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GoHornsGo
01-22-2007, 10:22 PM
I am a new poster to the forums but have been a frequent guest for over a year. Now that I got that out - here is my thought:

Amobi Okoye. The Texans need a run-stopping, defensive line push up the middle. After watching game film, this guy is very impressive and I believe strongly deserves consideration at the 8 spot as he would fill this void. I think he has the potential to be better than Branch. He is an absolute monster on defense. This would solidify our front 4 on D for many years to come. Amobi is 19 yrs old to boot.

AP would be a great pick and I wouldn't complain but I think shoring up the defense should continue to be the top priority. Watching the Bears manhandle the saints running offense and thus whip the Saints only added to my conviction. In fact, Grossman was horrendous for half of his games this year (kind of like Carr) and look where da bears are as of today - Super bowl bound. Incidently, they have a top five pick RB and a mid-round RB sharing carries - and the top five pick RB is still not even the starter.

Anyway, I have not seen much discussion on Amobi thus far and think he merits strong consideration for our first round pick.

Picking up Corey Redding to upgrade the other DT spot would just add fuel to this fire - and may even change my opinion to draft a RB first.

Texans Horror
01-22-2007, 10:29 PM
I am a new poster to the forums but have been a frequent guest for over a year. Now that I got that out - here is my thought:

Amobi Okoye. The Texans need a run-stopping, defensive line push up the middle. After watching game film, this guy is very impressive and I believe strongly deserves consideration at the 8 spot as he would fill this void. I think he has the potential to be better than Branch. He is an absolute monster on defense. This would solidify our front 4 on D for many years to come. Amobi is 19 yrs old to boot.

AP would be a great pick and I wouldn't complain but I think shoring up the defense should continue to be the top priority. Watching the Bears manhandle the saints running offense and thus whip the Saints only added to my conviction. In fact, Grossman was horrendous for half of his games this year (kind of like Carr) and look where da bears are as of today - Super bowl bound. Incidently, they have a top five pick RB and a mid-round RB sharing carries - and the top five pick RB is still not even the starter.

Anyway, I have not seen much discussion on Amobi thus far and think he merits strong consideration for our first round pick.

Picking up Corey Redding to upgrade the other DT spot would just add fuel to this fire - and may even change my opinion to draft a RB first.

Stopping the run will be an integral need if the Texans hope to move out of the AFC Cellar next year.

Getting a DT through free agency would really help. IMO, the DT spot is not very deep, so I don't like taking one unless it's the first or second round. Getting a DT late in the draft will not help the Texans.

Ole Miss Texan
01-22-2007, 10:31 PM
I don't know much about this kid but from everything I've read could be great. I wouldn't mind us picking AP at all but am kind of hoping he isn't there for us so there isn't all this talk if we pass on him. At the same time though...If he is there at 8 it would probably be easier to trade down with someone that would want him. maybe Green Bay if they'd much rather have him than lynch. At this point I can ...we can only speculate but I've seen Amobi lasting to their pick in many mocks. All this can change after the combine and all though. I think if AP is there it'd be easier to trade down and there would be a few guys that we were targeting at 8 that would be there. maybe like a safety -landry/nelson, a cb, de, dt, lb, ol...could go levi brown or okoye if he's there.

GoHornsGo
01-22-2007, 10:44 PM
we could be onto something - building the best defense may be our best offense. The ravens and bears are winning teams without good QBs (no offense to aging McNair or the Raven QB Superbowl winner).

I know we have lots of money tied up in our front 4. You can't run a business by worrying about this thought IMO. That's like asking a couple of dummies to stay on and run the great GE - shareholders wouldn't put up with this - or like keeping a terrible college coach just cuz he has a contract. The fact is we made a FO mistake by hiring them, now we must pay for that mistake and replace them with real talent.

Just think where we could be if we had a different front office...... I believe Shawn Merriman instead of TJ for instance.

Texian
01-22-2007, 11:39 PM
He is a mid to late 1st. Some say overrated. He would not be that much of an upgrade to the players already on the roster. Probable bust.

YoungTexanFan
01-23-2007, 12:05 AM
He is a mid to late 1st. Some say overrated. He would not be that much of an upgrade to the players already on the roster. Probable bust.

If you are talking about Okoye, you are wrong IMO. He is a beast. He is a mid first round talent at 19 y/o. That isn't adding in projections. The kid is that good now. He has proven to be more of a pennatrator than I originally gave him credit for. Super strong and quick. He is an upgrade to every single DT on our roster, even Weaver.

AustinJB
01-23-2007, 12:08 AM
He is a mid to late 1st. Some say overrated. He would not be that much of an upgrade to the players already on the roster. Probable bust.

:wow:

:joker:

threetoedpete
01-23-2007, 12:14 AM
If you are talking about Okoye, you are wrong IMO. He is a beast. He is a mid first round talent at 19 y/o. That isn't adding in projections. The kid is that good now. He has proven to be more of a pennatrator than I originally gave him credit for. Super strong and quick. He is an upgrade to every single DT on our roster, even Weaver.

Agreed. At first I was against him because of the 301. My first reaction was against the bigger maulers of the NFL at gaurd he would struggel. After watching him play he is a very strong guy. If he is an Elvin Bethea type guy, small but very powerful, he would make a very nice addition to the line. Let's see what the guy lifts at the combine. Incognito of St. Louis is still a loose cannon. But the guy is a very powerful man. If that is what Okoye brings, I think he is a legit first round guy. Probably why he isn't being disscussed here. Most of us consider him to be off the board by the time we come up in the second with the forty pick. I also like the Utah DT, Paul Solari. Very disruptive powerful man with a temper.

AustinJB
01-23-2007, 12:18 AM
If you are talking about Okoye, you are wrong IMO. He is a beast. He is a mid first round talent at 19 y/o. That isn't adding in projections. The kid is that good now. He has proven to be more of a pennatrator than I originally gave him credit for. Super strong and quick. He is an upgrade to every single DT on our roster, even Weaver.

Agreed, Okoye is definitely a 1st round pick. He would be a great addition to the Dline. Although Peterson is my choice at #8, I would not be disappointed in the least if we somehow got Okoye.

As I've said before, if we pass on Peterson, as long as it's for Anderson, Okoye, or a great trade-down scenario, I will be fine with it.:twocents:

dirty steve
01-23-2007, 12:34 AM
Just think where we could be if we had a different front office...... I believe Shawn Merriman instead of TJ for instance.
I don't think we were in contention to get him anyway. If I'm not mistaken, Merriman went #12 to the Chargers and we originally had #13 before the fateful trade down with the Saints to #15.

threetoedpete
01-23-2007, 12:39 AM
Okoye weighed in at 287. He lifts 30 or above, I won't be concered over the weight. He runs in the 4.7's...that there thing is a DE.

vtech9
01-23-2007, 01:15 AM
I don't know much about him, but all the reports I have heard on him have been positive.

phan1
01-23-2007, 06:36 AM
He's also a very young player. He's only 20 I believe. I would love to have him, but DT is a difficult position to scout. 1st round DTs bust pretty regularly...

kastofsna
01-23-2007, 09:22 AM
i'm seeing more 3-tech with okoye than pure NT.

bah007
01-23-2007, 10:48 AM
Much of the hype about Okoye is because of how young he is.

I believe he is worth a 1st round pick, but only late in the 1st.

The good thing about him is that he could be on a roster for 2 years and still be as young as the incoming draft.

IMO, he is overrated because of this. He is a good player, but I definitely put him behind Branch and Pitcock and only a little bit ahead of DeMarcus Tyler (NC St).

Texian
01-23-2007, 10:54 AM
Finally, the most surprising result of this morning's weigh-in process may well have been the weight loss of Louisville DT Amobi Okoye. Listed as 305 pounds from last spring's measuring for NFL scouts, Okoye showed up in Mobile weighing a slender 287 pounds. While he looks to be in good shape, Okoye may have turned some teams off that viewed him as a bigger interior presence.

bah007
01-23-2007, 10:58 AM
Finally, the most surprising result of this morning's weigh-in process may well have been the weight loss of Louisville DT Amobi Okoye. Listed as 305 pounds from last spring's measuring for NFL scouts, Okoye showed up in Mobile weighing a slender 287 pounds. While he looks to be in good shape, Okoye may have turned some teams off that viewed him as a bigger interior presence.

A lot of teams will probably try to have him move to DE.

Texian
01-23-2007, 11:23 AM
A lot of teams will probably try to have him move to DE.

I think he is to slow to play on the outside (5.11).

bah007
01-23-2007, 11:24 AM
I think he is to slow to play on the outside (5.11).

Well I didnt know that.

I have seen other posters on this board saying he can run as good as a 4.7

Maddict5
01-23-2007, 11:50 AM
ive read that so far hes been unblockable in the senior bowl practices..i also wouldnt mind spending #8 on him if hes as good as reported

Texian
01-23-2007, 12:18 PM
Iowa's Marshal Yanda also more than held his own against a very talented group of North defensive ends and Manuel Ramirez of Texas Tech got the best of Amobi Okoye in a matchup that I witnessed.

The North defense definitely fared a whole lot better than their offensive counterparts and while Louisville's Okoye is not physically opposing and did struggle at times he showed some flashes and displayed outstanding leadership qualities, pumping up his teammates on multiple occasions.

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/features/seniorbowl/reports/north122.html

beerlover
01-23-2007, 12:24 PM
Amobi Okoye is so athletic with skill moves I see him as a strongside (LDE) 4-3 tackle, not sure if the Texans would move Mario to RDE & select Amobi with that 8th pick? seems like overkill, but I do see him becoming a star in the NFL for some team :bubble:

threetoedpete
01-23-2007, 04:42 PM
Amobi Okoye is so athletic with skill moves I see him as a strongside (LDE) 4-3 tackle, not sure if the Texans would move Mario to RDE & select Amobi with that 8th pick? seems like overkill, but I do see him becoming a star in the NFL for some team :bubble:

Agreed. I saw that too. A taller faster, won't say stronger, squaty. Elvin Bethea. What a perfect compiment guy to go with Mario. See what he runs at the combine. Someone as you said is going to get a young fair prospect with the guy. He's going to be a beast to block for the slower OTs.

GoHornsGo
01-23-2007, 10:20 PM
Please take time to watch Louisville's bowl game. You will see that Amobi is a beast, disrupting tons of plays during the bowl game.

I did not see this from Branch or any other defensive lineman in bowl games. He is a beast and I encourage all on this board to take a hard look. He could be the ideal pick to line up next to Mario.

dirty steve
01-23-2007, 10:43 PM
the beat writer for the Texans Website (Carmine Perrone?) who is in Mobile said on 610 tonight that Okoye has been owning the opposition in a big way in the practices so far. definately another legit option, but i'd prefer to get him around when Baltimore scooped up Haloti Ngata last year at #12.

phan1
01-24-2007, 12:11 AM
ive read that so far hes been unblockable in the senior bowl practices..i also wouldnt mind spending #8 on him if hes as good as reported

He's in the senior bowl? I thought it was only for, well, seniors...

mexican_texan
01-24-2007, 12:16 AM
He's in the senior bowl? I thought it was only for, well, seniors...
He is a senior.

Davis37
01-24-2007, 11:01 AM
yeah it looks like Okoye is tearing it up in practice. This is from the article on the Texans website.

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/detail.php?PRKey=3300&section=N%20Latest%20News

News and Notes: Louisville defensive tackle Amobi Okoye was the talk of practice Tuesday morning. Okoye dominated several North offensive linemen in one-on-one drills and is lighting quick even at 312 pounds and just 19 years of age… Cal defensive back Daymeion Hughes has earned the respect of the North quarterbacks. All three agreed Tuesday that he was the best corner on the field Tuesday…Rutgers running back Brian Leonard has been taking snaps at both running back and fullback through two days of practices…Temperatures failed to reach 50 for the second consecutive day Tuesday.

threetoedpete
01-24-2007, 11:10 AM
He weighed in @ 287 yesterday.

Texan_Aggie222
01-24-2007, 08:37 PM
I want to know what yall think he is. I mean, before this week he was this big, nasty gap eating 19 year old defensive tackle, and now after he has weighed in at 287, all of a sudden he is a defensive end? WTH? I don't know what to think.

This weight at weigh in remains to be the biggest surprise of the Senior Bowl to me thus far.

Ole Miss Texan
01-24-2007, 08:46 PM
I want to know what yall think he is. I mean, before this week he was this big, nasty gap eating 19 year old defensive tackle, and now after he has weighed in at 287, all of a sudden he is a defensive end? WTH? I don't know what to think.

This weight at weigh in remains to be the biggest surprise of the Senior Bowl to me thus far.

I think we'll know more in 2 1/2 months...lol

nunusguy
01-24-2007, 09:45 PM
The first time I saw Okoye in action, the image of Dwight Freeney came to mind. Am I the only one who sees this similarity ?

mexican_texan
01-25-2007, 12:58 AM
Okoye pwnd Mozes.

phan1
01-25-2007, 09:10 AM
a 19 year old senior? Damn, that's pretty impressive...

Maddict5
01-25-2007, 10:21 AM
for fun, lets say draft day comes and at #8, okoye and AP are the BPA's left, who do we take???

personally, right now, id take okoye

nunusguy
01-25-2007, 10:38 AM
for fun, lets say draft day comes and at #8, okoye and AP are the BPA's left, who do we take???
personally, right now, id take okoye
I dunno, but a 19 year-old pass-rushing phenom (actually he'll be 20 in June),
at weakside DE and 22 year-old Mario at strongside DE would be pretty impressive bookends for our DLine
now and for a long time into the future.

Texian
01-25-2007, 11:02 AM
Okoye is a DT. If you want to move him outside and make him a DE then there are about 5-6 guys ahead of him who are better pass rushers than Okoye.

real
01-25-2007, 11:10 AM
Okoye is a DT. If you want to move him outside and make him a DE then there are about 5-6 guys ahead of him who are better pass rushers than Okoye.

Exactly.

We'd have two Strong side DE's and no pass rush.

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 11:18 AM
I dunno, but a 19 year-old pass-rushing phenom (actually he'll be 20 in June),
at weakside DE and 22 year-old Mario at strongside DE would be pretty impressive bookends for our DLine
now and for a long time into the future.

I like Okoye, but I think #8 is a bit high. At a similar size, with some questions about position, Tommie Harris went #14 with a ridiculous college resume and ran a 4.68. They are both high character guys... but I don't think Okoye (projected to run a 5.1+) is quite the prospect that Harris was.

Okoye had a great year at just age 19, and his numbers are similar to the ones Harris put up all three years. Harris was playing tougher comp, with a bigger target, so I'm inclined to believe Harris' stats were a little harder to come by. I think Okoye can definitely improve and be elite, but if he's neither huge or overwhelmingly athletic... it's tough to justify taking him that high. Without knowing the intimate details of d-line play, he seems like a younger, less athletic Tommie Harris (that's no insult). He'll be getting paid huge money up front and needs to make an immediate impact... so the age thing, while nice, isn't everything it's made up to be.

I hope Okoye shocks everybody and tests extremely well... I think under those conditions he is a justifiable #8 pick. Right now, as things stand, I like Russell,Peterson, or Thomas, if available, and a trade down to mid-1st (Okoye territory!) or a S.

Also, compare Haloti Ngata, 6'5", 338 lbs, ran a a 5.0, benched 505, squatted 615, and went to the Ravens at #12.

nunusguy
01-25-2007, 11:20 AM
Okoye is a DT. If you want to move him outside and make him a DE then there are about 5-6 guys ahead of him who are better pass rushers than Okoye.

Have you seen Okoye, along with these other 5-6 guys in action ?

Maddict5
01-25-2007, 11:22 AM
Okoye is a DT. If you want to move him outside and make him a DE then there are about 5-6 guys ahead of him who are better pass rushers than Okoye.

hes strong, hes fast and his spin move looks good enough to me

bah007
01-25-2007, 11:26 AM
Have we seen Okoye go one-on-one with Blalock yet?

That is a matchup I would like to see.

Meloy
01-25-2007, 11:28 AM
I just do not see the D line as needing another high pick. Travis Johnson was supposedly doing much better in 2nd half before injury. Remember this guy has been thru coaching changes. Last year we got Mario & Weaver. Neither Peek nor Babin imo have met my expectations. One or both may be gone. No one has said Paine is gone & he may prove to have some downs left in him. Cochran has been mentioned @ DE especially if peek or Babin goes.

Maddict5
01-25-2007, 11:30 AM
I like Okoye, but I think #8 is a bit high. At a similar size, with some questions about position, Tommie Harris went #14 with a ridiculous college resume and ran a 4.68. They are both high character guys... but I don't think Okoye (projected to run a 5.1+) is quite the prospect that Harris was.

Okoye had a great year at just age 19, and his numbers are similar to the ones Harris put up all three years. Harris was playing tougher comp, with a bigger target, so I'm inclined to believe Harris' stats were a little harder to come by. I think Okoye can definitely improve and be elite, but if he's neither huge or overwhelmingly athletic... it's tough to justify taking him that high. Without knowing the intimate details of d-line play, he seems like a younger, less athletic Tommie Harris (that's no insult). He'll be getting paid huge money up front and needs to make an immediate impact... so the age thing, while nice, isn't everything it's made up to be.



hypothetically, would you trade the #8 pick for tommie harris (well a very similiar player at least)??




*rhetorical- no need to answer*

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 11:38 AM
hypothetically, would you trade the #8 pick for tommie harris (well a very similiar player at least)??




*rhetorical- no need to answer*

I would trade the #8 pick for the prospect Tommie Harris, but not a prospect who lacks his otherworldy athleticism but may prove to be just as good.

If I were locked in to DLine at #8 I would take Gaines Adams.

nunusguy
01-25-2007, 11:42 AM
Would you use the #8 for a player you thought could be another Dwight
Freeney ? And Freeney went almost that high anyway, #11 back in 2002, before anybody knew he'd be what he became.
And Freeney is the player to
compare Okoye to, not Harris. Don't care what he played at Louisville, he'll
be on the outside at DE in the NFL.

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 11:46 AM
Would you use the #8 for a player you thought could be another Dwight
Freeney ? And Freeney went almost that high anyway, #11 back in 2002, before anybody knew he'd be what he became.
And Freeney is the player to
compare Okoye to, not Harris. Don't care what he played at Louisville, he'll
be on the outside at DE in the NFL.

Again, Freeney ran a 4.48, Okoye is expected to run around a 5.1 or a 5.0. Combine tests arent everything, but that's a huge difference.

Maddict5
01-25-2007, 11:47 AM
I would trade the #8 pick for the prospect Tommie Harris, but not a prospect who lacks his otherworldy athleticism but may prove to be just as good.

If I were locked in to DLine at #8 I would take Gaines Adams.

okoye is very athletic and may be an even better pass-rusher than harris...i dont know will we take him..i kinda hope we do but i dont think its too much of a stretch to say he may even be gone by the time we're picking

Maddict5
01-25-2007, 11:49 AM
Again, Freeney ran a 4.48, Okoye is expected to run around a 5.1 or a 5.0. Combine tests arent everything, but that's a huge difference.


i thought it was a 4.68 but again not certain, plus some1 (kast or ytf) posted that hes expected to run a 4.7 (not sure if this is right but i think its as possible as him running a 5.1- where did that come from?)

Texian
01-25-2007, 11:50 AM
Have you seen Okoye, along with these other 5-6 guys in action ?

Adams, Anderson, Johnson, Moss are not at the senior bowl. If you watched these guys in their bowl games you might be less likely to jump on the Okoye DE bandwagon. Okoye reminds me of two very good DTs Coleman and Holiday. Let's see what he runs at the combine before we put the crown on him.

Haams
01-25-2007, 11:54 AM
I dunno, but a 19 year-old pass-rushing phenom (actually he'll be 20 in June),
at weakside DE and 22 year-old Mario at strongside DE would be pretty impressive bookends for our DLine
now and for a long time into the future.

You really want to spend our first pick 2 years in a row on Defensive Ends?

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 11:56 AM
i thought it was a 4.68 but again not certain, plus some1 (kast or ytf) posted that hes expected to run a 4.7 (not sure if this is right but i think its as possible as him running a 5.1- where did that come from?)

Okoye: 5.15

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/dt/amobiokoye.html

Okoye: 5.10

http://football.about.com/od/nflplayerprofiles/p/amobiokoye.htm

Okoye: 4.95-5.10

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/profile.php?pyid=13143

Freeney: 4.48 (official time)

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2002/profiles/freeney_dwight.htm

Freeney had 17.5 sacks as a SR and 13 as a JR... that's production and freakish athleticism... the Colts had a pretty good idea of what they were getting.

nunusguy
01-25-2007, 11:59 AM
Again, Freeney ran a 4.48, Okoye is expected to run around a 5.1 or a 5.0. Combine tests arent everything, but that's a huge difference.

You're doing the same thing the Texans organization did last year when they assumed that Mario's timed 4.7 40 would guarantee them an elite edge rusher.
They didn't get one did they ?
It's a lot less than 40 yards from the Dline edge to the QB, and I think quickness, especially that first step to avoid the OT, is more important than
a 40 time.
Actually I dunno if #8 is too high for this guy, but would be surprised if he's
not gone in the top half of the first round. We'll see how he does the rest of
this week in Mobile and at the Indy combine.
Freeney may have 17 in the last year of college, but he played DE and not inside.

Maddict5
01-25-2007, 12:07 PM
Okoye: 5.15 weight 317

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/dt/amobiokoye.html

Okoye: 5.10 weight 310

http://football.about.com/od/nflplayerprofiles/p/amobiokoye.htm

Okoye: 4.95-5.10 weight(updated) 287

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/profile.php?pyid=13143

Freeney: 4.48 (official time)

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2002/profiles/freeney_dwight.htm

Freeney had 17.5 sacks as a SR and 13 as a JR... that's production and freakish athleticism... the Colts had a pretty good idea of what they were getting.


where do they get them from? and the weights shown shows they're not really accurate

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 12:07 PM
You're doing the same thing the Texans organization did last year when they assumed that Mario's timed 4.7 40 would guarantee them an elite edge rusher.
They didn't get one did they ?
It's a lot less than 40 yards from the Dline edge to the QB, and I think quickness, especially that first step to avoid the OT, is more important than
a 40 time.
Actually I dunno if #8 is too high for this guy, but would be surprised if he's
not gone in the top half of the first round. We'll see how he does the rest of
this week in Mobile and at the Indy combine.
Freeney may have 17 in the last year of college, but he played DE and not inside.

Well Elvis Dumervil was slower and smaller than Mario and look who got all the sacks. Speed matters for edge rushers... so does leverage, quickness, and skill. I just don't think you can compare the fastest DE to ever play with a quick DT who favors a spin move. I think Tommie Harris is a better comparable, and he's just not the athlete Harris is. He may prove to be a better pass rusher... but he certainly isn't close to Harris right now.

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 12:09 PM
where do they get them from? and the weights shown shows they're not really accurate

All these guys cover the draft... some mroe closely than others... but that's a decent caucus. Okoye was listed at 312 all season. He weighed in in Mobile at 287... thus the discrepancies. As you can see NFLdraftscout has adjusted it's weight because of this.

Texian
01-25-2007, 12:21 PM
You really want to spend our first pick 2 years in a row on Defensive Ends?

Absolutely, if we have a shot at Anderson or Adams. I entertain the visions of Reggie White on one side and Julius Peppers on the other and opposing QBs having less than 3 secs to throw. This being possible with out having to blitz. Defense First!

Maddict5
01-25-2007, 12:27 PM
All these guys cover the draft... some mroe closely than others... but that's a decent caucus. Okoye was listed at 312 all season. He weighed in in Mobile at 287... thus the discrepancies. As you can see NFLdraftscout has adjusted it's weight because of this.

i know- thats my point they're taking it off lists..they were wrong with the weight so im guessing they're wrong with the time also....he looks fast so im guessing he'll run < 5 secs easy and will get close to harris' 4.7/4.8 because hes just as athletic imo

Texian
01-25-2007, 12:28 PM
where do they get them from? and the weights shown shows they're not really accurate

They get these times from their Junior Pro days in the Spring. Most schools have these competitions in the spring including weights, times etc. Okoye said he played around 300 lbs at Louisville but had lost about 15 lbs before the Senior Bowl. He also said he wanted to be close to 300 lbs at the combine.

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 12:32 PM
i know- thats my point they're taking it off lists..they were wrong with the weight so im guessing they're wrong with the time also....he looks fast so im guessing he'll run < 5 secs easy and will get close to harris' 4.7/4.8 because hes just as athletic imo

They weren't wrong with the weight... Louisville listed him at a weight that he no longer weighs. Whether he ever weighed 312 or just lost 25 pounds, I don't know. But you're right and they're wrong. Let's draft him at #8.

nunusguy
01-25-2007, 12:32 PM
Well Elvis Dumervil was slower and smaller than Mario and look who got all the sacks. Speed matters for edge rushers... so does leverage, quickness, and skill.
Huh ? That's my point. Mario had a better 40 time and certainly was larger,
more physically impressive than a Dumervil but the Denver guy had more sacks because of his quickness and athleticism.
One player can have superior sprinting speed, strength, and even jumping ability but less quickness and less hand & foot dexterity than another player.
And as you correctly point out, the latter set of attributes is more important
than the former set for a successful pass rusher.

Maddict5
01-25-2007, 12:35 PM
They weren't wrong with the weight... Louisville listed him at a weight that he no longer weighs. Whether he ever weighed 312 or just lost 25 pounds, I don't know. But you're right and they're wrong. Let's draft him at #8.

:shades: sounds like a plan :winky:

that my point though his measurables are of out of date/wrong lists...did he ever weigh 317 and run 5.1? maybe but losing that 30 lbs would make him alot faster anyway

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 12:47 PM
Huh ? That's my point. Mario had a better 40 time and certainly was larger,
more physically impressive than a Dumervil but the Denver guy had more sacks because of his quickness and athleticism.
One player can have superior sprinting speed, strength, and even jumping ability but less quickness and less hand & foot dexterity than another player.
And as you correctly point out, the latter set of attributes is more important
than the former set for a successful pass rusher.

Is it so confusing to acknowledge the general thrust of your point, but to say that specifically you're wrong about Okoye being like Freeney? For Freeney, speed is everything.

The only comparison between Freeney and Okoye is this, Amobi Okoye is a quick defensive tackle who favors a spin move like Dwight Freeney, the fastest defensive lineman ever.

nunusguy
01-25-2007, 01:25 PM
For Freeney, speed is everything.

Not so. As an edge rusher, Freeney's 40 yard sprint time is less important than the quickness of his initial step when the ball is snapped along with his
dexterity.

mexican_texan
01-25-2007, 01:50 PM
Is it so confusing to acknowledge the general thrust of your point, but to say that specifically you're wrong about Okoye being like Freeney? For Freeney, speed is everything.

The only comparison between Freeney and Okoye is this, Amobi Okoye is a quick defensive tackle who favors a spin move like Dwight Freeney, the fastest defensive lineman ever.
It's not the speed, but the burst off the line that makes Freeney elite.

painekiller
01-25-2007, 01:50 PM
They weren't wrong with the weight... Louisville listed him at a weight that he no longer weighs. Whether he ever weighed 312 or just lost 25 pounds, I don't know. But you're right and they're wrong. Let's draft him at #8.

And the scout are not happy with his weight dropping 25 pounds. They are concerned that he will not be able to maintain a DT weight during the long NFL season. In the NFL the guards will wear down a smaller DT in time, remember the Colts run defense this regular season. 295 is on the small side now in the NFL.

Yes he has quickness but he has never shown speed. I think we should be looking at Adam Carriker who came in at 295 plays a natural DE, and he's have an excellent week in Memphis.

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 01:59 PM
It's not the speed, but the burst off the line that makes Freeney elite.

Think there might be a connection there?

mexican_texan
01-25-2007, 02:46 PM
Speed doesn't equal burst. Freeney has a better burst than say...Fabian Washington.

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 02:48 PM
Speed doesn't equal burst. Freeney has a better burst than say...Fabian Washington.

He's got the best burst of all defensive lineman and he's also the fastest... hmmm.

kastofsna
01-25-2007, 02:52 PM
i don't see freeney. i see warren sapp.

threetoedpete
01-25-2007, 02:56 PM
Agreed. If though he post nice numbers at the combine in the forty and the cone drills....just saying. The guy is twenty five pounds lighter. If he was ever going to hit 4-7-4.8 range, it's now. That would move him out of the trench with the beasties wouldn't it ?

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 02:59 PM
i don't see freeney. i see warren sapp.

Thank you. It's really not even close or comparable... I could see Sapp with the feet.

Buckle
01-25-2007, 03:01 PM
Well Elvis Dumervil was slower and smaller than Mario and look who got all the sacks.

I would say that Dumervil got more sacks than Mario, for a couple of reasons and none being that he is better than Mario. It has to do with that Mario a)got injured midway during the season when things started clicking b)look at how many d-line injuries we had, thats never good and c)I would say that the Broncos defense has more playmakers to worry about than the Texans do, so opposing teams can't game plan for just 1 player like they could with Mario and the Texans!

Dr. Toro
01-25-2007, 03:03 PM
I would say that Dumervil got more sacks than Mario, for a couple of reasons and none being that he is better than Mario. It has to do with that Mario a)got injured midway during the season when things started clicking b)look at how many d-line injuries we had, thats never good and c)I would say that the Broncos defense has more playmakers to worry about than the Texans do, so opposing teams can't game plan for just 1 player like they could with Mario and the Texans!

I agree with all of that... by no means was I saying Dumervil was better... just that you can't project success by how a guy tests in gym shorts alone.

GoHornsGo
01-25-2007, 09:35 PM
someone wrote: "Absolutely, if we have a shot at Anderson or Adams. I entertain the visions of Reggie White on one side and Julius Peppers on the other and opposing QBs having less than 3 secs to throw. This being possible with out having to blitz. Defense First!"

Under that scenario, you just spread the defense out and run the RB up the middle. This creates 2 and 5 or 3 and 4, where you only need 3 sec. to get a pass off. I think stopping the run and creating 2 and 9 or 3 and 8 scenarios is much more appealing. A good quarterback completes only 60-64% of his passes with an average of 7-8 yards per pass. The odds are then stacked toward the defense forcing the O to punt. Okoye has proven he can rush the passer as well. So, breaking down the pocket on 3rd and long gives the D even more advantage.

A great DT for our 8th is a no brainer in my mind. Too bad the previous FO didn't get this right with TJ, or we wouldn't have to do this all over again.

I would be happy with "All Day," but the better draft decision is Branch or Okoye - and I would choose Okoye over Branch. He has more upside IMO.

Maddict5
04-30-2007, 10:55 PM
bump

awtysst
05-01-2007, 01:18 AM
someone wrote: "Absolutely, if we have a shot at Anderson or Adams. I entertain the visions of Reggie White on one side and Julius Peppers on the other and opposing QBs having less than 3 secs to throw. This being possible with out having to blitz. Defense First!"

Under that scenario, you just spread the defense out and run the RB up the middle. This creates 2 and 5 or 3 and 4, where you only need 3 sec. to get a pass off. I think stopping the run and creating 2 and 9 or 3 and 8 scenarios is much more appealing. A good quarterback completes only 60-64% of his passes with an average of 7-8 yards per pass. The odds are then stacked toward the defense forcing the O to punt. Okoye has proven he can rush the passer as well. So, breaking down the pocket on 3rd and long gives the D even more advantage.

A great DT for our 8th is a no brainer in my mind. Too bad the previous FO didn't get this right with TJ, or we wouldn't have to do this all over again.

I would be happy with "All Day," but the better draft decision is Branch or Okoye - and I would choose Okoye over Branch. He has more upside IMO.

You got your wish!!!

Malloy
05-01-2007, 07:23 AM
talk about nailing it! :)

kastofsna
05-02-2007, 12:58 AM
heh, if you were drafting 8th, you would've probably taken Ginn. :D

Trap_Star
05-02-2007, 01:04 AM
heh, if you were drafting 8th, you would've probably taken Ginn. :D

nope...we woulda taken Jaamal Anderson....:cowboy1:

kastofsna
05-02-2007, 01:17 AM
i highly doubt that.

but thanks for not taking Ginn either way. ;)