PDA

View Full Version : Moving Lewis Sanders to FreeSafety??


thunderkyss
01-25-2007, 06:00 PM
I don't know if we talked about this before.... but what do you think?? Could that solve our Free safety problem??

I know some have toyed with the idea of moving Dunta to the FS spot, but he is way too small, and too fast for that..... Sanders IMHO is too slow to play Corner, so is Faggins, but he's too small to play safety.

I think if we move Sanders to Safety, & get some speed at the corner position(I just don't think Clements or Samuels are in our price range) our secondary would be much better.

Errant Hothy
01-25-2007, 06:04 PM
The easiest way to fix the secondary is to fix the pass rush. No secondary can cover indefiantly.

Hulk75
01-25-2007, 06:14 PM
The easiest way to fix the secondary is to fix the pass rush. No secondary can cover indefiantly.

The easiest way to fix your pass rush is to get some DBs. NOT have 4 1st rd picks playing Dline for you.

IT SUCKS! when you dont have DBs that can cover if your a DE, Trust me! I used to loose my mind tell ing my CB to jump everything cause all I needed was just one more second to get a sack or force preasure, Mario on A LOT of plays was right there all he needed was another step or 2.

It goes both ways, it all has to be right, just like a QB and his OLine are 1.......:secret:

Double Barrel
01-25-2007, 06:18 PM
The easiest way to fix the secondary is to fix the pass rush. No secondary can cover indefiantly.

I agree. Giving an opposing QB too much time in the pocket is always a sure fire way to make sure someone's going to eventually get open. Our pass rush is inconsistent, at best, and non-existent, at worst.

kiwitexansfan
01-25-2007, 06:21 PM
Anyone know if Sanders has ever played there?

The old saying goes you can't teach an old dog new tricks and it must be a pretty big change of approach playing safety vs corner.... correct me if I'm wrong.

I just have this horrid image of more mistakes in the secondary as Sanders tries to figure out his new role.... with WR's making unopposed catches 10 yards behind our deepest man.

thunderkyss
01-25-2007, 06:22 PM
The easiest way to fix your pass rush is to get some DBs. NOT have 4 1st rd picks playing Dline for you.

IT SUCKS! when you dont have DBs that can cover if your a DE, Trust me! I used to loose my mind tell ing my CB to jump everything cause all I needed was just one more second to get a sack or force preasure, Mario on A LOT of plays was right there all he needed was another step or 2.

It goes both ways, it all has to be right, just like a QB and his OLine are 1.......:secret:

I agree.... for the most part, we weren't giving up too much time to the opposing QBs...

2.5 seconds, we need to be able to cover for 2.5 seconds.

dirty steve
01-25-2007, 06:26 PM
I don't know if we talked about this before.... but what do you think?? Could that solve our Free safety problem??

I know some have toyed with the idea of moving Dunta to the FS spot, but he is way too small, and too fast for that..... Sanders IMHO is too slow to play Corner, so is Faggins, but he's too small to play safety.

I think if we move Sanders to Safety, & get some speed at the corner position(I just don't think Clements or Samuels are in our price range) our secondary would be much better.
noble thought TK, but i'd think any possible "answer" to our secondary doesnt include Lewis Sanders. I am hoping for a FA signing like Lewis and a CB drafted in April.

gtexan02
01-25-2007, 06:28 PM
I'm going to go ahead and say its not our DLs fault or our DBs fault. Its a combination of the two. We had an injury ridden, talent lacking DL and a physically inferior DB corp that combined for the problems we witnessed.

TEXANS84
01-25-2007, 06:54 PM
"Show me a defense that can't get to the quarterback and I'll show you 4 defensive backs that can't cover."

--Deion Sanders--

run-david-run
01-25-2007, 07:05 PM
"Show me DeMarcus Faggins covering a WR one on one and Ill show you a WR having a career day."

-- run david run & lee evans --

thunderkyss
01-25-2007, 07:07 PM
"Show me a defense that can't get to the quarterback and I'll show you 4 defensive backs that can't cover."

--Deion Sanders--


without a doubt, we need to improve the pass rush... at the same time, we need to be able to cover for some amount of time. If the opposing QB is sitting in the pocket for more than 3 seconds, then the DL is not doing their job.

IF the QB is getting rid of the ball in 2.5 seconds...... predominately to his first read, then we've got secondary problems as well.

Double Barrel
01-25-2007, 07:20 PM
I agree.... for the most part, we weren't giving up too much time to the opposing QBs...

2.5 seconds, we need to be able to cover for 2.5 seconds.

Which must explain our 28 total sacks last year, 27th in the league?... :um:

We either consistently pressure opposing QBs or we don't. Sack totals are quite revealing in that regard.

Bubbajwp
01-25-2007, 07:23 PM
"Show me DeMarcus Faggins covering a WR one on one and Ill show you a WR having a career day."

-- run david run & lee evans --

Faggins does fine in man on man in shorter routes.

If our CB's ever had any help over the top there wouldnt be near as many big plays against our secondary. The biggest need on our team is a true FS.

Look at the Dallas Cowboys. IMO they have Terence Newman a good #1 CB. Roy Williams a great SS. Anthony Henry is a above average #2 CB. Then they have Pat Watkins and Keith Davis at FS. Yet their defense lookes terrible.

thunderkyss
01-25-2007, 07:32 PM
Which must explain our 28 total sacks last year, 27th in the league?... :um:

We either consistently pressure opposing QBs or we don't. Sack totals are quite revealing in that regard.

Because the opposing QB doesn't have to look for his second read.... his first read is always open.. he gets rid of the ball on time.

Most sacks in this league occur beyond 2.5 seconds. Most of David's sacks have come beyond 2.5 seconds.

Of course there will be some in less time. but for the most part, the team has to be able to cover for 2.5 seconds.

Ole Miss Texan
01-25-2007, 07:35 PM
"Show me DeMarcus Faggins covering a WR one on one and Ill show you a WR having a career day."

-- run david run & lee evans --

hahaha

Two 83 yard touchdown receptions in a row is impossible. If anyone says that has happen they are lying...it's a myth.....an old wives tale...:shades:

wolfscar
01-26-2007, 08:12 AM
I don't know if we talked about this before.... but what do you think?? Could that solve our Free safety problem??

I know some have toyed with the idea of moving Dunta to the FS spot, but he is way too small, and too fast for that..... Sanders IMHO is too slow to play Corner, so is Faggins, but he's too small to play safety.

I think if we move Sanders to Safety, & get some speed at the corner position(I just don't think Clements or Samuels are in our price range) our secondary would be much better.

I agree that more speed at CB is essential, but I don't think Lewis Sanders is good enough to start at FS. I think these are probably our two biggest gaps on the roster and I think we need a significant upgrade to both.

I hope you're wrong about Samuels / Clements, although I suspect you're right, but there's a lot of FS/CB talent in this year's draft and a fair amount in FA - I just hope we address both with genuine quality players, whoever we end up taking.

Lucky
01-26-2007, 11:24 AM
I think if we move Sanders to Safety, & get some speed at the corner position(I just don't think Clements or Samuels are in our price range) our secondary would be much better.
I don't think Sanders is a good enough tackler to be the last line of defense. A nickel safety in passing situations, sure. Not an everydown starter. It would be like Marcus Coleman, Part Deux.

As far as upgrading the corner spot with Clements or Samuel, that would be great. Did anyone else hear the Nate Clements interview on 610 this morning? He's living in Pearland, and seemed somewhat receptive to the idea of signing with the Texans.

thunderkyss
01-26-2007, 11:33 AM
I don't think Sanders is a good enough tackler to be the last line of defense. A nickel safety in passing situations, sure. Not an everydown starter. It would be like Marcus Coleman, Part Deux.
.

That was my perception as well, and wondered if anyone else felt that way......

K.D.
01-26-2007, 11:35 AM
He might be receptive to the ideal but are we receptive to the price tag!!
He's gonna try to break da bank, if you know what I mean.

Lucky
01-26-2007, 11:49 AM
He might be receptive to the ideal but are we receptive to the price tag!!
I don't know. Clements will get paid by some team. And it didn't sound like he wanted to move back north. I'd hate to see him sign with the Jags or the Cowgirls, who both have a ton of cap space.

Please_Evolve
01-26-2007, 12:28 PM
I don't know. Clements will get paid by some team. And it didn't sound like he wanted to move back north. I'd hate to see him sign with the Jags or the Cowgirls, who both have a ton of cap space.


Is San Diego looking for a corner? They have some good cap space too.

El Tejano
01-26-2007, 02:07 PM
The way I see it is Sanders can be our FS or he can try and battle to be the CB which IMO he lost that job. I am sure he would rather start.

TexanAddict
01-26-2007, 02:28 PM
If Lewis Sanders is our starting FS, a position he has not played since 1997, then that is truly an indictment of our safety corps. If Lewis Sanders was the best we could put on the field in the FS spot, then we will be in serious trouble come next season. Heck, he wasn't even the first CB off the bench in nickel packages for the whole season. So to answer the question, no Sanders is not the answer at FS.

Meloy
01-26-2007, 02:34 PM
Faggins does fine in man on man in shorter routes.

If our CB's ever had any help over the top there wouldnt be near as many big plays against our secondary. The biggest need on our team is a true FS.
Look at the Dallas Cowboys. IMO they have Terence Newman a good #1 CB. Roy Williams a great SS. Anthony Henry is a above average #2 CB. Then they have Pat Watkins and Keith Davis at FS. Yet their defense lookes terrible. Ashanti Or Clemments across from DR will decrease % of completeions over 2o yds. This allows Petey to be a nickle and L/backers to stop run and blitz. A healthy year for dline will definitely improve our team. We do not need a safety in first 5 rounds.

Mr teX
01-26-2007, 03:04 PM
I don't know if we talked about this before.... but what do you think?? Could that solve our Free safety problem??

I know some have toyed with the idea of moving Dunta to the FS spot, but he is way too small, and too fast for that..... Sanders IMHO is too slow to play Corner, so is Faggins, but he's too small to play safety.

I think if we move Sanders to Safety, & get some speed at the corner position(I just don't think Clements or Samuels are in our price range) our secondary would be much better.

I thought faggins was one of the fastest guys on our team? he gets burned but that's mainly b/c of his technique.

thunderkyss
01-26-2007, 03:23 PM
If Lewis Sanders is our starting FS, a position he has not played since 1997, then that is truly an indictment of our safety corps. If Lewis Sanders was the best we could put on the field in the FS spot, then we will be in serious trouble come next season. Heck, he wasn't even the first CB off the bench in nickel packages for the whole season. So to answer the question, no Sanders is not the answer at FS.

I'm pretty sure had Faggins been healthy, Sanders would have been the nickel back.

The only reason he wasn't, was because he either started at corner, or he was hurt, and not playing.

& you do know that Corner is a promotion (so to speak) from FS...... so not playing the position since '97 because he was playing corner is a good thing....... Old Corners who've lost a step are moved to FS..... it's a natural move.

Double Barrel
01-26-2007, 03:40 PM
Because the opposing QB doesn't have to look for his second read.... his first read is always open.. he gets rid of the ball on time.

Most sacks in this league occur beyond 2.5 seconds. Most of David's sacks have come beyond 2.5 seconds.

Of course there will be some in less time. but for the most part, the team has to be able to cover for 2.5 seconds.

We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. I've got some games taped, and when I've got time I'll go back and watch them with a stop watch. I think we've been giving opposing QBs much longer than 2.5 seconds in the pocket. Our pressure has been weak all season.

With regards to DC, I've seen many sacks where he never got to plant his back foot to even start making reads. That happens within the 2.5 second period you're talking about.

There is a reason why Coach Kubiak said a pass rusher was one of the TOP priorities for this off-season.

Mr teX
01-26-2007, 03:46 PM
We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. I've got some games taped, and when I've got time I'll go back and watch them with a stop watch. I think we've been giving opposing QBs much longer than 2.5 seconds in the pocket. Our pressure has been weak all season.

With regards to DC, I've seen many sacks where he never got to plant his back foot to even start making reads. That happens within the 2.5 second period you're talking about.

There is a reason why Coach Kubiak said a pass rusher was one of the TOP priorities for this off-season.


Couldn't agree more with the bolded. Who can remember the countless times Salaam was "ole'd" before david could even get his plant foot down in a 5 step drop?

Texian
01-26-2007, 03:48 PM
The word that really counts:

Gary Kubiak (on fulfilling the need for pass rushers) “There’s no doubt, we’ve got to find a way to put some pressure on some people. We played a group yesterday that was missing a couple of guards and (defensive coordinator) Richard (Smith) dialed up plenty of zone gods trying to create pressure and that is one glaring thing that I’ve been looking at this morning, comparing progress, where there was progress and some things we didn’t do well. One of the first things that I looked at was the fact that we didn’t pressure the quarterback really well. we’ve got to figure out a way to do that and if we’ve got to be able to do that with four guys in this league if you’re having to dial-up zone dogs and blitz in this league week–in and week-out, specially in our division in my opinion, you’re going to get burned. So we’ve got to find a way to pressure the quarterback with four guys and that will be a big point of emphasis.”

dirty steve
01-26-2007, 04:53 PM
I don't know. Clements will get paid by some team. And it didn't sound like he wanted to move back north. I'd hate to see him sign with the Jags or the Cowgirls, who both have a ton of cap space.

He was on 610 this morning and sounded VERY confident in his abilities, calling himself the best CB in the league, and holding fast when Champ Bailey was mentioned by John and Lance. He didnt rule out Houston, but it sounded like wants to get paid too (who doesnt?).

TexansSeminole
01-26-2007, 06:55 PM
In regards to the original post I think it could be a possibility for him to backup a guy in a nickel situation, but not a starter at FS in any situation. Our DBs are weak overall. There is only one of them that I feel confident in most of the time and that is Dunta. I think our DBs are far inferior to the rest of our conference's and more importantly our division's WRs. They get absolutely schooled in too many games. We need some more reliable players back there. We don't have to have guys like Reggie Nelson, just someone we can rely on.

"Show me DeMarcus Faggins covering a WR one on one and Ill show you a WR having a career day."

-- run david run & lee evans --

The one thing that Faggins is not good at is covering his man in the endzone. He is constantly outjumped/outworked/outcomposed for touchdowns.

Coverage and pass rush will always be linked but they have to be on the same page. Our D-line isn't really built for pass rushing. None of Kubiak's additions anyway, and Casserly's guys are just not good enough (Babin, Peek). Mario should be a force next year but we need another guy that will consistantly rush the passer and create problems for the QB. With the 4 guys we rush on every play we've really only got 1 that can consistantly bring pressure, if even. DE or DT we need to bring someone in that will create some pressure.

We really lack a guy in the secondary who you could say is running the secondary. We can't get beat deep if we are going to blitz. It seems like our secondary is not on the same page with the rest of our defense sometimes. There are times when we know we can get pressure but our DBs cannot cover. That kills us when we play teams like the Colts and now the Titans in our own division. WRs like Harrison and Wayne will get open if the defense is struggling in this area. QBs like Vince Young, that can scramble and buy time, will do the same.

Overall, I think we need to bring players in on both the defensive line and the secondary. It is going to be difficult to do it during the draft considering all of our other needs.