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View Full Version : Cook has cost us two games


jaayteetx
11-19-2006, 02:59 PM
Two fumbles, two totally inopurtune times. I think we would be 5-5 right now otherwise.

Goldeagle
11-19-2006, 03:00 PM
Yeah, He and Stanley need to go!

Osso
11-19-2006, 03:04 PM
cut cook and put dayne in as fb.

Goldeagle
11-19-2006, 03:05 PM
Heck or Gado!

NJTexanFan
11-19-2006, 03:10 PM
I think the only reason we actually still have him on the team is because he's pretty good at blocking but i don't care he needs to go

TEXANRED
11-19-2006, 03:13 PM
Cook needs to go, Stanley needs to go, Brown needs to go, Earl needs to go, and CC needs to go.

my:twocents:

GP
11-19-2006, 03:18 PM
Yeah, where'a the Equal Benching Opportunity Act when you need one?

A guy has cost us two games, and there beter be some form of accountability.

TWO GAMES the guy puts the ball on the ground, and in the same way each time: Catch, turn to run up field, and BOINK! there goes the ball.

How do you go home to your mansion at the end of those games and feel like you've earned your paycheck?

Thanks, Cook. How about from now on you just drop the ball and not even catch it? We'd come out a whole lot better than when you catch it and try to run with it.

V Man
11-19-2006, 04:00 PM
Two bad plays got Sheppard release.

Time for Cook to follow. (where is Norris)

GP
11-19-2006, 04:05 PM
Two bad plays got Sheppard release.

Time for Cook to follow. (where is Norris)

Someone picked Norris up.

Put Dayne at FB. He breaks linemen's legs. He can do the job.

V Man
11-19-2006, 04:08 PM
Someone picked Norris up.

Put Dayne at FB. He breaks linemen's legs. He can do the job.

Where is that FB we picked up that played with Gado at Green Bay? Let's see what he can do.

kcwilson
11-19-2006, 04:30 PM
Carr obviously is not getting Cook the ball in the right place when he throws it to him. Carr should be benched. :sarcasm:

Why doesn't Cook get benched? I think he should.

Headlights of a Carr
11-19-2006, 04:36 PM
Cook needs to go, Stanley needs to go, Brown needs to go, Earl needs to go, and CC needs to go.

my:twocents:

Thats my list also. Get rid of 'em

Headlights of a Carr
11-19-2006, 04:37 PM
Carr obviously is not getting Cook the ball in the right place when he throws it to him. Carr should be benched. :sarcasm:

Why doesn't Cook get benched? I think he should.

That or released.

TexanSam
11-19-2006, 06:33 PM
You can't say he cost us games, but his turnovers came at bad times. We were driving during the Giants game when he fumbled and today he fumbled when the worst we could do was get a field goal. I would cut him. Vonta Leach can't be much worse can he?

TexansLucky13
11-19-2006, 06:42 PM
Yea... I am not really about blaming someone for two losses. He definitely needs to be straightened out, though.

gwallaia
11-19-2006, 07:22 PM
Stanley needs to go?
He pinned the Bills down a couple of times with nice punts.

For all these people that everyone is suggesting be let go, whom do we replace them with?

Specnatz
11-19-2006, 07:29 PM
Some people are not solution orriented, they just want to cut players or bench them without looking at what there is that could replace them at this late stage of the season.

I admit I thought Cook was a good signing at the beginning of the season. Now watching him play, I do not think he blocks as well as advertised and the two fumbles that cost the team (not saying the game).

Of course I want brown gone as well, and I would almost take anyone over him because he could not kick and extra point if it was at a crucial point.

coachdent
11-19-2006, 08:35 PM
I don't really think I need to weigh in on how I feel about Cook. His rear end needed to be collecting unemployment eight weeks ago. I can't stand him. Never have liked him. Hate seeing him on the damn field.

Hate the fact that on 3rd and 15, he is on the field with two tight ends and one receiver and we are running play action. Give me a damn break already. It is amazing to me the playcalling sometimes. Any play other than any down and less that two, I just don't see why Jamel Cook needs to be on the field. I honestly do not. RELEASE HIM NOW!

Big78
11-19-2006, 08:39 PM
Stanley needs to go?
He pinned the Bills down a couple of times with nice punts.

For all these people that everyone is suggesting be let go, whom do we replace them with?

i think what most people mean for most of these comments is that we need to find replacements in the near future or as soon as we can. As for stanley, i agree we could do worse. he doesnt always kick it as far as some would like but he kicks it ery high and allows the coverage guys to get under it, forcing a fair catch or giving them a chance to pin them deep.

i feel for Cook in the sense that i feel like both fumbles were not entirely his fault. Against the Giants he was hit just after he caught it and alot of people would drop that pass. Im not saying it wasnt his fault for not securing it fast enough, but he didnt have it for that long, and some argued that he didnt even have posetion of it and it should have been incomplete. As for the one today, on the replay u can see that he secures the ball well when he turns upfield, and when he anticipates the hit he puts his other hand around the ball as well and braces for the hit. I think this fumble was just because Ko Simpson got either his helmet or shoulder (couldnt see which) right on the ball and knocked it out. this happens fairly often and the fact that Jameel Cook fumbled like that only 2 games later and both during crucial drives was only bad luck and not his fault entierly. some of the fault does lie with him b/c there is always more that can be done and he might need to work on holding the ball tighter in practice, and the coaching staff might should give Leach some more looks, but i dont think the guy should be cut because of these fumbles alone. I didnt mean for this to turn into an essay so ill stop now, lol.

Runner
11-19-2006, 10:17 PM
Some people are not solution orriented, they just want to cut players or bench them without looking at what there is that could replace them at this late stage of the season.


First let me state that Cook's fumbles have hurt, but he made several key blocks on runs and pass protection today. Maybe he just shouldn't have the ball anymore. However, to be solution oriented...

I've been talking about this since the start of the season. First we had Cook and a 4th tight end/2nd fullback in Joppru. Talk about a swing player! When they cut Jops they brought in a 2nd fullback.

What could we have had instead of a second fullback who doesn't dress on game days? A 10th offensive lineman so we could have had much needed depth there this season. Keeping nine o-lineman led to the coaches to valuing "swing players" over single position talent. Now that we have injuries we are picking over leftovers who have no concept of our blocking scheme.

coachdent
11-20-2006, 08:20 AM
i feel for Cook in the sense that i feel like both fumbles were not entirely his fault. Against the Giants he was hit just after he caught it and alot of people would drop that pass. Im not saying it wasnt his fault for not securing it fast enough, but he didnt have it for that long, and some argued that he didnt even have posetion of it and it should have been incomplete. As for the one today, on the replay u can see that he secures the ball well when he turns upfield, and when he anticipates the hit he puts his other hand around the ball as well and braces for the hit. I think this fumble was just because Ko Simpson got either his helmet or shoulder (couldnt see which) right on the ball and knocked it out. this happens fairly often and the fact that Jameel Cook fumbled like that only 2 games later and both during crucial drives was only bad luck and not his fault entierly. some of the fault does lie with him b/c there is always more that can be done and he might need to work on holding the ball tighter in practice, and the coaching staff might should give Leach some more looks, but i dont think the guy should be cut because of these fumbles alone. I didnt mean for this to turn into an essay so ill stop now, lol.

I'm a pretty positive guy. But to say that those fumbles were not Jamel Cook's fault is a sickness for which there is no cure! He put the ball on the deck TWICE at crucial times. BOTH instances were squarely his fault and to be apologetic and alibi for him is ridiculous. Blame the coaches for ball security? Are you serious? Coaches? C'mon man!

He should be cut for the sole reason that he is not a professional football player. See who picks him up on waivers when he goes. I'll tell you who picks him up... The Philadelphia Soul of the Arena League. And they would be foolish.

Here are other reasons:

1) More of Walter and three wide sets that give us the ability to throw the ball down the field.

2) How many three yard pass plays can yuo throw to a guy who coughs it up in big situations?

3) We run the ball better out of the single back sets

4) He fades as the game goes on. His nice blocks come in the first half, not in the second. Why? Because he is small. Because he is not a bruising fullback who can ISO a linebacker 15 times a game. He STUNK in the second half as he ALWAYS stinks in the second half. The Texans do not have a viable option at fullback on their roster and need to blow up the position completely. Go to a true H back offense as the Redskins did and motion to provide better angles and more people at the point of attack.

5)Where Cook goes, the ball goes. He bastardizes the true zone and brings the linebackers directly to the point of attack. Not his fault, a schem fault, but with him on the field, our run game becomes predictable and it gets WORSE over the course of the game instead of better.

6) If Cook isn't on our roster, then it he CAN'T possibly be on the field in third down situations or in a two minute drill.

I'll tell you what....this season and the frustration I have for this offense rests squarely upon his shoulders. It is disgusting to watch week in and week out. Almost as disgusting as trying to rationalize his fumbles by blaming someone else. Hell blame David Carr along with everyone else! Geez!

Big78
11-20-2006, 11:51 AM
I'm a pretty positive guy. But to say that those fumbles were not Jamel Cook's fault is a sickness for which there is no cure! He put the ball on the deck TWICE at crucial times. BOTH instances were squarely his fault and to be apologetic and alibi for him is ridiculous. Blame the coaches for ball security? Are you serious? Coaches? C'mon man!

He should be cut for the sole reason that he is not a professional football player. See who picks him up on waivers when he goes. I'll tell you who picks him up... The Philadelphia Soul of the Arena League. And they would be foolish.

Here are other reasons:

1) More of Walter and three wide sets that give us the ability to throw the ball down the field.

2) How many three yard pass plays can yuo throw to a guy who coughs it up in big situations?

3) We run the ball better out of the single back sets

4) He fades as the game goes on. His nice blocks come in the first half, not in the second. Why? Because he is small. Because he is not a bruising fullback who can ISO a linebacker 15 times a game. He STUNK in the second half as he ALWAYS stinks in the second half. The Texans do not have a viable option at fullback on their roster and need to blow up the position completely. Go to a true H back offense as the Redskins did and motion to provide better angles and more people at the point of attack.

5)Where Cook goes, the ball goes. He bastardizes the true zone and brings the linebackers directly to the point of attack. Not his fault, a schem fault, but with him on the field, our run game becomes predictable and it gets WORSE over the course of the game instead of better.

6) If Cook isn't on our roster, then it he CAN'T possibly be on the field in third down situations or in a two minute drill.

I'll tell you what....this season and the frustration I have for this offense rests squarely upon his shoulders. It is disgusting to watch week in and week out. Almost as disgusting as trying to rationalize his fumbles by blaming someone else. Hell blame David Carr along with everyone else! Geez!

i didnt mean for it to sound like i was blaming the coaches for his mistake, and im actaully for using him less and going with another WR on the field in his stead. All i was trying to say was that the actual fumbles he made weren't caused b/c of anything he actaully did or didnt do, but b/c of the placement and timing of the hits that caused them.
But yes, i do feel like we should keep him out on most third down situations and use more 3 WR 1TE 1RB sets.

Texan_Bill
11-20-2006, 12:26 PM
^^^*BUMP*^^^ Someone in another thread, said that this type of topic would fall quickly to the second page.

humbleone
11-20-2006, 01:21 PM
I'm a pretty positive guy. But to say that those fumbles were not Jamel Cook's fault is a sickness for which there is no cure! He put the ball on the deck TWICE at crucial times. BOTH instances were squarely his fault and to be apologetic and alibi for him is ridiculous. Blame the coaches for ball security? Are you serious? Coaches? C'mon man!

He should be cut for the sole reason that he is not a professional football player. See who picks him up on waivers when he goes. I'll tell you who picks him up... The Philadelphia Soul of the Arena League. And they would be foolish.

Here are other reasons:

1) More of Walter and three wide sets that give us the ability to throw the ball down the field.

2) How many three yard pass plays can yuo throw to a guy who coughs it up in big situations?

3) We run the ball better out of the single back sets

4) He fades as the game goes on. His nice blocks come in the first half, not in the second. Why? Because he is small. Because he is not a bruising fullback who can ISO a linebacker 15 times a game. He STUNK in the second half as he ALWAYS stinks in the second half. The Texans do not have a viable option at fullback on their roster and need to blow up the position completely. Go to a true H back offense as the Redskins did and motion to provide better angles and more people at the point of attack.

5)Where Cook goes, the ball goes. He bastardizes the true zone and brings the linebackers directly to the point of attack. Not his fault, a schem fault, but with him on the field, our run game becomes predictable and it gets WORSE over the course of the game instead of better.

6) If Cook isn't on our roster, then it he CAN'T possibly be on the field in third down situations or in a two minute drill.

I'll tell you what....this season and the frustration I have for this offense rests squarely upon his shoulders. It is disgusting to watch week in and week out. Almost as disgusting as trying to rationalize his fumbles by blaming someone else. Hell blame David Carr along with everyone else! Geez!

Best post I have read in awhile...Thanks!

hollywood_texan
11-20-2006, 01:38 PM
I'm a pretty positive guy. But to say that those fumbles were not Jamel Cook's fault is a sickness for which there is no cure! He put the ball on the deck TWICE at crucial times. BOTH instances were squarely his fault and to be apologetic and alibi for him is ridiculous. Blame the coaches for ball security? Are you serious? Coaches? C'mon man!

He should be cut for the sole reason that he is not a professional football player. See who picks him up on waivers when he goes. I'll tell you who picks him up... The Philadelphia Soul of the Arena League. And they would be foolish.

Here are other reasons:

1) More of Walter and three wide sets that give us the ability to throw the ball down the field.

2) How many three yard pass plays can yuo throw to a guy who coughs it up in big situations?

3) We run the ball better out of the single back sets

4) He fades as the game goes on. His nice blocks come in the first half, not in the second. Why? Because he is small. Because he is not a bruising fullback who can ISO a linebacker 15 times a game. He STUNK in the second half as he ALWAYS stinks in the second half. The Texans do not have a viable option at fullback on their roster and need to blow up the position completely. Go to a true H back offense as the Redskins did and motion to provide better angles and more people at the point of attack.

5)Where Cook goes, the ball goes. He bastardizes the true zone and brings the linebackers directly to the point of attack. Not his fault, a schem fault, but with him on the field, our run game becomes predictable and it gets WORSE over the course of the game instead of better.

6) If Cook isn't on our roster, then it he CAN'T possibly be on the field in third down situations or in a two minute drill.

I'll tell you what....this season and the frustration I have for this offense rests squarely upon his shoulders. It is disgusting to watch week in and week out. Almost as disgusting as trying to rationalize his fumbles by blaming someone else. Hell blame David Carr along with everyone else! Geez!

I think your post needs a little perspective. Of course, Cook has his issues because of those two fumbles, but players make mistakes. The key is, does that player provide more value than the mistakes he makes? You could make the arguement of the Giants game fumble was a blown call and they didn't get it right.

Now for the perspective, even though Cook fumbled right before the second half, the offense still only got 31 yards and 1 first down in the fourth quarter. I don't think that had that much to do with Cook. In addition, the offense didn't score one point in the second half. Point is, Carr and the offense could have bailed out Cook and the mistake. This team has a hard time overcoming any coach's or player's mistakes, which leads to all this finger pointing!

My point is, this team has problems top to bottom, meaning the owner, down to the coaches, and down to the players. There is no ability to overcome. There are going to be mistakes on the football field, but can you overcome those mistakes? That is the question...

I get the feeling you are singling out Cook because of the heat on Carr. Cook needs to be looked at, I agree with you there, but perspective is important. It seems like you are scapegoating him for the entire loss when there was so much more to the game than that one play.

Carr has been the starter for 4 1/2 years and despite all the plays and what went on in that game, Kubiak put faith in Carr and Johnson to complete a short 2 yard pass in an offense that looks at that type of play as a running play. That is the point of the West Coast Offense. We all know the result. Carr and Johnson failed miserably on a play that the West Coast Offense regards as a high percentage. Kubiak gave Carr and Johnson and opportunity to prove their value!

So we come back to the perspective, does a player makes great plays that outweigh his failures and mistakes? That is the real question.

It is a serious question of Carr, Cook, and many other players on this team.

Lucky
11-20-2006, 01:49 PM
Prior to his fumble in the Giants game, Cook had not fumbled in 73 career touches. Since, he has fumbled twice in 6 touches. Go figure.

I could make an arm's length list of the Texans players and coaches failures that contributed to this loss. Bottom line: the Texans don't know how to win. They've got 6 games left in the '06 season to learn how.

Texan_Bill
11-20-2006, 01:54 PM
I agree with you Lucky. ALL 3 phases let us down yesterday, and as a Kubiak fan, coaching was suspect too... PERIOD!

rmartin65
11-20-2006, 01:59 PM
Maybe Leonard should be looked at in the draft. he has made some big plays, but I dont know about his blocking.

austintexanite
11-20-2006, 03:56 PM
needs to apologize in front of the team and walk with the football everywhere he goes.

Second Honeymoon
11-20-2006, 04:08 PM
needs to apologize in front of the team and walk with the football everywhere he goes.

LOL
that is some old school peewee football coach discipline right there

i hadn't heard that threat for a few decades...memories...
LOL

funny stuff

Sarg01
11-20-2006, 04:26 PM
Two fumbles, two totally inopurtune times. I think we would be 5-5 right now otherwise.


Assuming the Giants beat the Jags tonight, a Texans team without Cook would be the answer to the Who's the current #6 seed in the AFC? riddle tomorrow :(

EDIT: Oops, sorry, I saw the score with Oakland punk'ing the Chiefs at the end of the Texans game and didn't notice their game wasn't over. We'd actually be #7.

wenskek
11-20-2006, 05:16 PM
The solution to J. Cook is really simple. Cut his sorry @$$ as soon the as the season is over and lets draft Brian Leonard that bad mofo out of Rutgers. he'd make for one hell of a FB/HB/H-Back.

GP
11-20-2006, 06:42 PM
i think what most people mean for most of these comments is that we need to find replacements in the near future or as soon as we can. As for stanley, i agree we could do worse. he doesnt always kick it as far as some would like but he kicks it ery high and allows the coverage guys to get under it, forcing a fair catch or giving them a chance to pin them deep.

i feel for Cook in the sense that i feel like both fumbles were not entirely his fault. Against the Giants he was hit just after he caught it and alot of people would drop that pass. Im not saying it wasnt his fault for not securing it fast enough, but he didnt have it for that long, and some argued that he didnt even have posetion of it and it should have been incomplete. As for the one today, on the replay u can see that he secures the ball well when he turns upfield, and when he anticipates the hit he puts his other hand around the ball as well and braces for the hit. I think this fumble was just because Ko Simpson got either his helmet or shoulder (couldnt see which) right on the ball and knocked it out. this happens fairly often and the fact that Jameel Cook fumbled like that only 2 games later and both during crucial drives was only bad luck and not his fault entierly. some of the fault does lie with him b/c there is always more that can be done and he might need to work on holding the ball tighter in practice, and the coaching staff might should give Leach some more looks, but i dont think the guy should be cut because of these fumbles alone. I didnt mean for this to turn into an essay so ill stop now, lol.

The fumbles were not entirely his fault?

Well, uh, I guess you're right: He had to have a guy touch him in order for him to drop it.

Both times, Mr. Cook has caught the ball and turned upfield only to get it knocked out of his hands. And both times we were in field goal position.

If he holds onto that ball on both of those times, we'd be asking to cut kris Brown and not Cook. So I guess it's 6 one way and half-a-dozen the other.

I like your signature. One of my favorite movies, by the way.

"Maybe we ought to get us some of that ree-form?"

hollywood_texan
11-20-2006, 06:45 PM
Refresh my memory, but wasn't the Cook fumble against the Giants a blown call?

Kaiser Toro
11-20-2006, 06:48 PM
I did not think his first fumble was a fumble, but yesterday's was. No excuse for the FB to have two huge fumbles given their touches in this offense. Kubiak has brought some garbage in and will need to take it out.

GP
11-20-2006, 07:01 PM
I did not think his first fumble was a fumble, but yesterday's was. No excuse for the FB to have two huge fumbles given their touches in this offense. Kubiak has brought some garbage in and will need to take it out.

You got that right.

Letting Norris go was a mistake (Felt like that when it happened, and feel like it now).

(Sigh)

Sometimes NFL coaches and personnel get too cute with their ideology. Sometimes, like in the case of Romo vs. Bledsoe, they just flat out overthink it instead of going with what obviously looks right. How can you be Bill Parcells and stick with Bledsoe for that long? How can you do it? I mean, is it beacuse he owed it ot him? What was the deal? You have a guy who torched teams in the preseason like he was Joe Montana's daddy...and he is JUST NOW getting the call? Amazing.

Norris, IMO, was one of them more consistent (in a GOOD way) players on our team. He wasn't spectacular, but he was solid. JJ Moses was, too. He put the ball on the ground ONE time out of all those returns, and he even recovered his own fumble on that ONE time. But because he didn't have "break-away speed" he got canned. Well, Shepherd's gone. Wynn is a totally mystery to me in terms of trying to remember anything spectacular that he's done to earn his paycheck. And Anderson couldn't catch the ball either. We have gone through return guys, and only Mathis has been able to do something special with it....but yet HE'S on the verge of being cut loose because he cannot "get it together" like Kubiak wants?

(sigh)

Why do they have to make things so dadgum hard?

Over-thinking: The New Drug............and it's an epidimic around here.

Runner
11-20-2006, 08:52 PM
Sometimes NFL coaches and personnel get too cute with their ideology. Sometimes...they just flat out overthink it instead of going with what obviously looks right.

I absolutely agree with this. Coaches do have a tendency to over think in an effort to make things better. There are examples of this in the Texans history:

Constantly jacking the o-line around looking for a hidden combination rather than developing young players and working through the rough times. They are always starting over rather than building.

Playing Mario Williams at multiple positions as a rookie to make it tough on defenses because they "won't know where he's lining up next". Sounds good in theory, but it was too much for Mario. Let him get established before getting fancy.

Having unique roster combinations by saving spots on swing players. I think I've been clear on what I think of this.


The Texans have never been good enough to be tricky or cute. They need to build along more traditional lines.

TheRealJoker
11-20-2006, 09:17 PM
Never give Cook the ball in a clutch situation again.