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dbspi
12-06-2006, 06:22 AM
http://www.houstonprofootball.com/cap.html


Dead Money
Coleman, Marcus $2,533,134
Walker, Gary $1,833,333
Wade, Todd $1,666,667
Smith, Robaire $1,391,667
Cowart, Sam $750,000
Deloach, Jerry $562,000
Banks, Tony $400,000
Norris, Moran $400,000
Morency, Vernand $378,000
Hollings, Tony $233,250
Ioane, Junior $200,000
Washington, Todd $167,667
Est. sum of all players with less than $100,000 $889,400

Probable dead money added for next year could be -

Steve Mckinney
Wiegert
Morlon Greenwood
Seth Payne
Dominic Davis
Mark Bruener
Kailee Wong
David Carr

aj.
12-06-2006, 06:26 AM
You need to look closer at Walker, Wade, and Smith to get the full effect.

DontTreadOnMe
12-06-2006, 06:42 AM
so what does this mean??? 15-20 million dollars in dead salary money does not appear to be that bad (hell, the astros had to pay that last year for one player - baggy)... but i am alittle uneducated on the whole "salary cap" situation in the nfl... can a team go over the cap??? if so, why would it matter if we have all that dead money?? ncnair is one of the richest owners in the league, and he is a top 5 revenue maker... i think if someone came around in FA that kubes really wanted, ncnair would fork out the $$$ and get it done. he wants to win, and he knows what he has to do...

hobie
12-06-2006, 07:39 AM
Every team in the league has the "dead money" situation as well, so Houston isn't the only team with that problem..That's just part of the game.

aj.
12-06-2006, 07:44 AM
Every team in the league has the "dead money" situation as well, so Houston isn't the only team with that problem..That's just part of the game.


No team gave three free agents (Walker, Wade, Smith) $32 million in signing bonus only to cut them all two years later.

No team gave up a pair of Day 1 draft choices for a washed up corner.

No team gave up a second round pick in the supplemental for a RB who was out of the league 3 years later.

No team traded half their draft to a division rival to move up a few spots to take a tweener DE/LB who doesn't even start if everyone is healthy.

Somebody stop me...

JDizzle
12-06-2006, 08:03 AM
No
Somebody stop me...

No. Keep going, please.

Tulip
12-06-2006, 08:07 AM
IMO, Kubiak shouldn't have cut Robaire Smith or Moran Norris or traded Morency - so at least that much money is on him.

JDizzle
12-06-2006, 08:10 AM
IMO, Kubiak shouldn't have cut Robaire Smith or Moran Norris or traded Morency - so at least that much money is on him.

Not really, because neither Kubiak or Smith worked the contract. We are probably getting just as good of production from Dalton as we would from Robaire.

HJam72
12-06-2006, 08:57 AM
IMO, Kubiak shouldn't have cut Robaire Smith or Moran Norris or traded Morency - so at least that much money is on him.

I agree, except Smith was getting paid too much. We just should've kept him another year anyway.

Texan_Bill
12-06-2006, 09:00 AM
Didn't Boselli just come off that list. I think he was Dead Money for 4 years...

HJam72
12-06-2006, 09:02 AM
You forgot the deal for P-Burnt.

Uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuugly! :tearup:

whiskeyrbl
12-06-2006, 09:03 AM
Didn't Boselli just come off that list. I think he was Dead Money for 4 years...

No he didn't PBurnt is the washed up corner he is refering to.

Farough
12-06-2006, 09:05 AM
No team gave three free agents (Walker, Wade, Smith) $32 million in signing bonus only to cut them all two years later.

No team gave up a pair of Day 1 draft choices for a washed up corner.

No team gave up a second round pick in the supplemental for a RB who was out of the league 3 years later.

No team traded half their draft to a division rival to move up a few spots to take a tweener DE/LB who doesn't even start if everyone is healthy.

Somebody stop me...

You forgot the P-Burnt deal


No team gave up a pair of Day 1 draft choices for a washed up corner.

HOU-TEX
12-06-2006, 09:06 AM
Not really, because neither Kubiak or Smith worked the contract. We are probably getting just as good of production from Dalton as we would from Robaire.

It's funny you say that. I was thinking our Dline has looked it's best so far this season. They're stopping the run decently as well as putting together a decent pass rush. I wouldn't say it doesn't need improvement, but it's been kind of fun watching the D play at times. Dalton is the kind of DTs I like. He's a big run stopping DT. Actually, he put together a nice pass rush at times too.:cool:

Texan_Bill
12-06-2006, 09:15 AM
No team gave up a pair of Day 1 draft choices for a washed up corner.

I actually caught that and tried to edit it before it posted - my bad.

HJam72
12-06-2006, 09:32 AM
It's funny you say that. I was thinking our Dline has looked it's best so far this season. They're stopping the run decently as well as putting together a decent pass rush. I wouldn't say it doesn't need improvement, but it's been kind of fun watching the D play at times. Dalton is the kind of DTs I like. He's a big run stopping DT. Actually, he put together a nice pass rush at times too.:cool:

I have noticed that, so maybe I was wrong about not wanting to let Smith go this year. It just seemed so careless at the time to cut our best DT, even if he was getting paid too much.

HOU-TEX
12-06-2006, 09:38 AM
I have noticed that, so maybe I was wrong about not wanting to let Smith go this year. It just seemed so careless at the time to cut our best DT, even if he was getting paid too much.

There's always going to be second guessing on what personnel moves are made. I'm not in camp or at practices like some of our other MB members are, so I tend to stay away from any discussion over a release. I might raise an eyebrow over it, but that's about it.:cool:

kingh99
12-06-2006, 09:40 AM
No team gave three free agents (Walker, Wade, Smith) $32 million in signing bonus only to cut them all two years later.

No team gave up a pair of Day 1 draft choices for a washed up corner.

No team gave up a second round pick in the supplemental for a RB who was out of the league 3 years later.

No team traded half their draft to a division rival to move up a few spots to take a tweener DE/LB who doesn't even start if everyone is healthy.

Somebody stop me...

The prior regime was clueless. The former QB coach is doing children television as bippy the clown.

HOU-TEX
12-06-2006, 09:41 AM
The prior regime was clueless. The former QB coach is doing children television as bibby the clown.

I don't think we even had a QB coach. Am I mistaken?

HJam72
12-06-2006, 09:46 AM
I don't think we even had a QB coach. Am I mistaken?

Technically, we did, but he was not a real QB coach. They just picked somebody on the coaching staff and let him do it. Don't remember who or exactly what his normal position was.

Somebody will remember.

dbspi
12-06-2006, 03:45 PM
No team gave three free agents (Walker, Wade, Smith) $32 million in signing bonus only to cut them all two years later.

No team gave up a pair of Day 1 draft choices for a washed up corner.

No team gave up a second round pick in the supplemental for a RB who was out of the league 3 years later.

No team traded half their draft to a division rival to move up a few spots to take a tweener DE/LB who doesn't even start if everyone is healthy.

Somebody stop me...

Absolutely right. Keep going with the rest of the list.

dbspi
12-06-2006, 03:48 PM
Sooner we cut our loses better it will be in long range. This year I really like to see us clean house.

Blu
12-06-2006, 03:53 PM
Casserly
is
Judas
:brickwall

Texans Horror
12-06-2006, 03:56 PM
Mario Williams
Demeco Ryans
Spencer
Winston
Owen Daniels
Wali Lundy

All from Casserly. I know we like to barbecue him around here, but sometimes I think having a coach with a direction helped.

Vinny
12-06-2006, 03:58 PM
Why McNair let a lame duck in Casserly get involved with last year's draft and the Carr decision still puzzles me.

Runner
12-06-2006, 04:01 PM
Why McNair let a lame duck in Casserly get involved with last year's draft and the Carr decision still puzzles me.

Maybe he was convinced, or Reeves convinced him, that it was the coaches at fault. Who knows?

There are bad decision scattered through all levels of this organization the past few years. Maybe they are just noticed more because we are losing and don't overcome mistakes. Winning would certainly take our minds off of what would then be insignificant details.

Lucky
12-06-2006, 04:04 PM
Why McNair let a lame duck in Casserly get involved with last year's draft and the Carr decision still puzzles me.
I don't think we know how involved Casserly really was in the decision making. I have to believe that the picks ultimately were Kubiak's and Casserly was there to guide him through the process. If Rick Smith had been made available by the Broncos prior to the draft, I doubt Casserly would have been there at all.

infantrycak
12-06-2006, 04:05 PM
Mario Williams
Demeco Ryans
Spencer
Winston
Owen Daniels
Wali Lundy

All from Casserly. I know we like to barbecue him around here, but sometimes I think having a coach with a direction helped.

Huh? By all accounts Mario was Kubiak's choice not CC's. The other 1st day picks we don't know for sure but rumor has it were largely consensus (everyone amazed Ryans fell to them) or Kubiak/Sherman picks (Winston and Spencer for a renewed OL). CC gets definite credit for Daniels as Kubiak said CC lobbied to get him. That story is telling about the draft though--CC was lobbying Kubiak on a 4th round pick. Lundy is roster filler. You should have used DD on that one.

Runner
12-06-2006, 04:14 PM
...we don't know for sure but rumor has it were largely consensus (everyone amazed Ryans fell to them)...

I don't think Richard Smith wanted Ryans, but Johnny Holland was high on him. Luckily, Kubiak sided with the position coach on that one.

Texan_Bill
12-06-2006, 04:28 PM
I don't think Richard Smith wanted Ryans, but Johnny Holland was high on him. Luckily, Kubiak sided with the position coach on that one.

For me the jury is out on Richard Smith, but after reading your post Runner, about him not wanting Ryans, that may have swayed me in one direction.

ATX_Texan
12-06-2006, 04:42 PM
All from Casserly. I know we like to barbecue him around here, but sometimes I think having a coach with a direction helped.

HA HA HA HA

Glad to see the old "Casserly only made the good picks like AJ & DRob and Capers forced him to pick all the busts like Babin and TJ" myth is still being preached around here.

Casserly is responsible for all the horrible picks, trades, and terrible contracts because he was the the GM and the buck stopped with him. I guess Casserly is only a "draft genius" when he has a "draft genius" of a coach to direct him.

I know Casserly will always take credit for the good picks and blame everyone else for his mistakes, but that does not make it true no matter how many times he or his apologists repeat it.

Being an arrogant know it does not make a great GM. The horrible team that we are forced to watch ever week is Casserly's gift to us.

Second Honeymoon
12-06-2006, 05:01 PM
Casserley is what he is. He is one of those guys that think they are smarter than everyone else. He would never make the safe pick and would always reach for his 'prospects'..

He has made some good draft choices as Texan but in his rush to always prove how much smarter he was than everyone else, he made many blunders.

His blunders include:
David Carr
T. Johnson
J. Gaffney
D. Ragone
S. Wand

His hits include:
DeMeco
D. Davis
C. Pitts
T. Mathis

I never had a huge problem with his draft picks but where he really blew it is in trades and Free Agency/Contracts.

P Buchanon trade
Letting A. Glenn go
Letting J. Sharper go
J Babin trade
M Greenwood signing
R Smith signing
Wade signing
Carr re-signing (such a mistake its not even debatable)
D. Davis re-signing (way before necessary)

He would never make the safe pick, he would always reach and act like he knew something no one else did. He took a dump on our franchise and its gonna take years for us to wash it off of us and get it out of our system. I have also hated his seeming disdain for any player that played for the University of Texas. Derrick Johnson, Nathan Vasher, Shaun Rogers, Corey Redding, and a little player named Vince Young come to mind. Could you imagine DJ opposite Ryans in our LB corps? What about Vasher alongside Dunta? What about VY leading us to the promised land? Well it will never happen thanks to Casserley and his infinite wisdom.

Texan_Bill
12-06-2006, 05:06 PM
I don't think we know how involved Casserly really was in the decision making. I have to believe that the picks ultimately were Kubiak's and Casserly was there to guide him through the process. If Rick Smith had been made available by the Broncos prior to the draft, I doubt Casserly would have been there at all.

I kind of beleive that too. I think Casserly was well aware that he wouldn't be around for this season but was asked to help the transition from Capers to Kubiak. I would think that Dan Reeves and Kubiak had their guys in mind and thats essentially what we got in the draft

Second Honeymoon
12-06-2006, 05:11 PM
I kind of beleive that too. I think Casserly was well aware that he wouldn't be around for this season but was asked to help the transition from Capers to Kubiak. I would think that Dan Reeves and Kubiak had their guys in mind and thats essentially what we got in the draft

Yeah, I think we can shift the credit and blame from Casserley to McNair/Kubes. I think Casserley was basically a blocking back for McNair to pass on VY. McNair was more than happy to let Casserley take the bullet for the whole Mario/Vince/Bush/Carr argument.

However, I think Casserley can take credit for Owen Daniels and Spencer. Everyone else was pretty much a known commodity for the most part. Geez, I remember a NFL Mock Draft that had DeMeco at #10 overall before his senior season at Bama had even started. He had had a monster junior year and was dominating the SEC. He did more or less the same his senior year as well. He just dropped to end of 1st/top of 2nd because people are hesitant to spend 1st round picks on LBs. He is easily the best player the Texans have ever drafted...and I say Thank You to whoever...

Texan_Bill
12-06-2006, 05:22 PM
Yeah, I think we can shift the credit and blame from Casserley to McNair/Kubes. I think Casserley was basically a blocking back for McNair to pass on VY. McNair was more than happy to let Casserley take the bullet for the whole Mario/Vince/Bush/Carr argument.

However, I think Casserley can take credit for Owen Daniels and Spencer. Everyone else was pretty much a known commodity for the most part. Geez, I remember a NFL Mock Draft that had DeMeco at #10 overall before his senior season at Bama had even started. He had had a monster junior year and was dominating the SEC. He did more or less the same his senior year as well. He just dropped to end of 1st/top of 2nd because people are hesitant to spend 1st round picks on LBs. He is easily the best player the Texans have ever drafted...and I say Thank You to whoever...

I can certainly see Casserly being thrust as the goat for the VY/Bush/Mario deal... Do you really think that Daniels and SPencer were Casserly guys? That's actually pretty interesting.

I made my statement purely out of speculation given the circumstances, but by no means was I behind closed doors, so we may never know how it really shook out..
I wonder if 'Meco's stock dropped a bit because of his size too. Don't the pundits consider him small for a MLB?

Insideop
12-06-2006, 05:23 PM
I don't think we know how involved Casserly really was in the decision making. I have to believe that the picks ultimately were Kubiak's and Casserly was there to guide him through the process. If Rick Smith had been made available by the Broncos prior to the draft, I doubt Casserly would have been there at all.


This is what I think too. Other than the Owen Daniels pick, which someone mentioned CC had pushed for, I really think this draft belongs to Kubiak and his coaches. I just hope they hit another "home run" in the next draft. We need to fill alot of holes! JMHO!

tsip
12-06-2006, 05:35 PM
Technically, we did, but he was not a real QB coach. They just picked somebody on the coaching staff and let him do it. Don't remember who or exactly what his normal position was.

Somebody will remember.

...think the QB coach was Greg Roman--iCak can probaly verify or maybe Vinny...

Second Honeymoon
12-06-2006, 05:43 PM
I can certainly see Casserly being thrust as the goat for the VY/Bush/Mario deal... Do you really think that Daniels and SPencer were Casserly guys? That's actually pretty interesting.

I made my statement purely out of speculation given the circumstances, but by no means was I behind closed doors, so we may never know how it really shook out..
I wonder if 'Meco's stock dropped a bit because of his size too. Don't the pundits consider him small for a MLB?

Well obviously I am not sitting in on any of the behind closed door meetings or we would have drafted VY :) But seriously, I rememer Casserley talking about Spencer and Daniels as guys he had targeted. Spencer doesn't really fit the mold of the traditional Bronco Offense system.

Texan_Bill
12-06-2006, 05:51 PM
Well obviously I am not sitting in on any of the behind closed door meetings or we would have drafted VY :) But seriously, I rememer Casserley talking about Spencer and Daniels as guys he had targeted. Spencer doesn't really fit the mold of the traditional Bronco Offense system.

Well, with that said I will give credit where credit is due... (Even if it is Casserly).

aj.
12-06-2006, 06:12 PM
Mario Williams
Demeco Ryans
Spencer
Winston
Owen Daniels
Wali Lundy

All from Casserly. I know we like to barbecue him around here, but sometimes I think having a coach with a direction helped.


CC and his scouts did the same thing in '06 that they did from '02 - '05. They developed the draft board. Along with developnig the draft board comes justifying why one player is ranked above another. A lot of that justification comes out in discussion when they are war gaming the draft for a couple of weeks leading up to draft day.

The actual choices ultimately came down to Kubiak with input from Sherman and his coordinators.

johnboy
12-06-2006, 06:29 PM
HA HA HA HA

Glad to see the old "Casserly only made the good picks like AJ & DRob and Capers forced him to pick all the busts like Babin and TJ" myth is still being preached around here.

Casserly is responsible for all the horrible picks, trades, and terrible contracts because he was the the GM and the buck stopped with him. I guess Casserly is only a "draft genius" when he has a "draft genius" of a coach to direct him.

I know Casserly will always take credit for the good picks and blame everyone else for his mistakes, but that does not make it true no matter how many times he or his apologists repeat it.

Being an arrogant know it does not make a great GM. The horrible team that we are forced to watch ever week is Casserly's gift to us.

Why would you call Babin a bust. Babin has four sacks, Mario has 4.5 sacks. Babin signed for 5,000 mil ,Mario 54mil. Babin plays about one-third of the minutes Mario plays. Who is really the Bust.

Mario plays,.

RTP2110
12-06-2006, 06:44 PM
I think we can stop labeling Domanick Davis as a draft steal for Casserly. Davis was a mid round prospect because he was injured a lot in college. Although his production when he is on the field would make him look like steal, if you add in the games missed due to injury, I think Davis is an even value for a 4th rounder.

Double Barrel
12-06-2006, 07:11 PM
I don't think Richard Smith wanted Ryans,

yet another reason to wonder about Richard Smith...

For me the jury is out on Richard Smith, but after reading your post Runner, about him not wanting Ryans, that may have swayed me in one direction.

Me, too. I'm just not impressed with his defensive coordinatorship. I hope, of course, he proves me wrong.

Yankee_In_TX
12-06-2006, 07:15 PM
Does Joppru count?

Runner
12-06-2006, 07:18 PM
Does Joppru count?

Only if Spencer is a first year bust.

IMO, injuries don't count.

Second Honeymoon
12-06-2006, 07:43 PM
Joppru doesnt count as he was injured. I do think it was a stupid move to draft a TE in the 2nd draft of your franchise. Joppru probably would have been around in the early 3rd as well. It was a reach when he drafted him, it was a luxury pick ill-fitting an expansion team, and the dude doesnt ever play a meaningful down for us. I won't blame it all on Cass but I do blame that we spent around the 35th pick overall for him.

I even remember the ESPN draft 'gurus' saying 'seems like a reach for the Texans to draft this TE here'. Just another Casserley braindead reach...par for the course

ATX_Texan
12-06-2006, 07:51 PM
Why would you call Babin a bust?

I call Babin a bust because of all the draft picks Casserly had to give to the Titans in order to draft him. I also question the pick because Casserly and Capers selected him because these so-called experts in building the perfect 3-4 defense thought they could make him into an OLB. When the truth was that he played in a 4-3 in college. Casserly gave up way too much to get an unproven project.

The success this year is based on him actually playing in a system he is suited for. If you are building something and you don't choose the right parts, it is a bust. It was very discouraging to see teams like the Chargers and Cowboys build 3-4 defenses from scratch in a couple of years while the Texans had neither the players for a 3-4 or 4-3 when Casserly was finally run out of town after 5 seasons.

TheOgre
12-06-2006, 07:57 PM
I'll give Casserly a pass on Joppru because the guy didn't have a history of injuries.

Casserly and the scouts pushed for Owen Daniels. That is clearly a guy Kubiak had to get sold on. I think that one paid off. However, CC did so many things poorly that the good moments are like the eye of a hurricane. Kubiak took the scouts and CC's information and made markedly better decisions than Capers.

With the incompetence in coaching, personnel decisions, and salary cap from the previous regime, I don't blame Kubiak for wondering what he had in Carr. Clearly there is no longer any doubt. This guy needs to go, and the Texans need to find their QB of the future. So many of you have assumed VY was that guy. I'm just not so sure he is "all that". We have Mario and we still need to find our QB. Lets just hope they have a satisfactory plan to find our QB now.

nunusguy
12-06-2006, 08:38 PM
I call Babin a bust because of all the draft picks Casserly had to give to the Titans in order to draft him.

But that's not a bust. A bust is a failure, a player who's ability is so marginal
that he makes a minimul or nill contribution to the team.
One might say that Babin isn't a starter, but he has the misfortune of being on a team who's current top FA and top Draft pick play the same position as he does. And he was drafted to play OLB in the 3-4, which is probably his best position in the NFL regardless of his personal preference.
Did the Texans pay too much for him ? Yea, but that's an issue apart from the question of Babin being a success or failure.
But Casserly was known to have a hard-on for Reggie Bush, and I suspect that that was his recommendation to Kubiak for the Texans top pick.
But he also strongly supported Daniels, whom Kubiak hinself said he took based upon Casserlys recommendation.
I dunno, but I suspect Casserly provided a list of candidates and Kubiak and
his staff ultimately made the individuals choices. Could be he and Capers had
the same procedure.

Insideop
12-06-2006, 09:28 PM
I'll give Casserly a pass on Joppru because the guy didn't have a history of injuries.

Casserly and the scouts pushed for Owen Daniels. That is clearly a guy Kubiak had to get sold on. I think that one paid off. However, CC did so many things poorly that the good moments are like the eye of a hurricane. Kubiak took the scouts and CC's information and made markedly better decisions than Capers.

This kinda got me wondering. Does anybody know who our scouts are, and are they the same ones we had under Capers? I never heard of any of them being fired or stepping down when Capers left or when CC left. As important as this is in evaluating talent, I would have thought Kubiak and/or Smith would have brought in their own people. idonno:

The Pencil Neck
12-06-2006, 09:45 PM
This kinda got me wondering. Does anybody know who our scouts are, and are they the same ones we had under Capers? I never heard of any of them being fired or stepping down when Capers left or when CC left. As important as this is in evaluating talent, I would have thought Kubiak and/or Smith would have brought in their own people. idonno:

From my understanding, we kept most if not all of the same scouting staff.

aj.
12-06-2006, 09:47 PM
Smith brought in Dale Strahm as the new Director of College Scouting. Everyone else is the same.

dbspi
12-06-2006, 11:06 PM
Casserley is what he is. He is one of those guys that think they are smarter than everyone else. He would never make the safe pick and would always reach for his 'prospects'..

He has made some good draft choices as Texan but in his rush to always prove how much smarter he was than everyone else, he made many blunders.

His blunders include:
David Carr
T. Johnson
J. Gaffney
D. Ragone
S. Wand

His hits include:
DeMeco
D. Davis
C. Pitts
T. Mathis

I never had a huge problem with his draft picks but where he really blew it is in trades and Free Agency/Contracts.

P Buchanon trade
Letting A. Glenn go
Letting J. Sharper go
J Babin trade
M Greenwood signing
R Smith signing
Wade signing
Carr re-signing (such a mistake its not even debatable)
D. Davis re-signing (way before necessary)

He would never make the safe pick, he would always reach and act like he knew something no one else did. He took a dump on our franchise and its gonna take years for us to wash it off of us and get it out of our system. I have also hated his seeming disdain for any player that played for the University of Texas. Derrick Johnson, Nathan Vasher, Shaun Rogers, Corey Redding, and a little player named Vince Young come to mind. Could you imagine DJ opposite Ryans in our LB corps? What about Vasher alongside Dunta? What about VY leading us to the promised land? Well it will never happen thanks to Casserley and his infinite wisdom.

-----------------------------------------

Thanks to Casserly, I am going to list all the DRAFT BUSTS:

2002
1 David Carr - At this point, you can give all the excuses you want, but I say Bust.
2 Jabar Gaffney - Is he out of football yet?
3 Charles Hill - Out of football

2003
2 Tony Hollings - Out of football
2 Ben Joppru - Out of football? If not, he's walking the line.
3 Seth Wand - Out of football?
3 Dave Ragone - Completely wasted pick
S. Wand - Wasted pick since he is no longer on the team.

2004
1 Jason Babin - We traded away three first day picks for him. I say bust.

2005
1 Travis Johnson - Completely baffling pick. Likely a bust

Now look at the Free Agencies and Trade Acquitions:

P Buchanon trade
M Greenwood signing
R Smith signing
Wade signing
J Babin trade


Letting Go Key Players:

Letting A. Glenn go
Letting J. Sharper go

Players signing to new contracts in 2006 off season:

Carr re-signing (such a mistake itís not even debatable)
D. Davis re-signing (way before necessary)
S. McKinney (such a mistake itís not even debatable, last time I checked he has lost his job)

Now letís look at the Keepers (Players): Let me know if I have missed any one on this list.

AJ
DRob
Pitts
T. Mathis
Mario Williams
Demeco Ryans
Spencer
Winston
Owen Daniels
Wali Lundy

dbspi
12-06-2006, 11:18 PM
Why would you call Babin a bust. Babin has four sacks, Mario has 4.5 sacks. Babin signed for 5,000 mil ,Mario 54mil. Babin plays about one-third of the minutes Mario plays. Who is really the Bust.

Mario plays,.

For all the draft we wasted on him in trade, we had sincerely hoped that he would be starting for long time and dominate the game in a similar fashion to what Shawne Marriman of SD or Demarcus Ware of Cowboys are doing.

He is not bust by any means but expectations were very high of him when we had acquired him. In Capers own word, he had said he has capabilities to play like Greg Lloyd.

The Pencil Neck
12-07-2006, 01:15 AM
2003

2 Ben Joppru - Out of football? If not, he's walking the line.
3 Seth Wand - Out of football?

I think BJ got signed by the Seahawks this week. Wand got signed to the Titans, iirc, 2-3 weeks ago.

painekiller
12-07-2006, 04:43 AM
Didn't Boselli just come off that list. I think he was Dead Money for 4 years...

By definition Dead Money comes off at a max of 2 years. So Boselli has been gone a long long time.

**If player cut after June 1, the team has the option of counting the bonus money due to be expense in that year, and then expensing the rest of the bonus money in the following year.

HOOK'EM
12-07-2006, 04:48 AM
Joppru doesnt count as he was injured. I do think it was a stupid move to draft a TE in the 2nd draft of your franchise. Joppru probably would have been around in the early 3rd as well. It was a reach when he drafted him, it was a luxury pick ill-fitting an expansion team, and the dude doesnt ever play a meaningful down for us. I won't blame it all on Cass but I do blame that we spent around the 35th pick overall for him.

I even remember the ESPN draft 'gurus' saying 'seems like a reach for the Texans to draft this TE here'. Just another Casserley braindead reach...par for the course

..............and Jason Whitten was still on the board.:crying:

Texans Horror
12-07-2006, 08:19 AM
Huh? By all accounts Mario was Kubiak's choice not CC's. The other 1st day picks we don't know for sure but rumor has it were largely consensus (everyone amazed Ryans fell to them) or Kubiak/Sherman picks (Winston and Spencer for a renewed OL). CC gets definite credit for Daniels as Kubiak said CC lobbied to get him. That story is telling about the draft though--CC was lobbying Kubiak on a 4th round pick. Lundy is roster filler. You should have used DD on that one.

I have not heard the rumors about who picked who, and I don't think they will ever be more than rumors. FWIW, I've heard different rumors. I have heard that MW was a consensus pick of Cass and Kubes - they both prefered him to the USC back. The other rumor I had heard was that Sherman did not ask for new blood on the line through drafts. He felt secure with Wand/Pitts/Flanagan/Weary or McKinney/Weigert. Kubiak wanted new tackles and pushed to have them play over starters. Just the rumors I've heard.

I didn't want to add DD to the argument because I was only referring to this last draft only, but yeah, I think DD will always be Cass's "great" pick.

HA HA HA HA

Glad to see the old "Casserly only made the good picks like AJ & DRob and Capers forced him to pick all the busts like Babin and TJ" myth is still being preached around here.

Casserly is responsible for all the horrible picks, trades, and terrible contracts because he was the the GM and the buck stopped with him. I guess Casserly is only a "draft genius" when he has a "draft genius" of a coach to direct him.

I know Casserly will always take credit for the good picks and blame everyone else for his mistakes, but that does not make it true no matter how many times he or his apologists repeat it.

Being an arrogant know it does not make a great GM. The horrible team that we are forced to watch ever week is Casserly's gift to us.

My point was never to defend every move Cass made or pretend he didn't make some gigantic blunders. I felt the ship started sinking when Glenn and Sharper were let go. Buchanon was an immediate and obvious mistake. So I agree with you that there have been major errors. My point is that there we tend to roast him completely and totally, and I'm not sure the guy deserves being the Texans scapegoat. I can say the front office as a whole did a terrible job, but I hate pinning it all on one person. I really think the screw-up was a botched plan and bad communication between the front office and the coaching staff.

Casserley is what he is. He is one of those guys that think they are smarter than everyone else. He would never make the safe pick and would always reach for his 'prospects'..

He has made some good draft choices as Texan but in his rush to always prove how much smarter he was than everyone else, he made many blunders.

His blunders include:
David Carr
T. Johnson
J. Gaffney
D. Ragone
S. Wand

His hits include:
DeMeco
D. Davis
C. Pitts
T. Mathis

I never had a huge problem with his draft picks but where he really blew it is in trades and Free Agency/Contracts.

P Buchanon trade
Letting A. Glenn go
Letting J. Sharper go
J Babin trade
M Greenwood signing
R Smith signing
Wade signing
Carr re-signing (such a mistake its not even debatable)
D. Davis re-signing (way before necessary)

He would never make the safe pick, he would always reach and act like he knew something no one else did. He took a dump on our franchise and its gonna take years for us to wash it off of us and get it out of our system. I have also hated his seeming disdain for any player that played for the University of Texas. Derrick Johnson, Nathan Vasher, Shaun Rogers, Corey Redding, and a little player named Vince Young come to mind. Could you imagine DJ opposite Ryans in our LB corps? What about Vasher alongside Dunta? What about VY leading us to the promised land? Well it will never happen thanks to Casserley and his infinite wisdom.

The blunder with Wand was putting him on a team that did not want to play him.

As a Longhorn, I always thought it would be cool for a Longhorn to play for Houston, but that was it. I don't feel disparaged by the Texans for not taking a Horn.

Just my :twocents:

GlassHalfFull
10-25-2008, 01:42 PM
LOL at Casserly's wiki entry. It is pretty nauseating until you get to this paragraph. I wonder how long it will last.

wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charley_Casserly)

During Casserly's tenure, the combination of terrible draft selections and even worse free-agent acquistions ultimately drove the Texans into the ground. Casserly was responsible for trading away an entire draft for Jason Babin, trading away multiple Day 1 draft picks for P-Buc, and wasting millions in free agent contracts on Gary Walker, Todd Wade, and Robaire Smith. The most grevious error was extending David Carr's contract after Carr proved incapable of taking three steps without diving into the grass in a fetal position. Casserly is well known for taking credit for the things that work out and blaming others for things that don't. Casserly's little man know-it-all attitide ultimately wore thin on owner Bob McNair. After a head coaching change in 2006 in which former Denver Broncos Offensive Coordinator Gary Kubiak replaced Dom Capers, the Texans bounced back to a 6-10 season in 2006, led by offensive standouts David Carr, Andre Johnson, Owen Daniels, Chester Pitts, Fred Weary and Eric Winston, and defensive standouts Dunta Robinson, Travis Johnson, Mario Williams and DeMeco Ryans; all Texans' original draft selections.

ObsiWan
10-25-2008, 02:22 PM
this is exactly why Wikipedia cannot be completely trusted....
anyone with their own agenda can post entries and those who are uniformed take them as gospel.

CloakNNNdagger
10-25-2008, 02:40 PM
"STANDOUTS??" That's certainly a list that could use revision..........

ObsiWan
10-25-2008, 02:56 PM
LOL at Casserly's wiki entry. It is pretty nauseating until you get to this paragraph. I wonder how long it will last.

wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charley_Casserly)

just curious.... why were you digging thru this old thread anyhow? And whatever made you look up Casserly's wiki entry?
:thinking:

TEXANRED
10-25-2008, 03:47 PM
LOL at Casserly's wiki entry. It is pretty nauseating until you get to this paragraph. I wonder how long it will last.

wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charley_Casserly)

Not long. Its already gone. I say you go and repost your Wiki entry.

b0ng
10-25-2008, 04:01 PM
just curious.... why were you digging thru this old thread anyhow? And whatever made you look up Casserly's wiki entry?
:thinking:

Masochism

brakos82
10-25-2008, 04:02 PM
Maybe Casserly needs a Stinky Drawers thread... it would certainly be fitting. :thinking:

ObsiWan
10-25-2008, 04:18 PM
Masochism

I should have known.
Its a prerequisite to being a Texans fan

steelbtexan
10-25-2008, 04:18 PM
"STANDOUTS??" That's certainly a list that could use revision..........

Maybe their definition of standout includes the words

Gutless & underachieving for some on the list.

GlassHalfFull
10-25-2008, 04:56 PM
just curious.... why were you digging thru this old thread anyhow? And whatever made you look up Casserly's wiki entry?
:thinking:

I was reading the comments over at DGDB&D and the wiki entry was mentioned. I thought it would be a fun read for some of his fans here. I dug up the old thread to post it in, because I did not want to start a brand new Casserly thread. See, I have a very good explanation for everything. :smiliedance:

mussop
10-25-2008, 05:03 PM
Joppru doesnt count as he was injured. I do think it was a stupid move to draft a TE in the 2nd draft of your franchise. Joppru probably would have been around in the early 3rd as well. It was a reach when he drafted him, it was a luxury pick ill-fitting an expansion team, and the dude doesnt ever play a meaningful down for us. I won't blame it all on Cass but I do blame that we spent around the 35th pick overall for him.

I even remember the ESPN draft 'gurus' saying 'seems like a reach for the Texans to draft this TE here'. Just another Casserley braindead reach...par for the course

It was really a blunder when you consider that Jason Witten was still on the board at the time. I was stunned when they anounced Joppru as our pick. Could not believe that we took a late second early third (at best) talent TE over Witten who was a middle to late first round talent. Witten was CLEARLY the better talent in every facet of the game.

It still hurts when I watch my second favorite team (whomever is playing Dallas) and Witten makes a big play.

JayCee
10-25-2008, 09:12 PM
how is our dead money situation looking now?

Corrosion
10-25-2008, 09:52 PM
Casserly still sucks .... Keep him as far away from this team as possible.

cuppacoffee
10-26-2008, 08:19 PM
No team gave three free agents (Walker, Wade, Smith) $32 million in signing bonus only to cut them all two years later.

No team gave up a pair of Day 1 draft choices for a washed up corner.

No team gave up a second round pick in the supplemental for a RB who was out of the league 3 years later.

No team traded half their draft to a division rival to move up a few spots to take a tweener DE/LB who doesn't even start if everyone is healthy.

Somebody stop me...


Hell no...you're on a roll. :D


:coffee: