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View Full Version : Fire Gary Kubiak!!!


Toan
12-10-2006, 04:33 PM
When the hell are we gonna get a coach that want to win, not lose and get a frickin high draft pick. I do know bout you but im ready to kick him out of Houston, 5 years later and he still not ready for a HC job.

Texans Fans Rule
12-10-2006, 04:37 PM
What the hell is he thinking running out the clock at the end of regulation? Why not take a shot. Could it seriously have been worse than how it ended? I would rather have taken a chance to win instead of leaving the game to a coin toss.

doughboy
12-10-2006, 04:40 PM
VY for hall-of-fame.

FLYmeatwad
12-10-2006, 04:40 PM
It should be like college, let us get a chance to touch the ball before there can be a result. Leaving all that up to the toss of a coin. It really hurts. Each week I think that the loss can't be any worse then the most recent one that happened and it seems that every week we lost I'm proved wrong.

D-ReK
12-10-2006, 04:41 PM
PS, Vince didn't win the game, Kubiak loss it

Your grammar skills leave a lot to be desired.

dtran04
12-10-2006, 04:41 PM
I agree with not throwing but you could at least try to run it three times.

Scott D
12-10-2006, 04:42 PM
No, Kubiak (as of right now) didn't lose the game. Vince did due to the lack of experience of our ENTIRE football team. Keep bad players, lose ball games. I think most of our players are not up to NFL caliper. Until they retire (probably) or until somebody steps up and says we don't need those players, we will continue to experience losing games, season after season. Period.

Then you can blame Kubiak. Also, if you know so much about football and what it takes to make a winning team, join the Texans organization.

Koolbrz
12-10-2006, 04:51 PM
In all fairness no one can blame this loss on Carr. He did what he could to get this team a win. AJ for some reason decides to run out of bounds instead of putting his head down and picking up that freakin first down. 2 yrds is all he needed, as big and strong as he is he should have picked that up with no problem. Then we get this sorry azz play calling from the coaching staff. I could not believe what i was seeing. They have nothing to lose. Air the damn thing out, or at the very least make an attempt to air it out. We lost this game in the worst possible way. Making the powers that be in the Texans organization look like a bunch of idiots. Where was Mario when we needed him most?? I sure as hell know where VY was...Running downfield for the winning score. I dont know what else to say. This is just !@#$%^&*()_?><!!!!

hot pickle
12-10-2006, 04:55 PM
i dont get it, i post something, that is decent, and has no cursin in it, and the mods still delete it explain please?

IshouldbeGM
12-10-2006, 04:57 PM
We have Andre Johnson and Eric Moulds, we have two above avg pass catching tight ends, why is this offense not putting up the points??? How many times on 3rd and 6 are we going to run draws and dump offs??? What is up with this 3 yard hitch to Andre?? Kubiak needs to take this West Coast offense back to the freakin west coast!!!!! My Gawd man, im sick of this losing!!! Im sick of this pathetic offense!!!! How can you bypass Vince??? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! I know the titans wont do this, but....i'd trade our entire 2007 and 2008 drafts just for vince. This has to be the end for Dump Off Dave!! Bring in Troy Smith immediately!!!!

Napa Auto Parts
12-10-2006, 05:01 PM
im sorry to inform you of this but the only reason kubiak is conservative is because of our qb look at the last five 3 games and youll see what i mean imho i think kubiak has lost all confidence in carr:twocents:

TexanLen
12-10-2006, 05:03 PM
They will miss on Troy Smith too. I think Kub's lost faith in Carr. I think and hope Carr is as good as gone. Get a vet QB in here (Plummer?), draft a QB, trade Carr (6th round pick) and move on.

thetexanator
12-10-2006, 05:05 PM
maybe kubes doesnt trust carr? OH my bad, he doesnt trust the oline.

Ckw
12-10-2006, 05:05 PM
I hope you're right. I'm just a little worried. Kubiak does not play with any aggresion. Why on the 3rd and 13 did we run the ball with Dayne? I MEAN YOU HAVE TO TRY TO SCORE TOUCHDOWNS NOT JUST POINTS. I hope this will change with a new QB. But Jake Plummer is not that answer. I want to see a more aggressive team or get a new coach. I love Kubes, but what do we have to lose?

edo783
12-10-2006, 05:06 PM
Carr messed up as well. Carr did do some good plays, but he still cost us some plays where wide receivers where open and he just dink and dunked his passes.

And you know they were open how? You wern't at the game, because your were here on the board. Again, you are just making stuff up.

IshouldbeGM
12-10-2006, 05:07 PM
If he's lost confidence in carr, then put in porter or van pelt. Its not fair for the rest of the players, or the fans to see this brand of offensive football being played. this is pathetic, this is losing football!! Kubiak, swallow your freakin pride....just admit you made a hugeeeeee mistake, move on from carr. Quit saying you see something in David Carr, quit saying Carr is your qb!! I dont see what you see in Carr, nobody does!!! I'll tell you what i see, i see a LOSER!!!!
Get his ***** out of town NOW!!!!!!!

Silver Oak
12-10-2006, 05:08 PM
and the trolls run amok.....

Bongo59
12-10-2006, 05:09 PM
PS, Vince didn't win the game, Kubiak loss itkeep deluding yourself..............that way you'll feel better.

Scott D
12-10-2006, 05:10 PM
Let's face it. This team is a loser. Rebuild the team again and again and again. We'll go down in history as the only team that can't win a football team, year after year after year.

I can understand the first year or two, but 5 consecutive seasons with nothing to show for it? It is obviously keeping the bad players and giving away the good one's

afcman
12-10-2006, 05:12 PM
Well, we're not the Lions......yet.

Specnatz
12-10-2006, 05:12 PM
keep deluding yourself..............that way you'll feel better.

OK did you watch the game? The run defense of the Texans was horrible, yes did score the winning TD, but Seriously the second half the Texans could not stop the run and the only time the Titans failed to advance the ball was when VY tried to throw the ball. Yes he made some big plays but his throwing is erratic at best.

Oh not to mention the conservative play calling for the Texans was also no way to win a game, it was more playing to not lose the game.

Bongo59
12-10-2006, 05:14 PM
one constant in Houston................bad drafting is the reason you are where you are..................Dan Reeves told you to take VY and your owner paid him like 300K to help with this draft...............and they draft Mario and pass on two HOF players?

Specnatz
12-10-2006, 05:16 PM
one constant in Houston................bad drafting is the reason you are where you are..................Dan Reeves told you to take VY and your owner paid him like 300K to help with this draft...............and they draft Mario and pass on two HOF players?

Wow, I am glad you have this inside info, because this is the first time this has ever been mentioned.

Bongo59
12-10-2006, 05:16 PM
OK did you watch the game? The run defense of the Texans was horrible, yes did score the winning TD, but Seriously the second half the Texans could not stop the run and the only time the Titans failed to advance the ball was when VY tried to throw the ball. Yes he made some big plays but his throwing is erratic at best.

Oh not to mention the conservative play calling for the Texans was also no way to win a game, it was more playing to not lose the game. I was in a Suite for the whole game and had replay..............I saw it all........................ VY had a 60 yd bomb dropped too.............he could have thrown all day..............even Dunta is turning into a bad player................I dont know..............I think you need to put some windex on your glass eyes.

Homer
12-10-2006, 05:23 PM
Way to lose it for us. :hunter:

big homey
12-10-2006, 05:26 PM
The anouncers on CBS said that and they have more of a field view range than we do on TV. BTW your carr loving days are over and your just making stuff up like he is a good QB.

As bad as those announcers were, I wouldn't believe a word they said.

Although Carr is nothing special, he didn't lose this game. A few catches by AJ and a few more made tackles and we find ourselves 5-8. Our key players on D (DeMeco, Mario, and Dunta) didn't show up today.

Doom Capers
12-10-2006, 05:28 PM
Great post. Groundbreaking. 10/10.

shansmacker
12-10-2006, 05:30 PM
Way to lose it for us. :hunter:

He"ll win more than he loses,mark my words.We have a damn good coach of that I have no doubt.When we get our players assemblad we"ll see how good he is.Your no homer,I"ll proudly accept that designation.

Mr. White
12-10-2006, 05:30 PM
one constant in Houston................bad drafting is the reason you are where you are..................Dan Reeves told you to take VY and your owner paid him like 300K to help with this draft...............and they draft Mario and pass on two HOF players?

This is the first I've heard of this as well. Wouldn't surprise me if this were the case. I think that McNair had his mind already made up that Carr was staying when he fired Dom Capers.

ToroFan
12-10-2006, 05:30 PM
Why did we hire this guy again? He didn't call the plays in Denver, Shanahan did. He may have helped coach Elway, but I don't think he developed him. So why did the Texans hire this guy?

Oh it's because he is a Texas guy, who went to high school here and played for a state university. Sound familiar?

Oh yeah we passed on that guy because well we had...what did we have again?

We brought the wrong houstonian back. Get rid of this clown.

hot pickle
12-10-2006, 05:31 PM
Way to lose it for us.

i think it would be best if you just leave now

Scott D
12-10-2006, 05:31 PM
Better thank the players first. They are the one's that ultimately screwed it up. The coach didn't play the game. The players did. What if the players don't understand football as well as they should? What if the players contain bad habits? What about no team spirit? The only thing the players are sure of is that they are going to lose, so why bother.

Goldeagle
12-10-2006, 05:31 PM
He made some bone head calls, but this is his first year, give it some time.

Mr. White
12-10-2006, 05:32 PM
I knew this thread was coming since game 1 this season. I'm surprised it took this long. :francis:

Texas_Thrill
12-10-2006, 05:33 PM
This thread is totally out of control. lol

bah007
12-10-2006, 05:34 PM
I guess it doesnt count that we have doubled our wins in his first season as a head coach.

I guess if we doubled again next year and won 8 games you would still want him fired.

TheCD
12-10-2006, 05:35 PM
Why did we hire this guy again? He didn't call the plays in Denver, Shanahan did. He may have helped coach Elway, but I don't think he developed him. So why did the Texans hire this guy?

Oh it's because he is a Texas guy, who went to high school here and played for a state university. Sound familiar?

Oh yeah we passed on that guy because well we had...what did we have again?

We brought the wrong houstonian back. Get rid of this clown.



What exactly are you accusing Kubiak of doing that lost us the game?

He took gambles on several occasions that worked out for us. We've already doubled last year's win total with 3 games to go. The Broncos didn't win their 2 Super Bowls until Gary Kubiak started calling the plays.

He's worked with Steve Young, John Elway and Jake Plummer...all of whom excelled under hs watch. We can all see what happened to Plummer this year without Kubiak, and Steve Young has constantly praised him for his making his playing that much better.


What is your problem with him, exactly?

Texansfan36
12-10-2006, 05:44 PM
So I take it you would rather go 2-14 again? It's funny how everyone thinks that a team that was at the very bottom of the league last year is suddenly going to rack up 13 wins. Hello what the heck have you people been drinking, its the guys first year coaching a pitiful team and he has already doubled our wins from last year, and he gave us the best draft we have had since this team has been here. Calm the **** down. There is an old saying you know the one that says Rome wasn't built in a day. Well we have had to restart building "Rome". And as much as you hate to hear this its going to take "TIME"

Homer
12-10-2006, 05:47 PM
Better thank the players first. They are the one's that ultimately screwed it up. The coach didn't play the game. The players did. What if the players don't understand football as well as they should? What if the players contain bad habits? What about no team spirit? The only thing the players are sure of is that they are going to lose, so why bother.

The coach didn't give them a chance to win with 58 seconds left.

Homer
12-10-2006, 05:48 PM
i think it would be best if you just leave now

ooh scary :rolleyes:

ToroFan
12-10-2006, 05:51 PM
Let's go after Jeff Fisher because apparently he can rebuild Rome in a day. They were probably just as bad as we were last year. What has Kubiak done in this league?

Fisher has had issues with Bud Adams in the past. I think hiring him away under his nose would be a nice way to stick Bud Adams. Of course while I'm dreaming, ,in the unlikely event we did, I would love to have the press conference in Tennessee just to put the screws to ole Bud.

TexaninDenver
12-10-2006, 05:56 PM
Why did we hire this guy again? He didn't call the plays in Denver, Shanahan did. He may have helped coach Elway, but I don't think he developed him. So why did the Texans hire this guy?

Oh it's because he is a Texas guy, who went to high school here and played for a state university. Sound familiar?

Oh yeah we passed on that guy because well we had...what did we have again?

We brought the wrong houstonian back. Get rid of this clown.

Oh for God's sake!!!
:phone:
"Hi, is reality there?"

ToroFan
12-10-2006, 05:57 PM
Oh for God's sake!!!
:phone:
"Hi, is reality there?"

Reality bites if you are a Texans fan at the moment.

txwooley
12-10-2006, 05:59 PM
Did all of you forget that Kubiak is technically a rookie?
This is his first year as the leader of an entire team. It takes time to adjust to being the Head Coach just like it takes time to adjust to being the starting (insert position here). Let's give him the benefit of the doubt until his experience surpasses his win record.

LORK 88
12-10-2006, 06:00 PM
Word of the day is patience. We were a 2-14 team last year and people want his head midway season 1 for losing a close game? Give the man some time, your crazy if you expect anyone to turn around a team that was as bad as ours that quickly. Rome wasnt built in a day, and a team isnt turned around in a day either. What would firing him show anyway other than zero faith? I dont even think college coaches get fired this quickly, relax!!

TexaninDenver
12-10-2006, 06:00 PM
Reality bites if you are a Texans fan at the moment.

Fair enough - but come on!

The man hasn't even finished a complete season and is working with an applecart full of damaged goods - I get the frustration - but (as we've discussed on this board at length) this is not gonna happen overnight. 4 years of bad decisions isn't fixable in one season - and to think it is - well, that's just crazy.

kingh99
12-10-2006, 06:04 PM
Why did we hire this guy again? He didn't call the plays in Denver, Shanahan did. He may have helped coach Elway, but I don't think he developed him. So why did the Texans hire this guy?

Oh it's because he is a Texas guy, who went to high school here and played for a state university. Sound familiar?

Oh yeah we passed on that guy because well we had...what did we have again?

We brought the wrong houstonian back. Get rid of this clown.

I kind of feel like you. If McNair made the decision to pass over Bush and VY then no, but if it was Kubiak's idea, well then yeah he should be fired over this. Sorry to write that. There has to be a severe penance paid to the football gods for this to be forgiven. It'll be a curse of Babe-esque proportions, really the first real sunshine state curse in pro sports. It's really impressive what we are saddled with here. The guy begged to play here. That's like A Tell Tale Heart or something. IT's BAD. One of sports all time great blunders. Now if this was McNair's deal as I suspect it really is, well he's on track to exceed Ken Lay's fall from grace around these parts. He should be forced to wear women's clothing and paraded on a leash in front of Budweiser Plaza before games handing out free beer.

Gmurrie
12-10-2006, 06:07 PM
Homer,

Can you break down for us exactly how it is that Kubiak lost the game for us? I'm genuinely interested.

ToroFan
12-10-2006, 06:13 PM
Homer,

Can you break down for us exactly how it is that Kubiak lost the game for us? I'm genuinely interested.

If we hire coaches to not lose games instead of trying to win them, I think there in lies the problem.

Imatexanfan
12-10-2006, 06:24 PM
When the hell are we gonna get a coach that want to win, not lose and get a frickin high draft pick. I do know bout you but im ready to kick him out of Houston, 5 years later and he still not ready for a HC job.


WOW!!:gun:

Man, Toan you need to set the bottle down and chill out........seriously.

From a Texan to another go to rehab my friend just mmmeeeellllooowww. :ok:

hot pickle
12-10-2006, 06:24 PM
ooh scary :rolleyes:

it wasnt suppose to be scary but ok, if you want it to be then thats fine

it was a suggestion by the way




funny how many stupid people claim to be texans fans but complain about every lil thing when somethin isnt workin out

edo783
12-10-2006, 06:24 PM
The anouncers on CBS said that and they have more of a field view range than we do on TV. BTW your carr loving days are over and your just making stuff up like he is a good QB.

Listen, I'm not a Carr lover, but I don't like people who make stuff up or take the one time the announcer says something and then spin it as though it was all day all the time and that they were seeing it. That is BS and that is what you have spewed for weeks. Be happy your god made a nice play to win it and get over yourself.

TexaninDenver
12-10-2006, 06:28 PM
If we hire coaches to not lose games instead of trying to win them, I think there in lies the problem.

Now - I agree with you on this point. However, there has to be a trust built up between the coach and the QB - the last 6 games have not been great and I'll bet there is some doubt in Kubiak's mind about the outcome in "playing to win". (i.e. - why are these games so freakin' down to the wire late in the fourth quarter?) Obviously something is not happening during the game that is supposed to be happening and Kubiak is not fully trusting of the outcome if we gamble.

This is just my opinion - but winning only matters now to make the fans feel good for the moment. However, it does nothing for the long term solution that needs to be found for the team. Would Carr still be playing had Sage not broken his hand? Who knows? But - it is what it is.

Kubiak also has to navigate the problem of sitting David on the bench when he and McNair made the decision to keep Carr and shelled out all of that contract money. David Carr is a commodity - just like any other NFL player and regardless of how insane it makes us - the NFL is still a business (as you know, I'm sure). The decisions for 2006 have been made and right or wrong we have to live with them until the team undergoes another facelift in free agency and the draft.

I feel your frustration - I REALLY do! I'm shelling out hundreds of dollars for the NFL Sunday ticket because the Texans are never on television here in Denver - and I hate knowing I've paid for that to watch them lose - but again - progress is being made. Maybe not as fast as we would like . . .but at least we're not 2-14

W's and L's only matter when getting to the playoffs is a real possibility. Now that we're out - it all comes down to evaluation. Besides, we still have 3 more games.

Honoring Earl 34
12-10-2006, 06:29 PM
Actually they were talking about AJ and his ability to get seperation .

They also said Carr dinked to quick because Owen Daniels was open over the middle .

Accusations about making things up ... you don't check under the bed unless you hid there .

carter08
12-10-2006, 06:31 PM
Blah!
Blame everyone
Thats your mottos
Stupid bandwagoners

TexaninDenver
12-10-2006, 06:37 PM
If we hire coaches to not lose games instead of trying to win them, I think there in lies the problem.

Now - I agree with you on this point. However, there has to be a trust built up between the coach and the QB - the last 6 games have not been great and I'll bet there is some doubt in Kubiak's mind about the outcome in "playing to win". (i.e. - why are these games so freakin' down to the wire late in the fourth quarter?) Obviously something is not happening during the game that is supposed to be happening and Kubiak is not fully trusting of the outcome if we gamble.

This is just my opinion - but winning only matters now to make the fans feel good for the moment. However, it does nothing for the long term solution that needs to be found for the team. Would Carr still be playing had Sage not broken his hand? Who knows? But - it is what it is.

Kubiak also has to navigate the problem of sitting David on the bench when he and McNair made the decision to keep Carr and shelled out all of that contract money. David Carr is a commodity - just like any other NFL player and regardless of how insane it makes us - the NFL is still a business (as you know, I'm sure). The decisions for 2007 have been made and right or wrong we have to live with them until the team undergoes another facelift in free agency and the draft.

I feel your frustration - I REALLY do! I'm shelling out hundreds of dollars for the NFL Sunday ticket because the Texans are never on television here in Denver - and I hate knowing I've paid for that to watch them lose - but again - progress is being made. Maybe not as fast as we would like . . .but at least we're not 2-14

W's and L's only matter when getting to the playoffs is a real possibility. Now that we're out - it all comes down to evaluation. Besides, we still have 3 more games.

Gmurrie
12-10-2006, 06:40 PM
If we hire coaches to not lose games instead of trying to win them, I think there in lies the problem.
Is that what we did? Hired a coach who would play not to lose? Yeah, pretty sure that was on the lead paragraph of his resume: " I make all my decisions on a not-to-lose basis. I never play to win".

And when he went for 4th and 1 in our end of the field against the Jags he was definitely playing not to lose there wasn't he?

I swear, how about when you guys want to say something because you think it sounds good, why not just yell it out the window rather than posting it here.

My question still stands after your insightful post: What exactly did Kubiak do to lose the game?

dat_boy_yec
12-10-2006, 06:44 PM
I'll just point out a couple of things that upset me with the coaching today. 3rd and six and 3rd and 12. Translation 3rd and longs. Our run game isn't consistent, we haven't been able to get those yds. on the ground when we really needed them. Yet on those plays where we really needed to convert Kubiak called a run play? What's the logic behind that. Keep doing it and maybe we'll get lucky? Then there's over a minute in the game. You take knees and run out the clock. You don't even consider trying to get down the field to take it. Maybe the players leave everything on the field, but the coach doesn't. There's no guarantee you'll get the ball in OT or even score if you do get the ball, yet for some unknown reason you're willing to put the game on the line in OT without trying to pull it out in regular time? That's all on the coaches. I could keep going, but I'm already feeling sick about it.

TexaninDenver
12-10-2006, 06:45 PM
Is that what we did? Hired a coach who would play not to lose? Yeah, pretty sure that was on the lead paragraph of his resume: " I make all my decisions on a not-to-lose basis. I never play to win".

And when he went for 4th and 1 in our end of the field against the Jags he was definitely playing not to lose there wasn't he?

I swear, how about when you guys want to say something because you think it sounds good, why not just yell it out the window rather than posting it here.

My question still stands after your insightful post: What exactly did Kubiak do to lose the game?

Not sure if you were lumping me into this question or not. I was responding about "playing to lose" as an ideology - not in the case of Kubiak. I believe there is a breakdown in trust.

johnboy
12-10-2006, 06:47 PM
What exactly are you accusing Kubiak of doing that lost us the game?

He took gambles on several occasions that worked out for us. We've already doubled last year's win total with 3 games to go. The Broncos didn't win their 2 Super Bowls until Gary Kubiak started calling the plays.

He's worked with Steve Young, John Elway and Jake Plummer...all of whom excelled under hs watch. We can all see what happened to Plummer this year without Kubiak, and Steve Young has constantly praised him for his making his playing that much better.


What is your problem with him, exactly?

I believe kubiak never called the off. plays for Denver

Yankee_In_TX
12-10-2006, 06:48 PM
I agree with not throwing but you could at least try to run it three times.

W/ all the fumblitis we have, I agree with taking a knee that close to the endzone.

Yankee_In_TX
12-10-2006, 06:50 PM
I'll just point out a couple of things that upset me with the coaching today. 3rd and six and 3rd and 12. Translation 3rd and longs. Our run game isn't consistent, we haven't been able to get those yds. on the ground when we really needed them. Yet on those plays where we really needed to convert Kubiak called a run play? What's the logic behind that. Keep doing it and maybe we'll get lucky? Then there's over a minute in the game. You take knees and run out the clock. You don't even consider trying to get down the field to take it. Maybe the players leave everything on the field, but the coach doesn't. There's no guarantee you'll get the ball in OT or even score if you do get the ball, yet for some unknown reason you're willing to put the game on the line in OT without trying to pull it out in regular time? That's all on the coaches. I could keep going, but I'm already feeling sick about it.

Because we generally can't make a 12 yard pass. Every time Carr throws on 3rd and long, it ALWAYS lands (if caught) 5 yards inside the down marker. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Not sure which has a better chance of succeeding lately.

ToroFan
12-10-2006, 06:57 PM
Is that what we did? Hired a coach who would play not to lose? Yeah, pretty sure that was on the lead paragraph of his resume: " I make all my decisions on a not-to-lose basis. I never play to win".

And when he went for 4th and 1 in our end of the field against the Jags he was definitely playing not to lose there wasn't he?

I swear, how about when you guys want to say something because you think it sounds good, why not just yell it out the window rather than posting it here.

My question still stands after your insightful post: What exactly did Kubiak do to lose the game?

Your question does not make sense because they LOST the game. All of his decisions stem from that simple fact.

The "insightful" (your words, not mine) post was to demonstrate the real question that was supposed to be asked. What did Kubiak do to WIN the game for us today?

Ibar_Harry
12-10-2006, 06:57 PM
Some weeks ago I started screamming about Kubiak's play calling and saying he's not what we thought he was. As each game goes by it seems to be true more and more. Horrible game management is all I can say.

Gmurrie
12-10-2006, 06:57 PM
I'll just point out a couple of things that upset me with the coaching today. 3rd and six and 3rd and 12. Translation 3rd and longs. Our run game isn't consistent, we haven't been able to get those yds. on the ground when we really needed them. Yet on those plays where we really needed to convert Kubiak called a run play? What's the logic behind that. Keep doing it and maybe we'll get lucky? Then there's over a minute in the game. You take knees and run out the clock. You don't even consider trying to get down the field to take it. Maybe the players leave everything on the field, but the coach doesn't. There's no guarantee you'll get the ball in OT or even score if you do get the ball, yet for some unknown reason you're willing to put the game on the line in OT without trying to pull it out in regular time? That's all on the coaches. I could keep going, but I'm already feeling sick about it.
Yec,

OK. Thanks for being specific.

3rd and long: I don't like the run call either. Screens aren't much better. I'd guess that since we rarely stretch the field on 2nd and 2 we're even less likely to do it on 3rd and long. Why? My guess is that we don't have plays like that at the top of the call list due to our inability to protect the quarterback.

Taking a knee at the end of the game: This one I din't mind at all. Our defense had played fairly well all day and I liked our chances until the kick return (which had also handled pretty well until they put #32 Jones back there). Again, without a vertical passing game I don't see how we could get ~60 yards down the field with no time outs.

How do other teams do it? They stretch the field throughout the game. Ever notice how we hardly ever seem to have a receiver wide open? It's because the defensive field is only 15 yards deep when we have the ball.

I agree with you it's the coaches' call, I'm just not convinced they have any other option.

TexanBacker93
12-10-2006, 06:57 PM
Hey hes the one who stuck with Carr in the offseason how bout sticking with him in the game too and let him play to win? If he didn't think Carr was the guy he shouldn't have gave him the damn extension

McNair was going to give Carr the extension no matter what. Kubiak definitely said he thought he could make Carr a very good QB, but whether he really felt that was or not is moot. He was going to say that to get the job. I'm saying this as my opinion, but there was no indication from the front office that the team wasn't going to extend Carr anyways.

I can't agree that the team should look to fire Kubiak yet. I think it sets a team back when you continue to overhaul the coaching staff until it is apparent that the team can't get anywhere.

At the end of regulation with the ball on the 7, no timeouts, and under a minute left you don't go for it. It's a tie game and you don't want to have 3 quick incompletions and give the Titans the ball back at midfield. Stanley doesn't have the leg strength to kick it out of there.

threetoedpete
12-10-2006, 06:59 PM
Your grammar skills leave a lot to be desired.

LOL, yeah there was 34k of our tax money down the drain huh Ref ?

Yeah well , you can bang on Kubes all you want. He leaves the ball at mid feild...you get what you got anyway. We come with an all out blitz...and no one gets there. Kubes didn't bring that with him. Been like that for three seasons now. I know everyone is upset...but some of us tried to warn you this was coming back in August. Got one more rough one coming in '08...no matter who they darft. I like the way the team fought on both sides of the ball. I like the way the runners and gunners held the thumb tacks in check in the retrun game. Eric looked very good at RT. Hogden held is on in the inside against Hainsworth. And Efferaim is my come back player of the year.

Carr actually had three seconds this game to do something with the ball. If you get right down to it...as beat up as we are....Dav Anderson executes on the kickoff...we win. Just didn't do it. Can't bang the guy for his hustle. Just didn't make the play this game. I'm dearly enjoying the dancing by the VY fans. Revenge is gonna be cold and so sweet.

Gmurrie
12-10-2006, 07:02 PM
Not sure if you were lumping me into this question or not. I was responding about "playing to lose" as an ideology - not in the case of Kubiak. I believe there is a breakdown in trust.
'Denver,

Wasn't lumping you in there with some of the others. My response was to Toro

Loss of trust between the coach and QB may be part of it, I think the offseason will tell us more than we can possibly know right now.

My theory is just that we are still missing key components on both sides of the football and when those are in place we'll see a more diverse offense.

Panther5407
12-10-2006, 07:29 PM
Honestly, I think reading "fire Kubiak" is by far the dumbest thing I've heard in a long time. If you have an ounce of knowledge in you you'll know that you might need more than a year, just maybe. People these days have no patience what so ever. You know a UCLA basketball coach won 10 championships in his time there including seven in a row? Bet you also didnít know it took him 17 years to get the championship the first time. Success takes time and people donít think, they just want to be entertained. Sure I want to win, but seeing the little things and improvements show how well the team has progressed as a whole. You'll never get anywhere by hiring and firing coaches every few years. Kubes tried to rally his players at the end of the game, calling them all up on him to fire them up while going into overtime. Be a true fan, support your team in thick and thin and go out and be proud. If all you can do is complain and want to get the coach fired after less than a season, just engage the ole brain and learn some football.

Sorry for going on and on, I'm done ranting for now

Gmurrie
12-10-2006, 08:01 PM
Your question does not make sense because they LOST the game. All of his decisions stem from that simple fact.

The "insightful" (your words, not mine) post was to demonstrate the real question that was supposed to be asked. What did Kubiak do to WIN the game for us today?
My question comes from your contention "If we hire coaches to not lose games instead of trying to win them, I think there in lies the problem.". I thought your thesis was that Kubiak was playing "not to lose".

As to what Kubiak did to WIN the game today: By your logic he did nothing because the Texans lost.

I just don't believe that's the case. I think Kubiak has a tough hand to play and he is doing his best with it. It's not a winning hand, and the NFL is pretty much a "no-bluff" league. So, we don't win much. Let's see what happens in the offseason.

Also, I think there is very large, significant improvement from last year to this. Can you deny that this team is better than the last year under the old regime?

ToroFan
12-10-2006, 08:55 PM
My question comes from your contention "If we hire coaches to not lose games instead of trying to win them, I think there in lies the problem.". I thought your thesis was that Kubiak was playing "not to lose".

As to what Kubiak did to WIN the game today: By your logic he did nothing because the Texans lost.

I just don't believe that's the case. I think Kubiak has a tough hand to play and he is doing his best with it. It's not a winning hand, and the NFL is pretty much a "no-bluff" league. So, we don't win much. Let's see what happens in the offseason.

Also, I think there is very large, significant improvement from last year to this. Can you deny that this team is better than the last year under the old regime?

My quote is in response to your question.

You mock the quote saying that I should yell out the window instead of posting it here. Now you are claiming that there was a thesis behind it. That's an about face if I ever saw one.

You question supports a defeatist mentality. By your logic Dom Capers would still be our coach. Afterall, what did he do to lose.

While we are better than last year, that is not saying much. We haven't showed progress this year, we are actually getting worse as the year progresses. Also, in response to your tough hand comment, compare us to the teams who drafted behind us. New Orleans,Tennessee, NY Jets, and even Green Bay all look better at this point. And three of those teams have new coaches, and the other had a coach that was on the hot seat without an extension in place.

This isn't the pre-free agency days where it has to take a long time for a team to get better. We have seen instances where teams have gone from a top 5 draft pick to the playoffs. I also don't think we should use last year as the gold standard to base our success.

If you want to talk about tough hands, look at New Orleans where Sean Payton has basically taken a team that won 3 games last year in a city devasated by disaster and turned them into among the best in the NFC. Or Tennessee where Jeff Fisher loses his quarterback in the offseason, suffers from salary cap hell and still manages to put out a respectable team with talent equal to ours.

I don't understand why we should give Kubiak the benefit of the doubt. For all the VY detractors saying that if he weren't from htown and ut we wouldnt be having this conversation. On that same token, if Kubiak didn't happen to go to A&M or go to h.s. here would he be our coach?

What success has he had? He didn't develop a hall of famel quarterback like Andy Reid did before he got his shot. He didn't call plays for a dominating unit like Belichik did before he got his shot. He didn't lead a team to a championship on any level as head coach like Saban.

His claim to fame is helping turning a below average quarterback in Plummer into an average or slightly above average one.

Mr teX
12-10-2006, 09:07 PM
In all fairness no one can blame this loss on Carr. He did what he could to get this team a win. AJ for some reason decides to run out of bounds instead of putting his head down and picking up that freakin first down. 2 yrds is all he needed, as big and strong as he is he should have picked that up with no problem. Then we get this sorry azz play calling from the coaching staff. I could not believe what i was seeing. They have nothing to lose. Air the damn thing out, or at the very least make an attempt to air it out. We lost this game in the worst possible way. Making the powers that be in the Texans organization look like a bunch of idiots. Where was Mario when we needed him most?? I sure as hell know where VY was...Running downfield for the winning score. I dont know what else to say. This is just !@#$%^&*()_?><!!!!

That play drove me absolutely nuts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:brickwall :brickwall :brickwall :brickwall. after that i knew we were gonna lose. NONE of these guys have any game awareness. check that except for Demeco.

Dunta is getting used & tossed out like a piece of toilet paper, the whole secondary needs to be revamped.

Second Honeymoon
12-10-2006, 09:10 PM
I would lose ABSOLUTELY NO SLEEP if we fired Kubiak...sad reality but true

bottom line: he thought Carr was better than Young...for that alone he should get a lobotomy much less lose his job

leave it to an aggie to screw that whole freaking thing up....

carr sucks....what else is new
mcnair sucks.....franchise just plummeting
casserley sucked
capers sucked
kubiak is sucking....mightily

TxAg
12-10-2006, 09:51 PM
Bring in BILL COWHER

Revolution
12-10-2006, 10:17 PM
Why did we hire this guy again? He didn't call the plays in Denver, Shanahan did. He may have helped coach Elway, but I don't think he developed him. So why did the Texans hire this guy?

Please know what you are talking about before you post.

edo783
12-10-2006, 10:34 PM
I feel loved, getting all those neg. reps because of the title that wasn't mine.

I did say I'm sick of Kubiak but only because he was too conservative, and I did overreacted when I say we should get rid of him, obviously I didn't mean it. Who could blame me though, I can't be the only guy here that hates not having a two-minute drill. I wanted a coach that would try to score on every chance he gets. So far Kubiak is looking like another Dom Capers, scared of taking a risk.

And when the O-line doesn't hold up and the QB gets smacked around and winds up losing the ball because they can't protect, you would be one of the first crying about that also. Go read what Kubes said after the game and you will understand that the problem is the O-line and that they can't protect well enough.

Anguyen
12-10-2006, 10:51 PM
We have a proven head coach right under our nose, that is Mike Sherman.
I dont mind fire Gube, and promote Mike Sherman as head coach.

wwffan99tx
12-10-2006, 11:55 PM
We have a proven head coach right under our nose, that is Mike Sherman.
I dont mind fire Gube, and promote Mike Sherman as head coach.

Isn't Sherman responsible for "coaching" the worst part of the entire team, the O=line?

HJam72
12-10-2006, 11:55 PM
OK, I've read about 20 of the posts in this thread and I've seen all of about 2 that weren't written by a brainless *****. A lot of you need to just shut up, and probably go learn a little English.

ToroFan
12-11-2006, 12:59 AM
Please know what you are talking about before you post.

Obviously you don't, otherwise you would tell me the inaccuracy with it.

Kubiak joined the Bronco's coaching staff in 1995, more than a DECADE after Elway had been in the league. Before that, his connection to the Broncos was that he was Elway's backup. Considering that Elway had been to multiple super bowls by the time Kubiak joined the coaching staff seems to indicate that Elway had already developed quite a bit.

Also please tell me when did Kubiak call plays for the Broncos? Obviously you must know right, because you want to call people out. I guess Shanahan scripting the first few plays before every game, and holding that sheet full of playcalls was all for show then?

Second Honeymoon
12-11-2006, 01:30 AM
Isn't Sherman responsible for "coaching" the worst part of the entire team, the O=line?

so who told you that the OLine was the worst part of the entire team? ESPN told you that? Vandercarr?

The OLine is not the worst part of the entire team. That would belong to Carr, Stanley, and our owner for sticking by Cover Boy.

Dime
12-11-2006, 01:33 AM
My quote is in response to your question.

You mock the quote saying that I should yell out the window instead of posting it here. Now you are claiming that there was a thesis behind it. That's an about face if I ever saw one.

You question supports a defeatist mentality. By your logic Dom Capers would still be our coach. Afterall, what did he do to lose.

While we are better than last year, that is not saying much. We haven't showed progress this year, we are actually getting worse as the year progresses. Also, in response to your tough hand comment, compare us to the teams who drafted behind us. New Orleans,Tennessee, NY Jets, and even Green Bay all look better at this point. And three of those teams have new coaches, and the other had a coach that was on the hot seat without an extension in place.

This isn't the pre-free agency days where it has to take a long time for a team to get better. We have seen instances where teams have gone from a top 5 draft pick to the playoffs. I also don't think we should use last year as the gold standard to base our success.

If you want to talk about tough hands, look at New Orleans where Sean Payton has basically taken a team that won 3 games last year in a city devasated by disaster and turned them into among the best in the NFC. Or Tennessee where Jeff Fisher loses his quarterback in the offseason, suffers from salary cap hell and still manages to put out a respectable team with talent equal to ours.

I don't understand why we should give Kubiak the benefit of the doubt. For all the VY detractors saying that if he weren't from htown and ut we wouldnt be having this conversation. On that same token, if Kubiak didn't happen to go to A&M or go to h.s. here would he be our coach?

What success has he had? He didn't develop a hall of famel quarterback like Andy Reid did before he got his shot. He didn't call plays for a dominating unit like Belichik did before he got his shot. He didn't lead a team to a championship on any level as head coach like Saban.

His claim to fame is helping turning a below average quarterback in Plummer into an average or slightly above average one.


Wow... now you have pulled Dime into this discussion.

First off, You talk a good game but it dont work. Kub is in his rook year of coaching, and all the crap your flowing about claim to fame dont mean a hill of beans right now. We are not trading or firing the head coach for a min of 3 years. So you might as well get off that soap box. it aint happening.

Secondly, there are a few here that agree with you.. but very few. yes, his playcalling is suspect at time, but he is rebuilding a team and it will take at least 2-3 drafts and FA to aquire a good group going forward. We have a base, but that is it. He needs time and he is learning, both on playcall and his team.

Sean Payton this and that... Ummm hello! They already had a base core to start with and the pickup of Brees, Colston, and Bush only helped a improving situation. He has made good playcalls and is learning too.. Plus.. there is a cool thing called a O-line which is pretty solid for them that we dont have yet (have injuries hit too).

For your info.. We had a good draft ourselves, Almost all of our picks have already contributed when on the best draft day, it is considered a score when you get 4 really good picks. With Spencer (was good till injuried, Ryans, Winston (getting better), Lundy, Daniels, oh and someone who is becoming more of a impact player Mario (he will be a monster soon, you watch). We set up a few good base players. There are many more to go.

Lastly, saying fire Kub at this point is stupid. It wipes away any credibility you might have at this time. You got a problem with his play call or history.. fine! But to call for the job of someone with less then a season under his belt and our team has shown improvement from passer rating, to poise, to wins, to bringing in good talent to etc... you are preaching, to a deaf choir, from from a box in the middle of nowhere while a Aerosmith/Bon Jovi/Poison/and Garth Brooks is playing live in concert. We might glance your way from time to time now, but you aint got nothing to say i am interested in.

dat_boy_yec
12-11-2006, 10:26 AM
Yec,

OK. Thanks for being specific.

3rd and long: I don't like the run call either. Screens aren't much better. I'd guess that since we rarely stretch the field on 2nd and 2 we're even less likely to do it on 3rd and long. Why? My guess is that we don't have plays like that at the top of the call list due to our inability to protect the quarterback.

Taking a knee at the end of the game: This one I din't mind at all. Our defense had played fairly well all day and I liked our chances until the kick return (which had also handled pretty well until they put #32 Jones back there). Again, without a vertical passing game I don't see how we could get ~60 yards down the field with no time outs.

How do other teams do it? They stretch the field throughout the game. Ever notice how we hardly ever seem to have a receiver wide open? It's because the defensive field is only 15 yards deep when we have the ball.

I agree with you it's the coaches' call, I'm just not convinced they have any other option.

Okay, now that I've had some time to calm down and look at this rationally. I still think it sucks. I won't go as far as saying fire Kubiak. However his mistakes are littered throughout the game. In the first half I was really excited. I saw AJ run a different pattern deep. When he came back for the ball and had created a ton of separation between him and Pacman. So much separation that Pacman had to grab his jersey to keep him from getting back to the ball. Missed call anybody. Then a few plays later Carr overthrew Daniels on a what? A deep TE slant. I thought 'Oh happy day, we're finally gonna open up the offense. I was so confident in our team at that point. Alot of people just don't realize the importance of running different routes in order to get separation. Our WR's ran some different routes they were getting open and Carr was seeing them. Point is they were doing some good things, but instead of giving them more leash Kubiak pulled in the reigns and reverted back to conservative play calling. Towards the end of the game when we had the ball last I thought we can get them. We can take this game. The Titan's were so worried about giving the big play up-field we could have easily thrown deep out routes to the receiver's where they would be out of bound's before the CB's could get to them. At the beginning there was also a quick slant pattern I liked where they got the ball out to AJ and Mould's went downfield to block we picked up like 13-15 yds. on that play and had we made them adjust to that play other's would have opened up. What disappoints me is that the coaches are somewhat erratic with playcalling. I put this on the coach's because they failed to identify what was working and sticking with it. I'm sure I could go back and question a bunch of specific calls but overall it just has to do with doing what the team is being successful at and Kubiak hasn't done that.

dat_boy_yec
12-11-2006, 10:42 AM
Wow... now you have pulled Dime into this discussion.

First off, You talk a good game but it dont work. Kub is in his rook year of coaching, and all the crap your flowing about claim to fame dont mean a hill of beans right now. We are not trading or firing the head coach for a min of 3 years. So you might as well get off that soap box. it aint happening.

Secondly, there are a few here that agree with you.. but very few. yes, his playcalling is suspect at time, but he is rebuilding a team and it will take at least 2-3 drafts and FA to aquire a good group going forward. We have a base, but that is it. He needs time and he is learning, both on playcall and his team.

Sean Payton this and that... Ummm hello! They already had a base core to start with and the pickup of Brees, Colston, and Bush only helped a improving situation. He has made good playcalls and is learning too.. Plus.. there is a cool thing called a O-line which is pretty solid for them that we dont have yet (have injuries hit too).

For your info.. We had a good draft ourselves, Almost all of our picks have already contributed when on the best draft day, it is considered a score when you get 4 really good picks. With Spencer (was good till injuried, Ryans, Winston (getting better), Lundy, Daniels, oh and someone who is becoming more of a impact player Mario (he will be a monster soon, you watch). We set up a few good base players. There are many more to go.

Lastly, saying fire Kub at this point is stupid. It wipes away any credibility you might have at this time. You got a problem with his play call or history.. fine! But to call for the job of someone with less then a season under his belt and our team has shown improvement from passer rating, to poise, to wins, to bringing in good talent to etc... you are preaching, to a deaf choir, from from a box in the middle of nowhere while a Aerosmith/Bon Jovi/Poison/and Garth Brooks is playing live in concert. We might glance your way from time to time now, but you aint got nothing to say i am interested in.


I'm sorry, but I get tired of hearing that 'we gotta wait 2-3 yrs. for a better team. Like Torofan said, quick turn-around's aren't uncommon in this league. Kubiak is a rookie HC.....SO WHAT, WHAT'S YOUR POINT?! Is that his excuse or something? Mangini is a rookie HC, matter of fact they were a laughingstock as well in NY, had just lost their starting pro-bowl center and star DE and CB yet after all that still come back and get everything turned around. Our team was 7-9 two yrs. ago and had the talent to match up with anybody. Guess what though it was coached to the ground last yr. and this new coaching staff isn't exactly doing us any favors. Our draft class this yr. should also have helped an improving situation. Yeah, their doing the best they can, but that doesn't mean they did the best thing's possible.

Rightnow
12-11-2006, 10:48 AM
Kubiak isn't being fired. He is here for at least two more years. Besides who would replace him? "Anybody" isn't the answer. Just plugging in somebody to replace him isn't a good idea.

His half time adjustments are weak, and some of his playcalling is suspect, but overall he is doing a fine job considering what he has on the field.

I guess Bob could fire him for picking Carr over VY, but that doesn't make any sense.

TransplantTexan1
12-11-2006, 10:51 AM
Kubiak is conservative with the offense for two reasons (the order, I'm not sure of but I'm sure these two are the primary reasons):

1. - the quarterback is prone to making mistakes in two-minute situations. It has happened on a handful of occasions this year, most notably last week versus Oakland. Not only that, but David's pocket presence is such that it isn't conducive to running a two-minute offense or any vertical passing game, for that matter. David's quarterback clock is the same as when he was at Fresno State. That's not good for a fifth year starter, but it is what it is. He needs longer than the average pro QB to read what's going on, find a target and then get the ball out of his hand. He also needs that target to have gained a good amount of seperation for him to have enough confidence to get the ball there. You'll note that David doesn't try to thread balls nearly as much this year. Why? He's trying to cut down on his INTs. Of course, he's also making fewer plays in the intermediate passing game as well. But anyway, his pocket presence is such that he gets jittery the second anything that comes close to being pressure gets near him, and he goes to his check down more often than not, a lot of times, even when he doesn't need to. Kubes realizes this (about his QB's pocket presence and comfort level) and keeps the offense simple. It's painful, frustrating and agonizing but it is what it is.

2. As much as David's play makes you cringe, the OL is clearly not up to snuff either. Pass protection is, at times, abysmal. So bad, that Kubiak probably feels that he has even more incentive to keep the passing game simple. Jittery, unstable QB in the pocket + shaky pass protection = disaster. So, Kubiak is trying to keep the offense simple and cut down on mistakes. If he can run the football 45 times a game, he'd prefer to do that. But since he can't, the Texans O is caught in no-man's land: can't run the ball enough to keep the chains moving and can't pass the ball with enough impact to get the extra defender out of the box against the run.

It's frustrating, but it's what you've got until more changes are made in both the OL and at QB.

And anyone who seriously thinks Kubiak is going to get fired after just one season when he's doubled (at the least) the team's win total from the previous year, just isn't being realistic.

ToroFan
12-11-2006, 11:32 AM
Sean Payton this and that... Ummm hello! They already had a base core to start with and the pickup of Brees, Colston, and Bush only helped a improving situation. He has made good playcalls and is learning too.. Plus.. there is a cool thing called a O-line which is pretty solid for them that we dont have yet (have injuries hit too).


You do realize that the Saints had a turnover of 34 players right? They also lost their best offensive lineman in free agency in LeCharles Bentley...I'm not asking for the best record in the AFC. But a 4 win season isn't a success. Payton shaped the roster the way he wanted. Kubiak could have done the same with his.

My whole point is what is it in Kubiak's record that should merit our trust?

We know one of two things are true at this point...

1) He blundered in choosing David Carr as his quarterback

2) If he didn't blunder in choosing David Carr, he can't coach him

It may be unrealistic, but hey why not voice your opinion as a fan. I remember posters saying that Dom Capers or Casserly should be fired YEARS ago and people would say the poster is crazy, all Dom and Charlie needs is time. Well that sure got us far. Are you saying that at no point a coach can be fired based on one season in any circumstance?

Listen, I want the Texans to do well, but at this point they look like they are getting worse, not better. We should be able to take down the Titans at home. We should be able to get more than -5 net yards passing against the Raiders. We should at least keep things competitive with the Colts.

I'll make an agreement with you, if the Texans show improvement in these last few games, I'll back off and say mea culpa. But if the Texans stay where they are at 4-12, and show no signs of improvement from here, you will admit that my point has some validity.

TransplantTexan1
12-11-2006, 11:35 AM
Sean Payton this and that... Ummm hello! They already had a base core to start with and the pickup of Brees, Colston, and Bush only helped a improving situation. He has made good playcalls and is learning too.. Plus.. there is a cool thing called a O-line which is pretty solid for them that we dont have yet (have injuries hit too).


You do realize that the Saints had a turnover of 34 players right? They also lost their best offensive lineman in free agency in LeCharles Bentley...I'm not asking for the best record in the AFC. But a 4 win season isn't a success. Payton shaped the roster the way he wanted. Kubiak could have done the same with his.

My whole point is what is it in Kubiak's record that should merit our trust?

We know one of two things are true at this point...

1) He blundered in choosing David Carr as his quarterback

2) If he didn't blunder in choosing David Carr, he can't coach him

It may be unrealistic, but hey why not voice your opinion as a fan. I remember posters saying that Dom Capers or Casserly should be fired YEARS ago and people would say the poster is crazy, all Dom and Charlie needs is time. Well that sure got us far. Are you saying that at no point a coach can be fired based on one season in any circumstance?

Listen, I want the Texans to do well, but at this point they look like they are getting worse, not better. We should be able to take down the Titans at home. We should be able to get more than -5 net yards passing against the Raiders. We should at least keep things competitive with the Colts.

I'll make an agreement with you, if the Texans show improvement in these last few games, I'll back off and say mea culpa. But if the Texans stay where they are at 4-12, and show no signs of improvement from here, you will admit that my point has some validity.

If the Texans finish 4-12, having had Cleveland at home over the final three games, then, yes, I'd say that Kubes needs to make an impact next year to give people the confidence that he isn't merely Capers II. And even with that, you'd like to see the Texans at least be reasonbly competitive versus New England and Indy (especially Indy).

(Also: I think Kubiak probably didn't properly analyze how bad the depth and overall talent on the OL is).

luvyablue52
12-11-2006, 11:38 AM
I understand Texan fans frustration. but i dont think firing Kubiak this soon is the right way to go about it. There needs to be changes in positions on the field first. I just hope the texans dont try and get a guy like troy smith in the draft expecting him to be live vince young, because i think that it could blow up in their faces.

brncoz1fan
12-11-2006, 11:59 AM
That's a great idea!! Fire him and send him back to Denver along with Dayne. That would sure make a lot of you happy!

I thought it was a great game! Much better than I anticipated. I am sure most of you have some excuse why Dayne had another great game other then his own talent or your OL stepping up to do their job.

Texan_Bill
12-11-2006, 12:02 PM
This could possibly qualify as the dumbest thread - EVER!

brncoz1fan
12-11-2006, 12:06 PM
This could possibly qualify as the dumbest thread - EVER!

What else would you expect from a lot of these Texans "fans"?

TheOgre
12-11-2006, 12:11 PM
That's a great idea!! Fire him and send him back to Denver along with Dayne. That would sure make a lot of you happy!

I thought it was a great game! Much better than I anticipated. I am sure most of you have some excuse why Dayne had another great game other then his own talent or your OL stepping up to do their job.

Imagine if we had the steady rushing of a (now) healthy Dayne combined with the explosiveness of Bush (oh well, thought I would get that in since all of the VY fans have been plowing through the board). Dayne has been the bright spot offensively the past two weeks. Without him we likely lose to the Raiders and get killed by the Titans. Lundy really does look like a 6th round selection at this point. I still think this team needs a "homerun hitter" at RB. That lack of breakaway speed is a key reason I see Dayne's role as our backup long-term.

It looks like the 5 linemen we have starting now are similar to the line last year, good at run blocking but pathetic at pass blocking. I'd love for this team to add OT Joe Thomas, but I fear the fans will revolt if we don't add a "face of the franchise" (QB or RB) with our 1st rounder.

Texan_Bill
12-11-2006, 12:16 PM
What else would you expect from a lot of these Texans "fans"?

That was exactly my point (in other threads) about being the laughing stock of the NFL. We (the Texans) are the laughing stock not only because of the product on the field but also because of the "supposed" Texans fans that start threads like this. Absolutley ludicrous.

valleytexfan
12-11-2006, 12:33 PM
Fire Kubiak? Um, NO.

Buckle
12-11-2006, 12:50 PM
This is probably one of the most stupid threads I have ever seen started! Yeah lets fire our rookie coach who is trying to make up for 4 years of bad coaching and who put in a new offense and defense this year, and is dealing with a ton of injuries along the o-line and d-line among other areas. Reading garbage like this and other posts on this board make me disappointed to call myself a Texans fan sometimes!!

Dime
12-11-2006, 01:14 PM
Sean Payton this and that... Ummm hello! They already had a base core to start with and the pickup of Brees, Colston, and Bush only helped a improving situation. He has made good playcalls and is learning too.. Plus.. there is a cool thing called a O-line which is pretty solid for them that we dont have yet (have injuries hit too).


You do realize that the Saints had a turnover of 34 players right? They also lost their best offensive lineman in free agency in LeCharles Bentley...I'm not asking for the best record in the AFC. But a 4 win season isn't a success. Payton shaped the roster the way he wanted. Kubiak could have done the same with his.

My whole point is what is it in Kubiak's record that should merit our trust?

We know one of two things are true at this point...

1) He blundered in choosing David Carr as his quarterback

2) If he didn't blunder in choosing David Carr, he can't coach him

It may be unrealistic, but hey why not voice your opinion as a fan. I remember posters saying that Dom Capers or Casserly should be fired YEARS ago and people would say the poster is crazy, all Dom and Charlie needs is time. Well that sure got us far. Are you saying that at no point a coach can be fired based on one season in any circumstance?

Listen, I want the Texans to do well, but at this point they look like they are getting worse, not better. We should be able to take down the Titans at home. We should be able to get more than -5 net yards passing against the Raiders. We should at least keep things competitive with the Colts.

I'll make an agreement with you, if the Texans show improvement in these last few games, I'll back off and say mea culpa. But if the Texans stay where they are at 4-12, and show no signs of improvement from here, you will admit that my point has some validity.

First off..
You stated "You do realize that the Saints had a turnover of 34 players right? They also lost their best offensive lineman in free agency in LeCharles Bentley...".

So How many Core players did they already have in place. your not listening on what I am saying. Who on the Texans before this year do you consider a core player? By the math, the saints already had 19 players that were decent to above decent. We are starting out with a lesser core then they are.

Two, Kub is a QB coach first and foremost. He sees features and potential in Carr and Carr, this year in most games, has already shown improvement. Granted, it should have been years ago, but he wasnt given a mentor, but a suckup who thought Carr couldnt do no wrong. Now, he is being held accountable. I seriously believe that Kub thought he could fix Carr. I just dont know if he thinks that way now.

Your right on one thing.. I am saying to fire a coach after one year would be extremely odd. The only way i could see that happen is there was nothing of a team spirit, there were 0 wins, and making 4 down and 20 go for it calls. Then i could see it.. otherwise, your fooling yourself. Name one team who has fire thier coach after less then 1 season. Kub has done alot on this team already, but it will get to be more in the future.

They are doing worse, not better? Are you sure you aint watching last years games? You need to explain this. That makes no sense. Lets see... Do we have more wins? yes... Does Carr look better in the pocket? yes.... Did we have a good draft? yes... Can i go on for about a hour on this... Yes..

"I'll make an agreement with you, if the Texans show improvement in these last few games, I'll back off and say mea culpa. But if the Texans stay where they are at 4-12, and show no signs of improvement from here, you will admit that my point has some validity."

What?????? ummm 4-12 is already an improvement from last year. You need to set down and define goals you feel would qualify as improvement over last year. Making statements like this make no sense at all when improvement can been seen in all areas of the game. You cannot discount the improvement of many areas that have already shown something now. You make the list... we will discuss the list.

Dime
12-11-2006, 01:27 PM
I'm sorry, but I get tired of hearing that 'we gotta wait 2-3 yrs. for a better team. Like Torofan said, quick turn-around's aren't uncommon in this league. Kubiak is a rookie HC.....SO WHAT, WHAT'S YOUR POINT?! Is that his excuse or something? Mangini is a rookie HC, matter of fact they were a laughingstock as well in NY, had just lost their starting pro-bowl center and star DE and CB yet after all that still come back and get everything turned around. Our team was 7-9 two yrs. ago and had the talent to match up with anybody. Guess what though it was coached to the ground last yr. and this new coaching staff isn't exactly doing us any favors. Our draft class this yr. should also have helped an improving situation. Yeah, their doing the best they can, but that doesn't mean they did the best thing's possible.

Rome was not built in a day. My point which missed you apparently is that to build a winning team takes time, good coaching, and confidence. We dont have the confidence in the players that are on the field right now. Therefore it will take time to build the team. I dont care if you dont wanna wait. Switch teams if you are that impatient. The Texans are on a better path then they have been before, but there are items they have to work out. Quit comparing us to other teams that have been around for 10+ seasons which just need a few players to make them really good teams. You might not like it, but to give a guy less then a season when you gave the previous guy 4 years to improve the team is a bit like thinking you need a coach that can raise his hands and part the field. Relax. they will get better.

Dime
12-11-2006, 01:28 PM
That was exactly my point (in other threads) about being the laughing stock of the NFL. We (the Texans) are the laughing stock not only because of the product on the field but also because of the "supposed" Texans fans that start threads like this. Absolutley ludicrous.

yeah.. but we have been defined as laughing stocks for the past 5 year.. Nothing new there.

Dime
12-11-2006, 01:31 PM
That's a great idea!! Fire him and send him back to Denver along with Dayne. That would sure make a lot of you happy!

I thought it was a great game! Much better than I anticipated. I am sure most of you have some excuse why Dayne had another great game other then his own talent or your OL stepping up to do their job.

You must forgive some of our fans. They want to win so bad that thier emotions get the best of them.

Second Honeymoon
12-11-2006, 01:41 PM
You must forgive some of our fans. They want to win so bad that thier emotions get the best of them.

you must forgive some of our 'fans'. they are so blindly loyal that they refuse to see the forest through the trees. these are the same guys who actually think Carr deserved to go the ProBowl a few weeks back....that is just pure stupidity

Dime
12-11-2006, 02:40 PM
you must forgive some of our 'fans'. they are so blindly loyal that they refuse to see the forest through the trees. these are the same guys who actually think Carr deserved to go the ProBowl a few weeks back....that is just pure stupidity

You must also forgive those fans who preach doom every second they get. Who make up stuff to get attention, and have no patience in creating a football team. They are of the idea its easy to be a coach and think we should be in the Superbowl every year. They are just lost and need someone to love them.

Charter PSL Fan
12-11-2006, 02:49 PM
I think Rick Smith or Uncle Bob McNair should come down to the sidelines and rip Kubiaks tail on camera just as he does Carr. Kubiak lost a couple of games this year.

Texan_Bill
12-11-2006, 04:10 PM
yeah.. but we have been defined as laughing stocks for the past 5 year.. Nothing new there.

True.....

joedinkle
12-11-2006, 05:40 PM
Gary Kubiak is one of the few things that are right with this team. I happy he's our head coach.

...still feeling like this...:brickwall

texaslifter
12-11-2006, 05:42 PM
If I would have known that this was the way he was going to call plays, I never would have wanted him coaching our team. Can't we make coaches call a game in Madden before hire them, to see how they like to move the ball?

kingh99
12-11-2006, 05:44 PM
Gary Kubiak is one of the few things that are right with this team. I happy he's our head coach.

...still feeling like this...:brickwall

He's okay but a little too Mike Holovaky with his boys and kids comments. Treat em like boys and kids and that's what they'll be. Remind's me of ole Mike "He's a nice boy" Holovak? That guy was a good personnel man but he would crack me up talking about players.

Kubes couldn't take VY because Kubes is a QB technician and that's the last thing VY needs. Oil and water. Wouldn't have worked. With Fisher, perfect fit. Should be unstoppable once they get a consistent running game.