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Toro
01-28-2007, 02:24 PM
Everyone hangs Brady Quinn for the way Notre Dame as a whole played, however here's a stat for you guys to chew on.

In 11 games against ranked teams over the past two seasons, JaMarcus Russell threw 13 touchdown passes and 11 interceptions. He threw 30 touchdowns and six interceptions against everyone else. I'm not putting these numbers up to stake out an arguement of who's better of the two, I'm stating facts.

Texian
01-28-2007, 02:33 PM
How many of those 11 games did Russell win? How many ranked opponets did Quinn play agaisnt? How many did Quinn win?

htownfoozball
01-28-2007, 02:34 PM
who cares. not like either one is coming to houston

kastofsna
01-28-2007, 02:38 PM
quinn's performance against USC in '05 was far better than any performance russell had against any ranked team. and the talent differnece between those two teams was exceptional.

Toro
01-28-2007, 02:40 PM
who cares. not like either one is coming to houston

I thought this was the forum for NFL Draft discussion as a whole. Didn't know it was limited to Texan-only possibilities.

Silver Oak
01-28-2007, 02:44 PM
I think it has a great deal to do with the Texans, as if either of those players goes in a higher or lower spot, then our list of available players could be altered drastically.

I still don't see Russell being taken by the Raiders. Al Davis has to be a little leery of the rawness of him.

Toro
01-28-2007, 02:46 PM
How many of those 11 games did Russell win? How many ranked opponets did Quinn play agaisnt? How many did Quinn win?

LSU was 7-4 in 11 games against ranked opponents with Russell at the helm.

This year, LSU went 3-2 against ranked teams. Last year, 4-2 (Tennessee was ranked when they played and beat LSU).

Notre Dame was 8-6 in 14 games against ranked opponents with Quinn as QB, with Quinn throwing for 29 touchdowns and 12 interceptions.

Notre Dame this year went 2-3 against ranked opponents (Michigan State was ranked when they played), and Quinn threw 16 TDs and 6 interceptions.

Last year, the Irish went 4-2 against ranked opponents, with Quinn throwing 8 TDs against 3 interceptions.

In '04, they went 2-2 against ranked teams where he had 5 TDs and 3 Interceptions.

So, make your own judgements from this. I've heard many arguements that state Quinn plays like crap in the big game, where in actuality, he's played fairly well against ranked opponents.

Toro
01-28-2007, 03:24 PM
I think it has a great deal to do with the Texans, as if either of those players goes in a higher or lower spot, then our list of available players could be altered drastically.

I still don't see Russell being taken by the Raiders. Al Davis has to be a little leery of the rawness of him.

Good point, and until draft day occurs and Russell is selected, or news breaks otherwise, I STILL think the Raiders are taking Calvin Johnson.

Titan "Tack" Fan
01-28-2007, 03:30 PM
If you are going to throw those stats out there then how many TDs did Vince Young throw against ranked teams last year? Texas played what, one ranked team in the regular season? I don't think it matters.

Toro
01-28-2007, 03:33 PM
If you are going to throw those stats out there then how many TDs did Vince Young throw against ranked teams last year? Texas played what, one ranked team in the regular season? I don't think it matters.

Young also hung 467 all purpose yards against USC and put up 270 yards and 2 TDs against a damn good Ohio State defense so that logic can't be applied here.

kastofsna
01-28-2007, 04:05 PM
in actuality though, wins in college really mean nothing.

DRIFTAWAY
01-28-2007, 05:30 PM
in actuality though, wins in college really mean nothing.

well you would like to have someone from a winning program with a winning attitude.

run-david-run
01-28-2007, 05:34 PM
in actuality though, wins in college really mean nothing.

Thats why its dumb to compare the QB's record when its a team game. However, the stat that started this discussion is worth noting because it relates to the individual performance of the QB.

dtran04
01-28-2007, 05:39 PM
Ken Dorsey = winning QB

Toro
01-28-2007, 06:27 PM
It is stupid to compare the win and loss total of each. The only reason I brought that up is because of the requst of a poster in this thread who wanted to know how many wins came in those 11 games that Russell struggled in. I threw Quinn's totals in just for comparison purposes.

Also, it takes note because people will bang on Quinn for his team's "performance" in big games, when in actuality his numbers in a comparitive number of games were BETTER than Russell's. If anything, Quinn kept the Irish in games that really should have been worse blowouts than they actually were.

Texian
01-28-2007, 06:35 PM
It is stupid to compare the win and loss total of each. The only reason I brought that up is because of the requst of a poster in this thread who wanted to know how many wins came in those 11 games that Russell struggled in. I threw Quinn's totals in just for comparison purposes.

Also, it takes note because people will bang on Quinn for his team's "performance" in big games, when in actuality his numbers in a comparitive number of games were BETTER than Russell's. If anything, Quinn kept the Irish in games that really should have been worse blowouts than they actually were.

The same could be said about Russell.

run-david-run
01-28-2007, 09:45 PM
The same could be said about Russell.

No it cant. LSU as a team is much better then Notre Dame, as proven in the Sugar Bowl. LSU was the consensus most talanted team in the best conference in college football, Notre Dame is no where near that talent level.

While this analogy is a little exagarrated, the Jay Cutler from Vanderbilt/ Matt Leinart from USC comparison could work for Quinn/Russell because LSU was a very talanted and balanced team while Quinn pretty much carried Notre Dame.

Texian
01-28-2007, 09:49 PM
No it cant. LSU as a team is much better then Notre Dame, as proven in the Sugar Bowl. LSU was the consensus most talanted team in the best conference in college football, Notre Dame is no where near that talent level.

Thank You Very Much,

Signed
Urban Meyer and the Gators

kastofsna
01-29-2007, 08:22 AM
This format for responding to posts is dumb and old.

Signed,
kastofsna

also, LSU was the most talented and deep team in the country this year. for various reasons, they managed to lose two games. not a good sign.

Scribe
01-29-2007, 10:06 PM
FWIW, I wouldn't pin either of LSU's two losses from this past season on Russell. In the Auburn game, the coaches for some inexcplicable reason kept insisting on running the ball, even though we couldn't get anything going. It was LSU's first big opponent of the year, the o-line was breaking in three new starters and the top two RB's at the time were guys coming off knee injuries the previous year. They weren't hitting the line fast and Auburn was stuffing our run game.

We didn't spread the defense with multiple receiver sets much, instead showing a running formation a lot, which led to Auburn loading it up. We didn't start throwing until we absolutely had to, which was late in the game. Russell got some nice passes but we ran out of time and got stopped a few yards from the end zone.

Against Florida, we had five turnovers, eight penalties (including two that set them up first and goal), a fumble at the one yard line on first and goal, a touchdown pass called back due to a questionable holding call downfield, a fumble at the goal line, two blown pass coverages that left Florida WRs wide open, etc. Russell did throw three interceptions, but two weren't his fault. They were passes that hit the receiver right on the numbers but either a DB hit the WR at the right time, causing the ball to go up in the air, or the WR muffed it, causing it to pop into the air. Both instances, it fell into Florida hands. LSU actually started that game well and wound up outgaining them in yardage and first downs, but kept shooting itself in the foot.

The running game actually didn't seem to come to life until about the Tennessee game this past season, and even after that, was solid but not necessarily dominant, for the most part. So Russell had to contend a decent portion of the season with an inconsistent running game.

Russell's not perfect. He's still developing. But I think he doesn't get enough credit by some for the degree he has developed the last two years and how often he's delivered clutch drives to win games late against solid opponents.

Titan "Tack" Fan
01-29-2007, 10:52 PM
also, LSU was the most talented and deep team in the country this year. for various reasons, they managed to lose two games. not a good sign.

We may bump heads a lot, but you are right on this point sir. If they had Nick Saban they'd have won atleast 2 National Championships (thats including '03). Maybe 3...