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View Full Version : Mario = Youngest rookie in his draft class.


cptnbreakdance
12-15-2006, 12:27 PM
I still think we are jumping the gun saying Mario is a bust....
Coming out of N.C. State, he didn't have to use all of his natural skill and ability in order to dominate his position. I give him until mid season next year at least until we can start talking bust... With all of the injuries to the D-Line and the players signed off of the street to fill those voids, not to mention the complete lack of any other defensive talent besides he and DeMeco its no wonder he cant make the plays he would make if there wasn't a contender teams practice squad out there playing with him.

real
12-15-2006, 12:30 PM
I still think we are jumping the gun saying Mario is a bust....
Coming out of N.C. State, he didn't have to use all of his natural skill and ability in order to dominate his position. I give him until mid season next year at least until we can start talking bust... With all of the injuries to the D-Line and the players signed off of the street to fill those voids, not to mention the complete lack of any other defensive talent besides he and DeMeco its no wonder he cant make the plays he would make if there wasn't a contender teams practice squad out there playing with him.

At this point I don't even think it's about Mario's production....

It's more about VY's and RB's production and "what could've been"....Mario will be judged by what we passed on....not what he does....

If Mario becomes a pretty good DE...But RB and VY become great, then he will still be looked at as the wrong pick....

kfranco_utexas
12-15-2006, 12:32 PM
Are you sure about that?

run-david-run
12-15-2006, 12:38 PM
At this point I don't even think it's about Mario's production....

It's more about VY's and RB's production and "what could've been"....Mario will be judged by what we passed on....not what he does....

If Mario becomes a pretty good DE...But RB and VY become great, then he will still be looked at as the wrong pick....

2 decent games for Reggie does not a season make. Other then tearing up the 49ers, what has Reggie done that can constitute production?

Anyone else notice how all of a sudden ESPN keeps running those "top rookie" semgements on all their sports shows now that Reggie has finally scored a TD?

Mr. White
12-15-2006, 12:41 PM
I still think we are jumping the gun saying Mario is a bust....


That's why no one really is saying it now....most people around here think that he's a solid DE....just wasn't worth a #1.

Most of us are glad to have him.

real
12-15-2006, 12:44 PM
2 decent games for Reggie does not a season make. Other then tearing up the 49ers, what has Reggie done that can constitute production?

I'll assume you're directing this question towards me since you quoted me...

I never said that Bush or Young or anyone else has done anything this year....I was simply stating how I believe Mario will be judged...And as of right now looking at the total body of work, IMO, RB and VY have had better careers to date.....

Anyone else notice how all of a sudden ESPN keeps running those "top rookie" semgements on all their sports shows now that Reggie has finally scored a TD?

I'm sure it doesn't have anything to do with the season winding down...

Texan_Bill
12-15-2006, 12:46 PM
Way tooooo many "if's"... Lets talk about it in a year or so.... When each of those three guys have more of a body of work to judge them. Especially when any argument concerning the production of an offensive guy versus the production of a defensive guy is skewed to begin with. I am still not overly impressed with RB anyway... I mean I would be if I needed another receiver, but as a running back, not so much....

TexansSeminole
12-15-2006, 12:48 PM
Who said he was a bust?

Texan_Bill
12-15-2006, 12:51 PM
Who said he was a bust?

The people that won't accept the fact that their beloved VY is not here.

real
12-15-2006, 12:51 PM
Way tooooo many "if's"... Lets talk about it in a year or so.... When each of those three guys have more of a body of work to judge them. Especially when any argument concerning the production of an offensive guy versus the production of a defensive guy is skewed to begin with. I am still not overly impressed with RB anyway...

You guys are so caught up in this love/hate thing for these players that you all have twisted what this thread was about....The thread is about MARIO and how HE WILL be judged....Not about who has been better....The starter of this thread said that Mario needs to be given time....and I said that no matter how good he gets, IF Young and/or Bush turn out to be super studs, then Mario will be looked at as the wrong choice....I'm not sure what that has to do with WHO is better or WHO's going to be better....It was a discussion about how MARIO will be viewed....


I mean I would be if I needed another receiver, but as a running back, not so much....

What does it matter as long as he is producing and putting the ball in the endzone? 7 points is 7 points no matter how you get it....

TexansSeminole
12-15-2006, 12:59 PM
What does it matter as long as he is producing and putting the ball in the endzone? 7 points is 7 points no matter how you get it....

I think he is saying that because we need a RUNNING back...and Reggie Bush is not really a running back...more like a receiving threat out of the backfield.

RazorOye
12-15-2006, 05:57 PM
2 decent games for Reggie does not a season make. Other then tearing up the 49ers, what has Reggie done that can constitute production?

the double standard hypocrisy around RB and Mario never ceases to amuse me. When people start talking about Reggie Bush, everyone wants to point to numbers and not the impact he can have away from the ball or how defenses have to account for him - how he can complicate game planning.

But try to play the numbers argument for Mario, and it's no longer about numbers. It's about how Mario changes the offense's gameplan. How they rush away from him - you can't talk about numbers for Mario.

So which is it? Are you guys talking about numbers and stats? or are you talking about what potential impact a player can have on the other team? It seems that you stick to whichever makes the argument fall in your favor. A classic case of having your cake and eating it too.

You also talk about the time needed to develop - don't rush to judgment too early. And most of you ignore the progress that Bush has made. His yards per carry has doubled from the first half of the year because he is no longer dancing as much - hitting holes as soon as they open.

His run against Dallas the other night was impressive - not phenomenal - he had amazing blocking. But he shed a tackle and made a couple more miss.

You guys just dont want to give credit.

You use a completely different set of criteria to judge Mario and Reggie - and to some extent it's valid because you are comparing two different positions. But the heart of all of this is a bias against Reggie Bush. He's had more than a couple of good games.

he's had more than a couple of good highlight-worthy runs.

And you ask, stupidly in my opinion, how can we say that RB has "produced" - as a rookie, how is 400+ yards rushing, 80 receptions for nearly 800 yards, and 7 TDs through 13 games NOT production? And he's improvng every game.

Do I think he's ROY? No, I'd put him behind VY and maybe Jones-Drew - Colston's injury has made the two of them neck and neck imo. I'd like to see him hold on to the ball better. I'd like to see him move forward more when the holes open.

This might not seem possible - I grew up idolizing the Saints and my dad was a huge Oilers fan. When the Oilers left my dad was heartbroken and when the Texans arrived he was ecstatic. And living in Houston, I rooted for the Texans. And I found it easy to do both because they were in different conferences.

But even more than that was the shared disdain for all things Dallas Cowboys-related.

I really, really hope Mario works out. The guy looked stout before he got hurt. And I think all of this media bashing of Houston is premature. I dont think this is Sam Bowie and Michael Jordan. I think Williams will be a Pro Bowler once he gets more experience and isn't playing hurt.

I just don't see why it has to be a one-or-the-other and the ignorant refusal to give Bush credit, saying he's only had a "couple good games" - he's had more than that. And so has Mario.

hollywood_texan
12-15-2006, 06:01 PM
With Mario's physical talents, he should be just fine if he works hard and really hits the grind stone on techinque.

At his position and as young as he is, time is on his side.

But, he really needs to have a lot bigger impact next year though.

RazorOye
12-15-2006, 06:07 PM
At his position and as young as he is, time is on his side.

But, he really needs to have a lot bigger impact next year though.

Yeah, I think next year his numbers will improve markedly. He's playing hurt - before he got hurt, he was really playing well. I think he'll be fine.

As for his age, that's the benefit of not drafting people from BYU. Sucks when you draft a player who is already 26 and they get hurt.

ryansisgod
12-15-2006, 07:53 PM
no one on this board thinks he is a bust anymore, most of us are just disappointed that, Mario's production hasn't been like of the other rookie DE's. although there are a lot of things stunting his growth, like injuries and below average supporting cast. we just hoped that he would've had an impact on this team, like many other rookies like VY,RB, Lawson, Kiwanuka, Hali and the list goes on, however if we were 9-4 not 4-9 nobody in the media would care, its all about winning.

MrMeToo
12-15-2006, 08:13 PM
At this point I don't even think it's about Mario's production....

It's more about VY's and RB's production and "what could've been"....Mario will be judged by what we passed on....not what he does....

If Mario becomes a pretty good DE...But RB and VY become great, then he will still be looked at as the wrong pick....

I agree...

Number19
12-15-2006, 08:22 PM
...Mario will be judged by what we passed on....not what he does...If Mario becomes a pretty good DE...But RB and VY become great, then he will still be looked at as the wrong pick....And if Mario developes into a hall-of-famer - and if if RB and VY simply have quality careers - there will still be whiners and cry babies.

johnboy
12-15-2006, 08:26 PM
no one on this board thinks he is a bust anymore, most of us are just disappointed that, Mario's production hasn't been like of the other rookie DE's. although there are a lot of things stunting his growth, like injuries and below average supporting cast. we just hoped that he would've had an impact on this team, like many other rookies like VY,RB, Lawson, Kiwanuka, Hali and the list goes on, however if we were 9-4 not 4-9 nobody in the media would care, its all about winning.

Why would you think he needs a supporting cast,just maybe Mario needs to got off his a** and do something.He is not getting doubled team that much and he is playing like a second round draft choice not a number one pick in the draft.People on this board need to respect the other d linemen they are the ones that are busting are a**** off not Mario.

Number19
12-15-2006, 08:28 PM
..But, he really needs to have a lot bigger impact next year though.Is there any reason to doubt that he won't. Don't you know that he's hurting so bad, the staff holds him out of practice, just so he can hobble onto the playing field on Sunday.

BuffaloBills06
12-15-2006, 09:47 PM
Actually Donte Whitner is the youngest player of the draft class

ryansisgod
12-15-2006, 10:31 PM
Why would you think he needs a supporting cast,.

name any other great DE's who have below average supporting cast, because he doesnt have anyone else above average on that line with, his numbers are what they are, put a decent lineman on the other side and watch the numbers grow.:mario:

BattleRedToro
12-16-2006, 12:16 AM
But try to play the numbers argument for Mario, and it's no longer about numbers. It's about how Mario changes the offense's gameplan. How they rush away from him - you can't talk about numbers for Mario.

You can't talk numbers about Mario because he plays defense. There just aren't that many opportunities for defensive players to amass statistics. They have Tackles, Sacks, Assists, Fumbles Forced, Fumbles Recovered, Interceptions, and Passes Defenced. Sometimes you will see Batted Balls or Quarterback Pressures. What is QB Pressures, anyway. It doesn't even seem like something that is quantifiable to me. It sounds like something that leaves alot of room for interpretation.

Mysteryhunt
12-16-2006, 06:17 AM
you want a prediction: i think vince will be a bust despite what he's shown so far. CARR won a decent amount of games his rookie year with far less help than Vince has this year. Once people learned how to control Vick he became nothing special, it will take a year for the same thing to happen with Vince.

cptnbreakdance
12-16-2006, 12:42 PM
I remember reading multiple articles stating Mario was the yougest. It definatly said youngest rookie in the nfl. I'll try and find a link

johnboy
12-16-2006, 10:08 PM
name any other great DE's who have below average supporting cast, because he doesnt have anyone else above average on that line with, his numbers are what they are, put a decent lineman on the other side and watch the numbers grow.:mario:

He is not getting doubled team If he was getting doubled team I could understand about the supporting cast theory.He is just and avg. D end nothing more.

Dr. Toro
12-16-2006, 10:14 PM
Mario has the physical tools to be Reggie White. Does he have the heart:

"One quick Reggie story. Reggie White held the Eagles bench press record from the moment he stepped in the training room as an NFL "rookie". The season before Reggie left for Green Bay- a large and powerful offensive lineman beat his mark by two. As the man proceeded to bounce around the locker room bragging about the feat- Reggie- fresh off an exhausting work-out of his own, quietly walked back into the weight room and bested that mark by seven. Reggie hated to lose- and was virtually unstoppable when he set his mind to something."

http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/fantasy/corrstory?teamId=14&sportId=1&datePosted=11292005&timePosted=1436

Goldeagle
12-16-2006, 10:17 PM
Id like to see more from Mario, but before I write him off as a bust Im going to give him next year to show how much he learned in one year.