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Hervoyel
12-27-2006, 10:43 AM
There's a nice little article about Dayne in todays Chronicle.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/headline/sports/4427774.html

When we signed Ron Dayne I got very optimistic. I looked at his career stats, saw the very good average he posted with Denver last year, and made some assumptions about him right away. I thought he was going to blow up here and that if he was used in the right system (ours and Denvers for instance) on a steady basis then he would become the running back he was expected to be when he was drafted. I looked at his time in New York and saw that he rarely if ever got the number of carries that he seemed to need to get going and that his arrival there coincided with the emergence of Tiki Barber. I concluded that he would suprise everyone here and be a beast for us.

Then he didn't do any of that.

Instead he played as badly as our other backs and looked like another Kubiak "Denver Legacy" pickup that must have been signed to make Gary more comfortable with his roster. Of course I knew about the turf toe but I discounted it too easily and within a few weeks of Dayne playing I backtracked on all my initial expectations. I wrote him off as another Stacey Mack who wouldn't make much of an impact for us and be gone the next year.

The past four weeks have been a real eye opener for me and I'm sorry I didn't have more faith in him. I know this excercise is familiar to anyone who's been following Domanick Davis career over the years but if you take Daynes numbers over the past four weeks and average them out you find that he's averaged 107 yards per game in that time. Multiplied by 16 games that would come out to around 1700 yards.

Obviously you can't say for certain that he'd run like this all year long until we actually see him do it. We all used to look at Domanick Davis and figure up what he would have run for IF he'd stayed healthy all year long so I figured I'd do the same with Ron Dayne. I believe that even if he didn't make it through an entire year he'd at least outperform Domanick in a typical season.

Daynes December is IMO consistent production. He obviously had a big game against Indianapolis who at 32nd against the run seem tailor made for a back like him to explode on but he did very well against Tennessee and New England as well. Neither of those teams are sporting "Colts like" run defenses. The Texans end the season against Cleveland this Sunday and they happen to be the 31st ranked run defense. I expect another heavy day on the ground and if Dayne is healthy enough to go then he'll probably wrap this year up with another 100 yard effort.

Personally I like a team with a big back. I grew up watching the Oilers and Earl Campbell and I have always associated a powerful running game with a successful team. During the Oilers Run-and-Shoot years I missed seeing a good running game. I think the Texans would be nuts to not give Dayne a shot at being the guy next year. If they think they need to go get someone else to be that faster change-of-pace back then go find him but I'd try to make 20-30 carries from Ron Dayne a staple of my offense next season. I think he's got at least two more years left in him at that pace. Probably more like three to four years. Plus I absolutely love the idea of a player who is grateful for a legitimate chance to play. A guy like Dayne who clearly appreciates the shot he's been given and who seemingly wants to prove that he wasn't a bust (but was rather mis-utilized) is something we can really use here. Someone who sounds genuinely grateful to be here is a real nice change of pace I think.

I'm going to flip-flop back to what I was saying at the start of the season. I'm going to apologize to Ron Dayne (in fact I'm doing it right now) and jump on that bandwagon. I think he's got a real future here if the Texans are smart enough to keep feeding that man the ball.

Texan Asylum
12-27-2006, 10:53 AM
There's a nice little article about Dayne in todays Chronicle.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/headline/sports/4427774.html

When we signed Ron Dayne I got very optimistic. I looked at his career stats, saw the very good average he posted with Denver last year, and made some assumptions about him right away. I thought he was going to blow up here and that if he was used in the right system (ours and Denvers for instance) on a steady basis then he would become the running back he was expected to be when he was drafted. I looked at his time in New York and saw that he rarely if ever got the number of carries that he seemed to need to get going and that his arrival there coincided with the emergence of Tiki Barber. I concluded that he would suprise everyone here and be a beast for us.

Then he didn't do any of that.

Instead he played as badly as our other backs and looked like another Kubiak "Denver Legacy" pickup that must have been signed to make Gary more comfortable with his roster. Of course I knew about the turf toe but I discounted it too easily and within a few weeks of Dayne playing I backtracked on all my initial expectations. I wrote him off as another Stacey Mack who wouldn't make much of an impact for us and be gone the next year.

The past four weeks have been a real eye opener for me and I'm sorry I didn't have more faith in him. I know this excercise is familiar to anyone who's been following Domanick Davis career over the years but if you take Daynes numbers over the past four weeks and average them out you find that he's averaged 107 yards per game in that time. Multiplied by 16 games that would come out to around 1700 yards.

Obviously you can't say for certain that he'd run like this all year long until we actually see him do it. We all used to look at Domanick Davis and figure up what he would have run for IF he'd stayed healthy all year long so I figured I'd do the same with Ron Dayne. I believe that even if he didn't make it through an entire year he'd at least outperform Domanick in a typical season.

Daynes December is IMO consistent production. He obviously had a big game against Indianapolis who at 32nd against the run seem tailor made for a back like him to explode on but he did very well against Tennessee and New England as well. Neither of those teams are sporting "Colts like" run defenses. The Texans end the season against Cleveland this Sunday and they happen to be the 31st ranked run defense. I expect another heavy day on the ground and if Dayne is healthy enough to go then he'll probably wrap this year up with another 100 yard effort.

Personally I like a team with a big back. I grew up watching the Oilers and Earl Campbell and I have always associated a powerful running game with a successful team. During the Oilers Run-and-Shoot years I missed seeing a good running game. I think the Texans would be nuts to not give Dayne a shot at being the guy next year. If they think they need to go get someone else to be that faster change-of-pace back then go find him but I'd try to make 20-30 carries from Ron Dayne a staple of my offense next season. I think he's got at least two more years left in him at that pace. Probably more like three to four years. Plus I absolutely love the idea of a player who is grateful for a legitimate chance to play. A guy like Dayne who clearly appreciates the shot he's been given and who seemingly wants to prove that he wasn't a bust (but was rather mis-utilized) is something we can really use here. Someone who sounds genuinely grateful to be here is a real nice change of pace I think.

I'm going to flip-flop back to what I was saying at the start of the season. I'm going to apologize to Ron Dayne (in fact I'm doing it right now) and jump on that bandwagon. I think he's got a real future here if the Texans are smart enough to keep feeding that man the ball.
Good post and a very pleasant read Herv. I'm really excited about the prospects of Dayne running the ball for us as well. Cleveland's game should be a fine opportunity for Dayne to firmly establish himself as our go to guy for the run.

2-0 to finish the year Baby!!! Yea!

HOU-TEX
12-27-2006, 11:06 AM
He's looked boarderline outstanding since returning from the inactives. My question is his health issues. Can he stay healthy for a season? Has health even been an issue concerning his past? I wouldn't mind holding onto Dayne for next season, but I still believe we should evaluate the RB position just as much as the other positions in need. If we happen to jump out on the Browns with an early lead, I'd like to see a heavy dose of Chris Taylor.:twocents:

real
12-27-2006, 11:13 AM
. Of course I knew about the turf toe but I discounted it too easily ....

Im guilty of this as well....

edo783
12-27-2006, 11:42 AM
Intersting thing about the big toe is that you can't run well if it isn't functioning well ie. turf toe. In the Roman era IIRC they cut off a big toe on slaves that had run away and then were caught and returned. The idea was that they may run away again, but wont get very far. The big toe is key to walking and running, so if it hurts or is gone, you don't do either well. Turf toe sounds so.........silly, that we tend to discount it, but it's no easy thing to deal with.

stingray
12-27-2006, 11:48 AM
He's been awesome since he's started playing regulary. In the last 4 games, he's averaged 107 yards a game and scored 5 touchdowns. Not bad.

Double Barrel
12-27-2006, 11:53 AM
Great find, Herv! Thanks for posting it.

I didn't think he'd amount to much, either. He seems like a really great guy and appreciative to be given a chance, but I thought he would just be filler until the roster could be solidified over time.

But he's proven a lot of folks wrong, including Denver's coaches, too. Props to Kubiak for seeing his true potential, and I hope Dayne is around next year as a mentor to our young backs and possibly earning the starting spot.

SESupergenius
12-27-2006, 11:58 AM
I am a big back fan as well, I grew up with the Steelers and Franco Harris and the ton of big back they had all the up to Bam Morris. When we got Stacey Mack I for sure thought he'd be the answer to our running game. But, he got injured and that's all she wrote. Dayne seems to not have a lot of tread on him so he may actaully pan out, but the toe does concern me. I hear that this thing just doesn't heal very well and it's a career nagging thing. It's good however to see him finish strong heading into the offseason because then we will know what we have and that is just another positions we do not need to plan for.

El Tejano
12-27-2006, 12:27 PM
Ron Dayne has had some good games. We needed it back in October but he's given us hope.

IMO you still draft or sign your RB and put Dayne as the guy to beat out. That way they know they can grab the job but also so we can see how Dayne does on the hot seat.

If he is better for it, we as a team will be better for it. If someone else takes his job from him, you probably have a legit back.

3 Carries for 24 yard from Chris Taylor isn't going to change my opinion of drafting a back.

Porky
12-27-2006, 12:46 PM
Herv has some good points, but I think it's a little bit of fool's gold to think you are going to get 16 games at that pace out of Dayne. In fact, at that load, I doubt seriousely he even plays 16 games.

Not only that, but he is slow. He'll hit a homerun about as often as Willy Taveras. That said, I also have been impressed in the past 4 weeks. Even though some of the defenses we have played have been poor run stopping defenses, for the first time I have ever seen him, he is actually running like a big bruising back should. He is punishing defenders, dragging would be tacklers, etc. His current style reminds me of Jerome Bettis, and that's a complement.

I think we still need to draft a speed merchant, or all around threat. A breakaway homerun threat, who is also more of a threat in the passing game as well would be ideal. Maybe not in the first rd now, as I thought earlier, but 2nd, 3rd, or even 4th rd, we need to find a guy with homerun ability. Then we could have a version of thunder and lightening. Every good team needs two legit backs. We now have 1, but we still need another one badly imo.

Hervoyel
12-27-2006, 01:04 PM
Herv has some good points, but I think it's a little bit of fool's gold to think you are going to get 16 games at that pace out of Dayne. In fact, at that load, I doubt seriousely he even plays 16 games.

Not only that, but he is slow. He'll hit a homerun about as often as Willy Taveras. That said, I also have been impressed in the past 4 weeks. Even though some of the defenses we have played have been poor run stopping defenses, for the first time I have ever seen him, he is actually running like a big bruising back should. He is punishing defenders, dragging would be tacklers, etc. His current style reminds me of Jerome Bettis, and that's a complement.

I think we still need to draft a speed merchant, or all around threat. A breakaway homerun threat, who is also more of a threat in the passing game as well would be ideal. Maybe not in the first rd now, as I thought earlier, but 2nd, 3rd, or even 4th rd, we need to find a guy with homerun ability. Then we could have a version of thunder and lightening. Every good team needs two legit backs. We now have 1, but we still need another one badly imo.


I don't know man, it's not like he's had an injury filled career. He played in all 16 games his first 3 years in the league (2000-2003) and then all of a sudden he is inactive for the 2003 season. The next year he plays in 14 games (2004) and then he's a Denver Bronco (2005) where he's a role player trying to rejuvenate his career. That leads him here. I don't know if 14-16 games is out of the question from him. I think he might be able to be our "Bus".

This is a guy who seems to always produce more when he's given a load to carry. Give him 2-10 carries a game and he's nothing special but the more you put on his back the better he gets. The average goes up with the number of attempts.

I also think we need someone really, really fast to come in and spell him but I'd still like to see how far we can ride Dayne.

Porky
12-27-2006, 01:25 PM
I don't know man, it's not like he's had an injury filled career. He played in all 16 games his first 3 years in the league (2000-2003) and then all of a sudden he is inactive for the 2003 season. The next year he plays in 14 games (2004) and then he's a Denver Bronco (2005) where he's a role player trying to rejuvenate his career. That leads him here. I don't know if 14-16 games is out of the question from him. I think he might be able to be our "Bus".

This is a guy who seems to always produce more when he's given a load to carry. Give him 2-10 carries a game and he's nothing special but the more you put on his back the better he gets. The average goes up with the number of attempts.

I also think we need someone really, really fast to come in and spell him but I'd still like to see how far we can ride Dayne.

I can't really argue those excellent points, but by the same token, do we really want to hope he stays healthy, without a viable alternative? Many big backs seem to break down over time if they are ridden too hard. Sure, you can ride him for 25+ carries a game, but he might wear down faster. I'm not suggesting 5 carries a game either. I am thinking somewhere in between, say 15. I just think we need a legit option in case he either goes down, or if this really is an aberation. It's not like he has proven anything over his career.

seveneventer
12-27-2006, 01:38 PM
I love Dayne...he has been a breath of fresh air for me this season...and I feel real confident when he has the ball....I am on the Dayne Train for sure!
:texan:

HJam72
12-27-2006, 01:40 PM
A lot of it depends on who's available and when we pick, but I'd be OK with sticking with Dayne as the starter for next year and getting help in other areas. I don't really think it's best to go with BPA or need, but rather to take both into consideration.

threetoedpete
12-27-2006, 01:44 PM
Well I don't have a dog in this fight but will say if coach does what the Denver system does...everyone will get some touches. I don't think there will be 22 touches per game for sixteen games for the Great Dayne. Each RB will have their roll and coach will put each in the best position to succeed. In other words I doubt he'll be beaten down like DD was beaten down by the previous regieme. I don't know and I ain't in the loop. JMHO. also...plenty of day two backs on the board. They, Kubiak & Smtih, wait on the day one guys, takes one more in day two or FA, It'll say to me that they've turned the corner on RB tallent. I believe everyone agrees we can as a previous poster said so gracfully in another thread put it, scratch off full back. We got a blocking beast and the pass catcher tweener. We're, after one decent draft ,making the needs list smaller and smaller. At least now we're not a blind dog in the meat house like we were in '02.

threetoedpete
12-27-2006, 01:47 PM
Sorry porky didn't mean to step on your most excellent post...I'm a slow typer.

ArlingtonTexan
12-27-2006, 01:48 PM
Can someone confirm that Dayne is or is not a FA after the season? I would assume that the Texans should not have a huge issue resigning him even if he is, but I wish to confirm.

And yes, I am having to eat my negative Ron Dayne words.

BigBull17
12-27-2006, 01:53 PM
Ron Dayne has had some good games. We needed it back in October but he's given us hope.

IMO you still draft or sign your RB and put Dayne as the guy to beat out. That way they know they can grab the job but also so we can see how Dayne does on the hot seat.

If he is better for it, we as a team will be better for it. If someone else takes his job from him, you probably have a legit back.

3 Carries for 24 yard from Chris Taylor isn't going to change my opinion of drafting a back.

How about Peterson as the home run threat? Talk about a back field you hate to try and tackle. I dont see a 1st round rb, and with our holes there is too much that needs help, but that would be one painfull backfield.

threetoedpete
12-27-2006, 01:56 PM
Yeah but if All Day slips to nine...like I posted, it's going to be interesting to see which way they jump.

DayneBum
12-27-2006, 02:00 PM
i'm gonna go out on a limb here, and say. The texans wont be drafting no rb in next years draft. If anything they will sign an undrafted rookie..:twocents:

trutexan02
12-27-2006, 02:04 PM
For one I am very excited that Dayne has done so well, but let';s not get to ahead of ourselves. We are a team that is desperate to have something to grab onto and claim is great. We are too quick to assume that our search for a workhorse is over and we forget how quickly it came all come to a halt the last time we had a great RB. I hope Dayne is that workhorse, but I don't think we should hang our hats on him just yet. Three good games doesn't do it for me. Give me a 1000 yd. season then come see me.
Until then RB is a position we need to look at.

DD is the greatest RB this organization had ever had, but his injury problems are too much to overlook.

My position: Evaluate RB in the offseason.

And given his recent performance, heavily evaluate Dayne. He has earned it thus far.

Hervoyel
12-27-2006, 02:09 PM
I think if Dayne rolls over the Browns it will be hard for the coaches not to think "well, we're alright at RB for the time being". It's not at all my opinion that we can't use a good RB. Hey we can use another good player at almost every position. I think that Dayne maybe buys us some time at this position. I think his emergence means that we can grab a lineman or a player for our secondary. It means that we have a running back who can make some yards behind this line.

If Peterson falls then I won't be upset at all if we pick him up. With Dayne playing the way he has been I won't be upset if we pass on Peterson in favor of some other player we need either. I don't feel like we must address the RB position early. Now I feel like we've got "something" there. We can add to it or improve somewhere else.

Dayne this year has been arguably better than Davis was in his best years. Admittedly he's only done it for four weeks (hopefully 5 following the game Sunday) but he's been pretty consistent so far. He's getting it done week in and week out. When Dayne hurt his ankle last week he missed a series and then came back in and continued running through the Colts. When Davis used to get a knick or a ding he just wasn't the same player. Every single RB who plays regularly in the NFL is going to get some bumps and bruises during the course of the year. We've all heard the cliche about how everyone is banged up this time of year. It's true. When Domanick was banged up he was ineffective. Dayne doesn't seem to have that problem with the small injuries. I like that.

TexansSeminole
12-27-2006, 02:10 PM
I think the Texans would be nuts to not give Dayne a shot at being the guy next year. If they think they need to go get someone else to be that faster change-of-pace back then go find him but I'd try to make 20-30 carries from Ron Dayne a staple of my offense next season.


I couldn't agree more. I think him and Lundy will be the only backs to stay on the team after this year. Obviously depending on DD's situation.

I think if Dayne rolls over the Browns it will be hard for the coaches not to think "well, we're alright at RB for the time being". It's not at all my opinion that we can't use a good RB. Hey we can use another good player at almost every position. I think that Dayne maybe buys us some time at this position. I think his emergence means that we can grab a lineman or a player for our secondary. It means that we have a running back who can make some yards behind this line.

If Peterson falls then I won't be upset at all if we pick him up. With Dayne playing the way he has been I won't be upset if we pass on Peterson in favor of some other player we need.

I think Peterson would be a good pickup...I dont think he is as injury prone as some people say he is...a couple injuries is normal (the fact that they were as serious as they were is just bad luck). Every football player, especially running backs, gets injured. I also would not mind if we passed him up for a defensive player (secondary hopefully).

ArlingtonTexan
12-27-2006, 03:06 PM
i'm gonna go out on a limb here, and say. The texans wont be drafting no rb in next years draft. If anything they will sign an undrafted rookie..:twocents:

One of the reasons that the Broncos have "found" so many RBs is that they seldom went a year w/o drafting one. Possible, but I would be surprised.

brewhaus
12-27-2006, 03:15 PM
i'm gonna go out on a limb here, and say. The texans wont be drafting no rb in next years draft. If anything they will sign an undrafted rookie..:twocents:

I agree Bum......too many other needs to worry about drafting a running back. I think what we have will get us through the '07 season.

DayneBum
12-27-2006, 03:43 PM
I agree Bum......too many other needs to worry about drafting a running back. I think what we have will get us through the '07 season.

nOT ONLY THAT. bUT I BELEIVE THAT kUBIAK WILL HAVE DAYNE ON THE SAME WORKOUT plan that he was on when he 1st arrived in Denver. And he was playing at 235-238lbs, and he stayed healthy. Long as he stays healthy, i think we will have that 1000yrd back that everyone misses. With a great off-season. And with the competiton form Gado, Lundy and Taylor, and maybe a undrafted rookie, the backfield is set.

TheOgre
12-27-2006, 04:07 PM
If we pass on Peterson and go the OT, CB, FS, or QB route, then I still hope we find a change of pace back in the middle to late rounds. Someone with speed and return skills who could be our 3rd down back.

Vinny
12-27-2006, 04:15 PM
One of the reasons that the Broncos have "found" some many RBs is that they seldom went a year w/o drafting one. Possible, but I would be surprised.rb is such a high injury position and the shelf life is so short, most NFL teams draft a back every year or at least every other year regardless of their starter....if I researched it I'd bet I'd find that it is rare that any team would not draft a back in two consecutive drafts.

DreDaMan05
12-27-2006, 04:37 PM
You have to upgrade the RB situation. In the world of football where you got Tomlinson, L. Johnson, Barber etc. you have to have the homerun hitter to take the pressure off of Carr. Why did you think Carr looked so good when his stats was not that impressive. Don't let a string of 4 games have you on the bandwagon. As you remember we looked good the preseason too but you see how that worked out. Peterson and Dayne could be a backfield causing havioc for years. While giving Carr less pressures to worry about. So bring him back next year get Peterson or a proven veteran with speed and watch the Texans avg. 28 points a game. Go Texans.:yahoo:

stevo3883
12-27-2006, 09:01 PM
honestly, this is way too reminiscent of the whole "we don't need VY because Carr is more than serviceable."

You can't pass on great talent because you are *OK* at a position. Dayne just had his first 100 yard game in like 5 years, yeah, hes a keeper...

Hervoyel
12-27-2006, 09:51 PM
honestly, this is way too reminiscent of the whole "we don't need VY because Carr is more than serviceable."

You can't pass on great talent because you are *OK* at a position. Dayne just had his first 100 yard game in like 5 years, yeah, hes a keeper...


You can't look at someones stats for 5 years and think that the numbers on the page tell the entire story either stevo. Before this season when was the last time Ron Dayne got 32 carries in a game? The answer to that would be never. You have to go back to his rookie season before you see a game where he even got 20 carries. The man can't put up 100 yard games when he doesn't get the ball now can he?

I don't think the Texans have the luxury of being picky about where a player comes from when they find one. This year they found a RB in a resurgent Ron Dayne. That's a good thing and if they choose to fill another hole somewhere else because they think they have this one pretty well plugged for the time being I'm ok with that. I was very much interested in seeing them draft a RB in the first round in this coming draft. Now I'll be fine with a second day pick there and some other position in the first.

agnidragon
12-27-2006, 10:05 PM
Could Dayne be turning into the running back version of Jim Plunkett, a former Heisman Trophy winner who doesn't realize much NFL success until he's with his third organization?

In his four games this month, Dayne has firmly run himself into Houston's long-term plans. His career-best 29-carry, 153-yard day against the Colts gives him 429 yards and five touchdowns in the past four games, numbers that equate to 1,716 yards and 20 scores on the season if that pace were sustained.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/don_banks/12/24/week.16.snap.judgments/index.html

Dayne gets praised in SI. I think we should keep him next year also, he has been doing a great job since getting healthy. You could tell he wanted to play last sunday even with the sprained ankle he got in the 1 quarter.

stevo3883
12-27-2006, 10:28 PM
You can't look at someones stats for 5 years and think that the numbers on the page tell the entire story either stevo. Before this season when was the last time Ron Dayne got 32 carries in a game? The answer to that would be never. You have to go back to his rookie season before you see a game where he even got 20 carries. The man can't put up 100 yard games when he doesn't get the ball now can he?

I don't think the Texans have the luxury of being picky about where a player comes from when they find one. This year they found a RB in a resurgent Ron Dayne. That's a good thing and if they choose to fill another hole somewhere else because they think they have this one pretty well plugged for the time being I'm ok with that. I was very much interested in seeing them draft a RB in the first round in this coming draft. Now I'll be fine with a second day pick there and some other position in the first.

I just dont see anything he brings to the table that Peterson wouldnt be able to double. Peterson has the ability to give us a top 10 rushing game the minute he steps on the field. By keeping Dayne we are saying mediocre is good enough.

Ive been looking for a dominant rusher ever since we started, and ill be damned if Peterson, who IMO is almost perfect as a RB, falls to us and we go with Ron Dayne.

stingray
12-27-2006, 10:38 PM
I just dont see anything he brings to the table that Peterson wouldnt be able to double. Peterson has the ability to give us a top 10 rushing game the minute he steps on the field. By keeping Dayne we are saying mediocre is good enough.

Ive been looking for a dominant rusher ever since we started, and ill be damned if Peterson, who IMO is almost perfect as a RB, falls to us and we go with Ron Dayne.

I agree. I believe that if you have a top five pick, you try to pick that special player, no matter what your needs are. To many people get caught up in the oh we need a safety, or we need a middle linebacker. Look what happened to us last year, we didn't need Reggie or vince cause we had DD and Carr. The Lions passed on Leinart cause they needed a safety. A great player can overcome some of those needs. Don't get me wrong, you still need talent, but to many teams pass on great players early in the draft becasue of needs.

West Texas Texan
12-27-2006, 10:41 PM
The players think Dayne is a beast. Hard runner. Several defensive players on opposing teams didn't want to tackle him. He inflicts pain when he runs. He hasn't played much so his legs are still fresh 5 years later.

Chris Taylor is the real deal. 6'1'', 230 lbs, has as much or more speed than Lundy, except that he can run over people too. He gets his confidence, he'll be challenging for a starting position.

West Texas Texan
12-27-2006, 10:43 PM
The players think Dayne is a beast. Hard runner. Several defensive players on opposing teams didn't want to tackle him. He inflicts pain when he runs. He hasn't played much so his legs are still fresh 5 years later.

The Rams didn't want Jerome Bettis after three years, and look what he did with the Steelers.

Chris Taylor is the real deal. 6'1'', 230 lbs, has as much or more speed than Lundy, except that he can run over people too. He gets his confidence, he'll be challenging for a starting position.

Lundy will improve, DD is a question mark.

Pick up Peterson, and we will have a bevy of backs.

edo783
12-27-2006, 11:06 PM
We will be picking between 6-9 and I doubt AP falls that far. If he does.....probably should take him. I'm not a fan of taking a RB that high, but he might be worth it.

Hervoyel
12-27-2006, 11:12 PM
We will be picking between 6-9 and I doubt AP falls that far. If he does.....probably should take him. I'm not a fan of taking a RB that high, but he might be worth it.


And I'm not at all against taking him. I'm just no longer thinking we need to do whatever it takes to get a back that can roll over defenses. We have one of those now (from the most unlikely of places I might add) and so Peterson, should he fall to the Texans is some serious gravy.

I'd be perfectly content with Peterson. I'd be fine with Dayne and someone at another position too.

TexanSam
12-27-2006, 11:13 PM
The players think Dayne is a beast. Hard runner. Several defensive players on opposing teams didn't want to tackle him. He inflicts pain when he runs. He hasn't played much so his legs are still fresh 5 years later.

The Rams didn't want Jerome Bettis after three years, and look what he did with the Steelers.

Chris Taylor is the real deal. 6'1'', 230 lbs, has as much or more speed than Lundy, except that he can run over people too. He gets his confidence, he'll be challenging for a starting position.

Lundy will improve, DD is a question mark.

Pick up Peterson, and we will have a bevy of backs.

I think having a bevy of backs will be a negative. If Domanick Davis clears out before the draft, then even if AP is there I say we draft someone else or trade our pick. If DD doesn't clear out, then if Peterson is there I would take him. A Dayne-Peterson duo would be amazing, assuming Ron Dayne plays like he has these past few weeks.

newport texan
12-27-2006, 11:20 PM
his new nickname should be laDAYNEian

The Pencil Neck
12-27-2006, 11:57 PM
I agree. I believe that if you have a top five pick, you try to pick that special player, no matter what your needs are. To many people get caught up in the oh we need a safety, or we need a middle linebacker. Look what happened to us last year, we didn't need Reggie or vince cause we had DD and Carr. The Lions passed on Leinart cause they needed a safety. A great player can overcome some of those needs. Don't get me wrong, you still need talent, but to many teams pass on great players early in the draft becasue of needs.


I think people get too caught up on how high the pick is and expect too much out of it. Let's go with the surefire pick like... Robert Gallery or Tony Mandarich or ... whatever. You can't just look at what you need but you can't ignore what you need, either. It's all a crapshoot. A running back who looks really good before the draft could end up being Marshall Faulk or KiJana Carter, you really don't know until you get him out onto the field and the hitting starts. (And even then it might take some time.)

At this point, we still don't know if Leinart is going to end up being a good QB. We really don't. If the Lions become a powerhouse next year (which I seriously doubt), then maybe they made all the right decisions. Maybe Andrew Walters (or Marques whatsisname) is the answer for the Raiders... maybe Huff is going to end up being a better player for them than Leinart or Cutler would have been... Stranger things have happened. Well. Maybe but not MUCH stranger.

The bottom line is you take the guy you think is best keeping in mind what you need, what you have, and how you think this kid is going to play. Then you make your pick and cross your fingers. When the Bengals chose Dan Wilkinson instead of Faulk, they must have thought they were doing the right thing and not being stoopid.

As a fan, all I can do is sit back and hope our scouting department rawks and our coaching staff knows what it's doing. After last year's draft, I've got a pretty good feeling about next years draft. :snobord:

DC Texan
12-28-2006, 09:34 AM
A few weeks I put up a post asking all of your opinions on Dayne and at that point in time there were a lot of doubters. My response to that was give it a few weeks and I think you will change your mind. From this post it seems like people are starting to do exactly that. The man is a beast. He is like a throw back player. John Riggins comes to my mind first.

He brings an incredible demension to the offense. No he may not be that homerun hitter that can break a 90 play for a touchdown everytime he has the ball. What he does bring is consistency. He can consistently give you five yards at a time (he can break the long one as well) with out a doubt. This makes the quarterbacks job so much easier. As we saw against the colts, it stops the defense from blitzing which give the quartreback a lot more time to throw the ball. It also does something that is so valuable, it keeps the ball out of the opponets hands.

With that being said, there are a lot of other positions that we need to address before running back through the draft or FA. However, if we can get a speedy running back to compliment Dayne some where along the line, it would not hurt at all either.

P.S.

We are not going to get Peterson. He won't be around!!!!

DayneBum
12-28-2006, 09:52 AM
Tell me: have u heard of, Terrell Davis(6th rd pick) Mike Anderson(6th rd pick), Olandis Gary (4th rd pick), tatum Bell( 2nd rd pick, 23yrds away) Quentin Griifin(4th rd pick) clinton Portis( 2nd rd pick). These 6 rb's are the players who have rushed for 1000yards or more and who have made an name for themselves running in this dynamic zone-blocking scheme. And they were all drafted by the Denver Broncos. Now u have the offensive cordinator, who called plays, worked with, and coached for all of these rb's as the head coach of the Houston Texans. And as u can see, none of these guys are 1st rd picks, not even in the top 32.

If u think kubiak is drafting a rb 1st rd, your in for a rude awakeing come draft day. i dont care who is on the board when the Texans make there 1st selection. i'll tell u this....IT WONT BE A RUNNING BACK! We have a 1st rd pick heisman trophy winner in the backfeild already. And here's the kicker....he ran in this same exact run-blocking schme in college, which won him the heisman, and also still holds the Ncaa rushing title and rushing attempts till this day. A healthy Ron Dayne in this type of offense is a major problem for defenses. The proof is in the pudding ladies and gentlemen. And with kubiak's knowledge of this offense i wouldnt be surprised if he didnt draft a rb. There are to many other glaring needs to be filled, let alone the comeback of Dominck Davis. Trust me, u guys will be fine with Dayne,Taylor, Lundy, and Gado.

Hervoyel
12-28-2006, 10:41 AM
DayneBum I understand why you're saying that but it doesn't change the fact that Gary Kubiak tried to draft a running back in the 1st round of this past draft and was only prevented from doing so by Carolina grabbing DeAngelo Williams before we could move up to get him.

I agree with you that Ron Dayne and the supporting cast you name will be fine in 2007. I also think that if we add someone else to the mix through the draft we probably won't do it with a 1st round pick. It would be a second day project pick no doubt.

It's a mistake though to think that Kubiak won't pull the trigger on a running back in the first round just because Denver didn't do it when he was there. That's as much about Shanahan as it is anything.

Also keep in mind that the Broncos were pretty good during much of that stretch. How many can't-miss first round RB's did they get a shot at during that time? Not many since they weren't up to pick until later in the first round. Had they sported a high enough pick in the right draft you might very well have seen them take a RB somewhere in there.

Malloy
12-28-2006, 10:49 AM
I mentioned this in some other Dayne thread, but Dayne had me when he pushed a tackle into the endzone AND rammed Owen Daniels for several feet.

That's power and dedication, both of whom I love dearly :)

thunderkyss
12-28-2006, 10:50 AM
I'm down with Dayne....... but I told y'all that from the get go. Indy Washington.... it was poor playcalling, and game situations that affected his stats.

Miami, Dallas... well they've been the shiznit for stopping a running game... Ron Dayne behind a decent OL would've ate them up(no pun intended) but behind the line we gave him, there was only so much anyone was going to do.

But I wouldn't be surprised if We do draft AD if he's there.

I think we'll more than likely get a first round LT, so we can say........ "see David, we tried"..

RonDayne will have a break out year, ChrisTaylor & Lundy will have very good years.... if DD is playing, Gado is gone, if not, Gado's stock is going to go up, and we're going to trade him for a shut down Corner.

thunderkyss
12-28-2006, 10:52 AM
Also keep in mind that the Broncos were pretty good during much of that stretch. How many can't-miss first round RB's did they get a shot at during that time? Not many since they weren't up to pick until later in the first round. Had they sported a high enough pick in the right draft you might very well have seen them take a RB somewhere in there.

They made moves to get Tatum Bell & Jay Cutler. If there was someone that high that they wanted, they'd have made it happen.

But I agree...... our wheel'n & deel'n to get D'Angelo Williams proves it.

HOU-TEX
12-28-2006, 10:56 AM
RonDayne will have a break out year, ChrisTaylor & Lundy will have very good years.... if DD is playing, Gado is gone, if not, Gado's stock is going to go up, and we're going to trade him for a shut down Corner.

Do you really think Lundy will be around next year? IMO, he's done nothing to prove his worth to the team.

How is Gados stock going up? By being inactive? By being non-productive when active?

I'm not bashing, just curious.:)

DayneBum
12-28-2006, 11:24 AM
DayneBum I understand why you're saying that but it doesn't change the fact that Gary Kubiak tried to draft a running back in the 1st round of this past draft and was only prevented from doing so by Carolina grabbing DeAngelo Williams before we could move up to get him.

I agree with you that Ron Dayne and the supporting cast you name will be fine in 2007. I also think that if we add someone else to the mix through the draft we probably won't do it with a 1st round pick. It would be a second day project pick no doubt.

It's a mistake though to think that Kubiak won't pull the trigger on a running back in the first round just because Denver didn't do it when he was there. That's as much about Shanahan as it is anything.

Also keep in mind that the Broncos were pretty good during much of that stretch. How many can't-miss first round RB's did they get a shot at during that time? Not many since they weren't up to pick until later in the first round. Had they sported a high enough pick in the right draft you might very well have seen them take a RB somewhere in there.

Herv, i agree with u whole-heartedly. See this is my 1st year following the Texans. I'm sure the name explains why. I can see why Kubiak might of gambled on a rb in the 1st rd last year. Last year i think i was the deepest class of rb's ever in the Nfl draft. But this year, looks like there's only a few that will go 1st rd. And Kubiak stilll knows that u dont need no high priced 1st rd rb to be succesful in this offense. And i toatlly agree with u that Shanahan had alot to do with that. i can tell u that the broncos missed out on Stephen jackson, and even last year they were one of the teams with alot of picks, and they didnt even draft a rb. they either traded or went in another direction. And on top of that they had a healthy Ron Dayne in-house. And had he not gotten hurt, he may have been on that list of the great rb's to come out of Denver. But i think Houston will be the place for him to resurect his career. And now, kubes in the same position Shanny was faced with....But I'm still sticking with they will pick up an undrafted rookie.

kcwilson
12-28-2006, 11:34 AM
I WAS PRETTY DOWN ON DAYNE AND NOT A BELIEVER IN HIM.

I can't say I believe in him now, only because at times this year, he just doesn't have much else besides a bumble forward run attack. It still seems like he has missed some big holes this year, and still runs up the back of his lineman. I think there is a difference between the way Jerome Bettis runs and Dayne. Bettis leveraged his size and moved a pile. Dayne hits the pile and then just tries to fall forward through a hole in the pile....

That being said, I think he could be a good complement to the 2007 roster. I agree with making someone beat him out... but I PRAY THAT SOMEONE EASILY BEATS HIM OUT!

No homerun threat really changes how the defense has to play. Having one guy on offense that can make a big play isn't to hard to guard against.

DayneBum
12-28-2006, 11:42 AM
I WAS PRETTY DOWN ON DAYNE AND NOT A BELIEVER IN HIM.

I can't say I believe in him now, only because at times this year, he just doesn't have much else besides a bumble forward run attack. It still seems like he has missed some big holes this year, and still runs up the back of his lineman. I think there is a difference between the way Jerome Bettis runs and Dayne. Bettis leveraged his size and moved a pile. Dayne hits the pile and then just tries to fall forward through a hole in the pile....

That being said, I think he could be a good complement to the 2007 roster. I agree with making someone beat him out... but I PRAY THAT SOMEONE EASILY BEATS HIM OUT!

No homerun threat really changes how the defense has to play. Having one guy on offense that can make a big play isn't to hard to guard against.

Are u watching the same Dayne we have been watching? U must be looking at clips from New York.

thunderkyss
12-28-2006, 12:17 PM
Do you really think Lundy will be around next year? IMO, he's done nothing to prove his worth to the team.

How is Gados stock going up? By being inactive? By being non-productive when active?

I'm not bashing, just curious.:)

I'm talking about next year. I think we should pound the ball with RonDayne, then throw in shot of Lundy........ to me, he's basically the same thing as Vernand Morency, only a little more sure footed.

Gado.... also will boost his stock once we start opening big holes on the OL.... and he's allowed to get up to speed.

jdog
12-29-2006, 09:18 AM
I get the impression that Dayne needs to get a lot of carries in a game, and he has weight issues which affect his ability to handle a lot of carries.

He obviously has talent. I love the big, bruising back type. Plus, I just like the man. The quote from Carr about Dayne being in the huddle during the Colts game looking like a puppy dog hoping to get the ball makes me like him more.

Give the ball to #36!

GuerillaBlack
12-29-2006, 09:34 AM
If he just changes some of that fat to muscle, he could be better than Jerome Bettis.

Hervoyel
12-29-2006, 10:09 AM
Personally I don't think the guys fat. I think he uses that extra weight well and that his biggest problem has been a coach in New York (Fassel) who drafted a big-ass running back who gets stronger as the day goes on and then insisted on him becoming a smaller running back who gets a fraction of the carries but produces at the same level.

It's like the woman who dates a guy for a while, marries him, and then tries to change everything about him. Why did she marry him if everything about him needed to be changed? The Giants almost immediatley asked Dayne to change everything about his game that made him successful up until then. What did they expect to happen?

edo783
12-29-2006, 10:19 AM
Based on what I have seen of Dayne, he is a guy that needs the ball 25-30 times a game to be productive. He gets stronger (or does the defense wear down?) as the game goes on. Just one of those guys that just needs to get the work to be effective and get in the flow. Give it to him 12-15 and he just doesn't get going. Early in the season his toe was an issue, slowed him big time to the hole and cut his power, and I think he really hadn't got into NFL football shape because of the toe thing. Once it got better, he was able to put in more work and played himself into shape. His body type probably won't ever look lean, but that doesn't mean he is actually fat.

tulexan
12-29-2006, 10:26 AM
Dayne may be back next year, but he will not be the feature back for the Texans.

I really think that we are going to draft either Adrian Peterson or Marshawn Lynch with the first pick.

thunderkyss
12-29-2006, 10:32 AM
Dayne may be back next year, but he will not be the feature back for the Texans.

I really think that we are going to draft either Adrian Peterson or Marshawn Lynch with the first pick.

hmm...... I think Marshawn lynch was shown up by Forrsette......

Lynch wasn't very impressive...... not top 10 pick impressive....

I understand it was just one game.... but damn.

tulexan
12-29-2006, 10:36 AM
hmm...... I think Marshawn lynch was shown up by Forrsette......

Lynch wasn't very impressive...... not top 10 pick impressive....

I understand it was just one game.... but damn.

Can't judge a guy by one game. He didn't become the 2nd leading rusher of Cal history (after 3 years) with a career average of over 6.5 yards per carry by being mediocre. The guy can play and will be a great NFL player.

DenverBorn
12-29-2006, 10:40 AM
kinda like part-time running back J J Arrington - oh -

tulexan
12-29-2006, 10:45 AM
kinda like part-time running back J J Arrington - oh -

If anything Forsett is more like Arrington. Arrington was a scat back like Forsett, while Lynch has some power behind him. He is a lot like Laurence Maroney.

GuerillaBlack
12-29-2006, 11:11 AM
I hope we can pick up Lynch with our first pick. He can be our speedy guy and help out Ron Dayne a lot. Our second round pick can go to defense, and our third to defense our O-Line.

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site181/2006/0806/20060806_072931_cal_lynch.jpg

He would look good in a Texans uniform.

DocBar
12-29-2006, 01:01 PM
honestly, this is way too reminiscent of the whole "we don't need VY because Carr is more than serviceable."

You can't pass on great talent because you are *OK* at a position. Dayne just had his first 100 yard game in like 5 years, yeah, hes a keeper...

Some of it is reminding me of the RB discussion. Adrian Peterson will NOT make us a top 10 running team anymore than Bush did with New Orleans or VY make the Titans a top 10 passing team. Nor can you give Dayne the keys to the city for stringing together 4 good games. I think LT scored more TD's in a four games stretch than the Texans have all year. I guess what I'm saying is, I hope we have an honest, in-depth assessment of ALL the players and seperate the wheat from the chaffe. Rick Smith seems to be very good at evaluating talent from the results we see from the DL. The area's of need for this team are sre obvious. OL, DB, DL. We could use another stud LB like Ryans and a great RB would be great. We need to draft for need, IMHO, not BPA. Jerry Rice does us no good if the passs protection isn't there. Neither does Barry Sanders or Dan Marino. We need to get our lines in order after 4 yrs of neglect. We need to draft the big ugly guys a lot more than the flashy poster boys.
:twocents:

tulexan
12-29-2006, 01:08 PM
Some of it is reminding me of the RB discussion. Adrian Peterson will NOT make us a top 10 running team anymore than Bush did with New Orleans or VY make the Titans a top 10 passing team. Nor can you give Dayne the keys to the city for stringing together 4 good games. I think LT scored more TD's in a four games stretch than the Texans have all year. I guess what I'm saying is, I hope we have an honest, in-depth assessment of ALL the players and seperate the wheat from the chaffe. Rick Smith seems to be very good at evaluating talent from the results we see from the DL. The area's of need for this team are sre obvious. OL, DB, DL. We could use another stud LB like Ryans and a great RB would be great. We need to draft for need, IMHO, not BPA. Jerry Rice does us no good if the passs protection isn't there. Neither does Barry Sanders or Dan Marino. We need to get our lines in order after 4 yrs of neglect. We need to draft the big ugly guys a lot more than the flashy poster boys.
:twocents:

I can see what you are saying, but choosing two non-traditional players as your examples isn't going to help your argument. Look at what Maurice Drew is doing to the Jags running game. They are on the verge of having over 2,000 yards rushing this season.

DocBar
12-29-2006, 01:18 PM
I can see what you are saying, but choosing two non-traditional players as your examples isn't going to help your argument. Look at what Maurice Drew is doing to the Jags running game. They are on the verge of having over 2,000 yards rushing this season.

I think Drew is this years Cinderella( I like Colston a lot too). I enjoy watching the little guy. That example also helps make my point. The Jags have always, since they came into the league, made OL and DL a priority. They're known as a rushing team first and have one of the best DL's in the NFL. You don't get that by accident. Look at Detroit and the BPA approach they took with WR in the 1st rnd 3 yrs in a row. I'm all for the BPA when the needs of the team aren't as glaring as ours are. With Casserly gone, maybe we can fix that. I can't stress enough how important the person judging the talent is. DUH!! Remember leaving Derrick Johnson on the board for TJ????? BPA my ass.

elbison
12-29-2006, 11:29 PM
"During the Oilers Run-and-Shoot years I missed seeing a good running game."

I know it's only one year, but Lorenzo White was absolutely THE MAN in 1992 :shades: nearly 2000 total yards / 1200+ rushing. I was just a kid, but man he was fun to watch.....I'm thinking a huge jump TD in a MNF game against Miami or something....and some Campbell-esque untackleables at times.

Of course that year started out 1-4 W/L I believe and I think we ended 10-6 thanks to the hiring of Buddy Ryan and his ace, ball-strippin' D.

But, the 1992 wild card game was something we'd all like to forget......Steve Jackson or whatever that DBs name was had a great game :pigfly: .

Oh and Gary Brown was good in 1993.....5.1ypc, 1000yds.

kingh99
12-29-2006, 11:50 PM
The running back flavor of the month is the bowling ball rb like Gore or Jones-Drew. Weren't these guys working at Lowes or something last year?

TexansFanatic
12-30-2006, 11:18 AM
I know it's only one year, but Lorenzo White was absolutely THE MAN in 1992.

Of course that year started out 1-4 W/L I believe and I think we ended 10-6 thanks to the hiring of Buddy Ryan and his ace, ball-strippin' D.


The Oilers started 1992 with 3 wins and 1 loss and wound up 10-6. You're thinking of the following year, 1993, when they started out 1-4 and wound up winning 11 games in a row to finish 12-4. I remember it well, because they had Super Bowl written all over them during that streak and then, typically, went straight into the toilet in the playoffs....

elbison
12-30-2006, 11:48 AM
Thanks.

Originally I had written 1-4 to 12-4 and had in my head they had won 11 straight, but then I thought "nah maybe that was what I was hoping they'd do".....LOL

1991-1993 were fun years to watch until the Broncos in 91 / Bills in 92 / Chiefs in 93.

TexansFanatic
12-30-2006, 12:19 PM
1991-1993 were fun years to watch until the Broncos in 91 / Bills in 92 / Chiefs in 93.

Man, don't remind me. What masochists we Oilers fans were. How crazy do you have to be to hang in there with a team that breaks your heart so consistently? Now I'm a Texans fan and somehow I thought things were going different. Same song, different verse...

HJam72
12-30-2006, 02:16 PM
The Oilers started 1992 with 3 wins and 1 loss and wound up 10-6. You're thinking of the following year, 1993, when they started out 1-4 and wound up winning 11 games in a row to finish 12-4. I remember it well, because they had Super Bowl written all over them during that streak and then, typically, went straight into the toilet in the playoffs....

Well, they ran into a guy named Joe Montana. It's a shame, but that's what happened.