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Texans34Life
11-19-2006, 04:07 PM
How the hell can you give up 2 83 yard TDs to one receiver? Losman has sucked all year and he has a field day against us. What the hell is up with that? That's just f'n ridiculous.

It's not only just this game. Just before this game, we ranked 20th in the league - giving up 215.1 yds/game, 13 TDs, and only have 6 INTs.

Our offseason better focus on the OL and our crappy secondary!

V Man
11-19-2006, 04:10 PM
How the hell can you give up 2 83 yard TDs to one receiver? That's just f'n ridiculous.

Our offseason better focus on the OL and our crappy secondary!

Faggins is always getting burnt for big plays. He is a solid nickel corner but a below average starter.

kcwilson
11-19-2006, 04:11 PM
How the hell can you give up 2 83 yard TDs to one receiver? That's just f'n ridiculous.

Our offseason better focus on the OL and our crappy secondary!

I think the safety took bad angles each time, almost like they underestimated Evans' speed. We had no speed in the secondary to matchup with Evans. Petey doesn't have the legs, but held his own late in the game when the coverage required underneath passing.

THis is nothing new though... we all knew the secondary is less than average, and the DL wasn't getting all that much pressure on Losman, to Buffalo's OL credit, they were strong.

It is obvious that it will be a focus in the off season.

wolfscar
11-19-2006, 04:31 PM
I think the safety took bad angles each time, almost like they underestimated Evans' speed. We had no speed in the secondary to matchup with Evans. Petey doesn't have the legs, but held his own late in the game when the coverage required underneath passing.

THis is nothing new though... we all knew the secondary is less than average, and the DL wasn't getting all that much pressure on Losman, to Buffalo's OL credit, they were strong.

It is obvious that it will be a focus in the off season.

Looked like a combination of these to me - our battered D-Line were really ordinary (their O-Line did a good job of forcing mario inside, and he just had no push at all off his right foot) and Losman had way too much time to make his completions. Having said that, he threw the ball well and his do-nothing receivers stepped up some.

We need a good cover FS and we need a CB with speed to line up opposite Dunta (LaRon Landry and Asante Samuel?). Faggins has the potential to be one of the better nickel CBs in the NFL (IMHO), but he's not a starter.

For all that though, there were a lot of positives. I liked the character our boys showed throughout the game. Although Buffalo (Clements in particular) did a great job shutting down the long pass, we still put up over 200 yards through the air; we dismantled their running game, our special teams did a great job pinning them back and BOTH our RBs stepped up to be counted. Apart from those long passes to Evans we dominated that game throughout. And Winston made a few big plays in his first start - he looked good at RT.

I'm crushed that we lost it with 9 seconds to go (NNNGH!) but overall I'm happy with how we played it, given the personnel that we have. Maybe Dexter Wynn can line up as CB next week - he wasn't bad when he played for Philly...

Headlights of a Carr
11-19-2006, 04:34 PM
This is where you can put the blame on the loss.

The secondary, making JP Losman look like Joe Montana.

Ridiculous.:wild:

nunusguy
11-19-2006, 04:41 PM
We still aren't getting pressure on the QB. The Bills guy had all day on way
too many passing plays.

awtysst
11-19-2006, 04:46 PM
What concerned me the most was that after getting beat, Faggins looked like he had a chance to dive at Evans feet or something and didnt. In fact on both TDs, Evans is getting chased by Faggins until maybe the 20 and then Faggins seems to just give up. I dont like that effort.

threetoedpete
11-19-2006, 04:52 PM
Faggins is always getting burnt for big plays. He is a solid nickel corner but a below average starter.

OK, with a six guy blitz from us and the fastest guy on the Bills lined up over Faggins, whos responsiblity was it to be on top ? Who's responsiblity was it to get to the QB so he can't make the throw? Petie is what he is. Can't make a race horse out of a mule. Don't pile on. He's doing his best. There has been no support or play production out of our safeties this year. Without Mario 100% this only can be exasperated the rest of the year.

YoungTexanFan
11-19-2006, 06:21 PM
OK, with a six guy blitz from us and the fastest guy on the Bills lined up over Faggins, whos responsiblity was it to be on top ? Who's responsiblity was it to get to the QB so he can't make the throw? Petie is what he is. Can't make a race horse out of a mule. Don't pile on. He's doing his best. There has been no support or play production out of our safeties this year. Without Mario 100% this only can be exasperated the rest of the year.

Here is what you seem to be missing:

Faggins is not a starter for any other team in the NFL and would be a nickle on only a few teams as well. He doesn't have the wheels to make a play, but asking a FS to read both sides of the field and still be over top to one side is impossible.


I recognize that our FS/SS sucks, and that they aren't cover guys, but Faggins should not have a starting spot. I feel Sanders was better than him, and that Buchanon was better than him.

I'm not a bandwagon fan just dogging on him after today's game...I have been preaching this same "get him off the field" message for at least a year and a half.

YoungTexanFan
11-19-2006, 06:21 PM
What concerned me the most was that after getting beat, Faggins looked like he had a chance to dive at Evans feet or something and didnt. In fact on both TDs, Evans is getting chased by Faggins until maybe the 20 and then Faggins seems to just give up. I dont like that effort.

Faggins never looks like he gives his full effort and I really feel that wears off on our other players.

kiwitexansfan
11-19-2006, 08:30 PM
For all the hate P-Buc got at least he was fast, I am not sure P-Buc gets taken deep twice without running the guy down.

If your going to play slow corners you got to cover them deep with a safety, but you can't do that if your bringing the house.

So if we want to blitz a lot with players other than the front four we absolutely have to improve the speed and coverage ability of the secondary.

I think that we are a starting CB, FS and LB away from having a competitive defense.

JDizzle
11-19-2006, 08:40 PM
I can't hate on Faggins too much because Evans is a burner. This is what safeties are for .... and ours aren't very safe.

Mr teX
11-19-2006, 08:58 PM
Here is what you seem to be missing:

Faggins is not a starter for any other team in the NFL and would be a nickle on only a few teams as well. He doesn't have the wheels to make a play, but asking a FS to read both sides of the field and still be over top to one side is impossible.


I recognize that our FS/SS sucks, and that they aren't cover guys, but Faggins should not have a starting spot. I feel Sanders was better than him, and that Buchanon was better than him.

I'm not a bandwagon fan just dogging on him after today's game...I have been preaching this same "get him off the field" message for at least a year and a half.


Wow at the bolded. That guy was certified trash, at least petey makes a play every now and then, P-Burnt was just garbage & couldn't cover a Quadrapeligic. I am on record as saying i thought Sanders was solid over there but our safeties; CC & Earl are just not instinctive at all back there.

Look at The bills secondary. when DC threw it deep, the safety was right there over the top to assist, Ours just don't have the speed to get over there on time. I don't see how you can blame the D-line on those first 2 scores for the bills, I know for a fact JP held in there and took big hit from Mario & company so the pressure was there; the safeties just weren't.

YoungTexanFan
11-19-2006, 09:38 PM
Wow at the bolded. That guy was certified trash, at least petey makes a play every now and then, P-Burnt was just garbage & couldn't cover a Quadrapeligic. I am on record as saying i thought Sanders was solid over there but our safeties; CC & Earl are just not instinctive at all back there.

Look at The bills secondary. when DC threw it deep, the safety was right there over the top to assist, Ours just don't have the speed to get over there on time. I don't see how you can blame the D-line on those first 2 scores for the bills, I know for a fact JP held in there and took big hit from Mario & company so the pressure was there; the safeties just weren't.


Couple of things:

As bad as you may feel Buchanon was, he has more ability than Faggins and was improving a lot throughout TC.

The Bills secondary (safties) that played so well is made up of Donte Whittner from OSU taken 8th overall and Ko Simpson whom the Texans passed on.

Napa Auto Parts
11-19-2006, 10:59 PM
Petey Faggins let vote him in to the pro bowl.

eriadoc
11-19-2006, 11:53 PM
I have more of an issue with the defensive assignment than I do Faggins' shortcomings. Many posters here have opined that Faggins is not starter material for quite some time. Faggins hasn't magically gotten better - he is what he is. So why in the hell does the coaching staff insist on putting Robinson to one side of the field and leaving him there? Hello! The opposing team will just move their best WR away from him!!

Is there no one on the coaching staff that notices that AJ gets the opposing teams' best corner (Clements today) no matter where he lines up? Only when AJ goes into motion is he sometimes able to shake that corner pre-snap. Why the hell can't our team figure out that D-Rob is our best CB - scratch that - only starting-caliber CB - and assign him to the opposition's best WR? Evans is fast, but so is Robinson. He can run with him better than Faggins can, at any rate. This just seems so Capers-like. and I distinctly remember a MNF game where the Broncos played the Chiefs a couple years ago and the Broncos assigned Champ Bailey to cover Tony Gonzales all night, no matter which side he lined up on. So I know the concept isn't foreign to Kubiak.

Anyway, end of rant. I shouldn't even be here getting my blood pressure up.

Runner
11-19-2006, 11:56 PM
I have more of an issue with the defensive assignment than I do Faggins' shortcomings. Many posters here have opined that Faggins is not starter material for quite some time. Faggins hasn't magically gotten better - he is what he is. So why in the hell does the coaching staff insist on putting Robinson to one side of the field and leaving him there? Hello! The opposing team will just move their best WR away from him!!


Capers and crew did that too. I don't understand it either.

gtexan02
11-20-2006, 01:41 PM
I know that most NFL teams line up DBs on one specifc side of the field, but I ask you, when is enough enough?

Faggins is slower than Dunta Robinson, and he is also slower than Lee Evans. SO why did Kubiak leave him on an Island multiple times against Evans?

Evans set a franchise record with 11 catches, 280+ yards, and 2 TDs. Why not set up your best DB on their best WR?

eriadoc
11-20-2006, 04:05 PM
I agree .... http://forums.houstontexans.com/showthread.php?p=504981#post504981

Vinny
11-20-2006, 05:28 PM
espn page 2 found Dunta's comments about Losman ironic it seems...

J.P. Losman: After Losman led the Bills on a last-minute drive to defeat the Texans, Houston cornerback Dunta Robinson had this to say: "If that had been Peyton Manning, you'd expect it. But it was J.P. Losman. That's embarrassing. I hope he doesn't feel too good, because we just shot ourselves in the foot." Yeah, Losman, you shouldn't feel too good. You had to resort to a last-minute drive to beat Dunta Robinson and the Texans. Most teams usually put them away long before the fourth quarter. You should be embarrassed. You're so pathetic I'm surprised you're not a Houston Texan. http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=gallo/061120

edo783
11-20-2006, 10:02 PM
If Dunta really said this in the press "You're so pathetic I'm surprised you're not a Houston Texan." his teammates need to get all over him. That is major disrepect for/to them. He may think it and may even voice it in the locker room (still not a good thing) but to say that sort of thing in the press is bad, very, very bad form.

thunderkyss
11-20-2006, 10:09 PM
I have more of an issue with the defensive assignment than I do Faggins' shortcomings. Many posters here have opined that Faggins is not starter material for quite some time. Faggins hasn't magically gotten better - he is what he is. So why in the hell does the coaching staff insist on putting Robinson to one side of the field and leaving him there? Hello! The opposing team will just move their best WR away from him!!

1) Remember that play in Buffalo's second possession where Evans was in the slot, he 4 yards, then cut across the middle?? caught the ball right over the center, then ran to the otherside of the field, after 2 or 3 missed tackles??

Do you remember who covered Evans on that play, then jumped up and down screaming at (??) as Evans ran away from him??

2) Our defense has been better with Faggins in the line up, than without.

3) Sanders was hurt...

4) Lossman hasn't been allowed to throw the ball in those situations before this game.. after watching tape of the Bills previous games, no one would have played those passes differently, and we adjusted pretty well...... I think.

Kaiser Toro
11-20-2006, 10:12 PM
If Dunta really said this in the press "You're so pathetic I'm surprised you're not a Houston Texan." his teammates need to get all over him. That is major disrepect for/to them. He may think it and may even voice it in the locker room (still not a good thing) but to say that sort of thing in the press is bad, very, very bad form.

You need to read the article. Dunta did not say that.

Runner
11-20-2006, 10:12 PM
If Dunta really said this in the press "You're so pathetic I'm surprised you're not a Houston Texan." his teammates need to get all over him. That is major disrepect for/to them. He may think it and may even voice it in the locker room (still not a good thing) but to say that sort of thing in the press is bad, very, very bad form.

That was the author's comment. Dunta said the middle part.

After Losman led the Bills on a last-minute drive to defeat the Texans, Houston cornerback Dunta Robinson had this to say: "If that had been Peyton Manning, you'd expect it. But it was J.P. Losman. That's embarrassing. I hope he doesn't feel too good, because we just shot ourselves in the foot." Yeah, Losman, you shouldn't feel too good. You had to resort to a last-minute drive to beat Dunta Robinson and the Texans. Most teams usually put them away long before the fourth quarter. You should be embarrassed. You're so pathetic I'm surprised you're not a Houston Texan.

mean mark8
11-20-2006, 10:22 PM
Capers and crew did that too. I don't understand it either.

We've got the same secondary coach we've always had. Apparently veteran cornerbacks can't play man coverage except on one side of the field. That's why our pass defense bites so bad. Our corners have to stop at the hash marks.:confused:

HJam72
11-20-2006, 10:29 PM
It's true that Faggins is not a starting corner, but those two TDs are on the safeties. Been saying it since before the last draft....we need DBs, and we need to spend high picks and try to make sure they are reliable. First day picks for sure and probably no lower than the 2nd round for the first of our choices. I want TWO DBs in the next draft....a corner and a safety.

gameguy89
11-20-2006, 10:39 PM
I was wondering this whole Dunta/Evans issue myself.

Then I figured out the answer.

The coaching staff realized that assigning Dunta to Evans was a good idea with about 24 seconds to go in the game, promptly allowing Peerless Price to break Faggin's ankles and catch the game winning touchdown.

:sarcasm:

Runner
11-20-2006, 11:18 PM
We've got the same secondary coach we've always had. Apparently veteran cornerbacks can't play man coverage except on one side of the field. That's why our pass defense bites so bad. Our corners have to stop at the hash marks.:confused:

Good point. I forgot about that. I guess we only want offensive tackles and defensive ends that move all over the field. Cornerbacks stay put. :confused:

Texans34Life
11-26-2006, 11:47 PM
bump

To the rest of the NFL,

Just a reminder to everyone that our secondary just f'n sucks.

Thanks,
The "With the 1st Pick in the 2007 Draft" Texans

:thumbdown :embarrass :bag: