haha....i really forgot his name.....he's like 6 7 or sumthing...i dont know w/e

threetoedpete
02-24-2007, 04:01 PM
What frustrates me this morning is Tony Ugohs number's compaired to his play at the senior bowl. Maybe it's just a function of playing for a running team. Maybe it's a function of coaching that you can correct in the six months you have with the guy before the season starts. He's a great athlete for sure.

So many o-line guys running near the five oh mark this is a very tallentent o-line group. It's not just the forty itself as Vermiel stated. It's the way they get off the line. It's the grace and movement they demonstrate as they run...I mean Joe thomas has the worst running track form I've ever seen and he stil broke 5.0 . Mix in the cone drills you've got a good idea of the guys that can keep up with the right DE's in the league and those who can't. As beerlover says the proof is in the film, but the guy dosen't have the first step, what you have is a right tackle og gaurd prospect, Not an OLT prospect. The guys around 5.0 have the best shot. There not a lock by any means , but they have the best chance to suceed at the next level. Shame Staley couldn't work out.

threetoedpete
02-24-2007, 04:05 PM
i agree kalil wont be there in the second......there is a really tall guy not sure of his name though......they say he was a day two pick but now he is making himself into a 3rd or 2nd rd pick....anyone know of him or heard that.....id appreciate his name lol

Yep, that guy put an exlamation point on his body of work today. Going to make it very hard for people at the bottom of the first, top of the second to by pass the guy. I doubt he makes it to us now. Now that guy, not a babins guy...is worth a move up and sacrificing of picks.

beerlover
03-05-2007, 08:07 AM
anyone else listening to sports radio 610 w/John McClain? not a Levi Brown fan at all. says he is a late 1st rd. pick & maybe not even 2nd best tackle available. my question is why year after year when it gets closer to the draft the Texans/media beat down the tackle prospects even though it has been a clear #1 overall need year in & year out?

last year it was D'Brickashaw Ferguson & in 05 Jammal Brown. the Texans (David Carr) has never had a true LT, the duty falls into the lap of a tweener (LG, RT) see Pitts/Spencer, all the time McClain admits their #1 need is a LT. just doesnt make alot of sense to me.

in regards to Brown, his stock is down right now so go ahead & kick him when hes down, I'm sure all these games hes played the last few weeks are really taking their toll :sarcasm: just another football player who will dominate @ the next level but not good enough for :logo: or Mr. John McClain :pigfly:

TEXANRED
03-05-2007, 08:17 AM
anyone else listening to sports radio 610 w/John McClain? not a Levi Brown fan at all. says he is a late 1st rd. pick & maybe not even 2nd best tackle available. my question is why year after year when it gets closer to the draft the Texans/media beat down the tackle prospects even though it has been a clear #1 overall need year in & year out?

last year it was D'Brickashaw Ferguson & in 05 Jammal Brown. the Texans (David Carr) has never had a true LT, the duty falls into the lap of a tweener (LG, RT) see Pitts/Spencer, all the time McClain admits their #1 need is a LT. just doesnt make alot of sense to me.

in regards to Brown, his stock is down right now so go ahead & kick him when hes down, I'm sure all these games hes played the last few weeks are really taking their toll :sarcasm: just another football player who will dominate @ the next level but not good enough for :logo: or Mr. John McClain :pigfly:

Well his stock is falling b/c his forty time was slow. To be honest though that is an issue if your a Texan. Our Line guys really do need to be fast b/c when Carr fumbles the football you need someone fast enough to run them down and save the TD.

McClain I think sometimes gets caught up in the hype, he is drooling all over CJ and I am sure he would like to see us move up to draft Peterson. Brown is the boring pick. I am OK with boring.

nunusguy
03-05-2007, 08:22 AM
anyone else listening to sports radio 610 w/John McClain? not a Levi Brown fan at all. says he is a late 1st rd. pick & maybe not even 2nd best tackle available. my question is why year after year when it gets closer to the draft the Texans/media beat down the tackle prospects even though it has been a clear #1 overall need year in & year out?
last year it was D'Brickashaw Ferguson & in 05 Jammal Brown.
I'm listening to 610 myself right now, but I don't pay much attention to McClain when it comes to evaluating players.
I don't know what to think of LB ? I'm really looking forward to Rick Gossenlin's
first mock to see where he has Brown, 'cause most of these mockers are about as knowledgeble as McClain and therefor not too reliable.
That got my attention whne they said that Kubiak personally attended Quinns workout in South Bend yesterday ?
Whoa ! What was that remark about Anna-Megan ? Was that McClain ?

kastofsna
03-05-2007, 08:27 AM
brown's 40-time is meaningless. top 15 pick.

TEXANRED
03-05-2007, 08:29 AM
brown's 40-time is meaningless. top 15 pick.

I think you missed the joke.

kastofsna
03-05-2007, 08:31 AM
probably because i wasn't responding to a joke.

TEXANRED
03-05-2007, 08:32 AM
probably because i wasn't responding to a joke.

Oh OK.

Xman
03-05-2007, 11:03 AM
Based on these evaluations - I would say he should be a good RT - but we need a LT - so I pass in him at #8. But, if we moved down to 11-14 range, then I would take him (as long as Landry was off the board).

From ESPN:

Levi Brown
OT | (6'5", 323, 5.3) | PENN STATE

Scouts Grade: 92

Flags: (D: DURABILITY) Player that can't stay healthy

Strengths: Possesses adequate-to-good height and very good bulk. He displays outstanding quickness and body control for such a big offensive lineman. He has long, thick arms and also has a wide base. He does a good job of coming out of his stance low as a run blocker and he is big enough to engulf most defenders at the point of attack once in position. Does a good job with his first step and consistently takes good angles as a run blocker. Works hard to finish and shows enough of a mean streak. Sets quickly and rarely will get beat by speed off the edge. He displays above average lateral mobility. Also shows awareness to pick up stunts and blitzes in pass pro.

Weaknesses: Still has room to improve in terms of his overall technique. He needs to become more effective with his hand-placement and avoid getting crossed over as much in pass pro. He falls off of blocks occasionally and needs to do a better job of locking on and sustaining. He absorbs defenders at times instead of being aggressive and attacking. He will flash a mean streak occasionally but he also will look mechanical at times, which leads to him losing leverage and balance. He was durable throughout most of his career but minor knee surgery as a senior still generates concern about his durability.

Overall: Brown practiced at defensive tackle in 2002, did not see any action, and was redshirted. He was converted to the offensive line before the 2003 season and became the starting left tackle for all 12 games that year. As a redshirt sophomore in 2004, Brown started 10 games (nine at LOT and one at ROT), missing one game (10/9 vs. Purdue) because of a sprained knee that he sustained vs. Minnesota. He started all 12 games at the left tackle position in 2005. Brown started all 11 of the games he played in as a senior, missing two (Northwestern and Minnesota) as a result of a surgery to repair a torn meniscus in his knee.
Brown is an experienced left tackle prospect that finished his career at Penn State as a four-year starter. He still has room to improve in terms of technique, especially in pass protection. His knee injury as a senior also proved to be a minor setback and could cause him to slip a bit in the upcoming draft. Despite those concerns, we still give Brown a mid-to-late first round grade because of his outstanding combination of size, agility and strength. Furthermore, he had been durable for the three seasons prior to his senior year and his footwork is correctable.


From Footballs Future:
Levi Brown OT 6'5 328 Penn St.
By: Robert Davis
After redshirting in 2002, Brown took over at left tackle for the Nittany Lions in 2003, and has not let the position go since. He started one game at right tackle in 2004, but that was because he was slowed with a knee injury. He returned the left side the following week. Last season as a junior, Brown was named 1st team All Big 10, and landed on a few All American teams. He became a two time All American as a senior, landing on various AA lists after the season.

Levi Brown looks like an excellent right tackle prospect. He has the strong frame, and plays with very good power in the running game. He can dominate at the point of attack, and move defenders off the line. Brown will also finish off run plays by driving his man into the ground. He also shows the ability to keep the defender in front of him in pass protection. Brown may bring quite a bit of versatility. Heís played left tackle in college, and may be able to play there in the NFL. His best spot looks like RT, and his ability as a run blocker could allow him to play inside at guard as well.

Judging him as the left tackle spot he has played in college, Brown may lack the athleticism and agility to be a top notch left tackle at the next level. He may be able to hold his own, but it is something he will have to prove once drafted. As a right tackle however, he appears to be what everyone looks for at the position.

Brown is one of the top senior lineman available for the draft. He may not project the best as the premium left tackle position, but as a right tackle, he may be the best available. He is a legitimate first round talent, and a solid senior season will only cement that position.

Ole Miss Texan
03-05-2007, 11:10 AM
Any body see Arizona starting to become a trading partner for someone? i dont know who they've shown interest in...besides everybody saying thomas. I think Brown would be an awesome fit at right tackle for matt leinart....if they trade downt hey could get better value for him....maybe AP,BQ, or JR may be there at their spot and look for a partner..if its not too far down...washington is right behind them who needs more picks..so it could be a battle b/w the two.

Arizona Cardinals select RT Levi Brown!! lol

real
03-05-2007, 11:15 AM
T.a.d.b.

beerlover
03-05-2007, 12:22 PM
From ESPN:

Levi Brown
OT | (6'5", 323, 5.3) | PENN STATE

Scouts Grade: 92

Flags: (D: DURABILITY) Player that can't stay healthy


then they go on to say-

He was durable throughout most of his career but minor knee surgery as a senior still generates concern about his durability.

So he missed three games his carrer @ Penn State & they ding him a D for lack of durability? give me a freaking break.

Overall: Brown practiced at defensive tackle in 2002, did not see any action, and was redshirted. He was converted to the offensive line before the 2003 season and became the starting left tackle for all 12 games that year. As a redshirt sophomore in 2004, Brown started 10 games (nine at LOT and one at ROT), missing one game (10/9 vs. Purdue) because of a sprained knee that he sustained vs. Minnesota. He started all 12 games at the left tackle position in 2005. Brown started all 11 of the games he played in as a senior, missing two (Northwestern and Minnesota) as a result of a surgery to repair a torn meniscus in his knee.
Brown is an experienced left tackle prospect that finished his career at Penn State as a four-year starter. He still has room to improve in terms of technique, especially in pass protection. His knee injury as a senior also proved to be a minor setback and could cause him to slip a bit in the upcoming draft. Despite those concerns, we still give Brown a mid-to-late first round grade because of his outstanding combination of size, agility and strength. Furthermore, he had been durable for the three seasons prior to his senior year and his footwork is correctable.

Is that you John McClain?


From Footballs Future:
Levi Brown OT 6'5 328 Penn St.
By: Robert Davis
After redshirting in 2002, Brown took over at left tackle for the Nittany Lions in 2003, and has not let the position go since.

Ole Miss Texan
03-13-2007, 11:17 PM
Just thought I'd let all the big Levi Brown fans that his birthday is coming up...Friday March 16th. lol

thunderkyss
03-14-2007, 08:06 AM
What frustrates me this morning is Tony Ugohs number's compaired to his play at the senior bowl. Maybe it's just a function of playing for a running team. Maybe it's a function of coaching that you can correct in the six months you have with the guy before the season starts. He's a great athlete for sure.

So many o-line guys running near the five oh mark this is a very tallentent o-line group. It's not just the forty itself as Vermiel stated. It's the way they get off the line. It's the grace and movement they demonstrate as they run...I mean Joe thomas has the worst running track form I've ever seen and he stil broke 5.0 . Mix in the cone drills you've got a good idea of the guys that can keep up with the right DE's in the league and those who can't. As beerlover says the proof is in the film, but the guy dosen't have the first step, what you have is a right tackle og gaurd prospect, Not an OLT prospect. The guys around 5.0 have the best shot. There not a lock by any means , but they have the best chance to suceed at the next level. Shame Staley couldn't work out.

Does anybody know what Spencer & Winston did at the combine??

David's Busted Carr
03-14-2007, 09:10 AM
The Dolphins reportedly "do not think highly" of Penn State left tackle Levi Brown.

Miami are desperate for a left tackle, but not enough to reach for Brown in the top ten. Look for them to address the position in April because their weak in-house options include Vernon Carey, L.J. Shelton, and Anthony Alabi. The Dolphins will meet with former Falcons G Matt Lehr next week.

real
03-14-2007, 09:17 AM
Levi Brown is not worth a top 15 pick.

Only in draft weak at that position does he get pushed up like he is.

real
03-14-2007, 09:27 AM
Does anybody know what Spencer & Winston did at the combine??

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/graphics/nfldraft06/flash.htm

thunderkyss
03-14-2007, 09:51 AM
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/graphics/nfldraft06/flash.htm

Wow, that's a great site..... I'd love to be able to save that.

But I see Spencer's 40 time(5.25) & being projected as a guard didn't sway Kubiak in projecting him as a LT... And most of our fans seemed to be happy with him at LT.

real
03-14-2007, 09:56 AM
Wow, that's a great site..... I'd love to be able to save that.

But I see Spencer's 40 time(5.25) & being projected as a guard didn't sway Kubiak in projecting him as a LT... And most of our fans seemed to be happy with him at LT.

That forty stuff by itself is bogus...

Actually looking at any one aspect by itself is bogus...


If they had drills where they timed a linemans first step for different blocks that would be a hell-uv-a drill. First step is the one that matters to lineman.

Having Quickness out of your stance is probably one of THE most important things.

real
03-14-2007, 10:02 AM
And yeah, that's a cool site.

Ole Miss Texan
03-14-2007, 10:25 AM
awesome sight....that just reiterates how much Mario was above every other DE. His numbers were simply amazing...i'm in awe.

real
03-14-2007, 10:27 AM
Did you see how you can click on the players name and read up on their history ?

Vinny
03-14-2007, 10:31 AM
Wow, that's a great site..... I'd love to be able to save that.

But I see Spencer's 40 time(5.25) & being projected as a guard didn't sway Kubiak in projecting him as a LT... And most of our fans seemed to be happy with him at LT.since when did a tackle have to sprint 40 yards to set up and protect a QB? 40 times are totally overrated. Quick feet, balance and some junk in the trunk is more important than a 40 time.

David's Busted Carr
03-14-2007, 10:38 AM
awesome sight....that just reiterates how much Mario was above every other DE. His numbers were simply amazing...i'm in awe.

Who cares about numbers... I want to see it on the field.

Look at DeMeco. His numbers weren't spectacular, but he's your DROY...

People sometimes get too caught up in numbers IMO...

Vinny
03-14-2007, 10:43 AM
Who cares about numbers... I want to see it on the field.

Look at DeMeco. His numbers weren't spectacular, but he's your DROY...

People sometimes get too caught up in numbers IMO...over the years of watching people post on message boards I think that some of these guys don't watch as much football as they would like and have to rely on numbers to "evaluate" the players....it doesn't work, but it does create a ton of unintentional humor.

infantrycak
03-14-2007, 10:46 AM
Look at DeMeco. His numbers weren't spectacular, but he's your DROY...

People sometimes get too caught up in numbers IMO...

Can't remember the analyst (Kirwan maybe), but one of them does a rating which combines a bunch of the drills. DeMeco may not have been top in any one drill but his combined rating (along with Mario's) was at the very top of the class from last year's draft.

Yes, the numbers can be over analyzed though.

thunderkyss
03-14-2007, 11:00 AM
since when did a tackle have to sprint 40 yards to set up and protect a QB? 40 times are totally overrated. Quick feet, balance and some junk in the trunk is more important than a 40 time.

I totally agree. I was basically saying that to the idea(brought up earlier in this thread) that a Tackle who can't run a sub 5.0 40 is best suited at RT or Guard.

Ole Miss Texan
03-14-2007, 11:07 AM
over the years of watching people post on message boards I think that some of these guys don't watch as much football as they would like and have to rely on numbers to "evaluate" the players....it doesn't work, but it does create a ton of unintentional humor.

excuse me for being impressed by his numbers. He was replying to what i said so I'll take you're reply to him to be somewhat referencing me. He's just simply very strong and athletic.

IMO this is how you should look at combine numbers..or at least I do. They are sorta a bonus...they don't show his potential or leadership or anything on the football field. All it does is show how athletic, quick, and strong the athlete is. It's okay to be impressed with these numbers.

Looking at film is the best way to scout a player to see what he does in certain situations and how he reacts to those plays. I watch plenty of football don't hardly rely on numbers like some people. Stats can be just as disceptive as combine numbers...I think it's humorous when people simply look at stats...and not how the player got those 'stats'.